10) and Deborah England of Burke and McDowell Co, NC
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James A. Stroud (1804/10) and Deborah England of Burke and McDowell Co, NC
James A. Stroud (1800/04) and Deborah England of Burke and McDowell Co, NC

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I (Marty Grant) am a 4th Great Grand Nephew of James A. Stroud.

James A. Stroud was born ca 1800/04 (per census records) in Burke (now McDowell) Co, NC. He was called "Big Jim" to distinguish himself from "Little Jim", James Stroud (c1805) is a first cousin to this James.

Due to their being two James', there may be some confusion as to which record belongs to who. This James under study here had "A" for his middle initial, though IT did not appear on most the public records that I've found. It did show up on his Estate file though.

James A. Stroud is a son of Peter Stroud and Margaret Curtis. This is not entirely proven but it seems extremely likely. First of all Peter did have an apparent son this age. Secondly, James Stroud was the administrator of Peter's estate. This duty usually fell to a son or son-in-law. The questions remains though whether it was this James or the other one. I feel it was this one though, but there is room for me to be wrong about it.

The old family letters dated 1837 and 1838 (transcribed on Peter Stroud's page) mention "Big Jim" and say at that time (1837) that "Big Jim" and "Little Peter" are living together at that point and working on their house.

Further proof about James being a son of Peter and Margaret is that his son Alfred lived with Peter G. Stroud (1807) in 1860 in Towns Co, GA. Peter is also a son of Peter and Margaret. Some of James' other children later moved to Towns County, Georgia and lived near Peter G. Stroud.

James was apparently home with his parents in 1810 (age "under 10", born ca 1800/10) and still home in 1820 (age 16-25, born ca 1794/1804), and gone by 1830.

On 9 Oct 1828, James Stroud Jr (I have not verified that the original says "Jr") obtained a marriage bond in Burke County to marry Deborah England. Ezekiel England was the bondsman. Deborah A. England was born ca 1800/01 (per 1850 census). I don't know who her parents are, but Ezekiel England is probably a close relative since he acted as bondsman.

They were listed on the 1830 census in Burke County, just a few houses from James Mashburn (married to James' sister Rebecca Stroud) and just a few from Joseph Garrett (also a brother-in-law), and just a few from Peter Stroud Jr ("Little Peter", his first cousin Peter E. Stroud).

1830 census analysis (based on available evidence): (Explanation of this census)

1830 Burke Co, NC pg 185 James Stroud 1000100000000-0001000000000 Analysis: 1 Male(s) 20-29 (1800-1810) James STROUD (1800/04) s/o Peter & Margaret 1 Male(s) 0-4 (1825-1830) J. Logan STROUD (1828/29) son 1 Female(s) 15-19 (1810-1815) Deborah ENGLAND Stroud (1800/01) wife

James Stroud was listed as Administrator for his father's Estate on an Estate Sale dated 27 Nov 1834. He was also listed among the purchasers.

On 23 Feb 1835, Peter Stroud (his brother) of Burke County sold two tracts of land to Gardner Stearns and James Stroud for $160. The land was described as being on Muddy Creek, one of 275 acres, the other of 90 acres, all formerly belonging to Peter Stroud, deceased. Witnesses were Thomas Green and John H. Morrison. Peter signed with a mark. (McDowell Co, NC Deed Book 3 page 41).

On 21 Mar 1835, Joseph Garrett and Sarah Garrett (James' sister) sold their share of Peter Stroud's Estate to James Stroud and Gardner Stearns. The land was two tracts on Muddy Creek of 274 acres and 500 acres. Witnesses were Zachariah Hawkins and Thomas Green. (McDowell Co, NC Deed Book 3 page 40).

The voter list for the 1835 Congressional elections has survived, and for Burke County there were two voters named "James Stroud" and one "J. Stroud". All three voted in Neals Precinct (as did almost all the other Strouds). This is obviously James A. Stroud ("Big Jim") as well as his cousin James Stroud (c1805 "Little Jim") and the "J. Stroud" could be James L. Stroud (1810), though there is really no way to tell which was which based on the data provided.

On 22 Apr 1836, William Stroud (brother) and James Stroud witnessed a deed from their brother Robert Stroud to Gardner Stearns. (McDowell Co, NC Deed Book 1 page 137).

"Big Jim" was mentioned in the 1837 letter from James and Rebecca (Stroud) Mashburn (his sister) to John and Delilah (Bright) Stroud saying just this:

"Big Jim & Little Peter would all live with us now but they are a fixing their house to move as soon as they can get it ready"

On 19 Aug 1837, James Stroud and James Mashburn were named as Administrators for the Estate of James Stroud, deceased. This confused me for many years, wondering which James Stroud had died, however, the 1838 family letter makes it clear that this is "Little Jim" James Stroud (1805) and he wasn't dead, but had absconded owing lots of people money. The "deceased" was just a typo, as most estates were for someone deceased, but not in this case. Here is what James Mashburn said about it in his 1838 letter:

"Your letter stated something about James Stroud sale of land. I can in form you that his land was executed and sold at Morgantown all his claims for two hundred and seventy eight dollars and it was said that he was broke. But he married Omy Stroud and left our parts. Some sade he run away, he carried too horses and prity smart of money, and left me one hundred and sevety or eighty dollars to pay, by going his security. I can in form you that Ecles Stroud and family went with him."

Later in the letter he said that the sale of James' estate was forced by himself and others. The law at the time said that the person or persons who were owed the most could become administrators of an estate, and this is what apparently happened. James wasn't dead, but had moved west to Roane County, Tennessee.

James was listed in Burke County on the 1840 census. He was listed on the same page and not too far from his cousins Peter E. Stroud and William M. Stroud. James had an older woman residing with him aged 70-79 (born ca 1760/70), which is presumably his widowed mother Margaret Curtis Stroud.

1840 census analysis (based on available evidence): (Explanation of this census)

1840 Burke Co, NC pg 341 James Stroud 2210010000000-0000010001000 Analysis: 1 Male(s) 30-39 (1800-1810) James STROUD (1800/04) s/o Peter & Margaret 1 Male(s) 10-14 (1825-1830) J. Logan STROUD (1828/29) son 2 Male(s) 5-9 (1830-1835) Peter A. STROUD (1830/31) son James STROUD (1833/34) son 2 Male(s) 0-4 (1835-1840) Jasper STROUD (1836/37) son Alfred STROUD (1840) son 1 Female(s) 70-79 (1760-1770) Margaret CURTIS Stroud (1767/68) mother 1 Female(s) 30-39 (1800-1810) Deborah ENGLAND Stroud (1800/01) wife

In 1842, McDowell County was formed from the section of Burke County where the Strouds were living.

On 15 Mar 1843, James Stroud Entered 50 acres of land on North Muddy Creek bordering Gardner Stearns. I don't know when this land was actually granted to him.

James A. Stroud died sometime between 1843 and 17 Nov 1848 for on that latter date he was mentioned in a land entry as being deceased. His Estate File was dated "1847" so, he must have died that year in McDowell County. His estate file shows "J. A. Stroud" and that "Deba A. Stroud" (his wife) was the administrator. This data is from the Estates index, I have not looked at the actual estate file yet. (McDowell Co, NC Index to Estates, Book 1A1 page 127).

Deborah and children were listed on the 1850 census in McDowell County.

1850 census abstract: (Explanation of this census)

(Note: The dates at the end of each line are not part of the original census, but are approximate birth years based on age)

1850 McDOWELL CO, NC Page 263 House/Family # 126/ 126 - Twp STROUD DEBBY A 49 F W 225 NC 1800/1801 STROUD J LOGAN 21 M W FARMER NC 1828/1829 STROUD PETER A 19 M W FARMER NC 1830/1831 STROUD JAMES 16 M W NC 1833/1834 STROUD JASPER 13 M W NC 1836/1837 STROUD ALFRED 9 M W NC 1840/1841

I did not find Deborah Stroud on the 1860 census. I was only able to locate one of her children that year, and that was son Alfred who was in Towns County, Georgia living with his uncle Peter G. Stroud (1807).

I didn't find her in 1870 either. Three of her children were in Towns County, Georgia that year living around Peter G. Stroud. Deborah England Stroud must have died between 1850 and 1860.

Children

James and Deborah (England) Stroud had five children, all sons.

J. Logan Stroud (c1829)

Peter A. Stroud (c1830)

James Stroud (c1834)

Jasper Stroud (c1837)

Alfred Stroud (c1841)

J. Logan Stroud was born ca 1828/29 (per 1850 census) in Burke (now McDowell) Co, NC. He was apparently home with his parents in 1830 (age "under 5", born ca 1825/30), and still seemingly home in 1840 (age 10-14, born ca 1825/30). He was with his widowed mother for the 1850 census ("J. Logan Stroud" age 21, born NC).

On 15 Jan 1850, J. L. Stroud obtained a marriage bond in McDowell County to marry Malinda Sorrells. S. P. Hawkins was the bondsman. Now this is somewhat confusing, for the census was as of June 1850, and Logan did not seem to be married. There are two possible explanations for this. One, the bond is actually for June instead of January (if misread), or two, he did marry Malinda, but she died between January and June.

There were no Sorrells in McDowell County in 1850, but some in neighboring Buncombe and Yancey Counties. None of them had a daughter named "Malinda", however, Richard Sorrells and wife Malinda Sorrells (c1820) were in Yancey County. It seems unlikely this is the same Malinda.

I was unable to locate J. Logan Stroud on the 1860 census.

I think he died prior to 26 Feb 1857, for on that date his cousin John L. Ingle married "Malinda Stroud" in McDowell County. I have not confirmed that this Malinda was the widow of J. Logan Stroud, but I can't place her anywhere else yet.

Peter A. Stroud was born ca 1830/31 (per 1850 census) in Burke (now McDowell) Co, NC. He was apparently not home with his parents in 1830, so probably not born yet. He did seem to be home in 1840 (age 5-9, born ca 1830/35). He was with his widowed mother for the 1850 census ("Peter A. Stroud" age 19, born NC).

He might be the same "P. A. Stroud" age 20, listed on the 1850 census in Rabun Co, GA with the Jesse Carter family. Jesse was the father-in-law of Peter G. Stroud (1807), so therefore a "shirt tail" relative to Peter A. Stroud. I don't know if it is the same person or not, but having the same initials and being the same age (almost exactly) makes it seem possible. The Rabun record was dated 17 Oct 1850, and the McDowell record was dated 2 Aug 1850, so there was plenty of time between the two census records for Peter to move down to Rabun and be counted twice:

1850 census abstract: (Explanation of this census)

(Note: The dates at the end of each line are not part of the original census, but are approximate birth years based on age)

1850 RABUN CO, GA Page 332B House/Family # 247/ 247 - 536th DISTRICT Twp CARTER JESSE 67 M W FARMER 1000 NC 1782/1783 CARTER VINA 63 F W TN 1786/1787 BRIGGS REBECA 20 F W 1829/1830 BIRD ELIZABETH 27 F W 1822/1823 STROUD P A 20 M W FARMER 1829/1830

I did not find Peter on the 1860 census.

I don't know if it is him or not, but there is an "A. Stroud" on the 1870 census in Towns Co, GA just a few houses from widowed sister-in-law Rachel Stroud. His age is right, and since we know Peter's middle initial was "A", this could be him, but I'm not totally sure. A check of the Towns County marriage records might answer the question.

1870 census abstract: (Explanation of this census)

(Note: The dates at the end of each line are not part of the original census, but are approximate birth years based on age)

1870 TOWNS CO, GA Page 187B House/Family # 15/ 15-- Twp STROUD A 38 M W FARMER 200 NC 1831/1832 STROUD CLARINDA A 38 F W KEEPING HOUSE NC 1831/1832 STROUD MARTHA L 0 F W 6/12 DEC GA 1869/1870

I did not find them in 1880.

James Stroud was born ca 1833/34 (per 1850 census) in Burke (now McDowell) Co, NC. He was apparently home with his parents in 1840 (age 5-9, born ca 1830/35). He was with his widowed mother for the 1850 census ("James Stroud" age 16, born NC).

I did not find him in 1860.

I found a James Stroud in 1870 that I believe is this same James. He was in Towns County, Georgia next to his Uncle Peter G. Stroud, married with a family. They were living in the same household with J. E. and Sarah A. Roach, but with a different family number. This is either a typo, or they were actually all living together, though I don't know the connection.

1870 census abstract: (Explanation of this census)

(Note: The dates at the end of each line are not part of the original census, but are approximate birth years based on age)

1870 TOWNS CO, GA Page 195B House/Family # 124/ 125-- Twp ROACH J E 32 M W FARM LABOR 150 SC 1837/1838 ROACH SARAH A 32 F W KEEPING HOUSE SC 1837/1838 ROACH CHARLES R 4 M W KEEPING HOUSE GA 1865/1866 ROACH LILLIE A 1 F W GA 1868/1869 Page 195B House/Family # 124/ 126-- Twp STROUD JAMES 39 M W FARM LABOR NC 1830/1831 STROUD ELMINY 27 F W KEEPING HOUSE NC 1842/1843 STROUD JAMES W 9 M W AT HOME 1860/1861 STROUD WILLIS L 6 M W 1863/1864 STROUD NANCY L 3 F W 1866/1867 STROUD LILLIE M 0 F W 2/12 MAR 1869/1870

By 1880, they had moved to nearby Habersham County, Georgia. They were listed on the census there that year in Cool Spring Township. ** I don't have this entry typed up yet.

Jasper Stroud was born ca 1836/37 (per 1850 census) in Burke (now McDowell) Co, NC. He was apparently home with his parents in 1840 (age "under 5", born ca 1835/40). He was with his widowed mother for the 1850 census ("Jasper Stroud" age 13, born NC).

I did not find him in 1860.

Alfred Stroud was born ca 1838/39 (per 1860 census) in Burke (now McDowell) Co, NC. He was apparently home with his parents in 1840 (age "under 5", born ca 1835/40). He was with his widowed mother for the 1850 census ("Alfred Stroud" age 9, born NC).

In 1860 he was living in Towns Co, GA with his Uncle Peter G. Stroud.

1860 census abstract: (Explanation of this census)

(Note: The dates at the end of each line are not part of the original census, but are approximate birth years based on age)

1860 TOWNS CO, GA Page 165 House/Family # 345/ 345 -- Twp P.O. STROUD PETER 53 M W FARMER 2000 800 NC 1806/1807 STROUD LUCINDA 44 F W NC 1815/1816 STROUD JAMES 20 M W NC 1839/1840 STROUD LAVINA 17 F W GA 1842/1843 STROUD NANCY 15 F W GA 1844/1845 STROUD LUCINDA 12 F W GA 1847/1848 STROUD MARGARET 10 F W GA 1849/1850 STROUD NAOMI 6 F W GA 1853/1854 STROUD WILLIAM 2 M W GA 1857/1858 STROUD ALFRED 21 M W HIRELING GA 1838/1839

Alfred married Rachel M. Phillips before ca 1867 in Towns County. She was born ca 1844/45 in NC (both facts per 1870 census). Her maiden name is based on her widowed mother (Polly Phillips) living with her in 1880.

Alfred Stroud died in May 1870 in Towns County, per the Mortality Schedule. His widow and their two small children were listed on the 1870 census in Towns County.

1870 census abstract: (Explanation of this census)

(Note: The dates at the end of each line are not part of the original census, but are approximate birth years based on age)

1870 TOWNS CO, GA Page 187 House/Family # 5/ 5-- Twp STROUD RACHEL 25 F W KEEPING HOUSE NC 1844/1845 STROUD JOHN L 3 M W GA 1866/1867 STROUD MARY L 1 F W NC 1868/1869

Sometime before 1876, Rachel remarried, though I don't know where. She married Jehu C. B. Shown. He was born ca 1826/27 in Tennessee.

They were listed on the 1880 census in Wilkes County, North Carolina, which is well north of Towns County, Georgia. I don't know what drew them up there unless that is where Mr. Shown was from originally. Her Stroud children (John L. and Mary L. Stroud) were living with them, as were two small Shown children, and Polly Phillips age 75 (born ca 1805 VA), listed as "Mother-in-law" to Mr. Shown, so presumably this was Rachel's mother. ** I don't have this entry typed up yet.

Researcher List

Persons researching this family :

See Stroud Researcher List

Register Report