[04:38] <Kilos> morning superfly and others
[07:49] <inetpro> good morning Kilos and others
[08:04] <Kilos> morning inetpro
[08:04] <Kilos> i was scratching in stored stuff and found some cotton seeds
[08:05] <Kilos> forgot we grew them an utrecht as well
[08:05] <Kilos> good for dairy cows
[08:06] <Kilos> when you have time can we look what ive done wrong with local minetest
[08:06] <Kilos> cant get it to boot
[08:08] <Kilos> and didnt save how to make the StartMining command work
[08:23] <charl> good morning
[08:23] <charl> hi inetpro, Kilos
[08:24] <Kilos> hi charl
[08:35] <magespawn> howdy all
[08:39] <Kilos> hi magespawn
[08:39] <magespawn> hey Kilos
[08:39] <Kilos> hi man not hey
[08:39] <Kilos> charl  tell him
[08:44] <magespawn> horses eat it Kilos it has to be good
[08:44] <magespawn> hay at least
[08:44] <Kilos> no man
[08:44] <Kilos> hey is getho slang from the states
[08:44] <Kilos> ghetto
[08:44] <magespawn> is there any downside to running 64 bit software on x86 hardware?
[08:45] <Kilos> ?
[08:45] <Kilos> try it
[08:46] <magespawn> i am setting up a new asterisk server, and i want to use ubuntu instead of centOS, but it looks like the server only comes in 64 bit now
[08:47] <magespawn> don't really want to do all the work to find it is going create complications later
[08:47] <gremble> According to wikipedia x86 was introduced as 64bit in 2003
[08:47] <gremble> Depends on how old the hardware is then I suppose
[08:48] <gremble> x86 is a type of backward compatible instruction set
[08:49] <Kilos> no magespawn  i have server in 32bit
[08:49] <magespawn> let me check gremble
[08:50] <magespawn> Kilos, cannot find 32 on the ubuntu site
[08:50] <Kilos> Maaz  google ubuntu server 32bit iso
[08:50] <Maaz> Kilos: "Download Ubuntu Server | Download | Ubuntu" http://www.ubuntu.com/download/server :: "Alternative downloads | Ubuntu" http://www.ubuntu.com/download/alternative-downloads :: "Ubuntu 12.04.5 LTS (Precise Pangolin)" http://releases.ubuntu.com/12.04/ :: "Download Ubuntu Desktop | Download | Ubuntu" http://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop :: "Ubuntu 14.04.1 LTS
[08:50] <Maaz> (Trusty Tahr)" http://releases.ubuntu.com/14.04/ :: "Ubuntu 12.10 (Quantal Quetzal)" http…
[08:50] <Kilos> i got it a few weeks ago magespawn
[08:51] <Kilos> oh my where did i download it from
[08:52] <Kilos> http://releases.ubuntu.com/14.04/ubuntu-14.04.1-server-i386.iso
[08:52] <Kilos> magespawn  ^^
[08:53] <gremble> What makes ubuntu server different from desktop?
[08:53] <Kilos> no gui and all the server stuff is there already
[08:54] <Kilos> but you see a gui when installing
[08:54] <magespawn> text based installer
[08:54] <Kilos> lol once installed you hit text mode
[08:55] <gremble> Text based installers it not new to me :P I am more curious about the server stuff
[08:55] <Kilos> but using ssh to it works lekker
[08:55] <gremble> I know practically nothing about networking and setting up servers
[08:56] <Kilos> there is a guide gremble
[08:56] <Kilos> lemme check
[08:56] <Kilos> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/SystemDocumentation/UbuntuServerGuide
[08:57] <gremble> I will go have a look-see
[08:58] <Kilos> very interesting if you understand all that stuff
[08:58] <gremble> Sort of like most things in life :P
[09:01] <magespawn> gremble it is very useful for running computers that do not need a gui, so what i am going to doing s using it to run a lodges phones
[09:02] <gremble> VOIP?
[09:04] <magespawn> yes amongst other things, using this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asterisk_%28PBX%29
[09:05] <gremble> Oh ok
[09:05] <gremble> Cool
[09:06] <magespawn> i accept incoming calls through telkom usually, outgoing through VoIP and cellular and telkom, usually in that order
[09:06] <gremble> Vodacom recently won a court case that allows them to charch R10 per MB on voip
[09:06] <gremble> How fucked up is that?
[09:07] <magespawn> that means they have do some sort of packet inspection going out, which raises privacy questions
[09:08] <magespawn> it would be interesting to see if they can do it if the traffic is encrypted
[09:08] <gremble> All our ISP's do packet inspection
[09:08] <gremble> Mweb had a promotion on faster social media a while back if I recall correctly
[09:08] <gremble> and that is an even deeper inspection than just what protocal is being used
[09:09] <magespawn> yup and cell c is making whatsapp free
[09:09] <gremble> If you encrypt it using tor or something, it looks like TLS/SSL
[09:09] <gremble> so that should be fine
[09:12] <gremble> I think that the worst failing of the human condition is the protection of the status quo
[09:12] <gremble> We are too afraid of change and movement
[09:13] <Symmetria> hrm
[09:13] <Symmetria> testing netflix with 4k video
[09:13] <Symmetria> its eating 16 - 20mbit
[09:13] <Symmetria> which aint bad
[09:13] <gremble> Your eyes can only see 16fps anyway, so I dunno why you do dis
[09:14] <Symmetria> errrr, what the hell does frames per second have to do with the resolution of the video?
[09:14] <gremble> Nothing, Im trolling.  So you cannot really compare
[09:16] <gremble> Do you have a 4k screen Symmetria ?
[09:16] <Symmetria> gremble yeah I got a 4K 40" as one of the monitors on my pc, but its also a smart tv so watch netflix on it directly with the app
[09:16] <gremble> :Q
[09:17] <Symmetria> unotelly ftw to bypass geographic restrictions
[09:34] <Kilos> hmm... peer got him
[09:56] <charl> Maaz: coffee on
[09:56]  * Maaz flips the salt-timer
[10:00] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for charl!
[10:03] <charl> Maaz: thanks
[10:03] <Maaz> charl: No problem
[10:04] <charl> Symmetria: which monitor do you have exactly (if i may ask)?
[10:04] <charl> make/model
[10:47] <Symmetria> charl its a samsung 40" smart tv, the series 7
[10:47] <Symmetria> cant remeber exact model number
[11:07] <Symmetria> I want a new gopro hero 4+
[11:07] <Symmetria> 4k gopro ftw ;p
[11:10] <Symmetria> 8k on pre-order
[15:02] <Kilos> Maaz  coffee on
[15:02]  * Maaz puts the kettle on
[15:06] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for Kilos!
[15:06] <Kilos> Maaz  ty
[15:06] <Maaz> You are welcome Kilos
[16:51] <charl> good evening
[16:51] <charl> hi Kilos
[16:52] <Kilos> hi charl
[16:52] <charl> got my new tv today
[16:52] <Kilos> lekker
[16:52] <charl> salora 39" edge lit lcd
[16:52] <charl> cost me about 255 euro, which i think was a good price for a 39"
[16:52] <Kilos> sjoe i thought geeks dont do tv
[16:52] <charl> it was 299 but i got an extra 15% off
[16:53] <charl> i use it as an external screen
[16:53] <charl> got it connected to my laptop at the moment via vga
[16:53] <Kilos> haha
[16:53] <Kilos> ok
[17:01] <charl> if you want i can show you a picture but not sure if you can view pictures there with your data
[17:30] <Kilos> ya charl  you can as long as its not a 30m pic
[17:30] <Kilos> up to 5 meg is fine
[17:31] <charl> ah ok
[17:35] <Kilos> ok what?
[17:35] <Kilos> if its bigger gimp it or shotwell
[17:37] <charl> one sec
[17:39] <Kilos> lol
[17:39] <Kilos> no rush
[17:39] <charl> sorry i am having dinner here and doing everything at the same time :)
[17:40] <charl> multitasking isn't my thing
[17:40] <Kilos> eat first man
[17:42] <charl> ok ok ... :)
[17:42] <Kilos> shame one poor freestate farmer lost 1000 sheep to hail and cold
[17:42] <Kilos> thats ove 1million bucks worth
[17:44] <charl> ok dinner done
[17:44] <charl> ouch !
[17:45] <charl> i'll privmsg you
[19:18] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight


[02:43] <GeekMan1222> SO
[02:43] <GeekMan1222> I might be driving out to kentucky
[02:43] <GeekMan1222> to pick up some candy
[02:43] <GeekMan1222> rip
[02:43] <GeekMan1222> wrong room
[03:09] <Datz> sarnold: I think I've figured some more out about the local connection troubles I brought up earlier. My laptop is on a 5GHz radio, and I think it's treating it as seperate network.
[07:45] <Thumpxr> What way would i go to backup a LAMP server with various other services? tar and mysql dump + transfer via sftp ?
[07:52] <iDanoo> Thumpxr, my goto is usually rsync all live directories nightly to another drive, with configs + dump, then gzip + upload it offsite
[07:53] <iDanoo> might not be the 'cleanest' but it's pretty effective, then you've got a live backup right there as well as another offsite/online
[08:07] <rbasak> cpaelzer: http://paste.ubuntu.com/23587332/
[08:12] <lordievader> Good morning.
[08:14] <monsune> morning lordievader
[08:19] <lordievader> Hey monsune, how are you?
[08:23] <monsune> lordievader hungry :)
[10:42] <sayan> is there a vagrant libvirt box for ubuntu 16.04?
[12:21] <Genk1> Hello
[12:23] <Genk1> I am wondering what is the best way to migrate a MySQL production server to a new one without Downtime ?
[12:31] <ikonia> Genk1: depends on the database structure and use
[12:31] <rbasak> Genk1: Ubuntu (and Debian)'s packaging doesn't support that, but it might be possible to arrange it. Maybe a better place to ask would be an upstream venue?
[12:32] <rbasak> Stuff like Galera may be relevant, but I don't know much about that.
[12:32] <andol> Genk1: First of all, consider if a short downtime is acceptable or not? Doing a migration with almost no downtime is a lot easier than absolutely no downtime.
[12:33] <andol> Genk1: Also, is it acceptable to have a window where the database is availible, but only in a read mode?
[12:36] <Genk1> thank you guys
[12:36] <Genk1> ikonia, I am using MyISAM as a storage engine
[12:37] <Genk1> andol, No the server is in production therefore updates and insert are mandatory, no read only mode
[12:37] <ikonia> Genk1: so you're doing "writes"
[12:37] <ikonia> not read only
[12:37] <ikonia> and is it transactional
[12:38] <Genk1> ikonia, true
[12:38] <ikonia> Genk1: so you're only real option is multi-master
[12:38] <ikonia> or have an outage
[12:38] <andol> Genk1: Without being able to provide you with the actual details I can tell you that this will be non-trivial. Especially if you want to do it in a safer manner.
[12:38] <Genk1> ikonia, that's what I was told to do
[12:39] <Genk1> ikonia, thank you for your help
[13:14] <spidernik84> anyone of you guys/girls running your own enterprise metal? I'm facing some dilemmas. Like, how do you handle your infra services (dhcp/dns/ldap)? Do you run them in VMs, 1 service per VM?
[13:16] <binia> youprobably could do dhcp and dns off or
[13:16] <binia> one server*
[13:17] <binia> errm
[13:17] <binia> i mean vm
[13:20] <binia> as i virtualize pretty much all servers, ip's are deployed by virtualizor, using dns provider with ddos protected and white label name servers costs pretty much same as running own dns servers
[13:20] <binia> i pay 17.50 usd for 4 dedicated IP's and 50 dns zones, including rdns if needed
[13:26] <ikonia> spidernik84: why don't you just ask the actual question
[13:26] <ikonia> and in relation to ubuntu context
[13:28] <binia> maybe he wants all that on ubuntu, hence asking
[13:28] <binia> heh
[13:28] <spidernik84> ikonia, that was the question.
[13:28] <ikonia> it's not a question
[13:28] <spidernik84> It's not like the general rule "ask the question" applies everytime
[13:29] <spidernik84> I'm starting a conversation, to get opinions
[13:29] <ikonia> it does in this case
[13:29] <binia> to be honest, wouldnt use ubuntu on such vm's with such services
[13:29] <binia> at least centos
[13:29] <ikonia> what other people do doesn't matter as it's a usecase for your setup, needs and infrastructure
[13:29] <spidernik84> ikonia, it matters to me.
[13:29] <ikonia> it shouldn't
[13:29] <ikonia> certainly not without the context of your setup
[13:29] <maswan> spidernik84: I wouldn't put any services *needed* by my virtualisation servers to start up, inside VMs in it.
[13:30] <cpaelzer> rbasak: I'm through all your notes (not only the ones we talked about) and just pushed to the strongswan MP
[13:30] <binia> thats another thing
[13:30] <maswan> resolver, dhcp, ldap, might certainly count for those
[13:30] <cpaelzer> rbasak: ready for step 4 now (but busy in next room)
[13:30] <cpaelzer> rbasak: I might quickly come by to sync if you are there again
[13:30] <binia> should be able to get cheap small server for those
[13:31] <nacc> cpaelzer: he's still in the other meeting (afaik)
[13:31] <spidernik84> We have an infra, and we put all our basic services in VMs, even dhcp. All servers use static addresses. VMs are defined in the puppet nodefile of each kvm host we have. This, naturally, is not sustainable.
[13:31] <spidernik84> I am looking for a different architecture to support our infra. I'm looking into containers, LXD specifically
[13:31] <cpaelzer> thanks nacc
[13:32] <binia> LXC i think you mean
[13:32] <nacc> cpaelzer: np
[13:32] <spidernik84> nope! LXD :)
[13:32] <binia> mhm
[13:32] <spidernik84> it's the "successor", or something like that
[13:32] <binia> never used really
[13:32] <binia> openvz then kvm
[13:32] <spidernik84> based on LXC, but providing a daemon with restful API and better image packaging
[13:32] <spidernik84> it's kinda sweet
[13:34] <ikonia> yeah, depending on a project run and managed by canonical is a risk
[13:34] <ikonia> a project that canonical contribute to, sure, canonical run and own, hmmm
[13:34] <binia> yeah
[13:34] <spidernik84> yeah, well, I can't disagree
[13:35] <spidernik84> Thankfully we are not talking about another unity, upstart or mir
[13:35] <ikonia> how do you know ?
[13:35] <binia> well, i run all my important services on ubuntu
[13:35] <binia> looking into bsd
[13:35] <binia> damn not ubuntu
[13:35] <binia> centos
[13:36] <binia> ubuntu is for not important stuff really
[13:36] <ikonia> I disagree with that
[13:36] <spidernik84> Ahah you are in the right channel for such statements :D
[13:36] <binia> tbh had more problems with ubntu in last 3 months than with debian and centos in last 3 years
[13:36] <ikonia> it certainly can be, if you go into it with the risks under control
[13:36]  * ogra_ guesses wikipedia and netflix would disagree too ... or uber ...
[13:37] <binia> well, im not calling ubuntu bad OS spidernik84 , just saying theres more stable OS's for things you need to work not break
[13:37] <ikonia> ubuntu is a stable OS
[13:37] <ikonia> canonical is not a stable planner
[13:37] <ikonia> thats the risk
[13:37] <spidernik84> I agree
[13:37] <ikonia> it's certainly a risk that can be managed
[13:37] <binia> yeah, could be that
[13:37] <spidernik84> They introduced some major changes between 12.04/14.04/16.04
[13:37] <ikonia> every distro will introduce change
[13:38] <ikonia> or it's not developing
[13:38] <spidernik84> changed directories for critical services, modified how networking worked, etc.
[13:38] <binia> but tis weird doing stupid apt-get update and upgrade afterwards and see things breaking
[13:38] <binia> heh
[13:38] <spidernik84> oh yeah...
[13:38] <binia> never happened on centos, wont say 100% about debian
[13:38] <ikonia> binia: it won't break if you manage yoru system
[13:38] <binia> i do manage my system :)
[13:38] <ikonia> then it wouldn't break
[13:38] <binia> my network even :)
[13:39] <binia> gotta admit, servers that has ubuntu have also software that is 3rd party and updating every week
[13:39] <binia> sometimes they might push some bug by a mistake
[13:39] <binia> not sure did that happened last time but shit went crazy :D
[13:40] <ikonia> binia: so again - ubuntu will not break if you manage your system
[13:40] <ikonia> binia: please don't swear, there isn't a need for it
[13:40] <nacc> also sounds like FUD, since not running 'ubuntu' then
[13:40] <binia> dont spank me for not trusting you :D
[13:40] <binia> sorrry ikonia wont swear
[13:40] <ikonia> no problem
[13:40] <binia> sorry*
[13:41] <binia> but like im saying, i sue ubuntu for some things but refer to use centos if i can really
[13:41] <binia> use*
[13:41] <binia> that damn keyboard
[13:41] <binia> omg!
[13:41] <binia> check batteries, full load
[13:41] <binia> yet seems like its lacking powah
[13:44] <spidernik84> It's a tradeoff. I personally did not enjoy their introduction of the dnssresolver
[13:45] <spidernik84> but I took time to "understand", and started using it as they expected
[13:45] <spidernik84> some of my colleagues where not as understanding and started ripping packages apart. Now that is something you don't do with ubuntu
[13:47] <ikonia> you don't do it with any distro
[13:47] <ikonia> thats nothing to do with ubuntu
[13:47] <ikonia> thats to do with your collegues
[13:48] <sypher> I've not had an issue with Ubuntu LTS, aside from someone trying to dist-upgrade to 14.04 from 12.04 when the 12.04 system hadn't seen updates since 12.04 was released.
[13:49] <spidernik84> ikonia, don't tell me...
[13:51] <ikonia> then stop talking about ubuntu as if it's behaving different than other distros
[13:52] <spidernik84> ikonia, man, did you fall from the bed this morning? Are you always that aggressive? :) I mean't to say "tell me about it..."
[13:52] <spidernik84> s/mean't/meant
[13:52] <ikonia> "now that is something you don't do with ubuntu"
[13:52] <spidernik84> yes yes ok
[13:52] <ikonia> as if it's something you do with other distros, but you don't with ubuntu because it has problems
[13:52] <spidernik84> no need to argue about everything ok?
[13:52] <ikonia> no need to make false statements
[13:53] <ikonia> ok ?
[13:53] <spidernik84> oh ffs get a life
[13:53] <ikonia> you want a discussion, but you make incorrect statements
[13:53] <sypher> I'm with ikonia on this one. Distro wars are annoying. Aside from package manager, they're all the same.
[13:53] <ikonia> then get upset when someone calls it out
[13:54] <spidernik84> I am pro ubuntu, that was not a way to start a distro war
[13:54] <spidernik84> you missed the point
[13:54] <ikonia> because you didn't make a point
[13:54] <spidernik84> I use it everywhere
[13:54] <ikonia> ....and ?
[13:54] <spidernik84> and defended it in many occasions, so you're off target
[13:55] <ikonia> I'm not targeting anything
[15:00] <SipriusPT> hello guys
[15:00] <SipriusPT>  i am where with a weird thing at my smart host
[15:00] <SipriusPT> http://serverfault.com/questions/819032/unable-to-redirect-mail-from-outside-domain-to-outside-domain
[15:01] <SipriusPT> anyone?
[15:06] <SipriusPT> I have a smart host working in a MacosX 10.9.5 with Server App 3, and i have notice that i am just able to redirect mail inside of my smart host (Outlook, Mail app and roundcubemail installed in this server), for example i am just able to send mails from<EMAIL_ADDRESS>to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>where i have a redirection to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>if i try to send mail from<EMAIL_ADDRESS>to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>who is redirecting mail
[15:06] <SipriusPT> i will get this message at mail.log:
[15:07] <SipriusPT> Dec  6 14:37:12 remote.domainX.pt postfix/smtp[28504]: 0B8BD259F57<EMAIL_ADDRESS><EMAIL_ADDRESS>relay=mail.domainX.pt[]:25, delay=0.1, delays=0/0.01/0.07/0.02, dsn=5.0.0, status=bounced (host mail.domainX.pt[] said: 550-Verification failed for<EMAIL_ADDRESS>550-No Such User Here 550 Sender verify failed (in reply to RCPT TO command))
[15:07] <SipriusPT> From what it seems instead of using<EMAIL_ADDRESS>i am getting<EMAIL_ADDRESS>and my remote mail server will give that response. I am just using domainX.pt instead of remote.domainX.pt that i am not using at all.  My mail server remote.domainX.pt is connected to my remote mail server mail.domainX.pt.  Anyone knows how can i solve this?
[15:08] <SipriusPT> mail_version = 2.9.4
[16:06] <zul> coreycb: i think alembic was a bit too old for neutron...ci should be fine now (i hope)
[16:07] <coreycb> zul, ok
[16:07] <ddellav> coreycb zul have you tried installing horizon in zesty yet? I've tried a few ways and even when using whats in main i get a invalid syntax error during collect & compress: http://paste.ubuntu.com/23589188/
[16:08] <zul> ddellav: corey has
[16:13] <coreycb> ddellav, hrm..  that's not good.  i've only tested on xenial-ocata so far
[16:14] <coreycb> ddellav, this looks odd though: /home/david/.local/lib/python2.7/site-packages/eventlet/__init__.py
[16:17] <ddellav> coreycb hmm, yea, thats my venv. I'll disable and try again
[16:17] <hasenov> hello everyone i succesfully installed openstack novalxd using openstack, what is the best way to shut down now?
[16:18] <coreycb> zul, ^
[16:18] <ddellav> coreycb same error, this time it's just /usr/local/lib/python2.7 heh
[16:18] <coreycb> ddellav, i'd recommend using a fresh install
[16:18] <zul> hasenov:  what do you mean shutdown?
[16:18] <hasenov> and then when i start up my pc what is best way to start it all back up?
[16:19] <hasenov> i mean i have all these containers running
[16:19] <ddellav> coreycb alright, ill spin up a vm on serverstack and try it
[16:20] <hasenov> but idk if there is a juju command or whatnot to shutdown and start up
[16:20] <zul> hasenov: when you shutdown the machine the contianers should come back up
[16:20] <zul> rockstar: ^^^
[16:22] <hasenov> so i can just shutdown the host machine with no problem, and then when i start my host back up just issue "lxc start" on all the n number of containers right?
[16:22] <hasenov> like there is no requirement on something needing to start up first
[16:22] <zul> hasenov: coreect
[16:26] <zul> coreycb: you are doing debhelper stuff again?
[16:28] <coreycb> zul, yeah, did something break?
[16:29] <zul> coreycb: http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8080/view/Ocata/job/xenial_ocata_nova-lxd/32/
[16:52] <hasenov> hello another ques, how do i figure out which node is the nova compute node?
[16:52] <hasenov> for the web ui it looks like i can only spawn vm instances and not containers correct?
[16:53] <hasenov> looks like if i want to spawn a lxd container i need to go into the compute node and issue "nova boot --image=trusty --flavor=m1.tiny my-first-openstack-lxd-container
[17:03] <rockstar> hasenov: nova doesn't know you're actually firing up a container. It sees them all as "instances". Commonly, those instances are vms, but in the nova-lxd case, they're containers.
[17:05] <coreycb> zul, alright i need to try some debhelper backport testing in a ppa
[17:05] <rockstar> So you can use horizon to fire up "instances" of nova-lxd that are containers.
[17:05] <rockstar> But the image has to be a supported format.
[17:15] <NOVAtechies> anyone have any advice on why an intel I340 would randomly not work anymore?
[17:16] <NOVAtechies> i'm running 16.04 and just pushed the 4.4.0-53 update
[17:46] <zul> coreycb: fyi https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ceilometer/+bug/1647805
[18:48] <axisys> how do I extend this /boot partition? http://picpaste.com/pics/partitions-j2Tixte5.1481049709.png .. short from backing up and rebuild (posted in #ubuntu as well)
[19:52] <stomplee> axisys, I'm no expert but why extend it?  do an apt-get autoremove which will probably remove a bunch of kernel packages or whatever and free up a bunch of space in that partition
[19:59] <Ussat> axisys, had that exact same issue this am patching
[19:59] <Ussat> easy fix
[20:06] <axisys> i am not sure why my /boot partition is small.. I bump into this a lot and autoremove is not always enough
[20:07] <axisys> I need to atleast up it to 400M
[20:08] <nedbat> These lines are part of a vagrant packer script to build ubuntu boxes: I suspect that they randomly leave something locked so that the next "apt install" blocks forever: https://github.com/boxcutter/ubuntu/blob/master/script/update.sh#L20-L23  What might that lock be?
[20:11] <sarnold> nedbat: do you scrape the output of the apt-get -y dist-upgrade command?
[20:11] <sarnold> wait
[20:11] <sarnold> what's reboot ; sleep 60  do? :)
[20:12] <nedbat> sarnold: i didn't write this script. i was confused by that also.
[20:12] <nedbat> sarnold: packer continues on from there, without a 60-second pause.
[20:12] <sarnold> iirc the 'bash -e' means a failure in apt-get dist-upgrade will cause the script to abort
[20:12] <nedbat> sarnold: is there a lock that would make "apt install" block forever? Googling around, I see messages about "could not get lock"
[21:19] <nedbat> if you had an "apt install" command that blocked forever, what would you look for as the cause
[21:20] <nedbat> ?
[21:21] <tarpman> nedbat: can you pastebin strace output of the 'apt install' that's blocking?
[21:25] <nedbat> tarpman: that's a good idea, i will try that next time it sticks.
[21:28] <nedbat> tarpman: (these are in vagrant packer scripts, and it's only about 50% of the time that it gets stuck)
[21:47] <coreycb> zul, debhelper is fixed up for xenial-ocata
[21:57] <zul> coreycb: ok you going to kick off all those rebuilds right
[21:57] <coreycb> zul, well everything that was failing is successful now
[21:58] <zul> awesome
[22:24] <hhee> guys, how can check out - is root account blocked?
[22:46] <achiang> does anyone here look after the vagrant images?
[22:47] <stomplee> i do to a certain extent
[22:47] <stomplee> what's up?
[22:51] <achiang> stomplee: hey, wondering if you've seen lp #1569237, where the default username of the box is ubuntu, rather than vagrant (which is what vagrant expects)
[22:52] <stomplee> nope haven't run across that one.  if necessary i'd just pull down a working one and repakage as my own box to work around the issue instead of having to wait
[22:52] <stomplee> i currently use yakkety and works just fine
[22:53] <stomplee> you guys stuck using vagrant ssh then?
[22:53] <stomplee> cuz the username shouldn't really be a big issue i would think
[22:53] <achiang> ok, but... considering 16.04 is the LTS, my guess is that "works on yakkety" isn't a good resolution
[22:53] <stomplee> i used xenial before this without issue
[22:54] <stomplee> why is the different username tripping you up?
[22:54] <achiang> out of the box, vagrant expects the user to be "vagrant" - https://www.vagrantup.com/docs/boxes/base.html#quot-vagrant-quot-user
[22:55] <achiang> yes, you can change the username to be ubuntu in your vagrantfile, but there is a lot of code out there that expects the username to be "vagrant"
[22:56] <stomplee> you could also spin up the image, make the necessary changes to make the built in user be vagrant instead of ubuntu and repackage it as well
[22:56] <stomplee> though it is a pain in the butt
[22:57] <achiang> i mean, i agree i can do those things. it's just that the box known as 'ubuntu/xenial64' has some officalness about it, and it would be nice to make it work out of the box with vagrant
[22:58] <achiang> the box known as 'achiang/xenial64' doesn't quite have the same ring
[22:58] <stomplee> lol
[22:59] <stomplee> why would you want code to reference the vagrant user in the first place though
[22:59] <stomplee> better to just run stuff as root and kick off some script to provision some service account so this issue doesn't mess up the pipeline
[23:00] <stomplee> to me anyways, i'm just a noob in this area though so I could be missing something glaring
[23:00] <achiang> i agree it's not great, but that is the default, and people have built out lots of provisioning scripts based on this assumption
[23:01] <achiang> stomplee: i am happy to submit a patch, but i don't know who actually maintains `ubuntu/xenial64`, hence my asking on irc
[23:01] <stomplee> it's canonical themselves
[23:02] <stomplee> but vagrant recommends some other box, i forget by whom though
[23:07]  * achiang randomly pings jcastro ;)


[05:58] <Squirm> morning
[06:58] <Kilos> morning all
[06:58] <kodez> morning uncle Kilos
[06:59] <Kilos> all good kodez ?
[07:01] <kodez> i am better than yesterday, thanks for asking
[07:02] <Squirm> morning
[07:06] <kodez> is there anyone using lubuntu here?
[07:06] <Kilos> hi Squirm
[07:07] <Squirm> kodez: not I, but if it's a general Ubuntu issue you can ask anyway
[07:07] <Squirm> can't say I'm a big fan of LXDE
[07:07] <Kilos> hi Cantide
[07:07] <Cantide> hey Kilos :)
[07:07] <Cantide> how are you/
[07:07] <Cantide> ?
[07:07] <Squirm> hello Cantide
[07:07] <Kilos> good ty and you?
[07:07] <Cantide> Squirm :)
[07:07] <Cantide> Kilos, i'm okay - mild hangover and got 4 hours sleep last night
[07:07] <Squirm> although, LXDE is light :P
[07:07] <Cantide> but it seems i will still be able to study
[07:07] <Kilos> eina
[07:08] <Kilos> self inflicted punishment
[07:08] <Cantide> :D
[07:08] <Squirm> thus why I don't feel sympathy :P
[07:08] <Cantide> yeah, i've been behaving for too long
[07:08] <Cantide> it was just a matter of time
[07:09] <Cantide> it's okay, it was worth it :)
[07:09] <Squirm> meh
[07:09] <Squirm> it never feels worth it the next day :/
[07:09] <Kilos> lol
[07:09] <Cantide> nah, i'm not that hungover, really
[07:10] <Cantide> just a slight headache which might be more from lack of sleep
[07:10] <Squirm> Friday I was out, last night I just had a few beers watching the Sharks win
[07:10] <Cantide> nice :)
[07:10] <Squirm> and the Blue Bulls epic lose
[07:10] <Squirm> I lol'd
[07:10] <Cantide> Squirm, are you from Bloem or DBN?
[07:11] <Cantide> I also lol'd at that :p
[07:11] <Squirm> Cantide: more central kzn
[07:11] <Cantide> aha
[07:11] <Cantide> but you're a Sharks supporter i take it
[07:11] <Squirm> indeed
[07:11] <Cantide> cool :)
[07:11] <Cantide> that game was close
[07:11] <Squirm> where abouts are you from?
[07:12] <Cantide> we always seem to slack off in the first half
[07:12] <Cantide> Durban
[07:12] <Squirm> tbh, I can't believe we won. was an awesome comeback
[07:12] <Cantide> yeah
[07:12] <kodez> how to install pae?
[07:12] <Cantide> sucks to be a cheetahs fan
[07:12] <Kilos> sharks always struggle in the beginning of the cup because half the team is in the boks squad
[07:12] <Squirm> down 21-6
[07:12] <Squirm> and we won
[07:13] <Cantide> Kilos, that's also true, but it's true for bulls and WP, too
[07:14] <Kilos> well see when they are all home again
[07:14] <Squirm> kodez: I don't know, sorry
[07:14] <Kilos> wasnt happy losing to the bulls last week
[07:14] <Cantide> i'm still pining after that loss to the chiefs
[07:14] <Cantide> in the super rugby
[07:14] <Cantide> think i've seen enough rugby for the year
[07:14] <Kilos> ya that was sad
[07:14] <Kilos> like the sharks were payed to lose
[07:15] <Cantide> hmm
[07:15] <Cantide> not so sure about that
[07:16] <Cantide> they ran us off our feet
[07:16] <kodez> if i configure that my laptop must switch off if not used in ten minutes, it does so even if i am playing a movie. how can i correct this?
[07:16]  * Cantide doesn't know about auto-shutdown ._.
[07:18] <Kilos> kodez, is there a lubuntu irc channel
[07:18] <Kilos> yip #lubuntu
[07:19] <Kilos> they might know the ins and outs of lubuntu better
[07:19] <Kilos> hi psydroid
[07:19] <Kilos> yay
[07:19] <CanStudy> i think i'd better get started... else i might procrastinate all day :p
[07:20] <Kilos> lol
[07:20] <psydroid> hi Kilos and CanStudy
[07:20] <CanStudy> hi ^^
[07:21] <kodez> uncle Kilos, I am consistently failing to get an answer from them
[07:22] <Kilos> thats one of those channels where you have to be very patient
[07:22] <Kilos> no other channel seems as quick to offer help as here
[07:23] <kodez> I will keep on trying to research how to fix my laptop
[07:24] <CanStudy> http://askubuntu.com/questions/129366/shutdown-in-specific-way-if-no-one-uses-computer
[07:24] <CanStudy> the last solution on that page sounds good
[07:24] <CanStudy> but i'm no script-guru, so i wouldn't know how suitable it is :-S
[07:24] <CanStudy> trying can't hurt, surely...
[07:25] <Kilos> bbnn
[07:25] <Kilos> gonna sort sheep
[07:31] <kodez> CanStudy, thanks. i now have ideas how to fix my problem
[07:42] <Kilos> kodez, dont you have an option where you can do screensavers and power
[07:43] <Kilos> and make your settings default
[07:45] <kodez> i do. if i use those ones to switch off the system if not used for 10 minutes, it do so even if i am watching a movie
[07:52] <Kilos> lol
[07:52] <Kilos> go change them again
[07:53] <Kilos> set it for never switch off for starters
[07:53] <kodez> i did. i think i must try to use the script to check if i am still using it
[08:01] <kodez> how can i modify the script to check if mplayer or vlc is being used if not switch off?
[09:18] <Kilos> kodez, why did you go for lubuntu
[09:20] <kodez> unity and gnome 3 doesn't work in old laptops and i tried puppy linux and it worked well i then changed it to lubuntu after the launch of ubuntu 12.04
[09:22] <Kilos> doesnt unity 2d work even?
[09:22] <Kilos> my desktop pc is old but it works here
[09:22] <kodez> it does work well
[09:22] <CanStudy> unity 2d is going to be dropped, afaik
[09:23] <Kilos> arent they bringing something else out in its place for older pcs?
[09:23] <Kilos> i read somewhere about a new interface i think its called
[09:24] <kodez> unity doesn't work well in my mother's laptop
[09:24] <Kilos> inetpro, should know
[09:25] <Kilos> i only use 2d as well because when i activate the nvidia-server thing it sees my pc as a lappy and goes 640x480 screen
[09:25] <Kilos> so i gave up and use 2d
[09:27] <CanStudy> lol
[09:27] <CanStudy> tried updating drivers?
[09:28] <kodez> i am happy with lubuntu even it's not in the unity standard
[09:28] <CanStudy> :)
[09:31] <Kilos> i will try lubuntu when my son gets here with the iso sometime
[09:32] <kodez> where are you residing uncle Kilos?
[09:32] <Kilos> pta
[09:33] <kodez> which side? east, west, south?
[09:33] <kodez> or north?
[09:33] <Kilos> west
[09:33] <Kilos> towards brits
[09:34] <kodez> you are far from me. I have the desktop and alternate 32 bit.
[09:34] <Kilos> my son will bring when he gets a chance or has work to do in pta
[09:35] <Kilos> he has downloaded lots of iso's for me
[09:35] <kodez> kwl
[09:35] <Kilos> but im still getting used to unity 2d so no rush
[09:35] <Kilos> but still prefer gnome2
[09:37] <Kilos> i have even tried tinycorelinux but cant get the usb modem to connect without getting more packages
[09:37] <kodez> i prefere gnome2 too
[09:38] <Kilos> it was quicker in my opinion
[09:39] <Kilos> well still is
[09:43] <kodez> let me get my work of the incoming tray and will log in again later
[09:44] <smile4> :)
[09:48] <Kilos> hi smile4
[09:49] <smile4> hi Kilos
[09:49] <smile4> I'm tired
[09:49] <smile4> :p
[10:05] <Squirm> I'm Squirm
[10:05] <Squirm> :p
[10:06]  * Squirm ponders
[10:06] <Squirm> Ubuntu
[10:06] <Squirm> or
[10:06] <Squirm> Mint
[10:09] <smile4> Squirm: both! :p
[10:45] <Squirm> smile4: I'm scared
[10:45] <Squirm> :P
[10:56] <Kilos> you scared Squirm ?
[10:57] <Kilos> oh my
[10:58] <Squirm> what if I break something
[10:58] <Squirm> and then I've lost my data
[10:58] <Kilos> cant you do it in virtual box
[10:59] <Squirm> I want to install Ubuntu
[10:59] <Kilos> then run alongside
[10:59] <Squirm> no
[11:00] <Kilos> why?
[11:00] <Squirm> I have 3 partitions, / and /home and one where I store windows. so if I install it on /, I technically shouldn't lose my data
[11:00] <Squirm> but I'm scared :P
[11:01] <Kilos> backup first
[11:01] <sakhi> techinally you should not loose data as long as backup and create a volume/partition for the new installation.
[11:02] <sakhi> *technically
[11:02] <Squirm> sakhi: I want to overwrite my current distro. there shouldn't be a problem
[11:03] <Squirm> I can format and install it on sda1, because all my non-OS data is on sda5
[11:03] <sakhi> why don't you do-release-upgrade?
[11:04] <sakhi> that way you wont loose data but you will use bandwidth
[11:04] <Squirm> possible to move from Debian Squeeze to Ubuntu Natty?
[11:09] <Squirm> na
[11:09] <Squirm> I'll format
[11:09] <Squirm> mebbe tomorrow
[14:35] <Kilos> Maaz, coffee on
[14:35]  * Maaz starts grinding coffee
[14:35] <Kilos> kbmonkey, you here?
[14:35] <Kilos> hi superfly
[14:37] <superfly> hi Kilos
[14:39] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for Kilos!
[14:39] <Kilos> Maaz, ty
[14:39] <Maaz> You are welcome Kilos
[15:32] <Cantide> so Ubuntu just died on me -.-
[15:32] <Cantide> PC froze, when i rebooted had a nice little kernel panic
[15:32] <Cantide> i think the kernel got corrupt when it froze
[15:33] <Cantide> how do i fix this without reinstalling?
[15:47] <Symmetria> dammit
[15:47] <Symmetria> Im gonna have to switch to using cli exclusively
[15:47] <Symmetria> my damn dog just stole my second wireless mouse
[15:47] <Symmetria> and chewed it up
[15:48] <Kilos> Cantide, can you boot to grub menu and go recovery
[15:48] <Cantide> i tried
[15:48] <Cantide> it failed
[15:48] <Kilos> ok
[15:48] <Cantide> http://askubuntu.com/questions/28099/how-to-restore-a-system-after-accidentally-removing-all-kernels
[15:48] <Cantide> this looks okay
[15:48] <Kilos> boot from cd then get boot-repair
[15:48] <Cantide> i'll give it a shot..
[15:49] <Kilos> ok try that first
[15:50] <Kilos> Cantide, how did you get here if you cant boot
[15:50] <Kilos> http://www.howopensource.com/2012/05/reinstall-recover-grub-from-ubuntu-12-04-live-cd-usb/
[15:50] <Cantide> sometimes it reaches grub
[15:50] <Cantide> sometimes it doesn't
[15:51] <Cantide> had a kernel panic once
[15:51] <Cantide> another time i didn't
[15:51] <Kilos> ok try till you see recovery then use that
[15:54] <Kilos> otherwise option 2 here
[15:54] <Kilos> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Boot-Repair
[16:01] <Cantide> i think i need to reboot to see if i fixed it
[16:02] <smile4> bye
[16:02] <smile4> :p
[16:02] <Cantide> '-'
[16:02] <Kilos> cheers smile4
[16:02] <smile4> byebye :)
[16:37] <Kilos> oh my cantide didnt win, looks like
[16:39] <Symmetria> hrm
[16:39] <Symmetria> I want something that can read mp3 id3 tags and make me a nice html index
[16:39] <Symmetria> :p
[16:41] <Symmetria> hrm it seems that mp3tag can do that
[16:42] <Kilos> Symmetria, are you using ubuntu?
[16:42] <Symmetria> kilos using about every operating system you can name :)
[16:42] <Symmetria> I have loads of machines here at home
[16:42] <Kilos> http://forums.cnet.com/7723-6617_102-514512/how-to-edit-id3-tags-in-ubuntu/
[16:43] <Symmetria> heh, I got a tag editor, been editing tags alllll day
[16:43] <Symmetria> now I just wanna make pretty index's
[16:43] <Symmetria> :)
[16:43] <Kilos> ah
[16:43] <Symmetria> got about 17 thousand tracks not properly tagged yet
[16:43] <Symmetria> in the mp3 section
[16:43] <Symmetria> maybe another 15 thousand flacs
[16:43] <Kilos> your music is gonna be the death of you
[16:43] <Symmetria> which means Im 2/3rds of the way through :p
[16:44] <Symmetria> actually real easy to tag with the software Im using
[16:44] <Symmetria> select the album, tell the software to search amazon for the album, hit review, make sure that the tagging matches up with the actual tracks and hit go
[16:44] <Symmetria> and it tags the album with the album art from amazon and the proper track names, numbers, etc
[16:45] <Kilos> one by one
[16:45] <Kilos> ?
[16:45] <Kilos> you gonna be old and gray before you finished
[16:45] <Symmetria> heh no, it does it basically an album at a time
[16:45] <Kilos> whew
[16:45] <Symmetria> then hit another button and it renames all the files nicely and puts em in nice directories
[16:46] <Symmetria> with some pretty cool regex's
[16:46] <Symmetria> lol, hold on, will show you something
[16:46] <Symmetria> kilos whats your email addy :)
[16:47] <Kilos><EMAIL_ADDRESS>[16:50] <Symmetria> there
[16:50] <Symmetria> :p go look at that
[16:50] <Kilos> ok
[16:51] <Symmetria> heh everything thats not in the unsorted section is correctly tagged, with correct album art etc
[16:52] <Kilos> holy moly
[16:52] <Kilos> will take years to listen to all of that
[16:52] <Symmetria> lol, scary thing is, if its not a bootleg or impossible to buy, I own originals for I would recon 99% of that
[16:52] <Symmetria> :p
[16:52] <Kilos> whew
[16:53] <Kilos> no master of reality by sabbath
[16:53] <Kilos> or have i got the wrong group
[16:53] <Symmetria> hrm, if I dont have it lol, I'll probably find it when I do my next check against what Im missing in discographies and get it then
[16:54] <Symmetria> every so often I take each artist and do a search and fill in missing albums
[16:54] <Symmetria> :p
[16:54] <Kilos> ah
[16:54] <Kerbero> i would in such a case just index all my music in a mysql database
[16:54] <Kerbero> and write a php script to display w/e on a website
[16:55] <Symmetria> heh yeah i should do that
[16:55] <Kilos> http://www.amazon.com/Master-Reality-Black-Sabbath/dp/B000002KDO
[16:55] <Kerbero> it is basically what i did with my series
[16:55] <Kilos> dunno why i remember that
[16:56] <Kilos> musta enjoyed it 100 years ago
[16:56] <Symmetria> heh some of the stuff I have to actually scan the damn artwork myself because not even amazon can find it :p
[16:58] <Symmetria> you know something is pretty rare when amazon, discogz and freedb cant match it
[16:59] <Kerbero> indeed
[17:00] <Kerbero> i had it a lot with some classical cd's of my parents
[17:00] <Kerbero> and some afrikaans artists' cd's
[17:00] <Kilos> its no wonder youre always complaining about prices
[17:00] <Kilos> music costs
[17:02] <Symmetria> heh kilos I dont even wanna know how much Ive spent on my music collection
[17:02] <Symmetria> its an insanely sick amount
[17:02] <Symmetria> similar to my book collection
[17:02] <Kilos> lol
[17:02] <Symmetria> lol, I have 1300 fantasy titles in my book library excluding my ebooks
[17:03] <Symmetria> 1300 books x average of 120 bux a book probably = way 2 much money :p
[17:30] <magespawn> evening all
[17:32] <Kilos> hi magespawn
[17:32] <magespawn> hey Kilos
[17:32] <Kilos> my external was mounted as /media/usb0 and 1
[17:35] <magespawn> ahh there we go, nice to find the answer
[17:35] <Kilos> but had to go into home filesystem to find it
[17:36] <Kilos> booted from maverick again and they show on desktop as backup and storage
[17:37] <Kilos> hows things by you?
[17:42] <Cantide> good news
[17:42] <Cantide> i got it working '-'
[17:42] <Kilos> yay wb
[17:42] <Cantide> bad news
[17:42] <Kilos> uh oh
[17:42] <Cantide> i fought with a girl for a few hours else i would have been back online sooner
[17:42] <Kilos> lol
[17:43] <magespawn> good thanks Kilos
[17:43] <Kilos> woulda been bad news if you pc was dead
[17:43] <Cantide> yeah, because i can't buy another PC
[17:43] <Kilos> Cantide, save that last link i gave you
[17:43] <Cantide> but i can buy another girl :p
[17:43] <Kilos> lol
[17:43] <Cantide> boot repair thingy?
[17:43] <Cantide> i'll find it again if i need it :p
[17:43] <magespawn> not a good thing to fight with a girl, you always lose even if you thinknyou have won
[17:43] <Cantide> oh, i won
[17:44] <Cantide> and she got upset so she left
[17:44] <Kilos> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Boot-Repair
[17:44] <Cantide> she knew that i knew i won
[17:44] <Kilos> that works when nothing else does Cantide
[17:44] <Cantide> thanks Kilos :)
[17:44] <nuvolari> eek :-/ had no electricity for just over 13 hours today :(
[17:44] <Kilos> haha magespawn  you so right
[17:44] <nuvolari> howdy oom Kilos, magespawn, Cantide
[17:44] <Kilos> eish nuvolari
[17:45] <magespawn> hey nuvolari
[17:45] <Cantide> hello :)
[17:45] <Cantide> welcome back to civilisation :p
[17:45] <magespawn> buy a solar panel, generator and a big ups
[17:45] <nuvolari> thank you! We are so dependent on electricity it's not even funny
[17:46] <Cantide> and a bicycle (hamster wheel style)
[17:46] <nuvolari> what do you do an entire day without a computer? :O
[17:46]  * nuvolari napped
[17:46] <Kilos> sleep
[17:46] <nuvolari> lol
[17:46] <Kilos> hehe
[17:46] <nuvolari> ok, and played guitar a little bit
[17:46] <magespawn> take photos
[17:46] <Cantide> sometimes it's a good thing :p
[17:47] <nuvolari> magespawn: that solar panel can come in handy!
[17:47] <magespawn> right with a pen and paper
[17:47] <magespawn> indeed
[17:47] <nuvolari> Cantide: +1 on that
[17:47] <magespawn> superfly you around?
[17:47] <nuvolari> one needs a break from tech, even the basic household electronics, once in a while
[17:48] <magespawn> yup indeed
[17:48] <nuvolari> magespawn: right, one can even write :P
[17:48]  * nuvolari ducks
[17:48] <Kilos> hehe
[17:48] <magespawn> that too
[17:49]  * magespawn slaps nuvolari with a wet trout
[17:50]  * nuvolari hangs his fishy smelling shirt up by magespawn's PC
[17:50] <magespawn> lol
[17:50] <nuvolari> there
[17:50] <magespawn> i wonder why the fish always gets it
[17:51] <nuvolari> oh no, this isn't happening... this isn't happening!!! :(
[17:51] <magespawn> bye nuvolari
[17:51] <Kilos> ?
[17:51] <nuvolari> great, the one area at the office is becoming a temporary nursery...
[17:51] <nuvolari> no, electricity is fine now :P
[17:51] <Kilos> now you can have kids
[17:51] <magespawn> ooh thought the power was going again
[17:52] <nuvolari> having babbies crying and pooping around the office is not the best of ideas IMHO
[17:52] <Kilos> lol
[17:52] <magespawn> you at the office now?
[17:52] <nuvolari> no
[17:52] <Cantide> somehow i pictured plants before babies..
[17:52] <nuvolari> just got an email from the CEO
[17:52] <nuvolari> Cantide: yeh, that would be better, 'green' and silent
[17:53] <nuvolari> Kilos: I still need a woman to have them with :P
[17:53] <nuvolari> otherwise I'm quite stuck
[17:53] <Kilos> oh ya
[17:54] <magespawn> www.russianbrides.com
[17:54] <nuvolari> bwahaha
[17:54]  * nuvolari takes a peek anyhow
[17:54] <Kilos> there some cute ruskies
[17:55] <Cantide> nuvolari, well, there is a girl in Busan right now
[17:55] <Cantide> who may be vulnerable
[17:55] <Cantide> just saying
[17:55] <nuvolari> Busan? where's that?
[17:55] <Cantide> South Korea
[17:55] <Cantide> just swim there quickly
[17:56] <magespawn> bit far
[17:56] <nuvolari> I think I prefer ze russians
[17:58] <magespawn> fish 1 is now making his own starcraft maps
[17:58] <nuvolari> wait, what did I miss? fish 1?
[17:58] <magespawn> kid
[17:59] <nuvolari> ooh :P
[18:00] <superfly> magespawn: sorta, what's up?
[18:02] <magespawn> when you use the Go Launcher Ex did remove the HTC Sense?
[18:04] <superfly> magespawn: I don't have an HTC. but as far as I know, it replaces it, but it shouldn't remove it completely
[18:05] <magespawn> ohh you using it on a sumsung then?
[18:05] <superfly> no, on a Kindle
[18:06] <magespawn> no it does not, when using the home button from a program i get a choice of which one to use
[18:06] <magespawn> hah
[18:07] <superfly> magespawn: yes, and I was given the option of making one of the the default action
[18:08] <magespawn> ahh I did not do that, will rectify that shortly
[18:10] <magespawn> ahh ty if i used the choice without defaulting it was taking a long while to load
[19:17] <magespawn> night all
[19:35] <Kilos> night magespawn and others


[00:19] <AndroUser> Hello
[00:22] <AndroUser> Anyone around who might be able to lend a hand to a first time user attempting an install?
[00:32] <Bashing-om> AndroUser: Depends - what is holding you up ?
[00:37] <AndroUser> I'm using a bootable USB, on a 32-bit system and Xubuntu 18.04. I get a screen saying some ACPI errors of things not found, but it moves on to the loading screen (says Xubuntu and has dots going across), then it goes to a screen that says OK for a bunch of starting services and they're all saying OK. That's when it seems to stall and go to a black screen with a blinking cursor but it won't allow me to type anything
[00:39] <AndroUser> Tried Alt+Fkeys, and Ctrl+alt+Fkeys... I'm wondering if it's still just installing things and I just need to give it more time or if it's actually having some kind of issue
[00:40] <AndroUser> Been on this screen for about 20 min
[00:43] <AndroUser> USB LED isn't showing any activity but the Ethernet port is blinking quite a bit
[00:56] <Edenaluuk> Hi
[00:57] <Edenaluuk> I think my Nickname was AndroUser or something, but I had asked about my attempt at an Xubuntu installation
[00:59] <guiverc> Edenaluuk, if using a 'live' system, did you verify your write to media? or are you running from an installed system on thumb-drive?
[01:02] <Edenaluuk> I have a blank HDD and the Xubuntu (I believe it's the install iso, not a full OS) on the USB - but I haven't been able to get to a command prompt to do any type of verifications
[01:04] <Edenaluuk> I don't want to be that annoying guy who doesn't Google things first, but most of what I've found on Google involves entering commands which I haven't figured out
[01:09] <guiverc> Edenaluuk, when you first boot up, the menu includes a "Check disc for defects" (see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/CDIntegrityCheck) but note on most boxes you'll see a keys-in-box & person-in-circle type symbols, press a key when you see that to see the menu; applies to all flavors
[01:09] <guiverc> your other alternative if you're running it, is ctrl+alt+F4 and login to TTY terminal..  (does that work)
[01:10] <guiverc> my guess from your description is you have squashfs errors (bad write to media), or video/gpu issues (nomodeset required maybe)
[01:10] <Bashing-om> Edenaluuk: Set in bios to boot the USB - at the splash screen depress the escape key -> language screen; escape key again -> boot options screen, Here see what "check disk for defects' relates. will take a bit of time for the check to run.
[01:13] <Edenaluuk> Awesome, will give it a try, thank you!
[01:13] <Edenaluuk> Also doing some digging because it's an old VIA C7 processor and it might be something to do with the CPU instruction sets
[01:15] <guiverc> Edenaluuk, 18.04 does require a i686 grade cpu I believe (Debian & Ubuntu both call all x86/32bit i386, linux kernel makes distinctions), but you get a clear kernel message saying kernel needed is 686, you hav i586 for example
[01:18] <Edenaluuk> Got it, I'll do some more googling on that. Thank you!
[01:20] <guiverc> Edenaluuk, I don't think you'll need to, whilst I don't know/remember your via c7 cpu (I do recall problems with via video having security flaws & thus being dropped from later linux, and all windows), the message is clear in my opinion, or any time I've seen it
[01:32] <Edenaluuk> Yeah I haven't seen a kernel error, or any errors. Did some further digging and it's Pentium M equivalent (using the P6/i686 microarchitecture), and includes MMX, SSE, SSE2, and SSE3 instruction sets
[01:35] <Edenaluuk> I think I'll just keep tinkering for a bit lol
[01:37] <Bashing-om> guiverc: Edenaluuk In 18.04 do we still need to "force" PAE ? https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PAE .
[01:38] <guiverc> I have tested pentium M & pentium 4 machines, most do NOT need to force PAE, however a thinkpad r50p I have DOES require `forcepae --forcepae`  (it's an older pentium M)
[01:39] <Unit193> Some Pentium M systems might, but regardless Xubuntu isn't really the system to look at for i386.
[01:39] <guiverc> ^ was referring to 18.04, most required forcepae for 16.04 GA kernel
[01:49] <Edenaluuk> When the screen with keyboard and man in a circle shows up I'm spamming buttons on my keyboard but it doesn't do anything
[01:51] <guiverc> Edenaluuk, you have to be pretty quick, too slow & the keystrokes are ignored..
[01:51] <Bashing-om> Edenaluuk: USB or ps2 keyboard ? maybe check in bios for " enable USB" ?
[01:52] <Edenaluuk> So I'm not able to even get to the check disk for defects or other suggestions. USB keyboard...but I can use the keyboard on the BIOS screens
[01:53]  * guiverc just tested a xubuntu 18.04.4 i386 ISO on pentium 4 box nearby, I used space-bar (out-of-habit); but boxes can be unique & act different on the same ISO/media due to different firmware
[01:55] <guiverc> if the menu doesn't occur, normally I'd try it on another box with intention of running 'check disc for defects' there.. if it fails on both boxes (or I can't get it to appear/run), I assume it's a bad write & return to ISO validation & re-write to media
[01:58] <guiverc> the other option I alluded to before was trying to switch to term (TTY) and look for squashfs errors (`dmesg|grep squashfs` or equiv) assuming that is possible, if it's not I'd blame bad write to media anyway)
[01:59] <Edenaluuk> Good call, I'll see if I can get it working on my main PC. Couldn't get to the terminal. Thank you so much for all the help
[01:59]  * guiverc adds the dmesg|grep will result in what I think of as copyright/version messages, that is good & expcted, errors are not
[02:25] <Edenaluuk> So the USB is working great on my main PC, checked for disk defects and no errors, so I'm thinking the keyboard just isn't registering, time to play with the BIOS (the mobo has like 40 different jumpers so I'll look through those too...ok so it's more like 10 jumpers, but still a lot more than I'm used to seeing)
[04:23] <Edenaluuk> Also for posterity, Xubuntu 18.04 has a 32-bit download available, but it appears it was only 64-bit when it was released. I am very open to other distro recommendations for 32-bit systems (and/or if anyone knows of distros known to play nice with via c7-d CPU integrated in a via cx700 chipset mobo)
[04:39] <guiverc> Edenaluuk, I didn't understand your last, Xubuntu provided 32bit ISOs for 18.04, 18.10 (and into the alpha cycle of 19.04); I know as I tested & used them  (x86 was fully supported till end of 19.04 life)
[04:41] <Edenaluuk> Maybe I misunderstood/misinterpreted your earlier message that "Xubuntu isn't really the system to look at for i386"
[04:42] <guiverc> Edenaluuk, that was an opinion, XFCE has now fully upgraded from GTK2 (lighter) to GTK3 and thus uses more resources.. Just like MATE got slower on pentium M laptops, XFCE slowed as it made that move as well... ie progress means things change, older CPUs are limited & can struggle.
[04:43] <guiverc> You can still use them (I still have a thinkpad t43 on here running 18.04) , but I use it for things it can do, am careful with my software choices, what co-exists in ram (it only has 1.5gb ram)
[04:44] <guiverc> Edenaluuk, I think you're referring to a message from a developer, not me
[04:46]  * guiverc clarifies, the slow down of MATE & XFCE as they moved from GTK2 to GTK3 was rather noticable on pentium M, but on higher-grade c2d cpus it was almost undetectable & maybe just because I was expecting it... ie. cpu limitations on really old cpus
[07:37] <kattalinux> hello all


[12:02] <yolanda> jamespage, btw, were you able to take a look at heat?
[12:30] <mthaddon> if I have an extremely high revision number for a charm is that likely to cause problems when running upgrade-charm? "date +%s > revision && juju upgrade-charm" - my upgrade-charm hook seems to be running for a long time, taking a lot of CPU
[12:57] <marcoceppi> mthaddon: interesting Why are you even changing the revision? Juju should do that for you during upgrade-charm
[13:12] <ashipika> hey all.. just a quick one.. on bootstrap (in a VM): ERROR juju supercommand.go: 282 unrecognised architecture: precise
[13:16] <marcoceppi> ashipika: precise isn't an architecture, it's a series. What bootstrap/deploy command are you running?
[13:17] <ashipika> juju bootstrap --upload-tools --show-log.. null provider..
[13:17] <ashipika> i know it's a series, that's why i'm confused
[13:21] <mthaddon> marcoceppi: this charm doesn't have a revision file in the tree, so I need to manually create it - I realise this is possibly non-standard behaviour, but when you're relying on juju upgrade-charm for code rollouts having that file versioned can be problematic
[13:22] <marcoceppi> mthaddon: interesting concept. I have no idea what would cause juju to hang though. Try increasing the log verbosity for the service and seeing what shows up in the unit/machine log
[13:24] <mthaddon> marcoceppi: upgrade-charm seems to be checking if each previous revision exists for this env somehow
[13:24]  * mthaddon is just going to start from scratch
[13:28] <ashipika> marcoceppi: found an error.. when trying to ssh to the computer it fails to add the host to the know_hosts file (permission issues), so there is an extra line in the output of the detection script.. all lines get shifted by one line down..
[13:29] <ashipika> that is why it fails to properly parse the architecture
[13:29] <ashipika> and gets the series instead
[13:47] <X-warrior> morning
[13:58] <Luca__> marcoceppi: I keep getting this agent-state-info: 'hook failed: "ha-relation-changed"' when trying to add hacluster to mysql...
[13:58] <Luca__> any idea?
[14:17] <jamespage> marcoceppi, I'm helping Luca__ with that issue - worth noting that all of the openstack charms default to using eth0 for HA - but juju now configured a bridge automatically so it needs to be br0
[14:18] <marcoceppi> jamespage: ah, cool
[15:31] <jcsackett> sinzui: fighting g+, be at the 1x1 in a few.
[15:48] <jcastro> jamespage, for the docs, for charm features we have "the service shouldn't run as root"
[15:48] <jcastro> I want to crosslink to upstart docs to give people a clue on how they can do this
[15:48] <jcastro> http://upstart.ubuntu.com/cookbook/#run-a-job-as-a-different-user
[15:48] <jcastro> is this the right section?
[16:02] <jcastro> marcoceppi, do we have a link to something like "how to use amulet" for charm authors?
[16:02] <marcoceppi> jcastro: no, I'm writing that now actually
[16:02] <marcoceppi> in preperation for the release
[16:02] <jcastro> do you know where it will live URL wise?
[16:02] <jcastro> I'd like to crosslink
[16:04] <jamespage> jcastro, yes - thats right
[16:05] <marcoceppi>  jcastro howto-amulet.html probably
[16:06] <jcastro> authors-amulet.html seems to match more?
[16:06] <jcastro> actually howto is fine
[16:06] <jcastro> ok let's do that. :)
[16:17] <jcastro> marcoceppi, hey I think I messed up an MP for docs
[16:17] <jcastro> I just pushed a branch but it appears to have updated another one I had done earlier?
[16:17] <jcastro> https://code.launchpad.net/juju-core
[16:45] <marcoceppi> jcastro: it looks like you did a bzr push twice for two different branches?
[16:47] <jcastro> yeah I dunno why it did that, sent nick a mail and he'll just pull  from the right one
[17:23] <jcastro> hey sinzui
[17:23] <jcastro> I am doing my talk proposal for SCaLE 12x in February.
[17:24] <jcastro> " Any Ubuntu machine with an open SSH port can be managed by Juju." won't be a lie by then right? :)
[17:24] <jcastro> aka how's the manual provider looking these days?
[17:24] <marcoceppi> jcastro: thumper was saying he landed stuff to make it better last night
[17:25] <sinzui> jcastro, buggy and specifically with ssh
[17:25] <marcoceppi> err
[17:25] <jcastro> sinzui, buggy as in bad or buggy as in "I have 2 months worth of work until the talk"
[17:25] <marcoceppi> misspoke
[17:25] <sinzui> jcastro, We do want this production ready in January
[17:25] <jcastro> perfect, so submitting that statement for a February conference won't get my killed by the audience
[17:26] <sinzui> jcastro, or...I use your conference as an excuse to escalate a cluster (F) or ssh bugs
[17:26] <jcastro> that would be fine
[17:26] <jcastro> is there a tag for manual provider specific bugs I can follow along?
[17:27] <sinzui> manual-provider actually
[17:28] <utlemming> Just announced the Juju Quickstart Images: http://blog.utlemming.org
[17:28] <jcastro> oh cool, I'll share that around in a minute utlemming
[17:29] <arosales> utlemming, very nice blog post http://blog.utlemming.org/2013/12/beta-cross-platform-juju-development.html
[17:29] <arosales> utlemming, I think there is a "quickstart" plugin that is different from yours though.  I think your vagrant images is more of a local charm development work flow
[17:29] <arosales> for clearity
[17:30] <arosales> utlemming, but really nice work !
[17:30] <jcastro> yeah you can't call it quickstart
[17:31] <jcastro> unless we start naming various tools and aliases under "quickstart"
[17:31] <jcastro> which is fine by me if they behave the same
[17:32] <utlemming> hrm, I agree. If the effect is the same, Quickstart plugin vs Quickstart images, conveys the same idea: getting quickly started
[17:33] <jcastro> yeah
[17:34]  * marcoceppi is having flashbacks to bundle discussion wrt naming
[17:36] <jcastro> utlemming, you going to announce anywhere else or want me to handle it now? Don't want to douple post if you plan on
[17:37] <utlemming> jcastro: it landed on planet Ubuntu. But seeing as your the man with all the connects, if you would like to spred the message, that'd be great.
[17:40] <jcastro> utlemming, typo "Chose" the box in your header
[17:40] <jcastro> also why not recommend 12.04 by default?
[17:47] <rick_h_> utlemming: jcastro just a heads up that we might want to watch the quickstart branding as we bring the juju quickstart command up to users. https://launchpad.net/juju-quickstart
[18:10] <jcastro> rick_h_, yeah, we should def keep that in mind
[18:17] <lazypower> Hey thats cool. I was experimenting around with vagrant based juju development a while ago and had some marginal success using sshuttle to route the requests into vagrant....
[18:19] <lazypower> marcoceppi: this is basically the route we took when you came up to visit.
[19:26] <mxc> have some juju security questions
[19:27] <mxc> which i haven't been able to answer from reading the docs
[19:30] <mxc> specifically fire walling, creating juju instances, without exposing them (on azure at least) opens up a public port 22 to the world
[19:31] <mxc> is it possible to deploy charms (say mongodb for example) with very strict ufw/iptables configs?
[19:31] <mxc> or, would I have to basically fork the charms to do that?
[19:32] <sarnold> mxc: investigate the subordinate charms
[19:35] <mxc> thanks, but I may be missing something.
[19:36] <mxc> here's my situation, basically i want to have an environment like :
[19:36] <mxc> [ haproxy ] <--> [ app servers ] <--> [mongodb ]
[19:36] <mxc> where the app servers and mongodb are completely unreachable from the outside world
[19:43] <marcoceppi> mxc: by default only port 22 is available to servers
[19:43] <marcoceppi> all other ports are disabled unless you explicitly enable them
[19:44] <marcoceppi> you can supplement this, by creating a firewall charm
[19:44] <marcoceppi> that you can deploy on all of the service you care about, that restrict access by creating ufw, iptables, whatever on that machines
[19:44] <marcoceppi> this is done with a subordinate charm
[19:44] <mxc> aaah ok. now I get how the subordinate charms help
[19:45] <mxc> i create a ufw subordinate charm, add it to my config for the mongo charm etc
[19:45] <mxc> thanks!
[20:44] <med_> marcoceppi, is co-location still called co-location (kind of a meta question)
[20:46] <marcoceppi> med_: you're talking about the --to command, and I assume containerization?
[20:46] <med_> marcoceppi, related: can you have a constraint that only deploys "NEWCHARM" if "OLDCHARM" exists?
[20:46] <med_> marcoceppi, thanks, that's probably what I needed, "--to"
[20:47] <marcoceppi> we have "hulk smash" colocation, where you can just smash two services together with --to, we're making a better container story so you can truly co-locate two services on a physical machine via something like LXC
[20:48] <med_> "hulk smash" is probably more what I was thinking of then. And I'm more worried about "already available to users" vs "coming soon"
[20:48] <marcoceppi> med_: there's no constraint like that, you'd have to codify it yourself
[20:48] <med_> nod, that's what I thought
[20:48] <marcoceppi> med_: but we have plugins, so you could create `juju deploy-only-if`
[20:50] <med_> ah, I've found: https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/charms-deploying.html#deploying-to-machines
[20:50] <marcoceppi> med_: juju help deploy should also contain a good amout of information
[20:50] <med_> where do I read up on "deploy-only-if" or are you saying that's a plugin I need to write?
[20:51] <med_> I think you are saying I could write that myself in my copious free time.
[20:51] <marcoceppi> med_: yes, you could write that if you so wished to :)
[20:52] <med_> thanks marcoceppi . Fount of knowledge as per usual.
[21:21] <marcoceppi> hey sinzui for the charts on the review-queue how far back do they go?
[21:22] <sinzui> marcoceppi, The data varies. Some only from the moment the feature arrived in production.
[21:22] <marcoceppi> sinzui: anyway to have only show the last X months? Or possibly reset the stats?
[21:23] <sinzui> marcoceppi, not at this moment. jcsackett do you have any thoughts about marcoceppi 's question regarding http://manage.jujucharms.com/tools/review-queue
[21:23] <marcoceppi> sinzui jcsackett it's just defeating that the max wait time is 22 months
[21:23] <marcoceppi> that's not entirely accurate
[21:24] <marcoceppi> and average wait time is more like 5 days now, but because of such outliers it's going to take a long time to drop down
[21:24] <sinzui> I would think a breakdown of week, month, and quarter/year would be more informative
[21:25] <marcoceppi> I'm really just concerned with what the last 30 days have been as an average
[21:25] <marcoceppi> anything past that is just historical
[21:26] <sinzui> marcoceppi, I have some list of metrics to gather. We can definitely tune the sparklines since we need to revisit the data to gather the metrics
[21:26] <marcoceppi> sinzui: thanks! appreciate it
[22:29] <jcsackett> sinzui, marcoceppi: i think we can probably alter the window we're looking at without too much work. but truthfully the problem is i think you're interested in current max, not historical max. which is also probably not too difficult a tweak.
[22:30] <marcoceppi> well, max is one example, Really I just want to see a moving average of how long it takes for us to respond
[22:30] <jcsackett> marcoceppi: is it fair to say that min and max aren't really that useful? we added it in on one mention, but average is all i hear anyone talking about, really.
[22:31] <marcoceppi> I need to know, lets say, in the past X days, our average response time is X (hours hopefully, if not days)
[22:31] <jcsackett> marcoceppi: so i'm hearing a yes. you're not looking at min and max, really.
[22:31] <marcoceppi> Min and max are nice if they follow that same time window, but they're not nearly as important i odnt' think
[22:31] <jcsackett> sinzui, marcoceppi: how do we feel about just dropping display of min and max?
[22:32] <marcoceppi> jcastro: ^
[22:32] <jcsackett> i'd like to keep collecting it in case we need to craft a different report, but on review queue we could just show average.
[22:32] <sinzui> jcsackett, I don't think the min/max are interesting.
[22:33] <jcsackett> well, if jcastro doesn't object, i can whack the display of that and tweak average to only show the last 30 days worth of info in not too much time at all.
[22:33] <marcoceppi> jcsackett: Okay, executive decision, do that
[22:33] <marcoceppi> I dont' think jcastro will object
[22:34] <sinzui> jcsackett, given that the edges are exceptional, we may want to drop them
[23:32] <mxc> marcoceppi: does juju on ec2 use restrictive security group settings?
[23:32] <marcoceppi> mxc: what do you mean by restrictive security group settings?
[23:32] <mxc> well, basically i want to make sure that the mongo instances are only accessible from the app server instances
[23:33] <mxc> and the app servers are only accessible from haproxy
[23:33] <mxc> on azure, juju doesn't set up endpoint ACLs which is why your idea of an iptables subordinate service might have to be the way to go
[23:33] <marcoceppi> mxc: yes, juju on ec2 creates a sec group per unit and applies a restrictive setting. Only when juju expose is run does it open ports
[23:33] <mxc> ah, that was my question
[23:34] <mxc> so that would save me from having to create a separate instance
[23:34] <marcoceppi> mxc: if I understand you correctly, yes
[23:38] <mxc> i mean separate service
[23:38] <mxc> subordinated
[23:39] <marcoceppi> ah, then yes


[12:48] <shakes808> morning
[12:53] <cmaloney> morning
[12:53] <cmaloney> reminder: release party tonignt
[12:54] <cmaloney> be there or wait a year
[12:54] <jrwren> hrm. why don't we do october release parties? Just the convenience of PC?
[12:55] <cmaloney> because then i have to do more work. ;)
[12:55] <jrwren> :)
[12:55] <cmaloney> we could if someone wanted to sort out the details
[12:56] <jrwren> yup
[12:56] <jrwren> i'll have to remember and then decide in september if I want to plan something ;)
[12:57] <cmaloney> rhat would be cool
[12:57] <cmaloney> also pcon tends to hit the lts releases
[12:57] <jrwren> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReleaseSchedule  no artsy schedule up yet :(
[16:38] <greg-g> jrwren: it's easy, pick a good bar in A2, say you'll be there, go, drink, that's it :)
[16:41] <jrwren> exactly my thought.
[17:52] <rick_h> ok, I want this for my wife's van. https://techcrunch.com/2017/04/28/bmws-plug-in-hybrid-530e-iperformance-will-get-wireless-charging/
[17:56] <jrwren> wireless charging for a car? 3.2kW?  wow.
[17:57] <rick_h> jrwren: exactly. No cord/plug on the wall. Just park and go
[18:03] <greg-g> wireless power is crazy
[18:04] <greg-g> I mean, when I think about it I understand it, but when I'm just on auto-pilot thinking it's like "YOU'RE GOING TO BURN DOWN THE WORLD!"
[18:04] <rick_h> greg-g: well on a phone I was ok
[18:04] <rick_h> greg-g: but on a car level...whoa
[18:04] <greg-g> yeah, it's like licking a 9V battery versus a car battery
[18:05] <rick_h> That does give me another nudge to want to do solar at home. Would be awesome to charge the van over solar though it's at work during the day so...oh well
[18:05] <jrwren> i don't trust or believe in teh car think.
[18:05] <rick_h> so close yet so far
[18:05] <jrwren> that is a techcrunch article. its vapor.
[18:06] <jrwren> i'll believe it when I see it :0
[18:06] <rick_h> lol
[18:06] <rick_h> well at least it's got a real company behind it without someone that's on their 5th string of startups
[18:06] <jrwren> that is what tesla power wall is for. store that solar, the move it to vehicle.
[18:06] <greg-g> but yeah, I really want to learn more/buy some solar
[18:06] <rick_h> jrwren: yea, was explaining that to my wife
[18:06] <rick_h> though speaking of vaporware
[18:07] <rick_h> I love it on my rv trailer
[18:07] <rick_h> I need to get my wife past the inverter and it'll be complete
[18:07] <greg-g> yeah, that's my first application, the RV
[18:07] <rick_h> going to take her completely off grid this summer
[18:07] <greg-g> w00t
[18:07] <rick_h> found a place in the huron national forest up north to take it
[18:07] <greg-g> boondocking ftw
[18:07] <jrwren> cool.
[18:07] <rick_h> was just emailing a park ranger yesterday making sure I know where to get the water for the tanks/etc
[18:08] <rick_h> yea, if I can have a nice successsful boondocking weekend maybe I can convince her in investing in enabling more of it
[19:00] <shakes808> rick_h: i work with a guy who lived in the Appalachian Mountains off grid, for the most part.  He has some expertise in that area and we talk about that kind of stuff a lot.  I too have been trying to get the wife on board with the solar, but it is just too damn expensive
[19:01] <rick_h> yea, at some point I want to go with the li-ion batteries. That'll eat the budget.
[21:18] <jrwren> i know I complain about go a lot, but the std library is just beautiful.  io.Pipe()  built in FTW
[23:12] <greg-g> jrwren: jc<tab> rick_h: opinions on the UOS model of online summits. Someone is proposing it for the Wikimedia developer community and I'm not sure.
[23:13] <greg-g> Does it turn out to be more one-way/lecture or is there actually good dialog and (almost) decision making?
[23:13] <rick_h> greg-g: depends? It could be done well I think but I don't think we've done it well from our side in the server end
[23:19] <jrwren> greg-g: its not as good as face to face, but it is better than nothing.
[23:21]  * greg-g nods
[23:21] <greg-g> thanks both
[23:22] <greg-g> do either of you know who I should ask for any "this is how we felt this thing is doing, effectiveness-wise, from Canonical's perspective"?
[23:22] <greg-g> ...writeups.
[23:22] <greg-g> For instance, we do a survey and report on our yearly summit
[23:24] <greg-g> an IRC channel I should ask on Monday? :)
[23:25] <jrwren> greg-g: ping mhall in #ubuntu or #ubuntu-server, maybe?
[23:25] <greg-g> will do
[23:25] <greg-g> thanks!


[02:11] <mcc> Maybe I'll ask on the Ubuntu forums
[04:22] <bobdobbs> in the default desktop environment in Ubuntu, how can I get a screenshot of the screen in it's current state?
[04:23] <bobdobbs> If I hit the 'prtscrn' button, the state of the screen changes, and I lose the state that I'm trying to capture.
[04:24] <bobdobbs> Yesterday I needed to get a screenshot of the screen in the current state, and the only way to do it was to a KDE tool that gets video capture... then I opened the video capture in vlc... which I then used to find the right frame. But that's horribly inefficient.
[04:26] <bobdobbs> Basically I'm making some documentation and I need to show the context menu when my browser is active. But hitting 'print screen' closes that menu
[04:29] <bobdobbs> Just now I've tried OBS, but OBS doesn't capture the context menu. It's invisible to the video caputre!
[04:34] <bobdobbs> There's linux tool called 'vokoscreenNG' that is similar to OBS. That doesn't capture the right-click menu either
[04:34] <toddc> bobdobbs: have you tried the built in screenshot tool?
[04:36] <bobdobbs> yes. The built-in screenshot tool changes the state of the screen, which is precisely what I want to capture
[04:36] <bobdobbs> toddc: If I hit the 'prtscrn' button, the state of the screen changes.
[04:38] <bobdobbs> toddc: in particular, I need to show an image that show the open context menu in a web browser
[04:38] <toddc> mine stays the same same size no notible changes  testing a bit more
[04:39] <bobdobbs> toddc: that menu closes when you either use the "instant screenshot" feature of ubuntu's screenshot tool, or if you open the print screen options.
[04:41] <toddc> what version of ubuntu?
[04:42] <bobdobbs> 22.04
[04:44] <toddc> same here I fill out a search window on a web page then used selection option and it saved the test window data for me but it may also be that the web page you are looking at has added scurity
[04:46] <toddc> no idea maybe someone else can diag more
[05:27] <theh> I noticed a package in the universe repo being outdated. I think there's no dependency conflict to prevent an update. How can I request this? The launchpad page for the package?
[07:02] <arraybolt3> theh: Ubuntu packages in a stable release aren't generally updated to new versions, but rather bug and security fixes are back potted to the old versions.
[07:03] <arraybolt3> and he's gone already
[07:03] <Unit193> They're potting plants now?
[07:03] <arraybolt3> and CrimeOS horribly typoed "backported"
[07:03] <arraybolt3> *ChromeOS
[07:04] <arraybolt3> good grief
[07:04] <Unit193> I liked that typo better, even.
[07:05] <arraybolt3> Sounds like what you would call a Kali Linux variant focused on web apps
[07:09] <arraybolt3> My problem is that the keyboard to this thing broke so I'm having to rely on a touch keyboard and AutoIncorrect to type using my Chromebook now. Sometimes it works worse than others.
[07:57] <valued-customer> Hi.  The last few times I booted up my ubuntu 20.04 system popped up a message that there were a couple problems, and I've been having random crashes when watching video.  I am hoping I can get some advice about what to do to fix the problems.
[08:06] <gry> valued-customer: hi
[08:06] <gry> valued-customer: check output of 'dmesg', it may have a copy of these errors
[08:06] <gry> oops..
[09:13] <valued-customer> Hi.
[09:27] <arminx> Hi super hackers, I have been using ubuntu for like 20 years .. I always struggling with sudo apt-get update command... if you do regular update your system you get trouble. https://pastebin.com/H6GkxGV9 how can i fix? thanks in advance
[09:28] <ravage> arminx: your Ubuntu release is not supported anymore
[09:28] <ravage> !eolupgreade | arminx
[09:29] <ravage> !eolupgrade  | arminx
[09:29] <ravage> in your case i suggest to reinstall a supported release
[09:31] <arminx> i cant dup release upgrade every time i start a old machine for lab prupose
[09:31] <arminx> why cant i use old repos?
[09:31] <arminx> do they remove it?
[09:32] <ravage> because they do not exist on the archive servers anymore
[09:32] <ravage> there is https://old-releases.ubuntu.com/
[09:32] <ravage> see the link
[09:35] <elias_a> arminx: In your case, just run the old installation but never connect it to public Internet.
[09:37] <arminx> ravage you are my hero thanks alot
[09:37] <arminx> also i must complain over the NIC why in this world has it changed to ensxxx instead of the real deal ethX
[09:38] <arminx> elias_a of course not
[09:38] <elias_a> arminx: Good. Just wanted to make sure. :)
[09:38] <ravage> arminx: https://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/PredictableNetworkInterfaceNames/
[09:38] <elias_a> arminx: But if the os works, what do you need the repos for?
[09:45] <arminx> elias_a need few tools
[09:50] <elias_a> arminx: Ok.
[11:26] <kotgc> Hello, the Ubuntu printer is not printing on both sides? I have selected the option in Ubuntu settings, PDF settings.
[11:34] <CosmicDJ> kotgc: you do have a duplex printer, right?
[11:41] <kotgc> CosmicDJ, I don't know what duplex means, but I have printed on both sides with LinuxMint, but I've moved onto Ubuntu.
[12:17] <StucKman> I'm running KDE on ubuntu and for the first time I realize the sessions didn't start with a ssh-agent. is tehre any toggle I shoul touch?>
[13:37] <BluesKaj> Hi all
[13:45] <webchat12> Hey guys need help
[13:45] <webchat12> Anyone active rn?
[13:46] <ravage> !ask | webchat12
[13:49] <webchat12> I have a issue that is executing  grub-install/dev/nvme0n1 failed this is a fatal error please someone help me out by sharing the reason they this issue happens ( I am trying a clean install (not even dual boot)) please help.
[13:56] <mtn> webchat12: what were you doing when you got this error?
[14:00] <BluesKaj> webchat12, make sure you have an EFI boot partition of 512mb or so.
[14:15] <iomari891> greetings, is there a working repo to install boot-repair on 23.10?
[14:27] <toddc> iomari891: https://launchpad.net/~yannubuntu/+archive/ubuntu/boot-repair should work but I am not on 23.10 to test
[14:29] <chilversc> what's happened to the mainline repositories such as git://kernel.ubuntu.com/virgin/linux.git ? Is it a case that the wiki hasn't been updated with the new location?
[14:52] <ruser> does ubuntu come with systemd installed by default these days? or what is in it as an alternative?
[14:53] <ruser> or   Installing the systemd package will not switch your init system unless you boot with init=/lib/systemd/systemd or install systemd-sysv in addition.
[14:53] <ruser> so, i think this might be my answer
[14:53] <Melon> brb
[14:59] <iomari891> Greetings, after updating to 23.10,my grub is screwed. I can't even run grub-mkconfig without this error:  "/etc/grub.d/proxifiedScripts/linux: 1: version_find_latest: not found"
[15:31] <ogra> ruser, ubuntu switched to systemd in 2016
[15:32] <ogra> (and it has been the default since)
[15:34] <tennisanders> I have a couple Peak-CAN dongles I need to use on a HIL system, but with a Mac pc as the host. Which seems impossible to achieve. Would it be possible to run a docker container with ubuntu and have it link up the can dongles?
[15:37] <leftyfb> tennisanders: As long as you know the dongles run on ubuntu, the rest is building the docker container and then asking for support in #apple getting the docker container to work properly on mac
[15:38] <tennisanders> leftyfb, Ok thanks!
[15:46] <ruser> ogra: thnx.  i'm trying to figure which of the systemd scripts are causing me to get root auto login, and disable it.  i can't seem to track it down, you wouldn't happen to know anything about it?
[15:46] <ruser> I just setup an absolute barebones system
[15:46] <jj_> Sorry for the noob question, but if I'm running Ubuntu Budgie, am I alright to install Gnome apps? If there's a Gnome version and a GTK, should I go with GTK? (I'm not sure what the difference is to be honest)
[15:47] <leftyfb> ruser: no default ubuntu install will autologin as root
[15:47] <ogra> yeah ...
[15:47] <ruser> leftyfb: so am i in recovery mode then?
[15:48] <leftyfb> ruser: did you boot into recovery mode? Does it say you are in recovery mode?
[15:48] <ogra> jj_, gnome apps have some extra dependencies they install, if you are not massively short on diskspace, it should be fine to install anything you like ...
[15:48] <ruser> leftyfb:  no, it says hostname login: root (automatic login)
[15:48] <ogra> that doesnt sound like anything a proper ubuntu install would ever do
[15:48] <leftyfb> ruser: then you or someone else customized that install of ubuntu to do that
[15:49] <ogra> how did you install this ?
[15:49] <ruser> yes, i think i just found it
[15:49] <ruser> hang on
[15:52] <jj_> Thanks ogra!
[15:53] <ruser> you are both correct, i missed as a part of the install script the following https://bpa.st/JYVA however i was installing 20.04 and since then done dist upgrade to 22.04.  And now i don't see either of these files, any idea where upgrade might have moved them?
[15:54] <ruser> I tried grepping fror autologin in the system of the systemd dir and didn't find anything useful
[15:54] <leftyfb> they're more than likely gone
[15:54] <ruser> s/useful/anything/
[15:54] <ruser> Then how did the autologin persist?
[15:54] <leftyfb> ruser: good luck messing with that custom script
[15:54] <ruser> leftyfb:  yeah, i'm down the rabbit hole, i'm re-learning a lot but definitely shot myself in the foot repeatedly
[15:55] <leftyfb> ruser: I would recommend doing a fresh install of ubuntu 22.04 and not running that script
[15:55] <ruser> except, i want encrypted boot and root :/
[15:55] <ruser> and zfs
[15:55] <ruser> raidz1
[15:56] <leftyfb> then go through the script and manually run only the commands that set that up for you
[15:57] <ruser> that's fair, i dont' really want to do the reinstall so i think i'm stuck chasing where<EMAIL_ADDRESS>got moved during the upgrade
[15:58] <ruser> thank you both ogra leftyfb
[16:00] <ruser> I guess i'm learning systemd, which not a bad thing in it's own.  `systemctl cat getty@tty1` shows the autologin, looks like i'm on the right track
[16:02] <ruser> but yes, i picked up a large foot gun unfortunately
[16:09] <ruser> yes, success. `systemctl edit getty@tty1` got me to the goal, idk how grep -R missed it, oh well. But learned something new
[16:13] <ruser> does anyone here use fail to ban?  are default options good enough to stop getting my logs spammed? :)
[16:15] <leftyfb> ruser: I use fail2ban but your question is a loaded one
[16:15] <leftyfb> ruser: f2b parses logs for certain regex's and reacts to matches, typically with iptables DROP rules
[16:16] <leftyfb> I'm pretty sure the default jail is only for ssh
[16:16] <ruser> leftyfb: and how do you mean loaded? I guess i'm asking to wide of a question wrt to logs?
[16:16] <leftyfb> ruser: it depends on what logs you're referring to
[16:17] <ruser> gotcha
[16:18] <leftyfb> ruser: if you set your ssh port to a non-standard one, you'll get a lot less hits to your log
[16:18] <leftyfb> and will be slightly more secure(obscure)
[16:18] <leftyfb> I also recommend disabling password auth and certainly not allow root to login with ssh
[16:18] <ruser> I should read up on sshd hardening. i'd like to remove the banner for example (i wonder if it's a config option these days)
[16:19] <leftyfb> removing the banner provides zero security
[16:19] <ruser> are you saying bots these days try to run any and all exploits?
[16:20] <ravage> i get a SSH connect like every 20 seconds on my server ip
[16:20] <ravage> i dont think they care about your banner
[16:20] <leftyfb> bots don't care about banners nor do people attempting to gain access
[16:20] <ruser> ravage: you get bruteforce attacks
[16:20] <leftyfb> and yes, bots and people are constantly trying any and all exploits
[16:21] <ruser> leftyfb: so you are saying it's not worth the effort. are there good recent hardening guides available?   like way back when there grsec kernel patches, etc. I have dropped out from the field for a while  and have to re-learn
[16:22] <leftyfb> ruser: start with my advice above
[16:22] <ruser> leftyfb:  already on a diff port, and disabled direct root login, and moved to key auth
[16:23] <ruser> leftyfb:  and yet i still see bruteforce attacks in logs
[16:23] <ravage> why do you care about that?
[16:23] <leftyfb> they're not getting in with passwords, it doesn't really matter
[16:23] <ravage> install fail2ban if you want
[16:24] <iomari891> greetings, how to I change the ubuntu screen when the system is booting?
[16:24] <ruser> i care about reducing target vector, and hardening overall
[16:24] <ravage> ruser: disable the network interface
[16:25] <leftyfb> or power it off
[16:26] <leftyfb> ruser: the only way to stop attempts is to not be accessible
[16:26] <ruser> not an option, this machine is going to be used remotely
[16:26] <ruser> i get that, but let's not slide to the extreme
[16:26] <leftyfb> ruser: you're running on a non-standard port, you've disabled password auth. As far as bot attacks, you're covered
[16:27] <leftyfb> also disabled root ssh
[16:28] <ruser> I want to reduce the attack surface, and information leakage
[16:28] <leftyfb> congrats, you did that
[16:29] <ruser> lol
[16:29] <ruser> Either way, thank you for your help and knowledge, I do apprecite it
[16:30] <leftyfb> ruser: feel free to /join #security if you care to "slide to the extreme"
[16:31] <ruser> leftyfb: thank you
[18:09] <blackbird_0> Hi guys
[18:09] <blackbird_0> I have a serious issue: using any Nvidia driver freezes the OS, with X server the only resolution I have is 800x600. I searched a lot on google, but in vain. Please, Help
[19:55] <nunya> I've run out of ideas.  I've seen you prefer this:  https://pastebin.com/377Q1JGK
[20:01] <leftyfb> nunya: please watch the language
[20:01] <leftyfb> nunya: you want #windows for support with Windows
[20:01] <leftyfb> your Windows install has nothing to do with Ubuntu
[20:02] <leftyfb> also, this isn't the appropriate place to ask where to buy used hardware
[20:02] <leftyfb> nunya: I would start with running SMART checks on your storage device
[20:02] <leftyfb> nunya: good luck
[20:06] <nunya> It isn't purely windows support question, since clearly the problem was a direct result of the Lubuntu install. However, terse statements like that do simplify the support task.
[20:07] <nunya> Also, I haven't used IRC in 20 years.
[20:07] <leftyfb> it's unlikely Ubuntu had anything to do with the issues with your Windows partition
[20:07] <leftyfb> unless you deleted files from it or modified system file on it
[20:09] <nunya> >unless UBUNTU deleted files from it or modified system files
[20:09] <leftyfb> nunya: ubuntu does not modify anything on other partitions
[20:09] <leftyfb> unless you tell it to
[20:12] <nunya> It's fine. I've spent 8+ hours trying to find a solution to what appears to be a common problem resulting from dual-boot systems. I've typed nonsense into a black screen over and over, with inconsistent results. Just another day using Linux.
[20:13] <de-facto> is there any working sound server available in ubunut? pulseaudio and pipewire are too unstable for everyday usage, they always stutter on playback
[20:21] <marc|gonzalez1> Hello everyone, on Ubuntu 22.04 ESM, a program crashes, I think because of the recent update of a library. Is it possible to temporarily downgrade the dependency to test this hypothesis?
[20:21] <leftyfb> marc|gonzalez1: which library and what version are you running?
[20:22] <marc|gonzalez1> leftyfb: running vlc/jammy-apps-security,now 3.0.16-1ubuntu0.1~esm1 and library is ffmpeg/jammy-apps-security,now 7:4.4.2-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>+esm2
[20:23] <marc|gonzalez1> ffmpeg was recently updated to esm2, and I think it caused a regression
[20:23] <marc|gonzalez1> I want to test again with esm1
[20:23] <leftyfb> ffmpeg isn't a library
[20:24] <marc|gonzalez1> OK, libavcodec58/jammy-apps-security,now 7:4.4.2-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>+esm2 installed as a dep of ffmpeg
[20:24] <leftyfb> I don't think the "esm1" versions are available anymore
[20:25] <marc|gonzalez1> Maybe I could test with the non-ESM release?
[20:25] <leftyfb> you could try: sudo apt install libavcodec58=7:4.4.2-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>+esm1   # but I doubt it'll work
[20:25] <marc|gonzalez1> OK will give it a try, be right back
[20:25] <leftyfb> sudo apt install  libavcodec58=7:4.4.2-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>
[20:25] <leftyfb> that one is available ^
[20:25] <marc|gonzalez1> And to go back to the "normal" lib?
[20:26] <leftyfb> that's the non-esm library
[20:26] <leftyfb> the 2nd one I posted
[20:26] <marc|gonzalez1> No I mean to revert back to nominal?
[20:26] <marc|gonzalez1> How to undo the change I'm about to do
[20:27] <marc|gonzalez1> So that everything updates normally in the future
[20:27] <leftyfb> define nominal. If you mean the latest (esm2), and apt upgrade will probably upgrade it to the latest
[20:27] <marc|gonzalez1> OK noted, thanks
[20:31] <ruser> is there a better way to list installed packages other thank dpkg?
[20:31] <marc|gonzalez1> apt list --installed ?
[20:31] <ruser> I guess I should have opened man for apt, my bad
[20:32] <marc|gonzalez1> No worries, I'm battling apt, so I just typed the command a minute ago :)
[20:33] <candlejack> What's the correct way to configure Ubuntu server and workstation to install updates on a schedule?
[20:34] <candlejack> I've used the unattended-upgrades package but that never seems to actually install or reboot
[20:34] <ruser> candlejack: have you looked in the logs for it?
[20:35] <annexseven> On servers unattended-upgrades only installs security updates by default. I’ve never set the config option to have it reboot automatically though because I don’t want it to do that.
[20:36] <leftyfb> candlejack: you want your server to reboot automatically?
[20:36] <leftyfb> I do not recommend that
[20:36] <ruser> ^^
[20:36] <candlejack> Yes I do
[20:37] <ruser> there is a non-zero risk it won't come back from the reboot, just fyi
[20:38] <candlejack> Yes I'm aware of that, I've been running ubuntu as my primary computing OS for the past 17 years
[20:38] <ruser> so when you say it never seems to install anything,  have you confirmed that via logs?
[20:38] <leftyfb> and you don't know how to setup a cron/timer to do automatic updates and reboots?
[20:40] <annexseven> @candlejack The settings you need should all be in /etc/apt.conf.d/50unattended-upgrades
[20:41] <leftyfb> candlejack: https://www.kolide.com/features/checks/ubuntu-unattended-upgrades   first result on google for "ubuntu unattended-upgrades"
[20:41] <annexseven> By default it only installs security updates, but the options to reboot and install regular updates are commented out. You can uncomment them to enable them.
[21:08] <marc|gonzalez1> leftyfb: apt is a nightmare to tweak a single lib, it's just not a supported use-case
[21:08] <leftyfb> I didn't think it would be
[21:08] <marc|gonzalez1> I downloaded libavcodec58_4.4.2-0ubuntu<IP_ADDRESS>_amd64.deb
[21:08] <marc|gonzalez1> And unpacked it in /tmp
[21:08] <leftyfb> marc|gonzalez1: I would not recommend doing that
[21:09] <marc|gonzalez1> then ran vlc with LD_PRELOAD=local version of libavcodec
[21:09] <marc|gonzalez1> Why would you not recommend??
[21:09] <leftyfb> marc|gonzalez1: maybe try the snap version of vlc and ffmpeg?
[21:09] <marc|gonzalez1> leftyfb: I'm trying to prove that the problem is in the ESM lib
[21:09] <marc|gonzalez1> I just did
[21:09] <marc|gonzalez1> With LD_PRELOAD, vlc works fine
[21:10] <marc|gonzalez1> So they introduced a regression when they did the latest update
[21:10] <leftyfb> !bug | marc|gonzalez1
[21:10] <impermanence> is it possible to select audio inputs and output from terminal?
[21:10] <leftyfb> impermanence: yes
[21:10] <impermanence> leftyfb: how?
[21:11] <leftyfb> impermanence: pacmd "set-default-sink <sink id>
[21:12] <leftyfb> impermanence: pacmd list-sinks
[21:12] <impermanence> very nice thank you
[21:15] <impermanence> leftyfb: so...hm. What am I looking at here? Is this input and output or just ah...?
[21:16] <leftyfb> this is just output
[21:16] <sybariten> Hey. So, basically, what happens if i've installed something like node.js with apt-get and then try to install it with snap? I have yet to understand exactly where snap stands in the area of package management on linux
[21:17] <leftyfb> impermanence: pacmd --help
[21:18] <leftyfb> sybariten: snap has it's own package management. In your scenario, you would have a copy of each node.js package
[21:19] <sybariten> leftyfb: Wow. So potentially conflicts?
[21:19] <leftyfb> not likely
[21:19] <leftyfb> only 1 will be default
[21:20] <leftyfb> sybariten: run: which node  # to see which is default
[21:20] <leftyfb> the apt package won't have "snap" in the path
[21:20] <impermanence> leftyfb: thanks
[21:21] <sybariten> I'm asking because i just tried installing node using the command line "sudo snap install node --classic --channel=20" . Then i did node --version and it says v12.22 . And I'm realizing I may actually have installed node earlier, in the past, but forgotten about it. I definitely didn't know about snap back then so maybe i used apt? Is there a way to see if i may have done that, some sort of apt
[21:21] <sybariten> package install history?
[21:22] <leftyfb> zgrep node /var/log/dpkg.*
[21:22] <sybariten> leftyfb: oh so a snap package will even run from a snap related path, once installed?  My which node gives a normal usr bin path
[21:23] <leftyfb> sybariten: right, your apt package install of node.js is the default
[21:24] <leftyfb> sybariten: run this:    type -a node
[21:25] <sybariten> leftyfb: your zgrep command line spits out a lot... its from febryary 2023 so it wasnt that long ago after all. But yeah then it seems installed via apt.
[21:26] <sybariten> leftyfb: interesting! What is the type command actually showing me? It finds it in usr bin node, bin node, and snap bin node. So three places. One being a link i suppose
[21:26] <leftyfb> all possible paths for the command
[21:27] <leftyfb>  /usr/bin/node is probably a link to /bin/node for compatibility ... or the other way around, I forget
[21:27] <sybariten> sweet. I guess i will try de-installing the apt one and maybe the snap one too, and reinstall the snap one just to do it correctly.
[21:28] <leftyfb> you don't need to reinstall the snap
[21:28] <leftyfb> it'll just become the default
[21:29] <sybariten> you think it'll work out?
[21:29] <leftyfb> yes
[21:29] <leftyfb> the snap doesn't care if it was installed before or after the dpkg
[21:31] <sybariten> okay
[21:36] <sybariten> Okay, so this is interesting. Maybe i messed something up. I did, ofcourse, not follow your advice. First i purge removed the apt installation. THen i purge removed the snap installation. Then i installed snap with the same command that i've used before, as quoted earlier. No complaints, node 20 installed according to snap. But i dont have it in my path! Is that common?
[21:47] <leftyfb> sybariten: log out and back in
[21:49] <sybariten> leftyfb: ah
[21:50] <Guest1982> Can I speak here?
[21:51] <leftyfb> you just did
[21:51] <sybariten> leftyfb: thank you!
[21:51] <Guest1982> Fantastic. I am having an issue updating/upgrading 20/focal
[21:57] <sybariten> leftyfb: btw the snap linking structure is anything but intuitive.   :-)    installed packages thats are seemingly living in /snap/bin are in fact pointing to... all the same binary in /usr/bin ?
[21:57] <sybariten> i mean, for someone that doesn't know about snap
[22:04] <tomreyn> Guest1982: if you'd like help with this, you'll need to provide more info
[22:07] <lantech19446> having a weird issue with ubuntu 23.10 when the computer locks itself nothing will wake it up and it's ignoring the system settings telling it not to lock and not to turn off the screen. Any ideas?