[10:44] <|trey|> subterrific: I just wanna play  :/  GNOME still isn't has Human as Mac OS X today...
[10:45] <|trey|> s/has/as/
[10:45] <Treenaks> |trey|: but it's getting there
[10:45] <|trey|> They will openly admit that... although they are on the way...
[10:45] <Lowe> well i used them at school and it was the worst experience ever (this of course was 2 years ago)
[10:45] <subterrific> |trey|: i dunno, i think gnome 2.8 is really close and actually better in many places
[10:45] <|trey|> Treenaks: exactly...
[10:46] <topyli> OSX looks like a toy though. i'd put X and gnome there at once :)
[10:46] <|trey|> subterrific: Volume Management is a good improvement...
[10:46] <Tomcat_> I like OS X...
[10:46] <subterrific> gnome does a much better job of keeping consistent across all applications, visually at least
[10:46] <|trey|> The OpenNet or whatever will be great when I figure out how to use it  :/
[10:47] <subterrific> apple has this weird thing going where they can't decide why the hell they came up with brushed metal
[10:47] <|trey|> subterrific: I certainly couldn't tell them  :/
[10:47] <subterrific> first it was only for apps that mimic real world devices
[10:47] <topyli> |trey|: if you put in a cdrw with stuff on it, the volume manager mounts it. then nautilus cd burner gets confused. you have to umount from the command line because nautilus can only "eject" it, not "umount" :(
[10:47] <subterrific> then they make safari brushed metal
[10:47] <|trey|> It's Carbon vs Cocoa though...
[10:47] <subterrific> and then the finder
[10:48] <subterrific> and now i've totally lost them...
[10:48] <subterrific> i think the mac platform has far fewer good developers too
[10:49] <subterrific> apple has done just about everything they can to push developers away over the years
[10:49] <|trey|> Developers.a.c... Cocoa and Carbon... look them up... Carbon is older shit updated for OS X basically... but they have different themes...
[10:49] <subterrific> its gotten to the point that the few good ones left are just traded around by apple, adobe, macromedia (although their mac apps have taken a nose dive recently)
[10:50] <|trey|> Guess a few people still like Carbon...
[10:50] <subterrific> you have to use carbon still for many things
[10:50] <|trey|> subterrific: apple started competing with adobe, and to some extent macromedia though... thats why...
[10:51] <subterrific> driving developers away
[10:51] <subterrific> they even compete with small shareware developers
[10:51] <|trey|> The products basically aren't needed, because these are things Apple already installs....
[10:51] <|trey|> Or offers...
[10:51] <|trey|> Joe User won't go past Apple.com if what he wants is listed there... he obviously doesn't care about money...
[10:53] <|trey|> Things like Microsoft Office... and Micrsoft Virtual PC - Windows XP...
[10:53] <|trey|> Thats why they are popular...
[10:54] <|trey|> You can also use basically the entire Open Source software relm, and work on Darwin though... and plenty of Open Source projects are being used...
[10:55] <|trey|> Hardly pushing devs away... Jordan Hubbard didn't appear to think so at least...
[10:55] <|trey|> Co Founder of FreeBSD...
[10:56] <|trey|> He appeared to think they were an attractive oppertunity for a developer... X11 for OSX... its all there for Open Source software... and Fink is Debian's package management... Gentoo's Portage can be used...
[10:57] <tcurdt> to be honest: it's less the GUI that drives people to use OSX (btw: I like it) ...it's the easy installation and the software that's available
[10:57] <Lowe> holy crap how many upgrades are there lol, does ubuntu have new ones every day.
[10:57] <subterrific> |trey|: try using some open source software on darwin or OS X, its way behind linux
[10:57] <|trey|> Lowe: the Release Preview would be expected to perhaps....yes...
[10:57] <subterrific> for exmaple, Fink is now shipping gnome 2.4....wooo!
[10:57] <tcurdt> as for the installation we are slowly getting there
[10:58] <|trey|> subterrific: I actually have ran Darwin on X86... its not too bad actually... although its not Linux  :/
[10:58] <Lowe> well it's nice to have a distro that's kept uptodate
[10:58] <|trey|> Lowe: meet apt  :)
[10:59] <subterrific> one of the biggest reasons i left the mac is because i wanted open source software and good package management. gentoo wasn't available on the mac at the time.
[10:59] <Lowe> you know mandrakes urpmi, i could swear that was only updated monthly
[11:00] <|trey|> Gentoo is now available and working with DarwinPorts and Fink to provide packages for OSX...
[11:00] <subterrific> the mac is just not a very good development platform, you depend on apple for their customized gcc which is probably the buggiest gcc i've ever used
[11:00] <Lowe> < is to scared to try gentoo
[11:00] <|trey|> metapkg I think is that in writting...
[11:00] <subterrific> and their gdb crashes so much it should be able to debug itself
[11:01] <|trey|> Lowe: on my lowly 933 Duron... it isn't really logical... sure they run faster... but not when you're compiling something  :/
[11:01] <|trey|> Even with 512mb ram...
[11:01] <Mayday_> is it just me or isnt the nntp protocoll working in evolution?
[11:02] <Lowe> I only have 256mb ram :(
[11:02] <|trey|> [nana]
[11:02] <|trey|> Still not cool on 933 Duron though  :/  pos processor  :|
[11:03] <|trey|> Not a machine made for compiling  :/
[11:03] <|trey|> s/machine/chip
[11:03] <|trey|> I need to get a simular Athlon at least  :/
[11:03] <|trey|> It has to be AMD though  :(
[11:04] <Lowe> I have an athlon xp 2000+ but every os i use thinks it's a 1250+
[11:04] <|trey|> That sucks... use kernel-image-2.6-k7
[11:05] <|trey|> type exactly that... then 2.6.9 will get upgraded when its uploaded...
[11:05] <jono> hi all
[11:05] <Lowe> actually i think it's something in my bios
[11:05] <Lowe> since win xp thinks the same
[11:06] <|trey|> Lowe: NTKRNL.DLL is i386...
[11:06] <Lowe> eh?
[11:06] <|trey|> NT's kernel is not k7
[11:07] <Lowe> no but you see at one time it did recognize it as a 2000+
[11:07] <|trey|> Then you got lucky  :/
[11:07] <subterrific> wtf
[11:07] <Lowe> all these upgrades are fun
[11:07] <|trey|> Lowe: all those upgrades are done  8-)
[11:08] <Lowe> what you have everything up to date lol
[11:08] <|trey|> It rhymed  :/
[11:08] <|trey|> And yes  :)
[11:08] <Lowe> lol
[11:08] <Lowe> brb
[11:11] <jono> hey punkass
[11:15] <daniels> jono: yo
[11:18] <jono> daniels, heya man
[11:18] <jono> daniels, hows it going?
[11:18] <daniels> jono: not too bad, you?
[11:19] <jono> daniels, good, just figuring out why my sound is not working in ubuntu
[11:20] <subterrific> jono: what machine and sound card?
[11:20] <jono> it says, your oss device could not be probed correctly - it seems the kernel modules are loaded though
[11:20] <jono> subterrific, i386, M-Audio Delta 44
[11:20] <jono> any idea ?
[11:22] <subterrific> jono: well for one thing, you want ALSA, not OSS
[11:23] <subterrific> and i'm pretty sure that card is supported by ALSA
[11:23] <jono> subterrific, it is supported by ALSA, how do I switch to it?
[11:24] <joebeastie> ok. after a bit of work getting X working I am now logging in to my fresh ubuntu system :)
[11:25] <subterrific> well what does lsmod | grep ice say?
[11:26] <jono> subterrific, I will paste in #jonoflood
[11:27] <subterrific> jono: use http://paste.plone.org/
[11:27] <jono> ok
[11:27] <jono> subterrific, http://paste.plone.org/1468
[11:27] <subterrific> jono: so you're all set at the kernel level
[11:28] <subterrific> my guess is that you've got the volume all at 0 ;)
[11:28] <subterrific> thats the ALSA default
[11:28] <subterrific> so you probably need to run a mixer and unmute some channels and turn the volume up
[11:29] <subterrific> you can try Applications->Multimedia->Volume Control and switch to the tab labeled [ALSA Mixer]
[11:30] <subterrific> but this http://www.linuxquestions.org/hcl/showproduct.php?product=1040 suggests that you install some app named envy24control. so try that if alsamixer doesn't work
[11:30] <jono> subterrific, ok, I adjusted all of them - unlocked and unmuted them all and the same problem - do I need to restart NGOME?
[11:31] <subterrific> shouldn't, what are you using to play audio?
[11:31] <jono> totem
[11:31] <subterrific> ok, quit totem and then run gstreamer-properties
[11:32] <subterrific> switch everything to use ALSA
[11:32] <subterrific> then restart totem
[11:33] <subterrific> jono: what kind of audio recording are you doing with that card?
[11:33] <subterrific> if you don't mind me asking
[11:33] <jono> subterrific, ahhh works now :) I will ammend my bug report
[11:34] <subterrific> :)
[11:34] <jono> subterrific, I have a home studio :)
[11:34] <joebeastie> omg. this ubuntu rocks the socks of a fox
[11:34] <jono> subterrific, thanks dude :)
[11:34] <subterrific> jono: same here, i've got a CardDeluxe though. haven't tried it under linux yet though, i don't think ALSA supports it
[11:35] <subterrific> i usually go to my buddy's place, he's got a mac with protools and a control24 board. its a pretty insane setup for a home studio
[11:36] <jono> subterrific, cool - I normally boot to windows and use Cubase SX 2.0, but I am going to investigate Linux based stuff
[11:36] <jono> subterrific, some of my recordings are on www.jonobacon.org/music/
[11:36] <subterrific> jono: well let me know how it goes, i'm really interested in Linux audio too
[11:36] <joebeastie> jono what soung are you into?
[11:36] <joebeastie> sound rather
[11:36] <jono> check out Fragile
[11:37] <jono> joebeastie, I am actually into really heavy death/thrash metal, and I am in a band called Seraphidian (www.seraphidian.com), but I also do other styles
[11:37] <xsad> hi to all
[11:37] <jamesh> If anyone has run into this issue, please add a comment on the bug: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1587
[11:37] <jono> my music page has some old songs I recorded ages ago
[11:37] <xsad> does anyone tried to install ubuntu on a powerbook g4?
[11:38] <Tomcat_> omg... RMS is in town. :o
[11:38] <jamesh> if you see an icon of the wrong size in the recently used documents menu on the panel
[11:38] <jamesh> add a comment about the file type and icon theme in use
[11:38] <joebeastie> Tomcat_ : should ask him for so vi tips
[11:38] <Tomcat_> lol :)
[11:38] <joebeastie> tell him you where going to try emacs but you heard it sucks
[11:39] <jono> xsad, I have it on a g4 powerbook
[11:39] <xsad> i have problems with the keyboard......
[11:40] <xsad> it doesn't recognize keys like @
[11:40] <Tomcat_> Unfortunately I'm away when he speaks. :o
[11:40] <subterrific> jono: sounds good, good production
[11:40] <Treenaks> don't forget to tell him you use Linux
[11:40] <Treenaks> (without the gnu/)
[11:40] <jono> subterrific, cheers :)
[11:40] <jono> subterrific, just done in my bedroom
[11:41] <subterrific> jono: i'm pretty amatuer http://subterrific.net/~jason/blacktape.mp3
[11:41] <jono> subterrific, check out Presence too - I was really pleased with that
[11:41] <topyli> joebeastie: i'm sure rms does have a tip or two for vi users :)
[11:42] <subterrific> i never manage to make it to the stage of actually correctly mixing the tracks. i just end up with up with a bunch of half finished tracks of first takes and drum loops
[11:42] <jono> subterrific, mixing is my fave bit - I just need better mic's
[11:44] <jono> subterrific, sounds good :)
[11:44] <jono> subterrific, the key is not adding more, but taking out more
[11:44] <subterrific> i wish i could get into it, but i just enjoy playing. its more of a hobby
[11:44] <jono> ahhh right
[11:45] <jono> jees I havent heard Fragile for ages
[11:46] <subterrific> jono: oh definitely, thats the problem with that blacktape track for instance, you can't hear half the tracks because they're all there all the time at the same level
[11:50] <jono> I havent heard Presence for ages either hehe
[11:55] <jono> anyone know if lame is packaged for ubuntu?
[11:55] <subterrific> jono: it isn't
[11:56] <subterrific> but its packaged for debian
[11:56] <jono> I need an MP3 encoder that sound juicer can use
[11:56] <jono> if I install lame for debian, will it work though?
[11:56] <subterrific> yes
[11:56] <jono> where are the lame packages?
[11:56] <subterrific> http://hpisi.nerim.net/
[11:58] <jono> surely unofficial packages will break ubuntu when I upgrade to the next release?
[11:59] <Treenaks> jono: they might
[11:59] <jono> I assume I just uninstall the package then
[11:59] <jono> and it would work
[11:59] <subterrific> jono: just try to keep it to a minimum
[11:59] <subterrific> plus, lame will probably never be packaged officially by ubuntu
[11:59] <Treenaks> I only installed libdvdcss from there..  oh and the w32codecs
[12:00] <jono> ahhh cool, no dependencies needed
[12:00] <subterrific> jono: that repos is pretty strictly stuff that can't ever be official
[12:01] <jono> I need sound juicer to have an mp3 encoder, so I installed lame and now it says gstreamer doesnt work
[12:01] <subterrific> copyright issues, yay america land of freedom
[12:01] <jono> could not create gstreamer encoder
[12:01] <Lowe> add this to get all that audio stuff http://www.rarewares.org/debian/packages/unstable/ ./
[12:01] <Treenaks> jono: encode to ogg then..
[12:01] <jono> Treenaks, I need to encode to MP3 - for my iRiver database to work
[12:01] <jono> how can I make gstreamer do this?
[12:01] <Treenaks> jono: you'll probably need a re-compiled gstreamer
[12:02] <Treenaks> which tends to be Hard
[12:02] <subterrific> uhh no
[12:02] <subterrific> gstreamer is plugin based
[12:02] <Treenaks> subterrific: yes, but you'll need the gstreamer plugin then
[12:02] <jono> I am getting gstreamer-plugins
[12:04] <|trey|> subterrific: Ubuntu should install gstreamer0.8-plugins-ffmpeg by default...
[12:05] <subterrific> |trey|: it can't
[12:05] <|trey|> Especially if they will be sticking with totem-gstreamer...
[12:05] <|trey|> why?
[12:05] <Treenaks> subterrific: why not? ffmpeg itself is free..
[12:05] <|trey|> totem-gstreamer is useless without codecs...
[12:05] <subterrific> |trey|: ffmpeg violates US copyright law, wooo go USA!
[12:05] <Treenaks> subterrific: it does? how?
[12:06] <subterrific> it includes an mp3 encoder for one
[12:06] <|trey|> subterrific: put the server in a devs house in Mexico or something  :/
[12:06] <|trey|> Heck, even canada for the most part...
[12:06] <jono> I am using ripperx that steps over the gstreamer bullshit
[12:06] <jono> :)
[12:07] <|trey|> jono: gstreamer bullshit? gstreamer is THE shit... if you use everything they worked on...
[12:07] <subterrific> jono: just fyi: http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2004/07/msg01833.html
[12:07] <|trey|> subterrific: only thing to note... thats not 0.8  :/
[12:08] <subterrific> |trey|: work on those reading skills
[12:08] <|trey|> Thats 0.6 or something...
[12:08] <|trey|> subterrific: package says gstreamer-mad...
[12:08] <|trey|> thats 0.6
[12:08] <|trey|> gstreamer0.8-mad would be newest though...
[12:09] <|trey|> apt-get install gstreamer0.8-plugins-misc with universe enabled... should be there... else sarge...
[12:09] <subterrific> that email doesn't mention gstreamer-mad at all, its about gstreamer-lame
[12:09] <subterrific> you need sleep or something
[12:10] <subterrific> and it gives instructions for gstreamer 0.6 and 0.8
[12:10] <|trey|> 1. fetch a gstreamer-lame RPM. I got mine from --- first line of what that guy wrote...
[12:10] <subterrific> "or v0.8 for
[12:10] <subterrific>    sound-juicer v0.5.12+. I used a PLD package"
[12:10] <subterrific> same line
[12:11] <subterrific> and if you go to the url http://henrik.synth.no/deb/
[12:11] <|trey|> 4 lines later  :/
[12:11] <subterrific> http://henrik.synth.no/deb/gstreamer0.8-lame_0.8.2-2_i386.deb
[12:11] <|trey|> so it recommends 0.6 OR 0.8.. oh, I see...
[12:11] <|trey|> subterrific: thankyou  :)
[12:11] <|trey|> gstreamer0.8-plugins-misc depends that  :)
[12:12] <subterrific> i've never used alien though, so no idea how well it works
[12:12] <subterrific> rpm->deb seems kind of sketchy
[12:12] <|trey|> subterrific: he posted a deb...
[12:12] <subterrific> which was created from the rpm using alien
[12:12] <subterrific> read the email
[12:12] <|trey|> subterrific: works for me... none failed atleast... and worked when I installed them...
[12:12] <subterrific> i'm going to sleep
[12:13] <|trey|> alien --to-deb some.rpm  :/
[12:14] <Lowe> anyone know an easier way to mount filesystems? (gui or something)
[12:14] <|trey|> http://tigert.gimp.org/log/files/uploads/gnome-notification-rss-distractor_v2.png  LOOK, JDUB... I WANT THIS FEATURE  :)
[12:15] <|trey|> Lowe: not mount though?
[12:15] <Lowe> huh
[12:16] <|trey|> mount -t ntfs /dev/hda1 /windows (after creating windows)
[12:16] <Lowe> i want to mount an ext3 partiton
[12:16] <Lowe> but i don't know what hda(number) it is
[12:16] <|trey|> mount -t ext3 /dev/hda5 /some/where/here
[12:17] <subterrific> Lowe: is it removable media?
[12:17] <Lowe> no
[12:17] <Lowe> it has my pr0n on it lol
[12:17] <|trey|> Lowe: why no entry in /etc/fstab for it?
[12:17] <|trey|> then it comes up every time (no pun intended)
[12:18] <Lowe> all mines says is
[12:18] <|trey|> you could try mounting them all, and see which one has your pron  :/
[12:18] <Lowe> proc            /proc           proc    defaults        0       0
[12:18] <Lowe> /dev/hda3       /               ext3    defaults,errors=remount-ro 0       1
[12:18] <Lowe> /dev/hda6       none            swap    sw              0       0
[12:18] <Lowe> /dev/hdc        /media/cdrom0   udf,iso9660 ro,user,noauto  0       0
[12:18] <Lowe> /dev/fd0        /media/floppy0  auto    rw,user,noauto  0       0
[12:19] <|trey|> yeah, you will need a new entry enless you don't mind typing a command all the time  :/
[12:19] <|trey|> Well... after every reboot... so about twice a year here...
[12:19] <Lowe> my windows partiton isn't in there either, should it be?
[12:19] <Treenaks> Lowe: only if you want to mount it
[12:19] <|trey|> Lowe: if you want it to be mounted at boot... sure...
[12:19] <Lowe> i do because it has my music on it
[12:20] <|trey|> Lowe: win98 or nt?
[12:20] <Lowe> (only reason why i still have windows)
[12:20] <Lowe> winxp
[12:20] <|trey|> like I said then... mount -t ntfs /dev/hda1 /windows
[12:21] <Lowe> yeah i did that in the command line earlier but it's not in my fstab
[12:21] <|trey|> windows is first partion on primary master ide cable, thus /dev/hda1
[12:21] <|trey|> (it has to be to use grub)
[12:22] <|trey|> well, no, but its easier in that order  :/
[12:22] <Lowe> when i type mount i get /dev/hda1 on /mnt type ntfs (rw,uid=1000,gid=1000,utf8)
[12:22] <Lowe> do i paste that in my fstab?
[12:22] <|trey|> Then its already mounted apparently....
[12:22] <Lowe> yes i know it is, but so it mounts when i reboot
[12:22] <|trey|> no.... follow the same syntax... man fstab
[12:23] <petemc> Lowe: dont use that to mount ntfs
[12:23] <Lowe> why?
[12:23] <|trey|> petemc: high  :)
[12:23] <petemc> its not rw, for one thing
[12:23] <petemc> hey |trey|
[12:23] <|trey|> petemc: just enter that in fstab (ro)
[12:23] <petemc> Lowe: umask=022 is the only option you should need
[12:23] <|trey|> petemc: its already mounted now  :(
[12:24] <Lowe> i couldn't acces my files as a normal user so i added the rest of that crap
[12:24] <|trey|> petemc: or like that  :)
[12:24] <Lowe> and i need utf8
[12:24] <petemc> ok, so add that
[12:24] <Lowe> other wise i won't see my japanese files
[12:24] <|trey|> Lowe: dpkg-reconfigure locales
[12:24] <Lowe> huh
[12:25] <|trey|> select (for instance) US_en_UTF-8
[12:25] <|trey|> (uhh... or us_EN_UTF-8... I'm not perfect)
[12:25] <Lowe> uhm maybe later, anyway how do i mount my other partitons?
[12:26] <|trey|> Same thing... only -t ext3
[12:26] <Lowe> i don't know what one has my stuff on it ><
[12:26] <|trey|> like I said though... if you don't know the device file... its gonna be tedious...
[12:26] <Lowe> grr that's why you need a gui for this kind of crap
[12:26] <|trey|> Mount them all... one has it... hdaX probably... enless you have 2 hd's  :/
[12:27] <petemc> fdisk -l
[12:27] <|trey|> petemc: no mount point selected... only fs... he would need to guess by size... narrows it down I suppose  :)
[12:29] <Lowe> /dev/hda1   *           1       50475    25438896    7  HPFS/NTFS
[12:29] <Lowe> /dev/hda2           50476       66653     8153712    f  W95 Ext'd (LBA)
[12:29] <Lowe> /dev/hda3           66654       79780     6616008   83  Linux
[12:29] <Lowe> /dev/hda5           50476       66014     7831183+  83  Linux
[12:29] <Lowe> /dev/hda6           66015       66653      322024+  82  Linux swap
[12:30] <|trey|> Looks to me like /dev/hda2, which would make sense...
[12:31] <Lowe> ok so what do i type
[12:32] <|trey|> petemc: decided you like Jdub's Gnome too?  8-)
[12:34] <petemc> trying gnome2.8 was probably the main reason i installed ubuntu, yeah
[12:34] <petemc> Lowe: mount /dev/hda1 /mnt/win -o umask=022
[12:34] <Lowe> but that's already mounted, im trying to mount my other partiton
[12:35] <|trey|> petemc: I'm liking Computers and trashapplet  :)  ... usually no icons anyway... tedious to access when you're doing something else...
[12:36] <Lowe> i found my old fstab the partion i had mounted on mandrake was
[12:36] <|trey|> +firefox and industrial = pretty much what I use anyway  :)
[12:36] <Lowe> dev/hda5 /home/lowe/Stored ext3 umask=0,nls=utf-8 0 0
[12:36] <|trey|> Lowe: Stored needs to be created to use it... also /dev/hda5...
[12:38] <Lowe> uhm just tell me what to put in my fstab
[12:38] <Lowe> And i will reboot
[12:39] <|trey|> Also, it would appear your user account for ubuntu is Lowe, not lowe
[12:39] <|trey|> what petemc said  :)
[12:39] <Lowe> yeah but that was my old fstab (ie when i had mandrake, it was on a floppy just incase you were wondering)
[12:39] <|trey|> Lowe: petemc = smart... listen to him, not I  :)
[12:40] <|trey|> Or me... and Mandrake  blah... I hate mandrake, but it should be the same  :/
[12:40] <Lowe> mandrake sucks lol
[12:41] <|trey|> The 'easy installer' takes too long... and there is too much emphasis on Mandrake Club... even in the Community Edition...
[12:42] <|trey|> Pretty is ok... but there is NO reason to make it assume you're a moron :/
[12:42] <Lowe> I got banned from the mandrake forums for saying the club is for homo's lol
[12:42] <petemc> Lowe: in fstab, /dev/hdaN /mnt/point    ext3  defaults    0   2
[12:42] <housetier> I'd ban you for much less, Lowe
[12:43] <|trey|> Of course, I fully support replacing options for... nothing... then it takes less time  :)
[12:43] <Lowe>  /dev/hdaN <why N if it's 5
[12:43] <petemc> replace N with the partition number you want mounted
[12:44] <|trey|> Especially when its so simular to what I would set my box up with anyway  :)
[12:45] <Lowe> petemc shouldn't i copy the same options as / or is that a bad idea
[12:45] <petemc> defaults should be fine
[12:45] <|trey|> Although... despite it being justifiable in business... I wouldn't have included lsb related packages... namely rpm and alien... not needed...
[12:45] <Lowe> will that display utf9 fine?
[12:45] <Lowe> utf8*
[12:45] <|trey|> Lowe: if you reconfigure locales... sure...
[12:45] <petemc> if you have the correct locales set up it should
[12:46] <|trey|> gdebconf might make it easier... not used it yet though... IT SHOULD BE THOUGHT ABOUT THOUGH
[12:46] <Lowe> but my current / shows japanese files fine
[12:46] <Lowe> and i didn't mess with any locales
[12:47] <|trey|> Lowe: but that doesn't mean its UTF-8  :/
[12:47] <Lowe> oh
[12:48] <Lowe> what do i do to make sure it is?
[12:48] <|trey|> You need to enable it.... dpkg-reconfigure locales... select the one that looks like the one selected... but ends with UTF-8
[12:49] <|trey|> The one selected will be under J... not very original I know  :)
[12:49] <mojo> yay! new updates from Ubuntu - new XFree86 fixes - yay!
[12:50] <|trey|> Lowe: dpkg-reconfigure basically re-performs post-inst scripts... the configuration part of installing a package...
[12:50] <Lowe> en_GB.UTF-8 UTF-8 will that one do?
[12:50] <|trey|> Thats not japenese... but if you're in England, that will be right  :)
[12:51] <Lowe> Im in scotland but ok
[12:51] <|trey|> Locales is also language etc... so things will be spelled "colour" instead of "color" for instance  :)
[12:51] <Lowe> i think it picked the wrong one
[12:51] <Lowe> Generating locales...
[12:51] <Lowe>   en_GB.ISO-8859-1... done
[12:51] <Lowe> Generation complete.
[12:52] <|trey|> Umm... yeah... the UTF-8 one is supposed to be listed  :/
[12:52] <topyli> the whole locale business is annoying.
[12:52] <Lowe> but i did pick utf-8
[12:53] <Lowe> is it yet another bug?
[12:53] <|trey|> Or ID 10 T error  :/
[12:54] <|trey|> Do it with roots environment...
[12:54] <|trey|> sudo root passwd && su
[12:54] <Lowe> ok it works now
[12:54] <cef> |trey|: ID 10 T error is too well known now.. as is Pebkac.. so at work we now use RUAPAK
[12:54] <cef> |trey|: Replace User And Press Any Key
[12:55] <|trey|> cef: whats that?
[12:55] <Lowe> right now to add the NTFS partiton to my fstab
[12:55] <Lowe> and i will be done
[12:55] <|trey|> cef: hahahha  :)
[12:55] <|trey|> rew ah pak?
[12:55] <cef> that'd do it
[12:55] <|trey|> :)
[12:56] <|trey|> Lowe: same thing... only now its ntfs, not ext3  :/
[12:56] <|trey|> I could just do it for you?
[12:57] <Lowe> will i type ntfs in caps?
[12:57] <Treenaks> Lowe: no
[12:57] <|trey|> uhh... no
[12:57] <|trey|> thats why I typed it in lower case earlier  :/
[12:58] <Lowe> will i use defualts again for options?
[12:58] <|trey|> Lowe: fstab or file system table just handles mount for you basically... at boot...
[12:59] <Lowe> so it doesn't matter what i put for options really?
[12:59] <|trey|> The table that points software at hardware...
[01:00] <|trey|> Lowe: umm, they have to be valid... man fstab
[01:00] <|trey|> I don't like repeating myself...
[01:00] <housetier> then don't
[01:00] <|trey|> housetier: it was the answer though  :/
[01:01] <Lowe> my options in mandrake were umask=0,iocharset=utf8,ro
[01:01] <|trey|> ok... and those are some of many  :/
[01:02] <|trey|> 3 of about 10 or so  :/
[01:02] <|trey|> for that section...
[01:02] <Lowe> but what should i put :(
[01:02] <|trey|> The man page has all the answers I can't be asked to answer, honest...
[01:03] <|trey|> Even some that I have answered... but I expected you to be reading  :/
[01:03] <Lowe> reading is boring
[01:03] <|trey|> Great attitude.
[01:04] <|trey|> I'm going to stop wasting my time now.
[01:04] <dalderman> moring guys and gals
[01:04] <dalderman> I'm back with more problems :-)
[01:04] <|trey|> dalderman: shoot  :)
[01:04] <housetier> hooray dalderman
[01:04] <dalderman> When I run totem I get an error and it quits
[01:04] <dalderman> "An error occured. Resource busy or not available"
[01:05] <|trey|> dalderman: umm, what does the error say?
[01:05] <|trey|> Umm... lsof /dev/dsp.
[01:05] <dalderman> I am using esd and system sounds, which are working ok
[01:05] <dalderman> scutter:~# lsof /dev/dsp
[01:05] <dalderman> COMMAND  PID USER   FD   TYPE DEVICE SIZE NODE NAME
[01:05] <dalderman> esd     4399  dan    5w   CHR   14,3      6637 /dev/dsp
[01:06] <mojo> exuse me every1, I installed nvidia-glx, now I wonder does this include the GTK2 GUI Config Program?
[01:06] <|trey|> ok... gstreamer0.8-esd installed? dpkg -l | grep it
[01:06] <Lowe> i will just guess lol if it fucks up it fucks up brb
[01:06] <|trey|> Worst case scenario "it's not mounted" "here's the error"....
[01:07] <|trey|> Else I get to kill... deal?  8-)
[01:07] <dalderman> |trey|, nope, not there, I shall install
[01:07] <dalderman> could this be a borked dependancy then?
[01:07] <|trey|> dalderman: apt-get install gstreamer-plugins-misc
[01:08] <|trey|> dalderman: umm, no... bad package selection perhaps...
[01:08] <dalderman> I don't have a package called that
[01:08] <dalderman> I have gstreamer-plugins
[01:08] <|trey|> dalderman: Sarge has them...
[01:08] <|trey|> dalderman: apt-cache show that and see if it mentions esd at all
[01:09] <|trey|> ctrl + page up /page down = scroll
[01:09] <dalderman> scutter:/home/dan# apt-cache show gstreamer-plugins-misc
[01:09] <dalderman> W: Unable to locate package gstreamer-plugins-misc
[01:09] <dalderman> I need to add to my sources.list then
[01:09] <|trey|> ahhh... plugins...
[01:10] <|trey|> dalderman: its not recommended that you use "deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian sarge main contrib non-free" though...
[01:10] <dalderman> sure
[01:11] <dalderman> I have universe in there, but I guess that's different right?
[01:11] <|trey|> However you can set priority...
[01:11] <|trey|> thats only main, not contrib or non-free
[01:11] <dalderman> how do I do dat den?
[01:11] <|trey|> I suppose with universe, you could could just not use main from Debian...
[01:13] <dalderman> |trey|, forgive me, I am a little lost with what I should do
[01:13] <dalderman> |trey|, I'm a bit of  Debian newbie still
[01:14] <dalderman> |trey|, RedHat convert
[01:14] <werewolf> Hi all, I just re-installed on my machine win 2000 and ubuntu, GRUB for loader, but win doesn't start, any hints?
[01:14] <beezly> werewolf: what happens when you try to start windows?
[01:14] <|trey|> dalderman: apt is god... debconf is your best friend... dpkg does what its told...
[01:15] <werewolf> beezly: nothig, I see only the grub command
[01:16] <Lowe> I did it :D
[01:16] <Lowe> it works fine now
[01:16] <beezly> werewolf: and what does it say?
[01:16] <|trey|> werewolf: that would be bad..
[01:16] <dalderman> |trey|, so what do I add to sources.list to get the plugins-misc package from Sarge?
[01:16] <|trey|> You type what I said  :/
[01:16] <|trey|> Scroll up
[01:17] <dalderman> |trey|, the line about not reccomended?
[01:17] <Lowe> Although i had a very slow boot up, i forgot to copy down the error
[01:17] <|trey|> dalderman: you ever do apt-cache show gstreamer0.8-plugins and look for esd?
[01:18] <|trey|> Lowe: not slow if you time it... back scrolling just makes it seem longer  ;)
[01:18] <|trey|> black*
[01:18] <werewolf2> beezly, title           Windows NT/2000/XP
[01:18] <werewolf2> rootnoverify    (hd0,0)
[01:18] <werewolf2> savedefault
[01:18] <werewolf2> makeactive
[01:18] <werewolf2> chainloader     +1
[01:18] <|trey|> Hit the reset key, and find a better howto...
[01:19] <dalderman> yeah
[01:19] <dalderman> |trey|, it's in the depends list for that package
[01:19] <|trey|> Fedora was having problems though with dual booting, so perhaps its something with grub right now...
[01:19] <|trey|> dalderman: DAMN YOU!!!!
[01:19] <|trey|> dalderman: grr... INSTALL THAT THEN!!! (gstreamer0.8-plugins)
[01:20] <dalderman> |trey|, I have
[01:20] <|trey|> -misc is a few more.. but its more...
[01:20] <dalderman> |trey|, same problem
[01:20] <|trey|> ok... then it should work  :/
[01:20] <dalderman> |trey|, nope
[01:20] <dalderman> |trey|, and no need to shout
[01:20] <dalderman> |trey|, I'm trying my best
[01:20] <|trey|> COmpter >> Desktop Preferences >> Sound >> Start Sound Server
[01:21] <dalderman> |trey|, is already running
[01:21] <|trey|> logout and back in...
[01:21] <dalderman> |trey|, ok
[01:21] <|trey|> Wait.... ps -e | grep esd
[01:22] <|trey|> If its running /etc/init.d/esd restart
[01:22] <dalderman> |trey|, ok
[01:22] <dalderman> |trey|, there is no esd service in there
[01:23] <|trey|> ok... then you need to log out  :/
[01:23] <dalderman> |trey|, kill -HUP instead?
[01:23] <Lowe> trey i know it was to good to be true lol, only root can modify the files :(
[01:23] <|trey|> umm... actually just do what I said anyway  :/
[01:23] <dalderman> |trey|, brb
[01:23] <|trey|> esd lets you have more then one sound process...
[01:24] <|trey|> gstreamer won't let go of /dev/dsp  :/
[01:24] <|trey|> Now he can make it let go via esd  :/
[01:25] <|trey|> Apparently alsa lets you too... but I don't remember where I saw that working...
[01:25] <|trey|> It rarely does though....
[01:25] <|trey|> I think Fedora actually  :/
[01:25] <Lowe> trey will i put user in options(fstab)? so i can modify the files
[01:26] <|trey|> Lowe: DO NOT ATTEMPT TO CHANGE FILES!!!
[01:26] <|trey|> enless you could care less about losing it of course...
[01:26] <|trey|> IE, the partition...
[01:26] <|trey|> Most would rather avoid the risk  :/
[01:27] <dalderman> |trey|, nope no better
[01:27] <pere> Hi. Great distro!
[01:27] <dalderman> |trey|, I get the same problem as root too
[01:27] <|trey|> dalderman: grrr!!
[01:27] <Lowe> uhm im on about my partiton with my pr0n on it has padlocks on the folders
[01:27] <Treenaks> Lowe: "read-only"
[01:27] <Kamion> aj: yo. saw my name invoked, but I don't have access to our ftp-master equivalent, I'm afraid; elmo or thom do
[01:27] <Lowe> yeah how would i change that
[01:27] <|trey|> Lowe: user needs rights...
[01:28] <|trey|> you can do 'disks'... its already there...
[01:28] <dalderman> |trey|, should I file a bug now?
[01:28] <|trey|> That would be in man fstab though...
[01:28] <thom> Kamion: what was the question? (I have a few weeks while firefox builds)
[01:28] <|trey|> dalderman: I suppose... what would it say though?  "sound won't work" isn't helpful...
[01:28] <dalderman> thom, LOL
[01:29] <cef> thom: heh
[01:29] <dalderman> |trey|, sound works fine, totem crashes on startup for me
[01:29] <dalderman> |trey|, crashes on startup for root too
[01:29] <pere> Im unable to get bitTorrent to work. I tried installing bittorrent, but get en error: Could not load wxPython
[01:29] <dalderman> |trey|, with a SIGSEV
[01:29] <Kamion> thom: "where's the signing key for Release.gpg"
[01:29] <|trey|> dalderman: using totem-gstreamer or totem-xine?
[01:29] <Hrdwr_BoB> pere: you need to use it in a terminal
[01:29] <Mithrandir> pere: sounds like you've installed bittornado.
[01:29] <Hrdwr_BoB> use btdownloadcurses
[01:29] <dalderman> |trey|, just "totem" on the menu or on the command line
[01:29] <|trey|> Kamion: I still don't see why you need that  :(
[01:29] <Lowe> trey i changed the permissons but it doesn't change them for all files and folders
[01:29] <aj> Kamion/thom: tnx
[01:29] <dalderman> |trey|, I shall try the others
[01:30] <thom> aj: http://archive.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/misc/
[01:30] <housetier> pere, another suggestion: azureus
[01:30] <aj> err, that's not the right key?
[01:30] <Mithrandir> thom: it's not the one used for signing the Release.gpg
[01:30] <Kamion> |trey|: because it's the root of trust for the entirety of a Debian archive's security
[01:30] <thom> ooook
[01:30] <Kamion> |trey|: at least as far as clients are concerned
[01:30] <sivang> we now have a misc entry? or is this the "universe" repo?
[01:30] <thom> i shall kick elmo then
[01:30] <pere> Hrdwr_BoB: Can I use btdownloadcurses directly from Firefox (just clicking a torrent-link)?
[01:30] <Mithrandir> sivang: it's not a repo, it's just a directory.
[01:30] <|trey|> Kamion: correction, it WILL be, when 0.6 someday is in Stable...
[01:31] <Kamion> |trey|: furthermore aj wrote the script most people use to verify it (if they bother at all ...)
[01:31] <thom> unless i fix bittorrent first :P
[01:31] <Mithrandir> pere: I doubt it, currently.
[01:31] <Kamion> |trey|: you can verify it without apt 0.6
[01:31] <sivang> Mithrandir : for unspported stuff ?
[01:31] <dalderman> |trey|, I don't have totem-xine or totem-gstreamer, just totem.  Although installing totem-xine removes totem-gstreamer
[01:31] <Hrdwr_BoB> pere: hm.. possibly, I use it in a terminal btdownloadcurses --url 'http://foo.bar/baz.torrent'
[01:31] <Kamion> |trey|: it's a matter of verifying the signature and all the md5sums recursively
[01:31] <|trey|> debsigs?
[01:31] <Kamion> |trey|: no
[01:31] <Mithrandir> sivang: nah, for misc stuff, like the key which is used to sign the releases and such.
[01:31] <Kamion> |trey|: debsigs goes in individual .debs, it's a different scheme
[01:31] <Lowe> |trey| i thought i would have to change it in the fstab for me to get access to it?
[01:32] <|trey|> Lowe: you need to read the man page, specifically where it talks about rights...
[01:32] <|trey|> rights and access...
[01:32] <dalderman> |trey|, installing totem-xine makes it worse, itgives me a "The application totem has quit unexpectedly" error
[01:32] <|trey|> Lowe: I am getting sick of saying RTFM...
[01:32] <pere> Hrdwr_BoB: What package do I install. I see nothing similar to btdownloadcurses in Synaptic
[01:33] <Mithrandir> pere: "bittorrent"
[01:33] <|trey|> dalderman: wtf did you do?
[01:33] <Lowe> |trey| If your getting sick of it why offer to help in the first place?
[01:33] <fabbione> thom: are you sure that's the correct key? the 0x is different
[01:33] <sivang> Hrdwr_Bob : bt has complete brwoser integration
[01:33] <dalderman> |trey|, I tried totem-xine instead of totem-gstreamer
[01:33] <dalderman> |trey|, that seems worse
[01:33] <Linuxbcn> hi!
[01:33] <|trey|> dalderman: thats what I'm using here  :/
[01:33] <|trey|> Same exact packages and configuration  :/
[01:33] <dalderman> |trey|, with esd?
[01:33] <Linuxbcn> what name have a flash plugin in universe source?
[01:34] <dalderman> |trey|, perhaps it's my sound card?
[01:34] <|trey|> dalderman: yes... oh... for shits and giggles... apt-get install libesd-alsa0
[01:34] <dalderman> ok
[01:34] <pere> sivang: with bt you mean bittorent, or a package called bt?
[01:34] <dalderman> just filling a bug with bugbuddy
[01:34] <thom> fabbione: you're slow :-)
[01:34] <pere> ahh.. too late.
[01:35] <|trey|> dalderman: reportbug or from ubuntu's site...
[01:35] <fabbione> thom: sorry.. i am still having some BDSM with X.. you know
[01:35] <dalderman> |trey|, should I go back to totem-gstreamer or stick with the xine one?
[01:35] <|trey|> neither work... gstreamer is default....
[01:36] <thom> fabbione: i think you enjoy that too much
[01:36] <dalderman> |trey|, nope still the same with totem-xine, I'll try gstreamer
[01:36] <|trey|> BDSM?
[01:37] <dalderman> |trey|, nope still segfaults
[01:37] <fabbione> thom: oh yeah.. i love when Xfree86 spanks me :P
[01:37] <dalderman> |trey|, am I your best friend now :-)
[01:38] <pere> Hrdwr_BoB: Thanks. btdownloadcurses works very nice from the command line...
[01:38] <housetier> dalderman, does playing music with rhythmbox work? (afaik rb uses the gstreamer backend too)
[01:38] <dalderman> housetier, not tried that, one sec
[01:39] <Hrdwr_BoB> pere: np
[01:40] <pere> Pity though if there isnt a decent way to start it directly from the browser. Now I can't tell my girlfriend that in Linux she just can click on the movies she want to download (ehhh did I say movies?. I meant large iso files with linux distributions)
[01:40] <dalderman> housetier, "OSS device "/dev/dsp" is already in uise by another program"
[01:40] <dalderman> housetier, does it not use esd then?
[01:40] <Linuxbcn>  apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree non rulez... mmmm
[01:40] <Hrdwr_BoB> pere: you could make a launcher and 'start in terminal'
[01:41] <Mithrandir> pere: pere somebody could package http://gnome-bt.sourceforge.net/
[01:41] <Hrdwr_BoB> then drag/drop
[01:41] <Hrdwr_BoB> I think
[01:41] <Mithrandir> s/ pere/ /
[01:41] <sivang> pere : are you talking about bittorrent?
[01:41] <pere> yes
[01:41] <sivang> pere : there is
[01:42] <pere> When I start it from the browser I get errors about wxPython missing
[01:42] <sivang> pere : you just install the bittorrent package, and when you click on a .torrent link it opens automatically
[01:42] <sivang> pere : sec
[01:42] <pere> and something about wxPython discontinued development...
[01:42] <housetier> dalderman, that indeed is a strange error message. in newer kernels alsa provides an OSS emulation that actually should be able to handle multiple sound sources
[01:43] <housetier> dalderman, you see I can listen to radio streams with bmp and still listen what it said in the latest anime release playing in mplayer
[01:44] <dalderman> perhaps it's the driver for my specific sound card?
[01:44] <pere> sivang: It is trying to start a program called btdownloadgui.
[01:44] <dalderman> housetier, snd_intel8x0
[01:45] <dalderman> housetier, should I file a bug?
[01:45] <sivang> pere : try for a sec open another terminal and start that program manually
[01:45] <sivang> pere : type "btdownloadgui"
[01:45] <housetier> dalderman, I don't think we've tried everything yet :)
[01:45] <dalderman> housetier, ok
[01:45] <dalderman> housetier, just trying xmms with esd
[01:46] <dalderman> housetier, yep that works
[01:46] <dalderman> housetier, breaks if I change to OSS driver tho
[01:46] <pere> I get an error here as well. Sending you the error as a priv msg
[01:46] <thom> pere: possibly you're missing libwxgtk2.4-python, which is only a recommends and which btdownloadgui needs
[01:46] <Kamion> pere: sounds like you need to install libwxgtk2.4-python
[01:47] <housetier> dalderman, hmmm can you tell totem (xine or gstreamer) to use esd as well?
[01:47] <sivang> pere : please, do
[01:47] <Kamion> ha, thom beat me
[01:47] <dalderman> housetier, not sure how, command line perhaps?
[01:47] <thom> Kamion: same minute :-)
[01:47] <sivang> Kamion : that package should have depended on that lib
[01:47] <Kamion> sivang: it's not required for all functionality in that package
[01:47] <sivang> Kamion : only for GTK support?
[01:48] <Kamion> sivang: that's why it's a recommends
[01:48] <sivang> Kamion : meaning that ncurses interface would work fine..ok
[01:48] <pere> sivang: OK. I was not able to copy and pass the error-msg anyway...:-)
[01:48] <housetier> dalderman, only thing I can think of is "totem --disable-sound" so it maybe starts up correctly, then try to find something in the settings, save those, and restart without --disable
[01:48] <sivang> pere : before everything else, try
[01:48] <dalderman> housetier, ok
[01:49] <sivang> pere : apt-get install libwxgtk2.4-python
[01:49] <dalderman> housetier, nope still get device busy error
[01:49] <sivang> pere : than try to re execute btdownloadgui without parameters, should give you a gtk window with available command line options.
[01:49] <thom> Kamion/aj: key should be fixed now
[01:50] <dalderman> this sucks I don't want to have to use XMMS
[01:50] <dalderman> I had Sarge on here before and it all worked
[01:50] <dalderman> kernel 2.4 tho
[01:50] <dalderman> non alsa
[01:51] <pere> ahhh... its a buty..:-) installed and tested. Already downloading my first bittorrent-file. Thanks a lot everybody!!
[01:52] <dalderman> should I file a bug now then?
[01:52] <housetier> dalderman, there is already a bug filed for debian
[01:52] <dalderman> housetier, k
[01:52] <dalderman> housetier, I shall have to be patient then
[01:52] <dalderman> housetier, is it "oss won't share with esd" ?
[01:52] <housetier> dalderman, http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pkg-gnome-maintainers/2004-July/005480.html and the reply: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pkg-gnome-maintainers/2004-July/005501.html
[01:52] <dalderman> housetier, ta
[01:52] <sivang> pere : :-)
[01:53] <sivang> dakderman : why not using XMMS?
[01:53] <sivang> dalderman : why not XMMS?
[01:53] <dalderman> sivang, coz it's ugly
[01:53] <dalderman> sivang, gtk1
[01:54] <dalderman> sivang, and not really part of gnome
[01:54] <housetier> dalderman, you should give beep media player a try then
[01:54] <dalderman> sivang, I want rythmbox management style
[01:54] <dalderman> housetier, ok
[01:54] <dalderman> housetier, not heard of that one
[01:54] <housetier> dalderman, http://beepmp.sf.net for info screenshots etc
[01:55] <dalderman> housetier, still have a broken totem tho
[01:55] <dalderman> housetier, what should I use for video?
[01:56] <housetier> dalderman, the obvious answer is: use the player that works :D
[01:57] <housetier> dalderman, I only use mplayer, vlc when I have trouble setting the aspect ratio
[01:57] <housetier> dalderman, but then I have a very unique setup here
[02:00] <dalderman> housetier, yay beep player crashes too!
[02:01] <dalderman> housetier, I think it's crappy sound drivers
[02:01] <housetier> (its the reason I don't like sound daemons)
[02:03] <dalderman> housetier, mplayer crashes too
[02:03] <dalderman> housetier, I think I will not use esd
[02:05] <housetier> dalderman, however I can't really help you there. my setup is fundamentally different from yours. I can but give you hints and pointers
[02:05] <tseng> hm am i missing something, or is the ubuntu kernel source not available
[02:06] <spiv> tseng: linux-source-*
[02:06] <tseng> ah was looking at kernel-source
[02:06] <tseng> ta
[02:07] <dalderman> housetier, thanks for all your help
[02:07] <dalderman> |trey|, you too, thank you
[02:09] <dalderman> housetier, oss and alsa output works with beep-player
[02:09] <dalderman> housetier, once esd is dead
[02:10] <axe9> my coputer is still t3h borked..
[02:12] <housetier> dalderman, maybe it'll work with totem as well (once you made sure esd is not running anymore)
[02:13] <dalderman> housetier, nope just tried that
[02:13] <dalderman> housetier, totem still has the same error
[02:13] <axe9> anyoen know why my sound doesn't work?
[02:14] <dalderman> sound is the topic of the day it seems
[02:14] <dalderman> mplaer won't play my new StarWars DVD either
[02:15] <Hrdwr_BoB> that's convenient because it's broken
[02:15] <Hrdwr_BoB> han doesn't shoot first
[02:15] <Hrdwr_BoB> >:|
[02:15] <dalderman> lol
[02:15] <dalderman> won't play Empire either
[02:17] <dalderman> gxine plays it :-)
[02:18] <axe9> I just don't get ANY soud
[02:18] <axe9> sound*
[02:18] <Lowe> mplayer plays al my dvd's fine *yawn*
[02:18] <dalderman> nope, that crashes too
[02:19] <dalderman> Lowe, can I have your computer please?
[02:19] <Lowe> Maybe for your christmas
[02:19] <thaytan> dalderman: use totem-xine for DVDs
[02:20] <dalderman> thaytan, I just spent about an hour trying to find out why totem-xine crashes with no success
[02:20] <thaytan> ouch
[02:21] <dalderman> basically all multimedia on my laptop dies with Ubuntu
[02:21] <dalderman> it was fine with Sarge
[02:21] <dalderman> I think it's kernel 2.6 audio
[02:21] <thaytan> setting the audio output to null should tell you that
[02:21] <thaytan> or using esd
[02:21] <dalderman> gxine crashes with "NAV packet borked"
[02:21] <dalderman> esd works
[02:22] <dalderman> just nothing else will when it runs
[02:22] <Lowe> I'm glad i don't have all these problems :P
[02:22] <thaytan> dalderman: NAV packet borked is interesting
[02:26] <psyklops> I have been trying all night to install ubuntu, and every time I get the same result: at a random time during installation of the base system, I get disk i/o errors from my CDROM (hdb). I've tried burning the ISO to other disks, but that doesn't help.
[02:26] <thaytan> it could be a deficiency in libdvdnav
[02:26] <dalderman> Lowe, aren't you lucky
[02:26] <Treenaks> thaytan: or a buggy dvd
[02:26] <thaytan> Treenaks: good point
[02:26] <dalderman> I'll get another one and try it
[02:26] <dalderman> brb
[02:26] <housetier> *cough*bad rip*cough*
[02:26] <dalderman> no
[02:26] <dalderman> it's real
[02:26] <housetier> :D
[02:26] <Treenaks> dalderman: which one is it?
[02:26] <dalderman> dvd?
[02:26] <Treenaks> yes
[02:26] <dalderman> Empire Strikes back
[02:26] <dalderman> gonna try Shaun of the Dead
[02:26] <Treenaks> dalderman: hm, I hope it's not a problem with Empire... I've ordered that too
[02:26] <dalderman> gxine is just crashing with that one
[02:26] <dalderman> :-(
[02:26] <dalderman> this is pants!
[02:26] <Treenaks> dalderman: how about totem-xine?
[02:26] <Lowe> gxine hates full screen so it's no use to me
[02:26] <dalderman> Treenaks, have to install, one sec
[02:26] <sabdfl> elmo: any response from internet solutions re mirror in south africa?
[02:26] <psyklop1> bah... disconnected
[02:26] <psyklop1> how much of my message got out there?
[02:27] <Lowe> all of it
[02:27] <dalderman> Treenaks, "The Application Totem has unexpectedly quit"
[02:27] <psyklop1> it was three lines
[02:27] <Treenaks> dalderman: wow.. I'd file a bug
[02:27] <dalderman> ok
[02:27] <dalderman> no dvd's for me :-(
[02:27] <dalderman> good job I still have XP on here
[02:27] <psyklop1> 1) installing ubuntu results in i/o errors at random times
[02:27] <Treenaks> totem-xine works fine with dvds for me
[02:28] <Treenaks> (hm, maybe it's a css problem?)
[02:28] <psyklop1> 2) debian and knoppix install on the system without incident
[02:28] <Lowe> eww xp (I only keep mine because my music is on it)
[02:28] <dalderman> Lowe, well when I can play movies on here it will be gone
[02:28] <dalderman> till then it stays
[02:28] <psyklop1> Are there any known bugs with the filesystem of the iso?
[02:29] <psyklop1> it installs fine on my system, but on the other one it gives me random errors
[02:29] <dalderman> could this be anything to do with me using ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/ unstable main w32codecs package?
[02:30] <Lowe> download the win32codecs from the mplayer homepage
[02:30] <Lowe> but i doubt that's the problem
[02:31] <dalderman> I shall remove and try anyway
[02:33] <jMi> I've got devices hald is recognising, but Gnome doesn't know what to do with. Is there a collection of .fdi files anywhere, or should I be trying to write my own?
[02:35] <dalderman> aha
[02:35] <dalderman> totem now plays audio
[02:35] <dalderman> not dvd's tho
[02:35] <tseng> hey, new spamassassin is out
[02:36] <Treenaks> dalderman: have you installed libdvdcss from nerim.net as well?
[02:37] <dalderman> nope
[02:37] <dalderman> I removed all the nerim.net packages
[02:37] <dalderman> totem still crashes with dvd's tho
[02:37] <Treenaks> dalderman: you probably need libdvdcss for DVD CSS decoding
[02:37] <gluon> I'm having trouble with my sound card. The module (snd_intel8x0) is loaded, /dev/dsp exists, but I still cannot get sound. Rhythmbox gives out error: OSS device /dev/dsp is already in use by another program. Any ideas how to solve this?
[02:38] <dalderman> Treenaks, should I get that from nerim.net then?
[02:38] <thaytan> gluon: I'd figure out which app is accessing
[02:38] <Treenaks> gluon: tell rhythmbox to use esd
[02:38] <thaytan> it's probably esd
[02:38] <Treenaks> dalderman: it's on nerim.net
[02:39] <gluon> thank you guys, the problem was esd.
[02:40] <dalderman> WOOOHOOO
[02:40] <dalderman> :-)
[02:40] <dalderman> DVD tastic
[02:40] <dalderman> I wonder what the package that breaking it was
[02:40] <dalderman> something from nerim.net
[02:40] <dalderman> I removed them all
[02:41] <dalderman> re-installed libdvdcss, and pulled in loads of other stuff
[02:41] <dalderman> and now it works
[02:41] <dalderman> I shall now test Empire
[02:41] <Treenaks> dalderman: dvdcss probably.. most dvds are encrypted, and libdvdcss "breaks" that encryption so you can watch the movie
[02:42] <dalderman> yes, but it was there before
[02:42] <dalderman> as I was using the nerim.net repository
[02:43] <dalderman> I haven't got the w32codecs package from there on here now tho
[02:43] <dalderman> Empire seems to work ok
[02:43] <housetier> dalderman, that's good news :)
[02:44] <dalderman> so could it be w32codecs breaking it I wonder
[02:44] <Treenaks> dalderman: probably not..
[02:44] <Treenaks> dalderman: I have them, and it works great
[02:44] <dalderman> you wouldn't think so
[02:44] <dalderman> so what was broken then ???
[02:45] <thaytan> Hadess did blog something about fixing the w32codec loader the other day
[02:45] <dalderman> libdvdcss was there b4
[02:45] <Treenaks> don't know..
[02:45] <Treenaks> thaytan: then that might be it..
[02:45] <dalderman> maybe something was corrupt on disk and just needed reinstalling?
[02:45] <housetier> or maybe a package needed an upgrade
[02:45] <Treenaks> very unlikely, unless you altered files yourself
[02:46] <dalderman> Treenaks, true
[02:46] <Treenaks> is "planet ubuntu" up yet?
[02:46] <dalderman> Treenaks, but weirder things happen
[02:46] <dalderman> so I wonder if I can use esd now
[02:47] <dalderman> brb
[02:48] <julien_> hi
[02:48] <tsblack> 'lo all
[02:48] <tsblack> Are any of you aware of mail() issues with the current ubuntu php build?
[02:49] <julien_> I'v just updated ubuntu and my USB storage disks don't appear in "disks" anymore. However, they are mounted correctlt, just not happened to /etc/fstab.
[02:49] <Mitario> hey everyone
[02:49] <dalderman> ok, now my esd isn't starting
[02:50] <dalderman> did I frighten Trey off?
[02:50] <Treenaks> dalderman: esd isn't starting? that's weird..
[02:50] <dalderman> Treenaks, yeah, I know
[02:51] <dalderman> how do I debug this one?
[02:51] <dalderman> maybe my sound hardware is locked, reboot?
[02:52] <thaytan> fuser /dev/dsp /dev/snd/pcmC*p
[02:52] <thaytan> that should give you process ids if anyone is using the sound card
[02:52] <dalderman> nope
[02:52] <dalderman> nada
[02:53] <dalderman> lsof gives nothing either
[02:53] <thaytan> run esd manually?
[02:53] <dalderman> just esd, no args?
[02:53] <thaytan> yeah, that'll do
[02:54] <dalderman> dan@scutter ~ $ esd
[02:54] <dalderman> Audio device open for 44.1Khz, stereo, 16bit failed
[02:54] <dalderman> Trying 44.1Khz, 8bit stereo.
[02:54] <dalderman> Audio device open for 44.1Khz, stereo, 8bit failed
[02:54] <dalderman> Trying 48Khz, 16bit stereo.
[02:54] <dalderman> Audio device open for 48Khz, stereo,16bit failed
[02:54] <dalderman> Trying 22.05Khz, 8bit stereo.
[02:54] <dalderman> Audio device open for 22.05Khz, stereo, 8bit failed
[02:54] <dalderman> Trying 44.1Khz, 16bit mono.
[02:54] <dalderman> Audio device open for 44.1Khz, mono, 8bit failed
[02:54] <dalderman> Trying 22.05Khz, 8bit mono.
[02:54] <dalderman> Audio device open for 22.05Khz, mono, 8bit failed
[02:54] <dalderman> Trying 11.025Khz, 8bit stereo.
[02:54] <dalderman> Audio device open for 11.025Khz, stereo, 8bit failed
[02:54] <dalderman> Trying 11.025Khz, 8bit mono.
[02:54] <dalderman> Audio device open for 11.025Khz, mono, 8bit failed
[02:54] <dalderman> Trying 8.192Khz, 8bit mono.
[02:54] <dalderman> Audio device open for 8.192Khz, mono, 8bit failed
[02:54] <dalderman> Trying 8Khz, 8bit mono.
[02:54] <dalderman> Sound device inadequate for Esound. Fatal.
[02:54] <dalderman> I feel so inadequate
[02:54] <dalderman> Totem still plays audio tho
[02:55] <thaytan> hrmn, no idea what would cause that
[02:55] <thaytan> what's the sound card?
[02:55] <dalderman> intel POS
[02:55] <dalderman> snd_intel8x0
[02:55] <dalderman> Toshiba laptop, Sat Pro A10
[02:55] <thaytan> same I have here
[02:56] <thaytan> (which works)
[02:56] <dalderman> I'll hard reset and see what happens, it was working before
[02:57] <dalderman> brb
[02:57] <lamont> aj: about still?
[02:58] <lamont> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/misc/daily_signing_key.asc is probably it...
[02:58] <thom> lamont: elmo had to fix it first ;-)
[02:59] <lamont> figured it was fixed...
[02:59] <thom> lamont: it was the wrong key, previously
[02:59] <lamont> doh
[03:00] <dalderman> thaytan, nope reset didn't work
[03:01] <dalderman> thaytan, manual run of esd gets same error
[03:01] <thaytan> um... is the oss emulation module loaded?
[03:01] <dalderman> round and round and round we go :-)
[03:01] <dalderman> dan@scutter ~ $ lsmod | grep oss
[03:01] <dalderman> snd_pcm_oss            48168  0
[03:01] <dalderman> snd_mixer_oss          16640  3 snd_pcm_oss
[03:01] <dalderman> snd_pcm                85540  2 snd_intel8x0,snd_pcm_oss
[03:01] <dalderman> snd                    50660  11 snd_intel8x0,snd_ac97_codec,snd_pcm_oss,snd_mixer_oss,snd_pcm,snd_timer,snd_mpu401_uart,snd_rawmidi,snd_seq_device
[03:02] <dalderman> dan@scutter ~ $ ls -l /dev/dsp
[03:02] <dalderman> crw-rw----    1 root     audio     14,   3 2004-09-22 13:58 /dev/dsp
[03:02] <dalderman> beep player works with OSS output
[03:02] <dalderman> and with alsa output
[03:04] <Treenaks> could you add "snd_intel8x0m" and "snd-intel8x0m" to /etc/hotplug/blacklist, reboot and try again
[03:04] <Treenaks> ?
[03:04] <Treenaks> if it's not in there already
[03:04] <dalderman> already have done
[03:04] <dalderman> remove the modem right?
[03:04] <Treenaks> dalderman: doesn't work? weirdness..
[03:04] <Treenaks> yes
[03:04] <dalderman> Treenaks, yep
[03:04] <dalderman> Treenaks, I am full of that today
[03:05] <Treenaks> dalderman: what happens if you tell ESD to try 48 khz instead of 44.1?
[03:05] <dalderman> Treenaks, just had a thought
[03:06] <dalderman> I had libesd-alsa0 on there from earlier advice, replacing with libesd0
[03:06] <dalderman> Voila!
[03:06] <Treenaks> now it works?
[03:06] <dalderman> I blame |Trey
[03:06] <dalderman> yeah
[03:06] <dalderman> libesd-alsa0 is borked
[03:07] <thom> yeah, that's why we don't install it by default
[03:07] <Treenaks> dalderman: so everything works now? :)
[03:08] <dalderman> Treenaks, nope, Totem is broken now
[03:08] <dalderman> Treenaks, crashes on startup
[03:08] <Treenaks> what's the error?
[03:09] <dalderman> Treenaks, "The App Totem has quit unexpe..."
[03:10] <dalderman> try to restart
[03:10] <dalderman> and it just dies
[03:10] <Treenaks> dalderman: and if you start it from the command line?
[03:10] <dalderman> Treenaks, this is totem-xone
[03:10] <dalderman> xine
[03:10] <Treenaks> dalderman: doesn't matter, that works for me too
[03:10] <dalderman> nothing
[03:10] <dalderman> no output
[03:10] <dalderman> just dies
[03:10] <dalderman> beep player works with esd output tho
[03:11] <Treenaks> don't know then, sorry
[03:11] <dalderman> Treenaks, np, thanks for trying :-)
[03:13] <dalderman> gxine appears to work fine with esd
[03:13] <thaytan> dalderman: how can beep use esd output if it isn't running?
[03:14] <thaytan> oh, you reinstall esd-oss
[03:14] <dalderman> thaytan, yeah, removed the alsa one
[03:14] <dalderman> that was breaking it all
[03:14] <dalderman> IMHO alsa sucks
[03:15] <Sirius_Black> hi guys - how do i 'create' roor in ubuntu with sudo please
[03:15] <Sirius_Black> *root
[03:16] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, it's in the faq
[03:16] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/faq/helpcenterfaq.2004-09-15.5722653677
[03:16] <Sirius_Black> dalderman: tnx man
[03:17] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, np
[03:17] <dalderman> mmmm DVD playback on framebuffer X
[03:17] <Sirius_Black> i m installing it on my second machine and i had forgotten how i did it the first time round
[03:17] <Sirius_Black> ;)
[03:17] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, sudo passwd root
[03:18] <Sirius_Black> btw - is it possible to get framebuffer on console with nVidia cards
[03:18] <Sirius_Black> thnx dalderman
[03:18] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, AFAIk, I am using it with i810
[03:19] <andred> Any hope of getting security fixed Firefox and Thunderbird into Ubuntu soon?
[03:19] <dalderman> vga=0x318 should give you vesafb in 1024x768 with 24bit
[03:19] <Sirius_Black> dalderman: sudo paswd root, asks me for a password.  do i give it the user password?
[03:19] <dalderman> The Framebuffer HOWTO on tldp.org has all the modes listed
[03:19] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, yes your password
[03:19] <Treenaks> Sirius_Black: first, user password (to make sudo become root), then it'll ask for a root password
[03:19] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, then it will ask for a new root passwd
[03:20] <Sirius_Black> dalderman, Treenaks - got it tnx
[03:20] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, Treenaks know more than me, he's the eggspurt
[03:20] <dalderman> or she?
[03:20] <dalderman> actually I have no idea
[03:20] <Treenaks> dalderman: he :)
[03:20] <Sirius_Black> dalderman: i810 isnt nVidia.  is it?
[03:20] <dalderman> no
[03:20] <dalderman> but it uses vesa
[03:20] <Sirius_Black> ok
[03:21] <Treenaks> dalderman: doesn't X work natively (including 3d) on i810?
[03:21] <dalderman> which works IIRC
[03:21] <dalderman> my workstation has nvidia
[03:21] <Sirius_Black> so does anyone know if i can have framebuffered console with nVidia cards
[03:21] <dalderman> Treenaks, yes, I'm sick :-)
[03:21] <Treenaks> dalderman: ah ok
[03:21] <Treenaks> Sirius_Black: of course you can
[03:21] <Sirius_Black> Treenaks: tell me how please
[03:21] <Sirius_Black> :-((
[03:22] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, add vga=0x318 to your kernel boot line
[03:22] <Treenaks> Sirius_Black: just like you do on any other card... see dalderman's response
[03:22] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, in /boot/grub/menu.lst
[03:22] <Sirius_Black> ok tnx - i'll try that and will let u know :-)
[03:22] <dalderman> Sirius_Black, title           Ubuntu, kernel <IP_ADDRESS>-2-386 Framebuffer
[03:22] <dalderman> root            (hd0,1)
[03:22] <dalderman> kernel          /boot/vmlinuz-<IP_ADDRESS>-2-386 root=/dev/hda2 ro vga=0x318 quiet splash
[03:22] <dalderman> initrd          /boot/initrd.img-<IP_ADDRESS>-2-386
[03:22] <dalderman> savedefault
[03:22] <dalderman> boot
[03:22] <Sirius_Black> tnx a lot dalderman and Treenaks
[03:22] <dalderman> np
[03:23] <dalderman> nice to give some help back
[03:23] <dalderman> I been hogging this place all morning
[03:23] <dalderman> mmmmmm Empire on dvd :-)
[03:23] <Sirius_Black> dalderman: u using mplayer?
[03:23] <dalderman> gxine
[03:23] <Sirius_Black> i c
[03:26] <Se7h> hey
[03:26] <thaytan> Sirius_Black: I believe the correct way to add to the kernel line is to add them to the kopt line
[03:27] <Se7h> doesn't ubuntu come with tcl ?
[03:27] <thaytan> leave it commented out and add to the end
[03:27] <thaytan> then run update-grub
[03:27] <thaytan> otherwise new kernel packages are going to kill your modifications
[03:28] <Sirius_Black> thaytan: tnx
[03:28] <Sirius_Black> btw guys - is it safe to point sources.list to sid and do dist-upgrade?
[03:28] <dalderman> brb fooooood required
[03:28] <dalderman> mmmmmmm macarooon
[03:29] <Se7h> doesn't ubuntu come with tcl ?
[03:30] <beezly> Se7h: asking twice doesn't make you louder ;)
[03:30] <Se7h> i know it doesn't
[03:30] <Chriffer> it probably has it somewhere, there is a lon of junk in universe
[03:30] <dalderman> thaytan, sorry, I am giving bad advice
[03:30] <beezly> apt-cache search tcl
[03:31] <beezly> with universe in I get 216 entries
[03:31] <thom> Se7h: it's in main - tcl8.4
[03:31] <Se7h> tcl8.4-dev - Tcl (the Tool Command Language) v8.4 - development files
[03:31] <Se7h> hm hmm
[03:31] <Se7h> thanks
[03:32] <Se7h> grrrr
[03:32] <Se7h> i'm getting the dependencies stuff again
[03:33] <beezly> what like?
[03:33] <Lowe> tcl was already installed on my ubuntu, maybe im just special.
[03:33] <beezly> Lowe: nah, it was for me too and I don't think I installed it specially
[03:34] <thaytan> dalderman: 'salright, I only learnt myself yesterday :)
[03:34] <Se7h> forget it
[03:34] <Se7h> it is
[03:34] <thaytan> Sirius_Black: no, there's no guarantees of compatibility with sid
[03:34] <thaytan> and Bad Things may happen
[03:34] <Se7h> tcl8.4 is already the newest version.
[03:34] <beezly> yep
[03:34] <beezly> so you already have tcl installed
[03:35] <Se7h> checking whether the Tcl system has changed... yes
[03:35] <Se7h> configure: error:
[03:35] <Se7h>   Tcl cannot be found on this system.
[03:35] <Se7h> yeah but i get that
[03:35] <Se7h> what is the path to it ?
[03:36] <Treenaks> Se7h: which tcl ?
[03:36] <beezly> which tclsh
[03:36] <Lowe> building form source is so gay, i have like 1% of it working correctly
[03:36] <Treenaks> uh yes
[03:36] <beezly> /usr/bin/tclsh8.4
[03:36] <Se7h> checking for Tcl library... found /usr/lib/libtcl8.0.so.1
[03:36] <Se7h> checking for Tcl header... {not found}
[03:36] <dalderman> So, who can tell me why the modules shpchp.ko and pciehp.kp cause errors on boot and remain unloaded?
[03:36] <Treenaks> Se7h: tcl header != tcl library
[03:36] <Se7h> yes
[03:37] <Treenaks> Se7h: you'll probably need  apt-cache search tcl header
[03:37] <beezly> no no
[03:37] <beezly> tcl8.4-dev
[03:37] <Treenaks> which gives me:
[03:37] <Treenaks> tcl8.4-dev - Tcl (the Tool Command Language) v8.4 - development files
[03:37] <beezly> ah I see
[03:37] <beezly> apologies Treenaks
[03:38] <beezly> Se7h: perhaps you need to tell the thing you're compiling where the tcl headers are?
[03:38] <beezly> they're in /usr/include/tcl8.4
[03:39] <Treenaks> beezly: "teach a man to fish" and stuff...
[03:39] <Se7h> well
[03:39] <Se7h> it returned the tcl8.4dev
[03:39] <Se7h> brb
[03:40] <beezly> Treenaks: indeed
[03:40] <beezly> "and he'll cook you a mighty fish supper" :)
[03:40] <Se7h> lol
[03:40] <dalderman> Anyone know what the shpchp.ko and pciehp.ko modules do?
[03:40] <beezly> Se7h: what are you laughing at? We're expecting a mighty fish supper!
[03:41] <Se7h> and i will cook one for you both
[03:41] <Se7h> :)
[03:41] <Se7h> brb
[03:41] <Se7h> lunch
[03:41] <beezly> heh
[03:43] <Sirius_Black> is there any doc about installing nvidia drivers
[03:43] <jdub> Sirius_Black: BinaryDriverHowto on the wiki
[03:45] <beezly> mm, time for more caffeine
[03:50] <dalderman> If I wish to add ttf fonts to X so I can use them in xemacs, can I simply add the /usr/share/fonts/truetype dir as it has a fonts.cache-1 file, or do I need to add the individual subdirs
[03:51] <dalderman> or do I need to do ttmkfdir type things?
[03:51] <dalderman> it's a while since I did this stuff
[03:51] <Sirius_Black> guys - after i edit /boot/grub/menu.lst, do i need to run something that upadtes grub or takes account of changes
[03:52] <Mithrandir> Sirius_Black: no, grub reads the file system
[03:52] <thaytan> Sirius_Black: you need to run the update-grub script if you did the editing the way I said
[03:52] <thaytan> but that just rebuilds menu.lst to include your change to the kopt line
[03:52] <thaytan> grub doesn't need to reinstall itself like lilo
[03:57] <Se7h> erm i don't get it
[03:57] <Se7h> tcl8.4 is already the newest version.
[03:57] <Se7h> but then..
[03:58] <Se7h> checking for Tcl patch level...
[03:58] <Se7h> configure: error:
[03:58] <Se7h>   Your Tcl version is much too old
[03:58] <ich> hi
[03:58] <ich> just doin a apt-get upgrade, done one or two yesterday and today there are 10new packages?
[03:58] <ik5pvx> more or less
[03:59] <ich> much libs
[03:59] <WW> ich: I'm installing 41 packages, new since some time yesterday.  Looks like X was upgraded.
[03:59] <ich> yes it was maybe 4.4?
[04:00] <Se7h> 12 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
[04:00] <tseng> ich: no way
[04:00] <Se7h> 12 here
[04:00] <WW> No, 4.3.
[04:00] <ich> so, is firestarter a good firewall?
[04:01] <Treenaks> ich: "firestarter" is not a firewall, but only a tool that creates iptables rules. iptables rules tend to be "a firewall"
[04:01] <Lowe> Firestarter pwns
[04:01] <pisuke> ich, try shorewall
[04:01] <ich> ok, gonna try it
[04:01] <Lowe> No firestarter is nice and easy to use
[04:01] <lifeless> we couldn't find a really good robust firewall tool, which is why we don't have a specific one in warty...
[04:01] <ich> but firestarter is easy, so i like it, and its german
[04:02] <lifeless> firewalling gets complex /fast/.
[04:02] <lifeless> Just explaning why there are so many, and why you are having to choose one yourself :)
[04:02] <ich> ok @lifeless: but if i start firestarter it wants an password, can i remove this message to startt it as normal user?
[04:02] <Lowe> ich remember to start it like gksudo /usr/sbin/firestarter
[04:03] <ich> i wanted to write an sciprt for inet, like pon dsl-provider and then start firestarter?
[04:04] <dalderman> no msttcorefonts in Ubuntu?
[04:05] <ich> would an scipt like this ok?
[04:05] <ich> hmm?
[04:06] <Se7h> oh btw
[04:06] <Se7h> where the hell is gnome-audio ?
[04:07] <Lowe> there is a lot of gnome stuff missing in ubuntu that's supposed to be there
[04:07] <Se7h> i can see that
[04:07] <ich> ok, please tell me :)
[04:07] <Lowe> Like file types prefrences
[04:07] <Lowe> ich maybe no one knows
[04:07] <Se7h> a...
[04:07] <ich> oh
[04:07] <ich> ok
[04:07] <Anna> Hi it's me again
[04:07] <ich> so gonna try it
[04:07] <ich> hi ana
[04:07] <Se7h> Lowe isn't that there?

[04:07] <ich> anna
[04:08] <Lowe> no se7h
[04:08] <Se7h> hi Anna
[04:08] <ich> so ciao
[04:08] <Se7h> no?
[04:08] <Se7h> i mean
[04:08] <beezly> hey Anna
[04:08] <Se7h> what u mean bu file types preferences?
[04:09] <Anna> I have one of these newbies questions and I feel less intelligent already...
[04:09] <Lowe> hold on a min
[04:09] <Se7h> lol
[04:09] <Se7h> k
[04:10] <WW> After updating this morning, I see a new package is available called ubuntu-base.  Does anyone know what this is?
[04:10] <Anna> When I install a program with the SPM, and it is not listed in the GUI Panel, in which folder do I have to look?
[04:10] <beezly> SPM? is that Synaptic?
[04:10] <Anna> yes
[04:11] <beezly> ah
[04:11] <Anna> the ubuntu apt-get
[04:11] <beezly> eyp
[04:11] <beezly> Anna: you tried the "Find" button at the top?
[04:11] <Anna> Yes, but it wants the folder first....
[04:12] <Lowe> ok se7h
[04:12] <Lowe> File types and programs is supposed to be in Apps > desktop prefrences > advanced > file types and programs. But there is no advanced tab.
[04:12] <Lowe> File types
[04:12] <Lowe> You can specify how files of various types are displayed and edited. For example, you can specify an icon to reperesent a particular type of file. For another example, you can specify that if a file is a plain text file, the file is launched in a text editor.
[04:12] <beezly> Ah, do you mean where it says "Look in"?
[04:13] <Anna> yes
[04:13] <beezly> Just choose "Name"
[04:13] <Anna> ok, brb
[04:14] <beezly> you can still use apt-get too, you just have to put "sudo apt-get install blah foo whatever"
[04:14] <Se7h> Lowe yes, for sure Advanced isn't there
[04:14] <Se7h> but i think u can define that kind stuff
[04:14] <Se7h> w8
[04:14] <Lowe> I was expecting it to be there and was dissapointed since it's in the gnome manual which ubuntu comes with.
[04:16] <Kamion> WW: ubuntu-base is empty at the moment, but it's going to move into the base system and contain random Ubuntu-specific basic scripts
[04:16] <WW> Kamion: OK, thanks.
[04:17] <Kamion> speaking of, I should make the relevant debootstrap change now
[04:17] <Se7h> erm Lowe just a few days ago i was in the GUI window that lets u specify what program to use with each file type
[04:17] <Se7h> the icon
[04:17] <Anna> Ok, that was a misunderstanding. I'm not looking for applications *in* the SPM, I'm want to know the folder where applications are stored on my hard drive *after* I have installed them.
[04:18] <Se7h> can't remember
[04:18] <beezly> Anna: ah
[04:18] <Lowe> That's a less advanced version se7h
[04:19] <beezly> right click the package you are interested in
[04:19] <Anna> See, I have installed "imagemagick" and now I can't run it because I can't find it.
[04:19] <beezly> go down to properties
[04:19] <Nonphasis> anyone got xmms working?
[04:19] <Lowe> loads of people have, but i don't use xmms anyway. BMP all the way.
[04:20] <Nonphasis> bmp?
[04:20] <Treenaks> beep
[04:20] <Lowe> beep-media-player
[04:20] <beezly> Anna: then across to "Installed Files"
[04:20] <Nonphasis> aha, gotta check it out
[04:20] <Nonphasis> xmms crashed on me immediately
[04:20] <beezly> Anna: ImageMagick is a whole lot of programs none of which are called "ImageMagick" :)
[04:21] <WW> Anna: I think imagemagick provides a suite of command line program.  I've used `convert` quite a bit.  I don't think there is a main GUI app.
[04:22] <Anna> Yes, I've found the locations now under propterties - installed files.
[04:22] <mwh_> I like xmms because it support mod files, I like BMP, but it does not support mod files :(
[04:22] <Anna> The description read that it can also be run under GUI..
[04:23] <beezly> Anna: hmm, I don't know how to do that with imagemagick
[04:23] <beezly> Anna: are you wanting to manipulate images?
[04:23] <Lowe> BMP supports whatever xmms plays, since it can use xmms plugins.
[04:24] <WW> Anna: Ah, I see that is does.  So in this case, you could run `display` from a command line.
[04:24] <WW> s/is/it/
[04:24] <Nonphasis> Lowe, thanks for the tip, looks great show far
[04:24] <Lowe> xmms was really ugly (the menu at least)
[04:24] <Anna> But that still doesn't solve my problem. When I want to run "Abi-word" or Open Office, I click on its symbol and the application pops open. Now how do I open applications that are not listed in the panel? There has got to be a easier way then searching through folders..
[04:25] <pisuke> imho in the computer menu should be a Open Location (ctrl+l)
[04:26] <WW> Anna: Yeah, I agree.
[04:26] <beezly> Anna: if you know the name of the program you can create a new "launcher" on the panel
[04:27] <Anna>  How do I create the launcher?
[04:27] <Lowe> *sigh* I'm going to lie down
[04:27] <beezly> right click on the panel -> Add to Panel, then Applictaion Launcher
[04:28] <beezly> Anna: sorry, that's wrong "Custom Application Launcher"
[04:29] <Anna> I noticed.
[04:29] <Nonphasis> how do i associate a media player in right-click menu for folders... like "enqueue in winamp" on dos?
[04:29] <Nonphasis> it worked on kde...
[04:30] <tvon|x31> If you have rhythmbox installed there should be a right click menu item
[04:30] <tvon|x31> otherwise you can do right-click->properties->open with
[04:30] <Anna> Ah, now I'm back on square one, because it is asking me for the url
[04:31] <Anna> I assume the url means the location of the application...
[04:31] <Lowe> (well duh)
[04:32] <Anna> So this returns me to my initial problem of how do I know where the application is stored on my hdd.
[04:32] <Anna> since in the SPM, there are many different locations under preferences...
[04:33] <Treenaks> "the SPM" ?
[04:33] <Anna> synaptic package manager
[04:33] <WW> Anna: I am looking at the Create Launcher window; where does it ask for a URL?
[04:33] <Treenaks> ah
[04:34] <Anna> Once I click "ok" it gives me the error message.
[04:34] <Anna> Cannot create launcher
[04:34] <Anna> Details: You have to specify a valid URL or comma
[04:35] <WW> Anna: I see.  Enter `display` in the command field (without the quotes).
[04:35] <mwh_> Lowe: I cannot get BMP to play mods, what should I do to get it to do that?
[04:36] <mwh_> Lowe: when I compile xmms it gets support for libmikmod, but when I compile BMP it doesnot
[04:36] <Anna> Oh wow, it worked!
[04:36] <mwh_> Lowe: so its not intirely correct what you are saying
[04:37] <Anna> And I didn't have to specify the url
[04:38] <Anna> Thanks for your patience and advice WW
[04:38] <WW> Anna: It was asking for a "valid URL or command", and `display` is the command.
[04:38] <WW> WW: No problem.
[04:38] <WW> Anna: Doh!  Now I'm talking to myself.
[04:39] <Anna> Huh?
[04:39] <Lowe> Well it plays what i need and that's all that matters.
[04:39] <WW> Anna: (I typed WW: instead of Anna: a couple lines back.)
[04:39] <Anna> oh ok, lol
[04:40] <Anna> not that I noticed....
[04:40] <Anna> So the launcher would automatically associate the location just by entering the applications name?
[04:41] <Anna> (and typing 'display')
[04:41] <tvon|x31> why would you make a launcher for the 'display' command, btw?
[04:41] <Treenaks> Anna: I'd assume that it would look in a few standard locations (the path)
[04:42] <Anna> I see @ Treenaks
[04:42] <WW> Anna: Not sure I understand your question.
[04:43] <tseng> jdub: hmm the wiki page for universe candidates says its immutable
[04:43] <Sirius_Black> is there an mplayer binary or is it better to compile it from source?
[04:43] <Anna> Tvon, the task wasn't to create a launcher for 'display' it was to find an application (and add it to the GUI/panel) and apparently the command display was needed to assist the launcher in finding the applications.
[04:43] <WW> WW: `display` is an executable command; the launcher runs this command when you click on it.
[04:43] <tvon|x31> oh, gotcha :)
[04:44] <jdub> tseng: you need to log in (click UserPreferences)
[04:44] <tvon|x31> jdub: is Limi involved with this project?
[04:45] <jdub> tvon|x31: yeah
[04:45] <WW> Anna: Actually, YOU found the application, and told the launcher what to do.
[04:45] <beezly> gah, had to go talk to the boss
[04:45] <beezly> i complain but I get to change my hours two days per week :)
[04:46] <beezly> 12-8
[04:46] <tvon|x31> jdub: spiffy, just curious as I heard a rumor :)
[04:46] <WW> Anna: If you install some other package, and you want it to have an icon on the panel, you'll again have to figure out (or know in advance) the name of the executable file, and enter in the "Command" field.
[04:46] <Anna> Well I 'found' the application in the sense that I installed it from the SPM, but I didn't specify it's location to the launcher it that's what you mean.
[04:47] <Anna> I understand WW
[04:47] <WW> Anna: On the other hand, a few packages that I have installed automatically showed up in the Applications menu.
[04:48] <Anna> Yes, I discovered that too with Abi Word
[04:48] <Anna> It was just there in the panel at its appropriate location under "office"
[04:51] <Anna> But it's dawning on my that perhaps ubuntu (or Gnome) is as of yet outside my ability to effectively operate. There are just too many gaps of knowledge which are impossible to bridge without the information needed.
[04:51] <tvon|x31> Anna: out of curiosity, what app are you trying to add a launcher for?
[04:52] <beezly> Anna: try and bear with it for a week, you'll pick up stuff *really* fast
[04:52] <Anna> I feel like I'm sitting on an Island, planning to pull other islands towards me with a rope to make a continent, but I don't know which direction I have to throw the rope at to "catch one"
[04:52] <Anna> imagemagick, the one I mentioned earlier
[04:53] <tvon|x31> ah
[04:53] <tvon|x31> Which imagemagick command?
[04:53] <Anna> I just entered "imagemagick" and "display" into the launcher.
[04:54] <tvon|x31> For which fields?
[04:54] <beezly> Anna: are you specifically wanting to use ImageMagick or just do image manipulation? if it's the latter, you'd be better off install gimp
[04:54] <tvon|x31> eg, when you right click on the panel -> add to panel -> custom application launcher..  You added "imagemagick" for "name" and "display" for "command" ?
[04:55] <Anna> I have gimp already, actually I don't need imagemagick, this was just an exercise and I chose an application from which I assumed that it wouldn't burn a hole into my system trying to run it
[04:55] <Anna>  sorry tvon, yes
[04:55] <tvon|x31> Anna: and that doesnt work? that should be enough
[04:55] <tvon|x31> though I've never tried running 'display' without any arguments, does it open a GUI window without arguments?
[04:55] <Anna> yes
[04:56] <tvon|x31> ah, k
[04:56] <Anna> (the problem was I didn't know the "display" command.
[04:56] <tvon|x31> ahhh
[04:56] <Anna> and I also didn't know about the launcher;-)
[04:56] <tvon|x31> Now you do :)
[04:56] <tvon|x31> Isn't learning fun!
[04:56] <tvon|x31> heh
[04:56] <Anna> Yes and it's a nice feeling
[04:57] <Anna> And I think it's wonderful that there are always people around who I can bug.
[04:57] <tvon|x31> 99% of the time you will not need to add a 'custom application launcher' though
[04:58] <Anna> You mean the icon would appear automatically after installing the app?
[04:58] <tvon|x31> I'm mighty geeky and I dont have any custom app launchers... but then I also have a high interest in GNOME usability so I tend to do things the "GNOME way" over 'the old way I used to do it'
[04:59] <beezly> I'm lazy and do it the old way half the time ;)
[04:59] <tvon|x31> Anna: For most uses, there is an application that fits in with GNOME and will install itself into the applications menu.
[05:00] <Anna> Well I used to be a GUI whore until I decided to drop windows recently for varied reasons, so I'm coming from the other end
[05:00] <Anna> But it's all very exciting
[05:00] <tvon|x31> You should be okay then.  Its mostly a matter of figuring out what app you should use to accomplish a specific task
[05:01] <Nonphasis> Old way is sometimes the only way because the Gnome way requires you to search for all kinds of obscure stuff from cvs logs and whatnot
[05:01] <queuetue> Hi.  I've inherited a remote debian server, and ... caught between the blind idealism, love for the ancient, and all-around disagreement about what makes a distro 'good', I basically need an alternative.  Something tested and modern, that I can upgrade to completely remotely, that I can use to host a postfix+mysql+courier system...
[05:01] <Anna> I'll just have to learn..., I refuse to be defeated -permanently-
[05:01] <queuetue> Is ubuntu valid for that?
[05:01] <Nonphasis> Case in point - enabling an xmodmap via keybard layout selector
[05:02] <gluon> has anyone else besides me having trouble with Totem? When I launch Totem, an error dialog pops up with text: "Resource busy or not available."
[05:03] <Nonphasis> apparently there mere some files in /ush/share/gkb, but they weren't documented anywhere
[05:03] <Anna> Not to hurt the present Ubuntu developer's feelings, but what Distro is best for bleeding noobs?
[05:03] <Nonphasis> Anna, Ubuntu :)
[05:03] <Anna> lol
[05:03] <_Hiro_> totem has always problems
[05:03] <Anna> Your teasing me after having seen my ordeal
[05:03] <tvon|x31> Anna: Ubuntu is pretty good.  I used to reccomend Mandrake or Fedora.
[05:04] <Nonphasis> Apart from Ubuntu, I would have recommended Fedora
[05:04] <tvon|x31> for being a gnome freak as I am, I'd go with Fedora over Mandrake
[05:04] <gluon> _Hiro_, not always. I had zero problems with Totem when using gentoo.
[05:04] <Nonphasis> Anna, ubuntu will get easier once it gets a proper kde
[05:04] <_Hiro_> I come from gentoo
[05:04] <_Hiro_> totem never worked decently :/
[05:04] <jdub> Nonphasis: pfft.
[05:04] <_Hiro_> same for rhythmbox
[05:05] <_Hiro_> and I have redhat and fedora boxes here as well
[05:05] <tvon|x31> Nonphasis: bite your toungue
[05:05] <tvon|x31> heh
[05:05] <_Hiro_> it's just not 'stable' in its working :|
[05:05] <_Hiro_> vlc that works always :)
[05:05] <srbaker> _Hiro_, totem works perfectly here.
[05:05] <Nonphasis> Gnome just proves harder for many tasks...
[05:05] <Anna> Ok, these are standard Distros then. My fist experience was with Knoppix Live CD. That was my first nose of Linux and it hooked me immediately.
[05:05] <_Hiro_> oh it works here as well now
[05:06] <Nonphasis> like, how can I add a media player to right click menu for folders?
[05:06] <_Hiro_> xine back-end, which in turn makes me wonder again why to use totem at all
[05:06] <Nonphasis> in kde I just added it, in gnome I added it but it's not visible
[05:06] <_Hiro_> and rhythmbox just decides to kill its database once in a while ;)
[05:06] <Nonphasis> does the old "scripts" mechanism still work?
[05:07] <_Hiro_> but that's sort of standard practice with the thing :)
[05:07] <Nonphasis> rhythmbox crasher on reading my audio folder
[05:07] <Nonphasis> beep media player seems to be just the ticket
[05:07] <Anna> So my lesson for today is finished. Tomorrow I want to install firestarter (which is not in the SPM), meaning I will definitely be back:-) Meanwhile I say thanks a lot and see you guys later.
[05:08] <srbaker> where's the best location for information on wireless?
[05:08] <tvon|x31> Anna: no problem
[05:08] <srbaker> on the interweb
[05:08] <tvon|x31> srbaker: what kind of informations?
[05:09] <cardador> hello. there exist mirrors of the repositories?
[05:09] <srbaker> tvon|x31, configuration info, mostly.
[05:09] <queuetue> No reactions to ubuntu's value as a mail server?
[05:09] <tvon|x31> cardador: yes, they are listed in the wiki
[05:09] <tvon|x31> ...somewhere...
[05:09] <tvon|x31> queuetue: Ubuntu is more desktop oriented
[05:09] <cardador> ok ill try to find them
[05:09] <srbaker> i have a prism2 card.  hoping ubuntu will just pick it up
[05:09] <tvon|x31> cardador: http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/Archive
[05:10] <queuetue> tvon|x31: Is there a modern flavor of debian intended for server use?
[05:10] <Nonphasis> hah, the faq has an entry for "one click mouse"
[05:10] <Nonphasis> ( = one button)
[05:10] <cardador> tvon|x31: tks
[05:10] <housetier> queuetue, well it seems sarge will be released Very Soon Now (tm) :)
[05:11] <Nonphasis> queuetue, soon there will be, called "sarge"
[05:11] <tvon|x31> queuetue: you could try UserLinux, but at this point its basically a set of debian packages and not really customized beyond that
[05:11] <tseng> jdub: submitted :)
[05:11] <jdub> tseng: rocking :)
[05:11] <tseng> hmm my tinyurl broke
[05:11] <queuetue> Isn't sarge pretty old, itself?  I'm new to debian and #debian is not a good place to ask questions. :)
[05:11] <jdub> HOORAY FOR TSENG!
[05:11] <Nonphasis> queuetue, sarge is very recent
[05:12] <tvon|x31> queuetue: sarge is fairly current
[05:12] <tseng> er, no it didnt :)
[05:12] <Nonphasis> queuetue, for a server, sarge is a good choice
[05:13] <Nonphasis> queuetue, for a "non-enterprise" server that is... I think there is no support and whatyouhave
[05:13] <housetier> queuetue, woody is old :) sarge is NEW and SHINY :D
[05:13] <tvon|x31> its pretty shiny, yes
[05:13] <rapha> Hi all!
[05:14] <rapha> I checked my Ubuntu installation, and there's no libxine1 there, so I wanted to ask again where the version for Ubuntu can be downloaded?
[05:15] <ninj1> how come I can't build GNOME stuff? what package do I need to install to get the gtk/glib pkgconfig files?
[05:15] <mxpxpod> ninj1: libgtk-2.0-dev
[05:15] <tvon|x31> rapha: do you have universe and restricted in your sources.list?
[05:15] <mxpxpod> whoops
[05:15] <mxpxpod> ninj1: libgtk2.0-dev
[05:15] <rapha> tvon|x31: My computer doesn't have internet access...
[05:16] <tseng> ninj1: youll likely need alot of -dev libs, and build-essential
[05:16] <rapha> So I need to get everything manually from here and burn it to a CD.
[05:16] <tseng> ninj1: keep adding them until configure passes
[05:16] <tvon|x31> rapha: ah
[05:16] <rapha> :-/
[05:16] <tvon|x31> ninj1: what are you trying to build?
[05:16] <rapha> So do Universe and Restricted have ftp/http servers as well?
[05:17] <tvon|x31> ninj1: you can run "apt-get build-dep <package>" to pull down everything you need to build <package>
[05:17] <Kamion> rapha: same as the regular one
[05:17] <ninj1> mxpxpod: i tried that the other day, but I don't think I've got my /etc/apt/source.list quite right, as it was failing dependencies
[05:17] <Nonphasis> rapha, debian-based distros are not optimal for offline use until they are released
[05:17] <rapha> Kamion: Which I can't seem to find on the website...
[05:17] <ninj1> tvon|x31: that's not a bad idea - I'll try that if this fails
[05:17] <rapha> Nonphasis: Well, I just need libxine1 and maybe Anjuta and I'll be happy.
[05:17] <tvon|x31> apt-get build-dep is golden
[05:18] <rapha> Nonphasis: And believe me, I'd rather have internet access ;)
[05:18] <mxpxpod> to build mono-mcs, would I just apt-get build-dep mono-mcs and then apt-get source -b mono-mcs?
[05:18] <mxpxpod> or can I use pbuilder?
[05:18] <Kamion> rapha: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/download/, http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Archive
[05:18] <dalderman> so Rythmbox works now too :-)
[05:18] <rapha> Thanks Kamion
[05:18] <dalderman> gstreamer-properties did the magic
[05:19] <housetier> congrats dalderman :)
[05:19] <ninj1> can anyone  point me to a stock Ubuntu /etc/apt/sources.list I can refer to?
[05:19] <dalderman> housetier, ta
[05:19] <dalderman> housetier, ross of soundjuicer fame pointed it out to me
[05:19] <dalderman> housetier, now to find out why my xemacs menu has got such a huge font
[05:20] <housetier> dalderman, what did you do with gstreamer-properties, which properties did you set to what value?
[05:20] <housetier> the info might be useful for others too
[05:20] <dalderman> housetier, Default Sink Output to ESD and Input to ESD
[05:21] <housetier> ah good to know :)
[05:21] <dalderman> ninj1, Firefox?
[05:21] <housetier> dalderman, however I cannot help you with (x)emacs
[05:21] <dalderman> housetier, that's ok, it's a grdb/xrdb type problem
[05:21] <ninj1> dalderman: it's nice, but it still just doesn't quite feel right
[05:21] <dalderman> I think it's xemacs being borked
[05:22] <dalderman> ninj1, here is my sources.list if it helps
[05:22] <dalderman> #deb cdrom:[Ubuntu 4.10 _Warty Warthog_ - Unofficial i386 Binary-1 (20040915)] / unstable main restricted
[05:22] <dalderman> ## Uncomment the following two lines to fetch updated software from the network
[05:22] <dalderman> #deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ warty main restricted
[05:22] <dalderman> #deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ warty main restricted
[05:22] <dalderman> ## Uncomment the following two lines to fetch updated software from the network
[05:22] <dalderman> ## and be able to use more than 12000 unsupported packages from the universe archive.
[05:22] <dalderman> deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ warty main restricted universe
[05:22] <dalderman> deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ warty main restricted universe
[05:22] <dalderman> deb http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ warty-security main restricted
[05:22] <dalderman> deb-src http://security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ warty-security main restricted
[05:22] <dalderman> #deb http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian sarge main contrib non-free
[05:22] <dalderman> deb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/ unstable main
[05:22] <rapha> pool/main is the stuff I'll also find on the CD, right?
[05:23] <ninj1> dalderman: thanks (although I didn't need all the commented lines!)
[05:23] <dalderman> ninj1, sorry, was a grab and click
[05:24] <_Hiro_> openoffice places some kind of line at the bottom of a document, anyone know how to get rid of it?
[05:25] <dalderman> _Hiro_, seen it B4 but can't remember what I did, soz
[05:26] <_Hiro_> it started when I typed ----------------------    :/
[05:27] <Lowe> _Hiro_ you have to buy openoffice some coke
[05:27] <rapha> Kamion: The German mirror, should it be complete?
[05:27] <sabdfl> rapha: yes, if it isn't please holler
[05:28] <Kamion> rapha: looks ok at a superficial glance
[05:28] <rapha> sabdfl: I'm just still looking for libxine1, and at least it's not in universe/libx.
[05:28] <Qerub> rapha: you ought to be looking for the source package name
[05:28] <rapha> sabdfl: And also not in main/libx
[05:28] <ninj1> mxpxpod: problem is 'apt-get install xlibs-dev' returns a whole load of 'Depends:  libxyz-dev' but  it is not going  to be  installed'
[05:29] <ninj1> none of xlibs-dev's dependencies can  be fulfilled :(
[05:29] <Se7h> whats the command to shutdown a pid ?
[05:30] <rapha> sabdfl: Kamion: Qerub: Okay, found it. Thanks! :)
[05:30] <fabbione> ninj1: ??
[05:30] <fabbione> ninj1: which version of X? are you updating from the network?
[05:30] <mxpxpod> ninj1: talk to tseng
[05:30] <Lowe> ooh we just got a new carpet, damn it's so thick.
[05:31] <tseng> ninj1: do you have universal?
[05:31] <tseng> er, universe
[05:31] <ninj1> ii  xserver-xfree8 4.3.0.dfsg.1-6 the XFree86 X server
[05:32] <ninj1> tseng: yep
[05:33] <tseng> ninj1: well then im not sure what your problem is
[05:33] <tseng> apt-get update again
[05:33] <fabbione> i guess you will need to dist-upgrade first
[05:34] <tseng> dist-upgrade? is he doing something weird?
[05:34] <tseng> like changing dists halfway
[05:34] <ninj1> tseng: i've done apt-get clean, apt-get update and apt-get dist-upgrade - still no joy
[05:34] <tseng> worksforme.
[05:35] <ninj1> tbh, i had to bootstrap the machine with a debian sarge CD, then upgrade the core stuff and install apps etc from a Ubuntu CD to get this far :)
[05:36] <ninj1> Ubuntu installer doesn't work on my lappy :(
[05:36] <elim> whats wrong?
[05:37] <ninj1> elim: with what?
[05:37] <elim> he said it didnt work
[05:37] <ninj1> who said what didn't work?
[05:37] <elim> i asked what was stoping it
[05:38] <rapha> Curious.
[05:38] <rapha> Why does get -R main/lib*/*/*dev*i386.deb universe/lib*/*/*dev*i386.de also get "liba/libao/libao-dev_0.8.5-1_amd64.deb" and powerpc files?
[05:38] <ninj1> elim: the Ubuntu installer? I don't know - it was hanging at random points after booting
[05:39] <rapha> Has Ubuntu gcc and co. installed by default?
[05:39] <sladen> ninj1: are you able to md5sum check the CD you're booting off?
[05:39] <elim> hmm thats strange. maybe a kernel problem or a program causing problems
[05:39] <ninj1> sladen: yep - the CD was pucker - and I cut a second copy (also checked it)
[05:40] <ninj1> yep - I suspect the kernel, as it still wont boot from the standard Ubuntu kernel, so I had to build one from (kernel.org) source
[05:41] <sladen> I think there's a real case for having d-i check the parts of the CD itself.  There's an unbelievable number of dud burns happening;  and the installer is coping with most of them (eg, just coming up with lots of missing packages then requesting to fetch ~50MB over the net to make up
[05:42] <rapha> Another stupid question, how do you install a .deb manually?
[05:42] <Kamion> sladen: um, d-i does
[05:42] <nk> anyone knows where ubuntu stores the .deb files?  i have to modify the code a bit and after that I wanna install the package. is there a way? the more I added some sarge-mirrors, might that affect my installation in some bad way?
[05:42] <Kamion> sladen: the issue is probably not dud burns there, it's that the archive has newer versions of packages than the CD
[05:43] <dalderman> nk, /var/cache/apt/archives/
[05:43] <Kamion> we could default cdrom-checker/start to true, but it's probably pretty slow ...
[05:43] <sladen> rapha: dpkg -i foo.deb
[05:44] <rapha> Thabks sladen
[05:44] <Kamion> shame that we can't do the integrity check only on burnt CDs, not pressed ones
[05:44] <sladen> Kamion: both probably contribute to the problem
[05:45] <elim> i cant compile fluxbox on my mac :(
[05:45] <rapha> I'm asking because I'm on RedHat right now; does Ubuntu have gcc and the other development tools installed by default?
[05:45] <sladen> Kamion: yes we can.  Just munge Canonical's offical ISO's with an extra flag
[05:46] <jdub> rapha: no, but they're on the CD
[05:46] <sivang> rapha : even if not, you could just as easily install them using apt-get
[05:46] <elim> yes it does i just cant install fluxbox by compilation :(
[05:46] <Kamion> sladen: disapprove heavily of that kind of thing
[05:46] <Kamion> sladen: also, we'll be publishing the official ISOs; what's to stop people burning them, or indeed from copying pressed CDs?
[05:46] <sladen> Kamion: ``I see you're using a self-burnt CD.  Would you like me to checksum it first?''
[05:47] <ninj1> aha - debian sarge has a higher package release number for it's zlib1g package, so Ubuntu's version wasn't deemed newer, so was holding up the install of all the other dependencies
[05:47] <sladen> Kamion: can bit-twiddle sometime off the end of the CD
[05:47] <ninj1> it's  happily installing libgtk-2.0-dev (and deps) as we speak
[05:47] <Kamion> sladen: I disapprove of doing something I can't even test myself!
[05:47] <sladen> Kamion: can bit-twiddle something off the end of the CD;  is somebody copies it, it'll disappear
[05:48] <rapha> sivang: Well, no. I've no internet access at home.
[05:48] <Kamion> sladen: I will not do that, sorry
[05:48] <rapha> Thanks jdub!
[05:48] <rapha> jdub: Btw, nice seeing you here doing this Ubuntu stuff!
[05:48] <Kamion> if somebody else wants to, they'll need to have CD-pressing equipment to test it with
[05:48] <sivang> rapha : lemme check this for you a sec
[05:48] <sladen> Kamion: if I wrote the code, would you consider using it?  :-)
[05:48] <zombics> what i need to apt-get install to get the kernel source(2.6.8)?
[05:48] <rapha> I think it's a great idea and also greatly executed so far.
[05:48] <Kamion> sladen: probably not, I really dislike that sort of hack
[05:48] <rapha> (Plus, many others seem to think that as well)
[05:48] <Kamion> sladen: it's one step away from copy protection
[05:49] <Kamion> zombics: linux-source-<IP_ADDRESS>
[05:49] <sladen> Kamion: s/copy/"verification"/  ;-)
[05:49] <Kamion> sladen: not worth the cost
[05:49] <zombics> Kamion, THX !
[05:49] <Kamion> sladen: if we could test in software whether the CD had been burnt, that would be marginally less gross; AFAIK you can't
[05:50] <Kamion> sladen: and I mean something that doesn't depend on properties of the ISO
[05:50] <ggi> Does anyone use gvim here? (the vim-gnome package in universal)
[05:50] <ggi> s/universal/universe
[05:50] <srbaker> can i install ubuntu over wifi?
[05:51] <jdub> rapha: :-)
[05:51] <jdub> rapha: hope you enjoy it
[05:51] <jdub> hey, has everyone seen gnome-look.org today?
[05:51] <tvon|fixingcrap> srbaker: sure
[05:51] <tvon|fixingcrap> srbaker: well...nm, ignore me
[05:51] <jdub> ubuntu goodies on the front page :)
[05:51] <tvon|fixingcrap> jdub: ah, spiffy
[05:51] <rapha> jdub: Installed it yesterday, but already am. But tell us the truth, you only want Mark to get you a trip into space, right?
[05:52] <Kamion> srbaker: works for me ...
[05:52] <sivang> jdub : on wiki?
[05:52] <jdub> rapha: you do know we're all here on ISS, don't you?
[05:52] <tvon|fixingcrap> jdub: haha
[05:53] <jdub> Kamion: stop doing floaters!
[05:53] <sladen> Kamion: it maybe possible to do something non-hackish, if they burnt to a CD-RW
[05:54] <tvon|fixingcrap> jdub: hey, whats up with the default theme not being indubstrial?
[05:54] <rapha> jdub: Oh. But naaah, I'm gonna make my own distro and it's gonna be based on Mars!
[05:55] <loz> hey.  The FAQ, hints etc. on the site seem a little sparton, how can I help this?
[05:55] <y_sutedja> hello people
[05:55] <schweeb> loz: could put stuff on the wiki
[05:56] <loz> how does one get wiki access?  Sign up somewhere?
[05:56] <rapha> You know what'd be cool for Ubuntu? There's this "Start Linux from Windows" kind of thing, right? So one could make a little Win32 autostart program that opens when you pop in the Ubuntu CD under Windows, and lets you install it right from there.
[05:56] <jdub> tvon|X31: it is indubstrial :)
[05:56] <jdub> tvon|X31: (based on)
[05:56] <tvon|X31> jdub: oh? ahhh
[05:56] <mojo> hi
[05:56] <Kamion> rapha: stay tuned ;)
[05:56] <mojo> goodmorning every1
[05:57] <y_sutedja> mornin mojo
[05:57] <mojo> can someone show me how to add more languages in GNOME? I default choose Eng, now I want to test the Jap lang
[05:58] <rapha> Kamion: Aaah! :)
[05:58] <sivang> rapha : apparently it's not on the installer cd
[05:58] <ninj1> mojo: see locale-gen
[05:58] <sivang> rapha : actually, i think it's one of the design goals there were foreset in warty as a user oriented system first ;)
[05:59] <rapha> Well, you guys are obviously not smarter (hahah!) but definately faster than me...
[05:59] <mojo> thx
[05:59] <sivang> rapha : design goals = policy decision
[06:00] <Kamion> loz: just create an account, AFAIK
[06:00] <sivang> rapha : http://wiki.ubuntu.com/WartyWarthog_2fSupportedSeed
[06:01] <srbaker> oh, suck
[06:01] <srbaker> apparently this card only has 104-bit encryption
[06:02] <y_sutedja> 104-bit read error..?
[06:02] <y_sutedja> srbaker: what kinda card?
[06:02] <srbaker> D-Link DWL-650
[06:04] <Lowe> I just got another gmail<EMAIL_ADDRESS>so when ubuntu becomes famous i can sell it MWAHAHA *cough*
[06:04] <mojo> ninjl: I can't find any local-gen in Synaptic
[06:04] <rapha> sivang: Aaah! Thanks! Well, no worries then :)
[06:04] <mojo> ninjl: locale-gen I mean
[06:05] <stub> So can anyone tell me where I can stick my WEP key so that the Gnome network-admin tool won't nuke it? I've currently got it in /etc/network/interfaces, but that file is rewritten by that tool.
[06:05] <ninj1> mojo:  package is locales
[06:05] <mojo> ninjl: k
[06:06] <mojo> ninjl: yes I got that installed already but there is no option for lang in GDM
[06:06] <eazel7> hi ubuntu people
[06:06] <eazel7> how are you?
[06:06] <rapha> Why are you named after a dead company, eazel7?
[06:07] <eazel7> rapha, it's not because of the company
[06:07] <eazel7> it's something related with my name and the Neon Genesis Evangelion anime serie
[06:08] <mojo> ninjl: u have any idea
[06:08] <ninj1> mojo: you should configure /etc/locale.gen to list the languages you want
[06:08] <Sander__> Is KDE in universe?
[06:08] <jdub> Sander__: most of it
[06:08] <ninj1> on my system I have 'en_GB.UTF8'  on one line and 'th_TH.UTF8' on  another
[06:08] <rapha> eazel7: Ah, I see. Well, I'm more into Vietnamese than Japanese, so no Anime for me :)
[06:09] <ninj1> I run 'locale-gen'  and  it does stuff  to make stuff work :)
[06:09] <rapha> ninj1: Good stuff, that.
[06:09] <Sander__> thanks jdub is it usable, or will there be some sort of announcement?
[06:09] <eazel7> how can I add the a ubuntu mirror to sources.list?
[06:10] <eazel7> rapha, ok, how is life there?
[06:10] <tvon|X31> eazel7: check the mirrors list on the wiki
[06:10] <rapha> eazel7: If I right remember, Synaptic provides a means for that
[06:10] <tvon|X31> hrm...actually I dont think it provides the sources.list lines
[06:10] <tvon|X31> it probably should
[06:10] <mojo> ninjl: thx
[06:10] <rapha> eazel7: Well, good I hope :) - I'm in Germany, but I'll go there next year.
[06:10] <tvon|X31> Is there a mirrorselect setup for ubuntu?
[06:10] <zombics> what i need to apt-get install to update my kernel?
[06:10] <rapha> And in Germany it'a as dull as ever.
[06:10] <eazel7> rapha, ok
[06:10] <tvon|X31> linux-image
[06:11] <tvon|X31> zombics: ^^
[06:11] <mojo> ninjl: ah...I just want to add in Jap, Viet, Korean, so what do I have to edit locale.gen to?
[06:12] <tvon|X31> "dpkg-reconfigure locale" maybe?
[06:12] <mojo> what reconfig for?
[06:12] <jdub> Sander__: it's usable
[06:12] <jdub> Sander__: there won't necessarily be an announcement, because we do not support KDE
[06:12] <mojo> thx
[06:12] <mojo> thx tvon
[06:13] <rapha> Okay, that should be everything I need :-)
[06:14] <Sander__> jdub, bummer. So are these just rebuilt packages from sid, and if they work great, if not don't call us?
[06:14] <zombics> hmmm i got the new kernel + kernel source and i just cant install the NVIDIA drivers.(the error is that i dont have the kernel sources)
[06:14] <tvon|X31> zombics: get the headers too
[06:15] <tvon|X31> zombics: linux-headers
[06:16] <jdub> Sander__: at the moment, yes.
[06:16] <zombics> tvon|X31, thx ! ! !:)
[06:16] <thom> zombics: use linux-restricted-modules
[06:16] <jdub> Sander__: though you can help fix stuff :)
[06:17] <thom> zombics: (apt-get install nvidia-glx)
[06:17] <zombics> thom, cant. i have A64
[06:18] <eazel7> how can I add the ubuntu apt-source
[06:19] <whiprush> anyone using gmane newsgroups with evo2? It used to be a problem and it's reared its head again.
[06:23] <tvon|X31> eazel7: deb     http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu warty main restricted universe
[06:23] <tvon|X31> is the whole shebang
[06:23] <tvon|X31> ideally you would remove restricted and universe
[06:25] <eazel7> gracias, thanks
[06:27] <tvon|X31> de nada
[06:28] <eazel7> tvon, where are you from?
[06:28] <tvon|X31> eazel7: Baltimore MD (US)
[06:28] <eazel7> tvon, ok, I'm from Buenos Aires, Argentina
[06:28] <tvon|X31> ah
[06:28] <Sander__> OK jdub, INAD (in /. parlance) but I'll help where I can. I'm on Sarge now, but I'm monitoring the progress.
[06:29] <tvon|X31> I took 3 years of spanish and all I know is 'de nada' and a few obscinities that I can't spell :)
[06:30] <eazel7> hahahaha
[06:30] <mxpxpod> tseng: you have a ubuntu mono repo, right?
[06:30] <eazel7> I did, kinda 19 years of spanish and still I haven't learn the leanguage
[06:30] <tvon|X31> hah
[06:37] <eazel7> well, I'm now updating from sarge to ubunto
[06:37] <eazel7> hope this to work fine
[06:38] <eazel7> (when I read about ubuntu I said: this is what I'm looking for)
[06:39] <whiprush> eazel7: yeah, it's pretty cool
[06:41] <eazel7> I'm trying to build my own distribution, based in debian and gnome 2.8, but with my patches selection
[06:41] <eazel7> for now, I don't need to do this while there be ubuntu
[06:41] <eazel7> but, I'm wondering, does it has a stripe in the applications menu?
[06:48] <loz> where can I get more packages than are listed in synaptic?
[06:49] <zombics> no fdisk on ubuntu? :O
[06:49] <eazel7> zombics, perhaps cfdisk (I don't use ubuntu, but I guess) or fdisk isn't in your PATH variable
[06:50] <schweeb> yes, cfdisk is included
[06:50] <loz> eazel7: what are you doing in #ubuntu then?
[06:50] <eazel7> loz, asking about the apt repository because I hope to be using ubuntu when the download ends
[06:51] <loz> I see..
[06:51] <zombics> sudo: cfdisk: command not found
[06:52] <eazel7> will ubuntu use x.org?
[06:52] <loz> it doesn't yet
[06:52] <phlaegel> next release
[06:52] <zombics> how can i partition my disk?
[06:53] <loz> zombics: open a root shell, there is cfdisk on my ubuntu
[06:53] <zombics> how can open a root shell?
[06:53] <loz> are you in gnome?
[06:54] <zombics> yea
[06:54] <loz> apps->system->root term
[06:54] <loz> then your password (not root)
[06:54] <zombics> no :/
[06:54] <zombics> i dont have it
[06:55] <Treenaks> How does the zeroconf stuff work?
[06:55] <schweeb> open a terminal, sudo -s
[06:55] <loz> how come?
[06:55] <loz> look in synaptic then..  are you running ubuntu now?
[06:55] <zombics> cfdisk
[06:55] <zombics> bash: cfdisk: command not found
[06:55] <zombics> yea
[06:55] <loz> what version?
[06:55] <zombics> the last vertion....
[06:56] <zombics> the A64 version
[06:56] <loz> ah.. I'm on i686, so perhaps they differ.
[06:56] <zombics> bhaaa
[06:59] <mxpxpod> tseng: ping
[06:59] <rapha> Bye!
[07:08] <mxpxpod> has anyone here used pbuilder with ubuntu?
[07:10] <mxpxpod> lamont: oh?
[07:10] <mxpxpod> lamont: how well did it work?
[07:10] <lamont> yeah - I run the warty buildd's...
[07:10] <lamont> works well, thanks..
[07:10] <mxpxpod> lamont: I'd like to build mono packages for ppc
[07:11] <lamont> people.no-name-yet.com/~lamont/warty.buildd is the debootstrap script
[07:12] <lamont> mxpxpod: toss that in /usr/lib/debootstrap/scripts/ and you can debootstrap a warty buildd chroot
[07:12] <lamont> which I expect you could tar up and use with pbuilder.
[07:12] <mxpxpod> lamont: oh really...
[07:12] <lamont> it's kinda pretty close to sid/sarge/whatever
[07:12] <lamont> I forget what I had to change.
[07:13] <mxpxpod> jdub: ping
[07:14] <jdub> pong
[07:14] <mxpxpod> jdub: how did you build those gnome-bluetooth packages?
[07:15] <joem> hrm, why isn't there a menu for development apps (anjuta, devhelp etc..)?
[07:16] <mxpxpod> joem: ? it's under programming
[07:16] <jdub> mxpxpod: dpkg-buildpackage...
[07:16] <joem> yea, but the programming menu isn't there
[07:16] <mxpxpod> jdub: nothing more, nothing less?
[07:17] <lamont> mxpxpod: so where does mono-mcs come from?  If we could get that into universe, then the rest of mono should just try to build...
[07:17] <jdub> nup
[07:17] <mxpxpod> lamont: from mcs
[07:17] <mxpxpod> lamont: the other thing is that it's only at 0.96 in universe
[07:18] <lamont> universe/devel/mcs_0.96-1: Dep-Wait by buildd+terranova [optional:uncompiled]
[07:18] <lamont>   Dependencies: mono-mcs
[07:18] <lamont> grumble.
[07:18] <mxpxpod> lamont: do you have a buildd webpage somewhere?
[07:18] <lamont> is 0.96 worth me trying to bootstrap it in for warty?
[07:18] <mxpxpod> lamont: you should try getting 1.0.1 in :)
[07:19] <lamont> mxpxpod: convince jdub/mdc to take it, and I'll bootstrap it wherever I can.
[07:19] <mxpxpod> jdub: ^  :D
[07:19] <jdub> tseng's packages are the ones you want
[07:19] <mxpxpod> jdub: does he have source packages?
[07:19] <jdub> dunno
[07:19] <jdub> check
[07:19] <mxpxpod> where's his repo?
[07:20] <jdub> listed on -devel and in the wiki
[07:20] <lamont> jdub: if source shows up in the warty archive, and someone pokes me, I'll make it happen.
[07:20] <tvon|X31> Anyone using tomboy?
[07:20] <tvon|X31> tomboy is sweetness
[07:20] <mxpxpod> jdub: huh?
[07:21] <tvon|X31> like walter payton
[07:21] <jdub> mxpxpod: it was posted to -devel, and it is noted on the wiki in Universe(somethingorother)
[07:22] <mxpxpod> jdub: ok, thanks
[07:22] <joem> mxpxpod,  http://getsweaaa.com/~tseng/ubuntu/debs
[07:23] <mxpxpod> dammit, no source
[07:25] <Se7h> i don't know hurd-i386
[07:25] <Se7h> is it compatible with i386 ?
[07:28] <mxpxpod> jdub: thanks for the help :)
[07:29] <[SemTeX] > hi, does somebody has a pan (newsreader) .deb for ubuntu please?
[07:30] <ish> was there a bunch of updates in the last few hours?
[07:31] <Kamion> lamont: that warty.buildd script seems to be missing amd64 ...
[07:31] <Kamion> lamont: perhaps warty.buildd should go in the debootstrap package?
[07:32] <waslap> this might be a stupid question, but will i need to upgrade ubuntu everytime a new release is released, or will I have the benefit of simply just upgrading packages (gentoo user here)
[07:32] <tvon|X31> Hey, how can I get rid of the timeout for sudo?
[07:32] <tvon|X31> (so it remembers my pass)
[07:32] <Kamion> waslap: you'll be able to upgrade in-place without reinstalling
[07:32] <waslap> great, thanx
[07:32] <tvon|X31> I poked around the config and did not see anything that caught my eye
[07:33] <crimsun> ish: yes
[07:33] <tvon|X31> ah, nevermind, I'm a twit
[07:33] <crimsun> ish: lots of updates to GNOME- and XFree86-related packages
[07:34] <lamont> Kamion: yeah, it should...
[07:34] <lamont> Kamion: you want to file the bug, and I'll deal with amd64 and get the upload ready
[07:36] <lamont> gonna have to pester joshk when he gets home from school
[07:36] <peteog> Im sure sound shouldnt be so confusing... I was using ALSA with Beep and Totem-Xine, but was having issues in that when say beep was playing I didnt get sounds from Gaim, it seemed to be queing them as when I closed beep they would play. I have a kind of work around in that I enabled ESD, set sounds in Gaim to use ESD and beep to use ESD - this works, I can now hear Gaim sounds when mp3's are playing. but now I have no sound
[07:36] <peteog> in Totem-Xine. Also using ESD doesnt seem to be the correct way of doing this. Any ideas?
[07:37] <crimsun> [SemTeX] : it's in universe
[07:37] <crimsun> [SemTeX] : Candidate: <IP_ADDRESS>-1 500 http://archive.ubuntu.com warty/universe Packages
[07:37] <[SemTeX] > crimsun: thx
[07:37] <siretart> hi
[07:37] <crimsun> [SemTeX] : apt-cache policy pan
[07:37] <[SemTeX] > but strange enough, i couldn't apt-get those sources for universe?
[07:38] <siretart> i just created an account for the wiki, and now I get a lot of python errors after my search results after a title search. Is this known?
[07:38] <crimsun> that's because the sources return an error; i'm not sure if it's a faq on the wiki
[07:38] <crimsun> gzip: stdin: not in gzip format   Err http://archive.ubuntu.com warty/main Sources   Sub-process gzip returned an error code (1)
[07:39] <[SemTeX] > it was something like that yes
[07:39] <[SemTeX] > seems to be fixed now
[07:39] <lamont> that sources file (and the packages files) get re-created every 30 minuts (if there are changes)...
[07:39] <lamont> that makes it more likely to hit the time when they're being written...
[07:39] <crimsun> right.
[07:40] <[SemTeX] > ok, thx
[07:40] <mxpxpod> can someone check if they have /usr/lib/epiphany-1.4/extensions/libtabgroupsextension.so installed after installing epiphany-extensions?
[07:40] <siretart> ah, it only occurs with preffered style "warthogs"
[07:43] <ish> Out of habit I do 'apt-get uprade'..  Should I do 'dist-upgrade'?
[07:44] <Kamion> dist-upgrade allows the installation of new packages and the removal of old packages to satisfy dependencies
[07:44] <Kamion> when doing dist-upgrade, you should watch what apt-get is doing in case it goes insane
[07:44] <Kamion> but if you get packages "held back" during apt-get upgrade, you know why :)
[07:46] <ish> so I'm safe to do 'upgrade' until I see packages held back?
[07:46] <Kamion> right
[07:46] <ish> hmm..  maybe my lack of 'dist-upgrades' is why my previous stint at debian-unstable turned rotten.
[07:47] <lamont> hrm... that does reproduce.
[07:48] <Wsquared> Kamion: Sorry to jump into the middle of a conversation...  I've been using Synaptic almost exclusively.  Is the equivalent of dist-upgrade in synaptic?
[07:49] <Kamion> Wsquared: uh, not sure, I should probably start using synaptic seriously at some point :)
[07:49] <Wsquared> Kamion: Nevermind, I just read the message that appears in "Smart Update"
[07:50] <Wsquared> "Smart Update" is dist-upgrade.
[07:51] <Wsquared> ...and that's what I've been doing.  I haven't seen anything go insane yet. :)
[07:52] <pisuke> wow, that xwindow bug hit me hard
[07:52] <pisuke> radeon here
[07:52] <pisuke> now everything is ok
[07:52] <Tomcat_> How can I set my keyboard layout in X?
[07:52] <Tomcat_> dpkg-reconfigure console-common?
[07:53] <schweeb> dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86
[07:53] <Tomcat_> No, not in X...
[07:53] <Tomcat_> Wait... I'll ask again. :)
[07:54] <Tomcat_> Oh alright.. that's a problem in aterm... xterm can use the Umlauts.
[07:58] <dieman> hm
[07:58] <dieman> im going to have an 8way iwill qk8s box at some point in the near future
[07:59] <WW> Wow, looks like X has been updated _again_.   Done
[08:05] <Se7h> Building Dependency Tree... Done
[08:05] <Se7h> E: Couldn't find package
[08:05] <Kamion> you can't do that with apt-get ...
[08:05] <Se7h> do what ?
[08:05] <Kamion> if you have a .deb file on disk, you need to use 'sudo dpkg -i' on it, and resolve dependencies by hand
[08:05] <Kamion> apt-get install only takes package names
[08:05] <Se7h> lol
[08:05] <Se7h> forget it
[08:05] <Se7h> i must be drunk
[08:07] <mxpxpod> jdub: ping
[08:07] <jdub> pong
[08:08] <mxpxpod> jdub: how do I keep dpkg-buildpackage from signing the .dsc files?
[08:08] <mxpxpod> it keeps failing at that point
[08:08] <jdub> well, if it fails, you still have .deb files
[08:09] <jdub> but you can pass -uc -us to dpkg-buildpacakge
[08:09] <lnmnc> is there an image I can write to a usb volume to install ubuntu?
[08:09] <lnmnc> my computer can't boot off of it's firewire CD drive
[08:09] <mxpxpod> jdub: thanks :)
[08:12] <Kamion> lnmnc: not yet, on the to-do list
[08:12] <Se7h> yeaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh
[08:12] <Se7h> i got movies
[08:12] <Se7h> :D
[08:14] <lnmnc> so... I was installing ubuntu with the harddrive method, but some of the packages on the CD were corrupted.  This left my computer in an unbootable state.  There's no way to fix this with ubuntu?
[08:15] <phlaegel> fabbione: ping
[08:16] <lnmnc> Maybe a self-test function for the install CD would be a high priority?
[08:17] <Kamion> well, I only just fixed the self-tester today to work at all ...
[08:22] <lnmnc> well, I can reinstall debian from a usb stick and then go through the HD install method again...
[08:25] <phlaegel> hm. after switching to the k7 kernel, alsa seems to think it's a good idea to make my tv card the default output.
[08:32] <loz> how can I configure my card with alsa?
[08:35] <subterrific> loz: Applications->Multimedia->Volume Control
[08:36] <loz> subterrific.. no, actually get the driver to work..
[08:36] <subterrific> how do you know it isn't working?
[08:36] <loz> because there are no sound devices in /dev and volume can't run because of that.
[08:37] <subterrific> what sound card?
[08:37] <loz> i810_audio
[08:37] <loz> I don't know where to configure alsa in /etc/..  I don't know my way around ubuntu configs
[08:38] <subterrific> loz: no, i mean what card is it
[08:38] <subterrific> not the driver name
[08:39] <subterrific> is your machine a Dell?
[08:39] <loz> ntel Corp. 82801CA/CAM AC'97, yes dell laptop, C840
[08:41] <cybrjackle|work> Do  you use pinning to block installation of packages
[08:42] <loz> subterrific: essentially I want to know how I tell alsa to use the device, the install never did.
[08:42] <subterrific> loz: what does: sudo modprobe snd-intel8x0 do?
[08:43] <subterrific> loz: normally it auto detects everything and loads the drivers automatically, so this is a bug or ALSA doesn't support that card
[08:43] <loz> I had it all working under gentoo.. although not alsa.  however alsa has the driver..
[08:44] <loz> the module probes but does nothing in /dev/ for example..
[08:44] <subterrific> Dell has some issues, for example, my Dell at home has an SB Live! but it doesn't work with the standard SB Live! driver. i had to patch the ubuntu kernel with the latest ALSA and add a new driver for it
[08:45] <subterrific> loz: use paste.plone.org and show me the output from lsmod
[08:45] <subterrific> loz: you should also open a bug for this at bugzilla.ubuntu.org because everything should "Just Work"
[08:45] <Nonphasis> SB cards have several variations for the same card
[08:46] <loz> subterrific: done
[08:46] <subterrific> Nonphasis: this is a Dell specific variation, pretty sure no one else sells them. the driver source code specifically mentions Dell and the models the card ships with :\
[08:47] <Nonphasis> subterrific, yeah, it's probably some cheapo variation with emu chip...
[08:47] <subterrific> loz: everything looks in order there, are you sure you have no /dev/snd entries?
[08:48] <loz> controlC0  timer
[08:48] <loz> thn
[08:48] <loz> that's all
[08:48] <loz> no dsp etc..
[08:48] <Nonphasis> I bet there are like 10 different SB 128 PCI cards
[08:49] <subterrific> loz: open a bug for this and attach your dmesg output
[08:50] <subterrific> loz: i can also give you my patched kernel with the latest ALSA if you're interested in trying that, but i'd consider it a last resort
[08:50] <Nonphasis> subterrific, could you make via82xx sound card to default w/ dxs_support=2?
[08:51] <Nonphasis> subterrific, because, dxs support sucks more times than it doesn't
[08:52] <Nonphasis> subterrific, hissing/crappy sound quality. can't understand why dxs is enabled by default in the driver...
[08:52] <[SemTeX] > crimsun: I'm afrad that pan package makes my system crash
[08:52] <[SemTeX] > hard...
[08:52] <subterrific> Nonphasis: i haven't figured out how to pass module options in debian yet, sorry
[08:53] <Nonphasis> subterrific, can't it be put in modprobe.d?
[08:53] <subterrific> Nonphasis: but i have an on-board via82xx and dxs_support=4 works fine for me
[08:53] <Nonphasis> hmm
[08:53] <subterrific> you need to turn everything down a notch though
[08:53] <Nonphasis> it's a motherboard/bios issue
[08:53] <subterrific> you can't keep the channels in the red
[08:54] <subterrific> at least for me
[08:54] <Nonphasis> yeah i know... that,s pretty normal though
[08:54] <Nonphasis> but the dxs stuff... it took a lot of googling
[08:54] <Nonphasis> for the system that "just works", it should take the easy route
[08:55] <subterrific> Nonphasis: i found some comments about it on the alsa driver matrix page
[08:55] <Nonphasis> dxs doesn't do any good anyway
[08:57] <subterrific> Nonphasis: are you loading the module in ubuntu with dxs_support=2 right now?
[08:57] <Nonphasis> subterrific, yes
[08:58] <Nonphasis> subterrific, created a file in modprobe.d
[08:58] <subterrific> ahh
[08:58] <Nonphasis> subterrific, that's quite a bit more than "Just Works" approach should demand
[08:59] <Nonphasis> frankly' via8235 is a crappy sound chip
[08:59] <subterrific> Nonphasis: best thing to do then would be to open a bug, give me the bug number and i'll add myself to it and then i can take a look at the driver source and see what can be done
[08:59] <Nonphasis> even though mine does give optical spdif
[09:00] <Nonphasis> subterrific, sounds doable
[09:00] <Nonphasis> I'll do it when I haven't been drinking ;-)
[09:00] <subterrific> Nonphasis: i know, i only have one cause its on my motherboard
[09:00] <subterrific> i was pretty stunned at how crappy it was :\
[09:01] <Nonphasis> I thought it wouldn't matter if you feed spdif anymay
[09:01] <Nonphasis> anyway
[09:02] <Nonphasis> but these meisters invent stuff like dxs and every other driver has mysterious quality probs
[09:03] <dieman> heh, starting the i915 install now
[09:03] <dieman> be afraid
[09:03] <dieman> keyboard no work.
[09:03] <Kamion> USB keyboard?
[09:03] <clee> yay
[09:03] <dieman> yeah
[09:04] <dieman> im using the release cd
[09:04] <Kamion> dieman: any way you can get me lspci / lspci -n output?
[09:04] <dieman> i'll probally have to use a daily, eh?
[09:04] <dieman> Kamion: no
[09:04] <dieman> Kamion: usb only :|
[09:04] <dieman> i'll have to grab a knoppix cd
[09:04] <lezard> Hy all, I'm new to ubuntu and I have a stupid question. Can non-introduced users post on the ubuntu-devel mailing list or would it be preferible that just developpers post on it ?
[09:04] <Kamion> it's probably failing to load the appropriate *HCI module
[09:05] <Kamion> lezard: depends what it's about :)
[09:05] <dieman> is there a way to get d-i to talk over serial?
[09:05] <Kamion> dieman: boot with console=ttyS0 IIRC
[09:05] <lezard> Kamion: the last mail from Jeff Waugh about release dates
[09:05] <dieman> ok
[09:05] <dieman> i'll do that
[09:05] <lezard> Kamion: it seems unusual that the RC is so late compared to the final release date
[09:06] <subterrific> lezard: jeff is jdub here, talk to him in irc
[09:06] <Kamion> lezard: the 13th was going to be our release date, so it just means an extra final CD build
[09:06] <lezard> Wow, cool, what a great medi irc :)
[09:06] <lezard> Kamion: ok
[09:07] <lezard> I Don't know exactly when would be best for testing the release in fact
[09:07] <lezard> Waiting for RC or now ?
[09:07] <Nonphasis> hmm... if jeff is here, this might be a good place to inject some gnome feature request ;-)
[09:08] <Kamion> lezard: earlier the better
[09:08] <lezard> jdub: well, it's not a gnome feature request, but it seems that support for eagle-usb is missing
[09:08] <lezard> It is a driver for USB ADSL modem
[09:08] <Kamion> we have a bug about that I think
[09:09] <lezard> Ok, let me serach for it
[09:09] <lezard> *search
[09:09] <Nonphasis> USB ADSL! that way be dragons
[09:09] <lezard> Nonphasis: yep, that's awfull
[09:09] <Kamion> or maybe not, I don't see it
[09:09] <tvon|X31> where death awaits you with big sharp pointy teeth
[09:09] <Kamion> it was brought up on one of the mailing lists at least
[09:09] <Nonphasis> I'm not sure if such beasts should be even marginally supported
[09:10] <lezard> Nonphasis: I hope they will :)
[09:11] <Nonphasis> lezard, it's just that such support is completely *unnucessary*. People should really buy ethernet modems and that's the end of it
[09:11] <Nonphasis> lezard, supporting them is an unnecessary drag when almost everybody has a proper modem
[09:11] <dieman> Kamion: yay, a shell!
[09:11] <lezard> Nonphasis: well, that's a point of viex
[09:11] <lezard> *view
[09:12] <Kamion> Nonphasis: if both the hardware and the drivers exist and are reasonably free etc., we should try to support them
[09:12] <lezard> Nonphasis: I totally disagree with you, but I can respect that
[09:12] <dieman> Kamion: i can get you a /proc/bus/pci/devices
[09:12] <Kamion> dieman: that'll do
[09:12] <Nonphasis> Kamion, I guess trying shouldn't hurt anyone
[09:12] <lezard> Kamion: everything is under GPL
[09:12] <Kamion> lezard: "etc." includes "sane" of course :)
[09:12] <Nonphasis> internal adsl modems are understandable because they are cheap
[09:12] <lucas_> hi
[09:13] <lezard> Kamion: quite sane in fact
[09:13] <Nonphasis> but here, USB stuff is no cheaper than real ethernet modems
[09:13] <dieman> Kamion: ok, whats your email, or put it into bugzilla?
[09:13] <lezard> Kamion: well I'm not that objective
[09:13] <Kamion> Nonphasis: if the drivers exist and our free, it's not really our business to pass judgement on what hardware people should/shouldn't have bought
[09:13] <Kamion> dieman<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[09:14] <Kamion> dieman: bugzilla probably better though
[09:14] <dieman> Kamion: wtf!? IRQ 185?!
[09:14] <lezard> Kamion: the eagle-usb tools exist under Debian
[09:14] <dieman> the echi controller is on irq 185?!
[09:14] <Kamion> dieman: wow
[09:14] <Nonphasis> Kamion, how often is that a case? i mean free (as in oss) drivers
[09:14] <Kamion> Nonphasis: sufficiently
[09:14] <dieman> Kamion: ok
[09:14] <dieman> Kamion: i'll pop it off to that email
[09:14] <Nonphasis> well, times have changed then
[09:15] <lezard> Nonphasis: they are Sagem drivers and Sagem decided that they should be GPL, eagle-usb forked from the official to make clean ones
[09:15] <dieman> Kamion: i'll probally install it here and then just do a lspci instead
[09:15] <Nonphasis> back in the day, everyone was urged to boycott non-ethernet modems, even for windows
[09:15] <dieman> Kamion: and make one bugzilla bug for i915 support, if thats ok
[09:15] <Kamion> Nonphasis: basically I think we'd rather that people who come into this channel asking for hardware support (that's generally not unreasonable for us to support) aren't told that they should've bought better hardware ...
[09:16] <Nonphasis> Kamion, undebatably true :-)
[09:16] <Kamion> Nonphasis: hardware that isn't Linux-compatible at all because the manufacturers won't release specs may or may not be a different matter
[09:16] <lezard> Nonphasis: some people don't want to buy modem when ISP let you them for free
[09:16] <Kamion> dieman: fine
[09:16] <Nonphasis> lezard, good point as well
[09:16] <lezard> Kamion: in this case, we have all the specs
[09:17] <dieman> Kamion: yeah, because it needs an addtional line for tg3 too.
[09:17] <dieman> Kamion: hopefully this tg3 doesn't need firmware
[09:17] <Nonphasis> *but*, people that are shopping for hardware should be directed towards ethernet modems
[09:18] <dieman> BCM95751...
[09:18] <dieman> 100mhz/32bit.
[09:18] <dieman> nice
[09:18] <elmo> dieman: the firmware stuff for tg3's is automatic
[09:19] <Nonphasis> is bcm95751 a tg3?
[09:19] <elmo> sounds like it
[09:19] <Nonphasis> tg3 used to suck as far as drivers go, 3 years ago when configging them was involveh with my job
[09:20] <elmo> tg3 doesn't suck any more, davem rewrote it from scratch
[09:20] <Nonphasis> great
[09:20] <Capri> hey, I try to burn CDs with cdrecord. How do this scanbus thingy work? I've used cdrecord -scanbus dev=ATAPI: but there is no list
[09:20] <Nonphasis> tg3 is everywhere now (compaq proliants)
[09:20] <dieman> elmo: ahh, ok
[09:21] <dieman> also needs disk support loaded...
[09:21] <dieman> this is going to be a fun(!) install.
[09:21] <elmo> capri: might be easier to use nautilus - if you have an ISO, just right click and select 'Write to CD'
[09:22] <Nonphasis> ubuntu istall is so easy, i was almost disappointed ;-)
[09:22] <michel_v_> it's the post-install thing that's headache inducing :)
[09:22] <slackeerb> Nonphasis: its great isnt it. =)
[09:22] <michel_v_> with my wifi hardware, I mean ;)
[09:22] <michel_v_> else, it's great
[09:22] <slackeerb> does anyone know how to burn a .dmg cd image?
[09:23] <Nonphasis> yes, post-install... that's always the real problem
[09:23] <Capri> elmo, nautilus didn't work. I choosed the data and wanted to burn it. After making image it didn't go on to burning.
[09:23] <Nonphasis> 1) get sound and video going
[09:23] <Nonphasis> 2) get nvidia bin drivers going
[09:24] <Capri> elmo, must I do anything compareable to this ide-scsi stuff from 2.4 kernels in 2.6?
[09:24] <slackeerb> Nonphasis: http://serios.net/content/debian/nvidia-display-drivers.php
[09:24] <Nonphasis> ubuntu should really have "apt-get install mplayer-compile"
[09:24] <Nonphasis> slackeerb, my nvidia is going already
[09:24] <elmo> capri: I don't think so, but I'm not sure to be honest, cd burning in nautilus "just worked" for me
[09:25] <Nonphasis> slackeerb, just had to come up with the /etc/modules thing
[09:25] <Nonphasis> k3b is the only one that "just works"
[09:25] <slackeerb> Nonphasis: for mplayer add this to your apt source list "deb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/ testing main"
[09:25] <Nonphasis> too bad they didn't do it in gtk