[00:00] <blackboxsw> yeah, unfortunately, I didn't actually merge it ;)
[00:01] <blackboxsw> Permission denied (publickey).
[00:01] <blackboxsw> fatal: Could not read from remote repository.
[00:03] <powersj> O.o you are in the group
[00:03] <powersj> https://launchpad.net/~cloud-init-dev/+members#active
[00:04] <blackboxsw> yeah, git push origin master was a no go. hmm.
[00:04] <blackboxsw> I'll try a fresh clone merge push
[00:08] <blackboxsw> hrm fresh clone shows it merged.
[00:08] <blackboxsw> so when we git push origin master does launchpad automatically mark the branch merged?
[00:08] <blackboxsw> or is that manual
[00:09] <blackboxsw> I was used to LP marking my branches as merged automagically for bzr branches. not sure if that's the same for gitlp
[00:10] <powersj> blackboxsw: I think you have to mark it
[00:10] <powersj> I don't recall doing it automatically, only in bugs
[00:14] <blackboxsw> ok thx powersj yeah that was my confusion (and LP git was also showing stale data @ https://code.launchpad.net/~cloud-init-dev/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+ref/master)
[00:16] <blackboxsw> so I *think* rev b23d9d7 is in build https://jenkins.ubuntu.com/server/view/Cloud-init/job/cloud-init-integration-y/227/ too, so ok, we should be testing what I landed
[01:13] <smoser> blackboxsw, powersj it will mark merge in one of 2 ways (which are really kind of the same)
[01:14] <smoser> a.) you 'git merge' && 'git push'
[01:14] <smoser> b.) you squash, rebase, push --force [to your repo], then merge
[01:15] <smoser> but only you can do 'b', and i prefer the squash to the merge. so really only people with commit access can end up getting that to happen unless they rebase exactly on master with no in the middle commits.
[01:16] <powersj> yeah squash should be done imo
[01:16] <smoser> so... often times i go and mark 'merged' and then hit the edit button for 'merged at revision'
[01:16] <smoser> and put in the actual commit id
[01:16] <smoser> powersj, so do we think we're happy in trunk now?
[01:19] <powersj> For trunk build yes
[01:19] <powersj> I do see a centos build failure: https://jenkins.ubuntu.com/server/job/cloud-init-copr-build/8/console
[01:19] <powersj> and integration tests failed but due to test failures, those were during the firewall reboot, so I'll let them go for now.
[01:25] <smoser> powersj, you're missing python-jinja there
[01:25] <smoser> is that in a fresh container ?
[01:26] <smoser> that error is horrific. it should fail with a sane error rather than attempting to render a template with 'basic' when the template declares it is jinja and it knows it has no jinja
[03:07] <blackboxsw> hmm build failure on 227 above http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/24861805/
[03:07] <blackboxsw> have we seen this before? " Could not resolve \'us.archive.ubuntu.com\"
[03:41] <powersj> what time was that failure at? It may have been during firewall maintenance
[03:41] <powersj> I should just disable tests when we have those planned...
[13:48] <niluje> anyone knows how to submit a merge request with launchpad?
[13:48] <niluje> the "propose for merging" button doens't seem to exist on https://git.launchpad.net/~jcastets/cloud-init/
[13:54] <niluje> oh ok. Only available from code.launchpad.net, not from git.
[13:55] <niluje> https://code.launchpad.net/~jcastets/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/325740
[14:04] <smoser> niluje, thanks!
[14:04] <smoser> niluje, fyi http://cloudinit.readthedocs.io/en/latest/topics/hacking.html kind of explains it
[14:26] <blackboxsw> ok things looking a bit better on jenkins. though integration-x is failing w/ 2017-06-15 11:44:37,781 - tests.cloud_tests - ERROR - stage: collect for platform: lxd encountered error: Failed to create ZFS snapshot: cannot create snapshot 'default/images/ee1831d4efcc74310def225ec449c1b6a49cc371a744cbbb79ea5bf21b05c3b6@readonly': dataset already exists
[14:27] <blackboxsw> https://jenkins.ubuntu.com/server/view/Cloud-init/job/cloud-init-integration-x/220/console
[14:29] <smoser> blackboxsw, well, at least that doesn'st smell like cloud-init code regression
[14:29] <blackboxsw> amen to that
[14:29] <smoser> https://jenkins.ubuntu.com/server/view/Cloud-init/job/cloud-init-copr-build/8/console
[14:30] <blackboxsw> jinja template changes +  brpm changes
[14:30] <blackboxsw> smoser: I can take that if you haven't already
[14:31] <smoser> blackboxsw, you can. i think it needs jenkins change
[14:31] <smoser> right? it is just that wherever that is run it needs jinja
[14:32] <smoser> ideally it runs in a container. or it could use:
[14:32] <smoser>  ./tools/run-centos 6 --srpm --artifact
[14:33] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/24864792/
[14:34] <smoser> it could be useful to chagne run-centos to take a '--artifact-dir' to put artifacts (the srpm) in that directory rather than '.'
[14:35] <blackboxsw> that's a good call. I'll go that route
[14:35] <smoser> i dont think we need the '--artifact-dir' here as the build will always take place in a clean environment
[14:36] <smoser> https://git.launchpad.net/server-team-ci/tree/jenkins/cloud-init/centos.yaml is what you need to change i think
[14:37] <blackboxsw> yeah we can just switch CI to use run-centos I have a couple other jenkins changes from yesterday (to get deps installed for the integration-# builds too. so I'll fold them together
[14:38] <smoser> k
[14:40] <niluje> smoser: yep, I read the document but didn't notice it was only available on "code.laucnhpad.net" and not on "git.launchpad.net"
[14:43] <smoser> fair. i reviewed your proposal.
[14:43] <niluje> smoser: "we really, *REALLY* want a positive non-network identification" -> we already discussed about this on the previous PR (which was made longtimeeee ago), and unfortunately there no way to implement the on_scaleway method without hitting a network ressource
[14:43] <smoser> :)
[14:43] <niluje> you suggested to call dmidecode, it wouldn't work as we don't provide such info
[14:43] <smoser> yeah. feel free to link to that if you'd like.
[14:45] <niluje> smoser: just a thing about vendor-data. I added them in self.metadata['vendor-data']. Is it what is expected by cloud-init?
[14:50] <smoser> niluje, the datasource wants a
[14:50] <smoser>  self.vendordata_raw
[14:51] <niluje> is the interface documented somewhere?
[14:51] <smoser> well cloudinit/sources/__init__.py
[14:53] <niluje> oh
[14:53] <niluje> 'user-data' and 'vendor-data' are not expected to be in metadata
[14:54] <niluje> I thought so :p
[14:54] <smoser> well, cloud-init doesn't get to chose where you put information on the other end.
[14:55] <niluje> ok
[14:55] <smoser> i'm sorry if i sound like pestering...
[14:55] <smoser> are there plans (at least in the vms) to put some dmi information in ?
[14:55] <smoser> or some other way of identifying "you are on scaleway"
[14:58] <smoser> niluje, i'm really sorry if you've told me all this before. if I had a nickle for for all the things i'd forgotten...
[14:59] <blackboxsw> powersj: just put a branch for review https://code.launchpad.net/~chad.smith/server-team-ci/+git/server-team-ci/+merge/325745.
[15:02] <powersj> blackboxsw: thanks
[15:08] <niluje> smoser: we have two options
[15:08] <niluje> smoser: 1/ we can update our initrd to create the file /var/run/scaleway and check this file exists in cloud-init
[15:08] <niluje> 2/ we can add "scaleway" in the kernel cmdline and check it in cloud-init
[15:09] <niluje> this way the network check can go away
[15:09] <niluje> any preference?
[15:21] <smoser> since you already ahve a custom initrd, that seems fine.
[15:22] <smoser> in your vm images do you have a custom initrd ?
[15:23] <smoser> ie, the 'vc1s' does that have a custom initrd ?
[15:24] <smoser> either is fine. i think maybe kernel cmdline seems easier to maintain long term.
[15:24] <smoser> i'd like it if
[15:25] <smoser> a.) your vm instance types (vc1s, vc1m, vc1l) provided some dmi data . in theory that shoudl work even on arm64 vms (i dont know if you offer those), but reality differs
[15:25] <niluje> (yes we do)
[15:26] <niluje> for dmi data, it's really not an option as you have some baremetal servers and we don't want to maintain several solutions to identify the hardware
[15:26] <smoser> b.) your bare metal instance types, it seems like kernel cmdline is acceptable. at some point in the future when you started  being able to use stock images there, with a grub that loaded a kernel from inside the image... we'd have to figure someway out. maybe you'd have to modify the image to keep the kernel param on, or just touch a file or static config.
[15:26] <niluje> and we'd like to eventually get rid of the initrd (which is currently also used for vm)
[15:26] <niluje> if that's ok to you let's go for the commandline
[15:26] <smoser> in vm instances dmidata shoudl be possible
[15:27] <smoser> because at some point you want to get off maintaining your own images for vms (i'd think)
[15:27] <smoser> and having easy check of dmi platform data that says 'scaleway' is a win there.
[15:27] <smoser> even if its harder to get that same win elsewhere.
[15:28] <niluje> smoser: what about adding three checks ? dmidecode + cmdline + /var/run/scaleway?
[15:29] <niluje> this way we can just update the cmdline for now and/or update the initrd, and we have the flexibility to add dmidecode on our vm later when we'll (hopefully) allow to run custom images/kernels
[15:31] <smoser> that is fine with me.
[15:31] <niluje> awesome :)
[15:31] <niluje> last thing, what's the LP #id you want me to put in the commit message?
[15:31] <niluje> the MR id?
[15:36] <smoser> no. bug number
[15:36] <smoser> i you want to file a bug, you can.
[15:36] <smoser> that'd be nice.
[15:37] <smoser> but if you dont', then thats fine too
[15:38] <niluje> ok
[15:38] <niluje> thanks
[15:38] <niluje> I'll get back to you with improvements and unittests (and not in weeks, this time)
[15:56] <smoser> powersj, i suspect it'd be possible to get a freebsd vm into our jenkins right ?
[15:57] <smoser> in a low tech sort of way... powersj gets a vm image of freebsd or does an install, adds it to a libvirt and adds jenkins to it ?
[15:57] <smoser> then we could run freebsd c-i on that system.
[15:59] <powersj> smoser: yeah
[16:00] <powersj> assuming the jenkins client (java) runs on freebsd
[16:01] <rharper> https://docs.openstack.org/image-guide/freebsd-image.html
[16:02] <smoser> "You can specify up to 1 GB additional RAM to make the installation process run faster."
[16:02] <powersj> nice!
[16:02] <powersj> lol
[16:02] <smoser> any more than that, and its going to fail :)
[16:54] <smoser> blackboxsw, https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/325760
[16:54] <smoser> i'd appreciate read of that if you had some minutes
[16:56] <blackboxsw> grabbing right now
[16:56] <blackboxsw> powersj: https://jenkins.ubuntu.com/server/job/z_integration_y/1/console looks pretty good for the 2nd part of validation on https://code.launchpad.net/~chad.smith/server-team-ci/+git/server-team-ci/+merge/325745
[16:57] <blackboxsw> smoser: ci didn't like first pass. https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/325760
[16:58] <blackboxsw> but reviewing code now
[16:58] <smoser> its running the second now.
[16:58] <powersj> blackboxsw: your merge looks good to me
[16:58] <smoser> i dropped the pylint ignore on platform.dist()
[16:58] <smoser> which is unfortunatlye deprecated (but so was linux_distribution())
[16:58] <smoser> :-(
[16:58] <smoser> https://bugs.python.org/issue1322
[17:02] <rharper> aw bummer
[17:19] <NostawRm> long shot, but I'm trying to find anyway that I can specify some network configurations because I'm not happy with Openstack's IP selection. I just saw that using user data is not an option, so I'm seeing what other options I have
[17:20] <NostawRm> I  know I could just make a script to use but that's less than ideal :/ having it done proper by cloud-init would be better imo
[17:22] <smoser> NostawRm, i'm not sure that you can do that .
[17:22] <smoser> if openstack told you what your ip is, then its quite likely not going to route traffic if you take a different one
[17:23] <NostawRm> I thought not. Surely if I could, I would have found it right now :/
[17:23] <NostawRm> well, its a single interface/port with multiple IPs
[17:23] <NostawRm> and openstack just picks the first one in the list, but if a new one is added that is then the first one in the list, then say on a rebuild, the 'main' IP would change
[17:24] <NostawRm> don't know if that explains it well heh
[17:28] <blackboxsw> smoser: minor comment about suse on https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/325760
[18:52] <powersj> smoser: re: CI pipeline I have something here: https://jenkins.ubuntu.com/server/job/cloud-init-pipeline-ci/
[18:53] <powersj> I would like to keep the run times below 10 mins, so what I am going to do is work on creating parallel stages going and write a short integration test that hits as many areas as possible rather than running all the lxd-based tests.
[18:54] <powersj> Then plan would then be to replace the daily build/unit test with this and replace the per-merge CI tests with this as well, so every merge has coverage here.
[19:08] <smoser> http://doodle.com/poll/tq43i9876sw2vqca
[19:08] <smoser> larsks, ^ rharper powersj dpb1
[19:12] <blackboxsw> https://jenkins.ubuntu.com/server/view/Cloud-init/ all the green balls
[19:12] <blackboxsw> :)
[19:13] <smoser> blackboxsw, thanks for the suse . i will fix.
[19:16] <smoser> blackboxsw, actually..
[19:16] <blackboxsw> yeah was wondering what our story is with suse and templating?
[19:17] <smoser> yeah
[19:17] <smoser> see comment
[19:51] <powersj> smoser: FYI http://paste.ubuntu.com/24866805/
[19:51] <powersj> that just happened
[19:52] <powersj> centos7
[19:53] <smoser> thati sodd
[20:00] <smoser> powersj, i'll get it fixed.
[20:15] <blackboxsw> did I mention I love the cI
[20:16] <blackboxsw> did I mention I love the ci -- continuous integration for the win
[20:19] <rharper> *whew* ;  all but one integration test passing,   the mixed ipv6 mtu and device mtu case (which we have to workaround in ubuntu as well);
[20:20] <rharper> smoser: do you prefer a MR per bug/issue, or would you like a PR with all of the fixes and bugs?
[20:23] <smoser> well, i think one per issue is better.
[20:23] <rharper> ok
[20:23] <smoser> powersj, blackboxsw i can recreate that in a centos 6 container (./tools/run-centos 6)
[20:23] <smoser> but i dont understand it
[20:23] <smoser> why would this not show failure:
[20:24] <smoser> $ python -c 'from cloudinit import util; print(util.is_FreeBSD())'
[20:24] <smoser> False
[20:24] <smoser> or
[20:24] <smoser> $ python -c 'import platform; print(platform.dist())'
[20:24] <smoser> ('centos', '7.3.1611', 'Core')
[20:24] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/24867035/
[20:27] <smoser> oh. because he mocked platform.platform
[20:43] <smoser> blackboxsw, powersj https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/325771
[20:51] <powersj> smoser: there will be tox failures on that
[20:54] <smoser> i think fixed
[20:55] <smoser> powersj, ^
[21:00] <smoser> blackboxsw, ^ a review would be good. or rharper
[21:00] <blackboxsw> smoser comment added
[21:00] <blackboxsw> doesn't look like _check_freebsd_cdrom returns anything
[21:01] <rharper> ?
[21:01] <rharper> true or false
[21:01] <rharper> it's just code motion for mocking
[21:02] <rharper> smoser: why don't you need the PY3 in mock anymore ?
[21:02] <smoser> blackboxsw, you reviewed an older version
[21:02] <smoser> and caught a valid concern
[21:02] <smoser> which is now fixed
[21:02] <smoser> we mock just earlier now, so dont need PY3
[21:03] <smoser> look at updated diff. you see i remove usage of it.
[21:03] <rharper> smoser: gotcha, we're mocking the function, so no need to mock open
[21:04] <smoser> yeah.
[21:11] <blackboxsw> minor assert param reorder. but +1
[21:14] <smoser> blackboxsw, ?
[21:15] <smoser> i'm running a ./tools/run-centos and tox on feature/freebsd-variant
[21:15] <smoser>  https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/325760
[21:17] <smoser> bah
[21:17] <smoser> blackboxsw, you're right. it shoudl ahve been reordered
[21:17] <smoser> sorry
[21:17] <smoser> it is pushed now, and i just pushed https://code.launchpad.net/~smoser/cloud-init/+git/cloud-init/+merge/325760 also
[21:18] <blackboxsw> +1
[21:18] <blackboxsw> will watch jenkins
[21:19]  * smoser goes out. i'll check back in in a few hours
[21:19] <rharper> later


[03:08] <mhz> jsgotangco: ping
[03:09] <jsgotangco> hi
[03:10] <mhz> available?
[03:10] <mhz> jsgotangco: ?
[03:11] <jsgotangco> sure
[03:11] <jsgotangco> what's up
[03:11] <mhz> jsgotangco: could we meet?
[03:12] <jsgotangco> aren't we doing it now?
[03:12] <jsgotangco> jheh
[03:13] <mhz> jsgotangco: so, far I have no experience on writing guides nor books. However, I do feel there are certain points to set: Audience, Deepness, Average look, Format, etc
[03:13] <jsgotangco> did you see the wiki page?
[03:13] <mhz> at my lunch time, 13 hours ago
[03:13] <jsgotangco> i don't want to delve on setting up the whole server
[03:14] <mhz> The Edubuntu 6.04 Quick Guide
[03:14] <mhz>     *
[03:14] <mhz>       ?/IntroductionToEdubuntu
[03:14] <mhz>     *
[03:14] <mhz>       ?/GettingStartedWithTheEdubuntuDesktop
[03:14] <mhz>     *
[03:14] <mhz>       ?/TheEdubuntuApplications
[03:14] <mhz>     *
[03:14] <mhz>       ?/BeyondEdubuntuBasics
[03:15] <jsgotangco> i just want the basic desktop apps shown
[03:15] <jsgotangco> that is unique to edubuntu
[03:15] <mhz> jsgotangco: My guess is that chapters 3 and 4 will take longer
[03:15] <jsgotangco> because an ubuntu manual alrady addresses those
[03:15] <mhz> jsgotangco: agree
[03:15] <jsgotangco> 4 is just a table pointing to more complex tasks
[03:16] <jsgotangco> this thing shouldnt even go beyond 5 sections
[03:16] <mhz> JaneW: 3, how deep do you picture it?
[03:16] <mhz> sorry
[03:16] <mhz> jsgotangco: :)
[03:17] <jsgotangco> intro is the usual intro
[03:17] <mhz> jsgotangco: and 4, do you want to talk about each application or just table them ?
[03:17] <jsgotangco> and marketing stuff
[03:18] <jsgotangco> mhz, the edubuntu desktop apps is less than 15
[03:18] <jsgotangco> and those apps have their own manuals
[03:18] <mhz> jsgotangco: it depends.. Gcompris itself is about 40 apps
[03:19] <jsgotangco> i'm not planning to show everything on gcompris
[03:19] <mhz> jsgotangco: so you are happy with just a description of each app?
[03:20] <jsgotangco> pretty much
[03:20] <jsgotangco> unless you have something better
[03:20] <jsgotangco> 1) Need Math -> 2) Go here
[03:20] <jsgotangco> 1) Need English -> 2) Go here
[03:21] <mhz> jsgotangco: did you see what i listed here? https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuSoftwareList
[03:21] <mhz> jsgotangco: oh, I see, so you picture it divided in areas
[03:21] <mhz> thematic areas
[03:22] <mhz> or subject areas
[03:22] <jsgotangco> yes
[03:22] <jsgotangco> but i'm not a teacher, so that
[03:22] <jsgotangco> that's just a guess
[03:22] <mhz> hmmmm
[03:22] <jsgotangco> this is nice
[03:22] <mhz> what if we have them 'crossed'
[03:22] <jsgotangco> we can move this
[03:23] <mhz> #4 Could be: Need Math -> Go here...
[03:23] <mhz> Need Junior -> Go there
[03:23] <jsgotangco> i wish i had a working edubuntu now
[03:23] <mhz> jsgotangco: so maybe we can easily list all apps by 'categories'
[03:24] <mhz> by 'ages'
[03:24] <mhz> and by 'subjects/areas'
[03:25] <mhz> we use EdubuntuSoftwareList as a base DB
[03:25] <jsgotangco> im not that familiar with the age groups for the apps
[03:25] <jsgotangco> the wiki page can be massaged then moved to the distro
[03:25] <mhz> yup
[03:26] <jsgotangco> hmm
[03:26] <jsgotangco> who wrote this?
[03:26] <mhz> and if we included screenshots, a user may click on an application name, get to a mini wiki page with the shot and short description
[03:27] <jsgotangco> hmm
[03:27] <mhz> 18th versions, 17 writen by me
[03:27] <jsgotangco> would it be possible in our short time frame to make a wiki version for each app?
[03:27] <mhz> sure
[03:27] <mhz> piece of cake
[03:27] <jsgotangco> i'll proabably install 5.10 first in a machine
[03:27] <jsgotangco> then just grab screenshots
[03:28] <jsgotangco> just the desktop specific apps
[03:28] <jsgotangco> is that good?
[03:28] <mhz> good
[03:29] <mhz> jsgotangco: so, let's write a mini roadmap?
[03:29] <jsgotangco> yes
[03:29] <mhz> write = agree
[03:29] <jsgotangco> can you create a draft in the wiki?
[03:29] <jsgotangco> i
[03:29] <mhz> sure
[03:29] <jsgotangco> i'm currently doing something with a firewall
[03:29] <jsgotangco> what i'll do first is fix up my machine for 5.10
[03:29] <mhz> go ahead, let me get a coffe and get my hands on it
[03:29] <mhz> jsgotangco: heheh
[04:19] <mhz> jsgotangco: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuDocumentation/EdubuntuQuickguide/RoadMap
[04:21] <jsgotangco> looks good to me
[04:21] <jsgotangco> i can finish up the screenshots
[04:21] <jsgotangco> from 5.10
[04:21] <jsgotangco> hopefully not much have changed
[04:21] <mhz_tired> jsgotangco: I have like 10 or more screenshots
[04:22] <mhz_tired> about Gcompris and some other junior apps
[04:22] <jsgotangco> tha's ok i can do some more again
[04:22] <jsgotangco> and just compare when we're done
[04:22] <mhz_tired> cool
[04:22] <jsgotangco> hopefull, we'll have enough space on the CD
[04:22] <jsgotangco> heh
[04:22] <mhz_tired> hehehe
[04:23] <mhz_tired> jsgotangco: any chances a user can be directed from Yelp to Firefox?
[04:23] <jsgotangco> then go to the internet?
[04:23] <mhz_tired> or any chances we set that 'help button' to open a firefox tab
[04:23] <mhz_tired> ?
[04:23] <mhz_tired> nope, localhost
[04:23] <jsgotangco> direct from Yelp to firefox?
[04:24] <jsgotangco> hmm
[04:24] <mhz_tired> nope, localhost/EdubuntuQuickGuide
[04:24] <jsgotangco> yelp renders html
[04:24] <jsgotangco> a like to file will open up in yelp i think
[04:24] <mhz_tired> jsgotangco: I am imagining, localhost = Welcome to Edubuntu!
[04:24] <jsgotangco> but a link to http will open up the default browser
[04:25] <mhz_tired> like DSL does it
[04:25] <mhz_tired> you run DSL and get presented with a browser with all the info you need
[04:25] <mhz_tired> to start up
[09:50] <highvoltage> hi ribbo
[09:53] <ribbo> hi highvoltage
[09:53] <ribbo> so, much action here?
[10:01] <jsgotangco> :D
[10:08] <highvoltage> ribbo: sometimes, yes.
[10:36] <pips1> highvoltage, hi!
[10:37] <highvoltage> hi pips1
[10:37] <highvoltage> long time no see
[10:37] <pips1> how is it going! yes!
[10:37] <highvoltage> very busy down here, a lot of things going on, good and bad!
[10:37] <pips1> I was very busy with my day job since december...
[10:38] <pips1> I piled up a lot of overtime and now I get to compensate :-)
[10:38] <highvoltage> :)
[10:38] <pips1> Did you get the mail re edubuntu website from JaneW ?
[10:39] <highvoltage> yes, i have
[10:39] <highvoltage> mhz, hno73, etc. will work to make the moin part better
[10:39] <pips1> Well, I wanted to really get going with the website ... :-)
[10:39] <highvoltage> so that we'll eventually be able to do everything we wanted with drupal, but with moin (hopefully)
[10:40] <pips1> ah
[10:40] <highvoltage> i'm not quite sure how that will work yet, i'm a bit behind on that myseld
[10:40] <pips1> i noticed that hno73 revamped the ubuntu site to use moin now :-)
[10:40] <highvoltage> s/myseld/myself
[10:41] <highvoltage> yep, the plone site broke into a "million tiny pieces" and they couldn't get it back up again :)
[10:41] <pips1> moin/wikis are great for community contributions
[10:42] <highvoltage> yep
[10:42] <pips1> still, I thought that there will be the need for an "official" site with it's own set of needs
[10:42] <pips1> hm
[10:42] <highvoltage> seems not, hey :/
[10:42] <highvoltage> how much of your original plans will be applicable to the moin site?
[10:43] <highvoltage> can it be adjusted, and can we implement the most part of it and then find ways for the rest?
[10:43] <highvoltage> or does it depend heavily on drupals taxonimy?
[10:43] <pips1> well, I the meeting yesterday, I proposed to have a go at a drupal site (for the "official" stuff)
[10:43] <pips1> JaneW proposed that we meet on monday and decide how to go forward exactly
[10:44] <pips1> I intend to demo the drupal test site I'm currently building...
[10:44] <highvoltage> not a bad idea, i considered this too
[10:44] <pips1> then we'll vote if we need/use drupal or go moin completely...
[10:45] <highvoltage> so far, i think you'll have 3 votes for drupal
[10:45] <highvoltage> perhaps if that demo site is up, it will jump up quite drastically
[10:45] <pips1> well, we'll see ;-)
[10:45] <highvoltage> :)
[10:45] <highvoltage> gtg, talk again l8r
[10:45] <pips1> ok, if you get a spare minute, get in touch with me :-)
[10:50] <Kamping_Kaiser> i have a laptop here I'm about to install something on, but after that's done, does anyone think i should install edubuntu to test how it goes? i know ubuntu Breezy  runs perfectly, so i asume edu will work just as well
[10:57] <pips1> Kamping_Kaiser, if you install on a laptop you might want to do the "workstation" install
[10:57] <Kamping_Kaiser> pips1: ok thanks. *checks the wiki to see what the difference is*
[10:59] <pips1> If you want to test the current (unstable) Dapper version, please report your findings in the wiki here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/CurrentEdubuntu if you can :-)
[11:00] <Kamping_Kaiser> my iso is Breezy (my ISP don't mirror Ubuntu's unstalbe isos)
[11:01] <pips1> btw, I am running unstable "flight3" on a test pc (amd64) and it's fine just now
[11:01] <pips1> oh, I see
[11:01] <Kamping_Kaiser> pips1: i have a desktop pc that someone installed edubuntu on (i have it because of flppy issues)
[11:01] <Kamping_Kaiser> *floppy
[11:01] <Kamping_Kaiser> I'm just wondering how a lappy would handle it
[11:01] <pips1> ok
[11:02] <pips1> depends on your model, I guess
[11:03] <pips1> on my ibm thinkpad it runs rather well :-)
[11:05] <Kamping_Kaiser> :) this is a compac armada
[11:12] <pips1> maybe somebody already tested your model, have a look https://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/LaptopTestingTeam
[11:12] <Kamping_Kaiser> I'm installing for interest sake, but thanks for the url
[11:13] <pips1> sure :-)
[11:13] <Kamping_Kaiser> :)
[11:14] <pips1> well, you might want to report your findings (hint hint) ;-)

[11:16] <Kamping_Kaiser> maybe :) I'm just giving livelamp the evil eye. when I'm finished doing that I'll try EdU
[11:35] <Kamping_Kaiser> http://tangram.dnsalias.net:8008/gallery/LCA06-0129/p1280213 rofl
[11:53] <ogra> JaneW, for your pleasance: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/dapper-changes/2006-February/006434.html
[11:53] <jsgotangco> birthday gift for ogra : http://doc.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/about-edubuntu/C/index.html
[11:53] <jsgotangco> it now builds
[11:54] <JaneW> ogra: YAY
[11:54] <ogra> jsgotangco, we should probably drop the moodle stuff ...
[11:54] <ogra> we wont ship it ...
[11:54] <JaneW> jsgotangco:  nice :)
[11:55] <ogra> or rewrite it to: edubuntu recommends moodle for class management ...
[11:56] <jsgotangco> dinner
[12:03] <ogra> workstation installs edubuntu-desktop on top of a normal ubuntu system ...
[12:03] <ogra> server should be renamed to "minimal"
[12:03] <Kamping_Kaiser> so server is same as a normal ubuntu cd? (i agree about minimal)
[12:03] <ogra> and default installs (and configures) edubuntu-server and edubuntu-desktop
[12:03] <ogra> yes
[12:03] <Kamping_Kaiser> ok.
[12:04] <Kamping_Kaiser> *does workstation install*
[01:59] <lucasvo> what's the user password in the vmware virtual machine of ubuntu(cdimages.ubuntu.com/vmware)
[01:59] <jsgotangco> ubuntu
[02:03] <Kamping_Kaiser> hm. Edu workstation is going nice on this laptop :O only problem so far is the modem, but I'll check that out later. :)
[02:03] <jsgotangco> hmm
[02:03] <jsgotangco> i havent tested the daily build
[02:03] <jsgotangco> x86 looks sane
[02:04] <ogra> Kamping_Kaiser, dapper ?
[02:04] <jsgotangco> i still want to sulk over gnome-xchat though
[02:04] <Kamping_Kaiser> ogra: no, Breezy
[02:04] <jsgotangco> heh
[02:04] <ogra> jsgotangco, i wont use it ...
[02:04] <Kamping_Kaiser> i cant download dapper on my connection :\
[02:04] <jsgotangco> ogra: i agree
[02:04] <Kamping_Kaiser> lol jsgotangco
[02:04] <ogra> me neither today :(
[02:05] <Kamping_Kaiser> probably integrated or something
[02:05] <ogra> DSL broke ... i'm on ISDN ... 64k isnt really for syncing isos ...
[02:05] <jsgotangco> im using it now but this is worse than using gaim for irc
[02:05] <Kamping_Kaiser> wow
[02:05] <Kamping_Kaiser> that's bad
[02:07] <jsgotangco> ogra: but ISDN is pretty expensive over there right?
[02:07] <ogra> yup
[02:07] <ogra> but hey ... i had to upload a new ltsp today and need to attend two meetings ..
[02:08] <jsgotangco> yeah
[02:08] <jsgotangco> err kubuntu meeting?
[02:08] <jsgotangco> :D
[02:09] <ogra> lol, nope
[02:09] <ogra> development status meeting ... and a ltsp meeting adterwards
[02:10] <ogra> *afterwards
[02:10] <jsgotangco> hmm
[02:10] <jsgotangco> ahhh
[02:10] <jsgotangco> must be sudden
[02:12] <ogra> debian/ubuntu ltsp teams meet in #ltsp 18:00 UTC ...
[02:12] <ogra> its not a ubuntu meeting ... was initiated from the debian group
[02:12] <jsgotangco> heh this sucks i live in a timezone where all the action is happening at dawn
[02:12] <jsgotangco> ogra: that's nice...your work is paying off
[02:12] <ogra> lets see :)
[02:13] <ogra> they're not happy with some decisions and implementations ... its debian ...
[02:13] <jsgotangco> do you know why xchat-gnome has become default?
[02:13] <jsgotangco> ogra: why so? we're using muecow...
[02:13] <ogra> they want no autoconfiguration but do everything manually ...
[02:13] <jsgotangco> that's supposed to be ltsp-ng
[02:13] <ogra> they use our package since quite some time ...
[02:15] <jsgotangco> hmmm
[02:16] <jsgotangco> does mdz also maintain ltsp in debian?
[02:16] <ogra> mdz doesnt maintin ltsp anymore
[02:16] <ogra> thats my job
[02:17] <jsgotangco> oh!
[02:17] <ogra> he just looks over the code from time to time and complains if i did something wrong ...
[02:18] <ogra> but http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/bzr-archive/ltsp/dapper/ is the upstream archive for muecow in debian/ubuntu currently ...
[04:05] <jsgotangco> ogra: schools need bling! schools need compiz!
[04:05] <jsgotangco> hehe
[04:05] <ogra> pfft
[04:06] <ogra> I'm SO annoyed by all the xgl stuff ...
[04:06] <ogra> spams lists and channels for no good reason ... and wont be ready within the next 10 months ...
[04:07] <ogra> xgl will be great if done though ... but it sidetracks everybody from getting dapper ready ...
[04:07] <jsgotangco> right but let me enjoy this till next week since i'll be speaking in a trade show hehehe
[04:07] <ogra> :)
[04:08] <jsgotangco> at the moment, its really just wow factor
[04:08] <jsgotangco> nothing useful
[04:08] <ogra> it will hopefully replace xorg soon ... its far better by design ... but its not even dapper+1 stuff imho...
[04:09] <vmarks> I remember when xorg was the best thing going.
[04:10] <ogra> vmarks, doing all drawing by GL will give you a lot benefit even onn old hardware ...
[04:11] <vmarks> oh yes.
[04:11] <vmarks> that's for certain.
[04:11] <vmarks> I was just reminiscing.
[04:11] <Kamping_Kaiser> ogra: problem is people wont put effort into old hardware - and theats where it's needed
[04:11] <Kamping_Kaiser> *that's
[04:12] <ogra> Kamping_Kaiser, they will ... i'll scream and shout if edubuntu cant support old hardware ;)
[04:12] <Kamping_Kaiser> :D
[04:13] <Kamping_Kaiser> good. *knows what thin clients on old hardware are like*
[04:17] <vmarks> I find myself using old linux distributions or lighter weight window managers on old hardware.
[04:17] <ogra> not really necessary if you use ltsp ...
[04:18] <vmarks> although edubuntu seems to do remarkably well.
[04:18] <ogra> 300Mhz and &$MB are fine for thin clients
[04:18] <ogra> err
[04:18] <ogra> 64MB
[04:18] <vmarks> well, yes. but ltsp isn't perfect: I'm still hurting on the non-pxe booting.
[04:18] <vmarks> and 300mhz is a fast machine comparatively.
[04:18] <ogra> i'll write a howto soon
[04:18] <ogra> 300Mhz is PII class ...
[04:19] <vmarks> yes it is.
[04:19] <ogra> thats already quite old :)
[04:19] <vmarks> some of us have p166 and 200mmx still.
[04:19] <vmarks> :D
[04:19] <ogra> 6 years ?
[04:19] <ogra> 200mmx should be fine as well if you have the right amount of ram. ...
[04:20] <Kamping_Kaiser> itshares boxes are only 200mhz+96mb RAM (or was 12 months ago, it's about a 300/400 average now)
[04:20] <Kamping_Kaiser> so there's lots of 200s about
[05:23] <mhz_back4hrs> ogra: hi
[05:23] <mhz_back4hrs> ogra: any ideal specs for NIC's for the Edubuntu server?
[05:23] <mhz_back4hrs> speed? brand?
[05:23] <ogra> PXE capable NICS are helpful ...
[05:24] <ogra> 100Mbit as well
[05:24] <ogra> oh, the server ...
[05:25] <jsgotangco> ive used a gigiabit NIC
[05:25] <ogra> not really ... i know people that say you should take 3com in any case, but to be honest i never saw regressions with other brands ...
[05:25] <jsgotangco> then connected to a gigabit switch
[05:25] <jsgotangco> but a 100Mbit should actually work fine
[05:25] <ogra> yeah, if you have a gbit switch its fine to use a gbit card
[05:26] <juliux> you can also use the cards who have 4 ports
[05:26] <juliux> and than connect every client directly to the server
[05:26] <ogra> that gets quite tricky ...
[05:26] <ogra> ah, yes
[05:27] <ogra> i thought you wanted to trunk the lineks together
[05:27] <mhz_back4hrs> so, bottom line ? :D
[05:27] <ogra> *lines
[05:27] <juliux> ogra, no
[05:27] <jsgotangco> mhz_back4hrs: 100Mbit should work fine
[05:27] <jsgotangco> but 1GBit is recommended
[05:27] <mhz_back4hrs> jsgotangco: ideal specs?
[05:27] <mhz_back4hrs> okis
[05:27] <jsgotangco> you should be generous to your server as much as possible
[05:28] <mhz_back4hrs> processor? from 1.7 GB (AMD) ?
[05:28] <juliux> ogra, the pci bus has more than 400MBit bandwidth, and so every client has 100MBit, but you can only connect 4 clients
[05:28] <ogra> 100Mbit no specific brand at least ... ideally gbit for client and server and a T3 line to the internet ;P
[05:28] <juliux> ogra, only T3 ?
[05:28] <ogra> heh
[05:28] <jsgotangco> ived used 64bit with good results
[05:29] <ogra> nah, a direct Gbit uplink to the provider will do as well, juliux
[05:29] <juliux> ogra, the uni has only 622Mbit
[05:29] <ogra> pfft ... lamers
[05:29] <juliux> ogra, but with a flatrate
[05:29] <ogra> heh, funny
[05:30] <juliux> ogra, cost 1,5million + tax
[05:30] <ogra> peanuts ...
[05:31] <juliux> ogra, now you know why we have de.archives.ubuntu.com and ftp.de.debian.org here
[05:31] <ogra> mhz_back4hrs, so just go with juliux recommendation and you wont run into problems :)
[05:31] <mhz_back4hrs> hehe
[05:31] <mhz_back4hrs> juliux rox!
[05:32] <ogra> yes, he always has the cheap and easy solution for you :)
[05:32] <juliux> hehe
[05:33] <juliux> but at home i also have only a normal dsl connection
[05:33] <ogra> oh, you get dsl in dresden ?
[05:33] <ogra> i thought that wasnt possible ...
[05:33] <juliux> no in hamburg
[05:33] <ogra> oh
[05:33] <ogra> you moved ?
[05:33] <juliux> no there are my parents
[05:34] <ogra> ah
[05:34] <juliux> and that is for me home
[05:34] <juliux> not dresden
[05:34] <juliux> and in some parts of dresden you can get dsl
[05:34] <juliux> but it is like a gamble
[05:35] <ogra> yup, thats what i heard
[05:35] <juliux> but you can get internet over wlan
[05:35] <juliux> but it is very slow
[05:35] <ogra> as for most parts of eastern germany  ... where telekom was clever enough to replace all copper lines with fiber
[05:35] <juliux> yes but you can also do dsl over fiber
[05:36] <ogra> they should offer you direct fiber access :)
[05:36] <juliux> but the telekom dont want to do this
[05:36] <juliux> hansenet do it over fiber in hamburg
[05:37] <ogra> its more expensive ... you need two more modulators ...
[05:37] <juliux> that could be but you get a normal kabel into your flat
[05:38] <juliux> so you can use normal dsl hardware
[05:38] <ogra> sure, but the provider has more costs ...
[05:38] <juliux> yes but his own cables and not the cables from the telekom
[05:38] <juliux> so you get more bandwidth
[06:07] <bob> could someone send me a working sources file for dapper? the updates are being well sketchy for me
[06:08] <ogra> how did you upgrade ?
[06:09] <ogra> note that there is currently no clean way to upgrade the chroot, you need to rebuild it ...
[06:11] <ogra> also dont use dapper in a production environment, its far from being stable ...
[06:17] <bob> hmm ok
[06:17] <bob> i just replaces all the breezys for dappers
[06:17] <bob> *replaced
[06:17] <ogra> thats fine for the server ...
[06:18] <bob> hmm
[06:18] <ogra> after that run sudo apt-get update
[06:18] <bob> yeah
[06:18] <ogra> to make the system aware of the change
[06:18] <bob> its just full of missing stuff
[06:18] <ogra> sure, as i said its pretty broken based on a daily base ...
[06:19] <bob> haha ok
[06:19] <bob> how can i rebuild the chroot? i really cant work out whats going wrong any more
[06:19] <ogra> its in steady development :)
[06:19] <ogra> sudo rm -f /opt/ltsp/i386
[06:20] <ogra> sudo ltsp-build-client
[06:20] <bob> ta!
[06:20] <bob> whats the -f flag for?
[06:20] <ogra> force
[06:20] <bob> ta
[06:20] <ogra> else it wont delete directorys
[06:21] <bob> hmm doesnt work, shall i bung an R in too?
[06:22] <ogra> whats the error ?
[06:22] <bob> 'is a directory'
[06:23] <ogra> oh, yes -rf is better then :)
[06:23] <ogra> sorry
[06:23] <bob> :)
[06:23] <bob> so the sources file is right with all the breezys made dapper, right?
[06:24] <ogra> yup
[06:25] <bob> cool
[06:28] <bob> i can deal with dodgyness as long sa i know its meant to be dodgy...
[06:28] <ogra> ok ...
[06:29] <ogra> but this doggyness can also mean your network interfaces dont work and change names on every boot for example ... (a current problem )
[06:29] <bob> ahhh
[06:31] <bob> well not had much luck with brezy so i figured it was worth a shot :p
[06:36] <bob> hang on
[06:36] <bob> do i have to create seperate logins for clients?
[06:37] <ogra> you cant use the same user on all clients ... (you can, but themes break for example, dapper has a fix for that, but its not commited yet)
[06:38] <bob> hmm
[06:38] <bob> wlel
[06:38] <bob> it just booted ok, but its still not liking logins
[06:40] <ogra> you rebuilt the chroot ?
[06:40] <bob> you mean i just cant log in to more than one machine at a time, right?
[06:40] <bob> yeha
[06:40] <ogra> you can log in as many times as you want ...
[06:40] <bob> ok
[06:40] <bob> so what do you mean by i cant use the same user on all clients?
[06:40] <ogra> but not with the same user if you dont want your themes and wallpapers to break
[06:41] <bob> ahh ok, differnt screen resses and stuff?
[06:42] <ogra> nope, window frames and wallpapers on the destop etc ...
[06:42] <bob> ahh ok
[06:42] <bob> so you got any idea why logins arent working properly?
[06:42] <mezzapazza> hi all
[06:43] <mezzapazza> anyone with some knowledge on LTSP around here?
[06:43] <ogra> bob, is your /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/ssh/ssh_known_hosts having the right IP of your server ?
[06:43] <ogra> bob, if not, run sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys
[06:44] <bob> yup, the only 2 ips there are the server address
[06:45] <ogra> and actually the one that the thin clients are connected to i hope ...
[06:45] <bob> nope :(
[06:45] <bob> oh
[06:45] <bob> soryr
[06:45] <bob> you mean the ip of the sever the thins are connected to?
[06:45] <ogra> bob, yes
[06:45] <bob> yeah
[06:45] <ogra> ok, and sshd is running on the server ?
[06:46] <bob> yeah
[06:46] <ogra> and *no* user can log in ? not even the one you created during install ?
[06:47] <ogra> i.e. the admin user
[06:47] <ogra> mezzapazza, on the *client* ?
[06:47] <mezzapazza> ogra yep
[06:47] <ogra> hmm, why ?
[06:47] <bob> ogra, yup, i just get login incorrect
[06:48] <ogra> bob, where do you get that ? there is no such message in ldm (the login manager we use in ltsp)
[06:48] <mezzapazza> ogra hmmm... i want to run linux in cyber cafe, and our users are accustomed to win
[06:48] <mezzapazza> installed kubuntu-desktop metapackage
[06:48] <ogra> mezzapazza, no i mean why do you want to install it in the client ?
[06:49] <bob> it says 'ltsp login', and i type the user and pass, and it just says 'Login incorrect'
[06:49] <bob> it says 'ltsp login' too?
[06:49] <ogra> you usually only use kernel and X on the client, the rest runs on the server
[06:49] <mezzapazza> ogra ah... i didn't installed... just built it..
[06:49] <ogra> bob, do you have a gui at all on the client ?
[06:49] <mezzapazza> but i can't make client run KDE
[06:50] <bob> nope
[06:50] <mezzapazza> even .xinitrc doesn't help :(
[06:50] <ogra> mezzapazza, if you use the ubuntu ltsp implementation, all desktop tasks run on the server ...
[06:51] <ogra> mezzapazza,  sudo update-alternatives --config x-session-manager
[06:51] <ogra> will give you the option to select the system default
[06:51] <ogra> (which ldm will use then)
[06:52] <ogra> bob, your thin client setup is broken ... you should have a gui login
[06:52] <bob> ok
[06:52] <bob> any ideas?
[06:52] <bob> could it just be a shit video card?
[06:52] <ogra> bob, wipe the chroot as i told you above and rebuild the ltsp-client ...
[06:53] <ogra> sorry, i'm in a meeting in #ltsp now
[06:53] <bob> i did...
[06:53] <bob> hmm
[06:53] <bob> ok
[06:54] <bob> thanks for your help btw...
[06:54] <mezzapazza> There is only 1 program which provides x-session-manager
[06:54] <mezzapazza> (/usr/bin/gnome-session). Nothing to configure.
[06:54] <mezzapazza> although i have KDM installed
[06:54] <ogra> hmm, are you sure you installed kubuntu-desktop on the server ?
[06:55] <mezzapazza> no, this is what i did:
[06:55] <mezzapazza> ltsp-build-client  --root /var/ltsp/amd64/  --dist breezy --mirror http://hr.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu --late-packages kubuntu-desktop
[06:56] <ogra> hmm, and your clients boot ?
[06:56] <mezzapazza> yes
[06:57] <ogra> late packages is reserved for the kernel package ...
[06:57] <mezzapazza> hmm
[06:57] <mezzapazza> it boots just fine untill i try to login in X
[06:59] <bob> ogra, would i help if i rebuilt the client with --dist breezy as well?
[07:00] <mezzapazza> well, installing kubuntu-desktop on the server now, will keep asking questions in a few hours
[07:00] <mezzapazza> tnx for help ogra!
[07:06] <ogra> i'll be available after the meeting ...
[07:07] <bob> thats cool, no hurry :)
[07:50] <C-O-L-T> hy there
[07:50] <C-O-L-T> anybody there?
[09:27] <mhz> ogra: ebuntu?
[09:28] <ogra> mhz, yes :( very bad name choice
[09:28] <ogra> but what should we do about that ?
[09:31] <mhz> kill'em all!
[09:31] <ogra> heh+
[09:32] <mhz> well, all 17 y.o. girls :D
[09:32] <ogra> me hates e17
[09:32] <juliux> /me loves gnome
[09:33] <juliux> and since yesterday it is very fast here
[09:36] <ogra> e17 is clearly not among these
[09:36] <ogra> as their devs declare
[09:36] <mhz> ohhh
[09:37] <ogra> there are some statements from rasterman ... "we give a shit on freedesktop ... etc"
[09:37] <mhz> ogra: last week I had the chance to read 'xfce developers' do not use freedesktop standards regarding icons naming
[09:37] <mhz> and did not want to
[09:38] <mhz> fortunately, Daniele Favara, aka nomed in dsslive project, convinced them to follow the standards
[09:38] <ogra> but they stick to most other standards from freedesktop ...
[09:38] <ogra> disagreement is fine ... but refusing collaboration as a whole and reinvent the wheel (even if its shiny) is bad
[09:39] <mhz> ogra: oh, then I agree with you again! :(
[10:00] <signifer123> so is edubuntu switching to another desktop?
[10:00] <ogra> nope
[10:00] <signifer123> :-p
[10:00] <signifer123> good...
[10:09] <bob> hey ogra, you have any thgouhts on why my clients arent booting? shall i rebuild the ltsp client again with some different options?
[10:12] <mhz> bob: not booting? or not logging in?
[10:13] <ogra> bob, what hardware specs have these clients ?
[10:14] <ogra> i suspect you have to less mem to start an X server or a weird graphics card ...
[10:15] <ogra> mhz, the x server doesnt start
[10:17] <mhz> ogra: ok, so they boot, the server has X running BUt the clients ?
[10:18] <ogra> yes, the clients only start in console mode
[10:18] <ogra> i guess they are not >64MB or have a graphics card we dont know about (i suspect the first)
[10:19] <mhz> yah, me too
[10:19] <ogra> (since i cant imagine a unsupported graphics card for our xorg server)
[10:19] <mhz> hehhe
[10:19] <mhz> unles it is from other planet
[10:19] <mhz> are the clients x86 or ppc?
[10:20] <mhz> or arm?
[10:20] <ogra> no idea, but i suspect x86
[10:20] <ogra> bob ?
[10:20] <mhz> maybe he uses xfce and the mouse ate his tongue
[10:21] <mhz> ;p
[10:21] <ogra> thats a xfce feature ?
[10:21] <mhz> lol
[10:21] <mhz> ogra: yes, silent mode
[10:22] <mhz> ohhh, silent fingers
[10:22] <bob> whoops., worry
[10:22] <bob> sorry
[10:23] <bob> i dont really know the hardware specs. what was the command again, lspci?
[10:23] <ogra> free
[10:23] <bob> pretty rubbish i reckon
[10:23] <ogra> to get the amount of memory
[10:23] <ogra> cat /proc/cpuinfo
[10:23] <bob> k ill just boot it
[10:23] <ogra> to get CPU stats
[10:24] <ogra> you need to set a root password in the chroot to be able to log in
[10:24] <ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd
[10:24] <bob> k
[10:24] <mhz> oooh, chrooting
[10:25] <ogra> use root and this password to log in on the client
[10:25] <ogra> (note the first password thats requested is for sudo ... the second one is for the chroot)
[10:25] <bob> oih hang on somehting odd is happening, gonan reboot.
[10:35] <bob> hmm that passwd command just gives an error
[10:35] <bob> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 passwd
[10:35] <ogra> yes
[10:35] <ogra> it first asks for your user password ...
[10:35] <ogra> then offers you to set a root password in the chroot
[10:35] <bob> yeah it just says no such command
[10:36] <bob> 'canot run comamnd 'passwd': no such file or directory
[10:36] <ogra> can you give the exact errormessage ?
[10:37] <bob> ahh hang on, i might have tried to reinstall the client again earlier and it messed up, i thgouht it hadnt done anything, but...
[10:37] <bob> ill rebuild again
[10:37] <bob> shall i use any parameters for the rebuild?
[10:39] <ogra> hmm, be really carfull... if you broek it during build it might mees up the server
[10:39] <ogra> you dont need parameters ...
[10:39] <bob> ok
[10:39] <bob> what was the command again?
[10:40] <ogra> but if /proc is mounted inside the chroot it will break your server ... if you cant unmount /proc there you cant fix it ...
[10:40] <ogra> and if there is no shell in the chroot, you cant chroot to unmount /proc there ... its a chicken egg problem
[10:40] <bob> i think i tried to delete it when it was still kind of doing something, and there was still 2 files tied up
[10:41] <ogra> ouch
[10:41] <bob> problem?
[10:41] <bob> you think i just need a reinstall?
[10:41] <ogra> thats likely a problem that i cant solve ...
[10:41] <bob> hmm
[10:41] <bob> anything thats wortha  try?
[10:42] <ogra> if its meesed up anyway you will need to reinstall ... but in that case it wont break more if you try rebuilding the chroot :)
[10:42] <ogra> sudo ltsp-build-client
[10:43] <ogra> no options
[10:43] <ogra> and wipe /opt/ltsp/i386 first
[10:43] <bob> k
[10:43] <ogra> s/wipe/remove/
[10:43] <bob> ahh its already going, i did rm -fr /opt/ltsp/i386 thoguh?
[10:44] <bob> it sounds like its probably the graphics card thats the issue though
[10:45] <ogra> unlikely  ... i cant imagine a graphics card our xserver doesnt know ....
[10:45] <ogra> i rather suspect the clients have less than 64MB ...
[10:46] <bob> ram? ok
[10:46] <ogra> yes, ram
[10:46] <bob> is that the minimum?
[10:48] <ogra> yes
[10:49] <bob> k
[10:49] <bob> itd be sueful to ahve all the absolute min specs on the wiki :)
[10:49] <bob> unless they already are
[10:49] <ogra> they arent and i cant really tell them for breezy ...
[10:50] <bob> ah ok
[10:50] <ogra> i'll release them for dapper since there i did measuring ...
[10:50] <bob> cool :)
[10:50] <ogra> but dapper will for example support network swap, so the ram can be less ...
[10:50] <ogra> (thats the feature i'm currently working on)
[10:51] <bob> wow
[10:51] <bob> what is your general ubuntu type job then? :)
[10:51] <ogra> hacking on ltsp, caring for the screensaver and maintaining edubuntu
[10:51] <bob> cool
[10:52] <bob> ok its done, shall i try that passwd thing again?
[10:52] <ogra> additionally with some standard ubuntu stuff like random bugfixing etc
[10:52] <ogra> its done ??
[10:52] <bob> ah good stuff. how many people are there working on it?
[10:52] <ogra> you must have a fast connection then ....
[10:52] <bob> 8meg on a good day...
[10:52] <ogra> about 10 full employed for the whole distro ...
[10:53] <ogra> one is completely working on kubuntu as i am on edubuntu
[10:53] <ogra> so that leaves 8 for ubuntu :)
[10:53] <bob> how do you get funding? can you aplpy for grants and stuff?
[10:54] <ogra> i'm paied by canonical Ltd
[10:54] <bob> ok the password has set ok...
[10:54] <ogra> ok, now find out how much ram you have ...
[10:54] <ogra> use the "free" command after login
[10:55] <bob> ah ok, cool, free software is amasing and the fact people can get paid to do it rules...
[10:56] <bob> 123meg it says
[10:56] <ogra> thats plenaty
[10:56] <ogra> *plenty
[10:57] <ogra> cat /proc/cpuinfo
[10:57] <ogra> lets see what kind of cpu you have
[10:57] <bob> amd-k6 3d processor
[10:57] <bob> 501mhz
[10:58] <ogra> wow, thats a good thin client
[10:58] <ogra> ok, now lspci and look for the VGA device
[10:58] <bob> its one of the better boxes
[10:58] <bob> ati mach 64
[10:58] <bob> gx
[10:59] <ogra> hmm ...
[10:59] <ogra> that should be detected
[10:59] <bob> it comes up with the proper boot loader now and it didnt before
[10:59] <ogra> gui ?
[10:59] <bob> nah
[11:00] <ogra> less /etc/X11/xorg.conf and look for the Driver section
[11:00] <ogra> there should be ati or radeon in it
[11:01] <bob> hmm theres a device section but no driver section?
[11:01] <bob> and a section called DRI
[11:05] <ogra> ah, sorry
[11:05] <ogra> i meant Driver
[11:05] <ogra> Section "Device"
[11:05] <ogra>         Identifier      "ATI Technologies, Inc. M11 NV [FireGL Mobility T2e] "
[11:05] <ogra>         Driver          "ati"
[11:05] <ogra>         BusID           "PCI:0:16:0"
[11:05] <ogra>         Option          "UseFBDev"              "true"
[11:05] <ogra> EndSection
[11:05] <ogra> something like that ...
[11:06] <bob> yup
[11:06] <bob> got it
[11:06] <ogra> what does it say ?
[11:06] <ogra> (the driver line)
[11:07] <bob> driver, "ati", busid "pci:0:9:0"
[11:07] <ogra> sounds ok
[11:07] <ogra> hmm ...
[11:07] <ogra> try running startx and see if there is an error
[11:08] <bob> just at the fatal server error: no screens found...
[11:08] <bob> whoops
[11:08] <bob> ignore the just at the
[11:08] <ogra> hmm
[11:08] <bob> you want the rest?
[11:08] <ogra> nope
[11:08] <ogra> thats evil enough :)
[11:08] <bob> something about an error unlocking an authority file too
[11:09] <ogra> what kind of monitors do the clients have ?
[11:09] <bob> umm
[11:09] <bob> quite old
[11:09] <bob> shall i try a differnt monitor?
[11:09] <ogra> yup
[11:09] <bob> k
[11:09] <ogra> i need to change from isdn to dsl, brb
[11:11] <bob> k
[11:17] <bob> wow this is special
[11:17] <bob> i changed the moniutor
[11:17] <bob> ran xserver, and it seemed to freeze up
[11:17] <bob> so i rebooted and now im geting 'kernel panic - not syncing'
[11:18] <ogra> try another boot ...
[11:18] <ogra> that looks like a network issue
[11:19] <bob> k
[11:19] <bob> there is a rogue dhcp server i cant turn off
[11:20] <ogra> ouch
[11:20] <ogra> thats a problem
[11:20] <bob> rubbish router control panel
[11:20] <bob> ah gottit this time
[11:20] <bob> normally the srever wins the dhcp race... wow geek olympics/
[11:25] <bob> hmm it keeps doing it, its well eird this has just started
[11:27] <ogra> its intresting that you could boot at all
[11:27] <ogra> normally it breaks heavily with a second dhcp server
[11:28] <bob> you think that is most likely my problem?
[11:28] <ogra> with booting, yes
[11:28] <bob> (or one of the many)
[11:28] <ogra> not the one with the X server
[11:28] <bob> its really not liking it al all now
[11:28] <bob> hmm
[11:29] <bob> is there any way i can set the clients to only accept dhcp off the server or anything?
[11:29] <ogra> nope
[11:29] <ogra> you cant predict which dhcp server answers first ...
[11:30] <ogra> and you can force it only with a highly complicated setup if you run one of them on a different port ...
[11:30] <bob> arg
[11:30] <ogra> but that would take the whole night to get running
[11:30] <bob> haha
[11:30] <bob> hmm
[11:30] <bob> what a pain
[11:30] <bob> ok ill disconenct t'internet temporarly
[11:30] <bob> brb
[11:35] <bob> something fishy is going on
[11:37] <bob> crc error: ssytem halted?
[11:37] <ogra> huh ?
[11:37] <bob> on boot
[11:37] <bob> something really really odd is going on with this router
[11:38] <bob> arg, sorry about this
[11:38] <bob> its so weird its only just started being an issue
[11:39] <bob> crc error: system halted, this is probably still a network problem yes?
[11:40] <ogra> no idea ... sounds rather like a BIOS problem
[11:40] <ogra> or like it tries to boot from a non existent HD
[11:41] <bob> ook ill have a poke
[11:41] <bob> whod have thoguht changing a monitor could cause so much problem...
[11:41] <mhz> ogra: ever used xmaxima ?
[11:41] <ogra> whats that ?
[11:42] <mhz> it's a mix of math apps
[11:42] <mhz> octave is one of them
[11:42] <mhz> but the gui... sucks so badly that I don't even dare to inculde it as a default edu apps
[11:43] <mhz> I mean, the app is excellent, but its windows... too terrible
[11:43] <bob> ahhh ok. i was plugging it into the main box for power, plugged the monitor in seperately and its fine. psu must be on its last legs
[11:45] <ogra> mhz, what makes you think about including windows apps ?
[11:46] <mhz> ogra: I mean windows as in "the windows you use for your linux apps"
[11:46] <mhz> with the x button at the corner
[11:46] <ogra> heh
[11:46] <mhz> oh, you were kidding??!!
[11:46] <mhz> I see
[11:46] <ogra> :)
[11:46] <mhz> your back is so much better
[11:47] <mhz> OR
[11:47] <mhz> you have no mdz pressure
[11:47] <mhz> hehehe
[11:47] <mhz> OR
[11:48] <mhz> your girlfriend is turning into a geek too
[11:48] <mhz> (that would be nice)
[11:48] <ogra> in fact i'm spending the last 10 mins of my birthday, having a glass of merlot and syncing the live isos for testing
[11:48] <mhz> (but usually means she is not that pretty) :D
[11:49] <ogra> and my DSL is back ....
[11:49] <mhz> ogra: ooh, Happy day of Birth!
[11:49] <ogra> thanks :)
[11:49] <bob> its your birthday??
[11:49] <bob> happy birthday!
[11:49] <mhz> to you ...
[11:49] <ogra> thanks as well bob :)
[11:49] <bob> you should probabyl get off the internet and do something in the real world :)
[11:49] <ogra> it nearly *was* ...
[11:50] <mhz> ogra: I can get you a nice bottle of wine if Mark lets you come here by the end of april
[11:50] <mhz> thers's lot of fine viriety to choose from here
[11:50] <ogra> mhz, lets see ... its very tight with the ubuntu conference ...
[11:50] <mhz> nah
[11:51] <ogra> nah ?
[11:51] <mhz> Jeff Waugh has already agreed to come, So has Daniele Favara
[11:51] <mhz> ogra: not that tight
[11:51] <mhz> LA tour could easily take 10 days to do 4-5 countries
[11:52] <ogra> really ? jdub agreed ?
[11:52] <mhz> plus... with a nice bottle of chilean wine you would definately feel more loose
[11:52] <ogra> cool
[11:52] <ogra> i'd *love* to come ...
[11:52] <mhz> just come
[11:52] <mhz> :)
[11:53] <ogra> heh
[11:53] <ogra> lets see what mark says ... :)
[11:54] <mhz> he'llprobably say yeah, "I'll support from here"
[11:54] <mhz> :)
[11:54] <ogra> its two weeks ago that i talked to him ... he didnt mention anything ... when did you mail him ?
[11:55] <mhz> ogra: but I can't even express how important it is for some LA countries the tour takes place. There's really lots of reasons
[11:55] <bob> right, im not gna bother you any more on your birthday :p have a good one ogra, thanks for your help (yet again...) :)
[11:55] <mhz> ogra: I have emailed him at least 5 mails from 2 weeks ago until monday or tuesday
[11:56] <ogra> bob my bday is over in 4 minutes ... dont worry
[11:56] <ogra> bah
[11:57] <mhz> ogra: and JaneW has been CC'ed every email I sent to Mark
[11:57] <ogra> mhz, i'll talk to him once he's back
[11:57] <mhz> please
[11:59] <mhz_cook> ogra: thx
[11:59] <ogra> :)
[12:03] <mhz_cook> ogra: and about higher end-users (university opnes or science highschool), xmaxima is the fines reference in linux
[12:04] <mhz_cook> it is just its front end or gui that looks crappy for 2006 users
[12:04] <mhz_cook> very much like default emacs
[12:04] <mhz_cook> maybe worst
[12:04] <ogra> shudder
[12:04] <mhz_cook> shudder?


[00:38] <`6og> bind9 is run on systems which suspend??
[00:39] <Deeps> run a local caching dns server
[00:39] <Deeps> reduce your internet traffic marginally
[00:40]  * `6og is using dnsmasq for that - seems a better fit for the job
[00:40] <`6og> its a laptop after all :) bind == cputime++
[00:53]  * Deeps shrugs
[01:02] <lox_> hi
[01:03] <lox_> I have created a VM using vmbuilder
[01:03] <lox_> how do I launch it? it does not appear using virsh list
[01:07] <lox_> seems it is dead over here.... is there a special time when we can get some help ?
[01:13] <sommer> lox_: vursh start vmname
[01:14] <sommer> lox_: usually during business hours in north america and europe the channel is most active
[01:14] <ivoks> lox_: except when we are at UDS :)
[01:14] <sommer> err virsh start vmname
[02:00] <lox_> sommer: thks but virsh list returns nothing
[02:00] <lox_> anyway I managed to add it doing: virsh virsh
[02:01] <lox_> virsh create /etc/libvirt/qemu/ubuntu.xml
[02:02] <lox_> ping <IP_ADDRESS>
[02:02] <lox_> oops
[02:03] <lox_> ls
[02:15] <lox_> please anyone here taht can answer questions about vmbuilder?
[02:25] <ScottK> !ask | lox_
[02:26] <lox_> Using vmbuilder do I have to create a bridge interface mannually for each VM? Or vmbuilder should do it? thks
[02:27] <lox_> (sorry new to trc)
[05:06] <kees> lox_: i have, in the past manually adjusted settings to get bridging. soren may know more but probably afk for the evening.
[05:38] <lox_> kees: well I don't really un derstand how bridge do work.... if I follow https://help.ubuntu.com/8.10/serverguide/C/network-configuration.html#bridging my eth0 is not configured anymore. Does a bridge can be use by multiple VM?
[05:43] <kees> lox_: yes, but you need to configure the bridge first
[05:45] <lox_> kees: so having a look to https://help.ubuntu.com/8.10/serverguide/C/network-configuration.html#bridging i need to delete from /etc/network/interface the eth0 config and replace it with br0 config using eth0 "past" ip config?
[05:48] <kees> lox_: yes, that guide looks correct
[05:49] <lox_> kees: ok, and do you know where is that vnet0 that ifconfig shows please?
[05:50] <kees> I just ignore vnet0 -- libvirt will do the right thing once it's been configured to use br0
[05:51] <hads> You can remove it
[06:02] <lox_> Remove it from where? ....
[06:20] <lox_> hads well vnet0 is default libvirt bridge interface, this is only for NAT connectivity, no way/need to remove it
[06:28] <d-b> hi there why is a closed source piece of software shown to me with the motd ?
[06:28] <d-b> yes the landscape client is open source. but the server isn't
[06:29] <d-b> doesn't this go against ubuntu policy ?
[06:31] <hads> lox_: Yes, you can remove it.
[06:32] <lox_> hads: are you talking about "virsh net-destroy default" ?
[06:32] <hads> I've not done it from virsh, I have from VMM though.
[06:35] <Severian> Howdy.  I want to make a Ubuntu Server installed system run gnome on startup.  I have been searching the web for what to do, and have not found instructions for 8.10(intrepid ibex).  Any suggestions?
[06:37] <d-b> Severian: sudo apt-get install gdm and xserver etc.
[06:38] <zoopster> Severian: you are better off running ubuntu desktop as a server than trying to install the gui parts
[06:38] <hads> ubuntu-desktop will install everything
[06:38] <Severian> http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-186298.html  says I needed to run two more commands after installing, but they did not work on 7.10 and later.
[06:39] <lox_> hads: can you tell me how please ? what is VMM ...
[06:40] <hads> lox_: Virtual Machine Manager, the GUI which connects to your server via SSH. There will be a virsh command that does the same thing.
[06:43] <Severian> zoopster, vmbuilder builds virtual machines off of what is essentially JeOS.  I am not installing the OS an hardware, but creating scripts to build virtual machines.  vmbuilder is shipped with Ubuntu, and I am using the installed version.
[06:44] <zoopster> Severian: so you want to add x to that?
[06:45] <Severian> zoopster, yes.  I want to build a VM to use for software demos.
[06:48] <Severian> Well nevermind.  the instructions at http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-186298.html say there is a problem after 7.04, but it is pretty minor.  Thank you.
[06:49] <zoopster> Severian: the problem is that ubuntu-desktop installs a lot more than just gdm and xserver - good luck
[06:52] <lox_> hads: still have trouble setting my virtual machine network, my server ip is <IP_ADDRESS>, I would like my VMs ip in the range <IP_ADDRESS> to <IP_ADDRESS>, any advices? Here is my interfaces file: http://paste2.org/p/113535. With that config my VM takes the <IP_ADDRESS> ip ....
[08:04] <Scare|Working> Hi all
[08:17] <nme> anyone knows how to get rid of "CRON...: Sigfile not found" from /var/log/syslog ?
[10:02] <lox_> I always trace a log file with tail -f /var/log/mylog.log. I would like that it runs on a console a each system reboot, by "on a console" I means so I can see it if I Alt+F2
[10:02] <lox_> Is it possible?
[10:10] <Oliber> think you can do it with inittab
[10:10] <Oliber> but i havn't done that in years
[10:32] <_ruben> or just have syslog log to a tty, assuming its a log used by syslog
[10:33] <Oliber> oh yeah, thats how i did it 9yrs ago!
[10:39] <lox_> thks I'll continue to search
[10:39] <lox_> done it many years a go to and can't remmeber how ..
[11:07] <incidence> How to find out filesystems block size?
[11:27] <Scare|Working> incidence,  dumpe2fs device. but you can use it only if you have an ext2 o ext3 filesystem
[11:29] <maswan> xfs has xfs_info, I'm sure all the sane fss have some kind of util for that
[11:29] <maswan> actually, hm, if you want a general method, the block size is available in statvfs
[11:52] <AlexC_> hey all
[11:53] <AlexC_> is there a way to read what email was sent via Postfix? I just saw in my logs a weird email, sent by one of my address (a noreply@ one) to a weird email address. I'd like to read that and see just what it was, because I am confused as to where it was sent
[12:04] <hypnus9> ! server crash
[12:04] <hypnus9> !server access
[12:27] <lamont> AlexC_: once the mail is gone from the server, reading it is a matter of finding where it was stored on disk and looking there for what's left of it.
[12:27] <lamont> if it's still on the server, postcat is your friend
[12:27] <AlexC_> lamont, hum, I've really no idea how to go about finding it. I'll check postcat now, though do you have time to poke me further in the right direction?
[12:31] <AlexC_> lamont, I would have thought a copy would be in the 'Sent' mail dir (or where ever) in the users Maildir directory. Though I can't see any Sent email when using Mutt
[12:36] <hypnus9> Hello room. I just install Intrepid server edition on my desktop pc, and I had it accessible from my laptop, but I rebooted the server, and now I can't access it from my laptop. Any help?
[12:37] <Deeps> can you ping it?
[12:37] <hypnus9> Yep.
[12:37] <lamont> AlexC_: mutt is a mail user agent.  mail transport agents keep only logging records
[12:37] <Deeps> in what way were you 'accessing' the server?
[12:37] <hypnus9> SSH and samba
[12:37] <Deeps> you can ping the server, but you're unable to ssh anymore? what error do you get when attempting to ssh?
[12:37] <AlexC_> lamont, hum, ok. So what is meant by 'Copying to Sent Folder' in Thunderbird, when using IMAP when I sent email - where is that data stored? Locally?
[12:38] <hypnus9> Hold on.
[12:38] <lamont> thunderbird is a mail user agent as well
[12:38] <lamont> and it's probably in the "Sent" folder on the imap server
[12:38] <lamont> (and none of that is "postfix" related)
[12:39] <hypnus9> I get "timed out when logging in
[12:39] <AlexC_> lamont, I know it's a user agent - I'm just wondering if this 'Sent' folder is a feature of the MUA, or is what postfix does when an email is sent
[12:39] <lamont> MUA only
[12:39] <lamont> MTAs take the mail, pass it along, log it, and remove the copy they have on disk once the next hop says it has it.
[12:39] <AlexC_> bugger. Is there no way to get hold of what that email was?
[12:40] <AlexC_> if not, is there a way to trace what process could have triggered postfix to send that email?
[12:40] <lamont> tct - Forensics related utilities.
[12:40] <lamont> if you have process accounting turned on (unlikely, I think), then quite possibly
[12:40] <AlexC_> =(
[12:41] <lamont> what does /var/log/account have in it?  lots of pacct* files?
[12:41] <Deeps> hypnus9: is the sshd running on the server? `ps ax|grep sshd` on the server console should tell you
[12:41] <AlexC_> lamont, I've no such directory
[12:41] <lamont> likewise, do the postfix logs say that it was local, or received via smtp?
[12:41] <AlexC_> lamont, let me see
[12:41] <hypnus9> I check it out.
[12:41] <lamont> (so no process accounting)
[12:43] <AlexC_> lamont, http://paste2.org/p/113659
[12:43] <hypnus9> it looks to be.
[12:43] <lamont> connect from foobar[foobar] <-- so that, whatever it really was, is where the mail came froim
[12:44] <Deeps> hypnus9: are you sure you're connecting to the right ip? `ifconfig` on the server will tell you what ips it's assigned
[12:45] <AlexC_> lamont, indeed, which is very odd - since nothing should be sending email from noreply, and the things that do - don't email to that weird .ru address
[12:46] <lamont> AlexC_: and without the actual headers (I assume you trashed them?), there's not much more that can be said
[12:46] <AlexC_> lamont, I've not touched any headers
[12:46] <lamont> ah, ok
[12:46] <lamont> I assumed the 'foobar' comments were changed IP/hostname ish stuff
[12:46] <AlexC_> lamont, correct
[12:47] <lamont> that would be "trashed"
[12:47] <lamont> as in, yes, you touched the headers
[12:47] <AlexC_> lamont, hum, I just change them in the pastebin to remove them =)
[12:47] <lamont> thereby removing the information required to be able to do any further advising about what actually happened.  ok
[12:48] <AlexC_> lamont, are you saying, you need the Ip/hostname that I removed to help further? The values are there, I only changed it in Pastebin so they are not in a public pastebin
[12:49] <Deeps> 9 lines later...
[12:53] <lamont> AlexC_: either it's <IP_ADDRESS> and the mail originated there, or it's not <IP_ADDRESS> and that host delivered mail (which either means it was one of your TLS users, or you have really poor SASL password, or some such
[12:56] <AlexC_> lamont, the values were the main external IP of the server. The login was by a known users of mine ... I guess I'll just have to check all the logs I can
[12:58] <lamont> ok.  the mail arrived externally from that IP, and that computer is the one which you need to be looking at to find the origin of the mail
[13:00] <AlexC_> that is this computer
[13:00] <AlexC_> it's ok, I may be able to poke some of my application logs to see where the devil it came from
[13:58] <kraut> moin
[14:07] <kebomix> Free Programming e-books With Direct Links & Request ebooks Here : http://request-ebooks.blogspot.com/
[15:18] <Faust-C> after upgrading to 8.10 my system upon reboot gives file system is read only
[15:18] <Faust-C> and i have to manually make it r/w
[15:23] <zoopster> Faust-C: what hardware?
[15:24] <Faust-C> typical desktop system
[15:24] <Faust-C> zoopster, issue is really a desktop one but #ubuntu is worthless for real help
[15:25] <zoopster> Faust-C: understood, was curious simply because there is a kernel issue with ath9k and the 2.27.9 kernels that presents itself strongly on a macbook pro, but is present in other systems that shows a symptom like you describe, but usually not directly after reboot
[15:26] <Faust-C> ic, no we dont have that
[15:27] <Faust-C> hmm man idk wth happend
[15:27] <zoopster> Faust-C: without a lot more detail, not sure anyone can help - this channel may not be the proper forum...I would post to ubuntuforums.org as well as search there and generally in google
[15:27] <Faust-C> zoopster, yeah im gathering more info
[15:29] <zoopster> Faust-C: for the forums useful info is hardware detail, dmesg output, etc
[15:29] <Faust-C> zoopster, problem is that we cant even login to system to get that
[15:31] <zoopster> Faust-C: no way to open a terminal session after boot?
[15:38] <Faust-C> zoopster, nope
[15:38] <Faust-C> but im bootinhg to live gonna see what i can do
[15:39] <zoopster> Faust-C: that was the next suggestion...see if you can mount the disk - even if the disk is RO you can read from it
[15:39] <Faust-C> yeah
[15:39] <Faust-C> gonna see what the real issues are
[16:12] <Faust-C> init: tty2 main process (4063) killed by SEGV signal
[16:12] <Faust-C> init: tty2 main process ended, respawning
[16:13] <Faust-C> thats the error i get if i try to login via console
[16:55] <lionel> is someone experimenting issues with check_ntp_time since the beginning of december?
[16:56] <lionel> (with leep seconds not beeing handeled correctly)
[17:05] <Faust-C> why in the hell does the IP address keep going to dhcp
[17:20] <Faust-C> can someone please explain why server keeps using dhcp for inet even when ive specified a IP in /etc/network/interfaces
[17:23] <sommer> Faust-C: did you set the interface to static?
[17:23] <Faust-C> yep
[17:23] <Faust-C> iface eth0 inet static
[17:25] <sommer> Faust-C: do you have
[17:25] <sommer> dhcdbd running?
[17:25]  * Faust-C looks
[17:26] <Faust-C> ah dhclient3 is running
[17:27] <sommer> you should be able to turn that off
[17:28] <Faust-C> hmm ill look for the file to disbale it
[17:29] <sommer> Faust-C: if there's an init script you can do: sudo update-rc.d -f service_name remove
[17:29] <sommer> Faust-C: that should not start the daemon on boot
[17:29] <Faust-C> yeah i dont see a init script
[17:29] <Faust-C> nor a option to stop it via cmd
[17:32] <ivoks> if you installed system with dhcp address
[17:32] <ivoks> then on boot dhclient will start
[17:32] <ivoks> even if you change network configuration, dhclient will still be running
[17:32] <ivoks> so, best cure is to kill dhclient or restart machine after network configuration change
[17:32] <ivoks> we might consider this as a bug
[17:32] <ivoks> er....
[17:32] <ivoks> we should consider this as a bug
[17:33] <Faust-C> ivoks, oic
[17:33] <Faust-C> guess ill report it
[17:33] <Faust-C> where is bug report site
[17:33] <ivoks> lanuchpad.net
[17:33] <Deeps> launchpad*
[17:33] <ivoks> you don't have to report it
[17:34] <ivoks> i plan bringing this up on uds tomorrow
[17:35] <Faust-C> ivoks, oic sweett
[17:57] <refnumzx> have an ml350 G5 with the e200I controler, write performance is bad but my main problem is hat using 8.10 server i can not get the system to boot properly install goes fine but then when it is time for the cd to come out and we reboot says atempting to boot from drive c: any ideas?
[18:00] <ivoks> what's e200i?
[18:01] <Nafallo> ivoks: controllercard.
[18:01] <ivoks> ah, hardware raid
[18:02] <ivoks> have you setup raid logical volume before installation?
[18:05] <ivoks> refnumzx: ?
[18:05] <refnumzx> yes i have using the hp tools
[18:06] <refnumzx> the instaler recognizes it as an array so its fine
[18:06] <ivoks> what kind of array?
[18:06] <ivoks> 0 1 5 6?
[18:07] <ivoks> if you want me to help you, i'll have to understand what you are trying to achive
[18:07] <ivoks> otherwise, we'll spend hours for nothing
[18:09] <ivoks> do you have disks outside the array?
[18:09] <ivoks> either on controller or some other port (IDE/SATA/SCSI)
[18:10] <refnumzx> its a raid5 array with 4 SAS disk directly connect to the backpln  when i start the instaler the ubuntu system formats and recognizes the drives, what i want is for when the instaler finishes i want it to reboot and load the os. everythingelse during the instal is successful
[18:11] <refnumzx> no i do not
[18:11] <ivoks> so, before restart, inside ubuntu installer, you get 'atempting to boot from drive c:'?
[18:11] <ivoks> or after reboot?
[18:12] <refnumzx> no, after reboot.
[18:12] <ivoks> ok
[18:12] <refnumzx> grub does not even seem to load
[18:12] <ivoks> have you checked bios?
[18:12] <refnumzx> the installer completel finishes what it is supposed to do
[18:12] <genii> And it specifically says C:     ?
[18:12] <ivoks> did you set up raid controller as a first boot device?
[18:12] <refnumzx> i have updated the bios, firmware updated to latest, controler order is just fine. etc
[18:13] <refnumzx> it specifically says C:
[18:13] <ivoks> i see
[18:14] <refnumzx> well, it tries to boot from the cd then the disk, i assume because it does nothing accept for show that message
[18:15] <ivoks> did you set up your own partitions or system camed with at least one partition?
[18:15] <refnumzx> the controller is the only boot device.
[18:15] <refnumzx> i used guided, use entire disk
[18:15] <ivoks> hm, ok
[18:15] <ivoks> you have a ubuntu cd, right?
[18:15] <genii> You need raid support in the initrd for it to boot from there. But grub should have a tleast tried, I would think
[18:15] <ivoks> it should have 'boot from first cd'
[18:15] <refnumzx> yeah no grub anything
[18:16] <ivoks> genii: system doesn't boot from disk at all
[18:16] <ivoks> boot from first disk, not cd :)
[18:16] <refnumzx> the system boots the instal media and goes through the instaler just fine
[18:16] <refnumzx> when i rebot, i remove the install media
[18:16] <ivoks> refnumzx: put the cd in
[18:16] <ivoks> refnumzx: and don't start installer, choose 'Boot from first disk' option
[18:17] <refnumzx> the server is rather far away. then what?
[18:17] <ivoks> if it boots, then you bios is broken
[18:17] <refnumzx> ok. i will brb
[18:17] <ivoks> it it doesn't, which i doubt, then you'll tell us what message you get
[18:23] <refnumzx> absolutely nothing
[18:23] <refnumzx> booting from local disk.
[18:24] <ivoks> and blank?
[18:25] <ivoks> if it's blank, then grub might not be installed on disk
[18:25] <ivoks> how big is your raid logic volume?
[18:26] <refnumzx> 400gb or so
[18:26] <refnumzx> and blank, yes
[18:26] <ivoks> hm, odd
[18:26] <refnumzx> quite
[18:26] <refnumzx> during the installer it does say installing grub and produces no errors
[18:27] <ivoks> did building of logic volume finished?
[18:29] <refnumzx> here is the thing the raid is configured thtough the hp tols. during the installer it asks me if i want to recognize the device as a raid configuration, i answer yes, then i go off and format the single logical volume which is the correct size, and then i continue with the instal as normal
[18:29] <ivoks> and, in ubuntu, you see only one disk or more of them?
[18:30] <refnumzx> a single disk
[18:30] <refnumzx> which is what i am supposed to see
[18:30] <ivoks> right
[18:32] <ivoks> anything that comes to my mind is that logic volume isn't built, and mbr isn't formed yet
[18:32] <ivoks> which i've seen with low cost raid controlers
[18:32] <ivoks> never with 3ware :/
[18:32] <refnumzx> ok. so how couold that be if it formats the disk?
[18:33] <ivoks> dunno
[18:33] <refnumzx> thanks for the help though, we tried.
[18:33] <ivoks> could you start resuce option
[18:33] <refnumzx> gonna have to call hp, again.
[18:34] <ivoks> when you start it, you should be able to chroot to your partition
[18:34] <refnumzx> never tried that. isn't that available from the grub menu? this is the thing man grub is not loading
[18:34] <ivoks> then you should mount all
[18:34] <ivoks> you can enter resuce from installation CD
[18:34] <refnumzx> ok. then what croot what? mount all. and then....???
[18:34] <ivoks> it's an option above boot from first disk
[18:35] <ivoks> you'll be guided
[18:35] <ivoks> then, when you get droped in chrooted shell
[18:35] <ivoks> run grub-install /dev/sda
[18:35] <ivoks> or whatever it's name is
[18:35] <ivoks> maybe /dev/cciss/something
[18:36] <refnumzx> /dev/cciss is how its shown in the installer
[18:36] <ivoks> right
[18:36] <ivoks> it isn't cciss
[18:36] <ivoks> but /dev/cciss/c0d0 or something like that
[18:37] <refnumzx> right
[18:37] <refnumzx> i'll give it a whirl
[18:38] <ivoks> go go go :)
[18:54] <jcliff> I have a farm of about 800 servers about to be running ubuntu, is there some way of making sure they each get their ubuntu security updates/etc without sshing into each one
[18:54] <jcliff> pssh looks better than mannually sshing in but there's got to be better out there right?
[18:55] <yann2> same question here :)
[18:55] <jcliff> yann2: serious? lol
[18:55] <yann2> can have a look at puppet
[18:55] <yann2> but the thing is usually people use to say, " you dont want to automate apt upgrade"
[18:55] <genii> No one makes cronjobs for updates or so?
[18:55] <jcliff> maybe
[18:55] <yann2> considered harmful afaik :(
[18:55] <maswan> We use our own version of pssh
[18:56] <maswan> But yeah, that's how we do it. You just need to take care and make a wrapper script that works as hard as possible to make it run without interacting with the user.
[18:58] <maswan> Good env to set: DEBCONF_ADMIN_EMAIL= DEBIAN_FRONTEND=noninteractive
[18:58] <jcliff> yann2: as in automating security upgrades considered harmful or cronjobs considered harmful?
[18:58] <maswan> etc
[18:59] <yann2> jcliff > automating...
[18:59] <yann2> you know
[18:59] <maswan> jcliff: automating security upgrades isn't really considered harmful as such, but at least I'd prefer to apply them first to one of the servers before rolling them out everywher
[19:00] <yann2> "blah wants to install a new config file but it seems you have changed the original file - do you want to keep your old personnalized (incompatible) file? (Y)
[19:00] <ivoks> there are unanttened updates
[19:01] <refnumzx> right so reinstaling grub fixed the booting issue
[19:01] <refnumzx> so. is that an error in the installer?
[19:04] <ivoks> refnumzx: don't think so
[19:04] <ivoks> refnumzx: you installed grub on logical volume
[19:05] <ivoks> refnumzx: some raid controllers have an option of defining a boot volume
[19:09] <jcliff> maswan: thanks
[19:09] <refnumzx> boot volume
[19:09] <refnumzx> so what is the difference? wouldn't it go on the logical volume, is not that the corect way?
[19:10] <ivoks> i don't know, i don't know internals of all raid controllers
[19:11] <ivoks> maybe if you don't set up boot flag on logic volume, maybe controllers ignores it
[19:14] <ivoks> refnumzx: bottom line is that grub is installed on logical volume
[19:14] <ivoks> refnumzx: but, for some reason, controller doesn't boot from it
[19:15] <ivoks> refnumzx: oh, sorry
[19:15] <ivoks> refnumzx: i just saw that reinstalling the grub *fixed* the problem
[19:15] <ivoks> refnumzx: i tought it didn't :)
[19:15] <ivoks> refnumzx: yes, that's a installer bug
[19:18] <ivoks> refnumzx: could you send me /var/log/installer/syslog?
[19:37] <jcliff> maswan: oh absolutely.
[19:38] <jcliff> I've never had anywhere near this many computers to deal with in one go though :)
[19:46] <jcliff> yann2: thanks btw
[19:47] <yann2> np
[19:51] <mibocote> I have two gateways setup for <IP_ADDRESS>, but I only want one of them. how do I delete the other one from handling dest: <IP_ADDRESS>?
[20:06] <dejuren> sommer: ping
[20:08] <sommer> dejuren: yo
[20:09] <dejuren> sommer: question: who write ubuntu server guide? specially e-mail https://help.ubuntu.com/8.04/serverguide/C/email-services.html
[20:10] <sommer> dejuren: I've written a lot of that chapter, but some sections only updated
[20:11] <sommer> dejuren: did you have a question about a specific section?
[20:11] <dejuren> sommer: cause I'm looking for /etc/postfix/main.cf, /etc/postfix/master.cf, and /etc/dovecot/dovecot.conf examples. Can you help? Mean only default configuration.
[20:12] <sommer> dejuren: the default files are pretty good for a "standard" install.
[20:13] <sommer> dejuren: what are you trying to accomplish with your mail server?  ie, receive mail from internet, only forward mail to internet, etc
[20:16] <dejuren> sommer: receive mail from internet and send mail to internet and internaly in a small local network
[20:17] <sommer> dejuren: the serverguide should help you do that, I'd basically follow the postfix and dovecot sections
[20:17] <sommer> dejuren: then if you want to add spam, virus, etc filtering later work through the mail filtering section
[20:18] <sommer> dejuren: and when you run into trouble or have a specific question feel free to ask
[20:18] <dejuren> sommer: ok, will work on it. tks.
[20:19] <sommer> dejuren: you're welcome
[21:59] <donspaulding> I'm having some troubles setting up Samba+LDAP,  smbldap-populate is saying... "failed to add entry: modifications require authentication at /usr/sbin/smbldap-populate line 499, <GEN1> line 234."
[22:01] <donspaulding> I'm not sure why it's giving me this particular error.  I've got the username/password setup in /etc/smbldap-tools/smbldap_bind.conf
[22:10] <donspaulding> ah, nevermind, my DN wasn't fully qualified (i.e. "admin" instead of "admin,dc=mydomain,dc=local"
[22:10] <donspaulding> in smbldap.conf
[22:40] <agampher> Hello. I am trying to get a startup script to run at startup (crazy, I know), and it requires me to have the JRE_HOME environment variable defined to run it. It seems I am only successful at running the script at all if I sudo -s first. Any ideas on how to proceed?
[22:41] <agampher> i suppose i should reword that to say run a startup script at boot
[22:42] <`6og> init scripts are executed as root anyway
[22:43] <`6og> but in answer to your question, `export JRE_HOME=/path/goes/here/`
[22:43] <agampher> which i did, but using the sudo command to run the script causes is to fail
[22:43] <agampher> i have to sudo -s, then run the command as root
[22:45] <agampher> so if scripts are run as root at bootup, what is the best way (best practice) to include an application startup script in the mix?
[22:46] <agampher> pardon my noobishness
[22:51] <agampher> ok, heres what i did and it worked, tell me if it's bad practice
[22:53] <agampher> i created a file in the init.d folder with a line that defines the environment variable and then a line that initiates the application startup script
[22:53] <jmedina> agampher: using sudo -s it doesnt import all the env vars from root user
[22:53] <jmedina> why not start it with a rc script?
[22:53] <agampher> then i added to startu pwith sudo update-rc.d <name of script> start 51 S .
[22:54] <jmedina> agampher: that is the usual wey in ubuntu
[22:54] <agampher> k
[22:55] <agampher> just checking to see if that was best, thanks for your help
[23:25] <tonyyarusso> I'm having a bit of trouble with hostname lookups on my home network.  'ping <machinename>' gives "unknown host", but 'ping <machinename>.local' works fine.
[23:26] <jmedina> tonyyarusso: add local to your resolv.conf
[23:26] <jmedina> the line is "search local" without quites
[23:26] <jmedina> quotes
[23:26] <tonyyarusso> jmedina: I have that already, but it doesn't seem to be working.
[23:30] <tonyyarusso> jmedina: FWIW, the router is running DD-WRT
[23:33] <tonyyarusso> jmedina: Meanwhile on the router, the resolv.conf also has "search local", but it is the second search line - the first is "search hsd1.mn.comcast.net." (with the trailing period)
[23:34] <jmedina> I think you can only have 1 search line
[23:34] <jmedina> but you can use something like search local hds...
[23:34] <`6og> trailing . is ok. you might want to put search local above the other.
[23:42] <tonyyarusso> Okay, I got rid of the comcast line altogether, and I still have the same behavior.
[23:43] <`6og> do you have network mangler installed?
[23:43] <tonyyarusso> On the clients, yes.
[23:44] <tonyyarusso> not the router, obviously
[23:46] <donspaulding> can I use debootstrap to return a server to its original state?  after a fresh install?
[23:47] <donspaulding> how can I take a running server and lose all of its settings/installed packages? (keeping /etc/network/interfaces and .ssh/authorized_keys would be bonus, but isn't critical)
[23:48] <`6og> you save those files and reinstall. (i'm not aware of another method)
[23:51]  * jmedina thinks donspaulding wants something like MS system restore :D
[23:52] <tonyyarusso> `6og: what effect does N-M have on this?
[23:52] <donspaulding> jmedina: yes, that's it!  How can I install System Restore on my server?
[23:53] <`6og> tonyyarusso: the .local made me wonder. i'm also wondering if the wrt is eating the mdns data
[23:53]  * donspaulding is only kidding....
[23:53] <tonyyarusso> `6og: what should be my next step for diagnosis?  Disconnect the router and just work on the switch for a bit?
[23:54] <tonyyarusso> .local appears to be from avahi afaik
[23:54] <`6og> yes, its an avahi thing
[23:55] <jmedina> tonyyarusso: do you have a local dns?
[23:55] <jmedina> the .local domain on the router?
[23:57] <tonyyarusso> jmedina: The router can do DNS, yes.  Uses DNSmasq.
[23:58] <jmedina> tonyyarusso: why dont you send the search option via DHCP?
[23:59] <tonyyarusso> jmedina: It is - and it's sending 'local' for that too.


[13:40] <profus2> hi everybody
[13:40] <profus2> first time user of launchpad translator
[13:41] <profus2> could somebody help me out
[13:41] <profus2> what i am supposed to do after finishing translation
[13:41] <profus2> download translation and save it in a *.po file
[13:41] <profus2> ?
[13:41] <profus2> and after that upload po file to the project?
[14:04] <profus2> can someboy help me out or point me in the right direction?
[16:24] <nik90> profus2: I dont know much, but you just need to fill in the translation and just press the "save and continue" at the bottom. The app developer will be able to either import the po files himself or let launchpad merge it into his trunk automatically.
[16:25] <nik90> profus2: as a translator, you shouldn't have to worry about download the po file and uploading it. That's the app dev's job of ensuring it is merged into his trunk branch.
[16:27] <profus2> @nik: i was so entrenched in doing the translations, did not see your reply
[16:28] <profus2> after finishing I clicked on "download translation" and recieive a po file via email
[16:28] <profus2> out of curiosity i installed a po-editor and had a look at it
[16:29] <profus2> the editor gave me some more insights such as missing strings which seemed not to have been saved to the translation file
[16:30] <profus2> software is cross platform and called poedit
[16:31] <profus2> the nicest feature it had, was the ability to compare my translation to "machine translation" and to translation of others
[16:32] <profus2> which led me to to an update on several on my translations
[16:32] <nik90> profus2: I got to run, but it is not necessary to download the po afaik..may be someone might be able.
[16:33] <nik90> Happy translating ;)
[16:33] <profus2> after saving the po file i uploaded it
[16:33] <profus2> @nik90: anyway thanks for replying and trying to help me out