[06:53] <fnordahl> err, I made an mistake with the upload of the package ovn 23.09.0-1~fnordahl0 to mantic-proposed. It was destined for an PPA, my apologies. It's contents are all good though, and I'll follow up with an import request from Debian following proper procedures on the back of ffe bug 2032605 later today.
[06:53] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Bug 2032605 in ovn (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Update OVN to new 23.09.0 upstream version" [High, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2032605
[08:06] <fossfreedom_> Hi release team - I've been looking at the QA ISO tracker but can't figure out how to add in our (Ubuntu Budgie) legacy ISO to the tracker to complement the main new installer ISO for the upcoming beta.  Please can this be done for us?  TIA
[15:34] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: libfprint (jammy-proposed/main) [1:1.94.3+tod1-0ubuntu2~22.04.04 => 1:1.94.3+tod1-0ubuntu2~22.04.06] (ubuntu-desktop)
[15:50] <seb128> Hey there, could someone promote https://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/pending/ to current?
[15:51] <seb128> The CI job is failing because utah needs to be taught how to repack the initrd properly with linux 6.5 where the drivers got moved from main to early3
[15:51] <seb128> I manually verified the ISO and it's working
[16:00] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: snapd (jammy-proposed/main) [2.58+22.04.1 => 2.60.4+23.10] (desktop-core, ubuntu-server)
[16:43] -queuebot:#ubuntu-release- Unapproved: rejected ubuntucinnamon-meta [source] (lunar-proposed) [23.10]
[16:43] <bdmurray> vorlon: Do you know how to manually promote an image to current?
[16:51] <bdmurray> fossfreedom_: Should the test cases for the Ubuntu Budgie legacy and new installer be the same?
[16:51] <bdmurray> fossfreedom_: Also could you provide me the download links for the new and legacy images?
[16:53] <fossfreedom_> bdmurray: that was my next task to review what ubuntu is using  and see if they are applicable. Highly likely since the installer is very closely aligned.
[16:54] <fossfreedom_> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-budgie/daily-live/current/ and http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-budgie/daily-legacy/current/
[16:57] <bdmurray> fossfreedom_: Okay, AIUI you'll review the Ubuntu new installer test cases and let us (the QA team) know which are the correct tests to associate with the new Budgie installer. I'll try to just rename the existing one legacy then and add a new product for daily-live.
[17:15] <vorlon> bdmurray: bin/mark-current, I believe?
[17:24] <bdmurray> ack I'll have a look at that
[17:55] <bdmurray> seb128: mark-current -p ubuntu -s mantic -t desktop -a amd64 20230918: success
[17:57] <vorlon> ginggs, bdmurray: LP: #2013236 was targeted to 23.10 beta back in May, but doesn't otherwise seem to have gotten a committment from anyone to fix it...
[17:57] -ubottu:#ubuntu-release- Launchpad bug 2013236 in ubuntu-drivers-common (Ubuntu Mantic) "b43 driver conflicts with bcmwl driver for some Broadcom devices" [Undecided, Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2013236
[17:58] <vorlon> it's not clear anyone owns this
[18:03] <bdmurray> I targetted some things so we wouldn't lose track of them. Should we check with xnox about this specific bug?
[18:07] <vorlon> sounds like a good next step
[18:07] <Eickmeyer> bdmurray: Thanks for the reject on ubuntucinnamon-meta. That was an oops.
[18:21] <seb128> bdmurray, thanks!
[18:58] <fossfreedom_> bdmurray: and the qa team. Re the iso qa tracker tests for UB. Looks like ubuntus tests are WIP. For the moment please can our tests be same as in mantic ubuntu desktop section except for the two TPM tests. And run once of the canary no network test. Thx
[22:55] <xnox> bdmurray: context++?
[22:55] <xnox> ah
[22:55] <xnox> that
[22:55] <xnox> yes, it was on my mind that we should fix it all up
[23:01] <bdmurray> xnox: For Mantic or for Nanimal?
[23:06] <xnox> bdmurray: commented on the bug report
[23:06] <xnox> bdmurray: i thought everything was already fixed in lunar! so yes, if we can figure out what is missing i want to improve things in Mantic too
[23:08] <xnox> bdmurray: vorlon: i think in kernel team we have a bunch of "kernel freeze exceptions" to file. how is it best to do it? discourse post? lots of bug reports? ubuntu-release mailing list?
[23:09] <xnox> is it, or is not delegated to the kernel team to handle?
[23:09] <xnox> i have tried to gather a shortlist of things we know about that missed the deadline.
[23:09] <xnox> and it is not short
[23:09] <xnox> it's more of a mediumlist
[23:24] <vorlon> xnox: freeze exception requests should be bugs with ubuntu-release subscribed to them
[23:25] <vorlon> xnox what's going on with 'linux-modules-nvidia-390-lowlatency-hwe-20.04-edge'? https://ubuntu-archive-team.ubuntu.com/proposed-migration/mantic_uninst.txt


[00:54] <spO> is some special action needed if i installed a 2.6.30 kernel on a 2.6.28 system ?
[00:55] <dtchen> no, why?
[00:56] <spO> my system is not loading
[00:56] <spO> i guess it is because of my video card driver then
[00:56] <spO> ie, it is not installed correctly
[00:57] <spO> is there a way to go into console rather than desktop mode     at booting time?
[00:57] <dtchen> it should fall back to that automagically.
[01:01] <dtchen> if it doesn't, choose the rescue option in the boot loader
[01:04] <spO> i am using my old kernel now
[01:04] <spO> i installed a new kernel 2.6.30  over a 2.6.28 system
[01:04] <spO> but it doesn't boot right
[01:13] <spO> dtchen
[01:13] <spO> if i use a custom kernel
[01:13] <spO> that means my ati drivers will not work, right
[01:14] <spO> but how can i compile new ati drivers unless i run the kernel
[01:14] <spO> and how can i use the kernel if ati drivers dont work
[01:14] <dtchen> it means you likely need to recompile them, assuming you're using the dkmsized ones
[01:14] <dtchen> make sure you have kernel headers for your new 2.6.30 installed, too
[01:15] <dtchen> anyhow, this discussion isn't kernel development-related. i'm happy to help you in another channel or private message.
[01:38] <spO> what channel talks about custom kernel?
[01:38] <spO> #ubuntu has people who never made a custom kernel mostly
[01:39] <dtchen> as in user-created custom kernels? none, really. some people will help in #ubuntu or #ubuntu+1
[01:40] <spO> the problem with my new kernel happens when i it tries to mount my disk drive,    the whole disk by uuid does not work well or i didn't configure something
[01:40] <spO> i will try to compile a new kernel
[01:52] <spO> what are headers exaclty>?
[01:59] <spO> what did you mean when you said  dkmsized  ?
[02:11] <spO> is there a list of information about each kernel option in detail?
[04:21] <spO> so i tried to run a kernel that does not have journal file system  support, but i guess ubuntu doesn't like that , ie it won't run.... Why does ubuntu use journal file system anyways??    I don't want to create a journal nor do i need a whole file system to do that.
[05:10] <spO>  JFS was not made for being a OS fs , why is it being used for that now... people cannot create something that is more effective or efficent?
[08:58] <spO> If i make a custom kernel, such as kernel 2.6.30-4   , how do i install ATI drivers for that kernel? they are not working right for me
[19:39] <bjsnider> i thought ben collins headed the kernel team, but on the wiki page it says someone else does
[20:12] <ScottK> bjsnider: He did, but pgraner does now.  No idea why.


[02:15] <skellat> Erm, um: http://fox8.com/2014/12/07/mission-accomplished-group-launches-porta-potty-rocket-into-sky/
[02:15] <jenni> [ Mission accomplished: Group launches porta-potty rocket into sky | fox8.com ] - https://j.mp/12fQ0YL <-- lol


 Our five year journey to Android 9 | Behind the bytes | Fairphone … https://youtu.be/LcLmQp7ZdGU
 @ArashPrograms [hi. can support ubuntu touch on , galaxy tab A , or tab s 7 ?], Apparently a port was started by a community member - https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=p6JNZGKcTjU
 @TotalSonic [Apparently a port was started by a community member - https://m.youtube.com/watc …], tanx u bro .
[04:57] <ubptgbot> <Z T> Any older nokia phones that have symbian installed?
[04:57] <ubptgbot> <Z T> Would love to try on 808 pure view
 (Video, 110s) https://irc.ubports.com/2jFBht0p.mp4 Hello everybody! I wanted to ask, did anyone come across such a strange bug on OTA-16? Maybe someone knows how to fix this? And then somehow ... it's almost unrealistic to live under OTA 16 if I can't send a picture to telegrams or download files ...
 @im_not_dead_seiwer [<reply to media>], (Wow telegram stretched the picture a lot .... 😳)
 @Z T [Any older nokia phones that have symbian installed?], There is no support for Ubuntu Touch on those.
 Is there a way to disable Anbox desktop entry generation on Ubuntu Touch? It's a bit annoying to have two calendars, calculators, etc.
 Android Settings > apps > calculator > disable
 I would like to be able to open these apps through other apps. So, that is not an option...
 @im_not_dead_seiwer [<reply to media>], Are u on devel?
 @Flohack [Are u on devel?], No ...
 Can I use Halium even if I don't have LineageOS for my device?
 @im_not_dead_seiwer [No ...], We had a bug with contenthub but that should not be in stable
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [Can I use Halium even if I don't have LineageOS for my device?], Do you have kernel source?
 (Photo, 1920x2560) https://irc.ubports.com/LS016Rya.png
 @amyosx [Do you have kernel source?], Yes
 @im_not_dead_seiwer [No ...], See my picture, attaching works here
 @Flohack [We had a bug with contenthub but that should not be in stable], I don’t know how, but on the hike, this error was able to seep into the stable branch.
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [Yes], Then you can try patching it for ut
 @amyosx [Then you can try patching it for ut], I also have ROM source. But, Halium porting guide is for LOS devices. It instructs to use LOS source. What to do about that part?
 (Photo, 960x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/G20V2wXP.png OTA-16 .... with updated qt 5.12 .... And Google does not miss .... Nice update
 (Photo, 960x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/NEfZW2yt.png And one more bug .... Strange
 @im_not_dead_seiwer [<reply to media>], (After the call is dropped, the "phone" application simply hangs in this state)
[10:43] <ubptgbot> kauamotta13 was added by: kauamotta13
 Yay he's here :)
 hai frainds
 hai baist frend emy
[11:34] <ubptgbot> Sunflower2333 was added by: Sunflower2333
 welcome sunflower
 :)
[11:54] <ubptgbot> mkljczk was added by: mkljczk
 @eriki73 [Is there a way to disable Anbox desktop entry generation on Ubuntu Touch? It's a …], pull to refresh
 https://github.com/erfanoabdi/halium-boot/blob/halium-9.0/check-kernel-config
 What to do about neither enabled nor disabled configs found via this script?
 you may want join @ubports_porting
 try to provide as much context as you can, so that they give the appropriate answer
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [https://github.com/erfanoabdi/halium-boot/blob/halium-9.0/check-kernel-config], run with -w
 I have a lot of config files in arch/arm/configs for my kernel source. Among them, my device needs a specific config. How will I edit that with make menuconfig?
 [Edit] I have a lot of config files in arch/arm/configs in my kernel source. Among them, my device needs a specific config. How will I edit that with make menuconfig?
 only send in one group please :) (porting)
[12:23] <ubptgbot> s3verge was added by: s3verge
 hi all
 can i manually download and flash ubuntu touch on my nexus 5?
 ubports is not working
 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc.ubports.com/IOqPbTgy.png how to bypass this? tried VPN - no change
 try a different network
 @s3verge [<reply to media>], try an older version of the installer
 When trying Halium with GSI, what to do with Apparmor and the kernel? I'm a little bit confused!
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [When trying Halium with GSI, what to do with Apparmor and the kernel? I'm a litt …], Wrong grouo
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [When trying Halium with GSI, what to do with Apparmor and the kernel? I'm a litt …], [Edit] Wrong group
 @amyosx [Wrong group], bam
[14:35] <TechieGuy> I don't realize this line: "In order to get media working you need to update in apparmor in kernel" in this link: https://github.com/ubports/porting-notes/wiki/Generic-system-image-(GSI)#common-kernel-patches. What does it mean? Plz help anyone.
[14:41] <ubptgbot> Dobata was added by: Dobata
 hi do you have any UBports software for redmi note 8 pro (begonia)
 @s3verge [can i manually download and flash ubuntu touch on my nexus 5?], I also need to know that. I want to install a previous version. 😆
 @Dobata [hi do you have any UBports software for redmi note 8 pro (begonia)], hi the begonia variant isn't ready for use yet, it may take upwards of a few months
 ok thenks!
 @Fuseteam [try an older version of the installer], ty, older version is working
 @Fuseteam [hi the begonia variant isn't ready for use yet, it may take upwards of a few mon …], You are porting it?
[15:53] <ubptgbot> <Ted Rendol> (Photo, 1920x2560) https://irc.ubports.com/97yTuYQv.png
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [You are porting it?], no, but did see someone porting it in the porting group :p
 generally if its not on the list it ain't ready
 @Fuseteam [no, but did see someone porting it in the porting group :p], I came here after failing to port pmOS. Hoping it would be faster and easier, but seems like... :D
 @Fuseteam [no, but did see someone porting it in the porting group :p], [Edit] I came here after failing to port pmOS, hoping UT would be faster and easier, but seems like... :D
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [I came here after failing to port pmOS, hoping UT would be faster and easier, bu …], good luck 👍
[15:57] <ubptgbot> <Ted Rendol> @Flohack [<reply to media>], UT developer secret machine ? ;-)
 @kauamotta13 [good luck 👍], Hope I can port it fast. I hope I can use UT as daily driver and dump android.
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [Hope I can port it fast. I hope I can use UT as daily driver and dump android.], my friend is trying to port for g7 play she is pro
 me nub
 @kauamotta13 [my friend is trying to port for g7 play she is pro], She has ported it already?
 Can she use it as a daily driver?
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [Can she use it as a daily driver?], im asking with her waitin she respond
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [Can she use it as a daily driver?], she did it to boot
 @kauamotta13 [she did it to boot], Well, so porting UT isn't easy either :(
 U have to be a pro!
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [Can she use it as a daily driver?], No
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/j2aYWnuv.png
 Lol
 It's got ssh
 Maybe I should stop these porting stuffs and go study :D
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [Maybe I should stop these porting stuffs and go study :D], U can do this i believe in u
 @kauamotta13 [U can do this i believe in u], :D
[16:08] <ubptgbot> <Ted Rendol> @s3verge [can i manually download and flash ubuntu touch on my nexus 5?], Great windows / linux version working on nexus 5
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/OWVxs6eG.webp
 @kauamotta13 [U can do this i believe in u], Can you help me with kernel compilation?
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [Can you help me with kernel compilation?], me nub me dont use linux
 Sory
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [Can you help me with kernel compilation?], I did from halium source tree
 @amyosx [I did from halium source tree], I'm getting "arch/arm/boot/dts: no such directory" when running "make O=out clean"
 But, the directory is there in kernel source.
 don't do like that
 Do from halium itself
 @amyosx [Do from halium itself], How?
 Read the wiki
 @amyosx [Read the wiki], pro tip 👍👍👍👍👍😃😃😃😃😃👌👌👌👌
 @amyosx [Read the wiki], I'm porting with GSI.
 https://github.com/ubports/porting-notes/wiki/Generic-system-image-(GSI)
[17:05] <ubptgbot> Rossie Keller was added by: Rossie Keller
 Welcome rossie
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [I'm porting with GSI.], Check halium 9 page on how to build halium-boot
 You can use with gsi
[17:22] <ubptgbot> <Rossie Keller> Amazinggg🚀🚀🚀  MUSK giving cryptoo http://bit.do/fP68p
 Goodbye Rossie 👋
 lol its a bot ;-;
 Whyyyyy?! Musk was giving crypto for freeeee... 😥
 "Triggerred"
 Once I helped a niggerian prinzes...
 @C0n57an71n [Once I helped a niggerian prinzes...], You are from Constantinople?
 @ajqjwuuqbana041 [You are from Constantinople?], 👏👏
 Hi guys  … Why the supported phones are low … Can anyone explain the problems with other devices 🤔
 No one has ported them
 @SmoothAsPython [Hi guys  … Why the supported phones are low … Can anyone explain the problems with o …], Low as in number?
 @gibcheesepuffs [Low as in number?], Yep 😔
 Every device is different and someone has to port it
[18:19] <ubptgbot> <Steve Kueffer> @SmoothAsPython [Yep 😔], And porting a device is a huge work. It usually takes form 1 to 2 years to be well completed.
[18:20] <ubptgbot> <Steve Kueffer> @SmoothAsPython [Yep 😔], [Edit] And porting a device is a huge work. It usually takes from 1 to 2 years to be well completed.
 @Steve Kueffer [And porting a device is a huge work. It usually takes from 1 to 2 years to be we …], longer if the porter doesnt know how to code
 @Shakendo [longer if the porter doesnt know how to code], Me
 @amyosx [Me], you know more about coding than I do
 @Shakendo [you know more about coding than I do], I have coded in almost every language tbh
 Lol
 Like doesn't mean I'm any good, I've just done a hello world or fixed a bug or something
 @amyosx [Like doesn't mean I'm any good, I've just done a hello world or fixed a bug or s …], u good
 Could anyone who uses Anbox on an ARMHF (__not__ ARM64) device please share their `/usr/bin/anbox-tool file?` Something is not working on the MX4 (and yes I've patched the kernel correctly).
 @amyosx [Like doesn't mean I'm any good, I've just done a hello world or fixed a bug or s …], more than I have done lol
 @Steve Kueffer [And porting a device is a huge work. It usually takes from 1 to 2 years to be we …], Well I would not be that pessemistic, but main reason is: Someone needs to own the device to port it.
 I have 7 or 8 devices already on my table, its simply too much ^^
 [Edit] Could anyone who uses Anbox on an ARMHF (**not_**ARM64) device please share their `/usr/bin/anbox-tool file?` Something is not working on the MX4 (and yes I've patched the kernel correctly).
 @TartanSpartan [Could anyone who uses Anbox on an ARMHF (**not_**ARM64) device please share thei …], I have one that works in my gh
 [Edit] Could anyone who uses Anbox on an ARMHF (**not**ARM64) device please share their `/usr/bin/anbox-tool file?` Something is not working on the MX4 (and yes I've patched the kernel correctly).
 [Edit] Could anyone who uses Anbox on an ARMHF (**not** ARM64) device please share their `/usr/bin/anbox-tool file?` Something is not working on the MX4 (and yes I've patched the kernel correctly).
 [Edit] Could anyone who uses Anbox on an ARMHF ( not ARM64) device please share their `/usr/bin/anbox-tool file?` Something is not working on the MX4 (and yes I've patched the kernel correctly).
 [Edit] Could anyone who uses Anbox on an ARMHF (not ARM64) device please share their `/usr/bin/anbox-tool file?` Something is not working on the MX4 (and yes I've patched the kernel correctly).
 Cool, what's the URL?
[18:32] <ubptgbot> <Steve Kueffer> @Flohack [I have 7 or 8 devices already on my table, its simply too much ^^], Waw! 😉
 @TartanSpartan [Could anyone who uses Anbox on an ARMHF (not ARM64) device please share their /u …], It won't change anything I guess
 It should work on developed though
 @TartanSpartan [Cool, what's the URL?], in my bio
 It worked on stable for a while, then started to misbehave. Thanks for the link!
 @TartanSpartan [It worked on stable for a while, then started to misbehave. Thanks for the link!], i don't see how, since arale is not in https://cdimage.ubports.com/anbox-images/devices.json
 @dohbee [i don't see how, since arale is not in https://cdimage.ubports.com/anbox-images/ …], my device isnt in that list either, but anbox works on it, its painfully slow and doesnt work with any of the apps Ive tried, but it does work, I can open the built-in anbox apps and those work
 @Shakendo [my device isnt in that list either, but anbox works on it, its painfully slow an …], yes but you have to manually place the image if you're not on devel, because `anbox-tool` only works with what's' in that json file otherwise
 I install it the same as any of those, I just swap out the anbox-tool file for mine
 @Shakendo [in my bio], what does this mean? it's clearly not at the github url, as i only see vendor/device/kernel repos there
 its in my trlte-common repo, in the ubuntu folder
 https://github.com/tyg3rpro/android_device_samsung_trlte-common/blob/halium-7.1/ubuntu/anbox-tool
 @SmoothAsPython [Hi guys  … Why the supported phones are low … Can anyone explain the problems with o …], is that your actual name? i think i read about you but i can't put my finger on it
 @Shakendo [its in my trlte-common repo, in the ubuntu folder], ok, so you just hardcoded an image to hack around things; it's not necessary with devel now
 well I personally didnt hardcode things, Lyo contributed that and it has worked so far, the kernel has anbox bits but I havent messed with anbox for a while cause its painfully slow and unusable for me
 @SmoothAsPython [Hi guys  … Why the supported phones are low … Can anyone explain the problems with o …], [Edit] is that your actual name? i think i read about you but i can't put my finger on it … the reason is every device has an unique kernel
 @Shakendo [my device isnt in that list either, but anbox works on it, its painfully slow an …], >doesn't work with any apps I've tried but it does work … pretty much the current state of anbox in a nutshell lol
 yup
 @dohbee [i don't see how, since arale is not in https://cdimage.ubports.com/anbox-images/ …], https://forums.ubports.com/topic/1679/how-to-anbox-for-meizu-mx4-arale … ;)
 @TartanSpartan [https://forums.ubports.com/topic/1679/how-to-anbox-for-meizu-mx4-arale … ;)], switch to devel and run `anbox-tool install`
[20:38] <ubptgbot> fw190d13 was added by: fw190d13
 Am I to understand that for other devices which are on that standard `.json`, those devices can run Anbox on stable, as opposed to devices which aren't on the file and need to run it on devel?
 any device which has the kernel enabled can "run" it on stable, but `anbox-tool install` on stable (and rc until new image there) will only work for devices in the json
 on devel, it now checks for kernel support and downloads the correct image for either 32-bit or 64-bit binder (but there are only 32-bit armhf images, no arm64 or amd4 yet)
 But errr the forum topic instructs MX4 users to swap out the `.json` for one which does include arale. But the fact that it looks for that image for the 32-bit binder might be corrective here so I'll try it.
 yes it's old; the change to devel only merged a few days ago
 (Photo, 1920x1152) https://irc.ubports.com/YWC7x0Tj.png
 Same error as I ended up seeing on stable, that is, after the period of a couple of days where it did work.
 So what gives?
 looks like a syntax error
 No snark please :)
 no really, maybe @dohbee know what the actual syntax error is
 i don't know enough python
 i guess because variable names can't start with numbers
 ah that would explain it
 what bugs me is that error somehow made it into stable?
 and i am an idiot and forgot that, and didn't manually run flake8
 it's not in stable
 is it?
 pretty sure it's not anyway
 @TartanSpartan [Same error as I ended up seeing on stable, that is, after the period of a couple …], that's what seumas seems to imply
 @dohbee [and i am an idiot and forgot that, and didn't manually run flake8], oops
 (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/A6VSQu6g.mp4
 @TartanSpartan [<reply to media>], no Seumas no cornflakes
 Ahh, a Python style guide enforcer.
 sorry couldn't resist, i have no Idaa what flake8 is myself
 until now that is
 @TartanSpartan [<reply to media>], [Edit] no Seumas not cornflakes
 im just seeing you guys being pros when amy make for g7 play i will try this os , looks pretty cool she said to that have a store called openstore she said Also everything is free
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/4j1WdezR.webp
 im noob on these things but i want to learn
 its a great os yeah, looks like you just witnessed live debugging
 [Edit] its a great os yeah, looks like you just witnessed live debugging :3
 So, could I manually change this variable to, say, `binder32` and patch the issue on my device?
 i think so yeah
 Haha yes these things happen every so often with us.
 And I'll note that error for myself for whenever I'm doing Python.
 what i want to know is how the error looks like on stable
 @TartanSpartan [So, could I manually change this variable to, say, binder32 and patch the issue …], you can wait for my PR to finish building and test it with `ubports-qa`
 @Fuseteam [what i want to know is how the error looks like on stable], Exactly the same AFAIK.
 @TartanSpartan [Exactly the same AFAIK.], no
 Will be cool to try something that its not android
 that code doesn't exist on stable so it can't be
 now that's odd, stable shouldn't have the change that introduced this error
 I'll prove a point!
 do it
 @kauamotta13 [Will be cool to try something that its not android], it is definitely cool yeah
 considering i wrote the code and it was only merged literally on like thursday, i'm pretty certain is not in stable
 now, knowing you, you might have done a r/w and `apt-get install` on stable, or upgrade, and thus are no longer on stable
 or something's fishy
 can you guys Give me some screenshots of the os? If you guys have thanks
 Well according to the guide I did that indeed, I figured you'd read the guide.
 @dohbee [now, knowing you, you might have done a r/w and apt-get install on stable, or up …], oh right, there's that too
 i figured you'd read the release notes for OTA-16 and applied that knowledge to adjust said guide accordingly :0
 [Edit] i figured you'd read the release notes for OTA-16 and applied that knowledge to adjust said guide accordingly :)
 but also again, at that point you are no longer "on stable"
[21:28] <ubptgbot> TammoLienke was added by: TammoLienke
 there isn't a stable apt repo separate from debian apt repo
 [Edit] there isn't a stable apt repo separate from devel apt repo
 if you install something on stable, you get latest stuff
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/kcEMVCr7.png @kauamotta13 here ya go
 Defaulted to the forum guide because the MX4 is not on the official `devices.json`. Can the release notes cater for something which isn't on there?
 @TartanSpartan [Well according to the guide I did that indeed, I figured you'd read the guide.], well that explains it
 mystery solved
 @TartanSpartan [Defaulted to the forum guide because the MX4 is not on the official devices.json …], if it's not on there, then it's not supported; the release notes state that you no longer need to install anbox on OTA-16 as it's pre-installed. you only need to run `anbox-tool install`, which on arale will say the device is not supported
 which is precisely why that forum thread tells you to uses a modified `anbox-tool` script
 @dohbee [there isn't a stable apt repo separate from devel apt repo], wait is there a separate apt repo for edge?
 @Fuseteam [wait is there a separate apt repo for edge?], yes
 Indeed, and I did.
 Ok I guess I'll go back to stable, but not to prove the point any more, but more because anbox should work on there if I copy the PR you made to this file on stable.
 @dohbee [yes], cool! so technically `apt upgrade` means technically somewhere between devel and edge
 this is no different than all the people trying to install the dkms package on ubuntu 20.10 for anbox on PCs, because they don't read the bloody note in the instructions that say it's no longer necessary first
 @Fuseteam [cool! so technically apt upgrade means technically somewhere between devel and e …], no, it means you get devel
 there is nothing anywhere between devel and edge :P
 @dohbee [no, it means you get devel], oh that's interesting :3
 anyway
 @dohbee [this is no different than all the people trying to install the dkms package on u …], haha someone's still salty about that i see
 (well unless you are on android9 or edge, in which case you get devel + whatever might be in android9 or edge repos assuming they are updated with changes from devel)
 @Fuseteam [<reply to media>], wow thanks , i liked the style , how works like left from an program/app? idk how you guys call, we can customize like with themes?
 [Edit] Ok I guess I'll go back to stable, but not to prove the point any more, but more because anbox should work on there if I copy the PR you made to this file into stable.
 @kauamotta13 [wow thanks , i liked the style , how works like left from an program/app? idk ho …], so left the launcher, it hold all you're "favorite" apps the list in the middle is the drawer where you can find all your apps
 How fast do these PRs build?
 @TartanSpartan [How fast do these PRs build?], fast enough as it's already done
 @Fuseteam [so left the launcher, it hold all you're "favorite" apps the list in the middle …], you can open the drawer at any time via a left swipe
 so you can `ubports-qa install xenial_-_fix-syntax` (which of course is meant to be used on devel not stable)
 @Fuseteam [so left the launcher, it hold all you're "favorite" apps the list in the middle …], we can set which are our favorites or its by the most we use?
 @Fuseteam [so left the launcher, it hold all you're "favorite" apps the list in the middle …], [Edit] you can open the drawer at any time via a swipe from the left edge
 or you can do more manually
 @kauamotta13 [we can set which are our favorites or its by the most we use?], yes you can set your own favorites, it doesn't do it automatically. it does come with a default set, but you can customize it completely
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/r4Yd389T.png
 @Fuseteam [yes you can set your own favorites, it doesn't do it automatically. it does come …], wow nice im interested on this os, really, looks awesome
 oh and you can call the launcher separately from the drawer as well xD
 cant wait to test
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/V8Z8iFv5.webp
 @kauamotta13 [wow nice im interested on this os, really, looks awesome], It is nice, you're in for a treat. I'm 'just' a user, and I like it lots.
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/kfhmiX1O.png this when you swipe from the left edge XD
 @Fuseteam [<reply to media>], Wooow
 im impressed
 (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/A5DWAYab.webp
 short swipe switches between the first two
 @Fuseteam [<reply to media>], *right
 (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/aANPfrtr.png this when you swipe from the right edge XD
 dang it, what a weird typo
 @Fuseteam [short swipe switches between the first two], *last two ;)
 (ie most recent two)
 @dohbee [*last two ;)], those are the first listed in the spread no? :p
 @dohbee [*last two ;)], [Edit] those are the first listed in the spread, no? :p
 @Fuseteam [those are the first listed in the spread, no? :p], they are leftmost i think, but it can be quite confusing, since they also appear on the bottom
 the first two == is the left most tw— wait bottom?
 @dohbee [*last two ;)], [Edit] those are the first two listed in the spread, no? :p
 cool thanks i want to try alot this os my friend amy, i will ask some help to her is pro on these things also you guys are … she is my best friend ^\^ im also her tester/"translator"
 @Fuseteam [the first two == is the left most tw— wait bottom?], yes, look at the 3d windows, and which ones are on "top" of which
 thanks everyone
 sure no problem kaya
 imo they should be rotated the other way
 (Sticker, 512x288) https://irc.ubports.com/X1jPmJlR.webp
 @dohbee [yes, look at the 3d windows, and which ones are on "top" of which], oh yeah i did not look at it like that 👀
 @dohbee [imo they should be rotated the other way], like the left most on "top"?
 yes
 since you're pulling out from the right edge
 you are a dev @Fuseteam ?
 yeah i feel like the more recent ones on top of the stack makes more sense 🤔
 @kauamotta13 [you are a dev @Fuseteam ?], i try to be but i'm actually a noob compared to many others :)
 @Fuseteam [i try to be but i'm actually a noob compared to many others :)], Did you create this os for some phone?
 @kauamotta13 [Did you create this os for some phone?], no i'm not a porter, i did modify my keyboard. still working on getting it not shipped in the os tho
 @kauamotta13 [Did you create this os for some phone?], [Edit] no i'm not a porter, i did modify my keyboard. still working on getting it shipped in the os tho
 @Fuseteam [no i'm not a porter, i did modify my keyboard. still working on getting it shipp …], Nice 👍
 (Sticker, 496x512) https://irc.ubports.com/UI73cQHt.webp
 anime fans may recognize the keyboard somewhat xD
 @TartanSpartan [How fast do these PRs build?], are you testing btw? https://github.com/ubports/anbox/pull/47 is the PR, you can grab the debs from the CI build to install manually. let me know if it works for you
 @dohbee [so you can ubports-qa install xenial_-_fix-syntax (which of course is meant to b …], Trying this route first.
 That worked, but `anbox-tool install` is not quite working.
 Would the fact that this:
 https://iubuntu.cz/mx4/devices.json
 only lists 64-bit binders be a problem?
 n o
 @TartanSpartan [That worked, but anbox-tool install is not quite working.], what doesn't work?
 it doesn't use the devices.json any more
 @TartanSpartan [That worked, but anbox-tool install is not quite working.], `cat -vvvvv seumas` :^3
 ^lol whut
 @TartanSpartan [That worked, but anbox-tool install is not quite working.], This command to install the anbox emulator is not working.
 "Anbox has not been enabled for this device. Please consult device maintainer."
 If it isn't querying the `devices.json`, by what other means does it vet which devices it will install on?
 Perhaps the kernel was overwritten?
 @TartanSpartan [^lol whut], verbose mode activate lol
 Yes but are you trying to categorise me verbosely? The 1st level of verbosity would say: `cat: Seumas: Is a maverick` ;)
 I'
 [Edit] I'll try to put the image file back.
 Aha, that did the trick, here we go.
 Now let's hope it doesn't bork like before. Maybe because I appended the line to force portrait mode, that screwed something up at some point afterwards.
 @TartanSpartan [If it isn't querying the devices.json, by what other means does it vet which dev …], it's checking kernel
 you don't have `/dev/anbox-binder` device
 Gotcha.
 But I do have anbox now :) Thanks guys.
 sure
 @TartanSpartan [Yes but are you trying to categorise me verbosely? The 1st level of verbosity wo …], Nah i'm just enforcing maximum verbosity :P
[23:35] <ubptgbot> Ace Diamond was added by: Ace Diamond
 Welcome ace diamond
 you guys can call me mr welcome haha
 @TartanSpartan [There they are, thank you sir. … **Correction: actually, one above, so ~/.local/s …], Scrub that last `/applications/` (why won't you still let me edit, Telegram grrr).


[00:03] <thumper> sinzui: there are foundational bugs about trailing whitespace
[00:03] <thumper> sinzui: all I want is a ui=sinzui :)
[00:03] <thumper> sinzui: I'll look into the whitespace issue
[00:04] <thumper> sinzui: it appears that the multiline editor adds some carriage returns at the end for some reason
[00:04] <thumper> yet to be determined
[00:07] <thumper> mwhudson: got any comments on the pics above?
[00:11] <sinzui> thumper: The UI is r=me. You may want to verify the Comments IField is strippedText* and then you want to verify the setter does the cleaning instead of the widget. I had to do something similar in other Ajaxed forms
[00:11] <thumper> sinzui: ok, ta
[00:14] <mwhudson> thumper: looks nice
[00:14]  * mwhudson afk for lunch
[00:16] <sinzui> thumper: the StrippedTextLine is flawed. StrippedTextWidget is doing the work. The comment's IField type must work like c.l.field.URIField
[02:07] <thumper> anyone know our windmill xpath expressions?
[03:04] <thumper> mwhudson: you around for a pre-impl call?
[03:04] <mwhudson> thumper: sure
[08:03] <wgrant> Gnargh @ people who don't check security declarations before they export objects.
[08:13] <lifeless> going to ile a bug?
[08:14] <wgrant> Just done so now.
[08:14] <wgrant> bug #458833
[08:18] <adeuring> good morning
[09:15] <mrevell> Morning!
[09:23] <wgrant> bigjools: Morning... Want to have a look at bug #458833?
[09:52] <bigjools> wgrant: have you tried to rocketfuel-branch today?
[09:53] <wgrant> bigjools: No, I don't normally use it.
[09:53]  * wgrant tries
[09:53] <bigjools> ok
[09:53] <bigjools> I got an error when it builds the wadl - "ImportError: No module named apt_pkg"
[09:53] <bigjools> awesome
[09:54] <wgrant> Ah.
[09:54] <wgrant> I know why that is.
[09:54] <bigjools> missing __init_ ?
[09:54] <wgrant> There's a new python-apt in primary.
[09:54] <wgrant> Which supersedes the one in launchpad/ppa which supports python2.4.
[09:54] <bigjools> GAH
[09:54] <wgrant> Again.
[09:54] <bigjools> ffs
[09:55] <wgrant> maxb usually updates his, which then gets copied into launchpad/ppa, but it's easy enough for anybody to do it.
[09:55] <wgrant> For now, you can just downgrade.
[09:55] <bigjools> yarp
[09:55] <jml> rockstar, bzr-removable
[10:35] <gmb> allenap: I've a question about utilities/ec2 if you've the time.
[10:35] <allenap> gmb: Sure.
[10:37] <gmb> allenap: What Python should ec2 be using? It breaks with 2.4 because of the PQM issue and it breaks with the system python because of something to do with paramiko (don't have a traceback to hand at the moment).
[10:37] <gmb> allenap: It does work with python 2.5 but I figured we were hoping to skip that and go straight to 2.6 with the rest of LP.
[10:38] <allenap> gmb: It'll work with either 2.5 or 2.6.
[10:39] <gmb> allenap: Oh, okay. My paramiko error must've been caused by something else. Cool, thanks.
[10:39] <allenap> gmb: The utilities/ec2 script is a bit broken right now. See "Problems with utilities/ec2 test -s "..." on Jaunty (and possibly on Karmic too)?" on<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[10:40] <gmb> allenap: Yeah, test -s is what broke for me. Using the version in an old branch of stable worked for me though.
[10:40] <wgrant> Is a separate 2.6 branch going to be maintained for 6 months?
[10:40] <wgrant> ISTM that neither trunk can be moved to 2.6 before Lucid.
[10:43] <allenap> wgrant: Because 2.6 isn't on hardy?
[10:43] <wgrant> allenap: Right.
[10:44] <mwhudson> wgrant: there is A Plan
[10:44] <mwhudson> which involves a ppa
[10:44] <allenap> wgrant: I don't think a little thing like that will stop them :)
[10:44] <wgrant> mwhudson: Urgh.
[11:02] <deryck> Morning, all
[11:04] <maxb> bigjools: hmm..... but how did you get that newer python-apt installed?!  the requirements of launchpad-developer-dependencies should have forced you to stick with the old version until the PPA was updated!
[11:04]  * bigjools shrugs
[11:05] <maxb> My updating just now has presented me it as a held-back package (which is what prompts me to go and update it
[11:05] <bigjools> weird
[11:49] <thumper> deryck: hey, you might want to look at my lazr-js branch too
[11:51] <deryck> thumper, ok, will do.  do you do any work on this patching problem?  Or just fixes to get your stuff working?
[11:51] <thumper> deryck: the lazr-js branch is all css styling to use a class rather than an id
[11:52] <thumper> deryck: mwhudson has looked at it
[11:52] <thumper> deryck: but i was wondering about replacing rather than adding css styles
[11:52] <thumper> deryck: in my branch multiline edit branch I add the lazr-multiline-edit class to the bugs page too
[11:52] <thumper> deryck: in preparation for the lazr-js fix
[11:53] <deryck> thumper, ok, cool.  thanks for making this better. :)
[11:53] <thumper> deryck: np, I'm off now, it is almost midnight
[11:56] <deryck> cool, enjoy the weekend.
[13:13] <bigjools> maxb: did you figure out why your PPA package wants to get upgraded to karmic's?
[13:14] <maxb> It doesn't, for me :-)
[13:14] <bigjools> maxb: I downgraded and it wants to upgrade again for me, is there any debugging I can do for you?
[13:15] <maxb> What wants to upgrade it? apt-get ? aptitude? update-manager?
[13:15] <bigjools> tried the first 2 and they both want to
[13:18] <maxb> This makes no sense
[13:18] <bigjools> aptitude says: python-apt [<IP_ADDRESS>ubuntu3launchpad~maxb1 -> <IP_ADDRESS>ubuntu4]
[13:18] <maxb> After upgrading to vanilla karmic, the dependencies of launchpad-developer-dependencies would be violated
[13:18] <leonardr> allenap, when you are around would you check and make sure that bug 451158 is fixed in the version of launchpad i just released?
[13:18] <mup> Bug #451158: AttributeError: 'Credentials' object has no attribute 'authorizeSession' <launchpadlib :Fix Released> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/451158>
[13:18] <maxb> bigjools: you do have lp-dev-deps installed?
[13:19]  * bigjools facepams
[13:19] <bigjools> facepalms, too
[13:19] <allenap> leonardr: Okay.
[13:19] <bigjools> guess what!
[13:19] <bigjools> the karmic upgrade must have removed it :(
[13:21]  * maxb disappears for lunch
[13:21] <bigjools> maxb: and now it works, thanks
[13:44] <allenap> leonardr: I get this now: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/299769/
[13:44] <leonardr> aaargh
[13:44] <allenap> leonardr: I got the Python console by: bzr branch trunk boot && cd boot && virtualenv --no-site-packages . && bin/python bootstrap.py && bin/buildout && bin/py
[13:49] <leonardr> i tested get_token_and_login but not login_with
[13:52] <leonardr> i think i need to create a fake launchpad so i can write tests for these methods
[13:52] <allenap> leonardr: get_token_and_login() works fine.
[13:52] <allenap> leonardr: Something for a quiet afternoon perhaps ;)
[13:52] <leonardr> yeah, i think it's just called something other than 'credentials' now
[14:05] <leonardr> allenap, it looks like the problem is that the credentials object is no longer set as 'credentials' on the service root
[14:07] <allenap> leonardr: Is is somewhere else, or is this a pita to fix?
[14:07] <leonardr> it's a bit of a pita
[14:08] <leonardr> i'll probably end up doing another lazr.restfulclient release that sets it
[14:09] <leonardr> i bet it would currently be available as ._browser.authorizer, but it makes more sense just to set it again
[14:26] <leonardr> allenap: would you try your code in conjunction with https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~leonardr/lazr.restfulclient/set-credentials ?
[14:26] <leonardr> and also review that branch? (i'm writing mp now)
[14:27] <allenap> leonardr: Okay.
[14:28] <gmb> Okay, can someone help my poor, tired brain: Why would bug 438985 occur in a web environment but not in the harness or in a test?
[14:28] <mup> Bug #438985: Trying to make myself as bug supervisor of my project oopses <oops> <Launchpad Bugs:In Progress by gmb> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/438985>
[14:28] <gmb> Oh, wait.
[14:28] <gmb> I know why.
[14:28] <gmb> It's a DB object thing isn't it?
[14:29] <gmb> Okay, so, my next question: What's the best way for me to ensure that I've got two differnt objects that refer to the same row in the database?
[14:29] <gmb> allenap: Do you know? ISTR you having similar problems a while back (I could, of course, be making this up).
[14:31] <allenap> gmb: Why do you want to ensure that you have two different objects for the same row?
[14:31] <gmb> allenap: So that I can write a regression test for the above bug.
[14:31] <allenap> gmb: (a is not b and a.id == b.id)
[14:31] <gmb> allenap: Right, that's what I need.
[14:31] <gmb> Is there a simple way to do it that you know of?
[14:32] <allenap> gmb: Oh, and check the table.
[14:32] <allenap> gmb: I don't really understand. If you have two objects for the same row from the same store that's a bug in Storm isn't it?
[14:32] <gmb> allenap: Okay, I'm confused... I don't need to check that they're different, I need them to actually *be* different. How do I create two different object referring to the same DB row?
[14:33] <gmb> allenap: Well, it might be, but the problem is that we're comparing two Person objects using 'is' instead of '==', and it breaks in the web environment but not in tests or harness (because the object stays the same between queries)
[14:33] <gmb> allenap: Fixing the bug is easy. Writing the test to make sure it doesn't happen again isn't.
[14:33] <allenap> gmb: Ah, can't you just instantiate them and then set their properties? Or, if you don't need them to actually work, you could use a Snapshot.
[14:34] <gmb> allenap: Ah, interesting idea. Yes, I could cheat like that, I guess :).
[14:34] <gmb> \0/ for hacks
[14:34] <gmb> allenap: Thanks, I'll try that.
[14:35] <allenap> gmb: If the test is just to prevent someone from using "is" again, then it sounds like it's not worth it.
[14:35] <gmb> allenap: Would you be happy for that to land, as a reviewer?
[14:35] <sinzui> barry: stand-up
[14:36] <gmb> It's a bit of a bugger of a thing to detect, so I'm inclined to at least try to get the test to fail.
[14:39] <allenap> gmb: I guess I don't really know how this bug plays out in the code, so I'll keep quiet from here on :)
[14:39] <gmb> allenap: Fair enough. Suffice it to say it's a PITA.
[14:42] <barry> sinzui: just you and me? :)
[14:48] <allenap> leonardr: That took me a while ("now, how do I actually use an unreleased library here?") but in the end, it works fine.
[14:48] <leonardr> allenap: sorry, i could have helped oyu with that
[14:50] <allenap> leonardr: I found HackingLazrLibraries which was a good thing to read anyway.
[14:51] <leonardr> allenap: can i remind you to vote on the mp?
[14:52] <allenap> leonardr: Just done.
[14:57] <sinzui> barry: look at lib/canonical/__init__.py
[14:57] <sinzui> barry: I think you can filter all Set, SHA, and MD5 from there.
[14:59] <barry> sinzui: ah, very interesting.  thanks for the link.  one problem is that this won't filter anything for the twisted applications that run in a subprocess.  but i think i have hacked tachandler to do that.
[14:59] <sinzui> barry: I think you can. There used to be hacks in the tac files for error loging
[15:02] <sinzui> EdwinGrubbs: what is the status of bug 436507
[15:02] <mup> Bug #436507: Distribution series source package page has no links to distribution source package page <post-3-ui-cleanup> <Launchpad Registry:In Progress by edwin-grubbs> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/436507>
[15:02] <EdwinGrubbs> sinzui: I didn't work on it. It just needs a couple of minor changes before it can be put in review.
[15:03] <sinzui> okay
[15:03] <sinzui> EdwinGrubbs: the timeout bug is more import
[15:04] <EdwinGrubbs> sinzui: if I don't work on the timeout, I might get karmic retribution
[15:05] <sinzui> correct
[15:17] <barry> jml: ping
[15:17] <jml> barry, I'm on a call right now -- how can I help?
[15:18] <barry> jml: just ping me when you're free, i'd like some suggestions on how to handle a tricky twisted problem
[15:18] <jml> barry, ooh, fun.
[15:18] <jml> barry, will do.
[15:18] <barry> jml: thanks!  yes, "fun" :)
[15:30] <bac> hi beuno
[15:32] <beuno> hi bac
[15:33] <jml> leonardr, lazr.restfulclient's setup.py says it uses zope.interface, but zope.interface isn't used in the code
[15:33] <leonardr> jml: it's used by lazr.restful, which is a testing dependency of lazr.restfulclient
[15:33] <leonardr> you might be able to remove it from setup.py but it will still be downloaded and used
[15:34] <jml> leonardr, ahh ok.
[15:34] <jml> leonardr, I'm just trying to figure out what extra dependencies bzr would need if it started to use launchpadlib
[15:38] <adeuring> henninge: r=me for your branch from this morning
[15:54] <henninge> adeuring: thank you
[15:54] <adeuring> henninge: welcome :)
[16:16] <barry> jml: reping (if you're free)
[16:18] <jml> barry, like a bird on a wire
[16:18] <jml> barry, what's up?
[16:18] <barry> jml: maybe -> #launchpad-sprint?
[16:25] <BjornT_> gmb: did you make any progress on bug 438985?
[16:25] <mup> Bug #438985: Trying to make myself as bug supervisor of my project oopses <oops> <Launchpad Bugs:In Progress by gmb> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/438985>
[16:26] <gmb> BjornT_: I've got a fix playing in ec2 now.
[16:27] <BjornT_> gmb: i mainly wanted to know if you figured out what the problem was
[16:28] <henninge> adeuring: when approving merge proposals, it would be great if you could set the review type to "code". The new "ec2 land" command looks for that to find the reviewer for the the branch. Danke.
[16:28] <gmb> BjornT_: wgrant already did that: we were comparing two Person objects with "is" instead of "==" in the check to see whether one could subscribe the other. So even if you were subscribing yourself the comparison returned False, hence the OOPS.
[16:28] <adeuring> henninge: thanks for the head-up. I wasn't aware to this
[16:29] <gmb> BjornT_: The problem I had was writing a suitable regression test, but allenap helped me figure that out.
[16:29] <henninge> adeuring: np
[16:29] <henninge> adeuring: I wasn't either until it just refused to work for me ... ;-)
[16:31] <BjornT_> gmb: do you know why you had different objects there? what does the test look like?
[16:31] <gmb> BjornT_: No, I don't. I'll paste a diff of the test for you, hang on...
[16:32] <BjornT_> gmb: ok. did you try passing in a security wrapped object to the method? that should do it; i'm quite sure that is want is happening.
[16:33] <gmb> BjornT_: Actually, no I didn't. The test looks like this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/299839/.
[16:34] <gmb> BjornT_: The security-wrapped object would probably be a better test, actually. What do you think?
[16:35] <gmb> BjornT_: Actually, I wonder, looking at it now - is there a chance that that test could pass when it shouldn't? It failed for me every time without the fix, but perhaps I'm being overly optimistic about it.
[16:36] <BjornT_> gmb: makePerson() is buggy. it strips the security proxy from the created person
[16:36] <gmb> Ah.
[16:37] <gmb> Eurgh.
[16:38] <BjornT_> gmb: there is no rationale for stripping it (except for modifying some attributes), so i would try fixing it. if that fails, you should add an XXX, explaining why you get the created person from the db again.
[16:38] <barry> abentley: ping
[16:38] <gmb> BjornT_: Okay, will do. Thanks.
[16:38] <abentley> barry: pong
[16:39] <barry> abentley: hi.  i'm having a problem with 'bzr shelve somefile'.  it asks me whether i want to shelve it, i say yes, but then nothing gets put on the shelve and the change in the working tree doesn't get backed out.  any idea what's going on?
[16:39] <barry> abentley: bzr shelve --all works fine though (but it's too coarse for what i need to do now)
[16:40] <abentley> barry: And does "bzr shelve" work if you shelve only somefile?
[16:40] <barry> abentley: no
[16:40] <james_w> barry: do you press "y" twice in the case where it doesn't work?
[16:40] <abentley> barry: I'm not sure why you would get that.
[16:41] <james_w> al-maisan: we just tested your permission change on testing and it works, thanks
[16:41] <barry> james_w: it only asks me once, so i only hit 'y' once
[16:41] <james_w> barry: does it show a diff?
[16:41] <abentley> barry: That's very odd.
[16:41] <al-maisan> \o/
[16:41] <barry> james_w: it does!
[16:41] <barry> abentley: yeah
[16:41] <abentley> barry: It should always confirm the overall shelve operation.
[16:42] <barry> abentley: i never get that last confirmation
[16:42] <barry> abentley: unless i use --all
[16:42] <barry> Shelve? [yNfq?]y
[16:42] <barry> Selected changes:
[16:42] <barry>  M  lib/canonical/launchpad/daemons/tachandler.py
[16:42] <barry>
[16:42] <barry> then it exits
[16:43] <barry> % bzr shelve --list
[16:43] <barry> No shelved changes.
[16:43] <abentley> barry: Are you hitting lowercase y?
[16:43] <barry> abentley: yep
[16:43] <abentley> Does it say "no changes to shelve" before it quits?
[16:44] <barry> abentley: nope
[16:44] <barry> oh wow
[16:44] <barry> abentley, james_w: um, if i run it in a gnome-terminal instead of an emacs shell buffer, i get the confirmation message!
[16:45] <james_w> huh
[16:45] <barry> and when i give the second 'y', it works
[16:45] <barry> james_w: shall i file a bug on bzr?
[16:45] <abentley> barry: Please do.
[16:45] <barry> abentley, james_w thanks!
[16:46] <abentley> barry: I'm not sure-- it could be caused by the way prompts are written/overwritten with \r.
[16:46] <barry> abentley: very possibly so
[16:46] <abentley> barry: Or it could be the way we retrieve a single character.
[16:48] <abentley> barry: If you want to play with it, it's in bzrlib.shelf_ui.Shelver.prompt
[16:48] <barry> abentley: thanks.  my stack is deep right now so i'll just report the bug and move on ;)
[16:49] <abentley> barry: Understood.  Wouldn't want you to get a recursion traceback.
[16:49] <barry> abentley: MemoryError
[16:51] <barry> abentley, james_w: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/459185
[16:51] <mup> Bug #459185: 'bzr shelve' with confirmation fails in an emacs shell buffer <Bazaar:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/459185>
[18:48] <rockstar> abentley, could you give me hints on where to put pdb trace to find this hidden exception: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/299933/
[18:49] <abentley> rockstar: I could, but I've got a good guess at the cause: you haven't configured an oops directory.
[18:51] <rockstar> abentley, you mean error_dir ?
[18:53] <abentley> rockstar: possibly
[18:54] <rockstar> abentley, looks like it, but it doesn't appear to be set in any of the other jobs in configs/schema-lazr.conf
[18:54] <abentley> rockstar: True.
[18:55] <rockstar> abentley, configs/testrunner/launchpad-lazr.conf ?
[18:55] <rockstar> It looks like that's what I need.  Thanks.
[18:55] <abentley> rockstar: The error isn't accessible to you because the test is running a script.  Run the script yourself in order for pdb to work.
[18:56] <rockstar> abentley, yeah, but it didn't fail when I just ran the script.
[18:56] <abentley> rockstar: Probably you didn't set the CONFIG environment.
[18:57] <rockstar> abentley, maybe.  Adding it to the testrunner configs made my test work.
[18:57] <abentley> rockstar: Great.
[18:57] <rockstar> abentley, this job script stuff is quite nice once you get all the intricacies of it.
[18:58] <abentley> Thanks.  It could probably do with some reworking, because I put it together gradually.
[18:58] <abentley> rockstar: And the oops reporter should scream if you try to configure it with None as the error_dir.
[18:59] <rockstar> abentley, yeah, probably.
[19:13] <rockstar> abentley, chat?
[19:13] <abentley> rockstar: sure.
[19:15] <abentley> rockstar: Where?
[19:16] <rockstar> abentley, GTalk
[22:23] <mzz> is it normal for rocketfuel-get to complain about "Not a branch" twice (once for shipit, once for canonical-identity-provider)?
[22:26] <wgrant> mzz: Yes. Those two components remain proprietary.
[22:26] <mzz> ah, ok. I didn't notice anything breaking, just making sure I wasn't accidentally running a script normal people don't use
[22:27] <wgrant> That script will die if one of the essential components fails to download
[22:57] <mzz> so! I'm trying to fix bug 456764. Iiuc I need to teach lazr.restful how to convert a timedelta to json first. I figured I'd just do that separately, build an egg with the version bumped, put it in lp-sourcedeps, and tell launchpad to use it (versions.cfg?). But to do that I need a python 2.4 setuptools.
[22:57] <mup> Bug #456764: please expose builder queue state through the api <api> <ppa> <Soyuz:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/456764>
[22:57] <mzz> questions: is this at all sane, and is there a python-setuptools for python 2.4 somewhere?
[22:59] <mzz> or hmm, I guess I could be lazy and just let ez_setup grab setuptools


[21:49] <brendand> is there an outage?
[22:21] <cjwatson> brendand: Things seem OK to me.  What are you seeing in particular?


[00:38] <RodNICE> Can I upgrade from an iso instead of via slow wifi?
[01:29] <Hailwood> Hey folks, does anyone know what the shortcut is called I need to bind so I can CTRL+Enter to bring up the window options?
[01:34] <Hailwood> It's the one currently bound to ALT+F3
[01:35] <Hailwood> Oh, Found it.
[03:34] <Hailwood> Hey folks, I'm playing around with Krunner and Im wondering if I can get it to run commands in yakuake? E.g. if I type in "ls ~/Documents" as shown in the docs I'd expect to see the output, instead krunner just hides and I get no output
[03:35] <Hailwood> The commands are actually running though as "touch ~/.krunnertest" does create the file as I'd expect.
[03:36] <SporkWitch> Hailwood: it runs it in a background process, it doesn't spawn a window unless you're calling up a persistent graphical application, such as firefox, or konsole, etc.
[03:37] <SporkWitch> Hailwood: it's not dissimilar to the run window in windows, which exhibits basically the same behaviour: it'll execute the command and that's it.  Only output you get is if the command explicitly generates a window or errors
[03:39] <Hailwood> SporkWitch, ah I see. That makes sense I suppose. Alrightly, next question - Any idea why the dictionary wouldn't be working? typing "define apple" for example gives me no feedback, not even a selectable option. The dictionary is enabled and has it's default trigger of "define" set
[03:40] <valorie> might be a backend package missing
[03:45] <SporkWitch> ^
[03:45] <SporkWitch> there's more than a few missing packages that break core functionality; muon, for example, is not included in 16.04, which breaks Discover.  Installing it via apt-get/aptitude fixes it.
[03:46] <valorie> SporkWitch: please file a bug for that; first i've heard about it
[03:46] <valorie> discover should be pulling in muon automatically
[03:47] <valorie> easiest way to file it is in the commandline: ubuntu-bug discover
[03:50] <SporkWitch> valorie: if i find the time i'll download a latest copy of the 16.04 ISO and do a fresh install in a vm to see if it hasn't been fixed.  A few others, such as the driver manager getting stuck at "gathering information" have since been fixed.  As far as muon not getting installed, it's been an issue since 15.10, i believe; i wasn't the one that figured it out, there's several threads on the ubuntu
[03:50] <SporkWitch> forums mentioning the issue and fix, hence not submitting previously
[03:51] <SporkWitch> (similar issues of infinite loading appear in the various "get more [themes/widgets/etc.]" options in various dialogs; they never actually load any results)
[03:52] <valorie> I don't read the forums
[03:52] <valorie> I doubt other packagers do either
[03:52] <SporkWitch> that'd explain why you hadn't heard of it :)
[03:52] <valorie> there is only so much time in the day
[03:52] <valorie> forums used to be useful, but that doesn't seem true anymore
[03:52] <SporkWitch> understandable; i only even encountered the issue because i intermittently will open discover just to browse any new games that might have been added
[03:53] <valorie> I try to test all the gui stuff
[03:53] <SporkWitch> i won't disagree there, though I do like the services that compile mailing lists into a forum format
[03:53] <valorie> but generally just use the cli since i'ts faster
[03:53] <SporkWitch> exactly
[03:54] <SporkWitch> the specific issue is that you can click on things in the main display, but you cannot search; no results appear, and once you try to search it pretty much goes crazy and stops accepting input in a sane manner.  Installing Muon (which is missing), resolves it after reboot.  This was the case in June / July.  Not sure if it's been fixed; I know the issue with the Driver Manager was fixed as
[03:54] <SporkWitch> recently as mid-august
[03:55] <SporkWitch> (though come to think of it, i've no idea if that was fixed in 16.04 repos, or the backports)
[03:56] <valorie> I would appreciate a test and if necessary, a BR
[03:56] <SporkWitch> yup, just giving you what info i have, with the caveat taht i'm not sure if it's still current; i'll try to find time to test and submit if necessary
[03:57] <SporkWitch> reminds me, there's one in openkeychain i need to verify, too >_<
[04:38] <Not_a_Robot> Do you guys know if it is possible to configure Plasma tilling sections, please?
[04:40] <valorie> there are some scripts
[04:40] <Not_a_Robot> I have a 55" UHD monitor and... I would like to divide the screen in more sections, not only four, for example
[04:40] <valorie> the kwin maintainer will not make it part of the mainline code for various reasons
[04:41] <Not_a_Robot> What do you mean?
[04:41] <valorie> google for kwin tiling script
[04:41] <valorie> you'll find some stuff
[04:41] <valorie> kwin is the window manager part of plasma
[04:47] <Not_a_Robot> valorie: is it possible to have something like this by default when you move windows around? http://uploadpie.com/fnLtz
[04:59] <Not_a_Robot> What do you think?
[05:07] <valorie> Not_a_Robot: I have no opinion, since I don't use my computer this way
[05:07] <Not_a_Robot> but it is possible?
[05:10] <Not_a_Robot> Please :D
[05:17] <nokbd> i think kwin froze on the live system when i was trying to not use my second monitor. I'm partitioning right now, how can i restart kwin? I can't ctrl+atl+f(1-6)
[05:17] <nokbd> i think kwin froze on the live system when i was trying to not use my second monitor.
[05:18] <nokbd> i didn't mean to do that
[05:27] <eagleeyes> What command installs KDE on Ubuntu server?
[05:30] <valorie> eagleeyes: are you wanting Plasma, or an application, or what?
[05:30] <valorie> there hasn't been "KDE" for a long time
[05:31] <nokbd> eagleeyes: sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop will give you a full experience
[05:31] <valorie> nokbd: try `plasmashell & ` in krunner
[05:32] <valorie> without the backticks
[05:32] <nokbd> kwin appears to be frozen
[05:32] <nokbd> and i can't kill the partitioner
[05:32] <nokbd> or i lose /home
[05:33] <valorie> you know how to start krunner?
[05:33] <valorie> alt+space
[05:33] <valorie> or alt+f2
[05:35] <nokbd> yes, i know krunner. alt+sysrq+r then the ctrl+alt+f1 worked
[05:36] <nokbd> kwin --replace isn't going to kill my other programs, is it?
[05:37] <valorie> no
[05:37] <valorie> just kwin
[05:39] <nokbd> everything is still frozen
[05:39] <Not_a_Robot> valorie: is there any mailing list I can send my question ,please?
[05:41] <valorie> plasma-devel if you are still talking about tiling
[05:41] <Not_a_Robot> yes, valorie.
[05:43] <eagleeyes> valorie: plasma is what I want
[05:43] <valorie> nokbd is right, you want to install kubuntu-desktop then
[05:50] <nokbd> i still have a frozen display, but VT's on the other.
[05:50] <nokbd> everything froze up when i was trying to disable one
[06:22] <nokbd> is there a way I can tell if partitionmanager is done from the CLI?
[06:29] <Not_a_Robot> valorie<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[06:30] <valorie> yes
[06:31] <nokbd> if partitionmanager is sitting at 0% CPU according to top, is it likely finished partitioning my disks?
[06:31] <nokbd> and waiting for me to click the exit?
[06:33] <valorie> hmm, never tried to do it from the cli
[06:36] <nokbd> if i was just resizing one partition, the other disk is fine, right?
[06:40] <valorie> of course
[06:40] <nokbd> i raised the elephants after hoping partitionmanager was done
[06:40] <nokbd> it all works
[06:40] <nokbd> thanks for help
[06:42] <valorie> \o/
[07:19] <Not_a_Robot> Does somebody here use Firefox?
[07:20] <acheronuk> Not_a_Robot: yes
[07:21] <Not_a_Robot> acheronuk: the other day in a friend's computer using Windows, I noticed that if you click the midle click (the wheel) in Windows while browsing in Firefox, you can scroll up and down. Do you know how to enable that feature in Kubuntu's Firefox?
[07:22] <acheronuk> Not_a_Robot: yes, just a sec
[07:23] <Not_a_Robot> ohh thanks
[07:23] <acheronuk> Not_a_Robot: I think the feature you mean is enabled by ticking "Use auto-scrolling" in the Firefox preferences
[07:24] <Not_a_Robot> ohhh, yess!!! acheronuk I love you so much :D THNAKS!
[07:25] <acheronuk> glad to help :)
[08:37] <Veizdem> Hello, prompt, and to install the kubuntu near windows 10 where you want to put grub? I put it on the section / dev / sda2 (aka efi) but after rebooting the system issues that do not have a boot disk.
[10:42] <vitorbarreto> Olá
[13:16] <Not_a_Robot> Do you guys if it is possible to save a state and shutdown the computer, completely? I would like to save the desktop (Plasma) how it is currently and shutdown the computer and then, when booting it up again, have the desktop as I have it now.
[13:16] <Not_a_Robot> Is there any workaround, please?
[13:24] <soee> Not_a_Robot: did you checked this setting On login: http://i.imgur.com/lC2P1pr.png ?
[13:26] <Not_a_Robot> soee: ok I have it. Now what do I have to do? Just shut down? But for example, I have two firefox windows... Will they appear again? Or it just reopen applications?
[13:30] <soee> Not_a_Robot: not sure, test it
[13:30] <Not_a_Robot> wish me luck. soee
[13:30] <soee> :D
[14:08] <reisen_> e a pessoal beleza
[14:08] <reisen_> all fie i here
[14:25] <soee> reisen_: what ?
[14:26] <soee> !pt | reisen_
[16:29] <BluesKaj> hey folks
[20:22] <ANTI--mossad> Hi
[20:40] <heinkel_111> when I try to update my kubuntu 15.10 installation using sudo apt-get update I get an error message that there is no public key for the following key-IDs:
[20:40] <heinkel_111> 1397BC53640DB551
[20:40] <heinkel_111> (I am translating to english, maybe a word not similar to english message)
[20:41] <heinkel_111> how do I find out which source is the problem and fix it?
[20:48] <valorie> heinkel_111: it sounds like you might have a PPA that's gone awol or so?
[20:49] <valorie> also be aware that 15.10 is no longer supported
[20:49] <valorie> best to update and upgrade to 16.04 which is an LTS
[20:59] <acheronuk> google suggests that is an old problematic google-chrome signing key from google itself
[21:08] <valorie> thanks, acheronuk
[21:09] <valorie> my advice to heinkel_111 stands -- update, dist-upgrade, and then do-release-upgrade
[21:31] <heinkel_111> thanks for the advice people
[22:07] <mparillo> Could it be 32-bit? Google dropped support for 32-bit Chrome.
[22:24] <sensei> Trying to upgrade from 14 to 16
[22:24] <RodNICE> Trying to upgrade from 14 to 16
[22:25] <soee> good, any problems ?
[22:25] <RodNICE> The 14 DVD worked (which is how I got this far) but it seems like Kubuntu boots faster than the DVD can load up
[22:25] <RodNICE> sounds weird but I think that's the issue
[22:25] <RodNICE> anyhow, I guess I'll do an upgrade over wi-fi?
[22:25] <soee> sure
[22:26] <RodNICE> should I do the sudo do-release-upgrade thing?
[22:27] <soee> i think discover should give you and upgrade option
[22:27] <soee> but yes - you can use command line
[22:29] <RodNICE> what would I search for in order to upgrade via Muon Discover?
[22:33] <soee> i think it should ask you if you want to jump to next LTS
[22:33] <soee> but you must have 14.0.1
[22:33] <RodNICE> 14.04
[22:39] <RodNICE> someone said yesterday that I should never use sudo in Kubuntu
[22:39] <RodNICE> Can someone explain that?
[22:47] <soee> RodNICE: sudo when opening dolphin
[22:48] <soee> probably this was hat they said
[22:48] <RodNICE> hm...
[22:48] <RodNICE> OK
[22:57] <mparillo> Use kdesudo when launching a graphical app (e.g. kdesudo kate /etc/hosts)
[22:57] <mparillo> You can absolutely use sudo on terminal apps (e.g. sudo nano /etc/hosts)
 @fritigern, sorry, didn't see it earler
[22:59] <RodNICE> thanks, mparillo
[23:13] <sensei> gosh... upgrading to 16 from 14.04... 1 hour 20 minutes remaining!
[23:14] <RodNICE> gosh... upgrading to 16 from 14.04... 1 hour 20 minutes remaining!
[23:14] <RodNICE> Oh boy
[23:14] <RodNICE> That's what I get for cheaping out on internet at home
[23:16] <RodNICE> What happens if I disconnect while the Distribution Upgrade is getting new packages?
[23:25] <SerialLantern> FYI n00b ... samba is not running after entering password
[23:31] <SerialLantern> libuser.conf did not exist ... created it and configuration window opened ... i should be good to go from here
[23:53] <RodNICE> upgrading to 16.04
[23:53] <RodNICE> Seems like it went from me needing to wait 4 hours to now only 20 minutes
[23:53] <RodNICE> woo hoo!
[23:54] <soee> :-)
[23:57] <RodNICE> Thank you guys for all your help. If you don't hear from me in over a week, you'll know that 16.04 crashed my computer, lol
[23:58] <RodNICE> *6 minutes remaining*
[23:58] <RodNICE> After the "Getting new packages" step, would it be OK to drop internet connection?


[03:13] <bluesabre> evening all
[03:14] <Unit193> Howdy.
[03:14] <bluesabre> hey Unit193
[03:14] <bluesabre> quick on the response there :)
[07:13] <flocculant> jjfrv8: don't see galaxy - see breeze here both live/install reported to bug 1548647
[07:14] <flocculant> ochosi bluesabre ^^ - I think -artwork is the right package - that at least is where I can see LO theme in the changelog :)
[07:14] <flocculant> Nairwolf: welcome back - read the backlog - seen your tracker report - thanks :)
[07:16] <Nairwolf> flocculant, that's nothing ;)
[07:16] <Nairwolf> thank you for your help with zsync ;)
[07:16] <flocculant> that's nothing ;)
[07:17] <Nairwolf> I hope being able to help xubuntu more often, now ;)
[07:17] <flocculant> that's great :)
[10:30] <Akxwi-dave> Bluesabre.. Got some font feedback for you... been using it for the past 5 days... After a few days you cant tell the difference.. I have it on desktop  @ 1920x1080 and laptop on 1366x768 and looks good.
[10:31] <Akxwi-dave> Noto-san on gui and noto-mono on term..  all at 9 ..
[10:36] <bluesabre> Akxwi-dave: great, good to hear
[10:38] <bluesabre> flocculant: surprised that we are even installing breeze. ochosi and I need to work on our theme upstream in libreoffice so we can have them handle the packaging and fix weird issues like that
[11:52] <knome> bluesabre, ping
[11:59] <knome> pleia2, requesting contest.xubuntu.org
[12:30] <bluesabre> knome: hey
[12:31] <flocculant> hi bluesabre
[12:31] <bluesabre> hey flocculant
[12:32] <bluesabre> flocculant: nearly got the catfish clicking sorted... not sure how it became such a mess, but lets blame changes in GTK ;)
[12:32] <flocculant> yea
[12:33] <flocculant> obviously I blamed that mentally anyway :D
[12:36] <bluesabre> flocculant: I'll likely be trying to get this uploaded, as well as the font changes on Thursday after b1 isos are up
[12:36] <flocculant> ok :)
[12:36] <flocculant> there's going to definitely be 1 rebuild - probably more ...
[12:37] <flocculant> currently ubiquity crashes in flames if hardware includes a battery :)
[12:37] <bluesabre> yiiiiiikes
[12:37] <flocculant> figuratively speaking - not exploding batteries :D
[12:38]  * bluesabre breathes a sigh of relief
[12:38] <flocculant> :)
[12:39] <flocculant> if it was that bad I'd have m/list(s) +website + anything else I could think of :)
[12:45] <bluesabre> :D
[13:05] <Akxwi-dave> Think I'll leave the iso testing off my laptop then.. :-)
[15:47] <pleia2> knome: great
[20:19] <genii> oooo
[20:54] <pleia2> aiming for wednesday, mar 2nd at 17UTC for our next meeting, will anyone be around? :D
[20:54] <knome> wednesdays are a bit bad for me
[20:55] <knome> at least at that time i can't promise to be available
[20:55] <pleia2> thursday better?
[20:55] <knome> yep, wed has the only blocker
[20:55] <pleia2> ok, the 3rd then
[20:55] <knome> wfm
[20:56] <Unit193> My client will be connected, I may even read backlog.
[20:57] <pleia2> alright, good enough for me
[20:57] <knome> lol
[20:57] <knome> not very high standards then
[20:57] <pleia2> :P
[20:59] <ochosi> i'll do my best, can't promise anything though unfortunately
[21:00] <knome> ochosi, we know "your best"
[21:00] <ochosi> thanks :)
[21:00] <Unit193> Yeah, have his client break and disappear a few days before. :---D
[21:01] <knome> ochosi, not "you're best"
[22:25] <Nairwolf> hi
[22:25] <Nairwolf> is it still necessary to do test with the daily iso, or can I use the beta version ?
[22:25] <Nairwolf> with zsync the iso is different
[22:34] <knome> depends which milestone you are reporting tests against
[22:34] <knome> currently, we are testing beta1
[22:34] <knome> but please note that the beta1 images might get updated too
[22:34] <Nairwolf> ah ;)
[22:34] <knome> so make sure you have the latest beta1 image
[22:35] <Nairwolf> what is the difference between beta1 umage updated and the daily build ?
[22:36] <knome> beta - or any other milestone - is essentially a snapshot of the daily ISOs
[22:37] <Nairwolf> ok
[22:37] <knome> so theoretically on the first day of the milestone testing the image is the same
[22:37] <knome> but in an ideal situation, the milestone image would not change until the release of the milestone
[22:37] <Nairwolf> ok, so I have the same iso in fact
[22:37] <bluesabre> knome: poke
[22:38] <Nairwolf> ok, why it has changed ?
[22:38] <knome> no, because in real life, bugs happen and they are fixed and ISOs are updated
[22:38] <knome> so whenever zsync tells you you need to get new data, you need to.
[22:38] <knome> bluesabre, i'll poke you back in 15ish
[22:38] <bluesabre> knome: okie doke
[22:39] <Nairwolf> sorry, I don't understand
[22:39] <Nairwolf> you
[22:39] <Nairwolf> Yesterday, I downloaded the beta iso, and now, I've updated it with zsync
[22:39] <knome> then you have what you should.
[22:40] <Nairwolf> the correct beta image is here ? http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/357/builds
[22:40] <knome> but you also need to make sure with zsync if it has been updated
[22:40] <knome> s/also/always/
[22:40] <Nairwolf> yes
[22:40] <Nairwolf> i've done that
[22:40] <knome> ...so what's the question?
[22:42] <Nairwolf> my first question was "is it more important to test the daily iso or to test again the beta 1". But I didn't know that the beta1 image has changed, so, I'm going to test it again ;)
[22:43] <knome> whenever there is a milestone iso, that
[22:44] <Nairwolf> that ?
[22:44] <Nairwolf> Sorry, my english isn't perfect, I don't understand you...
[22:45] <knome> whenever we have a milestone iso, it is the priority to test the milestone iso
[22:45] <Nairwolf> okay, I didn't know that
[22:46] <Nairwolf> and how could I know that the beta 1 was updated ?
[22:46] <Nairwolf> (sorry for being annoying with my questions, I'm a newbie in QA)
[22:47] <knome> you know the beta1 (or any image) is updated by running the zsync command
[22:47] <Nairwolf> ok
[22:47] <knome> or the ISO version mentioned on the page you posted
[22:47] <knome> (basically if it's different than it was before, it's updated)
[22:47] <Nairwolf> I thought I've missed a mail or something like that
[22:50] <knome> sometimes it's specifically announced if it includes a very important update
[22:50] <knome> sometimes all flavor ISOs are updated because a common bug has been found
[22:50] <knome> in those cases the respin/update might not have a specific mention
[22:52] <Nairwolf> ok, isn't because of the ubiquity bug ?
[22:53] <Nairwolf> oh.... I can't boot on my usb key...
[22:53] <Nairwolf> Have you ever seen a message like that "No DEFAULT or UI configuration directive found!" and I have this prompt "boot: _"
[22:54] <knome> this time it might be of the ubiquity bug - that would be a common bug - but i don't know, i haven't tested the beta
[22:54] <flocculant> bluesabre: just so you know - upower still causing issues - I did us a rebuild - still an issue
[22:54] <flocculant> hi knome :)
[22:55] <flocculant> pleia2: 5pm is goodish for me - I should be about
[22:55] <knome> hey flocculant
[22:55] <pleia2> flocculant: great, thanks :)
[22:56] <Nairwolf> hi flocculant ;)
[22:56] <Nairwolf> ok, thank you knome ;)
[22:56] <flocculant> hey Nairwolf :)
[22:57] <flocculant> Nairwolf: if you are not sure if image is current - zsync it - it will say it has 100% and no need to download
[22:57] <flocculant> or words to that effect
[23:03] <Nairwolf> ok, thank you flocculant for your advices ;)
[23:03] <flocculant> no problem
[23:04] <flocculant> ftr it says "Read xenial-desktop-amd64.iso. Target 100.0% complete."
[23:06] <Nairwolf> yes, I've understood that, but firstly, I went to the daily iso, and I thought it's a new daily build and it's normal
[23:08] <flocculant> Nairwolf: for all intents and purposes the milestone and the daily are one and the same
[23:08] <Nairwolf> ok
[23:13] <flexiondotorg_> flocculant, Wha?
[23:14] <flocculant> not important - net split after freenode shenanigans - just 3 of us in here :)
[23:14] <bluesabre> o/
[23:15] <flocculant> hi bluesabre
[23:17] <bluesabre> hey flocculant
[23:17] <knome> flocculant, not always :)
[23:19] <knome> bluesabre, ok, so your turn to test my "app" ;)
[23:19] <knome> http://temp.knome.fi/xubuntu/wallpaper-contest/xubuntu-wallpaper-contest.tar.gz
[23:19] <flocculant> cya tomorrow peeps
[23:19] <knome> nighty flocculant
[23:19] <bluesabre> cya flocculant
[23:20] <knome> bluesabre, hint: it's a wordpress plugin
[23:22] <bluesabre> knome: ah
[23:23]  * bluesabre installs wordpress on his laptop
[23:24]  * cjbayliss hopes he didn't read that right
[23:24] <knome> which one?
[23:30] <bluesabre> knome: so, plugin installed
[23:30] <bluesabre> now what?
[23:30] <knome> bluesabre, see the sidebar
[23:30] <knome> bluesabre, in admin, that is
[23:30] <bluesabre> aha
[23:30] <knome> it should be more or less self-explanatory at this point
[23:30] <knome> voting and vote results are visible currently for admins
[23:31] <bluesabre> knome: cool, seems to work
[23:31] <Nairwolf> looks like there is still the bug with ubiquity and batterie....
[23:32] <knome> Nairwolf, then link that to your test report
[23:32] <bluesabre> knome: yup, painless
[23:32] <knome> bluesabre, good :)
[23:32] <Nairwolf> yes
[23:32] <knome> we should get the marketing wheels rolling then!
[23:32] <knome> (we almost have a new subdomain for this too)
[23:32] <bluesabre> knome: great :D
[23:33] <knome> also, probably sensible to check the terms too
[23:33] <knome> and add stuff there as needed
[23:33] <bluesabre> already reading
[23:33] <knome> and a final check on an openid/launchpad enabled site to make sure everything goes smoothly there
[23:33] <knome> it's mostly copied from the old terms page
[23:33] <pleia2> "almost"!
[23:34] <knome> pleia2, well, ticket is sent, IS has confirmed they understand what we're saying
[23:34] <knome> (eg. not talking gobbledigook)
[23:34] <pleia2> I know :)
[23:34] <knome> but of course, you know everything ;)
[23:38] <bluesabre> brb
[23:42] <knome> pleia2, you might want to take a look at the plugin as well
[23:48] <Nairwolf> guys, I'm doing this testcase : http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/357/builds/113180/testcases/1300/results and I have a strange "error"
[23:48] <Nairwolf> Failed to create a swap space
[23:48] <Nairwolf> Do you think it's a bug, or is it something with my computer ?


[01:15] <oldmanstan> who be in charge of translations? anybody?
[01:35] <somerville32> oldmanstan, Ogra was at one point
[02:05] <somerville32> oldmanstan, ping
[02:23] <btrigg> Hi There.  I'm on the Colorado LoCo and we have been discussing a user-friendly and educational way to confront this issue: http://ubuntuforums.org/announcement.php?a=54
[02:23] <btrigg> An idea we had was a sort of "sudo tutorial": A graphical tutorial on fresh-installs that pops up and details the power and danger of running commands as root prior to allowing any root commands to be run.
[02:23] <btrigg> I was referred here from #ubuntu-motu
[02:24] <btrigg> Is this the place to find a champion for this idea?
[02:25] <somerville32> btrigg, We already discuss the issue in the shipped documentation
[02:25] <oldmanstan> btrigg: your goal is to make the issue real obvious to new ppl?
[02:26] <btrigg> Understood.  But our thought is that RTFM isn't really that user-friendly.
[02:26] <btrigg> Yes.
[02:26] <somerville32> Unfortunately, there is no way to fully protect the user even if we forced them to try and read it
[02:26] <btrigg> Docs are great if you are looking for something.  If you don't know what you don't know, then docs aren't really that effective.
[02:27] <somerville32> btrigg, You might want to look for the people looking on the Welcome centre specification
[02:27] <btrigg> Agreed; we cannot save everyone from themselves.
[02:27] <somerville32> s/looking/working
[02:28] <btrigg> Ok, thanks, I appreciate that.
[02:30] <btrigg> The idea is that if we, as Ubuntu, provide education, then the folks who choose to ignore it are out of luck.  But we can say that we do educate our users instead of just letting them hang themselves or, worse, not letting them have enough rope to try.
[02:31] <somerville32> Sadly, I think most people would close to pop-up anyhow or be scarred away
[02:31] <somerville32> First thing they see when their new OS boots up:
[02:31] <somerville32> "DO NOT RUN THE FOLLOWING COMMANDS OR ELSE:"
[02:31] <btrigg> :-)
[02:32] <btrigg> Well...not like that exactly..
[02:32] <btrigg> More like...
[02:32] <btrigg> "As with any OS, there are dangers with installing software from unknown sources"
[02:32] <btrigg> Etc.
[02:33] <btrigg> Please enter the root password to confirm you've read this and continue installing.
[02:33] <btrigg> That kind of thing.
[02:33] <somerville32> lol
[02:33] <somerville32> We tell them not to randomly enter their root password and then we get them to do it :P
[02:33] <btrigg> lol
[02:33] <btrigg> Well...this is still within the comfy confines of their own system.
[02:34] <btrigg> And we'd give them an out for that.
[02:34] <btrigg> Have them enter the password and then choose to continue or abort.
[02:34] <btrigg> Either way, the tutorial would be gone for good going forward.
[02:36] <btrigg> You see where we're going with this, though, right?
[02:36] <btrigg> Somewhere between man sudo and "allow or deny".
[02:37] <somerville32> "You attempted to close this window. Allow or deny?"
[02:37] <btrigg> Right.    We know better" Extreme.
[02:38] <btrigg> And the RTFM extreme on the other end.
[02:38] <btrigg> Somewhere between those two.
[02:39] <btrigg> We're looking at the: "It's your system.  Here's how to use it wisely" approach.
[02:40] <btrigg> If we came up with the text for it to be reviewed would that help?
[02:40] <somerville32> Well, we can include it in the documentation
[02:41] <somerville32> :)
[02:41] <btrigg> Great, thanks!
[02:41] <kgoetz> i dont think more popups will go down well with upstream/s. makin teh 'enter your password' dialguges more usful would be better imo
[02:41] <btrigg> kgoetz: There's an idea
[02:42] <btrigg> Like maybe context-sensitive warnings?
[02:42] <btrigg> i.e. "rm -rf" can cause harm to your system type of stuff?
[02:42] <somerville32> lol
[02:43] <btrigg> What?  Why is that funny?
[02:43] <kgoetz> deja vu
[02:43] <kgoetz> just reading this http://ubuntuforums.org/announcement.php?a=54 ;)
[02:43] <btrigg> Ah...yes.
[02:43] <kgoetz> "rm -rf /"
[02:43] <kgoetz> *grin*
[02:44] <btrigg> That's what started this whole discussion in our LoCo.
[02:44] <btrigg> But you can see why we could be shooting ourselves in the foot with this, yes?
[02:44] <btrigg> We may not have the virus issue, but social engineering...that affects all of us.
[02:45] <somerville32> btrigg, How does Windows deal with it?
[02:45] <oldmanstan> btrigg: i agree
[02:45] <btrigg> somerville32: lol
[02:45] <kgoetz> problem is people get used to clicking 'close', and the more you ask them to, the less chance there is they'll do anything else
[02:45] <btrigg> "Allow or Deny"
[02:45] <kgoetz> windows's i've used havent *heh*
[02:45] <oldmanstan> the key is people have to realize that they need to read at least a little about their new os
[02:46] <oldmanstan> what about doing a screencast on "the dangers of sudo", talk to alan pope in #ubuntu-uk and those kids
[02:46] <btrigg> oldmanstan: Agreed.  But really..who reads docs?
[02:46] <oldmanstan> yeah, that's why a screencast might be good
[02:46] <btrigg> oldmanstan: Awesome, thanks.
[02:47] <oldmanstan> then throw it in people's desktops by default with a label saying "click here first!!!" or something, haha
[02:47] <btrigg> We are just looking to give some education.  Maybe (pray) that it will reinforce the idea of reading the fine manual.
[02:47] <btrigg> lol.  Yes.  Great idea, though!
[02:47] <oldmanstan> yeah, i agree with your mission 100%, it's a tough task though
[02:47] <btrigg> And...it can showcase the multimedia spiffiness of Ubuntu.
[02:48] <btrigg> Great.  Thanks.
[02:48] <oldmanstan> indeed
[02:48]  * kgoetz finds the forums post a bit alarmist
[02:48] <btrigg> Yes.  It is tough.  But I think it's the right thing to do.
[02:48] <oldmanstan> add it to the lovely nelson mandela video
[02:48] <kgoetz> for thos who can download vidoe of course
[02:48] <btrigg> It is a bit alarmist, but I also think it has the chance to become an "I told you so" topic.
[02:49] <oldmanstan> we could get it preinstalled with the distro possibly
[02:49] <btrigg> Yes.    Freedom.
[02:50] <kgoetz> macs for freedom? bs.
[02:50] <btrigg> But with freedom come responsibility.  And if someone doesn't say: "Here is one of them.  You can find more here...", then they can be scarred for like.
[02:50] <kgoetz> but thats an aside
[02:51] <btrigg> Yes.  But that's a reason whether we like/believe it or not.
[02:51] <kgoetz> i'll point out that video is huge, and the discs are squeezed for space as is
[02:51] <btrigg> Flash video?  Should be smaller?
[02:51] <oldmanstan> or dump the mandela video
[02:52] <btrigg> Or a Presentation file?
[02:52] <oldmanstan> ogg videos aren't "huge", the mandela one that we install is only 3.5 mb and it's a minute and a half
[02:53] <kgoetz> so 3 minutes of video is 1% of the cdrom.
[02:53] <oldmanstan> like i said, dump the mandela video
[02:53]  * kgoetz mutters about vim-tiny's presense on the cd. perhaps that carp can go
[02:53] <btrigg> lol
[02:54] <oldmanstan> and make it a minute and a half, kind of a "don't do drugs kids" warning thing and our net space on the disc is zero
[02:54] <oldmanstan> haha
[02:54] <oldmanstan> even if it wasn't on the cd though, it could still be featured prominantly
[02:54] <kgoetz> i still think the improving dialges holds merit
[02:54] <kgoetz> *sp (again :$)
[02:54] <oldmanstan> i think more people will watch a video than will read a document
[02:54] <btrigg> Yes.  Like a link to a hosted video on the net somewhere?
[02:54] <kgoetz> depends where said person is located
[02:55] <oldmanstan> yeah, it wouldn't have 100% penetration, but it would be something
[02:55] <btrigg> Subtitles
[02:55] <kgoetz> (i already have that issue with ubuntu install 'extras')
[02:55] <oldmanstan> changing the dialogs is definitely a thing to bug people about too though
[02:55] <btrigg> Agreed.
[02:56] <oldmanstan> a video could be made easily with minimal bureaucracy though
[02:56] <btrigg> So how do we get this started on our end?  Write the text?
[02:56] <oldmanstan> i would talk to the screencast ppl, i'm not sure if they have their own channel, but i know alan pope hangs out in #ubuntu-uk and he's in charge of it
[02:56] <kgoetz> btrigg: email the mailing list with a proposal
[02:56] <btrigg> I know a guy who does a GREAT Mandela impersonation...he could read it.  And then we could keep the Mandela aspect and still give the safety warning.  :-)
[02:57] <oldmanstan> lol
[02:57] <kgoetz> call it a 'spec' for bonus poits ;)
[02:57] <btrigg> Just kidding about that.  Sorry.
[02:57] <btrigg> kgoetz:  Ok, thanks much again!
[02:57] <oldmanstan> kgoetz: good point, people love "specs"
[02:57] <kgoetz> oldmanstan: canonicals projects in particular :)
[02:57] <oldmanstan> fer sure
[02:58] <btrigg> Make it a business case type spec?  More formal = more consideration?
[02:58] <oldmanstan> all about the launchpad
[02:58] <kgoetz> yep.
[02:58] <somerville32> omg, lmao
[02:58]  * somerville32 swats btrigg with a fanny of ubuntu cds
[02:58] <btrigg> :-)
[02:58] <btrigg> Ok...so I'm a noob dork.
[02:58] <oldmanstan> honestly i would  informally approach a couple ppl first, and then work on formalizing it
[02:58] <btrigg> But why smack me?
[02:59] <oldmanstan> but that's how i like doin stuff
[02:59] <btrigg> Ok.  And does that work?
[02:59] <btrigg> brb...bedtime for the nipper.  :-)
[03:01] <kgoetz> :)
[03:01]  * kgoetz hands over invoice to employer
[03:02] <btrigg> back
[03:02] <btrigg> lol
[03:03] <btrigg> Ok.  Well thank you everyone for the input, ideas, and advice.  I will take this back to our LoCo and we'll go from there.
[03:03] <oldmanstan> btrigg: #ubuntu-screencasts
[03:03] <kgoetz> :) good luck with it
[03:03] <oldmanstan> if you decide to go that route
[03:03] <oldmanstan> good luck!
[03:04] <btrigg> Thanks much again!
[03:04] <btrigg> Hi FunnyLookinHat
[03:04] <FunnyLookinHat> howdy
[03:05] <btrigg> You missed all the good stuff.  :-)
[03:05] <btrigg> Folks here are awesome.
[03:06] <oldmanstan> we are, you should get involved in the doc-team btrigg
[03:07] <oldmanstan> then we could have parties like this all the time! hehehe </plug>
[03:07] <kgoetz> hehe. talk about shameless :D
[03:08] <btrigg> lol
[03:09] <oldmanstan> that's how a roll
[03:09] <btrigg> I'm in my masters program and time is limited.  What kind of time commitment would we be talking here?
[03:09] <oldmanstan> not much, i'm doing a masters too and i'm pretty ok (admittedly mine isn't terribly time-consuming)
[03:10] <kgoetz> i'm not doign masters and i have no time :D
[03:10] <btrigg> kgoetz: lol
[03:10] <kgoetz> ;)
[03:10] <oldmanstan> you basically just edit docbook files (like html on crack)
[03:11] <btrigg> Cool.  Ok.  Is there a website where I can learn more?
[03:11] <btrigg> Get an idea of what it's all about, etc?
[03:11] <oldmanstan> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam
[03:11] <kgoetz> beat me :|
[03:12] <oldmanstan> :) i was hurrying cuz i knew you'd be getting it too
[03:12] <kgoetz> :P hey, good use of competition
[03:12] <oldmanstan> exactly
[03:12] <btrigg> lol
[03:13] <btrigg> Excellent, thanks much!
[03:13] <btrigg> And if I can swing it, then what?  Come back here and say, "Lay it on me" or what?
[03:13] <oldmanstan> well hit up https://lists.ubuntu.com
[03:14] <oldmanstan> and sign up for the ubuntu-doc list
[03:14] <oldmanstan> actually here it is doc
[03:14] <oldmanstan> http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-doc
[03:14] <oldmanstan> there we go
[03:15] <btrigg> Ok, cool, thanks.
[03:15] <oldmanstan> and then take a look around at the docs and see what kinds of things you'd like to work on
[03:15] <oldmanstan> then let everyone know by emailing the list and people either there or here will help you out in getting started
[03:15] <btrigg> Sweet.  Sounds good.
[03:15] <kgoetz> and more people with ideas to smack down can only be good :D
[03:15] <btrigg> lol
[03:15] <kgoetz> er, discuss :P
[03:15] <btrigg> Yes.
[03:15] <oldmanstan> haha
[03:16] <oldmanstan> if you are at all interested in helping with docs for xubuntu (dunno which distro you use) we are looking for people to help out
[03:16] <oldmanstan> you don't have to actually use a distro to write docs for it, but it helps
[03:16] <btrigg> Ok.  I run Ubuntu and have a laptop and backup machine on Kubuntu.
[03:16] <btrigg> Understood.
[03:17] <kgoetz> oldmanstan: i'm thinking about 'idot testing' the docs for kubuntu, so i'im happy to do xubuntu too :)
[03:17] <btrigg> I could pop Xubuntu on the laptop and run all three.
[03:17] <oldmanstan> go for it kgoetz we can use all the help we can get
[03:18] <kgoetz> Kamping_Kaiser: ^^ start downloading :)
[03:18] <oldmanstan> btrigg: well have a look around the docs and see what you'd like to do, it's not urgent or anything
[03:18] <oldmanstan> there's a docbook tutorial on the wiki also
[03:18] <btrigg> Ok oldmanstan.  Will do.
[03:19] <oldmanstan> welcome aboard!
[03:19] <btrigg> Excellent.  I will peruse that and let you know.  :-)
[03:19] <btrigg> Thanks!
[03:19] <oldmanstan> no prob
[07:11] <werewolf1985> hi
[17:01] <sommer> hey all, is the development branch of the docs built and served on the web somewhere?  in a draft status or something?
[17:03] <somerville32> docs.ubuntu.com ?
[17:04] <sommer> somerville32: doesn't look updated
[17:05] <somerville32> doc.ubuntu.com ?
[17:05] <sommer> somerville32: ya, doc.ubuntu.com
[17:06] <sommer> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/advanced-topics/C/index.html > Installing Server Applications
[17:06] <sommer> still points to a ghelp link
[17:06] <sommer> which I think was an issue with the old Server Guide... before it was merged into the generic folder
[17:06] <sommer> I could be wrong though
[17:11] <somerville32> The build is out of date most likely
[17:11] <somerville32> sommer, file a bug SVP
[17:12] <sommer> SVP?
[17:12] <somerville32> please
[17:12] <sommer> should the bug be filed agains the web site or doc team?
[17:14] <sommer> I guess I can file it against the web site and subscibe the doc team
[17:22] <somerville32> sommer, doc-team