[02:23] <tepsipakki> hi, I'm trying to preseed a server install to use a server-kernel, but so far without success
[02:27] <tepsipakki> so the question is, does the vanilla server-installation prompt the user for a kernel?
[02:27] <tepsipakki> or is "linux-server" something that has to be installed by hand?
[02:31] <tepsipakki> maybe I'll just file a bug..
[06:31] <lapo> hi
[06:56] <lapo> would be possible to have a more recent dovecot in dapper (in sid there are packages for the lastest one which is beta3)?
[06:57] <fabbione> no
[06:58] <fabbione> we are in deep bug fix mode only
[06:58] <lapo> beta3 fixes a lot of bugs :-)
[06:59] <lapo> I have a lot of "Corrupted index cache file" errors with the current build
[07:01] <fabbione> i am using it with no issue
[07:01] <fabbione> file a bug if you think it is utterly important to have the newest version
[07:02] <lapo> fabbione, #30314
[07:02] <fabbione> ok than somebody will process it
[07:02] <fabbione> sooner or laer
[07:02] <fabbione> later
[07:03] <lapo> I have the maildirs on xfs, can it be the source of the problem?
[07:04] <lapo> nothing is writing to those maildirs atm, except for dovecot
[07:04] <fabbione> yes
[07:04] <fabbione> xfs sucks
[07:05] <fabbione> like many others fs
[07:05] <fabbione> ext2 or ext3
[07:05] <fabbione> these are the only 2 i trust for my data
[07:05] <fabbione> ext2 if they are really really sensible
[07:07] <Psi-Jack> Anyone use any DNS server that uses mysql-based table lookups?
[07:20] <lapo> fabbione, seems like that the  "Corrupted index cache file" is not caused by xfs, I have the same behaviour with ext3 as well
[07:32] <lapo> fabbione, I found out references to that index corruption problem, seems like related to 64bit system, and seems like fixed in lthe betas, see http://www.dovecot.org/list/dovecot/2006-February/011360.html
[07:46] <lapo> fabbione, I filed #33457 regarding this thing, thanks for your attention
[07:46] <lapo> bye
[09:05] <eri1> hello?
[09:06] <eri1> I accidentaly overwrote root user in phpmyadmin and locked myself out, any way to fix that?
[09:08] <ivoks> yes
[09:09] <ivoks> but you have to be root
[09:10] <eri1> yeah
[09:10] <eri1> ...
[09:10] <ivoks> stop mysql service
[09:10] <ivoks>  /etc/init.d/mysql stop
[09:11] <ivoks> then run: mysqld --skip-grant-tables
[09:11] <ivoks> be aware
[09:11] <ivoks> now *everyone* can write in your DB
[09:12] <ivoks> log into your phpmyadmin and set a new password for root
[09:12] <ivoks> kill mysqld and start it as a service
[09:13] <eri1> how do I stop a service?
[09:13] <ivoks> /etc/init.d/mysql stop
[09:14] <ivoks> this is a question for #ubuntu
[09:18] <eri1> thank you
[09:32] <ivoks> np


[01:02]  * bspencer attempts to fix hardy image failure by pushing cairo and pango source packages to PPA...
[16:06] <taosinker> hi all
[16:06] <taosinker> nice to meet you
[16:06] <taosinker> why no any msg left by you?
[17:01] <sabotage> lool: ping
[17:02] <lool> sabotage: pong
[17:02] <lool> sabotage: I'm in the conference call
[17:02] <sabotage> I was looking into the blueprint for theming action from last meeting
[17:02] <sabotage> and I find this: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/mobile-theming
[17:02] <sabotage> but I can not edit it, no permission to create the blueprint
[17:03] <sabotage> lool: sorry, get back to me when not on a call
[17:04] <lool> sabotage: Are you a member of ubuntu-mobile?
[17:04] <sabotage> yes (pretty sure)
[17:04] <lool> sabotage: I think Tollef is the owner and we are stuck
[17:05] <lool> Mithrandir: Can you make ubuntu-mobile owner of the specs you currently own
[17:06] <sabotage> confirmed, I am a member of ubuntu-mobile
[17:06] <lool> sabotage: probably an ownership issue
[17:06] <sabotage> ok...I also did not have the ability to register a new blueprint so...
[17:07] <sabotage> maybe has to do with my permissions?
[17:07] <lool> sabotage: I've mailed Mithrandir to please set ubuntu-mobile as owner
[17:07] <sabotage> lool: thanks
[19:07] <bspencer> no bfiller ?
[19:09] <smagoun> lool: have you or anyone on your team tried elisa on a Q1? I get a nasty message about my graphics hardware not being configured right, have you seen it?
[19:10] <smagoun> "Your graphical hardware is not properly configured to support 3D software such as Elisa Media Center"
[19:11] <smagoun> I have elisa-0.3.5-1, and other 3D apps work fine
[19:12] <lool> smagoun: I didn't see it
[19:13] <lool> smagoun: I know some hardware isn't supported by pigment ATM with a SVN only fix, but I don't think this was associated with an error message
[19:15] <smagoun> lool: found a workaround. Naturally it has nothing to do w/ the error message :(
[19:15] <smagoun> https://code.fluendo.com/elisa/trac/ticket/1165
[19:16] <lool> smagoun: wow
[19:17] <lool> smagoun: If you find a nicer patch, I'll bridge it to the archive or upstream; they are on #elisa BTW
[19:17] <lool> s/nicer/nice
[19:17] <lool> s/nice/
[19:18] <smagoun> lool: ok, thanks
[19:53] <smagoun> bfiller: The problem with the mobile-basic-flash in the PPA is that the version is 0.35, which is incorrect (there is no such thing as 0.35, it hasn't been released). Sounds like there's another problem on Intel's side, there are two 0.34 tags in git (hardy-v0.34 and RELEASE_0.34) that contain very different code.
[19:54] <bspencer> bfiller, ping
[19:54] <bfiller> smagoun: ok
[19:54] <bfiller> bspencer: what's up
[19:54] <bspencer> bfiller, howdy.  we finished first round of changes for freedesktop.org
[19:55] <bfiller> bspencer: great
[19:55] <bspencer> it makes changes and may have unexpected results
[19:55] <bfiller> bspencer: such as?
[19:55] <bspencer> I added two gconf keys:   onlyshowin_filter and onlyshowin_ignore to help reduce the short term impact
[19:56] <bspencer> if an application doesn't supply OnlyShowIn=GNOME;Mobile, then it doesn't appear
[19:56] <bspencer> if it has a category that doesn't map to gnome-menus default, it will show up in "Other"
[19:56] <bspencer> the nice "Mobile" category is gone
[19:56] <bspencer> the default home screen now comes up to Accessories as the first thing the user sees
[19:57] <lool> bspencer: Did you discuss this at FreeDesktop or GNOME?  It would rock to get applications writer set this key properly in their .Desktop files
[19:57] <bspencer> galculator doesn't have an icon
[19:57] <bspencer> ...the list is long
[19:58] <bfiller> bspencer: so if onlyshowin_ignore is true, then all apps will be displayed in "Other" even if they don't have the onlyshowin property set?
[19:58] <bspencer> bfiller, not exactly...
[19:58] <bspencer> onlyshowin_filter = bool     FALSE = don't filter anything
[19:59] <bspencer> if FALSE, then it will show all .desktop file apps.   (e.g. bluetooth_analyzer, etc.)
[19:59] <bspencer> if TRUE, it filters and you get a very reduced set
[19:59] <bfiller> bspencer: I see
[19:59] <bspencer> so I added the next key:  onlyshowin_ignore = [list of desktop files to show regardless]
[20:00] <bspencer> onlyshowin_ignore defaults to something like  [browser, moblin-media(x3), galculator, mousepad, ...]
[20:00] <bspencer> onlyshowin_ignore should be removed later when everyone is onboard.
[20:00] <bspencer> open for suggestions
[20:01] <bspencer> I kind of think that while using .desktop is nice, using OnlyShowIn is a hassle
[20:01] <bspencer> but it is standard
[20:01] <lool> bspencer: It's required for systems where you install KDE and GNOME packages for instance
[20:01] <bfiller> bspencer: it sounds like a good solution. The key is making the .desktop files correct
[20:02] <bspencer> one thing undefined is what to show on the first-time, because "Accessories" is lame, and "All" now shows the Preferences apps so it is too cluttered
[20:02] <bspencer> and I was hesitant to fork the gnome_menu and add a new "Mobile" category
[20:03] <lool> bspencer: What about adding a Main or Home category?
[20:03] <bspencer> what we would need is either to have a mobile-basic-flash specific config, or add a new category group to /etc/xdg/menus/application.menu combined with .desktop file changes to add themselves to this group
[20:03] <bspencer> lool, yes, right that is an option.
[20:04] <bspencer> but how does an app-writer know if he should be there?  That is a UI-specific decisoin.
[20:04] <bspencer> s/UI/Home-screen implementation
[20:04] <bfiller> bspencer: I think adding a new category group to application.menu combined with .desktop would make sense
[20:05] <bfiller> bspencer: the same way apps have conditional mobile code for ui they could do the same for .desktop?
[20:05] <lool> bspencer: Why not simply not use All but some sensible Applications combination of all categories?
[20:05] <lool> That is, Home would only show the .desktop files in categories which we have decided should be on the home screen
[20:06] <bspencer> lool, bfiller   you're going in separate directions
[20:06] <bspencer> lool's idea is easier and is mobile-basic-flash specific, true?
[20:06] <lool> bfiller: I think bspencer is correct that it's hard for people to tell whether to list their app in this category
[20:06] <lool> And it would be lots of patching
[20:07] <lool> bspencer: We could set a per category flag whether to include it or not
[20:07] <bspencer> lool, that would be simple enough.  We could add another gconf key even with a list of Home categories.
[20:07] <bfiller> lool: but aren't apps going to have modify their .desktop files already to add the onlyshowin property to be shown in the mobile UI?
[20:08] <lool> Actually we can probably express it already; something like <Not><Category>Settings</Category></Not>
[20:08] <lool> bfiller: But that's going to be done as part of hildonization
[20:08] <lool> bfiller: While deciding whether to be shown or not by default is a bit hard to ask to an upstream
[20:09] <bspencer> and one mobile UI might choose to only show 4 apps, while another (ours) would show all apps except Preferenes
[20:09] <lool> bfiller: It might be simpler to have a specific .menu file rather than gconf keys IMO
[20:09] <lool> s/bfiller/bspencer
[20:09] <lool> So many b*s!
[20:10] <bfiller> lool: as part of hildonization for .desktop files why would it be difficult to add "Category=Mobile"?
[20:10] <lool> bspencer: Hmm that's a good point; but the configuration place already exists
[20:10] <lool> bspencer: Let us simply define a Menu which corresponds to what to show on the home screen and this should be customized by each implementation
[20:11] <lool> bfiller: That's fine, it's exactly what I agree should be done; what's hard is to ask people to add X-ShowOnHomeScreen: yes or similar
[20:11] <bspencer> won't everyone just put that, even if they shouldn't be on the home screen?
[20:11] <lool> Exactly, which is why I'm saying a .desktop file level solution isn't ok
[20:12] <lool> I think the solution is to define a menu and display whatever it matches on the home screen; the home menu so to say; it could include everything except settings by default
[20:12] <lool> And be customized for $ui or $customer
[20:12] <lool> But it's a single file to patch
[20:12] <bfiller> lool: I agree. I think I'm confused with the difference between Category field in .desktop file and Categories that are shown in the Mobile UI
[20:12] <lool> Changing 20 apps .desktop files for a customer would be painful
[20:13] <lool> bfiller: Mobile UI doesn't show categorgies but Menus (I hope!)
[20:13] <lool> categorgies hmm don't want to know what I was thinking of
[20:13] <bspencer> it does what Ubuntu does now, same categories
[20:13] <bspencer> and follows the same rules -- if no app there, it doesn't show.   If no matching category:  Other
[20:13] <bfiller> bspencer, lool : I get it now. I agree with lool's solution :)
[20:14] <lool> bspencer: Categories or menus?
[20:14] <bspencer> lool,  uh...
[20:15] <lool> bspencer: If you open /etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu on an Ubuntu system
[20:15]  * bspencer opens...
[20:15] <lool> It's a tree of Menus
[20:15] <lool> Defining filters on .desktop files
[20:16] <lool> The filters can be based on the categories in the .desktop files
[20:16] <bspencer> lool, oh, right.  Yes -- that is the Name we show
[20:16] <lool> Cool
[20:16] <lool> bspencer: So simply define a Home menu, make it include everything except settings
[20:16] <bspencer> which is a little odd sometimes.
[20:16] <lool> And if someone needs to specialize, he only has to change this file
[20:17] <bspencer> for example, if you put "Internet" in your category, it won't show up in "Internet".  You have to put "Network"
[20:17] <bspencer> > lool, define a Home menu
[20:17] <lool> bspencer: The menu is the Internet menu, and it includes anything related to Network
[20:17] <bspencer>  in a separate file ?
[20:17] <lool> bspencer: I don't know whether that's possible, but I suspect it is
[20:17] <bspencer> installed separately by mobile-basic-flash.    Or try to patch gnome-menu?
[20:18] <bspencer> lool, yes I think a separate one is possible, I see settings.menu and preferences.menu there.
[20:18] <bspencer> I'll look into it
[20:18] <lool> bspencer: In Debian, we have gnome-applications.menu, gnome-screensavers.menu, etc.
[20:18] <bspencer> yep
[20:18] <bfiller> bspencer: I'm pretty sure there is a cascading effect of menus. I believe it will look in  a special direcotry in the user's home dir
[20:18] <lool> You could have mobile-ui-foo.menu which would say how menus are layered in this UI
[20:19] <bspencer> ok.  I think I have enough to go forward here.
[20:19] <lool> bspencer: preferences.menu is used in System -> Preferences under GNOME
[20:19] <lool> And screensavers, I'm sure you know where it's used :à)
[20:19] <lool> bspencer: Cool
[20:20] <bspencer> bfiller, let's chat about hardy
[20:20] <bspencer> bfiller, two things:   broken, and smagoun's email
[20:20] <bspencer> I tried to build hardy image but hildon-desktop wouldn't install (last night).
[20:20] <bspencer> something about cairo and pango version mismatch
[20:20] <bspencer> is anyone building hardy and has this been addressed, or do I need to?
[20:21] <bspencer> rusty and I hypothesized that if we pushed a newer source version of pango and cairo to PPA it might work.
[20:21] <bspencer> lool, I guess I should bug you about it too.  ^^
[20:21] <bfiller> bspencer: we build a nightly hardy image of a hardy snapshot and PPA. It did not have the problem you are referring to.
[20:21] <ToddBrandt> bfiller: I'm trying to do a build with mccaslin-lpia-ubuntu-hardy-ppa-snapshot but it seems to have troubles creating the project, it loops forever on a set of packages with apt-get install, have you seen this?
[20:22] <bfiller> lool: did the nightly core image work correctly
[20:22] <bspencer> bfiller, hm.  Is the snapshot the same as I would get using the "snapshot" option in MIC?
[20:22] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, welcome to the same conversation :)
[20:22] <lool> bspencer: I'd need more info
[20:23] <lool> bspencer: What APT repos are you using and what was the exact failure?
[20:23] <lool> Ah ToddBrandt has the same issue
[20:23] <ToddBrandt> ahh, nice
[20:24] <lool> ATM, I don't have a screen attached to the host where I run MIC on; if you give me the exact APT error, I could figure it out perhaps :)
[20:24] <ToddBrandt> incidentally, mccaslin-lpia-ubuntu-hardy-ppa installs without error
[20:24] <bfiller> bspencer: not sure what image-creator snapshot is - we are using hardy snapshot from a few days agaon
[20:24] <bfiller> s/agaon/ago
[20:25] <smagoun> bspencer: we (Lexington/MSG) have our own snapshots that don't correspond to the ones from the core team
[20:25] <lool> ToddBrandt, bspencer: would one of you be so kind to provide
[20:25] <lool> me the error?
[20:25] <bspencer> lool, yep, fetching...
[20:25] <bfiller> bspencer: I'm guessing something in hardy was reve'd that is causing hildon-desktop from ppa to fail?
[20:25] <ToddBrandt> lool, I can give you the whole output log if you want
[20:25] <ToddBrandt> 1 sec
[20:26] <lool> ToddBrandt: The important part is the apt-get install failure
[20:26] <lool> Oh heck, I'll run image-creator in ssh -X
[20:27] <bfiller> lool: I thought moblin should be pointing at core's hardy snapshopt + PPA?
[20:27] <lool> bfiller: Did I contradict this earlier?
[20:28] <bspencer> lool, while my hardy image builds... let me double-check something we just agreed on
[20:29] <bspencer> if I add a new .menu file to the xdg/menus location, the only control I have is specifying which categories to show in my "Home" category.  I can't specify specific apps.
[20:29] <bfiller> lool: no you didn't, just not sure if the moblin guys are pointing at the right place
[20:29] <ToddBrandt> I'm grabbing the error from the log
[20:30] <lool> bspencer: I don't know what the .menu files allow; perhaps you can name app?
[20:30] <bspencer> so if a home screen wants to filter the apps, that would be something they do on their own, not dictated by us.
[20:30] <bspencer> lool, ok, sure.
[20:30] <bspencer> I'll look into it.
[20:31] <lool> bfiller: Right; I usually double check what people are using as APT sources
[20:31] <lool> bspencer: It would be part of writing the config; should be a one hour job
[20:32] <ToddBrandt> lool, bfiller: http://moblin.pastebin.org/25522
[20:32] <bspencer> I'm seeing a different error today.  Something about mobile-basic-flash not being configured.
[20:32]  * bspencer reads ToddBrandt's log
[20:33] <lool> ToddBrandt: And with what config you say this is happening?
[20:33] <ToddBrandt> lool: mccaslin-lpia-ubuntu-hardy-ppa-snapshot
[20:33] <lool> Ah crap, I am creating a -ppa one, not a -snapshot
[20:34] <ToddBrandt> mccaslin-lpia-ubuntu-hardy-ppa works fine, mccaslin-lpia-ubuntu-hardy-ppa-snapshot is busted
[20:35] <lool> ToddBrandt: So what happens is pretty simple: packages uploaded to the ppa are built against the latest version of hardy and this might create dependencies on versions which have been uploaded to hardy after the snapshot
[20:35] <lool> ToddBrandt: The solution is to find what is required and also push it to the ppa
[20:35] <ToddBrandt> bspencer: oh wait, I see the error you mentioned, that apparantly happened even earlier and may have cause the pastebin error I showed
[20:35] <lool> It's something which davidm and rustyl have discussed in depth I think
[20:35] <crevette> heya there
[20:37] <ToddBrandt> lool: this error happens during project creation, the one I sent before was target creation
[20:37] <ToddBrandt> http://moblin.pastebin.org/25523
[20:37] <ToddBrandt> lool: this is the command I use image-creator --command=create-project --platform-name=mccaslin-lpia-ubuntu-hardy-ppa-snapshot --project-name=atomichardy --project-desc=test --project-path=/usr/src/projects/atomichardy
[20:39] <bspencer> http://moblin.pastebin.org/25525
[20:39] <lool> #
[20:39] <lool> Setting up mobile-basic-flash (0.38) ...
[20:39] <lool> #
[20:39] <lool> I/O warning : failed to load external entity "/etc/gconf/schemas/mobile-basic-flash.schemas"
[20:39] <lool> #
[20:39] <lool> Failed to open `/etc/gconf/schemas/mobile-basic-flash.schemas': No such file or directory
[20:39] <lool> That's pretty bad
[20:40] <bspencer> I wonder when it was uploaded....
[20:40] <lool> bspencer: Hmm that's gutsy
[20:40] <bspencer> I haven't uploaded to hardy since we changed the schema
[20:40] <bspencer> because it wasn't ready yet.   :-\
[20:42]  * lool builds for -snapshot now
[20:42] <ToddBrandt> bspencer: ok, this may seem wierd, but I just tried to build a mccaslin-lpia-ubuntu-hardy-ppa-snapshot project outside the Intel firewall and it worked
[20:42] <bspencer> so how does mobile-basic-flash v0.38 get into hardy?
[20:42]  * bspencer is perplexed
[20:42] <ToddBrandt> we may have some bad links in there
[20:44] <lool> ToddBrandt: It failed for me
[20:44] <smagoun> bspencer: there is no mobile-basic-flash v0.38 in hardy or in the PPA
[20:44] <bspencer> lool, same error?
[20:44] <bfiller> lool: the MSG group's solution to the Hardy/PPA mismatch is to have stable snapshots of both Hardy and PPA. Both then get reved together to prevent mismatch.
[20:45] <lool> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6112/
[20:46] <bspencer> lool, that is what I expected to see
[20:46] <bspencer> lool, that is what I came to complain about.  Not sure about the other issue.  I'll look into it.
[20:46] <bspencer> :)
[20:46] <bspencer> perhaps cairo and pango have been updated in hardy
[20:46] <ToddBrandt> lool: oh never mind, I got the same error, but the project built far enough that I can build moblin-applets so I'm cool with that for now
[20:47] <lool> So hildon-desktop fails to install with this combination
[20:48] <lool> This is mostly thanks to GNOME 2.22
[20:49] <lool> pango1.0 1.20.0-1 was uploaded the 2008-03-11; hildon-desktop was uploaded to the ppa 2008-03-21
[20:50] <lool> When it built, it started to require libpango1.0-0 >= 1.20, but only 1.19.4-0ubuntu1 is available
[20:52] <lool> I've uploaded pango1.0_1.20.0-1ubuntu1~804um1.dsc to the um ppa now; once it's built, this will be solved
[20:52] <lool> Same issue with cairo, libcairo2 >= 1.5.12 is now required
[20:53] <lool> 1.5.8 is available
[20:53] <bspencer> lool, much thanks
[20:54] <bfiller> lool: I uploaded that version of hildon-desktop that is causing the problem. I did not know to check for newer dependecies in Hardy vs. Snapshot. What should I have done differently?
[20:55] <RwL> should Skype run on UME? any special way to install?
[20:56] <lool> cairo_1.5.14-0ubuntu1~804um1 pushed
[20:56] <lool> bspencer: This is all I see for now; ping me again if you see it later on
[20:56] <lool> bfiller: Hmm
[20:56] <bspencer> lool, great.
[20:56] <bspencer> RwL, I haven't tried Skype, but most apps I have tried do work.  Give it a shot.
[21:01] <bspencer> bfiller, I hear you have a fix in the works to dismiss the startup banner when a dialog pops up.
[21:02] <bfiller> bspencer: yes I do. It's working on my modified version of m-b-f. I need to grab your latest m-b-f and test and make a patch. Hopefully I'll get this done this week.
[21:03] <bspencer> bfiller, I'd like that patch.  The firefox dialog is always right there behind the banner "Restore previous session" ...
[21:03] <bfiller> bspencer: I also have a (better) fix that will solve the singleton app issue *without* having to modify the .desktop file
[21:03] <bfiller> bspencer: I will get these both to you when they are complete for sure
[21:03] <ToddBrandt> bfiller: I just uploaded moblin-applets 0.49.1 with that build bug fix
[21:04] <bfiller> ToddBrandt: great, thanks
[21:04] <bspencer> bfiller, you mean a singleton app for any app regardless of their .desktop ?  Great!
[21:05] <bfiller> bspencer: yes, my previous fix assumed their was a valid StartupWMClass defined in the .desktop, otherwise it would not work. The new way assumes everything is a singleton. It could be modified to check for the "SingleInstance" property in the .desktop. I think this is standard..
[21:11] <\sh> guys, I need some people to test wine on lpia :)
[21:12] <GrueMaster> What in wine needs to be tested?
[21:13] <\sh> GrueMaster: e.g. installing an windows app and how it hits the cpu on real lpia devices
[21:14] <\sh> GrueMaster: use windows rar as an example...and no I don't want to test "windows games" on it
[21:14] <crevette> \sh: winmine !!!
[21:14] <crevette> :)
[21:14] <GrueMaster> No games?  Awe....
[21:14] <\sh> crevette: that will work out of the box ;)
[21:14] <crevette> or minesweeper whatever it is called
[21:14] <crevette> :)
[21:14] <\sh> GrueMaster: well, I don't know anything about the ram on those devices..so it's hard to tell what is a good test case ,)
[21:15]  * \sh needs to get hands on a nokia device
[21:15] <lool> \sh: Nokia is arm
[21:15] <GrueMaster> My understanding is that the actual units will have a min of 256M.
[21:15] <\sh> or whatever is cheap
[21:15] <lool> lpia is Intel and we have like 256MB
[21:15] <\sh> and has intel in it
[21:15] <lool> \sh: You can actually run lpia on a regular PC; it's 32-bits
[21:15] <crevette> launch your laptop with mem=256
[21:16] <crevette> or in a vmware guest
[21:16] <GrueMaster> I'll check the wine DB and see what apps work well.  No need to test apps that don't work.
[21:16] <\sh> lool: are hct vendor devices (which runs win mobile normally) a perfect candidate?
[21:16] <\sh> GrueMaster: you'll find lpia packages of wine on my blog.
[21:16] <\sh> GrueMaster: http://www.sourcecode.de/content/wine-low-power-intel-architecture-lpia
[21:17] <lool> \sh: These are arm too
[21:17] <lool> I think
[21:18] <\sh> well, the fun part is to simulate a cpu with less then 3GHz ... I guess those devices are not so fast as my desktop or any vmware running on my desktop
[21:19] <\sh> HTC shift is lpia...
[21:20] <GrueMaster> \sh:  Got it.  I'll try to test it later this afternoon (it's 2:20pm now).
[21:21] <\sh> GrueMaster: thx a lot...if that works..I'll need to convince people to add lpia to the P-a-s file for debian and ubuntu
[21:21] <lool> \sh: There's a pas for ubuntu?!
[21:22] <\sh> lool: we share it with debian
[21:23] <lool> Hmm ok, didn't know that
[21:23] <lool> Makes a couple of things clearer to me now
[21:23] <crevette> a pas ?
[21:23] <lool> Packages arch specific
[21:23] <lool> a file where you say what to not build on some arches
[21:24] <crevette> ah okay, thank you, I can back to sleep now
[21:24] <crevette>  :)
[21:25] <\sh> crevette: http://cvs.debian.org/srcdep/Packages-arch-specific?rev=1.742&root=dak&view=markup
[21:27] <\sh> {elmo,lamont,infinity} needs to be bribed ;)
[21:29] <\sh> hmm htc shift x9500 with umts and hsdpa  for 1169 euro on amazon...my wife will kill me if I hit the "buy now" button
[21:31] <bspencer> ToddBrandt,
[21:36] <ToddBrandt> bspencer: howdy
[21:38] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, what platform did you create to get the mobile-basic-flash error you posted in your pastebin?
[21:38] <ToddBrandt> snapshot one
[21:38] <ToddBrandt> mccaslin-lpia-ubuntu-hardy-ppa-snapshot
[21:38] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, I can't reproduce it
[21:38] <bspencer> I can reproduce it with non-snapshot gutsy image, just not hardy snapshot
[21:39] <ToddBrandt> did you create a target?
[21:39] <ToddBrandt> The error is on target creation
[21:39] <bspencer> oh, ok.
[21:39] <bspencer> I thought I did
[21:39] <ToddBrandt> yea both the project and target fail with errors
[21:40] <ToddBrandt> http://moblin.pastebin.org/25523 is for the project build error
[21:40] <ToddBrandt> http://moblin.pastebin.org/25522 is for the target error
[21:41] <ToddBrandt> bspencer: and actually I don't see the mobile-basi-c-flash error in either, I think lool is the only one to see it so far
[21:42]  * bspencer needs a clue for installing schemas
[21:42] <bspencer> there's too many ways
[21:42] <bspencer> and I don't do it right apparently
[21:42] <bspencer> :(
[21:45] <ToddBrandt> bspencer: is your latest in mobile-basic-flash master?
[21:45] <bspencer> yep
[21:45] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, I have the step to install the schema when the user runs "make install"
[21:45] <bspencer> instead of forcing them to do it with a postinst script
[21:45] <bspencer> and I used dh_gconf
[21:46] <bspencer> but somewhere it screwed up, so I'm redoing it
[21:46] <ToddBrandt> heh, I think that's why I bailed on it
[21:46] <bspencer> I thought it was working yesterdaqy when I checked in.  I verified that I could install the package and make an image too, but for some reason today it is not working
[21:46] <ToddBrandt> dh_gconf is a gnome thing
[21:47] <bspencer> ToddBrandt,  in schemasdir = $(GCONF_SCHEMA_FILE_DIR)
[21:48] <bspencer> where does GCONF_SCHEMA_FILE_DIR get defined?
[21:48] <bspencer> is that part of AM_GCONF_SOURCE_2 ?
[21:48] <bspencer> (in my configure.ac,  but not in yours anywhere I can see)
[21:49] <ToddBrandt> I use the gconf-schemas command, it knows on its own
[21:50] <ToddBrandt> There's probably some reason for me to use dh_gconf in the rules file to install the schemas but I'll be damned if I could ever get it to work properly
[21:55] <RwL> error trying to install Skype: package architecture (i386) does not match system (lpia)
[21:56] <RwL> I downloaded the Ubuntu 7.4+ deb...
[21:56] <RwL> should I be installing it via apt-get instead?
[21:57] <bspencer> RwL, :(  You'll have to tweak the source to get it to install
[21:57] <bspencer> because that package is blocking based on arch check
[21:58] <agoliveira> RwL: or just manually install forcing the arch if the idea is just testing. Should work the same.
[21:58] <agoliveira> RwL: dpkg --force-architecture IIRC
[21:58] <RwL> aha! thanks, will check & try
[21:59] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, if I put postinst in debian directory, do I need to do more to get it to run ?
[21:59] <bspencer> or is just having it sufficient ?
[22:01] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, how can I remove a schema from my gconf to reset the system ?
[22:01] <ToddBrandt> bspencer: once you call gconf-schemas --register, it's registered, every user on the system will then get those settings by default
[22:01] <ToddBrandt> there changes get put in their .gconf dir
[22:02] <bspencer> yeah, I copied your pattern, put the gconf-schemas in a postinst file
[22:02] <RwL> agoliveira: that bypassed the architecture check but there are apparently dependency problems too. should I just try to get those via apt-get? (libqt4-core and libqt4-gui were the ones listed)
[22:02] <bspencer> do I need to call that somewhere (I don't see it anywhere so I assume that it just gets run)
[22:02] <ToddBrandt> I just remove them
[22:02] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, right, how?
[22:02] <ToddBrandt> however the correct way to do it is with the --unregister
[22:03] <ToddBrandt> gconf-schemas --unregister
[22:03] <ToddBrandt> I think I should fix that in my postrm
[22:03] <bspencer> hm,... postrm :)
[22:03] <ToddBrandt> yep, if someone can explain to me why that's bad I'll change it
[22:03] <ToddBrandt> but until that day, it works so well
[22:04] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, but why is OLD_DIR=/etc/gconf/schemas and not /usr/share/gconf/schemas ?
[22:04] <agoliveira> RwL: Yes, if you solve the dependencies manually it should install
[22:04] <ToddBrandt> because that's a bug I think, I need to use --unregister
[22:05] <ToddBrandt> it's probably leaving those things on the system after uninstall, which is bad
[22:05] <bspencer> got it
[22:05] <bspencer> I'll try
[22:07] <bspencer> argh!  I just now realize that horace made changes last night
[22:07] <bspencer> thus the broken schema.  Mine was working!  :(
[22:08] <ToddBrandt> bfiller: I added the moblin-settings-xsettings.c code to moblin-settings-daemon, however in order to ensure I've done it properly can you tell me what you use to test?
[22:09] <ToddBrandt> bspencer: ahhhh, so then it shall me I who copies your code :D
[22:10] <ToddBrandt> bfiller: and if it's on hardy I have no way to test that at the moment, I can't create a target image with MIC
[22:11]  * ToddBrandt just realizes that bfiller isn't even here
[22:11] <ToddBrandt> kyleN: I added the moblin-settings-xsettings.c code to moblin-settings-daemon, however in order to ensure I've done it properly can you tell me what you use to test?
[22:24] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, gconf-schemas --unregister <file> doesn't remove them when I run gconf-editor
[22:24]  * bspencer looks at how to restart gconf...
[22:25] <ToddBrandt> gconf-editor only looks at the changes, if the user has changes made to those keys then they'll stay
[22:25] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, oh.  do I remove ~/... something?
[22:25]  * bspencer looks
[22:26] <ToddBrandt> bspencer: you have to remember that gconf is actually a joke on us linux guys by the windows developers who created the registry. They're laughing at us right now...
[22:26] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, if it worked like the registry I'd have no complaints.   (sad but true)
[22:26] <ToddBrandt> bspencer: worst case you could delete the directory path under /root/.gconf and /home/ume/.gconf but that's getting hacky
[22:27] <bspencer> is there a non-hack way?  I just want ot verify that my install actually creates the schema correctly in my target
[22:27] <bspencer> but I can't get rid of the old schema
[22:27] <ToddBrandt> Actually, why don;t you use gconftool-2?
[22:27] <bspencer> ok.  I'm usin git
[22:27] <bspencer> I gconftool-2 --shutdown
[22:27] <ToddBrandt> you can run that as whatever user, then tell it to kill those keys
[22:27] <bspencer> still has schema
[22:28] <ToddBrandt> bspencer, run man gconftool-2
[22:28] <ToddBrandt> --recursive-unset
[22:28] <ToddBrandt>               Recursively unset all keys at or below the key/directory names on the command line.
[22:29] <ToddBrandt> there's also --unapply-schema which II've never tried
[22:38] <ToddBrandt> kyleN: I added the moblin-settings-xsettings.c code to moblin-settings-daemon, however in order to ensure I've done it properly can you tell me what you use to test?
[22:39] <bspencer> ToddBrandt, needless to say, none of those commands gets rid of my gconf keys :(
[22:40] <bspencer> but I'll just make a new target and try it there
[22:41] <ToddBrandt> I think user gconf changes aren't meant to be removed
[22:41] <bspencer> I think gconf removal is impossible
[22:41] <ToddBrandt> yea
[22:41] <bspencer> :)
[22:41] <ToddBrandt> which seems wrong
[22:41] <ToddBrandt> but there it is
[23:05] <lool> ToddBrandt, bspencer: MIC should be able to go further with the -snapshot platform
[23:05] <ToddBrandt> lool: did you fix it?
[23:06] <lool> Yes, well the uploads I did to the ppa fixed it
[23:07] <ToddBrandt> ahh, kewl
[23:07] <ToddBrandt> I'll try it now, thanks!
[23:08] <lool> ToddBrandt: It will probably fail in the q1full fset subsequently though; it just did for me
[23:08] <ToddBrandt> How can I help fix that?
[23:08] <ToddBrandt> i.e. how do I figure out which packages to upload from the errors, and then how do I upload them?
[23:08] <lool> ToddBrandt: So for instance, the error I now get is:
[23:09] <lool> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6123/
[23:09] <lool> ToddBrandt: I then chroot /srv/chroots/mccaslin-lpia-hardy-ppa-snapshot/targets/q1ufull/fs /bin/bash
[23:09] <lool> Reproduce with apt-get install ubuntu-mobile
[23:09] <ToddBrandt> oh lord, moblin-applets is breaking it
[23:09] <lool> Then I try "apt-get install ubuntu-mobile cheese"
[23:10] <lool> and I see:
[23:10] <lool> The following packages have unmet dependencies: cheese: Depends: libebook1.2-9 (>= 2.22.0) but 2.21.92-0ubuntu1 is to be installed
[23:10] <lool> At which point it's clear that libebook1.2-9 is too old now
[23:10] <ToddBrandt> yea, that's the about-=me dialogs dep
[23:10] <lool> So I'll snapshot eds
[23:10] <lool> It's going to take a while
[23:11] <ToddBrandt> wait, so I need to upload the latest ebook to hardy?
[23:11] <ToddBrandt> can you explain what snapshot eds does?
[23:11]  * ToddBrandt admits his ignorance
[23:12] <lool> ToddBrandt: Oh nothing in particular, I took EDS from hardy, and pushed it to th eppa
[23:12] <lool> With a proper changelog entry and version
[23:12] <lool> I'm uploading evolution-data-server_2.22.0-0ubuntu2~804um1.dsc now
[23:13] <lool> When it's built, we should see the install continuing
[23:13] <ToddBrandt> ahh, so that should take care of the libebook dep
[23:13] <lool> Yes
[23:13] <ToddBrandt> would I have access to upload things like that?
[23:13] <ToddBrandt> i.e. could I be of help instead of just someboedy whining?
[23:13] <lool> Sure, you could do it as well
[23:13] <lool> Anybody in ubuntu-mobile can
[23:13] <ToddBrandt> gotcha
[23:13] <lool> Another fix is to take a newer snapshot
[23:14] <ToddBrandt> oh yea, with dput
[23:14] <lool> And the proper fix is to build against the snapshot, but this requires a separate archive
[23:15] <ToddBrandt> lool: ok, so I find the hardy package that will satisfy the dependency, then I doanload it, pull out its source, and create the .source/.build.dsc files that are needed for spu, then I dput it to moblin-ppa?
[23:15] <ToddBrandt> spu = dput
[23:15] <lool> Yes
[23:15] <ToddBrandt> gotcha
[23:15] <lool> If you look at my cairo of pango1.0 uploads, you should see the delta with hardy is only the changelog
[23:16] <lool> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mobile/+archive/+builds => building now
[23:16] <ToddBrandt> ok


[16:58] <pleia2> charlie-tca: I have been thinking some, where on the "stuff that should be done" list is the new website theme?
[16:59] <charlie-tca> Didn't I add it?
[16:59] <pleia2> add it?
[16:59] <charlie-tca> wait! what new website theme?
[16:59] <pleia2> well there was one proposed when the rebranding happened
[16:59] <charlie-tca> for http://xubuntu.org or wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu ?
[16:59] <pleia2> xubuntu.org
[17:00] <pleia2> it still has our old logo and everything
[17:00] <charlie-tca> I must be behind.
[17:00] <charlie-tca> yeah, add it. It might need updating
[17:00] <pleia2> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Brand2?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=xubuntu-site.png
[17:00] <pleia2> I don't know who made it, but that was floating around
[17:01] <pleia2> does a "stuff that should be done" list exist? :)
[17:01] <charlie-tca> yup
[17:01] <charlie-tca> Let me find it
[17:01] <pleia2> thanks
[17:02] <pleia2> I took much of the maverick cycle off due to work concerns, but I'm hoping to help out with xubuntu for this cycle
[17:02] <charlie-tca> Here it is - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Roadmap
[17:02] <pleia2> website is something I can help with :)
[17:02] <charlie-tca> That would be great
[17:03] <pleia2> ok, shall I add this to "new objectives for natty"?
[17:05]  * pleia2 does
[17:07] <charlie-tca> Let's go with natty
[17:07] <charlie-tca> I think that was the planned template for moving the website to wordpress, too.
[17:07] <pleia2> that would be nice, any idea what it's running now?
[17:09] <charlie-tca> no one, I think. Knome was going to do it.
[17:10] <charlie-tca> vinnl and cody-somerville keep it updated for us
[17:10] <charlie-tca> vinnl is the website lead
[17:15] <charlie-tca> Oh, wrong answer.
[17:15] <charlie-tca> I think it is Drupal now
[17:15]  * pleia2 nods
[17:15] <pleia2> it's canonical-hosted so drupal makes sense
[17:16] <pleia2> and I'll touch base with vinnl about all this
[17:16] <pleia2> thanks :)
[17:18] <charlie-tca> right. I think there is a wordpress available too, now. It just came about in the last month or two, though.
[17:18] <charlie-tca> QA is using wordpress now.
[17:19] <pleia2> cool
[18:04]  * cody-somerville has shell access so please feel free to poke me if you need me.
[18:05] <charlie-tca> pleia2: ^ ^ ^
[18:05] <pleia2> thanks cody-somerville


[01:36] <bluesabre> Unit193: any idea what would make quilt not see debian/patches/series ?
[01:37] <bluesabre> ./xfce4-session-4.11.0/debian/patches/series
[01:37] <bluesabre> ./xfce4-session-4.11.1/debian/patches/series
[01:37] <bluesabre> works in 4.11.0, not in 4.11.1
[01:40] <bluesabre> makes me think I'm crazy
[01:48] <bluesabre> can you take a look (quilt push -a)?
[01:48] <bluesabre> smdavis.us/tmp/quilt_is_crazy.tar.gz
[02:08] <Unit193> bluesabre: Hardly had to look, xfce4-session-4.11.0/.pc/
[02:09] <bluesabre> drat
[02:09] <Unit193> bluesabre: Don't worry, it's voodoo to me too.
[02:29] <bluesabre> ok, got the new xfce4-session packaged up, no immediately noticeable issues
[02:33] <Unit193> Any benefit?
[02:34] <bluesabre> "- Use pkexec for xfsm-shutdown (Bug 9952)" could be interesting
[02:34] <bluesabre> xfce bug 9952
[03:16] <bluesabre> forestpiskie: xfce4-power-manager 1.4.2 and xfce4-session 4.11.1 uploaded to vivid.  Both should be painless :)
[03:18] <bluesabre> brainwash: yes, it was on the Linux Action Show in its first iteration :)
[03:23]  * Unit193 stabbity stabs bluesabre.
[03:23]  * bluesabre bleedity bleeds
[03:23] <Unit193> bluesabre: Where'd you get this xfpm package anyway?
[03:24] <bluesabre> ?
[03:24]  * bluesabre packaged it himself
[03:24] <Unit193> Or, did you drop all the deps from 4.11 to 4.10?  The stabbing was for systemd-services again.
[03:25] <bluesabre> lol
[03:25] <bluesabre> I really need to remember to remove that
[03:25] <bluesabre> remind me tomorrow and I will upload ubuntu2
[03:26] <bluesabre> that was the unstable 1.4.1 -> vivid -> 1.4.2 packaging
[03:26]  * bluesabre included the debian changelog
[03:27] <Unit193> libupower-glib-dev (<< 0.99) => libupower-glib-dev (>= 0.99)  and all the xfce packages went from 4.11.x to 4.10.  I was just wondering if that was intentional.
[03:27] <bluesabre> yeah, upower 0.99 in vivid
[03:28] <bluesabre> and xfce deps were lowered to 4.10 in unstable
[03:28] <bluesabre> http://packages.ubuntu.com/vivid/libupower-glib-dev
[03:31] <Unit193> Cool, cool. :)
[03:31]  * Unit193 really isn't stalking bluesabre.
[03:31] <bluesabre> dropping systemd-services now
[03:31]  * bluesabre feels stalked
[03:41] <bluesabre> Unit193: Merry (early) Christmas!
[03:41] <bluesabre> xfce4-power-manager (1.4.2-0ubuntu2) vivid; urgency=medium
[03:41] <bluesabre>   * debian/control: Drop depends on systemd-services, virtual package
[03:42] <Unit193> bluesabre: Hah, nice! :P
[03:44] <Unit193> Bumped PPA stuffs too.
[03:44] <bluesabre> cool
[03:46] <bluesabre> oh
[03:47] <bluesabre> you'll want to keep upower < 0.99
[03:47] <bluesabre> for trusty/utopic
[03:47] <Unit193> Check -verbose.
[03:48] <bluesabre> cheater
[03:48] <bluesabre> XP
[03:48] <Unit193> Well, has to work for trusty, utopic, and vivid.
[03:58] <bluesabre> time for bed, back tomorrow
[03:58] <Unit193> OK.  Sleep tight and danke.
[06:26] <Noskcaj> bluesabre, Wild guess, you didn't look at the pending merges from xfpm/xfce4-session?
[06:27] <Noskcaj> Deleting mine now
[11:15] <bluesabre> Noskcaj: didn't have a notification that you had packaged the updated xfpm/xfce4-session
[11:15] <bluesabre> did you subscribe me to the merges?
[11:17] <bluesabre> just drop me a ping on here as you have merges ready... I usually don't go looking for them.  If there's anything that was still in the queue for me to upload, let me know - finally getting back into the groove of things
[11:18] <Unit193> Mornin' bluesabre.
[11:18] <bluesabre> brainwash: if all goes as planned, will get menulibre-2.0.6 uploaded to trusty-proposed tonight
[11:18] <bluesabre> hey Unit193
[11:18] <bluesabre> want me to upload inxi tonight? :)
[11:20] <Unit193> Mmm, should be able to change it for Ubuntu, sure.
[11:21] <bluesabre> k
[11:22] <Unit193> If ye think it's worth it.
[11:23] <bluesabre> I find inxi to be pretty cool, so yeah, :)
[11:25] <bluesabre> heading out now, yesterday's commute was crap, so getting a head start
[11:25] <bluesabre> have a good one
[11:25] <Unit193> Good luck.
[15:41] <brainwash> bluesabre: that's good news :)


[00:47] <mwhudson> huh, shouldn't DEB_BUILD_MAINT_OPTIONS=hardening=-pie turn off PIE, even on yakkety?
[00:48] <slangasek> mwhudson: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dpkg/+bug/1576915
[00:49] <mwhudson> slangasek: whee!
[00:49] <mwhudson> slangasek: any eta on a fix?
[00:51] <mwhudson> golang-race-detector-runtime ftbfs in yakkety and setting DEB_BUILD_MAINT_OPTIONS=hardening=-pie would be the obvious fix
[00:51] <slangasek> mwhudson: nope, so far it's unassigned
[00:51] <slangasek> mwhudson: in absence of this, you can workaround it with DEB_CFLAGS_MAINT_APPEND=-no-pie, I think?
[00:52] <mwhudson> slangasek: i was trying to be clever and come up with something that would work on multiple releases :-)
[00:52] <mwhudson> but yeah
[00:52] <slangasek> heh yes
[00:53] <mwhudson> .. if i'm actually right about what's causing the failure
[00:55] <mwhudson> oh it's linking a test binary and it ignores LDFLAGS
[02:24] <kees> mwhudson: can you add the error you saw the description of the fix for it to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ToolChain/CompilerFlags ? (it'll need a PIE section added)
[02:24] <kees> sbeattie: ^^ we should have a section on PIE here
[02:25] <mwhudson> sure
[02:25] <kees> sbeattie: and should likely be updated to discuss -fstack-protector-strong
[02:28] <mwhudson> well
[02:28] <mwhudson> i can make some edits and click save
[02:28] <mwhudson> i'm not responsible for what does or doesn't happen next :-)
[02:28] <mwhudson> kees: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ToolChain/CompilerFlags#thread_sanitizer_vs_PIE
[02:49] <kees> mwhudson: awesome! thanks :)
[02:50] <kees> mwhudson: oh, I thought you found a different solution (missing LDFLAGS?)
[02:50] <mwhudson> kees: that was specific to the package i was building
[02:50] <kees> or was it that both were needed?
[02:50] <mwhudson> yeah
[02:51] <kees> gotcha. thanks!
[11:02] <pitti> Good morning
[13:09] <arthur-dent> Could anyone tell me what has happened to the /var/log/boot.log file on Ubuntu 16.04 as it was present there on 15.10 but I can't find it on the latest version? Has it been removed and replaced or...?
[13:11] <dobey> arthur-dent: there's a boot.log for me
[13:16] <arthur-dent> Well, I, and many other users can seem to find it on a fresh install... It's there if you upgrade from a previous version with it, but not on a fresh install. Is it meant to be there?
[14:40] <tseliot> pitti: hi, do you know why u-d-c is still in yakkety-proposed?
[14:41] <infinity> tseliot: update_excuses knows.
[14:43] <tseliot> infinity: oh, nice, a totally unrelated regression...
[14:45] <tseliot> pitti: bcmwl fails for some reason<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[14:46] <infinity> "for some reason" probably has to do with -fPIE compiler changes.
[14:46] <infinity> It's an ongoing discussion.
[14:47] <tseliot> fun. How do I get around it?
[14:47] <infinity> Wait patiently?
[14:47] <infinity> Is it harming your life currently to have a package in proposed?
[14:48] <tseliot> not my life, as I don't use nvidia. Anybody who does, though, might beg to differ ;)
[14:48] <infinity> dkms on yakkety is hit and miss broken right now anyway, due to the compiler changes, so...
[14:49] <tseliot> ok, so it won't really make much of a difference after all
[14:49] <tseliot> fair enough
[16:02] <doko> Mirv, did you mean to turn on tests again in qtbase-opensource-src ?
[16:17] <slangasek> lan3y: hi, it appears that the new vala synced in yakkety causes build failures because we have an older version of gtk+3.0: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/16.10.0-0ubuntu2/+build/9679540 is gtk+3.0 merge on your todo?
[16:20] <infinity> slangasek: GTK merge is needed for a lot of things, the last word I got was that the desktop team needs to hunt someone down to fix the unity themes for the new GTK.
[16:20] <slangasek> k
[16:20] <seb128> slangasek, no, we might not update to 3.20 at all this cycle, see bug #1576576
[16:21] <slangasek> seb128: alrighty; then can someone fix vala instead? :)
[16:21] <seb128> sure
[16:22] <seb128> (not likely today though)
[16:27] <slangasek> seb128: sure :)  do you want a bug report or anything?
[16:28] <infinity> seb128: Oh, erk.  Last I heard wasn't that we wouldn't update at all...
[16:28] <infinity> seb128: There are autosyncs coming in that depend on it, so we'll have to sort out what to do about that.
[17:23] <seb128> slangasek, you can if you want but we are going to deal with those even without bug
[17:26] <seb128> infinity, well, we are not going to update if it breaks things, so we need to fix the themes and apps before updating, let's see if we get anyone stepping up to do that
[17:27] <seb128> our desktop team theme maintainer left and there is probably quite some non-trivial work to do there, which is not on the top of our priorities for the cycle
[17:28] <seb128> I doubt many things depends on new GTK, it's mostly GNOME usually and most of that has patches for unity or some delta, we might have to patch the use of new gtk out/revert for a few things though
[18:31] <showaz> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2016-May/003739.html  no minimal-cd network deploy?
[18:31] <showaz> 2gd + deploy kvm,vmware etc... time install downup
[19:14] <infinity> tjaalton: When do I get a xenial HWE stack?
[19:17] <dobey> hmm
[19:18] <xnox> cyphermox, apt install libu2f-host0
[19:18] <dobey> might be good to warn in very big and AMD-red letters that people staying on 14.04.x for fglrx support should NOT install the 14.04.5 xenial HWE stack?
[19:19] <infinity> dobey: That'll be super fun when we drop support for the previous stacks.
[19:20] <xnox> infinity, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/yaboot/+bug/1400030
[19:20] <xnox> infinity, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/yaboot/+bug/1575384
[19:21] <dobey> infinity: yeah; wonder what mark would say about it :)
[19:23] <cyphermox> xnox: installed
[19:45] <slangasek> cjwatson: hey, re: bug #1576353, either I'm misunderstanding something or you are
[20:18] <ochosi> seb128: just my 2 cents, the xubuntu theme is basically in a similar state as the unity themes (even a tad better, tbh) but gtk3.20 means a *rewrite*, not just some refactoring or incremental changes
[20:34] <tjaalton> dobey: already being discussed with amd and their hybrid driver schedule
[20:35] <tjaalton> infinity: soon
[20:50] <doko> infinity, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dpkg/+bug/1576915
[21:00] <seb128> ochosi, k, feel free to write that on the bug report, that's useful information, as said earlier we should try to break no flavor with the update so better to list things that needs to be worked on before landing
[21:25] <cjwatson> slangasek: the man pages are clear as mud, but I think I see what you mean from the linked blog posts.  It would be a big patch though, and not one I'm willing to maintain as a distro patch or (TBH) write myself; needs to go upstream
[21:55] <slangasek> cjwatson: check :)
[22:05] <de-facto> how do i install all build-dependencies when im inside a package root directory (which has "debian" dir inside it) from a script?
[22:06] <de-facto> e.g. those shown as error when i run dpkg-buildpackage
[22:06] <de-facto> i want to install them in a automated way
[22:06] <slangasek> de-facto: by running 'sudo mk-build-deps -i -r'
[22:10] <mwhudson> you can point apt build-dep at the dsc as well
[22:10] <de-facto> nice can i default to "yes dont ask me just install them"?
[22:11] <de-facto> i just have a "debian" dir
[22:13] <de-facto> i want this to run through in a script without user interaction
[22:17] <de-facto> something like     mk-build-deps ; sudo dpkg -i *.deb ; rm *.deb ; sudo apt-get -y -f install     maybe?
[22:21] <mwhudson> de-facto: did you see the flags slangasek mentioned?
[22:21] <mwhudson> -i -r
[22:22] <slangasek> fwiw if you want to skip the apt install prompt you need an extra -t 'apt-get o Debug::pkgProblemResolver=yes -y'
[22:25] <de-facto> ah nice thats what i need ;))
[22:29] <de-facto> sudo mk-build-deps -i -r -t 'apt-get -o Debug::pkgProblemResolver=yes --no-install-recommends -y'
[22:29] <de-facto> seems to work thanks guys
[22:46] <rlaager> Does anyone have a fresh *GUI* install of 16.04 handy? I'm looking for the group memberships of a user created by the installer. A server install has adm cdrom sudo dip plugdev lxd lpadmin sambashare.
[22:54] <de-facto> rlaager its not completely fresh but i guess on ubuntu-gnome it would be something like <username> adm cdrom sudo dip plugdev lpadmin sambashare
[23:29] <rlaager> de-facto: Thanks.


[02:10] <kidx> Hello
[02:10] <roasted> hello
[02:11] <kidx> I wanna install alpha and help ind issues would this be iwse also i am a a gamer and running steam would it be wise to find errors with steam? also are you guys gona support steam and other gaming title just like ubuntu?
[02:12] <kidx> is your goal the same as ubuntu or just wondering casue i love gaming and love Gnome?
[02:13] <roasted> I'm not a developer, so I can't directly comment, but I can't imagine Ubuntu GNOME would be wildly different than Ubuntu in terms of gaming.
[02:13] <roasted> Ubuntu GNOME is built on the Ubuntu base.
[02:13] <roasted> And even if it wasn't, Steam is running on countless other Linux distros. Fedora, openSUSE, etc.
[02:13] <kidx> so whast the idea here
[02:14] <roasted> Ubuntu is based on Unity
[02:14] <roasted> Ubuntu GNOME is based on Gnome
[02:14] <roasted> It's the front end, the desktop environment which is different.
[02:14] <kidx> the ubuntu gnome main site said its easy to install true or false?
[02:14] <roasted> Ubuntu GNOME intends to be built on the Ubuntu base while being as pure Gnome as possible.
[02:14] <roasted> Oh yes.
[02:15] <kidx> so pretty much same as ubunut base with gnome so every thing is compatible correct?
[02:15] <roasted> I've never had an issue installing any sort of Linux distro, for the most part. Some are different but most are easy.
[02:15] <roasted> If it's compatible with Ubuntu, it's compatible with Ubuntu GNOME.
[02:15] <kidx> awsome
[02:15] <kidx> thast what i wanna hear
[02:15] <roasted> The only time that might not be true is if you're trying to install a Unity-specific feature (like a new lens or something) into Ubuntu GNOME.
[02:15] <kidx> i am installing alpha now to look for bugs
[02:15] <roasted> But that would be due to, well, not having Unity, since Ubuntu is Unity and Ubuntu GNOME is Gnome. :P
[02:15] <roasted> Nice. I'm running the alpha on my end too.
[02:16] <roasted> I had some issues with system hardlocks on the 3.8 kernel, which is what 13.04 is based on. The 13.10 alpha comes with kernel 3.10, and I've had *no* issues with it.
[02:16] <roasted> Apport comes up now and then saying it found an issue, but I've never had any actual stability issues to report.
[02:16] <roasted> For being in alpha, it seems pretty solid. I've never ran an alpha OS before. I'm a believer in LTS releases.
[02:16] <kidx> 12.10 was bad
[02:17] <kidx> i skipped it
[02:17] <roasted> But since Ubuntu GNOME is young yet, it missed the 12.04 LTS mark, so... here I am.
[02:17] <roasted> Yea I ran 12.10 for all but two days before I went back to 12.04.
[02:17] <roasted> On Unity, that is.
[02:17] <roasted> I didn't use Ubuntu GNOME in 12.10 days when it was the remix.
[02:17] <roasted> I was still trying to tolerate Unity.
[02:17] <kidx> unity is ok minux amazon
[02:17] <roasted> yeah
[02:17] <kidx> i hope none of that goes in here
[02:18] <roasted> The amazon thing ENRAGES me.
[02:18] <roasted> oh my gosh I doubt it ever would.
[02:18] <kidx> good
[02:18] <roasted> Gnome would never allow it, and Ubuntu GNOME aims to be directly in line with Gnome as much as possible.
[02:18] <kidx> i love this version just needs testers
[02:18] <kidx> ill be testing teh hell out of this
[02:18] <roasted> good deal!
[02:18] <kidx> 24/7 gaming and every thing
[02:18] <roasted> Lots of good guys in here.
[02:18] <roasted> I've had conversations with a few of the devs. They're great.
[02:18] <roasted> Volunteering their time and energy to make this distro spin amazing while listening to end users like me. Gotta love it.
[02:19] <kidx> never met teh gnome devs here
[02:19] <roasted> Yeah, there's a handful of them here. Great guys.
[02:19] <kidx> i need help installiong graphic drivers for my ati
[02:19] <kidx> amd
[02:19] <kidx> HD5770
[02:19] <kidx> thats all
[02:19] <kidx> and i am off to the races
[02:19] <roasted> It wouldn't be any different in Ubuntu GNOME than what it was in Ubuntu.
[02:20] <roasted> Just need to enable it in your additional drivers tab of the software sources menu.
[02:20] <kidx> just burning now and gona install oh does teh fan club driver installer work here
[02:20] <roasted> Also, good luck. AMD/ATI hasn't been the best with Linux support.
[02:20] <kidx> with gnome it has for me
[02:20] <roasted> Hopefully that card, being relatively new and all (if I recall), would yield better results.
[02:20] <roasted> I personally stick to Intel and Nvidia GPUs and Intel or Atheros wifi chips.
[02:21] <kidx> intel could not run a game more than 60fps maxed out lol
[02:21] <kidx> and they are a cpu dev not graphics
[02:21] <roasted> yeah, Intel GPUs aren't largely used for gaming.
[02:21] <kidx> nvidia i say yea
[02:21] <roasted> I prefer them for laptops, though, since gaming on laptops is kind of LOL.
[02:21] <kidx> but i had issue with nvidia in the past
[02:21] <roasted> They work great for HTPC setups though.
[02:21] <roasted> Nvidia used to be meh a few years ago.
[02:22] <roasted> Ever since Linus Torvalds flipped them the bird they've been bringing a lot of updates to the Linux side - which is great.
[02:22] <kidx> do you know the the ubuntu amd installer by fan club works
[02:22] <roasted> no idea
[02:22] <kidx> ill test it
[02:22] <roasted> I avoid AMD like the plague, to be entirely honest with you. :P
[02:23] <roasted> I haven't used AMD on Linux since... probably 2008
[02:23] <kidx> amd is not bad
[02:23] <roasted> AMD is not 'bad', but their lack of Linux support writes them off in my book.
[02:23] <kidx> its the linux xserver
[02:23] <roasted> Nvidia does a better job, so I support them by choice.
[02:23] <roasted> No - it's their drivers.
[02:23] <kidx> nope
[02:23] <roasted> I understand AMD only has 1 guy working on drivers, and his work has been somewhat questionable over the years.
[02:23] <kidx> the x server needs to be fixed
[02:24] <roasted> If you say so, man. ;)
[02:24] <kidx> thats why we get screen tear on all cards
[02:24] <roasted> There's no denying that the xserver needs an overhaul. That's where Wayland and Mir are coming from.
[02:24] <kidx> windows on the other hand dont have that
[02:24] <roasted> But it doesn't excuse why AMD has significantly worse driver quality than Nvidia as of right now, today.
[02:24] <roasted> But if it works for you, then that's great. That's all that matters.
[02:24] <kidx> but they copyrighted there patteren
[02:25] <kidx> what u mean driver quality
[02:25] <kidx> if you mean physicx
[02:25] <roasted> FGLRX is a royal headache.
[02:25] <kidx> lol
[02:25] <kidx> nvidia cant rollback
[02:25] <roasted> I've gotten kernel updates that broke FGLRX entirely, requiring me to resort to a terminal to fix the issue.
[02:25] <roasted> Meanwhile Nvidia rolls from one kernel to another without issue.
[02:26] <kidx> so they both have there issues
[02:26] <roasted> I have, literally, never had an issue with Nvidia GPUs
[02:26] <kidx> they are a headach in my eyes fans always going
[02:26] <kidx> the gpu chp is all that is good
[02:26] <roasted> They do. In some ways, it's like picking your poison. I'm just saying, if I have to pick a poison, I'd rather pick a teaspoon of arsenic than 10 gallons of it.
[02:27] <kidx> if you say so
[02:27] <roasted> In fact, some people were predicting 2013 would be the year AMD would have to sell out. That of course is kind of a stretch, but it made me laugh seeing that.
[02:27] <roasted> It doesn't affect me - I just buy different gear that I know works for my needs.
[02:27] <kidx> I rather coolr runnign better price range than what nvidia has to offer but to eeach their own man
[02:27] <roasted> If yours works, then great.
[02:28] <kidx> yup
[02:28] <roasted> But I will say this.
[02:28] <roasted> There's a reason Intel/Nvidia chips are in System76 (Ubuntu preinstalled laptop vendor) units and not AMD...
[02:28] <roasted> just my 2c. ;)
[02:28] <kidx> thats 1 lol only 1
[02:29] <roasted> Ha - okay, we're going no where.
[02:29] <roasted> If AMD works for you, use it.
[02:29] <kidx> i am using it
[02:29] <kidx> lol
[02:29] <roasted> But I avoid them for several reasons, and I don't see that changing unless AMD ups their Linux support substantially.
[02:29] <kidx> been great for years
[02:29] <kidx> how we suspose that
[02:29] <kidx> what we do
[02:30] <roasted> what do we do for.. what
[02:30] <kidx> i am not buying a expensive card unless my pc i get comes with it
[02:30] <roasted> I don't buy overly expensive cards for my systems.
[02:30] <roasted> I just buy what I need and move on with life. :P
[02:30] <kidx> i am a gamer all i wanna do is game with a budget price
[02:31] <roasted> Well, have at it.
[02:31] <roasted> I'd rather pay a few bucks more to know I'm getting good support than the reverse.
[02:31] <kidx> how much more 300
[02:31] <roasted> Hard to say without having a need on the table for a new system and a budget to spend on gear.
[02:32] <roasted> I haven't built a system that is gaming worthy for about 2 years, so I'd need to look around and read up.
[02:32] <kidx> i can double Intell for half teh price or less
[02:32] <kidx> 8 core cpu 209
[02:32] <roasted> That's fine.
[02:32] <kidx> price intel
[02:32] <kidx> i7
[02:32] <kidx> lol
[02:33] <roasted> But like I said, it doesn't matter if the most amazing AMD GPU is 10 bucks.
[02:33] <roasted> If it has crap support, it has crap support.
[02:33] <roasted> In Linux, people avoid AMD GPU's for a reason.
[02:33] <kidx> every one keeps saying this
[02:33] <roasted> I can't comment on AMD processors though. That's kind of a different beast since CPUs ar ea bit different.
[02:34] <roasted> CPUs don't need specific proprietary drivers to run as GPUs do
[02:34] <darkxst> my theory is that AMD don't really have the man power to maintain both a proprietry blob and the OSS drivre
[02:34] <kidx> you would think open source drivers would solve stuff
[02:34] <roasted> Open source drivers could solve stuff... but as long as AMD keeps code closed off, it's a difficult task to undertake.
[02:35] <kidx> i heard  they were gona open source it
[02:35] <kidx> but i guess thats a myth
[02:35] <roasted> I hope they do.
[02:35] <roasted> So far I haven't heard anything.
[02:35] <kidx> me neither
[02:35] <kidx> i just hear talks in the works
[02:36] <kidx> and stuff from other communitys
[02:36] <darkxst> they have a team working on radeon driver, however most of the code in fglrx will never be able to be open sourced
[02:36] <roasted> If they do, I'll be a number 1 supporter of AMD.
[02:36] <roasted> But I don't see them doing that.
[02:36] <roasted> darkxst: by choice, or by design?
[02:36] <darkxst> they have landed dynamic power management in 3.11
[02:36] <kidx> they once were the best cards to have
[02:36] <roasted> very nice
[02:37] <darkxst> by protecting IP i guess
[02:37] <roasted> darkxst: do you think 13.10 will be married to 3.10? Or do you think 13.10 has room to adopt newer kernels as the release date gets closer?
[02:37] <kidx> brb guys nice talking with you
[02:37] <darkxst> I don't think the kernel team has made the final call yet, so will depend on how things progress leading up to kernel freeze
[02:38] <roasted> is there a date set for that?
[02:38] <roasted> the kernel freeze?
[02:41] <darkxst> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelFreeze
[02:45] <roasted> good deal
[02:53] <tich_> Hey. I have been working on an essay and just noticed that my spell check isn't activated in libreoffice but it appears from the settings that it should be. any suggestions to get it working?
[02:55] <darkxst> tich_, you probably need to make sure you have dictionaries installed
[02:56] <darkxst> myspell-*
[02:56] <darkxst> and/or hunspell for some languages I think
[02:57] <tich_> darkxst, i am pretty sure i have myspell installed. i will check for hunspell
[02:58] <darkxst> tich_, check the wiki https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LibreOffice
[02:59] <kidx> hello guys i am on 13.10 but hen i installed it the os said 13.04
[02:59] <kidx> is that right
[03:03] <tich_> darkxst, yeah. i didn't have the right one installed but it is fixed now thanks
[07:57] <darkxst> Look what happened to the blinds ! https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/115870/Saucy%20-%203.9%20%40%202013-07-17%2017%3A54%3A11.png
[09:08] <anonee> BrokenThumb hi, I'm trying to add a bookmark using the Bookmarks menu or by pressing Ctrl+D but to no avail... (nautilus 3.4.2 in GNOME 3.4 fallback mode) can you please help me? P.S. no need to type the spaces, I understand :D and get well.
[09:09] <anonee> maybe jbicha got the answer?
[09:49] <darkxst> anonee, that works fine here
[09:50] <anonee> darkxst adding a local folder right?
[09:50] <darkxst> yeh
[09:50] <anonee> not working for me :(
[09:51] <darkxst> what version of nautilus?
[09:51] <anonee> nautilus 3.4.2 in GNOME 3.4 fallback mode
[09:51] <anonee> on*
[09:52] <darkxst> oh, I don't even have a VM with 3.4 anymore!
[09:53] <anonee> because 3.4 was the last version that offers GNOME Classic as far as I know
[09:54] <darkxst> 3.8 has classic mode, but still requires openGL for best performance
[09:55] <anonee> i have openGL
[09:55] <anonee> it's a physical machine
[09:55] <anonee> I'm afraid you
[09:56] <anonee> I'm afraid u make me upgrade now lol
[09:56] <anonee> how to?
[09:56] <anonee> do I have to purge 3.4 first?
[09:57] <anonee> btw I'm using compiz and emerald.
[09:57] <anonee> and conky
[09:57] <darkxst> you would lose compiz
[09:57] <darkxst> but conky should still work
[09:58] <anonee> you mean it won't work on 3.8?
[09:58] <darkxst> (its basically gnome-shell with a bunch of extensions to make it more like the old layout)
[09:58] <darkxst> yeh compiz won't work on 3.8
[09:58] <anonee> then no thank you, the jelly windows make me feel better lol
[09:59] <anonee> compiz is essential, it brings some fun to the serious times
[09:59] <anonee> darkxst I can live without the bookmarks!
[10:00] <anonee> but u know what I'm gonna run in terminal and see!
[10:00] <anonee> how did i forget that
[10:01] <darkxst> you might have troubling running gnome-shell in a terminal ;)
[10:02] <anonee> wait a min I should select the folder, and then Ctrl+D or click Add bookmark. right?
[10:03] <darkxst> on 3.8 you enter the folder and then ctrl+D to bookmark it
[10:03] <darkxst> I really don't remember how it worked in 3.4
[10:03] <anonee> I just felt stupid, but thank you, it's working :P
[10:03] <anonee> :D
[10:04] <anonee> and I was thinking there should be something wrong
[10:04] <anonee> :D
[13:13] <kidx> Hello did any one notice when installing 13.10 it says 13.04 or no?
[14:01] <ashish_> i m using ubuntu12.04. can i use gnome 3.8 on it. currently my gnome is 3.4. i tried but not able to install after adding ppa
[14:08] <ashish_> anybody will ans?
[14:28] <jbicha> gnome flashback with compiz still works in 13.10 but there are issues like bug 971051 and bug 1196177
[14:29] <jbicha> there effectively aren't developers working on flashback which is bad when gnome evolves so much from release to release
[14:31] <jbicha> there's also some bugs where apps assume that it is "GNOME" even though underneath it's probably more like Unity


[08:02] <mup> Bug #2046717 opened: unable to delete DNS record when record has invalid character <MAAS:New> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/2046717>


[07:50] <rydare> hello ubuntu budgies
[07:56] <fossfreedom_> rydare, hi
[07:56] <rydare> fossfreedom_: hey man you use this sh*t?
[07:56] <rydare> i'm liking it
[07:57] <rydare> i had to manually call gnome-screenshot with print screen though
[07:57] <rydare> apparently it's a bug
[07:57] <fossfreedom_> rydare, yep - fixed in 18.04
[07:57] <rydare> should i update or is it still pretty experimental?
[07:57] <rydare> that's nice that it's fixed
[07:57] <fossfreedom_> only if you are prepared to help test - and regularly reinstall
[07:58] <rydare> i've reinstalled linux like 10 times in the past couple weeks lol
[07:58] <rydare> i have a system
[07:58] <rydare> works a lot better now that i turned off legacy boot
[07:58] <fossfreedom_> things will be constantly changing until beta 1 hits in a couple of weeks
[07:58] <rydare> finds windows by default now
[08:03] <rydare> i'll probably wait for a beta
[15:46] <drazen> Hi, I am new to Ubuntu Budgie and I love it. But I noticed a bug. In upper right corner where icon for a Wi-Fi are, sometimes icon is just a "white mess" a blured dot... and sometimes its ok. Does anyone have that issue? Best


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[05:39] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Fridge:: Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter Issue 632 @ http://fridge.ubuntu.com/2020/05/25/ubuntu-weekly-newsletter-issue-632/ (by guiverc)
[08:12] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Softpedia:: Linux Laptop Spotlight: System76 Adder WS @ https://news.softpedia.com/news/linux-laptop-spotlight-system76-adder-ws-530095.shtml (by Bogdan Popa, Microsoft News Editor)
[08:14] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Ubuntu Blog: Design and Web team summary – 27 May 2020 @ https://ubuntu.com/blog/design-and-web-team-summary-27-may-2020
[08:35] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Ubuntu Blog: Hybrid cloud and multi-cloud: what is the difference? @ https://ubuntu.com/blog/hybrid-cloud-and-multi-cloud
[15:22] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::OMG!Ubuntu:: GNOME Devs Working on Major Improvements to the Apps Grid @ https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/?p=179364 (by Joey Sneddon)
[19:35] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Ubuntu Blog: Ubuntu on WSL 2 Is Generally Available @ https://ubuntu.com/blog/ubuntu-on-wsl-2-is-generally-available
[20:31] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Kees Cook: security things in Linux v5.5 @ https://outflux.net/blog/archives/2020/05/27/security-things-in-linux-v5-5/