[01:45] <MiningForMac> hello?
[01:45] <MiningForMac> anyone here?
[01:45] <zmoylan-2i> yes
[01:45] <MiningForMac> I have a VERY specific ubuntu question
[01:45] <zmoylan-pi> can
[01:45] <MiningForMac> and i can't find the answer anywhere
[01:46] <zmoylan-pi> can't hurt to try
[01:46] <MiningForMac> Is there a way to empty a windows recycle bin through a bootable ubuntu flash drive?
[01:47] <daftykins> when does that scenario even come up?
[01:47] <MiningForMac> In a TV Production class where your tricaster is lagging incredibly because you have 300+ gigs in the recycle bin
[01:48] <MiningForMac> but you can't access it because the computer crashes every time you exit the program
[01:48] <MiningForMac> and the program opens on startup
[01:48] <MiningForMac> I was thinking of booting into safe mode and trying it that way, but I'm not sure if that'd work
[01:48] <zmoylan-pi> press shift while starting windows prevents windows loading programs iirc
[01:48] <MiningForMac> ...
[01:49] <MiningForMac> is this really a thing?
[01:49] <MiningForMac> I've never heard of this
[01:49] <MiningForMac> oh my god
[01:49] <zmoylan-pi> i used it in windows 3 :-) i'll check to see if it still works :-)
[01:49] <MiningForMac> I think you've solved all my problems
[01:49] <MiningForMac> I just checked, it works on XP
[01:50] <MiningForMac> also, just in general, should I start using ubuntu as my daily OS? Like is it worth getting into?
[01:50] <zmoylan-pi> this is why i hate gui's a lot of the otions are invisible unless you know the secret combo
[01:50] <MiningForMac> or are is there a better starting linux distro?
[01:50] <zmoylan-pi> well we might be biased here a smidge :-D
[01:50] <MiningForMac> lol
[01:51] <MiningForMac> what advantages would I get from using it?
[01:51] <MiningForMac> like why Ubuntu > Windows?
[01:52] <zmoylan-pi> security is better, runs on cheaper hardware, more sane software
[01:53] <MiningForMac> hmm I see
[01:54] <daftykins> MiningForMac: never... ever set software to autorun.
[01:54] <MiningForMac> but with everything running natively on windows nowadays, are those pros really worth it?
[01:54] <MiningForMac> I don't, my teacher did
[01:54] <daftykins> educate him or her ;)
[01:54] <MiningForMac> the only reason we have it is to stream our morning announcements
[01:54] <zmoylan-pi> yes, i get to decide what runs on my system and when.
[01:55] <MiningForMac> it outputs to a tv channel only within the school and an internet stream
[01:55] <MiningForMac> hmm, that does seem mighty nice
[01:55] <MiningForMac> I always see ubuntu and want to get into it, but see no point in doing so
[01:56] <MiningForMac> like I get that it's a LOT more customizable and secure
[01:56] <daftykins> runs on cheaper hardware? that might be true of xubuntu or lubuntu but hasn't been true of ubuntu for years.
[01:56] <MiningForMac> and it seems great
[01:56] <zmoylan-pi> buy a rasp pi and learn linux without having to risk a parents laptop and they're cheap.  also robotics are good on the pi
[01:56] <MiningForMac> but idk, I have no reason to switch from windows, although I want a reason
[01:56] <MiningForMac> hmm
[01:56] <MiningForMac> that might be a good idea actually
[01:57] <zmoylan-pi> i'm now looking at getting my second pi to build a netbook/pda :-)
[01:59] <daftykins> nn
[01:59] <daftykins> happy October \o
[02:00] <zmoylan-pi> let the christmas adverts commence
[02:01] <daftykins> so glad i don't use broadcast TV
[02:01] <zmoylan-pi> i ended up with my first tv in years as i had no hdmi monitor to connect to so i connected it to scart tv :-)
[02:02] <zmoylan-pi> the rasp pi that is
[06:06] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[06:18] <SuperMatt> morning
[06:18] <brobostigon> morning SuperMatt
[06:20] <SuperMatt> so, I was in Italy for the last week. Shellshock?
[06:22] <Myrtti> moin
[06:22] <brobostigon> moin Myrtti
[06:23] <brobostigon> SuperMatt: everything more or less, fixed and patched up.
[06:23] <SuperMatt> but I don't know what it did or how it worked
[08:21] <Myrtti> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f51yPfhQZn8
[08:24] <foobarry> SuperMatt: you probably owe your colleagues a beer
[08:42] <SuperMatt> probably
[08:42] <SuperMatt> but lots of people on my team were out when heartbleed struck, so I got my own back this time
[09:06] <JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Vegetarian Day! :-D
[09:29] <jpds> SuperMatt: Why were you in a trench in Italy?
[09:38] <SuperMatt> hardly in a trench
[09:39] <SuperMatt> https://plus.google.com/u/0/104760950939866700163/posts/56ekTv3dsyB?pid=6065149204656318674&oid=104760950939866700163
[09:53] <diplo> Opening your link crashed my Xorg SuperMatt :D
[09:53]  * diplo is trying again
[09:54] <diplo> ah so it was trying to scroll around a panorama :/
[09:58] <ali1234> who wants a £35 xbox voucher code?
[09:59] <davmor2> JamesTait: Yay I love Vegetarians, mind you I like them most with roast potatoes, peas, yorkshire puddings and gravy
[09:59] <JamesTait> Me too, davmor2, as long as they're of the bovine variety. ;)
[10:00] <davmor2> JamesTait: :)
[10:02]  * zmoylan-pi hogs the bacon
[10:02] <davmor2> JamesTait: I don't mind bacon sandwiches either but I understand their omnivores
[10:02] <davmor2> they're even
[10:03] <davmor2> JamesTait: and stuff vegetarian at christmas is a must
[10:03] <zmoylan-pi> pigs turn rubbish into nicest of meats
[10:03] <davmor2> stuffed
[10:05] <JamesTait> I took some bacon out of the freezer this morning, so I can have bacon sandwiches for lunch.
[10:10] <popey> ali1234: my son probably would. he never has enough minecraft skins ☻
[10:39] <foobarry> i need to learn how to microwave bacon
[10:40] <popey> Today I learned http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Velology
[10:40] <zmoylan-pi> microwave bacon is ok in a pinch but it's not the same
[10:40] <Seeker`> foobarry: why not use a frying pan?
[10:41] <Seeker`> popey: seems a little late to start a collection :P
[10:41] <zmoylan-pi> because the last time he tried to microwave a frying pan it got smoky :-p
[10:41]  * Seeker` sighs at zmoylan-pi
[10:41]  * zmoylan-pi grins at Seeker`
[10:42] <popey> heh
[10:43] <Seeker`> popey: hows things?
[10:43] <popey> great
[10:44] <popey> see this? https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2040419302/matchstick-the-streaming-stick-built-on-firefox-os
[10:45] <Seeker`> popey: chromecast without the chrome?
[10:45] <foobarry> i like grilled bacon best
[10:45] <foobarry> wondered if microwave bacon tasted any different
[10:45] <foobarry> fried bacon requires too much washing up
[10:46] <dutchie> foobarry: i agree
[10:46] <dutchie> microwave bacon is ok
[10:46] <Seeker`> foobarry: ah.  Because I think bupa care is free at my job.
[11:44] <diplo> yeah you can still use NHS
[11:44] <diplo> As you will still pay your National insurance even though you pay for private
[11:44] <popey> of course you can, yes.
[11:45] <zmoylan-pi> only the freshest leeches will be used :-p
[11:45] <Azelphur> popey: I noticed you added me on steam, but under my alt account I use for catching cheaters, I added you on my main one :)
[11:45] <popey> heh
[11:46] <ujjain> ah ok, I'll just sign up for that then.
[11:49] <Azelphur> I think I broke uplink, I started playing yesterday morning, I got the bare essentials, hacked every single bank account in the game, cleaned out the ones with any money in them, fast forwarded through the story line, put all the money I stole on the stock market, I now have 30 million credits :P
[11:49] <directhex> ujjain: bupa don't offer comprehensive care, so you *can't* use them for most things
[11:50]  * directhex catches Azelphur, locks him up
[11:50] <Azelphur> hehe
[11:50] <Azelphur> directhex: I'm thinking about cleaning out every single account in the game regardless of value, just to see what the news says.
[11:50] <ujjain> so the only good ething about bupa is that I can go to a private hospital for the ENT doctor? not even sure about that
[11:51] <ujjain> I had an operation on my ear 18 months ago, better care ewould be better I guess,
[11:51] <popey> you can also skip queues for ops if needed
[11:51] <popey> and maybe get private rooms
[11:52] <awilkins> ujjain, My perception is that private has 2 advantages  i) nicer accommodation  ii) shorter queues
[11:52] <ujjain> ah wow, that's nothing, only good if you are operated on
[11:52] <awilkins> ujjain, But aside from that, you'll be treated by NHS doctors, often in NHS facilities
[11:52] <ujjain> shorter queues for everything, right?
[11:52] <ujjain> ah right
[11:52] <popey> shorter queues can be beneficial to some
[11:52] <popey> also, you may get drugs that aren't available on nhs
[11:53] <ujjain> although queues are quite crappy on NHS, but I had a doctor only working on fridays, and on holiday for a month and they told me I couldn't switch doctors either, argh
[11:53] <awilkins> The key phrase is that it's "affecting your ability to work"
[11:53] <ujjain> ah nice popey
[11:53] <ujjain> so like cocaine?
[11:53] <popey> lolz
[11:53] <awilkins> Cocaine is available on NHS! It's routinely used in opthalmic surgery.
[11:53] <ujjain> and they might pay for more boots drugs, right?
[11:53] <ujjain> instead of paying yourself?
[11:53] <popey> like expensive treatments that the NHS can't afford or choose not to use
[11:54] <ujjain> yeah, right
[11:54] <ujjain> I heard bupa paid 2k to people so they would use NHS instead of them for operation
[11:54] <popey> i haven't had to go private for anything so far in my life and I'm 42.
[11:54] <popey> perhaps in 20 years that might be different
[11:54]  * awilkins likewise
[11:55] <ujjain> and you have paid monthly for many years something like 50-100 per month?
[11:55] <awilkins> My only operation involving an anaesthetic has been my wisdom teeth which I needed out in my early 30s
[11:55] <directhex> i got bupa to pay for physio when my shoulder hurt
[11:55] <awilkins> I waited 6 weeks for the op, which I didn't think too onerous (although they were really ruining my ability to work)
[11:56] <awilkins> I have a new job and if they offer me private healthcare I will seriously think about turning it down, just on the grounds that I think it harms the NHS
[11:56]  * awilkins has worked for the NHS much of his working life
[11:57] <awilkins> That said, if the Tory plan to destroy the NHS comes to fruition, I am not so stupid as to cut off my nose to spite my face
[11:58] <awilkins> popey, I think the opposite is true in some cases about expensive treatment - BUPA don't want to foot the bill for complex and uncommon surgeries and will defer the cases to the NHS
[11:59] <popey> ujjain: i dont have private health care, never have
[11:59] <awilkins> Private health companies in general want the common, predictable, assembly-line medicine they can make a sure profit margin on
[11:59] <ujjain> ah right.
[11:59] <popey> ujjain: but you can on-demand go private for some things
[11:59] <ujjain> yeah, I've heard, they given you a better price if you say you have no privatea health insurance and have to pay yourself
[11:59] <popey> e.g. my father in law has back surgery, he went private for that
[12:00] <awilkins> ujjain, In the case of the USA, you'd best be prepared to negotiate (and that's one of the major roles your insurer fills)
[12:00] <ujjain> US seems like a nightmare when it comes to costs of health care and education.
[12:01] <awilkins> Yes, it is. By design, I feel.
[12:02] <awilkins> http://www.uta.edu/faculty/story/2311/Misc/2013,2,26,MedicalCostsDemandAndGreed.pdf
[12:02] <christel> the NHS is brilliant.
[12:03] <awilkins> There have been many enormous protest marches in the last few years over what the incumbent government has done to the NHS
[12:03] <awilkins> Sadly you don't see them reported on in mainstream media
[12:04] <awilkins> I was at one in Manchester last year. Oxford road (if you know it) was nothing but a sea of banners from the heart of the city, through the university district, down to the park near the Royal Infirmary.
[12:04] <christel> i've had surgery on the NHS and i've had surgery at a private hospital as a private patient -- bar being given a drug menu for postoperative analgesics i can't say that the quality of care was in any way or form better when i went private
[12:04] <awilkins> Over 50,000 people by the police count
[12:04] <awilkins> They gave that protest a 2 minute slot on the local news, and shot the crowd across a narrow street from a low angle to make it look like a mothers meeting.
[12:09] <ujjain> A lot of people truly love the NHS, but I haven't been that impressed by my GP and hospital, they ignore phone calls always.
[12:11] <awilkins> Having worked on the clinical side - they are doing their best with what they have.
[12:12] <awilkins> What they have, sadly, has been greatly curtailed by the government.
[12:18] <christel> ujjain: as in, your calls are not being answered or you do not receive a call back?
[12:18] <ujjain> lnot being answered
[12:19] <ujjain> i have to try 5 times a day
[12:19] <ujjain> for days
[12:19] <ujjain> at least the GP is close to my house, 50 meters and waiting time is <30min, so pretty acceptable still
[12:19] <ujjain> just the phone communication bothers me, and 2 month queue for ent appointment
[12:21] <christel> *nod* yeah, i find with my GP surgery i have to make sure to call within a specific window in the early morning if i want to get through/make an appointment, etc.
[12:21] <christel> sorry you're having to wait so long to see an ENT specialist
[12:22] <ujjain> yeah, 5 weeks until hospital processed the referreal
[12:22] <christel> the only thing that really grates at me is how slow it takes to get medical records from surgery a to surgery b when moving!
[12:22] <ujjain> then another 5-6 weeks, etc.
[12:22] <christel> (i moved from surrey to somerset in march -- my GP has still not received a copy of my medical records from my previous GP surgery)
[12:24] <ujjain> ah yeah
[12:24] <ujjain> in holland my GP lost it, :p
[12:24] <ujjain> so it's not a just UK thing haha :p
[12:27] <christel> haha
[12:46] <ujjain> Can you withdraw from your pension? I'm thinking of adding 5% of my income to my pension, as it's taxed 40% right now anyway, just wondering if I could withdraw some if I needed, even if it'd cost 40%
[12:48] <Myrtti> I've no idea how things work in here but nothing stops you from using different investment/savings instruments...
[12:49] <ujjain> If you break these rules you'll be charged 55 per cent tax. And if you don't tell us about it in good time, you may have to pay penalties on top.
[12:49] <ujjain> Even if you've reached 55 there are still rules as to how you can take your pension pot without being liable to a tax charge.
[12:49] <ujjain> uh,
[12:50] <Myrtti> I'm in Finnish taxation and national insurance so I'm still using my Finnish accounts and savings methods.
[12:50] <Myrtti> I'm putting 90€ on voluntary pension scheme a month, and 75€ each to two different investment funds a month
[12:50] <Myrtti> aforementioned I can't touch
[12:50] <ujjain> ah right.
[12:50] <Myrtti> but things are probably different in UK.
[12:59] <daftykins> excuse me i appear to have stepped into #finance-advice instead of #ubuntu-uk...
[12:59] <daftykins> hang on a minute O_O
[13:00] <christel> :o
[13:00] <directhex> isn't linux cool! you can compile kernels!
[13:00] <popey> That's what I like about this channel. Discussion of Ubuntu is almost never topic of the day.
[13:00] <daftykins> :D
[13:00] <Guest3848> finance advice is standard acceptable chat
[13:00] <Guest3848> what
[13:00] <daftykins> yeah i get tired of the nazi like regime in #ubuntu :/
[13:00] <Guest3848> who is guest
[13:00] <popey> er
[13:00] <popey> now now.
[13:01] <Guest3848> christ who stole my nick
[13:01] <popey> lets not equate irc to systematic destruction of people
[13:01] <daftykins> :P
[13:01] <popey> and to be fair you can be somewhat grumpy in there
[13:01] <daftykins> haha, yes, very true
[13:02] <daftykins> last night there was a bot/troll that joined in both #ubuntu asking for when the new version would be out - and in #xbmc at the same time asking the same
[13:02] <arsenip> i can't handle the ubuntu chan
[13:02] <arsenip> :<
[13:02] <daftykins> it's a wonder that there are people out there who actually find nothing better to do than to waste time like that
[13:02] <Myrtti> I could, but I haven't wanted to for months
[13:03] <daftykins> i still like to help but the idiot critical mass gets too much at times
[13:03] <christel> welcome to the internet :s
[13:03] <arsenip> i caiv enever been one for rigid rules from opers :p
[13:03] <Myrtti> I had to stop when I couldn't tell which side of the triangle had the most idiots.
[13:04] <daftykins> arsenip: ;)
[13:04] <Myrtti> arsenip: opers or ops?
[13:04] <arsenip> ops
[13:04] <arsenip> :)
[13:04] <Myrtti> I still have sympathies for everyone in #ubuntu
[13:04] <Myrtti> I just can't do it right now.
[13:04] <arsenip> now to figure out how to get my nick back
[13:04] <arsenip> pretty sure it's protected
[13:04] <Myrtti> in fact, this is the only Ubuntu channel I can withstand at the moment.
[13:04] <christel> i like your current nick
[13:05] <christel> it makes me smile
[13:05] <daftykins> XD
[13:05] <daftykins> it was all about arsensen
[13:05] <daftykins> totally has nothing to do with me having come up with it all those years ago :P
[13:06] <arsenip> tbh Myrtti - most heavily technical channels i find have similar stalin'esque regimes controlling them
[13:06] <arsenip> parsenip, daftykins
[13:06] <arsenip> :D
[13:06] <Myrtti> arsenip: if they're as big as #ubuntu, I can't see how they could even be anything else
[13:06] <arsenip> why is it - when i forget to log in to nickserv - it happily forces me to change my nick
[13:06] <arsenip> but when someone steals my nick ... noooo nickserv nowhere to be seen
[13:06] <Myrtti> not going to detail how different ops enforce the rules
[13:07] <Myrtti> but still
[13:07] <diplo> christel, you're in Somerset now ?
[13:07] <daftykins> arsenip: XD
[13:07] <christel> diplo: yesss!
[13:07] <arsenip> Myrtti  - ive never been one to subscribe to IRC hierarchy, i still work on the assumption irc is like IRL
[13:07] <christel> i'm in the chew valley, surrounded by cows
[13:07] <christel> (quite literally surrounded by cows)
[13:07] <diplo> Where abouts?  Not toooo far away
[13:08] <christel> we should beer!
[13:08] <diplo> Sounds good, I'm in Trowbridge, just the other side of Bath
[13:08] <christel> :D
[13:08] <daftykins> i had my first pint last night since the hospital ;_; that is to say, being in hospital... they didn't have a bar at the hospital
[13:08] <Myrtti> foobarry: I've not had it explained better
[13:09] <christel> daftykins: i wish they had bars at hoospitals
[13:09] <Myrtti> applause to you.
[13:09] <christel> i'd go there a lot more!
[13:09] <daftykins> XD
[13:09]  * foobarry bows
[13:09] <daftykins> "another tumble down the stairs christel? very well here's your booze delivery for breakfast"
[13:09] <diplo> Why have you moved christel ? Work ?
[13:10] <arsenip> i doth not understandings. Apparently i'm always arsenip. makes no sensing to me.
[13:10] <arsenip> brainfart.
[13:10] <arsenip> i think most non-serious injuries would dissapear if ther were a bar in hospital A&E's
[13:12] <christel> diplo: i work from home so i took work with me -- gareth is from bristol originally so we decided to head back to the west country to be closer to family before david started school :)
[13:15] <daftykins> some of my friends over here are still using the old ADSL2+ service that's only 16/0.75Mb - i went to look at ones setup last night, where the router said it was only syncing at 8Mb
[13:15] <daftykins> hilariously they had two routers networked together by cable, so you got online only if the primary one connected to the DSL service responded quicker to the DHCP request
[13:16] <daftykins> quickly killed DHCP on the second once i worked out what was going on :D
[13:16] <daftykins> then i took to the half-speed situation, firmware updates... current: v1.02.xx - new: v2.02.xx
[13:16] <daftykins> 8Mb turned into 13Mb with 2 minutes effort \o/
[13:18] <diplo> Ah nice, better schools here than down in the SE :D
[13:18] <christel> diplo: he's going to marksbury which is brilliant :)
[13:18] <christel> so i am chuffed with that!
[13:18] <diplo> Just down the road for you then
[13:19] <christel> yeah, not at all far -- they even do a compton dando mini-bus service so we don't even have to drop/collect, he gets picked up on the doorstep
[13:20] <christel> and he absolutely LOVES school (fingers crossed he continues to love it for some time seeing how he's got another 12 years to go!)
[13:20] <diplo> Blimey great service! How old is he now, last time I saw him was at popeys BBQ
[13:21] <christel> 4 and a half! just started reception :)
[13:21] <daftykins> cor i don't envy anyone starting the grind right over
[13:22] <arsenip> its less of a grind at 4yo :p
[13:22] <christel> https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10646741_10152651497210937_3153305172141467762_n.jpg?oh=2af3b7353b953a1f9f96f8d14e1896c3&oe=54CF0FDD&__gda__=1418241160_e1a3514256e041e4fe227ad080c6103d first day of school, waiting for the bus in the morning! :)
[13:22] <christel> diplo: how old are your boys now? :)
[13:22] <popey> awwww
[13:23] <diplo> Harry is 6 and Tom just turned 8 on Sunday
[13:23] <diplo> God he's changed!
[13:23] <christel> i know! he is growing up so fast!
[13:23]  * diplo doesn't do very well on photos, see if I can find my kiddos
[13:26] <diplo> https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10509479_628989883863606_4386114759863573979_n.jpg?oh=18b94b0834b61d445c173d14e5a2a913&oe=54C666C0&__gda__=1421275420_ac2ad2bee6e436717dcf5c698ef0318b
[13:26] <diplo> That's Thomas
[13:26] <christel> AWW :D
[13:27] <arsenip> oh how times are terrible
[13:27] <arsenip> i'd feel wrong for opening a link of someone elses kids
[13:27] <arsenip> just because its a computer
[13:27] <arsenip> goddamn mainstream media.
[13:27] <diplo> https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/251806_316855118410419_39672016_n.jpg?oh=8730aa2b125b47cb79c07de5ac09cc92&oe=54C182B1&__gda__=1421268856_f824e45e28d62b79ab72d5648437ade0
[13:27] <diplo> :D
[13:27] <daftykins> arsenip: i understand what you mean, strange isn't it
[13:27] <arsenip> yep
[13:27] <diplo> That was last year, I can't find uploaded copies
[13:27] <christel> oh they are lovely :D
[13:28] <arsenip> kids are awesome
[13:28] <arsenip> especially 3-6yo
[13:28] <diplo> daftykins, arsenip : Image this, I'm a single dad and quite often I can have up to 12-15 kids come round my house to play, majority of them girls
[13:28] <arsenip> under 3 = crying, over 7 = bratty
[13:28] <diplo> I'm pretrified most of the times
[13:28] <arsenip> lol diplo
[13:28] <directhex> blurg
[13:28] <arsenip> you should be able to apply for a "please dont investigate me" license
[13:28] <diplo> Not of the kids, more of the young girls in a house with a male
[13:29] <daftykins> diplo: you must be gold to single mums ;) *ahem* anyway enough of that
[13:29] <diplo> So each time a 'new friend' turns up I go to the parents house and let them know who I am, give them mobile and everything and text them to let them know their kids are with me
[13:29] <daftykins> diplo: that's very wise
[13:29] <christel> arsenip: you should meet my daughter! she doesn't do crying -- she does a lot of GRINNING LIKE A MANIAC and shouting (happily) loudly
[13:29] <christel> admittedly i do suspect she might be a bit simple
[13:29] <diplo> I'm much more easy going than all the other parents it seems, so my house is like a magnet to kids
[13:30] <christel> because i am sure she isnt supposed to be so bloody cheerful all the time
[13:30] <daftykins> christel: d'aww, a little hellraiser in the budding
[13:30] <christel> https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfa1/v/t1.0-9/251806_316855118410419_39672016_n.jpg?oh=8730aa2b125b47cb79c07de5ac09cc92&oe=54C182B1&__gda__=1421268856_f824e45e28d62b79ab72d5648437ade0
[13:30] <arsenip> lol made me laugh christel
[13:30] <arsenip> sounds like a good kid to have.
[13:30] <Myrtti> christel: time to consider getting a shotgun, then
[13:31] <christel> she has just worked out that whole walking thing -- i fear my life is about to become much more complicated!
[13:31] <christel> :)
[13:31] <daftykins> christel: you need to start plotting your productivity on a graph
[13:31] <diplo> christel : +1 - I always say to parents you shouldn't really wish them to walk
[13:31] <diplo> Your life will become even more hard :D
[13:32] <davmor2> christel: no that is what prison cell ermmm play pens are there for ;)
[13:34] <christel> david was quite easygoing (he was careful) at her age ... she is just complete and utterly insane
[13:34] <christel> i can't turn my back on her for two seconds as stuff like https://scontent-b-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10487574_10152515257690937_9029092255154474954_n.jpg?oh=f72a0fb6265c119a840470211e66e2ad&oe=548878C6 happens
[13:34] <daftykins> :O
[13:35] <daftykins> my cat is plenty responsibility for me
[13:37] <christel> hehe
[13:52] <diddledan> https://twitter.com/Channel4News/status/517266067614621696
[13:52] <diddledan> morning
[13:54] <daftykins> XD
[13:54] <daftykins> that was not checked.
[14:23]  * awilkins laughs
[14:23] <awilkins> Also : genuis (some foul language) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YBumQHPAeU
[14:35] <diddledan> awilkins: funny
[14:43] <Laney> I just absent mindedly cleaned my teeth and didn't realise I was doing it until spitting at the end
[14:45] <daftykins> surely you noticed with the whole bathroom walk? 0o
[14:46] <arsenip> gotta love morning autopilot.
[14:48] <Laney> I went to wash my hands after using the loo and then ended up cleaning my teeth too
[14:48] <diddledan> seriously offtopic, but the windows 10 reveal is in video on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfveyXCsiA8&feature=youtu.be&list=UUVGOyzms_XJNk_DHqrffXCw
[14:51] <Seeker`> diddledan: yeah, we've just had a short interlude about brushing teeth, and then you think that something OS-related is seriously offtopic? :P
[14:51] <diddledan> lol
[14:53] <diddledan> it seems ms are mirroring apple with os X vs windows 10 - os x was the last major release with multiple incrementals since and that's what ms seem to want to do
[14:53] <diddledan> so that probably means we'll end up with windows 10.10
[14:53] <diddledan> yosemite :-p
[14:55] <awilkins> Wow, WIndows 10.10 when we're on Ubuntu 14.10 soon :P
[14:55] <awilkins> COME TO THE PURPLE SIDE, WINDOWS GUYS
[14:55] <arsenip> purple?
[14:56] <diddledan> orange, surely?
[14:56] <arsenip> windows users can move to mac or ubuntu really
[14:56] <awilkins> Really?
[14:56] <awilkins> I thought it had all gone purple
[14:56] <arsenip> i'm personally of the opinion that ubuntu isnt very suited to enterprise, but maybe thats just me
[14:56] <directhex> aubergine.
[14:56] <directhex> announcing new Enterprise SteamOS!
[14:57] <directhex> control your access rights with Steam Groups, the smart person's alternative to Active Directory!
[14:57] <awilkins> arsenip, I've of the opinion that "Enterprise" is harmful for my personal productivity, maybe that's just me :-)
[14:57] <arsenip> for home use - definitely awilkins
[14:57] <awilkins> arsenip, Not just home, I use it for work, and get far more done than I would using the standard issue OS
[14:58] <arsenip> ah yes - but do you use it standalone at work, or part of any 'enterprise' services?
[14:58] <awilkins> arsenip, Standalone but it can consume the enterprise services I need (with a little effort in some cases)
[14:58] <awilkins> There are some things that I fall back to the Windows laptop for
[14:58] <arsenip> i dont dissagree, i like ubuntu - dont get me wrong - i am in here :)
[14:58] <awilkins> Evil things. Things that need IE to work.
[14:59] <arsenip> but i'd not consider ubuntu outside of desktop/laptop use.
[14:59] <diddledan> "group policy" invented for enterprises made IS departments think they needed to lock everything down
[14:59] <awilkins> We run a few servers on it
[14:59] <arsenip> or 'home server' via ubuntu server
[14:59] <awilkins> These servers are typically the happiest and least-touchy ones
[15:00] <diddledan> "ooh, we can make people change their passwords regularly? let's set that to hourly!"
[15:00] <awilkins> The windows ones get rebooted all the time and periodically broken by ICT (who are their overlords)
[15:00] <awilkins> The Ubuntu ones they won't touch in case they catch Linux Cooties.
[15:00] <awilkins> They have much better uptime.
[15:00] <diddledan> oh dear, that's nasty, the linux cooties
[15:01] <diddledan> you can't get rid of them easily
[15:01] <diddledan> once the genie is out it's very difficult to lock-down again
[15:01] <awilkins> My new employer has seen fit to order me a laptop and a bunch of Windows productivity software
[15:01] <diddledan> \o/
[15:01] <diddledan> yey?
[15:01] <arsenip> i have a work mac, and i does what i wants with it :D
[15:02] <awilkins> They asked if I wanted anything else to put on it
[15:02] <directhex> i have no windows license for work
[15:02] <awilkins> I said "Linux" ... :P
[15:02] <arsenip> i couldnt ever use windows for anything other than gaming now
[15:02] <arsenip> :/
[15:02] <awilkins> Yeah, that's my primary use for Windows
[15:02] <awilkins> The gaming is even creeping into the Linux though
[15:02] <foobarry> hardly touched win at work or home in 10yrs now
[15:02] <diddledan> unfortunately I like to use photoshop to generate assets from designs made by our designers - it's easier for me to pull them out myself at times
[15:03] <awilkins> Have Neverwinter Nights installed on my "house" laptop and it runs fine even on the Intel chip
[15:03] <arsenip> i need some more steam mac games
[15:03] <arsenip> for when im travelling
[15:03] <awilkins> If it was my setup I'd probably keep a Windows VM
[15:04] <arsenip> understandable, there's always something that demands windows
[15:04] <awilkins> One happy advantage being that you could move it between hardware without it complaining about licensing...
[15:04] <arsenip> usually some crappy software.
[15:04] <awilkins> I have a WinXP VM just for VB6
[15:04] <diddledan> VB6! \o/
[15:04] <arsenip> :(
[15:04] <awilkins> VB6 is a PITA to set up and configure to be good
[15:04] <awilkins> ish
[15:04] <diddledan> VB6 was awesome
[15:05] <diddledan> it's fugly now tho
[15:05] <awilkins> I've still only ever managed to get integrated debugging with ASP / VBScript working once, and man, was that some dark voodoo
[15:05] <diddledan> I remember making VB6 CGI apps
[15:05] <awilkins> Main advantage to VB6 was that with a few choice libraries you could knock out a GUI app really quickly
[15:06] <awilkins> Which still holds true for C# and other .NET langs I suppose
[15:06] <diddledan> yeah, c# and vb.net are quite nice, actually
[15:06] <awilkins> The GUI dev toolkits for most things are a total joke
[15:06] <arsenip> usually
[15:06] <awilkins> MS correctly got with the program and did a GUI toolkit that works well with version control
[15:07] <awilkins> ie code-behind files for .NET forms
[15:07] <arsenip> i find large hardware manufacturers tend to build management software that relies on windows and/or IE
[15:07] <awilkins> Everyone else is still scrabbling to make a GUI dev toolkit that actually works well
[15:07] <awilkins> arsenip, Ick, yes. We had some IBM servers that the management GUI for the lights-out card only works on IE
[15:07] <awilkins> And a particular version of IE
[15:08] <awilkins> When you've downloaded the right DLLs
[15:08] <arsenip> :)
[15:08] <arsenip> exactly.
[15:08] <diddledan> IE6 is common pre-req for enterprise web apps
[15:08] <directhex> vb.net is evil and wrong.
[15:08] <awilkins> Our cheif sysadmin keeps a VM just for that tool
[15:08] <awilkins> VB.NET is evil and wrong and I refused to learn it
[15:08] <awilkins> It's almost but not entirely unlike VB6
[15:08] <directhex> vb6 is eviler and wronger
[15:08] <arsenip> i had a VM for the same for a fujitsu infrastructure management tool
[15:08] <awilkins> Yeah, but VB6 will be the COBOL of our generation
[15:08] <arsenip> though i did a naughty and deleted it from my PC when i left
[15:09] <arsenip> though they deserved it.
[15:09] <awilkins> If I wipe out my VB6 knowledge with VB.NET I'm doing myself out of my retirement fund
[15:09] <awilkins> I'm seriously contemplating just doing a full crypto wipe of my work-issue laptop when I leave
[15:09] <awilkins> They'll re-image it anyway
[15:10] <awilkins> Ever since I discovered they were MITM attacking all our SSL I stopped using any kind of personal account on it
[15:10] <awilkins> They're running all our VoIP through a freaking SIGINT program as well
[15:10] <awilkins> And all our internal phones are VoIP
[15:11] <daftykins> this is clever http://xkcd.com/1427/
[15:11] <awilkins> I don't work for GCHQ or any other kind of high-security agency
[15:12] <daftykins> awilkins: why are they doing that?
[15:12] <awilkins> daftykins, I have no idea WHY
[15:12] <daftykins> surely one would demand answers from an employer
[15:12] <awilkins> I just know they ARE because we get the ICT changelogs and they are moaning about not being able to copy the data to the right SAN node
[15:12] <awilkins> So I looked up the product name (curious as to why they needed to retain a load of VoIP data)
[15:13] <awilkins> We asked about the MITM on the SSL
[15:14] <awilkins> We created a support ticketc for it
[15:14] <awilkins> It just got closed, no comments
[15:14] <arsenip> awilkins  - i had the same in my last role
[15:14] <arsenip> MITM ssl via <wahtever the california named firewall company is called - i forget>
[15:14] <arsenip> palo alto networks.
[15:14] <awilkins> (it was breaking some of our tools because they check certificates and the root CA list didn't have their mickey-mouse self-signed one in it)
[15:14] <awilkins> WebSense?
[15:15] <awilkins> Even when we leave the building, the laptop is configured to send traffic through their servers
[15:15] <arsenip> heh nice.
[15:15] <awilkins> The firewall is also configured to block EVERYTHING
[15:15] <arsenip> palo alto does SSL/SSH decrypt
[15:15] <arsenip> i noticed one day
[15:16] <arsenip> because a 'senior' sysadmin from our umbrella corp (who basically only existed to provide us internet..) told me he knew i was on IRC talking about buying a bicycle
[15:16] <daftykins> >_<
[15:17] <arsenip> so i set the motd on my dedi server to "<my company name> IT dept sucks d***" :)
[15:17] <arsenip> every time i log in...
[15:17] <daftykins> \o/
[15:17] <arsenip> makkes me laugh anyway.
[15:17] <arsenip> idiots.
[15:17] <diddledan> lol
[15:17] <diddledan> sucking dogs, eh?
[15:17] <diddledan> :-p
[15:17] <arsenip> not like they can complain about what it says - they shouldnt me monitoring it.
[15:18] <diddledan> yeah, we've got enough problems with GCHQ and NSA and various other countries' agencies
[15:19] <diddledan> now please bare with me while I use google
[15:19] <diddledan> :-p
[15:19] <diddledan> am I hypocrite? yes, yes I am
[15:19] <diddledan> damn j00 nsa/gchq - google? have all my things
[15:28] <foobarry> bare with you? take our clothes off?
[15:30] <diddledan> if you like
[15:30] <diddledan> only make sure you take some explicit photos for icloud
[15:31] <foobarry> done
[15:31] <diddledan> now tell me how to hack icloud?
[15:31] <foobarry> you want to see a naked foobarry ?
[15:32] <diddledan> not me, but surely someone somewhere on the net does?
[15:32] <daftykins> good lord man, think of the children that might inadvertently see this conversation!
[15:32] <foobarry> they might be able to help
[15:32] <daftykins> ;)
[15:32] <diddledan> like Jennifer Lawrence
[15:32] <diddledan> it's in the public interest
[15:33] <diddledan> speaking of which, did the mirror publish the photo that the tory mp took of his tackle and sent to their reporter?
[15:35] <diddledan> I think if a random woman started talking to me inciting me to send her a n0rty picture I'd rather do it via googley hand-outs
[15:36] <diddledan> that way she has to be responsive via video and therefore a real person
[15:39] <foobarry> she was a swedish model posing as an activist
[15:39] <diddledan> nope
[15:39] <foobarry> the rule for 50-something MPs should be that nobody wants to see your bits, don't fall for it
[15:40] <diddledan> it was a male reporter posing as an activist with a stolen photo of a swedish model
[15:40] <foobarry> ah, even worse
[15:40] <foobarry> thats entrapment
[15:40] <foobarry> ^2
[16:10] <shauno> I'm alive!
[16:14] <daftykins> crikey a wild shauno!
[16:14] <daftykins> shauno: you survived?!
[16:15] <shauno> barely.  I'm sore in all the places.
[16:15] <shauno> (granted that's more ryanair than the 2000m climb ..)
[16:17] <daftykins> shauno: :D
[16:24] <shauno> good stuff though.  lots of this kinda thing; https://www.dropbox.com/s/re6jkor4xdhfnu1/IMG_2056.JPG
[16:25] <daftykins> oooh nice
[16:25] <shauno> although slightly odd when it takes you 9 hours to get up a hill.  and at the top there's an old man in a hut selling soup and beer
[16:26] <shauno> how does he get the beer up there?  I could barely carry my legs!
[16:27] <christel> helicopter.
[16:27]  * christel nods
[16:30] <daftykins> i rememer trekking in Thailand, i'm slipping around in skate shoes climbing up and down and around these hill sides, then a Burmese guy in just flipflops is following laughing his ass off as i fall on my ass a few times :>
[16:31] <shauno> apparently the czechs have a bad reputation for that.  heading up the tatry in shorts & sandles, and then costing the slovak state when they need to go haul them down again
[16:32] <daftykins> erk! yeah planning needed there
[16:32] <dwatkins> people regularly need to be rescued from Athurs Seat in Edinbrugh because they go up to watch the sunset.
[16:32] <daftykins> these days i own some proper hiking shoes, they've been good to walk around in whilst i've been recovering from my accident.
[16:32] <daftykins> dwatkins: lol, then can't see the path down?
[16:32] <dwatkins> It's a great big volcanic plug near the city centre, you don't want to be climbing down it in the dark.
[16:33] <dwatkins> or perhaps a craig, I forget which
[16:33] <shauno> I've thought about that one a few times, but never got around to it.  it seems odd to go to edinburgh and walk *away* from the pubs
[16:33] <dwatkins> I went for a walk in converse all-stars and slipped over on a rock, it wasn't fun
[16:34] <daftykins> haha
[16:34] <daftykins> yeah those are not practical shoes for even road.
[16:34] <dwatkins> I wasn't expecting to be needing traction.
[16:35] <daftykins> hehe
[16:36] <shauno> I am curious why everyone had poles to walk with though.  like skiing sticks, but without the snow.  I'm curious if they help, or if it's just an extra pair of feet to think about
[16:37] <dwatkins> I've been in places where walking poles would have been useful.
[16:37] <shauno> I did get odd looks when everyone's out there with their fancy gear and walking sticks and such.  and I'm plodding along with a smoke and a small flask of whisky.
[16:39] <daftykins> sounds like that nordic walking shenanigans
[16:39] <daftykins> shauno: lol, love it
[16:40] <daftykins> i was headed down the Grand Canyon catching up with friends, some old woman at the side said "alright, no need to run!"
[16:40] <daftykins> s'like, mmkay you're old i'm young, deal with it ;)
[16:40] <shauno> lol, ouch
[16:43] <Myrtti> ooh nordic walking
[16:43] <Myrtti> I wonder where our sticks are
[16:44] <daftykins> funny fads ;)
[16:57] <dwatkins> dang, forgot I had someone coming round to quote for a boiler replacement, and I'm still at work
[16:57] <Laney> get him to kick the door in
[16:57] <dwatkins> I did consider suggesting he ring my neighbor's doorbell
[16:57] <zmoylan-pi> the only set of conditions that guarantees they'll be on time :-p
[16:58] <dwatkins> yeah, the best way to get through to some companies for support is to call the sales line
[16:59] <shauno> I think the trick with ours is to call on days they're closed.  the out-of-hours guys are bored and loney, and you might be the first person they got to talk to all day
[17:07] <davmor2> Myrtti: sticks are on the trees they need them more than you ;)
[17:08] <daftykins> btw i still have an invite if anyone wants to buy a http://oneplus.net/
[17:09] <Myrtti> daftykins: have they fixed the privacy leak yet?
[17:09] <daftykins> have who the what?
[17:09] <Myrtti> davmor2: mine are carbon fiber
[17:09] <Myrtti> davmor2: https://forums.oneplus.net/threads/security-breach.129297/
[17:10] <Myrtti> oh, looks like they have
[17:10] <daftykins> dwatkins: replacing mine cost me £2,000 \o/ gas boiler
[17:11] <daftykins> Myrtti: nothing major then
[17:11] <dwatkins> daftykins: yeah, I'm expecting that ballpark as I need to have a drain pipe fitted to mine
[17:11] <dwatkins> also, I need to put in a hatch to the attic
[17:12] <daftykins> best thing i did for my house since moving in, the existing one was going between lukewarm and cold for the shower
[17:12] <zmoylan-pi> or a rasp pi with camera and robotic arm :-)
[17:12] <shauno> a really big robotic arm that lifts you into the attic!
[17:13] <zmoylan-pi> no just a small arm to do the jobs you'd need the hatch to climb in for.  the first scutter
[17:17] <dwatkins> come to think of it, this boiler quote guy called me last week to arrange an appointment, then called me this Tuesday having realised he'd made the entry in his calendar a week later than I had
[17:19] <zmoylan-pi> he was using the gregorian calender? :-)
[17:19] <dwatkins> haha, maybe
[17:20] <dwatkins> wouldn't that be 5 days out?
[17:21] <zmoylan-pi> 13 days https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregorian_calendar#Difference_between_Gregorian_and_Julian_calendar_dates
[17:30] <dwatkins> ah ok, not a week
[17:30] <dwatkins> anyway, I should go home now my meeting's over, toodles!
[19:55] <ujjain> hey, Cameron is from the conversatives, right?
[19:56] <MartijnVdS> yes
[19:56] <ujjain> he has such a nice voice in his music video, I hope one day to have lost my Dutch accent and talk like that
[19:57] <MartijnVdS> ujjain: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8lmb9m4-tw
[19:58] <ujjain> haha, I meant https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YBumQHPAeU&feature=youtu.be, but that one seems awesome too, let me see
[19:58] <MartijnVdS> ujjain: I know but that one reminded me of the one I posted ;)
[20:02] <DJones> Heh, Nick Griffin has been kicked out of the BNP
[20:02] <DJones> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-29453341
[20:03] <MartijnVdS> DJones: isn't that the guy from Family Guy?
[20:03] <DJones> MartijnVdS: Never watched that, but if the character was offensive, racist & generally unpleasent, the probably
[20:04] <DJones> s/the/then/
[20:05] <MartijnVdS> DJones: apparently that character is "Peter Griffin"
[20:05] <MartijnVdS> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Griffin
[20:05]  * diddledan laughs familyguy style
[20:16] <ujjain> UKIP said they are not as racist as the Dutch PVV
[20:16] <foobarry> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-29448058
[20:16] <foobarry> \o/
[20:19] <foobarry> also...seen this? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-29410999
[20:23] <ali1234> not really very interesting
[20:24] <ali1234> all the different CPU architectures are very... what you might call "typecast"
[20:24] <ali1234> in the sense that everyone "knows" x86 is for desktops, arm is for phones, mips is for routers... etc
[20:25] <ali1234> ARM trying to get into IoT is like intel trying to make x86 phones
[20:26] <ali1234> or ARM servers for that matter
[20:32] <foobarry> ARM seem ideal for "things"
[20:32] <zmoylan-pi> low power? go arm
[20:32] <MartijnVdS> or mips
[20:33] <zmoylan-pi> needs to run cool? go arm
[20:33] <ali1234> AVR will destroy any of them
[20:33] <ali1234> if you want low power / low heat
[20:33] <ali1234> also much cheaper, and don't need an OS
[20:34] <MartijnVdS> my Hue Bridge runs "FreeRTOS"
[20:34] <MartijnVdS> on some kind of STMicro
[20:34] <MartijnVdS> (I think)
[20:34] <ali1234> STM do ARM chips and they have their own CPU arch too
[20:36] <MartijnVdS> http://www.st.com/web/catalog/mmc/FM141/SC1169/SS1575/LN9/PF250182?sc=internet/mcu/product/250182.jsp
[20:36] <MartijnVdS> So... ARM :)
[20:37] <ali1234> yeah
[20:37] <ali1234> the thing about the cortex M chips is they have a powerful ARM core combined with the memory and peripherals you'd find in a microcontroller
[20:37] <ali1234> which is completely pointless
[20:39] <MartijnVdS> why?
[20:39] <ali1234> i mean how much processing power does your smart-toilet actually need?
[20:39] <MartijnVdS> well.. depends on how big the thing you drop in there is
[20:40] <zmoylan-pi> your toilet might be doing a massive core dump... :-p
[20:40] <MartijnVdS> zmoylan-pi: yeah but you could just flush its buffers
[20:41] <zmoylan-pi> and a smart-toilet is perfect for water cooling
[20:42] <ali1234> basically those chips are jack-of-all-trades


[00:29] <poolie> hi maxb
[00:32] <maxb> hello
[00:46] <KombuchaKip> I just ran bzr sign-my-commits in my local working copy. I was prompted to sign previous unsigned revisions and did so. Now when I run bzr status, I don't see anything changed or new to commit to the repository. How do I commit the signed aspect of the revisions?
[00:48] <fullermd> You don't.  Signatures aren't committed things.
[00:48] <KombuchaKip> fullermd: Then how can others verify that someone else's commit is genuine?
[00:50] <fullermd> EBADCOMMUNICATION.  By making a signature, it's in the repo.  Signatures aren't something you commit, they're their own thing that making puts in the VCS storage, like tags.
[00:51] <KombuchaKip> fullermd: So if you don't commit them, how are they sent to the repository so others can verify the revision's authenticity?
[00:52] <fullermd> Same way the commits are; they get pushed/pulled around.
[00:53] <KombuchaKip> fullermd: I am using centralized model. How do I send my signature?
[00:54] <fullermd> Dunno.  In a Proper World(tm), making the signature automatically would propagate it upstream when you're using a checkout.
[00:54]  * KombuchaKip is very confused
[00:54] <fullermd> In the current mishmash, I'm not sure.  Maybe it goes as a side effect next time you commit something.
[00:55] <KombuchaKip> fullermd: It should really show something in status, at least a separate category for tags / metadata that changed.
[00:55] <fullermd> That's not what status does though.  Status talks about changes between revisions.
[00:56] <fullermd> Signatures (and tags, for that matter) aren't part of revisions.  They're a separate dimension.
[00:56] <KombuchaKip> fullermd: So then there should be a status for repository, in addition to one for revisions.
[00:57] <fullermd> Well, the bugs that cause it to be needed in this case should be fixed   :)
[00:57] <KombuchaKip> fullermd: When I click on the "signature" button in the nautilus bzr GUI, it just locks up every time.
[00:58] <fullermd> I'd guess that's something to do with it trying to read a passphrase from the terminal.
[00:58] <KombuchaKip> fullermd: Dunno. Not a very good design. seahorse-daemon just sits there spinning the clock.
[00:59] <fullermd> Hey, don't look at me.  I've never even seen the nautilus bzr GUI.  Or nautilus, for that matter   :)
[01:00]  * KombuchaKip visualized fullermd with a Lemote, virtual console, and X uninstalled.
[01:01] <fullermd> Ehhwut?  Sorry, I couldn't hear you over the clattering of my teletype.
[01:01] <KombuchaKip> fullermd: lol
[01:54] <poolie> thanks for all the patches, gary
[02:54] <mwhudson> what's the incantation to force bzrlib to use openssh as its ssh transport?
[02:55] <mwhudson> i thought it was BZR_SSH=openssh
[02:55] <fullermd> Accords with the docs...
[03:15] <mwhudson> i guess https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/677305 isn't going to make spiv feel any better when he gets back to work
[03:24] <maxb> ooh
[03:24] <maxb> I think I may have fixed that bug
[03:26] <lifeless> maxb: its what killed the importds :)
[03:28] <maxb> I'm kinda surprised no-one noticed - I guess no one actually uses sftp:// much
[03:28] <maxb> I only noticed because dput uses bzrlib for sftp
[03:29] <mwhudson> maxb: it seems that you can bzr branch sftp:// fine, i guess the __del__ method doesn't get called somehow then
[03:30] <lifeless> we nuke the interpreter, don't we?
[03:31] <mwhudson> oh right yes
[03:31] <mwhudson> so very unlikely that __del__ runs then :_)
[05:28] <_habnabit> Does anyone know offhand if a merge with conflicts will return a >0 status code?
[05:37] <poolie> _habnabit: yes, it should
[05:37] <_habnabit> Okay.
[07:06] <vila> hi all !
[07:13] <poolie> hi vila
[07:13] <poolie> i have to confess i am an awful patch pilot :/
[07:14] <vila> poolie: for your sin you will do it again next week :-D
[07:14] <vila> kidding
[07:14] <poolie> hm actually maybe i should
[07:14] <poolie> but, my turn will come around again soon
[07:14] <vila> Instead, you should feel very gulty so you'll be better next time
[07:14] <vila> still kidding
[07:14] <poolie> i'll try to do some next week without wearing the hat
[07:15] <poolie> i see john did some recently
[07:15] <vila> yeah, nice ones, good to see them again :D
[07:15] <vila> regarding pqm, it works again
[07:16] <vila> I haven't summarized the root causes yet, but briefly, we need to define the dependencies in a package that losas can use as a spec
[07:16] <vila> I'll try to work on this today
[07:17] <vila> This doesn't mean we don't need a backup plan, but this should severely reduce the occurrences of what we went through lately
[07:17] <poolie> i think there's a bug asking for that?
[07:18] <poolie> essentially a binary package that defines the dependencies even before such a bzr package exists?
[07:19] <vila> ECANTPARSE 'even before such a bzr' :-/
[07:20] <vila> a package with a Depends clause in the debian/control listing subunut, python-testtools and such (python-docutils ?)
[07:20] <vila> named bzr-check-dependencies or something
[07:21] <poolie> that's what i mean
[07:22] <vila> or bzr-pqm-dependencies (I'm still not sure if we will have variations on this theme like bzr-dev-dependencies or bzr-doc-dependencies for docutils/sphinx switch)
[07:22] <vila> ok
[07:22] <poolie> normally these would be stated as the build dependencies of bzr 2.3.something
[07:22] <poolie> however, there is no package of that name yet, because we can't commit the changes to upstream until we have installed the necessary dependencies into the chroot
[07:22] <vila> ha build, hmm
[07:23] <vila> meh, you lost me here :(
[07:23] <vila> lack of chroot practice probably
[07:32] <poolie> what packages will be depended-upon by tomorrow's bzr?
[07:32] <poolie> you can't look at the metadata of tomorrow's deb package of bzr to find out, because it doesn't exist yet
[07:33] <poolie> one solution to this bootstrapping problem is to have a second deb that just says what depedencies we want to have in the chroot
[07:33] <poolie> is that clearer?
[07:33] <vila> yup
[07:34] <vila> Once it exists, this package will be in the BuildDepends for bzr itself, is that it ?
[07:35] <vila> (since there is no TestDepends but we want to run tests during build this workaround this lack :)
[07:47] <vila> back to bug #676608 and 17 may not enough at http://sourcefrog.net/weblog/software/aesthetics/interface-levels.html
[07:48] <vila> s/and 17/and why 17/ for the ob tyop on my jokes
[07:48] <vila> meh, thanks too much ubot
[07:49] <poolie> almost: it won't be in the builddepends because we only need this is the special case of pqm
[07:49] <poolie> regular debian or ubuntu builds can just declare their build depedencies in the usual way
[07:49] <poolie> heh :)
[07:50] <vila> but they will define the same dependencies no ? May be I should not care about that for now though...
[07:51] <vila> poolie: those are just details, I got your points
[07:56] <vila> 18. Even when you get it right, you're wrong
[07:57] <poolie> :)
[07:59] <vila> The sad thing is that I just tweak my fix because even if all the tests (including the one failing without the fix) were passing *even* if my fix was wrong (and I'm fed up enough to not try to write a test to prove this because.... I'm not even sure I can :-/)
[07:59] <vila> So subtly wrong it looked right, but still :(
[08:00] <GaryvdM> Good morning all.
[08:01] <vila> Good Morning GaryvdM !
[08:01] <vila> err, I meant Goooood Morning GaryvdM
[08:02] <GaryvdM> Ha ha
[08:13] <poolie> good night, vila, gary
[08:13] <GaryvdM> Good night
[08:13] <vila> poolie: enjoy your week-end
[08:14] <poolie> GaryvdM: are you ok on those bugs? maybe vila can help if you need a buddy
[08:15] <GaryvdM> I'm ok - I started looking at doing a incremental annotate last night
[08:15] <GaryvdM> poolie: I spoke to jam about it
[08:16] <poolie> that would be great
[08:16] <vila> GaryvdM: feel free to ping
[08:16] <GaryvdM> poolie: for bug 153787
[08:17] <GaryvdM> poolie: I know that it won't help for command line annotate - So I hope that will be ok for them.
[08:18] <GaryvdM> But doing a incremental annotate in a gui is more suited to my skills than implementing a cache.
[08:18] <GaryvdM> vila: Thanks
[08:19] <poolie> doing an incremental annotate in a gui would be superb
[08:19] <poolie> iwbn if it could also feed out incremental data to emacs or loggerhead (over ajax)
[08:20] <GaryvdM> vila: how would it be possible to do that with emacs?
[08:20] <vila> yup. exactly what poolie said, try to keep it in mind even if you start with a qbzr version (but I'm sure you thought about it)
[08:21] <vila> GaryvdM: emacs can communicate with an asynchronous  subprocess
[08:21] <vila> GaryvdM: so in theory it can update the display when the subprocess returns more precise annotations
[08:22] <vila> GaryvdM: but as jam told you, you need first to revert the whole way the annotations are processed today starting with 'I have no idea where its coming from' to 'this line comes from this revision' via 'this line comes from a revision older than this one'
[08:23] <GaryvdM> vila: re emacs: using something like curses?
[08:23] <vila> GaryvdM: additional bonus if you managed to somehow restrict that to a window of lines currently displayed
[08:24] <GaryvdM> vila: I can't see that that would make it faster.
[08:24] <vila> well, emacs works from a tty to X11 displays and OSX graphic lib and Windows graphic lib, you shouldn't care about what it uses, just give him (line number, revision)
[08:25] <vila> or (line start, line end, revision) tuples
[08:26] <GaryvdM> vila: Is there a defined protocol for this?
[08:26] <vila> GaryvdM: none that I know of
[08:27] <vila> another additional bonus would be an option to limit the age of annotations as in: "Don't tell me about revisions older than 6 months"
[08:28] <GaryvdM> vila: so we would need to write something that runs in emacs that parses this data, and displays it?
[08:28] <GaryvdM> vila: re date limit: that would be easy. :-)
[08:29] <vila> GaryvdM: yes, some emacs code should be written
[08:29] <GaryvdM> ok
[08:29] <vila> GaryvdM: this may even be a f.. good idea to be your buddy on the emacs side...
[08:30] <vila> nothing beats parallel clients to debug a common implementation...
[08:30] <GaryvdM> A curses version would also be nice. I also have been dreaming of a curses version of qlog :-)
[08:30] <vila> clog then :)
[08:39] <vila> ... of course I didn't realized that clog is a valid English word...
[08:42] <guilhembi> GaryvdM: hello! Thanks for your reply on
[08:42] <guilhembi> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/588698
[08:43] <GaryvdM> Hi guilhembi!
[08:43] <guilhembi> GaryvdM: do I interpret correctly that you mean "all is normal"?
[08:45] <GaryvdM> guilhembi: It's unfortunate that that merge conflicts. I did user tests for other examples of that situation, and the conflicts when using --weave were minimal.
[08:47] <guilhembi> GaryvdM: to be sure: you mean the high number of conflicts is normal? You can say "yes" (I will then study this more in depth).
[08:48] <GaryvdM> guilhembi: The conflicts happen because storage/innobase was added by 2 different people, not because of the shape of the rev graph.
[08:49] <guilhembi> GaryvdM: so they are normal?
[08:49] <guilhembi> i.e. expected, not a bug?
[08:49] <GaryvdM> Yes
[08:49] <guilhembi> GaryvdM: thanks. I'll look into the history to see how this mess happened.
[09:13] <GaryvdM> guilhembi: I did a bzr log storage/innobase for both the jp and mm branches
[09:13] <GaryvdM> jp: http://paste.ubuntu.com/534208/
[09:13] <GaryvdM> mm http://paste.ubuntu.com/534209/
[09:16] <GaryvdM> If you take a look - you will see that they have different histories.
[09:27] <hrw> hi
[09:28] <jelmer> hey hrw
[09:28] <hrw> I have a problem. as "git bzr push" does not want to work and I have no time to dig in code to find out why I need to import ~10 patches into bzr (exported by "git format-patch"). how to make it without having to go by "patch <0001;bzr add -r .;bzr commit"?
[09:29] <jelmer> hrw: do you know what about "git bzr push" doesn't work, it isn't an easy patch?
[09:29] <jelmer> hrw: Alternatively you could try bzr-git's pull
[09:31] <hrw> jelmer: http://pastebin.com/YVmSr4Cu
[09:31] <hrw> bzr-git sounds worth to check
[09:33] <Tak> whoa, there's a git bzr now?
[09:34] <hrw> Tak: few plugins exists - none of them works perfectly
[09:34] <hrw> Tak: I use git-bzr-ng one and it is fine for "git bzr clone" but "git bzr push" fails.
[09:34] <hrw> Tak: ah.. and in natty even clone does not work but thats a matter of waiting for new bzr-fastimport package release (r282/284 fixed two bugs)
[09:36] <hrw> jelmer: thx for bzr-git hint
[09:36] <Tak> does bzr-git support push/dpush now?
[09:37] <hrw> now only need to wait till LP will scan new branch and can request review
[09:37]  * Ng cries at another -ng project ;)
[09:37] <hrw> Tak: I only needed import
[09:37] <Tak> no, that was a question for my own curiosity :-)
[09:37] <Ng> however, I was just thinking about popping over to #bzr with a suggestion, so the highlight is a welcome reminder :)
[09:37] <hrw> Tak: I use git for managing trees and bzr only to push to lp
[09:38] <hrw> Ng: ;D
[09:38]  * Ng wondered if it's possible to (globally) uniquely identify the ultimate root parent of any branch
[09:39] <Ng> I sometimes go to pull from launchpad and find that the branch has disappeared because someone renamed a team or something - would be cute if LP could respond with "404, but here's a list of branches you could switch to or merge from"
[09:39] <jelmer> Tak: it supports dpush, not yet dpush.
[09:39]  * Tak segfault
[09:40] <jelmer> Ng: Yeah, I agree that would be useful. Just a simple test search would help a lot I think. Keeping the history of names around explicitly would probably be harder.
[09:40] <jelmer> Tak: argh, you caught me pre-coffee
[09:40] <jelmer> Tak: it supports dpush, not yet push
[09:41] <Ng> jelmer: is it worth me filing a wishlist bug?
[09:41] <jelmer> Ng: please do
[09:41] <Tak> ok - I would mainly want dpush anyway ;-)
[09:42] <Tak> I'd offer you a coffee, but our machine is broken (again)
[09:42] <Ng> jelmer: k, thanks :)
[09:46] <jelmer> Tak: :-) Thanks anyway
[09:47] <Tak> we do, however, have a wide selection of teas
[10:14] <ssandberg> hi #bzr! is there a way to set per-file commit messages on the command line? perhaps there is a plugin?
[10:15] <jelmer> hi ssandberg
[10:16] <jelmer> ssandberg: There isn't one at the moment as far as I know.
[10:21] <ssandberg> jelmer, ok. any idea how easy/hard it would be to write one? i suppose it would need one new command, and also it would need to modify the commit command so that it uses the global and per-file messages
[10:23] <jelmer> ssandberg: do you want to do this the proper way or just a quick hack?
[10:24] <jelmer> ssandberg: doing it properly would mean moving the current per-file commit backend code from bzr-gtk into bzrlib.
[10:24] <jelmer> ssandberg: and then adding a UI for it (either in a plugin or in bzr core)
[10:24] <ssandberg> jelmer, right. i see there is a https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/185224 for this
[10:27] <jelmer> it'd be very useful to have that in core (also so e.g. qbzr can easily use it)
[10:30] <ssandberg> jelmer, i agree, would be great to have this bug fixed
[10:30] <ssandberg> jelmer, i can't spend too much time on this myself though... i have a perl script that copies per-file comments from one place to another, which is sufficient for what i need except i have to go through the gui when i commit
[10:31] <ssandberg> jelmer, so if it's not too much work i could create a hack that modifies the commit command to take the per-file messages into account. sorry i can't help more...
[10:31] <jelmer> ssandberg: you could probably do a quick hack based on the existing code in bzr-gtk
[10:33] <ssandberg> jelmer, ok. i'll look at that
[10:33] <ssandberg> jelmer, thank you!
[12:07] <speakman> hi folks
[12:08] <speakman> can I check out just the source files from a bzr repo, without the .bzr dir?
[12:08] <speakman> I just want a "snapshot" of the source tree for e.g. specified date
[12:09] <jpds> speakman: bzr checkout --lightweight ... ?
[12:11] <speakman> Will it ignore commit history and such?
[12:12] <jelmer> speakman: bzr export
[12:13] <speakman> jelmer: thanks!
[14:55] <lvh> Hi!
[14:55] <lvh> Is this the right place to ask about bzr-hg?
[14:56] <lvh> I accidentally made the mistake of assuming hg's svn interop was good. I now have a directory Twisted-hgsvninteropdisaster.
[14:56] <lvh> The last three revisions are changes I'd like to get out. How do I do that?
[14:56] <lvh> (I could just use hg and get a diff of the last three and then apply that, of course.)
[15:00] <james_w> lvh, if you have bzr-hg installed you may be able to "bzr diff" in there
[15:00] <james_w> I'm not sure quite what you want to achieve though
[15:02] <lvh> james_w: Okay, so the fourth last revision applied a patch (in hg): I also have a bzr repo at that point.
[15:02] <lvh> james_w: Then I committed some changesets in hg.
[15:02] <lvh> I'd like to take those changesets and apply them to the bzr branch instead.
[15:02] <james_w> ah, I assumed you were targeting svn
[15:03] <james_w> "bzr pull" might work for you
[15:03] <james_w> "bzr pull ../Twisted-hgsvninteropdisaster" in your bzr bracnh
[15:07] <lvh> Nah, they're different: the bzr branch has the original development, in the hg branch I just applied a patch
[15:08] <lvh> I'll go with bzr diff
[16:23] <vila> jam: about readability, note that the comment was saying: """Return true if any of the trans_ids, will have contents.""" which is highly ambiguous when all we want to know is: do we need to refuse to unversion/delete this directory
[16:24] <jam> vila: I didn't think it was ambiguous at all. If any have contents, then it returns true
[16:24] <jam> the comma shouldn't be there
[16:25] <vila> jam: *I* find it ambiguous: which content ? Versioned ? Not versioned ?
[16:26] <vila> jam: what's the difference between _removed_contents and _removed_ids ? Can a key be present in the latter but not in the former ?
[16:26] <jam> I won't say the internals of TT aren't confusing at times. But the function _any_contents does what it says
[16:27] <vila> hehe, but that doesn't answer my question when I was reading it: what's content ?
[16:28] <vila> s/doesn't/didn't/
[16:29] <vila> Oh, and the special casing was for final_kind() (Added a comment to the review)
[16:32] <vila> jam: weird, you voted 'needs information' then 'approve' and your reviewer status on the mp page is still needs information...
[16:33] <jam> vila: email landed into launchpad after I went to the webpage to see if I had an out-of-date diff
[16:33] <jam> so probably the "first" vote was handled second and took priority
[16:34] <vila> but is still displayed first... weird, n obig deal anyway, just mentioning
[16:34] <vila> jam: thanks for the review !
[16:54] <glyph> so we're talkin' about bzr bugs in #twisted again
[16:54] <glyph> last time I came in here I had a problem with an svn branch whose history started before the first revision of trunk which included bzr-svn metadata
[16:54] <glyph> that looked like it came from an alternate history
[16:55] <glyph> (because the bzr-svn metadata in question was v3, and I was using a version of bzr-svn that used v4, so trunk and the branch disagreed as to how revisions were identified)
[16:55] <glyph> I am pretty sure this is a known / existing bug, but I can't find it
[16:55] <glyph> can someone toss me a link?
[16:58] <jelmer> glyph: bug 332116?
[21:43] <glyph> hey, do you guys still support hardy?  because if so, https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/677655
[21:50] <spiv> glyph: we do
[21:54] <jam> hey spiv, feeling better?
[22:08] <glyph> spiv: all my hardy machines with bzr-svn installed are now unusable for all bzr operations, so that one would be a good one to fix :)
[22:08] <glyph> I guess it must have snuck in in the last update?
[22:09] <spiv> jam: almost!
[22:09] <jam> glyph: sounds like you got an updated bzr-svn but not an updated subvertpy
[22:10] <glyph> jam: all I did was 'apt-get upgrade'
[22:10] <glyph> jam: you can see my policy settings on the bug, I'll adjust them if something's wrong
[22:16] <jelmer> glyph, jam: That looks like a broken subvertpy package.
[22:17] <jelmer> newer bzr-svn versions should generally work with older versions of subvertpy


[10:28] <jibel> does anyone know if anything changed recently in bionic that could explain this error https://people.canonical.com/~paride/priv/utahfail1.png ?
[10:28] <jibel> udpkg not found
[10:28] <jibel> cyphermox, ^ do you know?
[13:03] <cyphermox> oh my
[13:03] <cyphermox> no, not really. udpkg is pretty important ;)
[13:03] <cyphermox> I can go look into the d-i images


[00:00] <drab> dunno what your hw is, but thought I'd mention because after finally being able to install in EFI I thought I had it
[00:00] <drab> and I was soooo wrong...
[00:00] <drab> :)
[00:00] <drab> yeah, sucked to be me that week
[00:00] <drab> on the up side I learned quite a bit through the process
[00:00] <drab> so I don't really mind, just need to take a step back for perspective, in the moment it quite sucked I admit
[00:04] <sarnold> plus no nvme booting :/ on a machine that could probably stand to use some help booting more quickly :)
[00:04] <drab> nah, I think I got that covered, I put in a pci-e adapter and slapped a m2-ssd in it :P
[00:05] <drab> that's one of the many nice things I found out about in that week
[00:05] <sarnold> that worked but the nvme didn't? o_O how's that different?
[00:05] <drab> there's actually some surprisingly cheap things you can do with pci-e expansion slots and m2
[00:06] <drab> yeah, the pci-e adapter still has a sata cable going to the sata port on the mobo
[00:06] <drab> so the disk is still presented to the bios as a sas device
[00:06] <sarnold> really? is that just for booting? or .. now.. now I'm confused again
[00:06] <drab> for booting and OS, I got a dual card, one side is a m2sata, the other is nvme
[00:07] <drab> so the sata is for OS/booting, the nvme for app
[00:07] <drab> all in one pci-e
[00:07] <sarnold> ohho
[00:07] <sarnold> that's clever
[00:07] <drab> and the nvme is accessed through pci-e bus, which in the X9 feeds right into the CPU, it's pretty neat
[00:07] <drab> while the m2 goes through standard sata bus, but it's plenty for Os/boot
[00:08] <drab> it's both a headache and fun to find creative way to make the little donation money work
[00:09] <drab> but you can build a 32cores, 128GB of ram with nvme for ~$700 on a good day
[00:09] <drab> and beats in reliability, power comsumption and maintenance all the donated desktops they were using
[00:10] <drab> (moving some off to containers on that srv as I type... finishing cups instance up)
[00:12] <sarnold> zounds nice work
[00:13] <drab> I'd rather be doing woodwork all the time :P
[00:13] <sarnold> you resisted the temptation to just keep looking at slightly newer and slightly newer gear..
[00:13] <drab> but they need this more than they need work, so whatever, I'm here to help after all
[00:13] <drab> sarnold: well there just isn't the money... :P
[00:13] <sarnold> drab: oh that helps
[00:14] <drab> at this point I figured that 2 generations old is the sweet spot... you get new features and relatively upgradable tech while costs have dropped substantially
[00:14] <sarnold> I started out skimming ebay and deepdiscountservers and kept going for better efficiency and quieter and so on..
[00:14] <drab> in the case of SM for example the X10 and X11 have of course many improvements, but to this business case it really doesn't make a difference
[00:15] <drab> and we have a remote basement :P
[00:15] <drab> wouldn't want this in a homelab for sure
[00:15] <drab> yeah, I've done that too, then I look at the budget I was given and hit the back button :)
[00:16] <sarnold> :)
[00:16] <drab> it's very time consuming to build custom like this tho, I'd never do it for a business
[00:16] <drab> you can save quite a bit and get quite a lot out of each $$, but it's a huge time sink, you'd spend more in wages at that point
[00:18] <sarnold> I was happy to pay thinkmate to build and test it for me; I don't have any parts tha I could use for troubleshooting, and that class of hardware was entirely new to me. I didn't want to wind up with a few thousand dollars worth of parts that didn't want to play well together
[00:18] <drab> yeah totally, I was on the edge for the whole week because no matter how much I gogoled I just couldn't be sure
[00:18] <drab> but there's also 30 days return
[00:19] <sarnold> well done with the neato sata + pci mixed thing. crazy.
[00:20] <drab> the worst part was to get the power cable over since the chassis aren't really designed for that...
[00:20] <drab> it's a SAS case with a backplane, no SATA business even tho it has sata connectors on the mobo
[00:21] <sarnold> heh that was half of why I liked thinkmate there -- even though it's got a sas expander they were prepared to sell it with sata drives plugged in. :)
[00:55] <rose_> can someone tell me why downloading from an internet ip like using http is faster than using http from a local pc on the lan. the download speed from the internet is 3megabytes/s while local pc source is 30kb/s!! can someone tell me what's up? I'm downloading to a laptop pentium 3 with gigabit card from a iis web server on windows 7 that has also gigabit card
[01:03] <cncr04s> something is wrong then
[01:04] <cncr04s> you would need to diagnose the issue
[01:04] <cncr04s> its either the nic, cable, the server/config
[01:05] <rose_> I can test with samba if I knew how
[01:05] <rose_> cncr04s: do you know about iis
[01:08] <cncr04s> I used it once a long time ago, I'm an apache person
[01:11] <rose_> I know my nic is fine cause it can download a 3MB from the internet must be the iis
[01:11] <rose_> I'll use another pc good idea
[01:15] <rose_> a third laptop with windows 10 on wireless n downloads at 5mb/s is not iis
[01:25] <rose_> i'm using links2 to download the file could that be why? where to change download speed? I checked couldn't find
[01:27] <sarnold> I guess that's a possibility; try wget or curl, those should hit almost-wire speeds no trouble
[01:27] <sarnold> even on a p3
[01:27] <sarnold> maybe not full gig,but hopefullysomething better than 30kbps :)
[01:28] <sarnold> the next debugging steps might be to use tshark or wireshark or tcpdump to see what's actually being sent
[01:31] <rose_> sarnold: yea  I forgot about curl or wget! gez
[01:31] <rose_> sarnold: btw what mime type do I set for pk3 files
[01:32] <rose_> application/x-pk3?
[01:33] <sarnold> rose_: sorry, no idea; what application would you use to read those?
[01:33] <rose_> urban terror
[01:36] <rose_> sarnold: I tried wget I have no curl and the speed is 50kb/s slow too
[01:36] <sarnold> hrm, not much docs around the web about the mime type to set. I think I'd use application/octet-stream unless you can find something specific..
[01:37] <rose_> sarnold: why? is not iis why downloading from other lan pc is slow I can donwload faster from internet
[01:37] <rose_> sarnold: ok
[01:38] <sarnold> rose_: you'll just have to figure out what's wrong one step at a time; you can try replacing components one at a time or maybe tcpdump, wireshark, tshark, etc., to watch the transfers and try to spot protocol problems, or excessive arps, or whatever
[01:40] <rose_> sarnold: unfortunately I don't know how I'll have to post it on like a forum
[01:41] <rose_> I can record with tcpdump but then I wouldn't know where to start
[01:41] <sarnold> unless you're familiar with what normal looks like it could be hard to spot abnormal..
[01:46] <rose_> sarnold: do u know how to connect to my windows shares?
[01:46] <rose_> I type smbclient IP <IP_ADDRESS> and it shows help info
[01:47] <sarnold> it's something like smbclient \\\\servername\\sharename
[01:47] <sarnold> if you need to use an IP because the servername isn't automatically resolved then I think -I will let you specify the IP
[01:54] <rose_> I did that I'll try again
[01:59] <rose_> sarnold: it doesn't work
[01:59] <rose_> sarnold: I get the screen with all the swtiches
[01:59] <rose_> I'm typing smbclient -I <IP_ADDRESS>
[02:00] <rose_> I tried -p 445 too
[02:00] <sarnold> I think the server name may be mandatory
[02:00] <sarnold> either smbclient -I <IP_ADDRESS> -L \\\\servername    or smbclient -I <IP_ADDRESS> \\\\servername\\sharename
[02:01] <rose_> sarnold: however -L and hostname shows my shares
[02:01] <rose_> yea I'll keep digging
[02:07] <rose_> sarnold: ok I'm in
[02:08] <rose_> sarnold: I typed get file.mp4 and it gave me an error
[02:08] <rose_> it kinda hanged for like 30sec
[02:08] <sarnold> what error?
[02:08] <rose_> sarnold: I can download files from that share from other pcs
[02:08] <rose_> I'll know in a second
[02:10] <rose_> it says paralle read returned nt_status_io_timeout
[02:20] <rose_> sarnold: I got the same problem than a guy on superuser forum
[02:20] <rose_> nt timeouts and slow file sharing
[02:21] <sarnold> rose_: maybe that means there's something in the windows event viewer
[02:41] <rose_> sarnold: not much
[02:58] <rose_> sarnold: just some errors not related to file sharing
[02:58] <rose_> sarnold: asI can share with like my laptop and phone
[02:58] <sarnold> rose_: dang :/ time for me to run; good luck
[02:59] <rose_> cool
[10:03] <lordievader> Good afternoon
[14:54] <hosas> hello. how do I setup my ubuntu 16.04 to use my school proxy? the normal gui just not working for me. thanks
[15:06] <gunix> hosas: i don't think this question is for ubuntu server, but i will help you anyway
[15:06] <gunix> hosas: you have 2 options of setting up your proxy. via GUI (write proxy or network in search box) and you will have a window to configure manual proxy. however, this will work for chromium/firefox but it might not always work for bash
[15:07] <gunix> hosas: for bash, you should run the following commands: "export http_proxy=http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8080/" and "export https_proxy=https://<IP_ADDRESS>:8080"
[15:07] <gunix> hosas: of course, replace <IP_ADDRESS> with your ip
[15:07] <hosas> gunix: thanks
[15:08] <gunix> hosas: adding the exports within the terminal will fix your proxy for stuff like apt and wget within the terminal, but not for stuff from the Desktop environment. you need to add them with the network interface in order to get proxy to work with chromium or whatever browse you use
[15:13] <hosas> gunix: the proxy has a username and password- how do I add that to the bash-option?
[15:14] <gunix> hosas: i forgot
[15:15] <gunix> hosas: there were multiple ways, but i found a proxy within my company that works without auth, so i use that
[15:16] <hosas> ok
[15:16] <hosas> it's school proxy I just need to use to activate an academic license of a software
[15:17] <gunix> hosas: export http_proxy='username:password@http://proxy_hostname:proxy_port'
[15:17] <gunix> try that
[15:17] <hosas> gunix:  wait in the network interface I can't see proxy option there
[15:17] <hosas> ok
[15:18] <hosas> thanks
[15:18] <gunix> hosas: from GUI you should find this: https://i.stack.imgur.com/YkO3x.png
[15:18] <hosas> oh that
[15:19] <gunix> hosas: if this works for you, please confirm so you can make me happy i helped someone
[15:19] <hosas> I didn't work with the terminal
[15:19] <hosas> but thanks
[15:20] <gunix> hosas: if your password has some special characters you might need to escape them
[15:20] <hosas> gunix: It doesn't have to work for to know you've helped. you've helped already by just replying me.
[15:21] <hosas> gunix: of course my password has special characters
[15:22] <gunix> hosas: i thought so ... that will give you some work :D try to do some "wget google.com" and you should receive the error from the proxy. if the credentials fail, try escaping the characters
[15:22] <hosas> ok
[15:22] <hosas> let me give it a try
[16:09] <hosas> the proxy didn't work, but thanks man. I think it's because of the special character:-D
[16:09] <gunix> ...
[16:10] <gunix> hosas: did you try to google it?
[16:10] <hosas> I did
[16:10] <gunix> hosas: and still nothing?
[16:10] <hosas> someone suggest character encoding
[16:10] <gunix> hosas: give me your password so i can try it locally
[16:10] <gunix> cool joke, right?
[16:11] <hosas> hahahahaha
[16:11] <hosas> maybe I drink too much
[16:12] <hosas> gunix: would try it when I'm more sober. thanks again.
[16:13] <gunix> hosas: too much wine in paris and you have been tasked to clean all the bottles?
[16:13] <hosas> :)
[16:13] <hosas> it's weekend man
[16:14] <gunix> hosas: i don't judge
[21:19] <shrouder> how does nm-applet do I.C.S. I want to copy over the settings for doing I.C.S. without the gui or x running.
[21:20] <shrouder> something for #ubuntu-router
[21:33] <Poster> If you're referring to Internet Connection Sharing, you can setup a very basic NAT system by enabling IP forwarding and applying one iptables rule
[21:34] <Poster> in /etc/sysctl.conf, set net.ipv4.ip_forward=1 (it may be commented out), you can activate it with "sudo sysctl -w net.ipv4.ip_forward=1" the last thing is to apply NAT on your external interface, assuming it's eth0, it would be "sudo iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE"
[21:34] <Poster> there are much better ways to set all of this up, but that should get you started


[10:09] <arraybolt3> Eickmeyer: Are you absolutely sure that there aren't any other DKMS modules in Ubuntu Studio 22.04.1? I just got another secure boot install failure with the same error message as before with the latest ISO.
[10:11] <arraybolt3> Eickmeyer The v4l2loopback-dkms package is still there in the latest 22.04.1 ISO.
[10:11] <arraybolt3> Eickmeyer: Secure Boot is failing to install in a VM as a result.
[14:05] <Eickmeyer> arraybolt3: Investigating with sil2100 later, but he's in a meeting. I just did a germinate on the seed and it's completely gone, so I'm stumped.
[17:39] <arraybolt3[m]> Eickmeyer: OK, so I made the patch and the documentation for it. Tell me what you think of this. (Again, this is just a fallback, hopefully it won't even be necessary.)
[17:40] <arraybolt3[m]> Ubuntu Studio 22.04 and 22.04.1 currently suffer from a bug that causes the installation process to fail on computers with Secure Boot enabled. (Long story short, we included a cool program that allowed you to use output from OBS Studio as a webcam for other programs, however this required a special... (full message at https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/libera.chat/dc2ec306bd0a09ea785ea2139dc1c9e17d049b1a)
[17:43] <Eickmeyer> We can probably upload that somewhere to launchpad.
[17:43] <Eickmeyer> (launchpad has git capabilities)
[22:46] <Eickmeyer[m]> arraybolt3: You probably got the email.


[02:59] <_stink_> career objective: to be Dalai Lama.
[03:06] <snap-l> Heh
[03:10] <snap-l> http://openmetalcast.com/2017/03/13/open-metalcast-episode-150-one-five-oh/
[03:26] <_stink_> \m/
[13:28] <cmaloney> morning
[13:31] <rick_h> party
[13:31] <jrwren> dance dance.
[13:37] <brousch__> yo
[13:37] <cmaloney> 6 1/2 years of OMC
[13:40] <widox> morning
[13:40] <jrwren> whoa, long time no chat?
[13:40] <widox> cmaloney: nice
[13:40] <widox> that's also about how many days I've been without power :(
[13:40] <rick_h> it's widox wheeee
[13:40] <rick_h> ouch
[13:41] <widox> we are lucky enough to be in that group of ~7k without power still
[13:41] <rick_h> double ouch
[13:41] <rick_h> "I've been meaning to give the fridge a good clean out..."
[13:41] <rick_h> keeping warm ok?
[13:42] <jrwren> yeah, does that old place of yours have a fireplace to keep you warm?
[13:42] <jrwren> i can't imagine it is insulated very well
[13:42] <widox> yeah, we have been at Heather's aunt & uncle's for a couple days now
[13:42] <widox> no fireplace, sadly
[13:42] <widox> and yeah, not a ton of insulation
[13:42] <widox> Heather stopped by this morning, said its 33* in there currently
[13:43] <jrwren> *gasp*
[13:43] <jrwren> i heard that if you leave a faucet on, dripping, not a lot, a drip every few seconds is enough, it will help prevent pipe freeze
[13:43] <widox> I've heard that as well. we actually did that yesterday. so fingers crossed
[13:44] <cmaloney> widox: Ugh.  To still be without power sucks.
[13:47] <widox> kinda messes things up...
[13:47] <cmaloney> I said "amazing beard Matt is still without power" to JoDee. She remarked that she doesn't want your amazing beard to freeze and hopes you get power back soon.
[13:49] <jrwren> amazing beards are meant to freeze and be a protective layer while in the elements.
[13:49] <widox> :D
[13:50] <widox> thanks. at least there isn't any snow today to slow DTE down any further
[13:50] <cmaloney> Yeah, no joke.
[18:19] <greg-g> cmaloney: 6.5 years of OMC? wow
[18:49] <rick_h> +1 that's awesome
[19:22] <cmaloney> greg-g: Yeah
[19:22] <cmaloney> Started in August 2010. Just hit Episode 150
[19:22] <cmaloney> (not counting the club metal / instrumetalcasts / interviews)
[19:25] <cmaloney> (thank you. :) )


[04:50] <pitti> Good morning
[08:11] <dkessel> good morning pitti
[15:22] <elopio_> om26er: the meeting you set up is at the same time as the landing meeting. Would be ok for you if I move it 30 minutes?
[15:22] <om26er> elopio_, sure
[15:23] <om26er> elopio_, done
[15:23] <elopio_> thanks.
[15:34]  * ianorlin thinks if there is a bug that says ddate in command not found is in util-linux and the newest util-linux doesn't have ddate I should file the bug against command not found right
[15:45] <dkessel> ianorlin: not sure... maybe the package would be "command-not-found-data". i believe command-not-found is data-fed
[15:56] <brendand> dkessel, ianorlin - the maintainer of command-not-found says it must be a problem with the dataset
[15:57] <brendand> ianorlin, command-not-found-data is right
[15:57] <brendand> ianorlin, it's often wrong in development releases
[16:04] <netlar> Hi all
[16:07] <slickymasterWork> !hi
[16:31] <elopio_> om26er: I'm on the hangout.
[16:32] <om26er> elopio_, coming
[19:49] <netlar> So how can I help


  Whee.
[01:24] <infinity> flocculant: Merged and deployed.
[01:24] <infinity> PS: This airport WiFi is atrocious.
[08:02] <flocculant> infinity: thanks :)
[14:44] <infinity> pitti: Is the autopkgtest world starting to catch up with whatever broke on the weekend?
[14:45] <infinity> pitti: The queues still look awful, but I assume you've been watching to see if they're going down? :P
[21:28] <doko> pitti: ^^^ did you accept this?
[21:28] <doko> asking because it's not yet in yakkety, autopkg test failing
[21:30] <pitti> doko: yes, I'm doing SRU review; but we usually block sru-release on having the fix in devel, not at accepting into -proposed?
[21:32] <doko> maybe better to get it into the release pocket first ... let's if it fails in xenial too
[21:33] <pitti> infinity: FYI, I reviewed gstreamer1.0, and left a comment in the bug


[14:38] <CIA-7> ubiquity: cjwatson * r5565 trunk/ (d-i/manifest debian/changelog):
[14:38] <CIA-7> ubiquity: Automatic update of included source packages: flash-kernel
[14:38] <CIA-7> ubiquity: 3.0~rc.4ubuntu7, partman-lvm 79ubuntu2.
[14:47] <CIA-7> ubiquity: cjwatson * r5566 trunk/tests/run-pep8: Exempt autogenerated ubiquity/keyboard_names.py from the PEP-8 test.
[14:51] <CIA-7> ubiquity: cjwatson * r5567 trunk/debian/changelog: releasing version 2.11.16
[15:40] <CIA-7> debian-installer: cjwatson * r1719 ubuntu/ (build/config/armel/armadaxp.cfg debian/changelog): Move armhf/armadaxp to 3.2.0-1605 kernels.
[15:42] <CIA-7> debian-installer: cjwatson * r1720 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 20101020ubuntu157


 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/2kG6UfXU/file_23249.jpg I am having huge graphical problems in the login screen. Any idea?
 After I installed two desktop environments (wanted to try xfce on my slow pc), baloo file indexer keeps crashing upon login... … Any idea why... … I understand that baloo indexes the files for krunner, so they are easily searchable... … But baloo is not able to scan my home directory somehow after that... … And there is a crash during every login.
[12:24] <BluesKaj> Howdy all
[12:32] <user|56888> how use open vpn
 @tyakrish, By the way, KDE is lighter than XFCE 😉
 @tuxifan, Yea... Thats why installed 5.17... … But baloo still crashing... … Currently have kept it disabled
 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/ugVXYanl/file_23260.jpg Y try to conect to wpa3 WiFi and not work
 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/ge2Sw7MA/file_23261.jpg If try to conect manual, not work
 Wpa3-sae
 @Carles, Translation?
 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/Mx00uM0P/file_23269.jpg
 (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc-attachments.kde.org/DcIQ4ICY/file_23270.jpg
[18:23] <tomreyn> Carles: You will probably need Kubuntu 19.10 /20.04 LTS to make use of WPA3 (-SAE).
[18:24] <tomreyn> related https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/NetworkManager/NetworkManager/issues/172
[18:30] <tomreyn> NetworkManager-1.16 introdcued WPA3-SAE support. i don't think there is a backport to 18.04 LTS.
[19:32] <user|69669> kann wer deutsch
 @user|69669, Ja... But it's better to speak english here
[20:32] <tomreyn> they lasted for 5 minutes with a 2 minute break


[01:40] <Rocket2DMn> ogra, are you available?
[01:47] <Rocket2DMn> nvm ogra , sorry to bother
[05:37] <bliZZardz> w.r.t bug #228003 , openoffice.org-java-common is not part of the OO install. This does not look like a packaging bug but more of a an upstream one. Can someone give some ideas or correct me if i am wrong.
[10:07] <mcas> hi
[10:08] <bliZZardz> hello
[10:48] <kgoetz> sigh. trying to build 5-a-day on etch is a pita. all sorts of ubuntu-only packages i need to try and rebuild
[14:30] <hefe_bia> Hi! I have a short question: On bug 223280 somebody set it to Committed for the Ubuntu package while it is only fixed in upstream CVS. Should I set it back to confirmed?
[14:32] <techno_freak> hefe_bia, fix has been committed in the upstream source
[14:33] <techno_freak> hefe_bia, hence it is the right status
[14:35] <hefe_bia> Ok, thanks. I think https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Status is a little misleading in this case.
[14:37] <hefe_bia> Maybe "For an Ubuntu package, the changes are pending and to be uploaded soon (it's what PENDINGUPLOAD was in Bugzilla)" should be amended with "or fixed upstream."
[14:39] <Hobbsee> techno_freak: or "fixed somewhere" ie "there is a fix"
[14:39] <Hobbsee> it doesn't necessarily have to be in the upstream source, afaik.
[14:39] <techno_freak> Hobbsee, ok :)
[14:40] <Hobbsee> oh, interesting, it's changed meanings slightly.
[14:41] <hefe_bia> So I guess anywhere where it will make it into the Ubuntu package someday?
[14:41] <techno_freak> hefe_bia, you can also comment it to the bug report
[14:43] <hefe_bia> techno_freak: It's already commented there.
[14:44] <hefe_bia> I was mislead by Bugs/Status - I thought "For an upstream project..." rule would only apply to the bug status regarding a "project", not the Ubuntu package.
[14:50] <Hobbsee> bug 150484
[16:20] <bliZZardz> w.r.t bug # 241018, there is no 'fix' as such.. what should the bug status be?
[16:28] <gnomefreak> bug 241018
[16:30] <bliZZardz> gnomefreak : (am tempted to ask this Q to u ) is GNOME's memory footprint larger than KDE?
[16:30] <gnomefreak> adding the upstream bug to the lp bug report is a good start so it can move to confirmed
[16:30] <gnomefreak> bliZZardz: offhand not sure
[16:30] <gnomefreak> but decide what upstream link you should use
[16:30] <gnomefreak> since they are different upstream bug numbers
[16:31] <bliZZardz> gnomefreak : even the upstream doesnt have a 'fix' - they just said the same
[16:31] <gnomefreak> bliZZardz: if they are still open it would suggest they are being worked on?
[16:32] <gnomefreak> theme integration is optional as i recall and if its needed to make it not crash there is a problem that needs to be fixed
[16:32] <bliZZardz> gnomefreak : they are CLOSED upstream. Am not sure what is the equivalent of 'CLOSED' in lp.
[16:32] <gnomefreak> bliZZardz: invalid
[16:33] <gnomefreak> fix released if ther eis a fix
[16:33] <gnomefreak> there isnt
[16:33] <bliZZardz> ok - then i will invalidate it
[16:34] <gnomefreak> i still think ther eis a bug there that needs to be looked at or others will crash it since theme integration isnt manditory but i dont do OO.o fixes
[16:34] <bliZZardz> and what to do if Windows bug is reported in LP :P ? (bug 240159)
[16:34] <bliZZardz> ok - i get your point. i shall mention the same in the comment.
[16:35] <bliZZardz> but that means that an equivalent bug in upstream also should be opened - isnt it?
[16:36] <gnomefreak> bliZZardz: i commented on it
[16:36] <gnomefreak> that bug needs an upstream bug attached if it happens on windows maybe its jus the locale being used
[16:37] <gnomefreak> bliZZardz: there maybe one already that they havent seen yet
[16:39] <bliZZardz> you mean an upstream bug which is already existing for the former bug?
[16:40] <gnomefreak> its very possible
[16:40] <gnomefreak> there should be upstream bugs on both bugs that i looked at
[16:40] <gnomefreak> but that is up to OO.o guys
[16:42] <bliZZardz> gnomefreak : but shouldnt WE link it to upstream
[16:47] <gnomefreak> bliZZardz: we should
[16:47] <gnomefreak> we do
[16:48] <gnomefreak> we sometimes file it upstream for the users atleast we as in mozilla-ubuntu devs do
[16:56] <macd> bug 222804 seems fairly important, and is indicated its fixed, however it is not
[17:16] <gnomefreak> it says confirmed from what i see
[17:18] <gnomefreak> it maybe fixed in intrepid just not hardy could be fora  few reasons
[17:18] <sectech> hello hello
[17:19] <gnomefreak> may not meet SRU and if so noone felt like filing a backport bug for it but make sure it doesnt meet SRU before filing backport bug
[17:19] <gnomefreak> hi sectech
[18:22] <macd> gnomefreak, yeah its fixed in intrepid, as sid has it already, just not in hardy, but it really seems like it should be a SRU for hardy
[18:24] <gnomefreak> than i would folloow the instructions on the wiki for SRU and get it done that way
[18:24]  * gnomefreak gone for the rest of today ive caught up on my work for this week
[18:25] <macd> gnomefreak, ty I was planning on that ;P
[18:49] <iustin> hi, anyone could help me with pointers on how to deal with a bug?
[18:51] <techno_freak> iustin, sure
[18:51] <iustin> thanks
[18:51] <techno_freak> iustin, never ask to ask, just ask your question :)
[18:52] <iustin> so I'm one of the Debian maintainers for the package ganeti, and in Ubuntu there's a (valid) bug (243828) about the version of the package in hardy
[18:52] <techno_freak> bug #243828
[18:53] <iustin> the version in debian is fixed for a while, but hardy has an old version without the fix
[18:53] <iustin> since I think hardy is released, can this be fixed in the hardy version? or is it too minor?
[18:53] <techno_freak> Iulian, if am not wrong, we can mark it as fix released. can you comment in that bug, as well confirm it?
[18:53] <techno_freak> err... iustin ^^
[18:54] <techno_freak> sorry Iulian
[18:54] <Iulian> No problem.
[18:55] <iustin> so, the bug editor allows me to choose either confirmed or fix released; should I do it in two steps? (first confirmed, and then fix released)
[18:55] <techno_freak> Iulian, on the above bug, do we mark it as sync request or something?
[18:55] <techno_freak> iustin, fix released and comment will do :)
[18:55] <iustin> ah, ok1
[18:55] <iustin> err, ok!
[18:56] <Iulian> I think the fix is in Intrepid, not in Hardy.
[18:56] <iustin> indeed
[18:56] <Iulian> iustin: Check the version from Intrepid.
[18:57] <iustin> the version in intrepid is fixed indeed
[18:57] <iustin> but the hardy one not
[18:57] <techno_freak> so it is fix released right?
[18:57] <Iulian> techno_freak: Yes
[18:57] <techno_freak> :)
[18:58] <iustin> ok, I marked it as such
[18:58] <iustin> thanks for the help!
[18:58] <techno_freak> welcome anytime :)
[19:10] <Rocket2DMn> OK, I need some help on this bug 245645 - should that be added to Wishlist rather than keeping it closed?
[19:43] <jonpackard> is there a better getting started guide than the HowToTriage page on the wiki?
[19:47] <Rocket2DMn> jonpackard, the guides are really spread out over a few pages
[19:48] <Rocket2DMn> there are separate pages for Status, Importance, Responses, and Assignment to name a few
[19:53] <jonpackard> thanks! I will keep looking around. I am looking for a good way to get involved.
[19:54] <Rocket2DMn> right on
[19:55] <jonpackard> I am testing Intrepid right now.. I seem to have my hands full reporting bugs =)
[19:57] <jonpackard> It has helped me to get my feet wet with bug reporting and I have seen some good responses to my bug reports. Launchpad is a very positive environment.
[20:00] <Rocket2DMn> well if you havent been to this page, its a good place to start - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam
[20:00] <Rocket2DMn> you would want to join DocuMENTORS
[20:00] <Rocket2DMn> wait wtf am i saing
[20:00] <Rocket2DMn> ignore that
[20:00] <Rocket2DMn> wrong channel, lol
[20:00] <Rocket2DMn> you want the Bugsquad team on LP
[20:02] <Rocket2DMn> jonpackard, once you get a little more experience handling bugs, you can apply for ubuntu-bugcontrol
[20:02] <Rocket2DMn> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-bugcontrol
[20:09] <savvas> I'm going to need some help on figuring out the culprits of debian control file fields
[20:09] <savvas> I made an sqlite database and imported all the ubuntu packages and ended with these fields:
[20:09] <savvas> http://www.pastebin.ca/raw/1063994
[20:10] <savvas> the x-original-maintainer
[20:10] <savvas> sorry, the x-original-maintainer should be xsbc-original-maintainer ?
[20:33] <jonpackard> Rocket2DMn: Thanks for the tips!