[00:22] <Unit193> jrgifford: You're alive!
[00:23] <jrgifford> Yup
[00:23] <jrgifford> Reports of my death are greatly exaggerated
[00:29] <Unit193> My Jello isn't done. :(
[00:30] <Unit193> It's kind of too late for coffee, but I'd make an exception.


[11:15] <AlexExtreme> woah
[11:16] <AlexExtreme> launchpad's design totally doesn't work in internet explorer ;)
[11:17] <Keybuk> which lp design?
[11:18] <AlexExtreme> i mean
[11:18] <AlexExtreme> the page layout
[11:18] <AlexExtreme> the CSS
[11:19] <AlexExtreme> on launchpad.net
[11:20] <Keybuk> really?  intersting
[11:20] <Keybuk> I would have thought they tested that
[11:20] <Keybuk> what's broken about it?
[11:21] <AlexExtreme> umm
[11:21] <AlexExtreme> in the menu at the top left
[11:21] <AlexExtreme> when you move your mouse over it, it drops down, but there's spaces between all the menu items
[11:22] <AlexExtreme> also some things appear misaligned
[11:22] <Keybuk> heh
[11:22] <AlexExtreme> should i file a launchpad bug report?
[11:22] <Keybuk> there's a new UI coming soon anyway
[11:22] <AlexExtreme> oh ok
[11:22] <AlexExtreme> maybe file an IE bug instead ;)
[11:23] <AlexExtreme> bbl
[02:10] <AlexExtreme> Keybuk: one comment about the graph on the ReplacementInitscripts wiki page - shouldn't the line from "logging daemon" come from started rather than stopped?
[02:12] <AlexExtreme> bbl again
[05:54] <mbiebl> AlexExtreme: what about syslog-ng, did you investigate it any further if it could replace logd?
[05:55] <AlexExtreme> nah, i haven't had the chance - school work's been getting in the way and of course it's more important
[05:55] <mbiebl> np
[05:56] <mbiebl> When you mentioned it, I gave it a quick try and defined a new source like unix-stream("/com/ubuntu/upstart/logd");
[05:56] <mbiebl> But that didn't work out.
[05:57] <mbiebl> syslog-ng seems to expect a real file there.
[05:57] <AlexExtreme> ok
[05:57] <AlexExtreme> i'll take a look later once i've done homework
[06:00] <Keybuk> mbiebl: you forget the \0 on the front
[06:00] <Keybuk> the socket is in the abstract namespace, so it's \0/com/ubuntu/upstart/logd
[06:04] <AlexExtreme> mbiebl: could you test that then? I mean if it works then great, we have a logd replacement ;)
[06:07] <yankees26> sorry (accidental cmd+q)
[06:08] <Keybuk> you'd need to cope with the additional bit of logd protocol
[06:08] <Keybuk> SOCKET PROTOCOL
[06:08] <Keybuk>        logd listens on a unix(7) stream  socket  in  the  abstract  namespace,
[06:08] <Keybuk>        bound to /com/ubuntu/upstart/logd.
[06:08] <Keybuk>        init(8) opens a new connection for each job that is to be logged, bind
[06:08] <Keybuk>        ing the socket to the standard input, output and error file descriptors
[06:08] <Keybuk>        for the job.
[06:08] <Keybuk>        Before  running the job, it sends the job name on the socket so that it
[06:08] <Keybuk>        can be logged along with the messages.  This is sent as a  size_t  that
[06:08] <Keybuk>        contains  the length of the name to read, followed by that many charac
[06:09] <Keybuk>        ter bytes.  The NULL terminator is not sent as part of the protocol, it
[06:09] <Keybuk>        is up to the receiver to add that if required.
[06:09] <Keybuk>        Further  information  about  the  job,  such as its description, can be
[06:09] <Keybuk>        obtained by opening an ordinary connection to the  init(8)  daemon  and
[06:09] <Keybuk>        querying it using the name received.
[06:09] <Keybuk> --
[06:09] <Keybuk> (yes, it has a man page, don't look shocked <g>)
[06:09] <AlexExtreme> saying "have a look at man <whatever>" would have been simpler ;)
[06:09] <yankees26> hehe
[06:10] <Keybuk> it's only in 0.3.0, which isn't packaged yet
[06:10] <AlexExtreme> good point
[06:10] <AlexExtreme> btw did you see my comment about the graph on the ReplacementInitscripts wiki page?
[06:11] <Keybuk> I did
[06:11] <Keybuk> you're right
[06:11] <Keybuk> there's lots of bugs in that actually
[06:11] <Keybuk> it was just a brain dump to at least write something :)
[06:11] <AlexExtreme> like that empty oval in the middle of nowhere :)
[06:12] <Keybuk> that's deliberate
[06:12] <Keybuk> it meant something
[06:12] <Keybuk> unfortunately I did the graph before upstart got the ability (in my mind) to track states
[06:12] <AlexExtreme> ah
[06:12] <AlexExtreme> ok
[06:12] <Keybuk> so I have no idea how I'd redraw it now, dotty isn't good at those
[06:12] <yankees26> sorry once again
[06:15] <AlexExtreme> last question: there are a lot of things pointing to "multiuser". that's an event, right? if so, how do you have events generated once several things have been done?
[06:16] <mbiebl> Keybuk: I tried with @, \0 and nothing on the front.
[06:16] <mbiebl> The error is always: Error binding socket; addr='AF_UNIX(0/com/ubuntu/upstart/logd)', error='No such file or directory (2)'
[06:16] <Keybuk> probably needs doing inside the code then
[06:16] <Keybuk> abstract namespace unix sockets are a bit ... interesting :p
[06:16] <Keybuk> plus Linux specific afaik
[06:17] <Keybuk> AlexExtreme: it was in that draft (which is old)
[06:17] <AlexExtreme> AF_UNIX(0/com/ubuntu/upstart/logd) << that looks wrong, it seems to ignore the \
[06:17] <Keybuk> in reality, it'll just be a flag and we'll make all the jobs parallel again
[06:17] <AlexExtreme> ok, cool
[06:17] <Keybuk> but I've not even written the spec for flags yet
[06:17] <Keybuk> or, in fact, states
[06:17] <Keybuk> I AM TEH SUCK
[06:17] <AlexExtreme> lol
[06:18] <Keybuk> http://upstart.ubuntu.com/wiki/EventStructure
[06:18] <Keybuk> http://upstart.ubuntu.com/wiki/GoalChangeEvent
[06:18] <Keybuk> ^ so far
[06:21] <AlexExtreme> makes sense
[06:21] <Keybuk> I will try and write more tomorrow
[06:21] <Keybuk> this week has not been good for me :-/  too much jet lag and conf exhaustion
[06:22] <wasabi__> #
[06:22] <wasabi__> #
[06:22] <wasabi__> The arguments are not appended to binaries the job executes directly, scripts must be used for that.
[06:22] <Keybuk> I really need to get the stuff wasabi_ and I discussed over very hot thai down
[06:22] <wasabi__> ^ Except for special "exec $1" syntax?
[06:22] <Keybuk> wasabi_: sssh :)  we decided not to tell anyone about that trick <g>
[06:22] <wasabi__> that thai was fucking hot. holy shit.
[06:22] <thom> heh. yeah
[06:23] <AlexExtreme> lol
[06:27] <AlexExtreme> btw, what could be done about having the ability to enable/disable services? i mean, currently, if a file is in event.d, it will be used
[06:28] <yankees26> you could have a simple conf file somewhere (or something like that)
[06:28] <yankees26> kinda like a blacklist file
[06:28] <AlexExtreme> mbiebl: try putting \\0 at the start to see if that makes syslog-ng actually realise that the \ is there
[06:28] <wasabi__> We did some talking about white/blacklist files, for profile stuff. Probably need to talk about that more.
[06:29] <wasabi__> ya know, single-user mode, etc.
[06:29] <AlexExtreme> yeah
[06:29] <mbiebl> AlexExtreme: doesn't help :-/
[06:29] <AlexExtreme> still exactly the same error?
[06:29] <mbiebl> yep
[06:30] <AlexExtreme> then i'll write in something hardcoded to be able to specify an upstart source
[06:30] <AlexExtreme> gimme a few mins
[06:32] <yankees26> or in the actual file in event.d you have something like disable on startup
[06:33] <mbiebl> yankees26: this wouldn't be good from a package maintainer pov.
[06:33] <AlexExtreme> yeah
[06:33] <mbiebl> Having to mangle files is fragile
[06:33] <AlexExtreme> basically, modifying the event file is not an option
[06:33] <Keybuk> AlexExtreme: you probably want that anyway, to get the job name
[06:33] <wasabi__> It is an option.
[06:33] <wasabi__> Three way merge. Etc.
[06:34] <wasabi__> dish time!
[06:34] <AlexExtreme> because if the package providing the job file is upgraded, it would be overwritten
[06:34] <yankees26> mbiebl: true
[06:34] <Keybuk> AlexExtreme: three way merge
[06:34] <AlexExtreme> hmm well, the problem there: frugalware for example doesn't have any sort of capability for merging files
[06:34] <Keybuk> ucs, etc.
[06:34] <AlexExtreme> or am i talking BS? :)
[06:35] <Keybuk> the thought was to ship a standard upstart tool that would merge config files
[06:36] <wasabi__> I suspect if we go down the "profile" path, we'll have to do this too.
[06:36] <wasabi__> And it'll take care of it.
[06:36] <AlexExtreme> so, in a package's upgrade scriptlet you could run an upstart-provided tool that would merge them?
[06:36] <Keybuk> right
[06:36] <Keybuk> packages could install to /usr/share/upstart/... or something, and just run "update-event.d"
[06:36] <wasabi__> [default] \n*=on\ndisableme=off
[06:36] <AlexExtreme> k, sound's good
[06:36] <wasabi__> [single-user] *=off\nsvc1=on
[06:37] <mbiebl> So, update-event.d would create a link to /etc/event.d/?
[06:37] <wasabi__> That being a fairly easy file to update, compared to job files.
[06:38] <Keybuk> mbiebl: maybe.  or copy it
[06:38] <Keybuk> I have a mild allergy to symlinks
[06:38] <AlexExtreme> why's that?
[06:39] <Keybuk> I try and edit them
[06:39] <Keybuk> and end up editing non-config-files
[06:39] <Keybuk> or you end up with the hideous apache style configuration, where the editable config file is in one directory, symlinked to another right alongside
[06:39] <Keybuk> or worse, the Debian udev style, where the config files are just one level up
[06:41] <mbiebl> Maybe doesn't look nice, but it has it's pros
[06:41] <Keybuk> such as?
[06:41] <mbiebl> E.g. if you want to disable a udev rule, you can remove the symlink
[06:42] <mbiebl> I guess in Ubuntu you have to move the *.rules files somewhere else.
[06:42] <Keybuk> rm /etc/udev/rules.d/...
[06:42] <Keybuk> same command ;)
[06:42] <mbiebl> And if you want it back?
[06:43] <Keybuk> get it out of the package again
[06:43] <mbiebl> Not that easy.
[06:43] <Keybuk> why not?
[06:44] <mbiebl> apt-get install --reinstall will not get the file back.
[06:44] <mbiebl> You'd have to download the deb and extract the file
[06:44] <Keybuk> dpkg --force-confmiss --install ...
[06:45] <yankees26> what about a custom .rules?
[06:45] <Keybuk> you could also just edit the file and comment bits out
[06:46] <AlexExtreme> bleh, i can't think right now. i'll look at syslog-ng some other time
[06:47] <yankees26> turkey clogging your brain?
[06:47] <mbiebl> Keybuk: Imho both approaches have pros and cons, it's basically a matter of taste ;-)
[06:47] <Keybuk> indeed
[06:47] <mbiebl> And we know that it is hard to argue about that ;-)
[06:47] <Keybuk> my favourite phrase during UDS was "it's my bikeshed!"
[06:48] <AlexExtreme> mbiebl: want to try metalog? that can handle sockets AFAIK
[06:48] <AlexExtreme> http://metalog.sourceforge.net
[06:48] <thom> Keybuk: GREEN!
[06:49] <AlexExtreme> the only problem with it is that it seems to be unmaintained - the last change was 22 months ago
[06:49] <Keybuk> the truth is that I haven't put more than minimal thought into the config file problem yet
[06:49] <Keybuk> we briefly discussed it at UDS
[06:49] <yankees26> ugh, you guys are making me wanna look through upstart code (and in other words, hurt my brain)
[06:50] <Keybuk> the upstart code is nice
[06:50] <mbiebl> AlexExtreme: never tried metalog
[06:50] <yankees26> it'd still hurt my brain Keybuk :P
[06:50] <AlexExtreme> yankees26: it's better than this syslog-ng code *shudder*
[06:50] <yankees26> i start doing header file searches for functions and thats when it gets painful :P
[06:51] <yankees26> AlexExtreme: never looked at syslog-ng code
[06:51] <yankees26> (nor do i plan to :P)
[06:51] <AlexExtreme> the indentation in it is absolutely disgusting, it's completely unreadable
[06:51] <yankees26> i care a lot about indentatio
[06:51] <yankees26> n
[06:51] <Keybuk> indentation is easy, one TAB per indent ;)
[06:51] <yankees26> i spent like 5 minutes reindenting one of my nirvana perl modules
[06:52] <AlexExtreme> Keybuk: exactly how i like it :)
[06:53] <yankees26> i have it set for 4 spaces but it acts like a normal tab (set softtabstop=4 ftw)
[06:54] <mbiebl> And spaces for alignment ;-)
[06:54] <yankees26> alignment of what (i've never really fiddled with .vimrc)
[06:54] <Keybuk> spaces for alignment is ... irritatingly hard to get right in an editor
[06:55] <yankees26> TO GOOGLE FOR ALIGNMENT! ('cause im dumb and confused ;P)
[06:55] <mbiebl> yankees26: e.g. function arguments, that span over multiple lines.
[06:56] <mbiebl> They should be indented by spaces
[06:56] <Keybuk> yeah, ideally you'd have
[06:56] <yankees26> ah like: int my_extremely_painful_function( int a, string  adfadsfasdfasdf,
[06:57] <Keybuk> ^I^Isome_function (arg1,
[06:57] <Keybuk> ^I^I               arg2);
[06:57] <Keybuk> whereas most editors (including emacs) will do:
[06:57] <yankees26> ah
[06:57] <Keybuk> ^I^Isome_function (arg1,
[06:57] <Keybuk> ^I^I^I     arg2);
[06:57] <yankees26> ya
[06:57] <yankees26> (my example was too long :P thanks for typing that ;P)
[06:58] <Keybuk> it's almost certainly possible to get emacs to do that with some lithp
[06:58] <Keybuk> but my lithp-fu is not strong
[07:00] <yankees26> im gonna find out how in vim
[07:00] <yankees26> (hopefully)
[07:01] <AlexExtreme> hmm. "At the time we started, it was common for a Linux distribution to boot in a mere two or three minutes." Frugalware starts in 40 seconds! </boasting-session>
[07:01] <AlexExtreme> sorry, i had to say that ;)
[07:01] <yankees26> arch takes me 26 :P
[07:01] <yankees26> ;)
[07:01] <yankees26> seconds that is :P
[07:01] <AlexExtreme> arch?!
[07:02] <yankees26> dont act like you dont know where pacman came from :P
[07:02] <Keybuk> edgy is around 35s
[07:02] <mbiebl> Depends on what services you start and how much sanity checking they do.
[07:03] <AlexExtreme> http://frugalware.org/~alex/bootchart-sysvinit.png - i was wrong, it's 30 seconds ;)
[07:03] <mbiebl> Tried initng some time ago and was able to reduce my boot time to 18 sec.
[07:03] <yankees26> i still win ;)
[07:03] <yankees26> ok i lose now
[07:03] <mbiebl> Still it took quite some time until gdm was up.
[07:04] <AlexExtreme> yeah, the reason for that is that because things start in parallel there's more disk access and cpu usage going on which makes it a little slower
[07:04] <mbiebl> But to be honest, bootup time is not so important for me.
[07:04] <AlexExtreme> i found that with Runit, i had the services starting in parallel yet gdm still took the same amount of time to start
[07:04] <mbiebl> Service supervision is much more important e.g.
[07:04] <yankees26> off the top of my head i start: syslog-ng, network, hal, dbus, portmap, fam, alsa, mpd, crond, and then gdm goes
[07:05] <yankees26> i should try that bootchard thing
[07:05] <AlexExtreme> mbiebl: yes, but faster boot time is always nicer ;)
[07:05] <Keybuk> AlexExtreme: on a processor like that, it should be faster than 30 :p
[07:06] <mbiebl> AlexExtreme: but suspend to disk is getting more and more reliable
[07:06] <yankees26> this is why i wanna try upstart when i do lfs
[07:06] <Keybuk> AlexExtreme: you've got a few dead spots
[07:06] <AlexExtreme> yeah i know
[07:06] <mbiebl> You can't beat s2disk ;-)
[07:06] <AlexExtreme> heh
[07:06] <wasabi__> When I think of "profiles" I think of :
[07:06] <wasabi__> http://upstart.ubuntu.com/wiki/Profiles
[07:07] <AlexExtreme> Keybuk: well, this machine is limited in speed because of the hard disk, really. it's about 3 years old. i need to upgrade to SATA II sometime
[07:08] <AlexExtreme> ah well
[07:08] <AlexExtreme> http://frugalware.org/~alex/bootchart-runit.png << runit got 2 seconds improvement
[07:08] <AlexExtreme> anyway, i've gotta go
[07:08] <AlexExtreme> dinner's ready :)
[07:09] <AlexExtreme> btw wasabi__, looks good. quite easy to understand for the average user in my opinion
[07:10] <yankees26> 'cause im unaware of most upstart syntax
[07:10] <yankees26> what are the *=y do?
[07:11] <mbiebl> I guess it means, all available jobs are "activated"
[07:11] <yankees26> ok
[07:13] <wasabi__> the "current profile" is something that is simply set once, and the bits on the job that track whether they are enabled or disabled are just set when switched to it.
[07:13] <wasabi__> so you can pass "default" on the kernel command line, and it just applies those rules to enabled/disable jobs
[07:14] <mbiebl> wasabi_: What about creating directories in /etc/even.t/profiles/(default|single|foo)
[07:14] <wasabi__> And the file is distributed basically exactly as shown. Two levels.
[07:14] <mbiebl> and linking the to be activated jobs in there.
[07:15] <wasabi__> no linking. =(
[07:15] <mbiebl> Why not?
[07:16] <mbiebl> Would be more fool-prof
[07:18] <mbiebl> If the one profiles get's corrupted: bad
[07:18] <mbiebl> If the editor makes a syntax error: bad
[07:19] <mbiebl> Besides, it's harder to manage from withing package maintainer scripts.
[07:19] <wasabi__> i'd hope no package maintainer script would ever touch it
[07:20] <wasabi__> I'm a bit tired of symlink farms.
[07:20] <wasabi__> Also they can't represent *
[07:21] <mbiebl> That's surely is true
[07:21] <wasabi__> We also had an idea of "flags"... some arbitrary strings you could pass to init on boot... to disable things. I'm not sure where we went with that. It was between bofs.
[07:22] <wasabi__> Keybuk: ?
[07:22] <Keybuk> "corridor bof"
[07:22] <Keybuk> I quite liked the flags idea
[07:23] <wasabi__> i seem to have forgotten it
[07:23] <Keybuk> just a bunch of "on" or "off" values, jobs could elect to only run if a flag was on or off
[07:24] <Keybuk> so you could have "if networking" in a network-device-added task
[07:24] <wasabi__> ahh.
[07:24] <Keybuk> if you turn the networking flag off, that doesn't happen
[07:25] <wasabi__> So, on a kernel line, you could have networking=off, and they wouldn't run.   But what would turn networking on in the common case?
[07:25] <wasabi__> or would you call the flag no-networking
[07:25] <Keybuk> something like that
[07:25] <wasabi__> "if not no-networking"
[07:25] <Keybuk> it got fused in my head with the jobs-can-be-states idea, and I need to write that down first
[07:26] <Keybuk> I did at least write all my notes down this time
[07:26] <Keybuk> I just have pages of them
[07:30] <mbiebl> wasabi_:  Should we add the idea with the profile directories + symlinks as alternative proposal to the wiki?
[07:30] <Keybuk> sure, it's a wiki, fill it :)
[07:30] <mbiebl> IIRC it's basically what gentoo uses today.
[07:31] <Keybuk> you need to register to be able to edit pages, as usual
[07:31] <mbiebl> Another one is borrowed from initng.
[07:31] <yankees26> ugh, bootchart's dependency of java annoys me :(
[07:31] <AlexExtreme> yankees26: well
[07:31] <AlexExtreme> the actual script doesn't need java
[07:31] <mbiebl> There, a single file represents a profile.
[07:31] <yankees26> i run a java free system
[07:31] <yankees26> and yes, that is how much i hate java
[07:31] <Keybuk> right, off for dinner, l8r
[07:31] <mbiebl> And you can include files
[07:31] <yankees26> have fun eating Keybuk
[07:31] <AlexExtreme> just download it and run the log it creates through the chart creatorr on bootchart's site
[07:31] <AlexExtreme> Keybuk: have fun
[07:32] <yankees26> AlexExtreme: so java is what takes the log and creates the chart
[07:32] <yankees26> so really i dont need java, hmmm....
[07:32] <AlexExtreme> yeah
[07:33] <AlexExtreme> just download the script from bootchart's site, stick it in /sbin, run the log through the generator on their site
[07:33] <yankees26> will do
[07:33] <mbiebl> AlexExtreme: I thought java was only needed to generate the graph from the log file.
[07:33] <yankees26> hence i can do it from the website
[07:33] <yankees26> not java :D
[07:33] <yankees26> and keep my java free system
[07:33] <AlexExtreme> mbiebl: i know, that's what i'm saying
[07:34] <mbiebl> AlexExtreme: I'm a bit slow atm ;-)
[07:34] <AlexExtreme> heh
[07:34] <AlexExtreme> woah
[07:34] <AlexExtreme> i just found a gawping security hole in cherokee (it's a webserver)
[07:35] <mbiebl> bbl
[07:35] <AlexExtreme> it's htpasswd validation is totally broken - i put in a username that isn't listed in the passwd file and no password, it let me in
[07:35] <AlexExtreme> cya mbiebl
[07:35] <yankees26> bye mbiebl
[07:36] <yankees26> AlexExtreme: do i only need a certain script from the src tarball?
[07:37] <yankees26> thats prebuilt?
[07:37] <AlexExtreme> wait, let me find it
[07:38] <yankees26> ok, thanks
[07:39] <AlexExtreme> get the source tarball
[07:39] <AlexExtreme> copy the bootchartd script from the script dir to /sbin and chmod 755 it
[07:39] <yankees26> ok
[07:40] <AlexExtreme> and copy the bootchartd.conf file from the script dir to /etc and chmod 644 it
[07:40] <yankees26> ok
[07:42] <yankees26> then at boot i set init to init=/sbin/bootchartd, right?
[07:42] <AlexExtreme> yep
[07:42] <yankees26> where is the log file afterwards?
[07:44] <AlexExtreme> /var/log
[07:44] <yankees26> bootchart.tgz?
[07:44] <AlexExtreme> yep
[07:45] <yankees26> 24 seconds :D
[07:47] <yankees26> http://fhatsoft.googlepages.com/bootchart.png
[07:47] <yankees26> have fun admiring :P
[07:48] <AlexExtreme> heh
[07:48] <AlexExtreme> brb
[07:49] <yankees26> ok
[07:51] <AlexExtreme> back
[07:52] <yankees26> welcome back
[07:52] <yankees26> one more seinfeld disc left before i've finished season 7 ;D
[07:56] <yankees26> brb: i'm gonna get some lunch
[08:13] <yankees26> brb


[10:17]  * tomtiger11 welcomes all
[10:19] <tomtiger11> charlie-tca: im back, muhahahahah!(Joke)
[10:19] <tomtiger11> abhinav-: welcome
[10:20] <abhinav-> tomtiger11: thanks :)
[10:20] <tomtiger11> abhinav-: no problem *)
[10:20] <tomtiger11> abhinav-: oops :)
[10:22] <tomtiger11> abhinav-: its quite quiet here
[10:22] <abhinav-> hm I guess many peoply would have gone for the desktop summit
[10:23] <tomtiger11> maybe, or there to busy triaging bugs, thats probaly not going to happen!
[10:25] <tomtiger11> how do i register an irc nick on launchpad?
[10:26] <tomtiger11> tiagolramos: welcome to ubuntu-bugs irc chat!
[10:28] <tomtiger11> dont worry, ive registered it!
[10:44] <tomtiger11> im breaking the ice, bye!
[12:54] <bdmurray> yofel: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=569729
[12:54] <ubot4> Debian bug 569729 in digikam "digikam: Geolocation Using Marble Not Available" [Normal,Fixed]
[12:57] <bdmurray> Could not find module FindMarbleWidget.cmake or a configuration file for package MarbleWidget.
[12:57] <bdmurray> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/75801087/buildlog_ubuntu-oneiric-amd64.digikam_2%3A1.9.0-1ubuntu2_BUILDING.txt.gz
[13:19] <yofel> bdmurray: thanks, the marble devs seem to have dropped that for 4.7 and digikam 2.0 uses libkgeomap instead, I'll see what can be done
[13:42] <^arky^> bdmurray, Do you why some many emacs packages (cbe, ieieo, etc) are broken in 10.04
[14:55] <bdmurray> mvo: what does apt-cdrom identify [] mean?
[14:55] <bdmurray> mvo: the stuff in the square brackets in particular
[14:55] <bdmurray> Aug  3 20:59:04 ubuntu apt-setup: [d33553c53c246d8f29a64e66fa3b5305-2]
[15:00] <mvo> bdmurray: its the "checksum" (identifier) of the cd
[15:02] <bdmurray> mvo: cool
[16:07] <jibel> mvo, re bdmurray's question is that a md5 or sha256 (looks like md5)
[16:08] <jibel> mvo, bdmurray for example in bug 820731
[16:08] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 820731 in casper (Ubuntu) "Oneiric Ocelot Xubuntu Desktop images fail to install (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/820731
[16:08] <jibel> it says Aug  4 08:53:29 ubuntu apt-setup: [d33553c53c246d8f29a64e66fa3b5305-2]
[16:09] <mvo> jibel: neither, its just a hash of the rootdirectory of the medium
[16:09] <mvo> its not useful for verifiying if the medium is ok unfortunately
[16:09] <jibel> :(
[16:10] <jibel> mvo, so the only way to identify the medium from syslog is the label ?
[16:13] <bdmurray> jibel: do you mean the deb cdrom line?
[16:14] <jibel> bdmurray, no rather Aug  4 08:16:16 ubuntu apt-setup: Found label 'Xubuntu 11.10 _Oneiric Ocelot_ - Alpha amd64 (20110803.2)'
[16:15] <bdmurray> jibel: well its basically the same
[16:15] <bdmurray> ubuntu apt-setup: deb cdrom:[Ubuntu 11.04 _Natty Narwhal_ - Release i386 (20110427.1)]/ natty main restricted
[16:15] <jibel> bdmurray, what do you think about the last lines of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/casper/+bug/820731/+attachment/2254286/+files/syslog , could that be a fatal error ?
[16:15] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 820731 in casper (Ubuntu) "Oneiric Ocelot Xubuntu Desktop images fail to install (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [High,Confirmed]
[16:16] <jibel> I fail to understand why same version of 11.10 systematically fails on charlie-tca's tests and doesn't for me.
[16:17] <bdmurray> that ValueError is common with bad hardware
[16:17] <bdmurray> but I am not seeing any SQUASHFS errors
[16:19] <bdmurray> Aug  4 14:28:46 ubuntu kernel: [ 2404.402069] SysRq : SAK
[16:19] <bdmurray> Aug  4 14:28:46 ubuntu kernel: [ 2404.402127] SAK: killed process 1508 (Xorg): task_session(p)==tty->session
[16:19] <bdmurray> that's rather suspicious
[16:19] <bdmurray> jibel: ^
[16:44] <brendand> roadmr - does this shell command make sense for finding the interface?
[16:44] <brendand> nmcli dev list | grep -B 1 wireless | grep GENERAL.DEVICE | awk '{print $2}'
[16:45] <brendand> roadmr - out of curiosity, what did you use?
[16:48] <jibel> charlie-tca, ^ what bdmurray said. looks like bug 788435
[16:48] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 788435 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "ubiquity crashed with RuntimeError in __init__(): could not create GdkCursor object - SysRq : SAK pressed (affects: 1) (heat: 12)" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/788435
[16:48] <jibel> but at a different stage of the installation.
[16:52] <charlie-tca> and that is going to be low importance?
[16:52] <charlie-tca> I hit no keys, simply wait for the install to hang, on both arches
[16:53] <jibel> charlie-tca, I'm not talking about importance but trying to understand what is happening.
[16:54] <charlie-tca> oh, sorry
[16:55] <charlie-tca> I think my brain died last night
[16:55] <jibel> the OR didn't reply so we don't know if he did something or the system killed the console.
[16:56] <charlie-tca> I see
[16:56] <bdmurray> there are plenty of bugs with SysRq: SAK in them
[16:56] <charlie-tca> I have to kill it here, since it just spins for as long as I let it
[16:58] <charlie-tca> I thought it might be hardware failure, until I reproduced on both systems at the same time
[17:01] <charlie-tca> Well, unless there is something else I can run, I am going cut my grass
[19:43] <charlie-tca> it worked
[20:47] <andersk> Can someone set bug 815190 to importance Medium and bug 820147 to Low?
[20:47] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 815190 in gnupg2 (Debian) (and 1 other project) "gpg2: pkglue.c:41: mpi_from_sexp: Assertion `data' failed. (affects: 1) (heat: 410)" [Unknown,Unknown] https://launchpad.net/bugs/815190
[20:47] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 820147 in mutter (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Transparency broken in non-maximized windows (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/820147
[21:35] <bdmurray> hggdh: bug 820582
[21:35] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 820582 in apport (Ubuntu) "debian-installer package hook should include installer log files (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/820582
[21:35] <hggdh> bdmurray: looking
[21:36]  * hggdh bows foe the man
[21:36] <yofel> bdmurray: thanks! :)
[21:36] <hggdh> bdmurray: thank you!
[21:37] <bdmurray> no problem
[22:57] <ashams> Can someone please set Importance to this bug: http://pad.lv/275971
[23:01] <paultag> ashams: sorry, that's an ubuntu-community and ubuntu-website bug
[23:01] <paultag> ashams: I'm subscribed to it as well
[23:01] <paultag> ashams: let it run, it's generating lots of talk.
[23:01] <ashams> paultag: yeah but we just wanted to move on :)
[23:01] <paultag> ashams: yuppers :)
[23:01] <ashams> paultag: thanks
[23:02] <paultag> ashams: cheers, good luck, I'll be watching :)
[23:02] <ashams> paultag: thanks
[23:18] <trinikrono> hello bugsquad was there a hugday today?


[04:52] <yax51> Hello
[04:53] <yax51> I am having some issues with DVD playback on 12.04 and the forums are down :(
[04:53] <yax51> basically it's poor quality and its shaky. I know there is a fix but can't find it with the forums down
[04:55] <yax51> I am using movie player because VLC is being special...but one issue at a time :P
[05:13] <krytarik> yax51: Do you maybe mean this?: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:OkzelkGBqn4J:ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php%3Ft%3D1658587
[05:16] <yax51> That was it!!
[05:17] <yax51> Thanks!
[05:19] <krytarik> Cool. :)
[05:26] <GigaWarez> how is everyone?
[05:29] <GigaWarez> just curious to ask what was the best way to share files between two ubuntu boxes on the same network?
[05:34] <yax51> wouldn't you just go to places>network?
[05:35] <GigaWarez> in nautilus?
[05:37] <yax51> are you using gnome?
[05:38] <GigaWarez> yes
[05:38] <GigaWarez> gnome 3
[05:38] <yax51> ok, next to the applications it should say places...
[05:40] <GigaWarez> im sorry, im still not understanding...
[05:40] <yax51> hmmm
[05:43] <yax51> http://s1280.photobucket.com/user/yax51/media/Screenshotfrom2013-07-24223920_zps102ab1ce.png.html
[05:46] <yax51> http://www.datamation.com/open-source/file-sharing-options-for-ubuntu-pcs-2.html
[05:47] <yax51> or this might be what you are looking for
[05:47] <GigaWarez> which version of gnome was the first picture?
[05:48] <yax51> 2 I think
[05:48] <GigaWarez> this is what im looking at
[05:48] <GigaWarez> http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/547/9hw1.png/
[05:49] <yax51> aaah ok I see the confusion now :P
[05:49] <yax51> http://quickmediasolutions.com/apps/14/nitroshare
[05:49] <GigaWarez> for the most part what im trying to do is merge the second computers home folder to this one
[05:49] <GigaWarez> lol
[05:49] <yax51> try this.....
[05:53] <GigaWarez> alright thanks, ill try that right quick!
[05:53] <yax51> cool I'm instaling it now too :)
[05:53] <GigaWarez> ha alright
[05:54] <GigaWarez> future reference, is the network locations in nautilus only for windows home groups?
[05:56] <GigaWarez> ttererer
[05:58] <GigaWarez_> whoops
[05:58] <yax51> sweet!! just installed it on my windows box and ubuntu box and it works like a charm :)
[05:59] <yax51> but now I need to go to bed
[05:59] <GigaWarez_> hah gotta love when things work the first time
[05:59] <GigaWarez_> thanks for your help
[05:59] <yax51> I hope that was what you were looking for, there are other options in that first link I sent too
[06:00] <yax51> good night!!
[06:02] <krytarik> GigaWarez_: You should look at NFS.
[06:02] <krytarik> !nfs
[06:04] <GigaWarez_>  this^
[06:04] <GigaWarez_> exactly what i was looking for
[06:04] <GigaWarez_> thank you
[06:04] <krytarik> Welcome. :)
[23:54] <Vantrax> anyone here good with scripts?


[16:00] <dviererbe> o/
[16:00] <adrien> o//
[16:00] <ginggs> o/
[16:00] <ogayot> o/
[16:00] <slyon> \o
[16:00] <mkukri> o/
[16:00] <zhsj> o/
[16:01] <liushuyu> o/
[16:01] <bdrung> \o
[16:01] <enr0n> o/
[16:01] <pushkarnk> o/
[16:01] <cpete> o/
[16:01] <juliank> o/
[16:02] <juliank> Firefox is really annoying when I try to find my GOogle Meet url
[16:02] <juliank> #startmeeting
[16:02] <meetingology> Meeting started at 16:02:30 UTC.  The chair is juliank.  Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology
[16:02] <mateus-morais> o/
[16:02] <meetingology> Available commands: action, commands, idea, info, link, nick
[16:02] <juliank> I forgot the name
[16:02] <juliank> #topic Lightning rounds
[16:03] <juliank> (This is the foundations weekly meeting)
[16:03] <juliank> #link https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/foundations-team-updates-thursday-11-january-2024/
[16:06] <bdmurray> "Weird stuff"
[16:09] <slyon> danilogondolfo: see enr0n's status about the apparmor namespace issue. I guess that's what we see in Netplan, too?
[16:09] <schopin> why is netplan using unshare() ? oO
[16:10] <slyon> unshare? oO I didn't check the details yet, but we're seeing strange autopkgtest failures related to namespace restrictions, that cannot be reproduced in Debian
[16:11] <schopin> that'd be the syscall to create new namespaces :)
[16:12] <juliank> We ready to continue?
[16:12] <slyon> oh right. We're not creating any namespaces manually... But it was ringing a bell in my head when I saw that context :)
[16:12] <danilogondolfo> the issue we are seeing seems to not be related to that I guess. It's due to /usr/lib/netplan being deleted and not recreated due upgrade as far as I can see
[16:13] <juliank> #topic Release incoming bugs
[16:13] <juliank> #link http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-nn-incoming-bug-tasks.html#foundations-bugs
[16:13] <enr0n> slyon: do you have a link to an example?
[16:13] <juliank> bug 2048953
[16:13] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Bug 2048953 in grub2 (Ubuntu) "grub fails to add boot entries if python3-apt is missing" [Medium, Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2048953
[16:14] <juliank> mkukri already tagged it foundations-todo, but we also need to clean the rls-nn-incoming tag
[16:14] <mkukri> already tagged totdo
[16:14] <Skia> [5~[5~
[16:15] <slyon> enr0n: I don't think it's visible from the public logs. Danilo had to dig into a local VM to extract some logs. But it might be unrelated after all..
[16:15] <enr0n> ack
[16:15] <juliank> bug 1969394 is with desktop still I believe and not actionable
[16:15] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Bug 1969394 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "'Settings & Livepatch' button opens 'settings' tab, not livepatch" [Low, Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1969394
[16:16] <juliank> I'll bounce it to oo
[16:16] <juliank> bug 1838372
[16:16] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Bug 1838372 in apport (Ubuntu) "'ubuntu-bug -w' doesn't work under wayland" [Wishlist, Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1838372
[16:16] <juliank> I don't think that's even possible?
[16:17] <bdmurray> That's my memory
[16:17] <juliank> Wayland doesn't support things like that by design for security reasons
[16:17] <bdrung> juliank, is there no way to map a window to a program name?
[16:17] <juliank> You can't get a list of windows even I believe
[16:17] <enr0n> I thought we did an SRU for this a year or two ago
[16:18] <bdrung> The use case: A user knows the icon and window title, but not the program name
[16:18] <enr0n> This looks like a duplicate of bug 1952947
[16:18] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Bug 1952947 in apport (Ubuntu Jammy) "ubuntu-bug -w (using xprop) doesn't work under wayland" [Medium, Fix Released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1952947
[16:18] <juliank> Well
[16:19] <schopin> There's no DE-agnostic way, but maybe we can figure out an API for Gnome and KDE?
[16:19] <bdmurray> "The patch for this bug adds a message explaining that the -w,--window option cannot be used on Wayland, and suggests a method for finding the window's PID instead."
[16:19] <bdrung> Yes, but the problem is that user do not know the application name.
[16:20] <waveform> how does firefox manage it (as a Wayland application, and something that lists "what window do you want to share?")
[16:20] <schopin> FWIW xdg-portal has a way to list windows when trying to do screenshots/screencast.
[16:20] <waveform> ah
[16:20] <juliank> it might not be possible to get back to the pid from that
[16:20] <schopin> However reading the doc I didn't see a way to get from the handle to a PID or anything like that.
[16:21] <juliank> if you can get the .desktop that is enough though
[16:21] <juliank> But we can discuss this more and find out ways or someone on the bug tells us before comitting this to jira
[16:21] <juliank> bug 2048760
[16:21] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Bug 2048760 in python-cssselect (Ubuntu) "[MIR] python-cssselect" [Undecided, Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2048760
[16:21] <slyon> this is looking for a volunteer to do an MIR
[16:21] <schopin> not it
[16:21] <juliank> mkukri: ?
[16:22] <mkukri> sure
[16:22] <slyon> thanks!
[16:23] <juliank> bug 2048766
[16:23] -ubottu:#ubuntu-meeting- Bug 2048766 in dmraid (Ubuntu) "Please remove dmraid from the Ubuntu archive" [Undecided, New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2048766
[16:23] <slyon> We have a plan for this one already (see my last comment)
[16:23] <slyon> I'm not sure how we can track it, to not forget about it?
[16:26] <slyon> we might target it to a milestone, so it pops up with the release team before release
[16:26] <juliank> Target to feature freeze milestone
[16:26] <juliank> and removed the incoming tag
[16:26] <juliank> #link http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-mm-incoming-bug-tasks.html#foundations-bugs
[16:26] <juliank> is really nothing new there
[16:26] <juliank> just desktop stuff
[16:26] <juliank> #link http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-jj-incoming-bug-tasks.html#foundations-bugs
[16:27] <juliank> surprisingly empty too
[16:27] <juliank> #link http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-incoming-bug-tasks.html#foundations-bugs
[16:27] <juliank> is empty too
[16:27] <juliank> #topic Team proposed-migration report
[16:28] <juliank> #link https://ubuntu-archive-team.ubuntu.com/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#foundations-bugs
[16:28] <juliank> firefox is hanging
[16:30] <juliank> libtircp vs glibc is with danilogondolfo still I believe
[16:30] <juliank> python-werkzeug is with slyon still
[16:30] <danilogondolfo> juliank, this one is related to the problem schopin is investigating in glibc
[16:31] <juliank> debconf is still with enr0n
[16:31] <juliank> wpa vs netplan is with ogayot
[16:31] <schopin> danilogondolfo: sorry I forgot to do the migration-reference runs for other archs than amd64 -_-
[16:33] <juliank> libxcrypt vs ruby
[16:33] <juliank> libxcrypt vs ruby: adrien?
[16:33] <adrien> I'm innocent (ack)
[16:34] <juliank> netplan.io blocking network-manager: slyon
[16:35] <juliank> systemd-hwe: enr0n
[16:35] <juliank> debootstrap: bdrung
[16:35] <bdrung> ack
[16:36] <juliank> rsyslog: xypron
[16:37] <juliank> Sadly we are out of bold items and I assigned alphabetically so uh sorry
[16:37] <juliank> Next time we can start from the back!
[16:38] <juliank> python-werkzeug: pushkarnk
[16:38] <pushkarnk> ack
[16:39] <juliank> #topic AOB
[16:39] <bdmurray> Monday is a US holiday
[16:39] <enr0n> \o/
[16:41] <juliank> well I guess that's it
[16:41] <juliank> #endmeeting
[16:41] <meetingology> Meeting ended at 16:41:14 UTC.  Minutes at https://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2024/ubuntu-meeting.2024-01-11-16.02.moin.txt


[00:22] <Trevinho> RAOF: hey
[00:22] <Trevinho> RAOF: could you please review the unity7 xenial SRU that is in queue?
[00:22] <RAOF> Trevinho: Sure!
[00:22] <Trevinho> RAOF: related silo is https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1843
[00:22] <Trevinho> RAOF: thanks a lot
[00:23]  * RAOF dislikes reviewing SRU syncs. :(
[00:24] <Trevinho> Eh, i'm sorry about that... We should really have some scripts which produces debdiff for these
[00:24] <RAOF> Yeah, I could totally improve some of the scripts in ubuntu-archive-tools to do this.
[00:24] <RAOF> Not your fault!
[00:24] <Trevinho> RAOF: what would be the best way for helping SRU team in that? debdiffs attached to bugs, or what else?
[00:25] <Trevinho> eh, I know.. I've heard about some difficulties about that, but I'm not much into that work to understand what's missing :-)
[00:25] <RAOF> Trevinho: Make sru-review in lp:ubuntu-archive-tools handle syncs.
[00:25] <cjwatson> It's really an LP bug, but quite a hard one to fix.
[00:26] <cjwatson> (https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/851562, specifically)
[00:26] <RAOF> It would not be *that* hard to make sru-review DTRT; it'd just need to follow the sync link, then hope that the PPA has the regular stuff.
[00:27] <RAOF> Trevinho: Presumably you need bamf, compiz, and unity all done at once?
[00:27] <Trevinho> RAOF: yeah... I mean, there are no interdependencies... So you can actually land these in the order you want
[00:27] <RAOF> Trevinho: Cool.
[00:29] <Trevinho> RAOF: I see there's a from_ppa option in the review script, is that helpful?
[00:29] <RAOF> Actually just checking that out :)
[00:31] <RAOF> No dice, but --no-diff is helpful.
[00:31] <RAOF> Heh. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/913880 is clearly not fix-released in xenial :)
[00:34]  * RAOF wishes PPAs built their debdiff against -updates
[00:39] <Trevinho> ah, that's annoying...
[00:39] <Trevinho> using options -p ci-train-ppa-service/landing-085 didn't give me anything though, but maybe it's just something else
[00:39] <Trevinho> anyway... if there's any problem, let me know... time for bed now :-)
[00:42] <RAOF> Trevinho: Do any of your bugs have xenial tasks? :)
[00:45] <Trevinho> RAOF: no.... Cause I'm not an Ubuntu driver and I can't add these without confirmation it seems 😢
[00:46] <RAOF> Trevinho: You can nominate them, at least. But I'm happy to do so while processing, too. Just for future reference :)
[00:54] <RAOF> Wow. That unity upload is all that and a bag of potato chips.
[01:43] <RAOF> Trevinho: (For when you wake up) Is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1616031 actually fixed in the uploaded unity and/or Yakkety?
[01:49] <RAOF> Trevinho: Also, a *lot* of those bugs are pretty borderline SRUs.
[01:52] <RAOF> Trevinho: Accepted the bamf and compiz SRUs, as they're good and correct.
[01:54] <RAOF> Trevinho: Once you've checked that bug 1616031 is actually fixed in yakkety and the package, unity can (with some reservations) go through.
[05:09] <pitti> RAOF: urgh, seriously? that should take a few minutes, not a day..
[05:09] <RAOF> IPv6 snafu, it seems.
[05:14] <RAOF> Each package tried to resolve over IPv6 with a 1min timeout, failed, then tried again for the next package.
[05:14] <RAOF> pitti: Anyway, ping!
[05:15] <pitti> RAOF: aye!
[05:16] <pitti> RAOF: "yakkety" → "unstable" in changelog, s'il te plaît
[05:16] <RAOF> Ahem.
[05:20] <RAOF> pitti: Done.
[05:29] <pitti> RAOF: and built/uploaded
[05:46] <cpaelzer> good morning
[06:35] <RAOF> Oh, kfreebsd. Hush.
[06:36] <pitti> RAOF: heh, --fail-missing FTW: )
[06:37] <RAOF> touch debian/not-installed.linux; echo "/lib/udev/..." > debian/not-installed
[06:37] <pitti> RAOF: oh, is debian/not-installed a thing? I wasn't aware of that
[06:37] <RAOF> New in compat 9, I think?
[06:37] <pitti> RAOF: I usually use some -X*.rules fu (conditionalized)
[06:39] <RAOF> I think I'll go the not-installed route.
[06:42] <RAOF> Aaargh. Git! When I push I want to push the signed tags, damnit.
[07:16] <RAOF> pitti: I can't seem to push to colord git anymore, but the permissions on the repository seem fine? I was hoping to have another go at building on kfreebsd/hurd :/
[07:17] <pitti> RAOF: uh, what happened since this morning? you still pushed the changed debian/changelog release target?
[07:17] <RAOF> Yes! I don't know. I went to push 1.3.3-2 (that should build on kfreebsd/hurd, hopefully), and git is complaining about insufficient permissions on ./objects
[07:30] <pitti> RAOF: some chmod -R on git.debian.org?
[07:42] <RAOF> pitti: Everything seems to be 775, owned by mpitt:scm_collab-maint
[07:42] <pitti> RAOF: uh, did I set up the colord.git? I don't remember that at all
[07:44] <RAOF> pitti: Would you be able to pull from github.com:raof/colord.git ?
[07:44] <pitti> RAOF: sure
[07:45] <pitti> RAOF: there are a few files owned by raof-guest:raof-guest which should probably have group scm_collab-maint, but that shouldn't stop pushing for you..
[07:46] <pitti> RAOF: oh, I do see a few files which are 444
[07:47] <pitti> RAOF: perhaps do try a chgrp -R scm_collab-maint and chmod -R ug+w ?
[07:48] <pitti> I just did that, but I cannot change the raof-owned ones
[07:49] <RAOF> Nope
[07:49] <pitti> RAOF: hmm, then I guess moving the whole colord.git/ dir away and re-creating/pushing it? I'm out of ideas
[07:50] <RAOF> Oh, hello!
[07:51] <RAOF> There are 3 files in objects/; two owned by mpitt:mpitt one by biebl:biebl.
[07:52] <RAOF> Are you able to remove those final ones?
[07:52] <pitti> RAOF: done
[07:52] <pitti> RAOF: (pulled/building from github in the meantime)
[07:53] <RAOF> And collab-maint/colord.git is now updated.
[07:55] <pitti> RAOF: pulling works indeed, thanks
[08:00] <pitti> RAOF: -2 uplaoded
[08:01] <pitti> (which is better than uploading, obviously!)
[08:01] <RAOF> It's more ladder-like.
[08:21] <Trevinho> RAOF: so... We used to be pretty flexible in unty SRUs to keep the delta with trunk to the minimum
[08:21] <Trevinho> So... Yes, there are bigger changes, but still all fixes
[08:22] <Trevinho> RAOF: as for that bug, I thought I removed it from the changelog, didn't I?
[08:22] <Trevinho> Since it wasn't fixed here
[09:47] <Laney> what's this "Stale file handle" business that's going on with sbuild?
[09:47] <Laney> anyone else seen that?
[09:55] <pitti> Laney: oh, you got it too? xnox and me too
[09:56] <pitti> I tried to apt-get clean/-f etc. in src:sid, but didn't help, so I just rebuilt it from scratch (easier than wasting time)
[09:56] <Laney> pitti: first saw it yesterday and though it was some freak occurrence, but now I get it on other schroots too
[09:56] <pitti> I only got it in my sid schroot; either because it was sid, or becasue that was my only schroot that used an overlay (the others are tarballs)
[09:56] <xnox> Laney, pitti - you shall not use overlayfs and dpkg
[09:57] <xnox> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dpkg/+bug/1620525 our bug
[09:57] <pitti> it has worked for many years, but since all my others are tarballs I just use a tarball too now
[09:57] <xnox> debian bug is https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=836211
[09:57] <pitti> and live with the 2 s unpack time
[09:57] <xnox> pitti, use older kernel?
[09:58] <Laney> xnox: do you know what changed?
[09:58] <xnox> or newer....
[09:58] <Laney> this has always been the case on overlayfs hasn't it?
[09:58] <xnox> Laney, something rather fixed in overlayfs. Re-creating chroots with new enough apt pre-installed should work too, because then the subdir move is not needed.
[09:59] <Laney> I get it on loads of random stuff
[09:59] <Laney> Updating certificates in /etc/ssl/certs...
[09:59] <Laney> mv: cannot move '/tmp/ca-certificates.crt.tmp.OgRoXw' to 'ca-certificates.crt': Stale file handle
[09:59] <xnox> excellante.
[09:59] <xnox> i bet all the live images are busted too
[11:36] <tjaalton> looks like a xenial server of mine has had an unattended-upgrade in limbo since june
[11:37] <seb128> tjaalton, like a stucked job? any error?
[11:38] <tjaalton> yeah kernel install stuck
[11:38] <tjaalton> nothing in dpkg.log
[11:38] <seb128> urg
[11:39] <seb128> do you know where it's stucked?
[11:39] <tjaalton> grub-mount
[11:39] <seb128> I guess that's worth at least a bug report
[11:39] <tjaalton> then again this has zfs-on-root
[11:40] <seb128> oh...
[11:40] <tjaalton> eldon# LANG=C grub-mount /dev/sda1 /var/lib/os-prober/mount
[11:40] <tjaalton> error: unknown filesystem.
[11:40] <tjaalton> guess that's it
[11:41] <seb128> well, it should handle the case better
[11:41] <tjaalton> I'll file it against os-prober
[11:42] <seb128> thanks
[11:49] <tjaalton> hmm or grub2 actually
[12:43] <pitti> juliank: there is no way to get a .dsc or diff for the synced apt 1.2.14 in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/xenial/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=apt
[12:44] <juliank> pitti: Why?
[12:44] <juliank> I just ran syncpackage for it :/
[12:44] <pitti> juliank: this makes it extremely hard to review for SRU; normal uploads are a lot simpler
[12:44] <pitti> juliank: this might also explain why nobody reviewed it yet
[12:45] <Mirv> I seem to have many problems with "Finished" builds not really finishing like https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-1916/+build/10713715 (this is retry number two)
[12:45] <pitti> oh, I can get it from here: https://launchpad.net/debian/+source/apt/1.2.14
[12:45] <juliank> pitti: Yeah
[12:45] <Mirv> maybe it's a test failure in content-hub though showing off as unkilled thread
[12:45] <pitti> but this takes creativity (no click-through path), downloading two packages, running debdiff, etc.
[12:46] <brendand> this feels like a dumb question, but i want to be able to ssh to the autopkgtest host from the testbed, without being prompted for a password - what are my options?
[12:46] <pitti> brendand: scp your host's key to ~/.ssh/authorized_keys once?
[12:47] <juliank> pitti: Right. I can upload (the next release) 1.2.15 as a .dsc for the next upload. infinity sort of wanted that to be in a PPA and then synced from the PPA, but if it's easier to look at, I can just re-upload the .dsc from the PPA then.
[12:49] <pitti> juliank: got a diff now; I'm ok with accepting into -proposed, but for verifying (for -updates) I'd like to see an actual test plan such as testing a dist-upgrade with that apt, to see how it performs in big scenarios which the test suite doesn't cover
[12:49] <brendand> pitti, i still get prompted for the password... maybe something i need to change in the hosts ssh configuration?
[12:50] <pitti> brendand: no, this is determined by the guest, and this generally allows key-based auth (I do that often)
[12:50] <pitti> brendand: maybe you forgot to say ubuntu@ ?
[12:50] <pitti> brendand: the scp itself (for copying id_rsa.pub) will ask for the password of course, but after that it should work
[12:51] <brendand> pitti, no i definitely did do that
[12:52] <brendand> pitti, ah i think i know a way. i can set up the access in the base image
[12:52] <pitti> brendand: please run ssh with -vv to see what it doesn't like about your key
[12:52] <juliank> pitti: There were no changes at all to the installation code in 1.2.14 since 1.2.12(~ubuntu16.04.1) - don't you have some automated update testing tools in some QA thing somewhere?
[12:53] <pitti> brendand: if this is lxc, lxd, or qemu, you can also funnel it in through the side channels like lxc-attach or ttyS1
[12:53] <pitti> juliank: we have the autopkgtests, but AFAIK no automatic upgrade tests against -proposed
[12:53] <pitti> we used to have some, or still have -- if so, running those is fine of course
[12:56] <xnox> cjwatson, gimock fails to spawn things that are supposed to be executed in the subprocess as far as I can figure out. There is no stdin/stdout and the pipe that should unpickle things raised EOF. Who is the current maintainer of click/gimock?
[12:56] <xnox> it's probably something changed in gi and/or python.
[12:56] <cjwatson> xnox: already fixed in a silo awaiting QA approval
[12:56] <xnox> ah excellent!
[12:56] <cjwatson> https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1878
[12:57] <cjwatson> xnox: (but I think it's waiting until after OTA13 - that's still in adequate time for yakkety so I'm not worrying about it too much)
[12:57] <juliank> pitti: In the worst case, starting with a 16.04 image, install apt 1.2.14 and then upgrading to updates+proposed should be a good test
[12:57] <cjwatson> xnox: there were quite a few little details wrong, I had a "fun" bit of weekend work sorting it all out
[12:59] <juliank> 1.2.15 is going to be awful, I have queued 46 cherry-picked commits so far: https://github.com/Debian/apt/compare/1.2.14...julian-klode:1.2.y - one changes the cache format in order to fix a buffer overflow, and another one changes the main MarkRequired() algorithm to allow kernels to be autoremoved again in the presence of (zfs) virtual deps
[13:00] <xnox> cjwatson, /o\ ok. So i'll grab that ppa, and retest that things don't regress with new python-debian / gpg -> because those trigger click tests. If all is good, I'll ask Laney to skiptest click on those packages.
[13:01] <xnox> because gnupg2 transition is possibly stuck with click failure now.
[13:01] <xnox> or possibly partially release above silo into yakkety only?
[13:01] <juliank> Oddly enough, I did not reserve any space in the cache version, so both 1.3 and 1.2.15 have 10.6. That works now as they are the same format, but I should invent a better way to allow for independent changes in multiple branches of apt
[13:03] <pitti> xnox: oh, I just force-badtest'ed the current click version as I thought it got broken by some apparmor thing, not the new gnupg2?
[13:13] <xnox> pitti, no it's broken all by itself. the gnupg2 impact is unknown. It does use debsigs-verify thing, which uses gpgv, which should be fine.... but i want to test that.
[13:15] <kgunn> flexiondotorg: ping
[13:21] <cjwatson> xnox: I don't really want to think about doing a partial release, no idea how bileto would cope
[13:21] <cjwatson> (hopefully it would be fine, but I don't know)
[13:58] <Laney> xnox: are you winning?
[13:59] <xnox> Laney, i am working on making more win
[14:00] <Laney> k
[14:00] <xnox> trying to fix parcimonie on our infra, it passes locally...
[14:00] <Laney> well done for taking it on
[14:02] <Laney> xnox: can provide you with access to a machine if you want
[14:02] <xnox> nah it's all good. i create citrain thingy and it gives me access to our infra for adt
[14:02] <Laney> you can operate it interactively then
[14:02] <Laney> but ok
[14:04] <doko_> tvoss: any update on unity-scopes-api and thumbnailer?
[14:13] <Laney> xnox: reproduces for me with an adt-buildvm-ubuntu-cloud thingy btw
[14:15] <xnox> Laney, i use lxc locally.
[14:15] <Laney> well you also couldn't reproduce it
[14:16] <Laney> just saying :)
[14:16] <xnox> right. it's building in bileto, and should fix things there ( i did a blind patch ) in the mean time porting buildroot
[14:39] <Laney> ahh
[15:25] <Laney> xnox: add-apt-repository doesn't work out of the box due to dirmngr not getting installed
[15:25] <xnox> muahaaaaaa
[15:26]  * xnox ponders why it needs dirmngr all of the sudden....
[15:27]  * Laney knows nothing
[16:08] <doko_> Laney: please could you just attach the D file that triggers the issue? #1620681
[16:09] <Laney> if you want
[16:09] <doko_> ta
[16:19] <doko_> Laney: I want the command line too ;p
[16:20] <Laney> I doubt you can build those things alone
[17:00] <bdmurray> pitti: the ubuntu-release-upgrader package tests started failing recently and I wonder if its related to the server change - http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/ubuntu-release-upgrader
[17:03] <bdmurray> pitti: the same failure happens if changelogs.ubuntu.com is not accessible when running test_dist_upgrade_fetcher_core.py
[17:12] <Laney> doko_: got a reasonably minimal reproducer now
[19:07] <pitti> bdmurray: which server change? was changelogs.u.c. changed recently and the test needs updating?
[19:10] <bdmurray> pitti: I mean the autopkg test server
[19:13] <pitti> bdmurray: I'm not aware of any change there; IS changed the firewall the other day, but the proxy should still behave as it used to
[19:28] <bdmurray> pitti: is there anyway to test the firewall manually?
[19:29] <pitti> bdmurray: sure, I can run things in a scalingstack instance
[19:30] <pitti> bdmurray: indeed wget -O- http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/last_check.txt hangs now
[19:30] <pitti> it seems our proxy stopped allowing changelogs.u.c.
[19:32]  * pitti adds it to $no_proxy
[19:33] <bdmurray> pitti: thanks
[19:34] <bdmurray> pitti: also, the link back to the package here is broken http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/u/ubuntu-release-upgrader/trusty/amd64
[19:41] <pitti> bdmurray: I rolled out the proxy config update, so a retry ought to work now
[19:44] <pitti> bdmurray: link fixed, thanks for pointing out
[19:58] <nacc> smoser: thanks for the importer bugs and MRs, I'll try and get to them this week!
[19:59] <smoser> nacc, cool. thanks.
[20:25] <jbicha> sakrecoer: where did you get numix-blue from?
[20:29] <jbicha> numix-blue should really be a separate source package (I can't tell what version it claims to be or where it came from or who wrote it)
[20:49] <krytarik> jbicha: We are planning to get it in via Debian - but it was too late for this release.
[20:52] <jbicha> krytarik: ok, I understand UI freeze
[20:56] <Unit193> LocutusOfBorg: ...Feel like sponsoring something super simple to Debian?
[20:58] <flexiondotorg> kgunn, Hi
[20:59] <kgunn> flexiondotorg hey :)
[20:59] <flexiondotorg> I was busy at work today so not on IRC.
[20:59] <flexiondotorg> But, evening now :-)
[20:59] <flexiondotorg> kgunn, How you doing?
[20:59] <kgunn> good, you? i wanted to pick your brain, as mine got fuzzy, but I was wondering about those gpu drivers...
[21:00] <flexiondotorg> OK
[21:00] <kgunn> i couldn't recall were those closed source? or are those in some way realted to the freedesktop project here
[21:00] <kgunn> https://github.com/anholt/mesa/wiki/VC4
[21:01] <flexiondotorg> Those are the drivers.
[21:01] <LocutusOfBorg> Unit193, yes
[21:04] <LocutusOfBorg> but I guess you will have to send a mail :)
[21:05] <Unit193> LocutusOfBorg: Git or dch?
[21:07] <kgunn> flexiondotorg awesome, so do you know the story on those? e.g. is that a broadcom supported project?
[21:09] <flexiondotorg> kgunn, My understanding is Eric used to work for ARM (maybe Broadcom) but is now in the employee of the Raspberry Pi Foundation working specifically on those drivers.
[21:09] <kgunn> flexiondotorg ah, that's great...
[21:09] <kgunn> flexiondotorg and our guys recently enabled gallium as part of the archive build...
[21:09] <kgunn> so these should "just be there"
[21:10] <flexiondotorg> Yes.
[21:10] <flexiondotorg> They are in the 4.4 Ubuntu Kernel. At least a version of them.
[21:10] <flexiondotorg> And the corresponding mesa and xserver pieces.
[21:11] <flexiondotorg> In 16.04.
[21:11] <kgunn> flexiondotorg cool, better story than i thot
[21:11] <kgunn> time to get a pi3 i gues
[21:11] <flexiondotorg> But I'm using the Raspberry Pi Foundation kernel on those demos I showed you.
[21:12] <flexiondotorg> The Ubuntu kernel needs some more Pi 3 hardware enablement.
[21:12] <flexiondotorg> Last time I checked.
[21:13] <kgunn> flexiondotorg missing gpu firmware? or kernel modules for things?
[21:13] <flexiondotorg> https://github.com/gohai/vc4-buildbot
[21:14] <flexiondotorg> I think missing device tree for VC4.
[21:14] <LocutusOfBorg> Unit193, I prefer mentors
[21:14] <flexiondotorg> And firmware for wifi (I think).
[21:15] <Unit193> LocutusOfBorg: Oh dang, I was going to link you to https://sigma.unit193.net/source/inxi_2.3.1-1.dsc or ssh://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/inxi.git :3
[21:15] <Unit193> I can do that too.
[21:15] <flexiondotorg> kgunn, Eric was at Intel previously.
[21:15] <kgunn> thanks flexiondotorg
[21:15] <kgunn> will help a discussion i'm having tomorrow
[21:16] <flexiondotorg> Great. I'd love to see for Pi 2/3 is the Ubuntu raspi2 kernel.
[21:16] <flexiondotorg> There are several million of those devices out there now.
[21:16] <LocutusOfBorg> Unit193, .
[21:16] <flexiondotorg> So worth targeting.
[21:20] <Unit193> LocutusOfBorg: Oh wow, thanks.  Had just uploaded to mentors!
[21:22] <LocutusOfBorg> oops, sorry
[21:23] <Unit193> Nono, totally fine.  Thanks. :)
[21:23] <LocutusOfBorg> :)
[21:32] <doko_> jamespage: I filed rt#95411 for the porter box updates :-/
[23:37] <Unit193> nacc: Oh, never said because you were offline.  Congrats!
[23:37] <nacc> Unit193: thanks!
[23:37] <sarnold> oh!
[23:37] <sarnold> nacc: congratulations :)
[23:37] <nacc> sarnold: thanks!


[21:12] <jelo> hello. is mate-maximus removed from 22.04 ? "undecorate full screen windows" in mate-tweak ( i was need to copy binary from old system on one upgraded machine )
[21:13] <jelo> it was something in google that it was removed due to removed laptop-desktop ""
[21:15] <superkuh> It's part of the mate-netbook-common package.
[21:15] <superkuh> It's in the ubuntu 22.04 repositories.
[21:27] <jelo> but it wasnt removed? it just apt-get remove it during upgrade?
[21:28] <jelo> mate-netbook-common - MATE utilities for netbooks (common files)
[21:28] <jelo> ah, ok. it is.
[21:29] <superkuh> I don't know why it's containing package got changed/renamed.
[21:30] <jelo> undecorated fullscreen are fine, but these netbook desktop style was weird i remember (i remember it was automatic theme on 1024 resolution in 2018)
[21:30] <jelo> they probably removed this theme and maximus was moved somewhere else
[23:34] <donhw> Hi.I am trying to upgrade mate 22.04 to 22.10.  Using software updater it asked a few questions and disapeared. Restored /etc/apt/sources.list to jammy and tried again. Same result. Tried cli sudo do-release-upgrade. https://pastebin.com/RjZtFN6Z
[23:34] <donhw> Did I need to fix something else?


[03:55] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Softpedia:: Tails Linux OS Version 4.8 Released with Major Security Updates @ https://news.softpedia.com/news/tails-linux-os-version-4-8-released-with-major-security-updates-530413.shtml (by Bogdan Popa, Microsoft News Editor)
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[06:59] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Fridge:: Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter Issue 637 @ http://fridge.ubuntu.com/2020/06/29/ubuntu-weekly-newsletter-issue-637/ (by wildmanne39)
[16:16] -SwissBot:#ubuntu-news- ::Planet:: Oliver Grawert: Rebuilding the node-red snap in a device focused way with additional node-red module... @ https://ograblog.wordpress.com/2020/07/01/rebuilding-the-node-red-snap-in-a-device-focused-way-with-additional-node-red-modules/


[22:09] <Tumie> tyche: i need your help !
[22:09] <Tumie> i need to talk about 'some subject' in front of the class (don't know the word for it),, but i don't know a subject


[10:21] <davmor2> evand: Final cracked the mail issue in vista I'm now retrying m-a and will bug on what doesn't transfer after :)
[11:18] <CIA-50> debian-installer: cjwatson * r970 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 20080522ubuntu17
[11:50] <davmor2> evand: bug 279000
[14:02] <evand> thanks davmor2
[14:35] <superm1> xivulon, i build a live disk with that network manager patch, and there were no issues with wubi 509
[14:35] <superm1> xivulon, i put some more thought into doing a combined fe/be though - I dont believe you can preseed a bind mount can you?
[14:54] <xivulon> hi superm1, what do you mean by "preseeding a bind mount"?
[14:56] <xivulon> on my side I can preseed anything I want... It is up to partman(-auto-loop)/d-i/ubiquity to deal with what I preseed...
[14:56] <xivulon> Ah you mean preseeding the windows drive as a place to use for mythtv backend storage?
[14:57] <superm1> xivulon, yeah that's what i mean
[14:57] <xivulon> That will always be mounted as /host so I do not see any need to bindmount it, you just need to create and use directories therein
[14:58] <superm1> well the thing is that all of the myth* packages expect to find it in /var/lib/mythtv
[14:58] <xivulon> be aware that write speed to ntfs is worse though in 8.10 (10X worse) since there is no caching anymore
[14:58] <xivulon> write speed is ok for ntfs inside of ntfs
[14:58] <xivulon> since then ext3 cache is in place
[14:59] <superm1> so normally in our regular recipe we make a different partition for /var/lib/  and format that
[14:59] <superm1> but since /host is always mounted, we need to bind mount the two
[14:59] <superm1> oh well then lets not do this for 8.10
[14:59] <superm1> if  performance is a problem i dont want people accounting it to different things and being set away from this project
[15:01] <xivulon> yep I do expect performance in 8.10 to be worse then 8.04 when it comes to ntfs writes
[15:12] <xivulon> superm1 you might want to simply create a /host/mythtv folder and bindmount that, if you want to try things, I do not remember if ubiquity honours the early-command hooks though
[15:12] <davmor2> evand: would it help to have a full list of what works and doesn't across the range?
[15:13] <xivulon> otherwise you could simply place that in custom-installation/hooks/early-command.sh and use that for testing purposes
[15:13] <evand> davmor2: if you have the time, otherwise I can investigate that when I have more time to look into it
[15:14] <xivulon> evand, can you use early-command in ubiquity? or equivalent?
[15:14] <superm1> xivulon, well i think 9.04 will be a better focus to determine definitively and plan for this
[15:14] <superm1> xivulon, the frontend stuff will be good for now
[15:14] <xivulon> superm1 ok for me
[15:15] <xivulon> I assume there are no changes then on my side, you might want to test though with wubi 510
[15:15] <evand> xivulon: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopCDOptions
[15:16] <xivulon> well superm1 ^ that is handy if you want to play with the backend as well
[15:16] <xivulon> preseed/early_command=/path/to/script.sh
[15:17] <xivulon> For wubi preseed/early_command is set to execute custom-installation/hooks/early_command.sh (if there is one)
[15:17] <cjwatson> casper implements preseed/early_command, so yes you can use it
[15:18] <xivulon> hmm /isodevice is renamed into /host in autopartition-loop, which is run after casper, not sure how that will impact things
[15:19] <cjwatson> erm? autopartition-loop doesn't mention /isodevice
[15:20] <davmor2> evand: it's no probs I'm smoke testing anyway.  I think I have your email I'll did about a bit in MM and find out where the settings are and have a look through everything else :)
[15:21] <evand> ok
[15:21] <davmor2> s/did/dig
[15:21] <xivulon> cjwatson don't think it does an explicit move, it mounts moves target to host
[15:22] <xivulon> but target is originally called isodevice in casper
[15:23] <cjwatson> xivulon: leaving it as /target would be, er, not a very good idea ;-)
[15:24] <cjwatson> anyhow, it only moves it to /target temporarily so that it can use partman's mount.d scripts
[15:24] <xivulon> I agree was just mentioning that, since if superm1 is to use early-command, /host will not be around (or better will be around with a different name)
[15:25] <cjwatson> oh, right, I see
[15:25] <cjwatson> (and yes, it's true that autopartition-loop looks around in /proc/mounts for the mount point of the partition you're using for / and moves it)
[15:26] <cjwatson> well, maybe lupin-casper should just mount it on /host instead, providing that works
[15:27] <xivulon> have yet to provide the patch for dm-loop by the way, but have managed to waste the laptop keyboard for the second time in a year
[15:27] <xivulon> this time it was beer
[15:27] <cjwatson> xivulon: preseed/early_command is no use in superm1's case; he needs something that instructs partman to act differently, not something that instructs the live CD to act differently
[15:28] <xivulon> ah true
[15:28] <superm1> eg it would need to be a patch to one of the partman apps
[15:29] <cjwatson> partman-auto-loop, surely
[15:29] <superm1> so something more worthwhile to worry about the next few months rather than now
[15:29] <cjwatson> can't it be just another loop-mount file in the Windows drive?
[15:29] <xivulon> yes, but I think the main purpose for the backend is to be able to use a LOT of space
[15:29] <superm1> the files are going to be quite large, so i dont think most people want a ~200 gig loop mount file sitting in their windows drive
[15:30] <superm1> (or more)
[15:30] <xivulon> so the idea is to use /host raw
[15:30] <xivulon> that said with syncio patch, writes onto /host should be far worse than writes in a loopfile inside of /host...
[15:32] <xivulon> in fact superm1 if you wanted to just test things you could use success commands, copy the files from /var/lib/mythtv to /host/mythtv then add a line to /etc/fstab to bindmount that
[15:33] <superm1> xivulon, the expectation would be that it's ready immediately after partitioning
[15:33] <superm1> xivulon, because later steps do depend on it
[15:33] <superm1> oh but yeah i suppose that would work to just copy them in the success command
[15:34] <xivulon> well move in fact...
[15:34] <xivulon> not for deployment,  but should be ok for a quick test
[15:34] <superm1> nonetheless, i'd prefer to defer this for 9.04 for backend/frontend stuff when i've got a lot more time to dedicate to it
[15:34] <xivulon> I agree
[15:37] <cjwatson> xivulon: a target-config hook would be more appropriate than a success command
[15:37] <cjwatson> even that isn't perfect but at least it runs just after copying files
[16:02] <davmor2> evand: Should m-a work in alternate?
[16:03] <cjwatson> evand: should usb-creator be seeded somewhere?
[16:03] <xivulon> davmor2, did you check if m-a works in wubi?
[16:03] <davmor2> xivulon: no it doesn't :(
[16:04] <xivulon> could you install in verbose mode and provide the installation logs?
[16:04] <davmor2> xivulon: well nothing obvious is transferred across anyway
[16:04] <xivulon> no rush
[16:04] <davmor2> xivulon: can do
[16:27] <davmor2> xivulon: running now.  This is where I select verbose from the grub line before the install starts right?
[16:41] <evand> cjwatson: indeed, I'm thinking it should go on the live CD (if we have space), but I need to make sure it handles that situation well
[16:41] <evand> (not trying to install to the device that contains the live system)
[16:42] <evand> davmor2: I don't believe we ever turned it on in the alternate CD, but there should be nothing preventing it from working there if we were to (can't this cycle given the amount of time left)
[16:42] <cjwatson> desktop seems like one obvious place for it
[16:42] <davmor2> evand: np's
[16:43] <evand> ok
[16:49] <davmor2> evand, xivulon: www.davmor2.co.uk/install/casper.log www.davmor2.co.uk/install/partman www.davmor2.co.uk/install/syslog www.davmor2.co.uk/install/version www.davmor2.co.uk/install/initial-status.gz for the contents of var/log/installer/* on the verbose wubi install
[17:01] <xivulon> davmor2, I do not see anything obvious in the logs, I can see ma-apply being launched and os-probes finding windows on sda1... evand any hint?
[17:06] <evand> xivulon: not sure without looking into it myself.  I'd first check to see if anything showed up in ~ right after install, to see if it's just an issue of m-a not writing the correct data.
[17:07] <evand> But m-a is low priority for me at the moment.  There are more serious bugs in the installer that I need to resolve first before I can look at m-a bugs.
[17:08] <xivulon> sure
[17:32] <CarlFK> sudo update-grub; "Found kernel: /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.27-5-server, Updating /boot/grub/menu.lst ... done"; grep "5-server" /boot/grub/menu.lst = nothing
[17:33] <CarlFK> am I missing something, or did it not do what it should have done?
[17:35] <davmor2> evand: mail sent.  How do I check for anything showing up in ~ easily is it just a case of monitoring it on another screen?
[17:36] <evand> davmor2: once the install finishes, switch to a vt and look in /target/home/whatever
[17:36] <davmor2> no probs I'll try it now and let you know
[17:36] <evand> ok
[17:37] <evand> be sure to use -a in ls
[17:37] <davmor2> np's
[18:26] <davmor2> evand: nothing only examples shows up in /target/home/tester
[18:26] <davmor2> and about 4 . files
[18:27] <evand> what are the . files?
[18:29] <davmor2> bashrc profiles I think I'll see if I can enter in through rescue before it gets chance to fire any more up
[18:31] <davmor2> evand: .bash_logout .bashrc .profile and examples link
[18:32] <davmor2> I can re-run and see if there was anything else if you want
[18:32] <evand> ah, no, that should be sufficient
[18:40] <davmor2> evand: Anything else you need?
[18:40] <evand> nope, thanks though
[18:41] <davmor2> evand: What about info on Vista MM?
[18:43] <evand> In order to support Windows Mail I'll need to know where it stores the settings (registry keys, usually).  I can find that out when developing said support though.
[18:45] <davmor2> okay np's
[19:07] <kirkland> cjwatson: our HP contact sent me an email with the following... http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/54727/
[19:08] <kirkland> TheMuso: ^
[19:11] <cjwatson> the problem is more likely "Apt update failed" than the dmraid bit
[19:11] <cjwatson> in order to see why we'd need the whole log
[19:13] <cjwatson> but it may well be the cluster of problems around bugs 273979 and 276349
[20:54] <CIA-52> tasksel: cjwatson * r1378 ubuntu/ (4 files in 2 dirs):
[20:54] <CIA-52> tasksel: Update Ubuntu tasks from seeds, adjusting descriptions of samba-server,
[20:54] <CIA-52> tasksel: tomcat-server, and virt-host tasks.
[20:55] <CIA-52> tasksel: cjwatson * r1379 ubuntu/debian/changelog: releasing version 2.73ubuntu10
[21:10] <LogicBox> hey can anyone help with this i put the install disk in it comes up to boot menu letting me choose run, install, verify, etc.. and what happens is i click on install (have tried just running it from cd) and it shows the ubuntu logo and the status loading bar and then it just goes into a screen with text about Busybox v1.1.3 with some more txt then gives me what looks like a command line with...
[21:10] <LogicBox> ...a blinking cursor
[21:11] <evand> LogicBox: if you hit f6 at the boot menu, then hit the end key and remove 'quiet splash' from the end of that string and hit enter, it should show you a more detailed error.
[21:12] <LogicBox> ok like me try that
[21:14] <LogicBox> i didnt see anyting that said Quiet splash
[21:16] <LogicBox> what pops up afte rthe gui spalsh screen is this "BusyBox v1.1.3 (Debian 1:1.1.3-5Ubuntuv12) Built-in shell (ash) Enter 'help' for a list of built-in commands.  then it has (initramfs)_ on two lines below
[21:16] <LogicBox> the _ is a blinking cursor
[21:16] <cjwatson> boot CD, press Enter to dismiss language screen, press F6, then a "Boot Options" line appears with "quiet splash --" at the end
[21:16] <cjwatson> this is all before you actually boot Linux
[21:16] <LogicBox> ya
[21:16] <cjwatson> whereas the stuff you're describing is after the CD boot menu disappears
[21:17] <LogicBox> i was trying to install this on a dell dimension 2400
[21:17] <LogicBox> right after i say install
[21:17] <LogicBox> but i did restart and go into the boot menu and pressed f6
[21:17] <cjwatson> right, and what happened?
[21:17] <LogicBox> here i will write my options hold 1 sec
[21:18] <LogicBox> Other Options: acpi=off  noapic nolapic edd=on free software only
[21:18] <cjwatson> dismiss that (press escape)
[21:18] <cjwatson> there should be a "Boot Options" line
[21:18] <cjwatson> (it sounds like you pressed F6 twice by mistake)
[21:20] <LogicBox> nope f6 only once
[21:20] <LogicBox> right now its sitting at the Ubuntu menu, the Try ubuntu, install, check CD, Test mem, boot from hdd
[21:20] <cjwatson> never mind, just dismiss that menu and you should see a "Boot Options" line stretching all the way across the screen just above the menu bar at the bottom
[21:21] <LogicBox> i tried this on a newer dell and it worked just fine
[21:21] <LogicBox> tried the cd
[21:21] <LogicBox> ya i saw that line
[21:21] <cjwatson> ok, at the end of it is "quiet splash --"
[21:21] <LogicBox> es
[21:21] <LogicBox> yes
[21:21] <cjwatson> delete "quiet splash" from that line
[21:22] <cjwatson> (by the way, this is almost certainly a kernel bug not an installer bug, so all we're doing here is helping you gather information that you can pass onto the kernel guys later)
[21:22] <LogicBox> ahh
[21:23] <LogicBox> ok an error poped up that well it repeated itself saying end_request: I/O error, dev fd0, sector 0
[21:23] <cjwatson> you can skip that error
[21:23] <LogicBox> now its just sitting at that busybox msg again
[21:23] <cjwatson> were there no other messages?
[21:24] <LogicBox> not that i can see
[21:24] <cjwatson> type "cat /casper.log"
[21:24] <LogicBox> i see ha:cache flushes supported
[21:24] <cjwatson> without the quotes of course
[21:24] <LogicBox> hda: hda1
[21:24] <cjwatson> this will be easier if you have a digital camera
[21:24] <cjwatson> transcribing into IRC is hopeless
[21:26] <LogicBox> ok i typed that and took a pic
[21:26] <LogicBox> loading it into photoshop 1 sec
[21:27] <LogicBox> cj u want me to err i will uploaded it to my photo bucket
[21:28] <LogicBox> http://i485.photobucket.com/albums/rr213/SilverRavage/IMG_01791.jpg
[21:28] <LogicBox> sorry the iPhone takes a shitty pic
[21:29] <cjwatson> ok, now "dmesg"
[21:30] <LogicBox> ok a bunch of crap just scrolled through the screen really fast
[21:30] <cjwatson> you can use "dmesg | more" instead to get it displayed in pages; use space to display the next screen
[21:32] <LogicBox> are u ganna want a screen cap of all of them?
[21:35] <cjwatson> the kernel guys typically ask for dmesg output, yes
[21:35] <LogicBox> is there any way to pull it like maybe to a usb key
[21:35] <LogicBox> make it to a txt
[21:35] <cjwatson> remember that they have very little to go on to start with; they don't have your machine, and just telling them the model name actually helps a whole lot less than you'd think
[21:36] <cjwatson> how much Linux experience do you have? it's possible, but it will be tricky if you haven't used the command line much
[21:36] <cjwatson> the usual facilities aren't available at this level
[21:36] <LogicBox> meh not much, ive installed ubuntu b 4 and played around with it but thats about it.
[21:37] <cjwatson> it would involve inserting the USB key, figuring out the device name and mounting it on a scratch directory, say /mnt, then 'dmesg > /mnt/filename'
[21:38] <cjwatson> if the device doesn't become available immediately you'd have to poke udev a bit
[21:38] <LogicBox> ok i will try and see what i can do
[21:39] <cjwatson> other things you'll need will be "ls /sys/block" and "cat /proc/bus/pci/devices"
[21:39] <cjwatson> oh, and "uname -a" and "cat /proc/version_signature"
[21:40] <cjwatson> (see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeamBugPolicies)
[21:40] <cjwatson> /proc/bus/pci/devices replaces the lspci command there since lspci isn't available at this point
[21:41] <cjwatson> once you've collected that information, you should file a bug on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+filebug saying that your CD drive isn't being detected
[21:41] <cjwatson> also remember to quote the version of Ubuntu you're using ;-)
[21:44] <cjwatson> LogicBox: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingCasper may help you
[22:16] <ago_> evad, on 247461, is umenu shipped with the DVD a different version?
[22:18] <evand> ago_: umenu is the same on all CDs
[22:18] <evand> err
[22:19] <evand> yeah, it is.  Wubi just isn't on the DVDs.
[22:19] <ago_> what about umenu?
[22:20] <ago_> I remember fixing umenu not to show the wubi entry so that it could be used on DVD
[22:20] <evand> It's on all the images, DVDs included.
[22:22] <ago_> evand: one possible explanation for the bug above is that we bumped the  version number (checked by umenu) to .1 but that new umenu revision didn't make the DVD
[22:23] <TheMuso> kirkland: What were you pointing me to?
[22:23] <Fragadelic> hello
[22:23] <kirkland> TheMuso: dmraid not found error, possibly known apt error in the installer
[22:23] <kirkland> TheMuso: see that pastebin
[22:25] <Fragadelic> cjwatson - are you online now?
[22:31] <Fragadelic> anyone have any idea why the installer would hang at 94% trying to reconfigure popularity-contest on a remastered version of Ubuntu?
[22:35] <cjwatson> Fragadelic: run it with DEBCONF_DEBUG=developer on the kernel command line, post /var/log/syslog
[22:35] <cjwatson> (or /var/log/installer/syslog if that exists)
[22:36] <kirkland> cjwatson: i'm curious... would it make sense to just keep DEBCONF_DEBUG=developer through alpha/beta, and just switch it off before rc?
[22:37] <cjwatson> no, because it logs passwords
[22:38] <Fragadelic> I'll try that - killing the reconfigure lets it move on without issues.  Its only on a remaster - original is fine.
[22:38] <cjwatson> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=357118
[22:38] <cjwatson> kirkland: ^-
[22:38] <Fragadelic> its almost like the popularity-contest package is originally prepared in a certain way and after an initial install it starts with this behaviour
[22:39] <kirkland> cjwatson: gotcha
[22:40] <cjwatson> I'm not sure how much help debconf debugging will be, but at any rate I certainly need to see the log
[22:40] <cjwatson> Fragadelic: alternate installer or desktop installer?
[22:43] <Fragadelic> cjwatson: regular desktop installer - has been happening since I think 7.10 but 8.04 for sure and 8.04.1.  I had to have remastersys remove the popularity contest and ubuntu-standard packages so install would work normally but I'd prefer to leave it there.  I also tried many variations of removing and purging the package and installing it without configuring,etc - will have to change remastersys to
[22:43] <Fragadelic> leave popularity-contest in and test.  will take a bit to remaster and test but I'll be back.  you want it posted here or in the list?
[22:50] <cjwatson> Fragadelic: in a bug report on ubiquity, ideally
[22:51] <cjwatson> (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+filebug)
[22:51] <cjwatson> Fragadelic: though you could link to the bug here
[22:55] <Fragadelic> cjwatson: I'll do that but it doesn't really relate to an original ubuntu install - it only happens on remasters.  Thanks for your time.
[22:55] <cjwatson> Fragadelic: I understand, but I'm keen to fix this sort of thing if it does turn out to be a bug since it means fewer questions for us to answer
[22:57] <Fragadelic> cjwatson:  sounds good - up until now I've just been putting workarounds in remastersys to get around certain things in casper and ubiquity
[22:58] <cjwatson> it may turn out that we can't fix it, in which case I'll mark it invalid with advice
[22:59] <Fragadelic> is there a list of other debug options for the command line?  I know about break=bottom as I stumbled upon that accidentally but it would be nice to have any others so I could help folks with their backups even more.
[23:00] <Fragadelic> i tried checking the package info for the different versions but couldn't really find a lot of info about ubiquity and casper which is why I had to spend hours going through all the differnet scripts - lol
[23:04] <Fragadelic> if only I'd know I could contact you all like this without actually being part of the team a year ago it would have  made things much easier for me - I sent you an email eons ago but never got a response.  I'm assuming now that it might have been due to the fact that I use a yahoo email address for portability reasons.


[08:37] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[08:38] <knightwise> hey brobostigon
[08:38] <brobostigon> hi knightwise
[08:39] <knightwise> what are you up to this morning ?
[08:43] <brobostigon> voluntary job to go to 11am till 3pm.
[08:51] <knightwise> hmm on a sunday ? :(
[08:54] <brobostigon> yes.
[09:12] <knightwise> I'm cramming away on my chromebook a little.
[09:12] <knightwise> seeing how much fun you can have with a 200 euro machine
[09:15] <brobostigon> knightwise: :)
[09:19] <knightwise> and there is something delightfully wrong with running opera with its default Vpn client on a chromebook :)
[09:20] <brobostigon> lolz
[12:31] <ikonia> as I recall there are some keen gamers in here, I'm trying to hunt down a wireless arcade stick, like the old wildcard type device, even better, a double, anyone ever used/found one
[12:32] <ikonia> actually, wasn't called the wildcard
[12:32] <ikonia> thats the wrong name
[13:11] <popey> ikonia: to play with games in steam or other? (like emulators or whatever)?
[13:12] <popey> ikonia: http://www.jasenscustoms.com/ come recommended
[13:12] <popey> (not currently in stock)
[13:15] <ikonia> popey: thank you, non-steam games, emulation mostly
[13:16] <popey> I ended up buying a picade to do that kind of thing
[13:16] <popey> which comes with a reasonable joystick and 6 buttons
[13:16] <ikonia> so this is all being powered from my pi
[13:17] <ikonia> but my pi is hidden out of sight, and I want to play some classic arcade games with the full on arcade stick....but wireless
[13:17] <popey> ah
[13:17] <ikonia> looks just what I'm after actually, hard to get all the info on it as it's out of stock it seems most of the site is just empty about it
[13:18] <popey> i recently bought an 8bitdo SNES30 controller
[13:18] <popey> (not what you're looking for, I know)
[13:18] <ikonia> well, it is too
[13:18] <popey> They do a lot of different controllers
[13:18] <ikonia> I was trying to find proper wireless snes controllers
[13:18] <ikonia> ended up with logitech junk
[13:18] <popey> I found it near impossible to get it working with bluetooth on linux
[13:18] <ikonia> oooh I like a challenge :)
[13:18] <popey> so I ended up plugging the USB cable in, which makes it appear as a joystick
[13:19] <popey> mame "just works" with it in that mode
[13:19] <ikonia> yeah, usb would kill me, due to the location of the pi
[13:20] <popey> can't have a long usb cable?
[13:20] <popey> I mean, I know that's shit, but hey ho :)
[13:20] <ikonia> it would be quite an effort to run that, plug it, unplug it when done etc etc
[13:20] <ikonia> possible, but not first choice
[13:20] <popey> right
[13:22] <ikonia> 8bitdo look nice device, love the usa snes and jap famicon controllers
[13:22] <ikonia> they where always my favourite
[13:23] <ikonia> https://github.com/retropie/retropie-setup/wiki/Setting-up-an-8bitdo-Bluetooth-controller
[13:23] <ikonia> very well documented too
[13:23] <popey> yeah, and they do firmware updates and stuff
[13:23] <popey> ooh, not seen that page
[13:23] <popey> will give that a go
[13:24] <ikonia> looks like the key is matching the frequency to the firmware
[13:24] <ikonia> (without reading in depth)
[13:24] <popey> yeah
[13:25] <popey> if I got this working, I'd probably attach a pi to the TV in the lounge and use that for emulation stuff
[13:25] <ikonia> pretty much what I've just done
[13:26] <popey> hmm, very tempting
[13:26] <ikonia> be nice to have a stick to play mortal kombat and street fighter 2 though,
[13:26] <popey> I have a micro sd card in the picade which has everything I ever want to play on it, I can just duplicate that and put it in another pi on the TV
[13:26] <popey> hmmm, good plans
[13:26] <popey> I think this could be a go-er
[13:26] <ikonia> it's almost too easy
[13:26] <popey> yeah
[13:27] <popey> the only problem for me will be if I have enough HDMI ports :) #firstworldproblem
[13:27] <ikonia> i just upgraded my amp in the last 4 weeks, so I now have 8 inputs :)
[13:27] <popey> nice
[13:27] <ikonia> I saw this problem coming
[13:27] <zmoylan-pi> and not 11? :-P
[13:27] <popey> i don't have a big room for decent audio
[13:27] <popey> so have a sound bar on my xmas list
[13:28] <ikonia> ahhh thats probably the only thing I do like about my house is my living room, it's great for audio/TV
[13:28] <popey> nice :)
[13:28] <ikonia> so I'll make the most of it
[13:28] <ikonia> while hating the rest
[13:28] <popey> hah
[13:28] <ikonia> but it's all about offset/compromise of course
[13:28] <popey> ok, now trying to think of reasons not to just do this now
[13:28] <popey> as it's sunday
[13:28] <ikonia> you won't
[13:28] <ikonia> I tried
[13:28] <popey> I have a spare pi 3 laying around
[13:29] <popey> haha
[13:29] <popey> right, thanks :)
[13:29] <ikonia> it took my 8 minutes to set it up and get it working just nice, the rest of the time has been looking for a controller I like
[13:29] <ikonia> I'm sure you can invest 8 minutes
[13:29] <popey> already on it
[13:29] <ikonia> 7:30 and counting
[13:30] <popey> will take more time dding the sd than anything else
[13:30] <ikonia> I did it on am mac and I was shocked how quick it was
[13:30] <ikonia> approx 1 minutes onto a 128mb micro sd
[13:30] <ikonia> never seen it that quick
[13:31] <ikonia> although maybe I'm used to linux support of SD readers sucking
[13:31] <ikonia> so to use one with good support in the OS seems a treat
[13:33] <popey> this is a 32GB one that is full of roms
[13:33] <ikonia> I've got quite a few emulators going and wanted to store roms for quite a few setups
[13:33] <ikonia> didn't want to do it over nfs
[13:33] <ikonia> so 128gb seemed pretty cheap and easy
[13:33] <popey> wowzers
[13:34] <popey> thats a lot
[13:34] <ikonia> I think the whole lot comes in at around 85GB
[13:34] <ikonia> snes/nes/mega/master system/neo/mame/c64/amiga
[13:37] <popey> ah bum, turns out the one in my retropie is indeed 64
[13:37]  * popey adds another 64 to the cart
[13:37] <ikonia> I like your attitude
[13:48] <popey> hmm
[13:48] <popey> nothing on telly screen
[13:48] <popey> changed hdmi_safe=1 but still nothing
[13:49] <popey> it's up, I can ssh into it over wifi
[13:50] <popey> \o/ hdmi port oddity
[13:57] <ikonia> Hmmm I used to have that on an old tv
[13:57] <ikonia> it just never synced...ever
[13:57] <ikonia> luckily I changed the TV before I actually needed it to be working so never had to have the full fight
[14:03] <popey> all working
[14:03] <popey> just need to setup bluetooth thing now
[14:05] <ikonia> exciting
[14:05] <ikonia> watching your bluetooth situation as my digital guinee pig
[14:05] <popey> :)
[14:06] <popey> doing a dist-upgrade first as haven't done that for a while
[14:06] <popey> it didnt find the snes30 initially, so doing this to see if that fixes it
[14:06] <popey> glad I setup mac address thing on my router so I know the IP of this thing when it has no display
[14:07] <popey> also, need to sort the aspect ratio out, it's drawing a 4:3 box on my 16:9 telly
[14:07] <popey> which will be fine in game but in the uI I'd expect it to be right
[14:08] <popey> taking ages, i think the wifi on the pi is a bit tardy
[14:10]  * popey unloads the washing machine while that does its thing
[14:16] <popey> will have to finish this later, kids dragging me out of the house to go pokemon hunting
[15:30] <popey> ikonia: well, it found the device and associated.. so that's a step forward :)
[15:35] <ikonia> good good
[15:35] <ikonia> you are my canary in the cage as I hover above the "buy" button
[15:39] <popey> bah, it's really ropey
[15:40] <popey> like, it connected but can't see the controller in emulationstation
[15:42] <popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/23471231/
[15:42] <popey> barfs when pairing
[15:44] <popey> exobuzz: you managed to get an 8bitdo controller paired with retropie?
[15:44] <popey> ah, looks like https://github.com/RetroPie/RetroPie-Setup/issues/1213
[15:47] <popey> \o/ success
[15:52] <popey> problem is how do you do insert coin in mame?
[15:53] <popey> i think i need a bluetooth keyboard as well as the controller
[15:57] <ikonia> you can map auto coin insert
[15:58] <ikonia> I used to do that in many years gone by
[15:58] <ikonia> must still be possible
[15:59] <popey> found my wireless keyboard
[15:59] <exobuzz> popey, yep. I have 3 of them
[15:59] <exobuzz> popey, https://github.com/retropie/retropie-setup/wiki/Setting-up-an-8bitdo-Bluetooth-controller
[15:59] <popey> finally got it working, booting with START+R
[15:59] <exobuzz> yeah. you have to power on in the right mode
[15:59] <popey> ya, used that, it was a bit flaky in places
[16:01] <popey> hm, no audio
[16:05] <Spearo> join
[16:32] <exobuzz> popey, on retropie ? hdmi or jack ?
[16:41] <popey> hdmi
[16:41] <popey> i think i previously had it configured for my picades, so had audio going over the jack
[16:41] <popey> need to tell it to go over hdmi now it's in the telly
[17:14] <popey> pretty neat that I can ssh in, and run the config tool to tell retropie to use hdmi for audio out
[18:39] <popey> \o/ Introducing Sam to some classic arcade games like Marble Madness :)
[18:40] <penguin42> how does he like them?
[19:06] <popey> well, he's taken the controller from me and is now playing Fifa on the megadrive
[19:06] <popey> so my idea of playing games myself is out the window
[19:06] <popey> when it first started he went "WOW! These graphics are terrible"
[19:06] <popey> I did point out this was 20 years ago, 10 years before he was even born
[19:06] <diddledan> megadrive graphics are bad?!
[19:07] <popey> his reference point is fifa 2017
[19:07] <diddledan> we were spoilt with megadrives as kids!
[19:07] <popey> i never had any consoles as a kid
[19:08] <diddledan> they were so advanced that I didn't ever have one
[19:08] <diddledan> I had to go round a friend's to play with one
[19:18] <exobuzz> marble madness is great - megadrive version is the best home conversion too I think
[19:18] <ali1234> megadrive graphics were bad compared to their contemporaries, yes
[19:28] <diddledan> megadrive was the last popular cartridge console AFAICT
[19:28] <diddledan> after that we had PSX
[19:28] <ali1234> N64
[19:29] <ali1234> the snes was also released later and outsold the genesis
[19:30] <diddledan> fair dinkum then :-)
[19:30] <diddledan> perhaps I was just in a backwards town :-p
[19:30] <ali1234> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_game_consoles#Home_game_consoles
[20:43] <zmoylan-pi> megadrive graphics were decades beyond my 8bit spectrum yet when i installed an emulator on my brothers pc a decade back his kids were all over it till he deleted the emulator as he needed to use the pc for work... jetpac was the favourite game...
[20:50] <diddledan> emulators are awesome
[20:55] <exobuzz> <3 spectrum  - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-kkzl2foaQ / https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_iXpKALQeQ
[20:56] <exobuzz> mazing stuff from the demo scene
[20:57] <diddledan> the demo scene passed me by
[21:00] <zmoylan-pi> it was great at the end of the spectrum era when every magazine had a tape on the cover with old full games...
[21:02] <exobuzz> hmm i have to disagree - towards the end, the magazines were so thin. I would have preferred content over tapes etc (but the tapes were good)
[21:02] <exobuzz> I guess it was inevitable - and the speccy mags like your sinclair did well to last so long
[21:03] <zmoylan-pi> people are still developing games for it... it's a solid little machine... :-)
[21:03] <zmoylan-pi> not much in the way of commercial releases mind...
[21:04] <exobuzz> the quality of the homebrew games is suberb though of course
[21:04] <zmoylan-pi> a single programmer could understand the whole machine from top to bottom and write a piece of code to maximise it's use
[21:06] <popey> that video is amazing
[21:07]  * zmoylan-pi is ripping audio version of yes minister to mp3s so is waiting before playing it...
[21:08] <zmoylan-pi> 12 episodes on 6 cds... which will all fit on one cd once ripped to mp3...
[21:09] <popey> amazing what they can do with the z80 and no gpu
[21:10] <zmoylan-pi> were they're going, they don't need no gpu... :-)
[21:10] <popey> i just keep looking at it and puzzling how they did it
[21:19] <exobuzz> the first video is "no flicker" version - this one is how it looks on a tv I guess https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jmXzROb2l8
[21:20] <exobuzz> lots of switching between two images etc to get extra colours etc
[21:21] <exobuzz> impressive tricks though - and lots of changing colour on every scanline etc
[21:31] <popey> yeah


[09:51] <jussi> tjaalton: Unfortunately the RC3 did not fix it. Is it worth my time to try RC2 and RC1?
[09:51] <jussi> (now that I finally got to testing it)
[11:22] <tjaalton> jussi: nah, rc3 has fixed things for others, so your bug is something else
[11:23] <jussi> tjaalton: ahh. I seill need to test the sleep bug, but the artifacts are still around
[17:00] <lool> Sarvatt: Hey
[17:01] <lool> Sarvatt: xserver-xorg-input-synaptics 1.3.99+git20110116.0e27ce3a-0ubuntu14 you dropped a build-dep to avoid some feature being turned on; I would like to make this a build-conflict instead; is this ok with you?
[17:02] <lool> Sarvatt: pushed to git
[17:20] <lool> Sarvatt: uploaded, shoot if that was wrong  :-)
[17:20] <lool> or shout
[21:34] <ricotz> Sarvatt, hello :)
[21:36] <ricotz> Sarvatt, i'd like to upload an updated nvidia driver to edgers perhaps you want to take a look first -- http://people.ubuntu.com/~ricotz/nvidia/275.09.04_update.debdiff