[02:21] <Meshezabeel> Can I ask if I can ask a question?
[02:22] <LaserJock> you're supposed to ask the question first since it depends on the question ;-)
[02:23] <Meshezabeel> :)
[02:27] <mhz> hhehe
[02:28] <mhz> yeah, just shoot (but not 'us')
[02:29] <LaserJock> lol
[02:31] <mhz> "I shot tha sheriff..."
[02:31] <mhz> Meshezabeel: so? what is it?
[02:32] <mhz> LaserJock: do yo knw how to recover a ssh key?
[02:32] <mhz> (from public key)
[02:37] <LaserJock> hmm, I wouldn't think that would work
[02:37] <LaserJock> would kinda defeat the purpose
[02:39] <mhz> hmm
[02:39] <mhz> then, I am just screwed?
[02:39] <mhz> or, I have been 'shot' :D
[06:02] <mhz> re
[06:07] <Meshezabeel> re?
[10:44] <DanielC> Hi. I'm on the rom-o-matic website to pick a ROM that I can use for my laptop's PCMCIA ethernet card. So I can use it as a thin client to test Edubuntu.
[10:44] <DanielC> I don't know what card to pick, there are no markings. Is there a pcmcia equivalent to lsmod?
[10:45] <DanielC> lspci sorry
[10:48] <DanielC> I wish there was an lspmcia just like there is an lspci and an lsusb.
[11:03] <DanielC> Does anyone know how I can find card information for a pcmcia card? (something like lspci but for pcmcia would be nice).
[11:08] <spacey> i have no idea about pmcia, sorry
[11:08] <DanielC> :(
[11:08] <DanielC> There has to be a way to figure out what type of pcmcia card I have.
[11:08] <spacey> DanielC: if you want to test it you can also burn a rom-o-matic iso and burn it on cd
[11:08] <spacey> and boot it on your laptop
[11:09] <DanielC> spacey: But there are a hundred possible ROMs there.
[11:09] <spacey> oh yeah
[11:10] <spacey> does it show up in dmesg?
[11:11] <DanielC> I see several instances of 'pcmcia' but none which are revealing.
[11:11] <DanielC> pmcia: parent pci bridge I/0 window: 0x2000 - 0x2fff
[11:11] <DanielC> Things like that.
[11:11] <spacey> i never had a pcmcia nic so no idea
[11:11] <spacey> pmcia
[11:12] <DanielC> I thought that pcmcia and pci were totally different things, why does it have a "parent pci bridge"?
[11:13] <spacey> i guess it hooked up on pci, but not sure, look it up in wikipedia :)
[11:13] <DanielC> :)
[11:58] <DanielC> Help. I can't boot my thin client. It starts booting and you see the Ubuntu splash screen and all but after a few moments it goes back to the text terminal and says:
[11:58] <DanielC> Ip-Config: eth0 hardware address 00:0b:6a:55:e9:ca mtu 1500 DHCP RARP
[11:58] <DanielC> And it just stays there, doing nothing.
[11:59] <DanielC> The line above that simply says "Uncompressing Linux... Ok, booting kernel"
[12:01] <lucasvo> DanielC: is the dhcp server running?
[12:02] <DanielC> Yes.
[12:02] <DanielC> The client can even download a Linux kernel from the server and start booting it.
[12:03] <DanielC> I just figured that it dies at the "Mounting root file system" step.
[12:07] <DanielC> I guess that the problem must be at the server, in the directory /opt/ltsp/i386
[12:07] <DanielC> Looks like the ltsp client system is broken.
[02:26] <cbx33> afternooooooon all !
[02:42] <Yagisan> cbx33: G'day
[02:43] <cbx33> hey Yagisan
[02:43] <cbx33> howz it going
[02:44] <cbx33> how are your daughters fingers
[02:46] <Yagisan> cbx33: she's getting better. having trouble using her hand.
[02:46] <cbx33> but no broken bones?
[02:47] <Yagisan> nope. just a bloody mess
[02:47] <cbx33> eeek
[02:47] <cbx33> what are you up to today?
[02:47] <Yagisan> package updates
[02:47] <cbx33> oh?
[02:47] <cbx33> deng?
[02:48] <Yagisan> and I'd like to make a trailer for deng
[02:48] <Yagisan> yep
[02:48] <Yagisan> 1GB+ of data packs to update
[02:48] <cbx33> yikes
[02:48] <cbx33> i won;t download them yet then
[02:48] <Yagisan> yeah :(
[02:48] <Yagisan> cbx33: on dapper yet ?
[02:48] <cbx33> yes
[02:49] <Yagisan> good. as the com out you can download them
[02:49] <Yagisan> s/the com/they come
[02:53] <cbx33> Yagisan, when i try to upgrade deng
[02:53] <cbx33> from brezzy to dapper
[02:53] <cbx33> it keeps the package back
[02:53] <cbx33> so when i do apt-get install deng
[02:54] <cbx33> I think I'm gping to have to reinstall the packages again
[02:55] <Yagisan> cbx33: odd
[02:55] <Yagisan> cbx33: deng is beta4 in dapper, and beta3 in breezy
[02:55] <cbx33> hmm
[02:56] <cbx33> can you give me the list of essential packages again?
[02:56] <cbx33> actually nevermind
[03:01] <Yagisan> cbx33: heh we are calculating our userbase of deng after a windows user bitched about *nix support
[03:02] <Yagisan> cbx33: we ran the numbers, and well as far as we can tell, we may have more *NIX users then Win32. http://forums.newdoom.com/showthread.php?t=30565&page=3
[03:02] <Yagisan> cbx33: heh heh - I should propose dropping Win32
[03:02] <Yagisan> >:)
[03:05] <cbx33> Yagisan, I'm experiencing worse performance on dapper?
[03:05] <cbx33> :S
[03:06] <Yagisan> cbx33: that's not good :( theres no change from the svn that you were sent
[03:06] <cbx33> I never tried that
[03:07] <cbx33> I've been running on breezy
[03:07] <cbx33> i just upgraded to beta4
[03:07] <cbx33> i only updated the deng package
[03:07] <cbx33> the others were installer packages
[03:07] <cbx33> which I don;t need to i?
[03:08] <Yagisan> cbx33: shouldn't need them. they need some love though
[03:09] <cbx33> what do you think I should try
[03:09] <cbx33> i was playing map downtown
[03:09] <cbx33> and the next one
[03:09] <cbx33> I'm getting tonnes of lag
[03:10] <Yagisan> cbx33: that is really odd
[03:11] <cbx33> hey pygi
[03:11] <cbx33> want me to try anything
[03:11] <cbx33> can i get an fps or something
[03:11] <pygi> cbx33, what do you mean?
[03:11] <cbx33> I'm gonna uninstall completely and reinstlall
[03:11] <cbx33> sorry pygi talking to Yagisan
[03:11] <pygi> AH oki :)
[03:13] <Yagisan> cbx33: in the control panel it has an otion to show the fps
[03:13] <cbx33> ok
[03:14] <Yagisan> cbx33: it doesn't like wide open areas with heap of monsters
[03:14] <Yagisan> cbx33: that is lag city
[03:16] <cbx33> hmmm
[03:16] <cbx33> but it ran pretty much ok on breezy version
[03:16] <cbx33> oh and sky is still broken
[03:18] <Yagisan> cbx33: send me a screenie + Doomsday.out
[03:18] <cbx33> ok
[03:18] <cbx33> hang on
[03:19] <Yagisan> cbx33: I've never reproduced a broken sky error though
[03:21] <cbx33> how can i confirm which version I'm running
[03:25] <Yagisan> cbx33: press ~ it should say in the console
[03:26] <cbx33> 1.9.0-beta4
[03:26] <juliux> hi cbx33
[03:26] <cbx33> hey juliux
[03:27] <cbx33> Yagisan, I sent you an email
[03:27] <cbx33> it says Giles but it shuld be Files
[03:30] <Yagisan> cbx33: WTF!
[03:31] <cbx33> eh?
[03:31] <Yagisan> cbx33: that pic!
[03:31] <cbx33> yeh screwed up eh?
[03:32] <cbx33> it's like in the old doom when you used to build levels and forgot to apply a texture to the sky
[03:32] <Yagisan> cbx33: yeah, biy it has "MISSING" on all missing textures in deng
[03:32] <Yagisan> s/biy/but
[03:33] <cbx33> ahh
[03:33] <Yagisan> cbx33: so the error is somewhere else. I usually use full models and skuboxes, but you've got none of that
[03:34] <cbx33> nope
[03:34] <cbx33> did you see my frame rate
[03:34] <cbx33> :(
[03:35] <cbx33> 21 :(
[03:37] <cbx33> Yagisan, this is on a laptop
[03:37] <cbx33> but it should be ok
[03:40] <Yagisan> cbx33: 21 is ok. ideally you don't want less then 35
[03:40] <Yagisan> cbx33: because that is the internal clock. 35hz for doom
[03:40] <cbx33> ah
[03:50] <cbx33> hey highvoltage
[03:54] <highvoltage> hey cbx33
[03:54] <cbx33> howz it going
[03:55] <lucasvo> telnet ascii-wm.net 2006
[03:55] <highvoltage> ehg.. just one of those days.
[03:57] <highvoltage> how are you mr cbx33?
[03:57] <cbx33> I'm fine highvoltage how are you
[03:58] <highvoltage> feeling like i can't catch up with work, but otherwise ok.
[03:58] <cbx33> lucasvo, then what :p
[03:58] <cbx33> oh y is that?
[04:00] <highvoltage> heh@ascii wm live
[04:03] <lucasvo> when is the next play?
[04:06] <highvoltage> no idea
[04:06] <cbx33> what is it?
[04:07] <highvoltage> cbx33: ascii tennis :)
[04:07] <lucasvo> niederlande is play8ing
[04:08] <cbx33> cooool
[04:09] <cbx33> lucasvo, anyway to increase the res?
[04:09] <cbx33> hhehe
[04:09] <lucasvo> no
[04:10] <cbx33> aww, that sux
[04:11] <highvoltage> cbx33: append vga=791 ;)
[04:12] <cbx33> hang on
[04:12] <cbx33> where?
[04:12] <cbx33> on the command line?
[04:12] <cbx33> :S
[04:12] <highvoltage> cbx33: yes, just a joke. (appending vga=791 increases your VT resolution to 1024x768)
[04:13] <cbx33> oh
[04:13] <highvoltage> cbx33: but you can also set your terminal font smaller :)
[04:13] <cbx33> I already did that
[04:13] <cbx33> but It's still too difficult to see
[04:13] <highvoltage> heh, don't feel stupid
[04:37] <DanielC> Help: The thin client starts booting but stops at the "Mounting root filesystem" step.
[04:38] <DanielC> I take it to mean that the problem is in /opt/ltsp/i386
[04:38] <DanielC> But I don't know what to do to make that filesystem mount correctly.
[04:39] <DanielC> The client doesn't give any errors. It just stops booting. I checked /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/fstab and I only saw the /proc filesystem listed. Is that normal?
[04:40] <lucasvo> DanielC: is nfs running?
[04:40] <DanielC> dunno
[04:40] <DanielC> How do I check that?
[04:41] <lucasvo> try to start it with:
[04:41] <lucasvo> sudo /etc/init.d/nfs-kernel-server start
[04:41] <lucasvo> sudo /etc/init.d/portmap start
[04:43] <DanielC> No change :(
[04:44] <lucasvo> DanielC: do you have a firewall?
[04:44] <DanielC> On Edubuntu? Not that I know of. This is a vanilla install.
[04:45] <DanielC> Standard Edubuntu --> switch --> thin client
[04:45] <jsgotangco> no firewall in default nor open ports if you've isntalled workstation
[04:45] <DanielC> I did start out with a workstation install and then 'apt-get edubuntu-server'.
[04:54] <DanielC> brb
[05:06] <Yagisan> cbx33: I suspect your mirror effect is related the the other opengl issues I'm hunting down
[05:07] <DanielC> back
[05:07] <DanielC> Does anyone know how to mount the LTSP root file system from the command line?
[05:08] <DanielC> I just connected my laptop to the network served by the Edubuntu server. It received an IP and I can ping the server.
[05:08] <mhz> cool
[05:08] <DanielC> So next I want to try the nfs mount step, and hopefully get a meaningful error message.
[05:12] <DanielC> mount <IP_ADDRESS>:/opt/ltsp/i386 /mnt/ltsp
[05:13] <DanielC> Btw, I'm using the 192.168.17.x addresses to avoid conflict with the outer network using 192.168.0.x
[05:14] <DanielC> Ok, the mount didn't work and this is the error:
[05:14] <DanielC> mount: RPC: Timed out
[05:15] <mhz> hmm
[05:15] <mhz> DanielC: sorry I ask (I just got in) but you did use an edubuntu fresh install?
[05:16] <DanielC> mhz: I did a "workstation" fresh install and then ran "apt-get install edubuntu-server" and then "ltsp-build-client".
[05:16] <mhz> DanielC: hmm, and you get mounting errors?
[05:16] <mhz> but you do get DHCP server working because you do get IP at the client?
[05:17] <Yagisan> G'day DanielC, mhz
[05:17] <DanielC> mhz: When I boot the thin client, it reaches the point where it says "Mounting root file system" and then it just stops.
[05:17] <mhz> Yagisan: hey bro! Nice to see ya
[05:17] <mhz> hmmm
[05:17] <DanielC> mhz: I'm mounting from my laptop so I can get a more meaningful error, and what I got was the time-out.
[05:17] <mhz> DanielC: not sure but.. can you try 'ltsp-update-sshkeys' ?
[05:18] <mhz> (at the server side)
[05:18] <DanielC> Yes, DHCP itself is working. I can ping the server, and indeed download a kernel from the client.
[05:18] <Ron_o> When I try to run edubuntu's live CD, after the initial boot choices it just hangs with a blinking cursor. I md5ed both the iso and the CD.....
[05:18] <Ron_o> anyone?
[05:18] <DanielC> mhz: Ok, give me a minute to run ltsp-update-sshkeys
[05:19] <mhz> DanielC: I assume you are editing /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf NOT /etc/dhcp-server/blabla
[05:19] <mhz> Ron_o: hmm
[05:19] <mhz> Ron_o: you say CD is ok?
[05:20] <Ron_o> I md5ed it according to the md5 instructions on the Ubuntu wiki.
[05:20] <Ron_o> md5sum..... | grep ... 'OK$'...
[05:20] <Ron_o> it came up with no errors.
[05:20] <mhz> Ron_o: and RAM of your pc is?
[05:20] <Ron_o> 196..
[05:20] <mhz> and processor?
[05:21] <Ron_o> PII 350Mhz..
[05:21] <cbx33> Yagisan, think it'll be fixed soon
[05:21] <mhz> Ron_o: AFAIK, and after trying many times, I got same issue with LiveCD's
[05:21] <Yagisan> cbx33: well, I know it does not appear with the skyboxes on
[05:21] <DanielC> mhz: ltsp-update-sshkeys mad no difference. I can't mount from my laptop and the thin client still fails at the mount step. Yes, I've been editing /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
[05:21] <mhz> Ron_o: LiveCD's with GNOME or XFCE or KDE are too heavy
[05:21] <cbx33> bah....skyboxes....
[05:22] <cbx33> naughty naughty Yagisan
[05:22] <Ron_o> I ran LIveCD with gnome and xfce and has no problem.
[05:22] <Ron_o> I just don't get it.
[05:22] <Yagisan> cbx33: actually, for doom, it really helps (covers up problems with broken wads)
[05:22] <mhz> Ron_o: I have always failed with similar hardware, no matter how much ram I use in PII or PIII under 500 MHz
[05:22] <cbx33> yeh....
[05:22] <Ron_o> OK..
[05:22] <Ron_o> that must be it then.
[05:22] <mhz> Ron_o: unless... I use DamnSmall Linux
[05:22] <Yagisan> Ron_o: not always
[05:23] <mhz> Ron_o: which will give you a nice FLuxbox env.
[05:23] <cbx33> Yagisan, we always used to shout at each other for using skyboxes
[05:23] <Ron_o> but xubuntu worked fine... as did ubuntu liveCD..
[05:23] <Ron_o> that's what's so confusing.
[05:23] <mhz> Ron_o: however, if you try booting for installing instead of Live mode, then you can have no problems
[05:23] <DanielC> mhz: I don't see any NFS entry in /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/fstab, is that normal? All I see is a /proc entry.
[05:23] <Ron_o> well, I don't really want to install.
[05:23] <mhz> Ron_o: but GNOME is still too heavy
[05:23] <Ron_o> Gnome is. It's slow, but workable.
[05:24] <mhz> DanielC: let me check my paths
[05:24] <mhz> Ron_o: yeah but Live mode is LOT heavier
[05:24] <Ron_o> What I wanted it for is my neice coming over and she could use it on my computer..
[05:24] <mhz> heavy = expensive
[05:24] <Yagisan> Ron_o: my experience on a P2 233 is livecd is too slow, but a local install is just usable (256MB)
[05:24] <Ron_o> ok.
[05:24] <DanielC> Ron_o: Try installing Xubuntu. It should be faster.
[05:24] <Ron_o> I'll accept that it's my hardware. I know I'm really out of date.
[05:25] <mhz> Ron_o: hmm, how about installing Edubuntu server to a more resourcefull hardware and have the P3 boor from it via LTSP ?
[05:25] <Ron_o> mhz, I'll try that.
[05:25] <Ron_o> thanks.
[05:25] <mhz> Ron_o: xubuntu live cd also failed in  a PII of 400 MHz
[05:26] <mhz> well, not failed BUT took 40 minutes to actually start using it :D
[05:26] <DanielC> Try Damm Small Linux. It's quite respectable I think.
[05:26] <mhz> Ron_o: I have a Celeron 1 GHz with 256 MB of ram and boot the PII from it
[05:27] <mhz> so my daughter plays Gcompris
[05:27] <mhz> DanielC: yeah, I love DSL
[05:27] <mhz> Ron_o: same PII took about 3 minutes to be rady to work with DSL
[05:27] <mhz> and it was really fast
[05:28] <Ron_o> I have DSL. I like it but it was a bit much for me when I first got into linux.
[05:28] <Ron_o> now, maybe not so.
[05:28] <Yagisan> Ron_o: the problem with the live cd's is, it spends all its time uncompressing the applications etc, so much time that on older systems, it takes ages to run the applications
[05:28] <Ron_o> Yagisan, that's somewhat true. Knoppix is quite efficient on my system.
[05:28] <mhz> Ron_o: hehehe, yeah, Fluxbox is not so aimed for end-users (but still a bit intuitive)
[05:30] <mhz> DanielC: so it seems, I only have an entry for /proc
[05:30] <DanielC> mhz: ok
[05:30] <DanielC> hmm....
[05:31] <mhz> DanielC: it gets my attention that I have always isntalled edubuntu in the most unusual way
[05:31] <DanielC> So the most likely culpit is NFS. For some reason I can't mount over NFS.
[05:32] <mhz> DanielC: I usually get Ubuntu via NetBoot (well, from an Edubuntu server) into my thinlaptop-server. Then, I install edubuntu-server + edubuntu-desktop
[05:32] <mhz> then, buil client, and never had a problem
[05:32] <DanielC> Computers don't like me. I always have problems.
[05:32] <mhz> DanielC: nah!
[05:32] <mhz> :D
[05:33] <mhz> DanielC: do you have a router somewhere?
[05:33] <mhz> or only switch or hub
[05:33] <DanielC> Just a switch.
[05:33] <mhz> hmm, so no routers conflicting with dhcp from edubuntu
[05:34] <DanielC> No, it's just:  Edubuntu --> switch --> laptop and the thin client
[05:34] <DanielC> dhcp seems fine, I can ping the Edubuntu server.
[05:34] <mhz> DanielC: this may sound not clever, but nay chance you can rebuild client?
[05:34] <mhz> nay  = any
[05:35] <DanielC> You mean ltsp-build-client ?
[05:35] <mhz> yup
[05:35] <Ron_o> I'm trying Edubuntu live on my Celeron 366Mhz and I'll see how it goes. It's already gone farther than this system.
[05:35] <DanielC> I'm willing to try it.
[05:36] <Ron_o> but it may not be very useable regardless. :)
[05:37] <DanielC> Btw, I can even ssh from my laptop to the Edubuntu server. So the problem is not with DHCP. It's NFS.
[05:37] <DanielC> Rebuilding the client should not fix a problem with NFS though, should it?
[05:38] <mhz> only Murphy would get an answer for that, DanielC :)
[05:44] <DanielC> Hmmm... /etc/hosts.allow doesn't have anything. Is that normal?
[05:47] <Yagisan> DanielC: yes. hosts.deny is also empty
[05:47] <DanielC> Yagisan: Any idea why I wouldn't be able to mount over NFS?
[05:48] <mhz> Yagisan: what would i need to recover a ssh key when I did not back up?
[05:48] <Yagisan> DanielC: to be honest, not at this moment.
[05:48] <Yagisan> mhz: urgh. as in disk recovery ?
[05:50] <mhz> Yagisan: nope, as in "I did not back up my .ssh stuff and I need to log in to a server which only allows my ssh key :( "
[05:52] <Yagisan> mhz: you'd need an act of $DEITY then :(
[05:52] <mhz> ?what?
[05:53] <Yagisan> mhz: it other words, you are out of luck
[05:53] <Yagisan> mhz: time to make a new key + backup
[05:53] <Yagisan> mhz: sorry mate :(
[05:54] <mhz> Yagisan: oh
[05:54] <mhz> Yagisan: the sysadmin will not like that
[05:54] <mhz> Yagisan: I already had lost one the first time ( i had buld it from a cyber cafe...duh!)
[05:55] <mhz> Yagisan: it is me.. I was the fool, so  no worries
[06:21] <DanielC> Could someone help me set Edubuntu to accept remote X connections? I tried:
[06:21] <DanielC> iptables -A input -p udp -i eth1 --port 177 -j ACCEPT
[06:21] <DanielC> But that gave me the error "No chain/target/match by that name"
[06:24] <DanielC> Found it. 'input' should be 'INPUT' (it's case sensitive).
[06:43] <DanielC> Grrr... could anyone tell me how to open UDP port 177 or TCP port 6000 please?
[06:49] <spacey> DanielC: doe you have a firewall installed?
[06:49] <spacey> or a script loaded
[06:49] <spacey> edubuntu doesn't have that by default
[06:50] <spacey> you only have to check that gdm will it
[06:50] <spacey> [xdmcp]
[06:50] <spacey> Enable=true
[06:50] <spacey> in /etc/X11/gdm/gdm.conf-custom
[06:52] <spacey> you can probably do it in System -> Administration -> login manager as well
[06:54] <DanielC> spacey: This is a default Edubuntu install. No firewall.
[06:54] <spacey> DanielC: then you don't have to open ports in the firewall ;)
[06:54] <spacey> DanielC: make sure you put any changes in gdm.conf-custom and not in gdm.conf itself
[06:56] <DanielC> gdm.com-custom looks fine
[06:57] <DanielC> I had already enabled it through System > Admin > login manager; but I checked godm.conf-custom and it looks as you say it should.
[06:58] <DanielC> I went to System > Admin > Network tools > Port Scan and ran a scan on the server's IP. I didn't see any entry for ports 177 or 6000.
[07:00] <spacey> what about netstat?
[07:02] <spacey> netstat shows the ports that are open
[07:02] <spacey> and connections at the moment
[07:02] <DanielC> I must be stupid today, I don't see where it says which ports are open.
[07:03] <spacey> try `netstat -ap`
[07:03] <spacey> Proto Recv-Q Send-Q Local Address           Foreign Address         State       PID/Program name
[07:03] <spacey> tcp        0      0 <IP_ADDRESS>:44544         <IP_ADDRESS>:*               LISTEN     -
[07:04] <spacey> tells you that something listens on <IP_ADDRESS>:44544
[07:04] <DanielC> Ok.
[07:06] <spacey> DanielC: you want to LTSP.org ltsp?
[07:06] <spacey> *use
[07:07] <DanielC> I'd be happy using ltsp, but since that's giving me trouble I'm testing a small thin client box which is not ltsp and instead tries to establish a remote X connection.
[07:08] <spacey> ltsp.org ltsp does the same thing
[07:08] <spacey> thats why i asked
[07:08] <spacey> the ubuntu ltsp is over ssh
[07:09] <DanielC> netstat doesn't show either port 177 or 6000 open.
[07:09] <DanielC> I don't know how ltsp.org ltsp is different from Edubuntu ltsp.
[07:09] <spacey> like i said, ubuntu ltsp goes over ssh (encrypted)
[07:09] <spacey> ltsp.org ltsp goes with XDMCP
[07:10] <spacey> same you are trying now
[07:10] <spacey> what kind of small thin client box are you using now?
[07:11] <DanielC> It's a custom-made box.
[07:11] <DanielC> It's a tiny box (4inches x 4 inches x 1 inch) that runs a Linux distribution which establishes a remote X connection through XDMCP.
[07:12] <spacey> its white label?
[07:12] <DanielC> It's nice because it's small and silent.
[07:12] <DanielC> I don't understand your question :(
[07:12] <spacey> the little box doesn't have a brand?
[07:12] <DanielC> The brand is Sumo but you are not likely to have heard of it, it's very new.
[07:13] <spacey> ah ok
[07:13] <spacey> expensive?
[07:13] <DanielC> It's from a guy in this town who hopes to sell them.
[07:13] <spacey> we have a few HP ones: http://users.lichtsnel.nl/~spacey/?p=206
[07:13] <DanielC> yes and no: :)  the "fair" price for it would be perhaps 40 pounds, but because this guy wants to recoup his investment he is selling them for 175 pounds.
[07:13] <DanielC> *click*
[07:14] <spacey> hmm
[07:14] <spacey> the hp ones cost around 200 euro
[07:14] <spacey> excl VAT
[07:14] <DanielC> Oh, his boxes look much like that.
[07:14] <DanielC> A bit smaller, but much the same.
[07:15] <spacey> the ones we have also have linux on it
[07:15] <spacey> with XFCE
[07:15] <DanielC> Do the HP ones work well? Do they work with Edubuntu?
[07:15] <spacey> on the flash card
[07:15] <spacey> but we boot them with PXE
[07:15] <spacey> yes they do, see picture :p
[07:16] <DanielC> Well... I guess that want I want to know is if you had to do a lot of fiddling with Edubuntu. Whether it's not the default Edubuntu setup.
[07:16] <spacey> well we use them with ltsp.org ltsp, which needed a few extra parameters in the lts.conf
[07:16] <spacey> but it should work on edubuntu just fine
[07:16] <DanielC> Was it hard to do?
[07:17] <spacey> took me half an hour but i guess i have a bit more experience then you
[07:17] <spacey> the thing you have now should work as well
[07:17] <DanielC> Ok.
[07:17] <spacey> if you don't get this working  you probably run in the same problems with the HP one
[07:18] <DanielC> 200 Euros you said... that's a bit cheaper than the one I have here, but not loads cheaper.
[07:18] <DanielC> Understood.
[07:18] <spacey> i don't know how much the pound is worth
[07:18] <spacey> also depends where you buy
[07:18] <spacey> and on the quantities i suppose
[07:19] <DanielC> ok
[07:19] <DanielC> From what you say, I take it that configuring ltsp.conf to use DXMCP is not simple. :(
[07:19] <spacey> if you set up the dhcp server, tftp and nfs correctly you can boot them with PXE
[07:19] <spacey> its nicer then using the onboard flash card linux thingy
[07:20] <spacey> there is no ltsp.conf :)
[07:20] <DanielC> Ok.
[07:20] <spacey> and the lts.conf has nothing to do with xdmcp
[07:20] <DanielC> Clearly I've never configured ltsp before.
[07:20] <spacey> ;)
[07:21] <spacey> just follow the edubuntu documentation
[07:21] <spacey> and you should get it working
[07:21] <DanielC> I've been following it for 3 days and it's still not working.
[07:21] <DanielC> I did setup Edubuntu once before, at a school. So I do have a general understanding of how it works. But nothing in depth.
[07:22] <DanielC> Currently I'm having problems with NFS mount.
[07:22] <DanielC> I just can't mount over NFS.
[07:22] <spacey> if you have some specific errors we can help you with that
[07:22] <DanielC> I get a time out.
[07:23] <DanielC> The error is:  mount: RPC: Time out
[07:23] <spacey> is your /etc/exports alright?
[07:23] <spacey> and does your thinclient get the correct ip for the server? (dhcpd.conf setting)
[07:23] <spacey> portmap installed?
[07:23] <DanielC> yes to all.
[07:25] <spacey> if you boot the thinclient i think it also displays the ip address it wants to connect to
[07:25] <spacey> thats the right address?
[07:25] <DanielC> It says:  /opt/ltsp  *(ro,no_root_squash,async)
[07:25] <spacey> thats correct
[07:25] <DanielC> The server is <IP_ADDRESS>  I'm pretty sure that's what the client said, but I'll reboot and test.
[07:26] <spacey> sometimes it can be in the small typo's
[07:29] <DanielC> It says:  ip=<IP_ADDRESS>:<IP_ADDRESS>:<IP_ADDRESS>:<IP_ADDRESS>
[07:29] <DanielC> ooops
[07:29] <DanielC> ip=<IP_ADDRESS>:<IP_ADDRESS>:<IP_ADDRESS>:<IP_ADDRESS>
[07:30] <DanielC> The first is a reasonable address for the client.
[07:30] <DanielC> The second is the correct address for the server.
[07:31] <turf_> sorry to interrupt, i would just like to ask if you know any software that create still picture to movie like slide show?
[07:31] <DanielC> I can't see any errors for NFS, so I can't check that. But on my laptop I use the mount command and that fails.
[07:32] <spacey> DanielC: what command do you use on your laptop
[07:32] <DanielC> turf_: Sorry, no.
[07:32] <DanielC> spacey: mount <IP_ADDRESS>:/opt/ltsp ltsp
[07:32] <DanielC> (where ltsp is a local directory)
[07:32] <spacey> turf_: at least pitivi can do movie stuff
[07:32] <spacey> hmm
[07:32] <spacey> i would add -t nfs
[07:33] <spacey> but maybe thats auto detected
[07:33] <DanielC> Worth trying...
[07:34] <DanielC> mount: special device <IP_ADDRESS>:/opt/ltsp does not exist
[07:34] <turf_> actually i'm looking for a software that is like picture pacakge for edubuntu
[07:34] <spacey> turf_: picture programs i know would be f-spot and gthumb
[07:35] <DanielC> I can ssh from the laptop to the server, so I expect that the problem is with NFS itself.
[07:35] <spacey> DanielC: mount -t nfs <IP_ADDRESS>:/top/ltsp /mnt/ltsp (or where ever you want to mount it)?
[07:35] <spacey> um
[07:35] <turf_> ok, thanks
[07:36] <spacey> s/top/opt
[07:36] <DanielC> spacey: Yes, that's what I did.
[07:36] <spacey> DanielC: reloaded nfs-kernel-server when you changed /etc/exports?
[07:37] <DanielC> I never changed /etc/exports
[07:37] <spacey> what ifyou type `exportfs` on the serveR?
[07:37] <DanielC> I just reloaded the server just for kicks, no change.
[07:38] <DanielC>  /opt/ltsp   <world>
[07:40] <spacey> something is wrong allright
[07:40] <DanielC> :-(
[07:40] <spacey> if the /opt/ltsp wasn't shared
[07:40] <spacey> it would give an error like this:
[07:40] <spacey> # mount -t nfs cluebox:/opt/ltsp ltsp
[07:40] <spacey> mount: cluebox:/opt/ltsp failed, reason given by server: Permission denied
[07:41] <DanielC> Hmmm...
[07:41] <spacey> that special device error is wierd
[07:41] <spacey> never seen that
[07:42] <spacey> you have portmap installed on your laptop btw?
[07:42] <DanielC> I don't know.
[07:42] <DanielC> I don't.
[07:42] <spacey> apt-get install portmap
[07:43] <DanielC> Ok, one minute...
[07:43] <spacey> *might* help
[07:44] <DanielC> installing...
[07:45] <DanielC> installed
[07:45] <DanielC> Now, what's portmap and what do I do with it?
[07:47] <spacey> its works automagicly
[07:47] <spacey> just try to mount again
[07:47] <spacey> my housemate just finished cooking
[07:47] <spacey> so i have to eat
[07:47] <spacey> i will be back later
[07:47] <spacey> good luck
[07:48] <DanielC> Jesus I'm so sutpid. I typed "ntfs" instead of "nfs". With the correct command the error is still the same (timeout).
[07:48] <DanielC> spacey: thanks, enjoy your meal
[08:07] <Amaranth> S = chi2P(-2.0 * math.log(reduce(operator.mul, map(lambda p: 1.0-p[1] , probs), 1.0)), 2*n)
[08:23] <Yagisan> cbx33: started pushing out updated deng installers. feel free to try them
[09:02] <yurtboy> anyone know why my keyboard keys do not work (other then numbers row) when booting the ltsp client?
[09:06] <cbx33> odnol
[09:07] <cbx33> bimble
[09:07] <cbx33> jackobee
[09:07] <cbx33> I'm all out
[09:07] <cbx33> bbl guys
[09:12] <highvoltage> bye cbx33
[09:20] <Yagisan> catch you later cbx33
[09:25] <mhz> cbx33: hey
[09:59] <cbx33> I'm back
[10:00] <cbx33> hi highvoltage
[10:00] <cbx33> hi Yagisan
[10:00] <cbx33> hi mhz
[10:00] <cbx33> and a ping for HedgeMage
[10:00] <highvoltage> yo cbx33
[10:01] <cbx33> but i once was ddicted to diet coke
[10:01] <mhz> highvoltage: it all depends if you wanna get some sleep or just read or keep fingers on kbd
[10:01] <Yagisan> highvoltage: I do it all the time. Thats why I'm in bed now sleeping
[10:02] <mhz> cbx33: you are then one deleting emails just before i get to do it ?
[10:02] <mhz> :D
[10:02] <mhz> Yagisan: lol
[10:02] <cbx33> nope not i mhz
[10:03] <cbx33> but edubuntu-devel is getting a lot of spam
[10:03] <Yagisan> cbx33: your a pom - is it the queens birthday today ?
[10:03] <highvoltage> i was also addicted to coke. it was quite bad.
[10:03] <highvoltage> Yagisan: lol!
[10:04] <cbx33> i dunno
[10:04] <cbx33> highvoltage, did you get the headaches afterwards
[10:05] <cbx33> i stopped drinking it cold turkey and had a headache for a week afterwards
[10:05] <Yagisan> cbx33: apparently it's the queens birthday public holiday today - but different states do it on different days - so I was wondering which queens birthday is the cause of the shops being closed
[10:06] <cbx33> oh
[10:06] <cbx33> sorry Yagisan I'm clueless
[10:06] <cbx33> unless she programs in python I don't know much about her
[10:06] <highvoltage> cbx33: yes, bad headaches.
[10:06] <cbx33> can i ask...
[10:07] <highvoltage> cbx33: but getting myself to stop was difficult, we always have coke in the house
[10:07] <cbx33> anyone here experienced and RSI symptoms?
[10:07] <highvoltage> i used to drink 2-3 liters every day
[10:07] <cbx33> highvoltage, me too
[10:07] <cbx33> gonna go see my doctor....really worried abotu it
[10:07] <cbx33> seeing as coding is all I'm good at
[10:08] <highvoltage> yeah, seeing your doctor is probably a good idea.
[10:08] <cbx33> highvoltage, you ever had any symptoms?
[10:09] <Yagisan> cbx33: yeah - I got RSI
[10:09] <cbx33> Yagisan, bad?
[10:09] <highvoltage> i use my own style of typing. i don't know if it's ideal, but i've been typing like this since i were 7, and haven't had any problems yet, so i don't think there's a problem with the way i type.
[10:09] <Yagisan> cbx33: somewhat. Really need to rest up or it will get worse
[10:10] <Yagisan> cbx33: so I switched to my left hand for two weeks
[10:11] <highvoltage> thursday evening... a friend and i were driving around
[10:11] <highvoltage> my laptop was on the back seat, connect to the internet via gprs/edge, and he connected from his laptop to mine via wi-fi
[10:12] <highvoltage> and had irssi running. he asked for directions to the guy we were driving too (who happened to be on irc)
[10:12] <highvoltage> i thought that it would be quite cool if voice recognition worked well in linux, then i could do this more often.
[10:13] <highvoltage> i also realised that accessibility features can actually be real handy in a lot of cases, not just for people who have a disability.
[10:13] <cbx33> highvoltage, how do you type?
[10:13] <highvoltage> i can think of a few cases where it might be handy for my computer to 'listen' to me instead of having to type.
[10:13] <cbx33> well I probably use a computer about 16 hours a day at the moment
[10:14] <highvoltage> cbx33: instead of usinf f and j as home keys, i use d and k. and instead of using my index fingers there, i use middle fingers.
[10:15] <highvoltage> and i keep my hands at an angle, like you would on a microsoft natural keyboard
[10:15] <highvoltage> so i almost always have fingers on all rows
[10:15] <highvoltage> hmmm... actually, if you'd try to do it on what i've just said it won't work
[10:15] <highvoltage> i'll have to physically show you sometime.
[10:15] <Yagisan> highvoltage: I found a voice recognition app some time ago, but the guy that wrote was hired by a windows voice recognition software firm, and then the source disappeared :(
[10:16] <cbx33> rats
[10:16] <cbx33> sometimes I wake up in the morming with slight pain in my fingers
[10:16] <highvoltage> :/
[10:16] <cbx33> but my mum told me there is a history of rhematism (however you spell it) and arthritis
[10:16] <cbx33> in the fingers
[10:16] <cbx33> in our family
[10:16] <highvoltage> afaik, RSI is something you feel more in the wrist
[10:16] <cbx33> yeh
[10:16] <cbx33> and in fact
[10:16] <Yagisan> cbx33: I have it all up my right arm. mainly wrist and elbow
[10:17] <cbx33> CTS is usually accompanied by numbness which i don't feel
[10:17] <cbx33> Yagisan, yikes
[10:17] <cbx33> my eyes are screwed too
[10:17] <cbx33> when I'm tired they cross quite badly
[10:17] <cbx33> i got like double vision constantly for anything over about 5-7 metres
[10:17] <cbx33> :S(
[10:18] <Yagisan> my vision is too good. better then 20/20
[10:18] <cbx33> realy?
[10:18] <cbx33> wow
[10:18] <Yagisan> yeah
[10:18] <highvoltage> i often see slightly blurry. i first thought it was because i spend too much time in front of pc.
[10:18] <Yagisan> there is a catch though
[10:18] <cbx33> oh?
[10:18] <highvoltage> but lately i've been wondering if i'm slightly diabetic.
[10:18] <cbx33> we're a rght bunch aren't we
[10:19] <Yagisan> I'm sensitive to light. It causes severe migranes, and it's because of my better then normal vision
[10:19] <highvoltage> i drink a lot of water too, and sometimes have a real good apetite, while other times i can go a day without eating. whcih is kind of diabetic symptoms.
[10:19] <cbx33> Yagisan, really?
[10:19] <highvoltage> Yagisan: you said you live in skin cancer capital, right?
[10:19] <Yagisan> cbx33: really.
[10:19] <cbx33> highvoltage, I drink a lot of water
[10:19] <Yagisan> highvoltage: yes
[10:19] <cbx33> Yagisan, you wear shades a lot?
[10:19] <Yagisan> cbx33: part of the reason I like night shift is it's darker
[10:19] <highvoltage> Yagisan: remember you were a bit concerned a while back, did you get any feedback from the doctor?
[10:20] <Yagisan> cbx33: no, I don't own a pair of shades
[10:20] <cbx33> brb
[10:20] <Yagisan> highvoltage: 2 moles removed, 3rd is being removed
[10:21] <highvoltage> is it painful?
[10:21] <cbx33> Yagisan, I'll keep you in my thoughts
[10:21] <DanielC> Where does Yagisan live?
[10:22] <Yagisan> DanielC: Sydney, Australia
[10:23] <DanielC> Ok.
[10:23] <cbx33> Yagisan, wanna try doom again?
[10:23] <highvoltage> goodnight guys
[10:23] <cbx33> or is it still broked
[10:23] <cbx33> nn HedgeMage
[10:23] <Yagisan> highvoltage: I'm a wuss, so I've decided to freeze them off with liquid nitrogen. It stings a bit, but should have less scars
[10:23] <cbx33> nn highvoltage
[10:24] <Yagisan> DanielC: the hole on the ozone layer, it covers Antarctica and a large part of Australia depending on the time of year
[10:25] <Yagisan> DanielC: as a result, we get a lot of skin cancer here
[10:25] <DanielC> Yagisan: Yes. I know that the southern tip of Chile and Argentina is the worst.
[10:25] <DanielC> Yeah.
[10:25] <Yagisan> not to blame anyone, USA and Europe
[10:25] <DanielC> It must be pretty bad in Australia.
[10:25] <Yagisan> oops, sorry it just popped out
[10:25] <DanielC> Oh, /I'll/ blame the USA at least.
[10:26] <cbx33> heh
[10:26] <cbx33> Yagisan, doom network working yet?
[10:26] <Yagisan> cbx33: yes & no
[10:26] <DanielC> They produce more pollution than Europe though they have fewer people. Europe is at least making an attempt to move to clean energy.
[10:26] <cbx33> wanna try it?
[10:27] <Yagisan> cbx33: I'm not getting *NIX boxes to talk at the moment. Win32 seems ok though. So we can't at the moment
[10:27] <cbx33> :(
[10:27] <Yagisan> :(
[10:28] <Yagisan> have fun
[10:28] <cbx33> oh btw
[10:28] <cbx33> sound still only works if I run the game from the console
[10:28] <Yagisan> DanielC: yep. The USA won't switch with the current president.
[10:28] <Yagisan> cbx33: really odd
[10:29] <crimsun_> gah, the "sound" highlight strikes again
[10:30] <Yagisan> crimsun_: heh. just a timidity/sdlmixer issue
[10:30] <crimsun_> ok, as long as it's not broken alsa
[10:31] <Yagisan> crimsun_: not that I'm aware of - although I've heard reports of broken openal with alsa
[10:31] <crimsun_> "alsa's not broken!"
 Is she happy enough now
[10:42] <Yagisan> noo!!! I must get back to my coffin before the suns rays fry me
[10:42] <RobinShepheard> lol, what days is it for you, sunday morning??
[10:44] <RobinShepheard> if I think I may have found a possible bug, should it be reported via the edubuntu-dev mailing list or via here??
[10:44] <RobinShepheard> or both??
[10:44] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: it's monday 7am. She's having trouble eating, but otherwise she's getting better
[10:44] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: all bugs should go to launchpad, or they get lost
[10:45] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: https://launchpad.net/
[10:46] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: good to hear about your daughter, I will check out launch pad
[10:47] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: it's not exactly intuitive to use, but it used to be worse
[10:47] <RobinShepheard> yeah, I have found relevant section, my sister found a couple of possible ones
[10:48] <Yagisan> my son heard the microwave, and has woken up and  expects a feed
[10:48] <RobinShepheard> how old is he??
[10:48] <Yagisan> 6 months
[10:48] <crimsun_> it's amazing how young we become conditioned
[10:49] <RobinShepheard> sounds like you got yuor hands full there
[10:49] <Yagisan> yeah. he hears "ding" then I hear "waaaaaaaaahh"
[10:49] <Yagisan> yes. typing one handed
[10:49] <RobinShepheard> lol
[10:50] <Yagisan> he's a pig. he eats more then I do
[10:50] <Yagisan> no wonder he is 10kg
[10:50] <RobinShepheard> daft question, if you go into gcompris and try and load chess, it says that you need gnuchess installed, and it is not by default, should I list this as a possible bug as it affects the overall package??
[10:50] <RobinShepheard> 10kg is not bad going for 6 months
[10:52] <RobinShepheard> oh and there is an issue if you try and do the geography lvl 4 I think, you get to do the entire african continent and there is a missing file
[10:52] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: it's pushing obese based on standards here. Considering all family history, he is huge - and it's mostly muscle.
[10:53] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: I wouldn't worry, I was much the same, now I am only slightly overweight (about 2kg) and that is down to a fondness of beer
[10:53] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: It won't hurt to file a bug on gcompris, but I suspect gnuchess is universe isn't it
[10:53] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: I dont know for certain, will check
[10:55] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: I'm bad. sometimes I tease him and call him "Sumo", but as it is muscle I'm not too worried. muscle weighs more then fat.
[10:56] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: It actually appears to be in the main repository
[10:56] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: that was always my excuse :)
[10:57] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: might not be enough space on the cd then
[10:57] <RobinShepheard> true
[10:58] <RobinShepheard> only other thing I have found is on my machine all the tool buttons go black after you click on the first one in kig, but that may be just my display settings, I am going to have to check when I get access to the other machine in the office
[10:58] <Yagisan> ugh, he is a pig. 500ml of milk gone
[10:58] <Yagisan> have ever tried to drink half a liter of milk in one sitting - it's not easy
[10:59] <Yagisan> great, he wants more :(
[10:59] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: no kidding, just wait till he finds beer
[11:00] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: at least it won't be my beer. I hate the stuff
[11:00] <Yagisan> now sprits on the other hand - mm yummy
[11:01] <RobinShepheard> lol, what is your poison then??
[11:01] <Yagisan> translates as Japanese plum wine
[11:01] <RobinShepheard> I don't know that one, don't think I have ever seen umeshu here in the uk.
[11:01] <EmxBA> hi folks
[11:02] <RobinShepheard> hiya EmxBA
[11:02] <EmxBA> few days ago i told you some things about my linux site
[11:02] <EmxBA> skolarci.linux.org.ba
[11:02] <RobinShepheard> yeah
[11:02] <EmxBA> the one you said that you are going to add the link on edubuntu.com
[11:02] <EmxBA> when i translate it
[11:02] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: I had my in-laws leave me several bottles when they were last over
[11:02] <RobinShepheard> ahh that was not me
[11:02] <EmxBA> and you said that you would like different theme
[11:02] <EmxBA> something like tango
[11:02] <EmxBA> i've changed it
[11:03] <EmxBA> erm...
[11:03] <EmxBA> look at http://skolarci.linux.org.ba/index.php?option=com_poll&task=results&id=14
[11:03] <EmxBA> i just need to change this banner
[11:03] <EmxBA> no problem
[11:03] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: I take it that it is not easily available in aus then
[11:03] <EmxBA> RobinShepheard: that was highvoltage
[11:03] <EmxBA> highvoltage: hi
[11:03] <EmxBA> what's new
[11:04] <EmxBA> i just wanted to say that
[11:04] <EmxBA> and i gotta go soon
[11:04] <EmxBA> so hurry if you have any questions
[11:04] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: I can get it, at larger bottle shops (none near me), but my mother in law makes an absolutely fantastic Umeshu
[11:04] <Yagisan> very strong stuff :-D
[11:04] <RobinShepheard> EmxBA: looks pretty good to me, pity I cant really understand it :)
[11:05] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: makes??? as in home-brew
[11:05] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: yep :)
[11:05] <EmxBA> RobiShepheard, yes
[11:05] <EmxBA> you may not understand it
[11:05] <EmxBA> it is on bosnian :D
[11:05] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: got my female friends plastered in no time
[11:06] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: is it a case of like the hungarians, do they distill it??
[11:06] <EmxBA> so gotta go
[11:06] <EmxBA> i'll translate it in few days
[11:06] <RobinShepheard> bye EmxBA
[11:06] <EmxBA> see ya
[11:06] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: I'm not sure exactly how she makes it, but it is distilled
[11:07] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: plastered = blind drunk
[11:07] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: If you like stuff like that you ought to try hungarian palinka, they make and distill that at home and the silva one is made from plums silva = plums
[11:07] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: we use the expression plastered here as well
[11:08] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: palinka,
[11:08] <RobinShepheard> doh
[11:08] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: palinka comes out at about 50-60%abv
[11:08] <Yagisan> had I been single it may have been an eventful night O:-), but I'm not, and I rather like having my balls attached
[11:08] <RobinShepheard> but it has a great taste
[11:08] <RobinShepheard> lol
[11:12] <Yagisan> I'll find out my my new Uni application is succesful
[11:13] <RobinShepheard> Uni application?? as a student or teacher??
[11:14] <Yagisan> student (they won't let me teach without a bachelors, even though I can paper a wall with my qualifications, and actually enjoy teaching)
[11:15] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: show off :)
[11:16] <Yagisan> no need to be jealous of my Umeshu. It's only out 2-3 times a year. otherwise the house is alcohol free for the kids safety
[11:17] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: thank you. I worked hard for those useless pieces of paper, I may as well show off.
[11:18] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: I have to completely agree with you, after all nobody else really gives you the credit you are due for the work that goes into things like that
[11:19] <Yagisan> yep. they helped in getting 0 jobs
[11:19] <Yagisan> 4+years of study, and what, nothing. gee thanks
[11:20] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: I have some mates who went to uni and know far more than me and they are stacking shelves in a supermarket, I have no qualifications and I am an IT manager for a stockbrokers, there is no realy justice to it
[11:20] <RobinShepheard> *real
[11:21] <RobinShepheard> I guess I was just in the right place at the right time
[11:22] <RobinShepheard> The only reason my job is still there is that they need someone on site to tell them there is no paper in the printer, or change the toner cartridge otherwise my job would have probably gone the same way
[11:24] <RobinShepheard> I gave it up for a regular pay check
[11:24] <RobinShepheard> nice, I would love to see japan one day
[11:24] <Yagisan> I'll toss the keys to the landlord, pack up my pc, and buy a one way ticket
[11:25] <Yagisan> if I scam it right in two weeks, I may leave sooner
[11:25] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: what is happening in 2 weeks then??
[11:26] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: after all the crap I've had in this country, and seeing that they care more about illegal boat people, then their own citizens, I'll be happy to go
[11:26] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: I'm going to the Japanese embassy to attempt my biggest sell
[11:27] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: I'm going to try for their JET program, without a bachelors
[11:27] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: JET???
[11:28] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: http://www.jetprogramme.org/e/index.html
[11:28] <RobinShepheard> Oh I got you, my cousin did that, she taught english in japan
[11:29] <RobinShepheard> she reeeaally enjoyed her time in japan
[11:29] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: yep. I get in, then re-open my business :)
[11:29] <RobinShepheard> good luck to you
[11:30] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: the difference is, I already have permanent residency
[11:30] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: I don't need a Working Visa - heh heh
[11:31] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: that has got to be a serious advantage, is that because your are married to a japanese lady then??
[11:31] <Yagisan> then, I can dump the kids with the in-laws and spend some time with my wife at last
[11:31] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: yes.
[11:32] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: she was a hard catch too
[11:32] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: But worth it I take it :)
[11:32] <RobinShepheard> dont answer that one
[11:32] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: absolutely. 7 years so far
[11:33] <RobinShepheard> I had a time catching my fiancee, happiest days of my life so far (2 years so far)
[11:34] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: I met mine right after I got evicted from my share accommodation. the owner lost the house in her divorce.
[11:34] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: best thing that has ever happened to me, but although we have no kids I still find it hard enough to spend much time with her
[11:34] <RobinShepheard> * much should really be enough
[11:35] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: I know what you mean
[11:35] <RobinShepheard> I ended up working with my fiancee, worst bit is she has known my mum longer than she has known me
[11:36] <Yagisan> anyway, as it is 8am, and I've been here all night, so I'll duck off to bed soon
[11:36] <RobinShepheard> she now works for a different company
[11:36] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: good night
[11:36] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: heh. my "family" has never met my wife, they don't even know I married
[11:37] <RobinShepheard> I am very close to my family, so it not really an option
[11:37] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: I take it you don't see eye to eye with them
[11:38] <RobinShepheard> again leave answering that one if you want
[11:38] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: mine chose ciggies over kids and dumped me on the streets, so yeah. I'm not close (read I would cause great harm to them if I see them)
[11:38] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: sorry, didn't mean to bring that up
[11:39] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: no worries, I'm reminded daily anyway
[11:40] <Yagisan> I learnt everything about being a parent from them. Just do the exact opposite and it turns out well
[11:40] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: how come??
[11:40] <RobinShepheard> ahh sorry I got you
[11:41] <Yagisan> RobinShepheard: I have no one to help with the kids for starters
[11:41] <Yagisan> anyway. me -> bed. Wife is waiting impatiently
[11:41] <Yagisan> bbl
[11:41] <RobinShepheard> Yagisan: alright, see you later, good night
[12:02] <cbx33> nn all