[02:14] <danieru_> wait, if this channel was created 1.3 years ago is that about when the ubuntu phone project started?
[02:17] <danieru_> As 12.10 does not work with my netbook I am on 12.04, does ubuntu phone development environment work on 12.04
[02:17] <danieru_> ?
[02:23] <nOStahl> not sure
[02:23] <nOStahl> why does 12.10 not work
[02:24] <nOStahl> it works on my eee pc 901 perfectly
[02:25] <danieru_> I am not sure. It is a aspire one D270
[02:25] <danieru_> I tried 12.10 and it got through live cd fine but black screened after install
[02:25] <danieru_> My desktop and laptop have 12.10 though
[02:25] <danieru_> but I use the netbook for class
[02:25] <nOStahl> simple fix
[02:26] <nOStahl> google black screen
[02:26] <nOStahl> ubuntu 12.10 blackscreen boot
[02:26] <danieru_> is it a common issue?
[02:26] <nOStahl> nope
[02:26] <danieru_> I don't remember finding anything helpful back when I was troubleshooting
[02:57] <DanielDressler> I do have qt-components-ubuntu installed which depends on qt5 which is also installed, but I cannot find the qmlscene binary
[02:57] <DanielDressler> Any ideas?
[03:02] <DanielDressler> ah found it, find to the rescue. It was /usr/bin/qmlscene
[03:04] <DanielDressler> so either my install is odd but the tutorial uses /opt/qt5/bin/qmlscene
[03:11] <DanielDressler> awesome, the tutorial code is now working
[14:20] <nOStahl> any news on if that welcome screen is coming to desktop ubuntu as well?
[14:21] <usererror> not heard anything on that topic yet myself
[14:27] <nOStahl> I'm real excited for this heh
[14:27] <usererror> yeah :)
[14:27] <k1l_> any rumors on a nexus4 image?
[14:27] <usererror> none
[14:28] <usererror> there won't be until source is released
[14:28] <k1l_> i hope the ubuntu-phone guys are not still in backorder-limbo :)
[14:28] <usererror> then there will be plenty of people porting it to everything under the sun
[14:30] <nOStahl> any word on when they will do ubuntu for tablets ?
[14:56] <usererror> out of the many questions I have, the most immediate one is, will the images be for the international Galaxy Nexus only?  Or the GSM versions only?  Or all?  Because I have a Toro (VZW), and it'd be nice to know if I'll be waiting for images or if it'll be included in the initial release...
[14:57] <usererror> but I'm sure I'll find out soon enough?
[15:09] <ryansipes> usererror: I asked the same question, initially the image will be released for the GSM Galaxy Nexus
[15:10] <ryansipes> usererror: However, there appears to be much interest to port it to the other GN models, and after the image and source code are released this effort can begin.
[15:13] <usererror> :) ty ryansipes.. that is what I figured would happen, but it is good to know for sure
[15:13] <ryansipes> usererror: The response I got on the mailing list was: "The GSM model is the only one being targeted right now.  The OS may run on the other models, but it wouldn't be able to use the phone or 3G/4G data functionality.
[15:13] <ryansipes> usererror: So if it isn't your primary phone you could still play with it possibly.  Haha.
[15:14] <usererror> fun lol
[15:16] <ryansipes> Yeah, using a phone without the "phone" functionality doesn't seem all that enticing.
[15:16] <ryansipes> But if you just want to test your app or something it might not be all that bad.
[15:17] <ryansipes> And I'm sure it will only be a short time before someone ports the image to another phone, considering Ubuntu Phone OS can allegedly use Android drivers.
[15:19] <popey> thats what we're hoping ☺
[15:19] <popey> s/allegedly//
[15:19] <wastrel> i have a galaxy nexus ♥
[15:21] <ryansipes> popey: That is exciting if it can use them with relative ease.  I know many people who have older Android phones, and I bet Ubuntu Phone could breathe new life into them.
[15:22] <ravirdv_> having it on N9 would be great!
[15:23] <popey> I have no idea which phones would be capable of running it, that's what the community and people like xda-developers are for, they know this stuff ;)
[15:25] <ryansipes> popey: Yeah, I just figure without the java element thrown in there (as with Android), it will be able to run on phones with less capable hardware.
[15:26] <ryansipes> popey: Because it won't have to bother with the virtual machine that Android does.
[15:27] <ryansipes> ravirdv_: Yeah, I'm sure a lot of N9 owners would appreciate that.
[15:28] <ryansipes> ravirdv_: The N9's specs aren't that bad, it's not dual core like the Galaxy Nexus but it has the same amount of RAM
[15:59] <nOStahl> wish I could install ubuntu for phone on my iPhone 5
[15:59] <ubuntubhoy> LOL - no chance of that
[16:04] <nOStahl> it'd sure be nice
[16:53] <larsgk> mhall119: hi
[16:53] <mhall119> hi larsgk
[16:54] <larsgk> mhall119: I have been a bit behind on things as I just had a new baby.  I'm a bit uncertain on if we are already digging in code - or the designers need to do some polishing (or we are the designers)?
[16:55]  * larsgk I am Lars Knudsen, on the RSS Feeder app
[16:55] <mhall119> larsgk: the designs were done on Balsamiq, we haven't started coding yet, but would like to start on that soon
[16:55] <mhall119> I just pushed new bzr branches to each of the projects with an updated template
[16:55] <DanielDressler> has the ubuntu phone sdk changed at all? I installed it last night from the instructions on 12.04 but my qmlscene is in a different directory vs the tutorial. Find found two qmlscenes in /usr/bin/qmlscene
[16:55] <DanielDressler> /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/qt5/bin/qmlscene
[16:56] <mhall119> DanielDressler: yes, the switch from qt5-beta1 to qt5-proper PPA changed the install location, the tutorial hasn't been updated yet
[16:56] <larsgk> mhall119: ok - and when we start coding, do we then work in the master branch? (I did a small commit on a build error already - but don't know if you prefer things in a separate branch)
[16:57] <DanielDressler> is /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/qt5/bin/qmlscene the proper qt5 one?
[16:57] <mhall119> larsgk: the process will be to push to a separate branch, and then create a merge proposal for it in Launchpad
[16:57] <mhall119> DanielDressler: I think /usr/bin/qmlscene is the one you want, it will automatically pick the qt4 or qt5 version depending on your target qml
[16:57] <larsgk> the qt5-proper install screwed my 12.04/qt4 btw ;) .. and I am on a contract dependent on qt4.. oh well.. fixed it manually
[16:58] <DanielDressler> very nice. I have been using that one and it has been working but I thought that might just be by chance
[16:58] <mhall119> larsgk: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuPhone/CoreApps/DevelopmentGuide, specifically the sections "Using Bzr" and "Using Launchpad"
[16:58] <larsgk> mhall119: ok - I am new to launchpad/bzr - thanks for the links
[16:59] <mhall119> larsgk: jppiiroi1en where should he file a bug about conflicts between qt4 and qt5?
[16:59] <mhall119> larsgk: no problem, the whole page is all about developing these core apps, so worth reading before you get started
[17:00] <larsgk> mhall119: do we just do an update on the sdk package to get the pure QML2 version?
[17:00] <KevinWright> Hey ho Calendar App people!
[17:01] <mhall119> larsgk: no, you'll need to do a new checkout of the project branch
[17:01] <larsgk> mhall119: ok
[17:01] <mhall119> so bzr branch lp:ubuntu-rssreader-app ./new-template
[17:01] <larsgk> mhall119: thanks :)
[17:01] <rferrazz> KevinWright, i'm here!
[17:01] <mhall119> but the new template is very nice, provides the top-tabs and bottom-toolbar for you, just like the phone demo shows
[17:02] <larsgk> mhall119: sounds good :)  . o O (thanks Nokia - for the investment in Qt5/QML2) ;)
[17:04] <mhall119> KevinWright: is there an agenda doc or anything for this meeting?
[17:04] <KevinWright> mhall119: blueprint only
[17:04] <KevinWright> mhall119: and nothing in it!
[17:04] <KevinWright> mhall119: we need to fill it up
[17:04] <mhall119> that can be corrected :)
[17:05] <mhall119> links for those interested in following along:
[17:05] <mhall119> wiki: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuPhone/CoreApps/Calendar
[17:05] <mhall119> Blueprint: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu-calendar-app/+spec/initial-calendar-development
[17:07] <KevinWright> are Aleksandr, frank, Steven, Kunal, Mario B., or Mario Z. here?
[17:07] <KevinWright> frank == frank
[17:07]  * mariob is here
[17:07] <KevinWright> mariob: hey!
[17:07] <mariob> KevinWright: Hi
[17:07] <mhall119> hey mariob
[17:07] <mariob> mhall119: Hi
[17:07] <KevinWright> mhall119: thanks for pasting those links
[17:08] <mhall119> np
[17:08] <KevinWright> mariob, mhall119: let's wait a moment. maybe it will be a small and short chat
[17:08] <sunil_> KevinWright: Hi
[17:09] <mariob> KevinWright: np
[17:09] <KevinWright> sunil_: hi there
[17:09] <mhall119> frankencode are you here?
[17:09] <mariob> KevinWright: I'm not sure if you included Mario Z in the invitation mail
[17:09] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: did you have a chance to look at the resources?
[17:10] <KevinWright> mariob: maybe he was a later addition to the mailing list
[17:10] <mariob> KevinWright: Have browswd it quickly
[17:10] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: and have you been able to install the ubuntu-sdk + components?
[17:11] <mariob> no issues
[17:11] <KevinWright> mariob: excellent
[17:11] <sunil_> yap. just got the update
[17:11] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: have you have a chance to go through the tutorial at developer.ubuntu.com?
[17:12] <mariob> But I hvan't checkout the new stuff mhall119 mailed out
[17:12] <sunil_> yes
[17:12] <mariob> KevinWright: Yes
[17:12] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: awesome
[17:12] <mhall119> mariob: it's simplified version of what's in the tutorial
[17:12] <mhall119> just run "qmlscene calendar.qml"
[17:12] <mariob> mhall119: ok
[17:13] <mhall119> you should also be able to open the .qmlproject in QtCreator and run it from there
[17:13] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: so in the wiki link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuPhone/CoreApps/Calendar there should be a rough sketch of the plan
[17:14] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: but we need to fill in more detail
[17:14] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: and make some work items
[17:14] <mariob> KevinWright: sure
[17:14] <sunil_> KevinWright: let me check the plan
[17:14] <KevinWright> sunil_: np take your time
[17:14] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: so we should validate the user stories, functionality etc.
[17:15] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: it does not need to be perfect of course
[17:15] <frankencode> mhall119: yes
[17:15] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: we can add/update anytime
[17:15] <mhall119> frankencode: ah, good, calendar meeting time :)
[17:15] <sunil_> KevinWright:okey
[17:15] <KevinWright> hey frankencode
[17:15] <frankencode> hey
[17:15] <KevinWright> frankencode did you catch the earlier part of the discussion?
[17:16] <KevinWright> we didn't get so far into it yet
[17:16] <frankencode> i'm scanning it
[17:16] <KevinWright> frankencode, np
[17:16] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: anything you can think of to add to the functionality or use cases in the wiki
[17:16] <frankencode> i had an issue with the code template for the apps to work with qt5 on 13.04
[17:16] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: or just thoughts off the top of your head
[17:17] <KevinWright> frankencode: what was the issue
[17:17] <mhall119> frankencode: there's a new code template, just pushed this morning
[17:17] <larsgk> q: what is the difference between qt5-proper and Qt5.0.x from Troll...Nok..Digia?
[17:18] <mhall119> jppiiroi1en: Mirv: ^^ can either of you answer that?
[17:18] <frankencode> the hack with setting the app name went infunctional
[17:18] <KevinWright> mhall119: do we have designs for mariob, sunil_, frankencode
[17:18] <sunil_> KevinWright:okey, will send them to you
[17:18] <frankencode> rootObject() vs rootItem() i think
[17:18] <KevinWright> sunil_ or you can mention them here
[17:18] <mhall119> KevinWright: only the Balsamiq ones linked to from the wiki
[17:18] <KevinWright> mhall119: better than nothing!
[17:18] <frankencode> there are some good use cases on myalsamiq
[17:19] <frankencode> i looked at it yesterday
[17:19] <mhall119> frankencode: the new template is 100% QML
[17:19] <sunil_> KevinWright: are we targeting specfically for Phones.
[17:19] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: should we write up the use cases based on what is in balsamiq
[17:19] <frankencode> real artists need a white sheet of paper;)
[17:19] <KevinWright> sunil_ yes
[17:19] <sunil_> KevinWright: okey
[17:20] <mariob> KevinWright: sure
[17:20] <sunil_> KevinWright: is the calender will be online or offline only
[17:20] <frankencode> i heard the strategy is to go feature phone first
[17:20] <mariob> KevinWright: but there's already a couple of stories on the wiki, right?
[17:20] <frankencode> not sure if it holds true
[17:20] <KevinWright> sunil_ at least offline, also online would be nice
[17:21] <KevinWright> mariob: yes I wrote those up...they are not set in stone
[17:21] <mhall119> frankencode: the feature phone requirements are a subset of the smartphone requirements, so it makes sense we'll have it first
[17:21] <KevinWright> mariob: but if they are good enough then that is fine
[17:21] <sunil_> KevinWright: means only with U1 not XChange or GCal
[17:21] <mariob> KevinWright: no, but their a good starting point
[17:21] <frankencode> mhall119: that's what i was thinking
[17:22] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: I suspect supporting U1 should be must have if we can also do online
[17:22] <frankencode> U1?
[17:22] <mhall119> Ubuntu One
[17:22] <mhall119> our cloud-syncing service
[17:22] <frankencode> ahh
[17:22] <frankencode> clear
[17:23] <frankencode> is it xml or json, api wise?
[17:23] <sunil_> KevinWright: okey
[17:23] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode but I think the first stage is to get a local app
[17:23] <sunil_> KevinWright: agree
[17:23] <mariob> KevinWright: Should we use QOrganizer? That would make it transparent w/ plugins, right?
[17:23] <mhall119> frankencode: I'm not sure, but the info should be here: https://one.ubuntu.com/developer/
[17:23] <frankencode> ok
[17:24] <mariob> KevinWright: sorry, QtOrganizer from the mobility project
[17:24] <KevinWright> mariob: Yep I knew what you meant
[17:24] <KevinWright> mariob: although I'm not familiar with the whol API
[17:24] <KevinWright> whole
[17:24] <frankencode> sunil_, mariob: i experimented already with the month view
[17:25] <mariob> KevinWright: There's already QML bindings etc
[17:25] <KevinWright> frankencode: is it easy to work with?
[17:25] <frankencode> tried a nice flicking with month-wise snapping, but figured it feels crappy...
[17:25] <KevinWright> mariob: that's what we need
[17:26] <frankencode> KevinWright: easy to work with what?
[17:26] <jppiiroi1en> mhall119: larsgk: packaging at least
[17:26] <KevinWright> frankencode: sorry I might have misunderstood what you said earlier
[17:27] <larsgk> mariob: about the stuff from mobility ... in what state is it?
[17:27] <KevinWright> frankencode: ignoer my commment
[17:27] <KevinWright> ignore
[17:27] <larsgk> mariob: it was my impression that the mobility stuff was not exactly on par with core qt
[17:27] <mariob> larsgk: Not sure, maybe we can check w/ digia
[17:27] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: so what are some of the first steps we need
[17:27] <mariob> larsgk: Not all of the modules
[17:28] <sunil_> i suggest we start from goundup make it simple to use. then existing onces
[17:28] <frankencode> i tried qtpim, but couldn't make it compile with qt5;)
[17:28] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: any extra information needed at this stage or just start to make work items?
[17:28] <larsgk> mariob: ok .. because I remember some that were not that ...great ;) .. but it could be that the organizer is (didn't work with that one)
[17:28] <mhall119> +1 to sunil_'s idea, start simple just to get started
[17:28] <sunil_> KevinWright: designer input !
[17:29] <mariob> larsgk: But I'm sure they better than starting from scratch :)
[17:29] <KevinWright> sunil_ +1
[17:29] <mariob> KevinWright: I'd go for creating the UI
[17:29] <frankencode> i'm on go, too
[17:29] <larsgk> mariob: ;)
[17:29] <mhall119> sunil_: anything specific you want from the designers?
[17:30] <frankencode> my next work item, is to try another month view, look at the balsamiq input
[17:30] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: so someone want to take care of another view?
[17:30] <DanielDressler> I'm filling out the contributer aggreement and it is asking for "Canonical Project Manager or contact". Who should i put there?
[17:31] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_: day? week? view
[17:31] <mhall119> DanielDressler: put Kevin Wright
[17:31] <DanielDressler> mhall119: thank you
[17:31] <mhall119> np
[17:31] <mariob> KevinWright: I can take a look at the day view
[17:31] <KevinWright> mariob: OK
[17:31] <KevinWright> sunil_ you OK with day view?
[17:32] <sunil_> yes. actually if rather we start by coding . if we get designer to guide us then the day/week/month views will be uniform. just a suggestion
[17:32] <sunil_> sure
[17:32] <sunil_> day_view is okey with me
[17:32] <frankencode> i tried already to get the month view in ubuntu shapes
[17:33] <frankencode> but it looks cluttered
[17:33] <mariob> KevinWright: Should I do the edit view then since sunil_ is doing the day view?
[17:33] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: design input is of course needed but we can still work on the models for each view
[17:33] <frankencode> ultimatly i think the design will look not much different than a calendar on the wall
[17:33] <KevinWright> mariob: whoops
[17:33] <frankencode> of course in full ubuntu fidelity
[17:33] <mariob> KevinWright: np for me
[17:33] <KevinWright> mariob: sorry my mistake I should have said week to sunil_
[17:34] <sunil_> either one is fine with me
[17:34] <mariob> KevinWright: I can take Week since I like Week view :)
[17:34] <frankencode> mariob, sunil_: you are more into c++ or qml/js?
[17:34] <KevinWright> mariob: sure that sounds good, sorry for that mistake :)
[17:34] <j-b> Can we develop totally natively or do we need qml?
[17:34] <sunil_> mariob: you preference
[17:34] <DanielDressler> will ubuntu phone have something similar to android's intents?
[17:34] <mariob> frankencode: I like QML :) but I do C++ too
[17:34] <mariob> sunil_: Ok, I'll take the week view  then :)
[17:34] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: we want to encourage a very QML centric approach as much as possible
[17:34] <mhall119> DanielDressler: not yet, no
[17:34] <sunil_> lot of C++ and 1 year QML
[17:35] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: as in declarative heavy
[17:35] <frankencode> KevinWrigt: +1
[17:35] <mariob> KevinWright: Lot's of QML last 2 years, less C++
[17:35] <sunil_> KevinWright: is fun to work
[17:35] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: so push as much in that direction as possible
[17:35] <mariob> KevinWright: Sounds good
[17:36] <sunil_> KevinWright: Okey
[17:36] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: use C++ in a plugin if you need to
[17:36] <frankencode> mariob, sunil_: please ignore the exiting MonthModel.cpp, it's just an early prototype, i'm in rewrite today
[17:36] <DanielDressler> mhall119: is it on the roadmap. I ask because I am interested in the file manager since coming from android ever app goes and reimplements a file browser. If ubuntu phone will ship with a file browser by default then that could mean great propress vs the current android situation
[17:36] <DanielDressler> sorry I missed at least one '?'
[17:37] <mariob> KevinWright: That's why I though QtOrganizer would be good since it already have QML bindings, but it might be too heavy, not sure
[17:37] <sunil_> KevinWright: just one question. Is the UbuntuPhone Components only used .. or can use others?
[17:37] <mariob> KevinWright: But I can't say in what state the module is in Qt5
[17:37] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: for the UI itself please use the Ubuntu components
[17:38] <mhall119> DanielDressler: I don't know if it's on the roadmap yet
[17:38] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: but other available plugins we caan utilize for other functions
[17:38] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: if there is something missing from Ubuntu components for the UI don't be afraid to bring it up
[17:38] <wastrel> i did the currency converter tutorial what do i do next
[17:38] <sunil_> mariob: i donot suggest qOrganizer as more desktop app look
[17:39] <KevinWright> mariob: I'm not sure either
[17:39] <KevinWright> mariob: we can and should check
[17:39] <mariob> sunil_: no not qOrganizer, but QtOrganizer, just an API: http://doc.qt.digia.com/qtmobility/qtorganizer.html
[17:39] <sunil_> KevinWright : Okey.
[17:40] <KevinWright> mariob: could you take an action to check that API?
[17:40] <frankencode> sunil_, mariob: you can get the source for the ubuntu components from   lp:ubuntu-ui-toolkit
[17:40] <mariob> KevinWright: Sure, I can check how the QML bindings look like and maybe write a small example app
[17:40] <KevinWright> mariob: great!
[17:40] <sunil_> mariob: oops. my bad
[17:41] <mariob> sunil_: np :) I also got lite confused when searching for the module
[17:41] <frankencode> i think to that ui-toolkit project we can also place feature requests
[17:41] <frankencode> ultimatly a date picker will be needed there...
[17:42] <sunil_> frankencode: yes
[17:42] <mariob> frankencode: That could actually be as simple as WP or BB10 do it, List view with three columns :)
[17:42] <frankencode> qtorganizer: oh, that's a fat api already
[17:43] <larsgk> mariob: didn't all things 'mobility' sortof got put on the shelf when they closed down brisbane?
[17:43] <mariob> Yep, but it supports everything you need for PIM :)
[17:43] <frankencode> mariob: yea, have get that bb10 sim back running again
[17:43] <KevinWright> larsgk: somewhat yes
[17:44] <KevinWright> larsgk: but for some modules it is only temporary
[17:44] <mariob> larsgk: The question is if we should maintain the module or start developing one ourself...
[17:44] <frankencode> larsgk: there are still some ex trolls working on mobility for bb10 here in munich
[17:44] <frankencode> difficult to kill qt;)
[17:44] <larsgk> frankencode: cool :) ... I failed to deliver an app within the timeframe... stuck with the dev device (cool though)
[17:44] <KevinWright> frankencode: it is indeed
[17:45] <mariob> larsgk: KevinWright frankencode and I'd be supprised if Jolla doesn't use it...
[17:45] <frankencode> i surely will have a look at it
[17:45] <larsgk> frankencode: Qt is excellent - using it for all current projects .. qtmobility not so much
[17:45] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode should we wrap up the official part of the meeting? I think we have a good start
[17:45] <mariob> larsgk: qtmobility didn't get the love it deserved :)
[17:46] <mariob> KevinWright: Yes
[17:46] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: feel free to continue talking of course
[17:46] <sunil_> larsgk: can't agree more... Qt is great ..but .. qtmobility is not
[17:47] <mariob> KevinWright, sunil_ , larsgk , frankencode I have to leave but I'll take a look at the QtOrganizer stuff and see if it works w/ Qt5 and create a small example app
[17:47] <larsgk> sunil_: mariob: I especially love the plugin framework - like with qtsensors (soon to come back, I hope)
[17:47] <KevinWright> mariob: thanks and talk to you soon!
[17:47] <mariob> larsgk: Yes, Qt made by devs for devs :)
[17:47] <sunil_> KevinWright: sure. will update the progress on day_view soon
[17:47] <mariob> KevinWright: Thanks bye
[17:48] <larsgk> sunil_: again - thanking Nokia for investing in Qt5 .. I really hope it manages to stay as open under Digia
[17:48] <frankencode> KevinWright: cu, thx
[17:48] <KevinWright> mariob, sunil_, frankencode: thanks all!
[17:48] <larsgk> KevinWright and all: thanks for now
[17:49] <sunil_> KevinWright: thanks. bye
[17:49] <larsgk> :)
[17:49] <KevinWright> larsgk: and thanks to you too
[17:49] <larsgk> ;)
[17:50] <sunil_> larsgk: i feel nokia dragged Qt to 5 years back ... just by putting name with it
[17:50] <frals> hmm, been browsing through the docs a bit from a dev perspective.. is there any system diagram that shows all the components that are suppose to be in the os?
[17:51] <sunil_> frals: searching for the same too.
[17:51] <KevinWright> frals: the UI components? or other app dev support?
[17:51] <j-b> frals: same here.
[17:51] <j-b> And what we are allowed to use and not as a dev
[17:51] <sunil_> UI components.
[17:51] <frals> KevinWright: everything except UI components, more or less, which libs are available and stuff like that
[17:52] <j-b> Yep. Anything not Qt related
[17:52] <frals> yeah
[17:53] <j-b> Can I use libc? glib? PA? OpenGL? Xv? xcb? D-Bus?
[17:55] <larsgk> sunil_: actuall - Nokia made sure Qt got ready for mobile
[17:55] <larsgk> sunil_: don't know if you worked there?
[17:56] <frals> larsgk: guess theres quite a few ex-nokians here ;)
[17:56] <KevinWright> larsgk, sunil_: Nokia also make Qt more open that it was before under Trolltech
[17:56] <sunil_> larsgk: m not ex-nokian.
[17:56] <larsgk> sunil_: correcting myself... Nokia made sure (with money and pressure - to put on actual phones) that Qt got ready for mobile
[17:56] <daliusd> Hi
[17:57] <KevinWright> daliusd: hey there
[17:57] <larsgk> sunil_: Personally, I am in this to do my part for Ubuntu Phone to become what Nokia failed to continue
[17:57] <j-b> frals: is you ever find this info, can you ping me ? :)
[17:59] <frals> j-b: sure
[17:59] <j-b> frals: thx
[17:59] <sunil_> for me  Canonical helped Qt more then Nokia by using it in day-to-day products .. not some prototypes. Anyway that is just me.
[17:59] <frankencode> larsgk: i think there is no choice, some open linux distro has to make it into the future, where there will be mobile computing devices only
[18:00] <sunil_> larsgk: appreciate it.
[18:01] <frals> KevinWright: i assume the clock app intro meeting-thingy will be in this chan since you didnt mention any other info in the mail, right? :)
[18:01] <daliusd> sunil_: Qt is used on Symbian and MeeGo devices daily as well ;-)
[18:01] <daliusd> Yep time for meeting
[18:01] <kuifei> clock app things is expected here?
[18:01] <KevinWright> frals: my email was confusing
[18:02] <frals> kuifei: i think so :)
[18:03] <sunil_> larsgk KevinWright: Thanks guys. See you soon again. Bye
[18:03] <larsgk> sunil_: thanks - ttyl
[18:03] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei are here for the clock app because of a mistake I made
[18:04] <daliusd> KevinWright, and I'm here for calc app :)
[18:04] <KevinWright> and daliusd, rferraz for calculator
[18:04] <larsgk> any RSS Feed Reader app guys here?
[18:04] <KevinWright> I double booked, yikes :) sorry every one
[18:04] <daliusd> KevinWright, no problem
[18:04] <kuifei> KevinWright, mistake?
[18:04] <KevinWright> kuifei my mistake
[18:05] <KevinWright> kuifei: I accidentally asked two groups to meet at the same time
[18:05] <KevinWright> no problem though
[18:05] <KevinWright> I have some general questions for all
[18:05] <kuifei> sure
[18:06] <KevinWright> kuifei, daluisd, larsgk, frals, rferraz: did you have a chance to see all the docs?
[18:06] <daliusd> Yes
[18:06] <rferrazz> yes
[18:06] <KevinWright> mhall119: can you help me with links for calculator, rss feed, and clock?
[18:06] <mhall119> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuPhone/CoreApps/ has all the app links at the top
[18:06] <mhall119> each app page has a blueprint link
[18:07] <kuifei> tutorial, guidelines, and the code committed, what else?
[18:07] <larsgk> KevinWright: I need to read up on launchpad (general), process, etc. There wasn't much specific to the rss reader
[18:07] <frals> KevinWright: ive seen some of the docs - ie the getting started stuff, but im looking for (as i mentioned earlier before this meeting) system overview docs
[18:07] <KevinWright> kuifei: there are specific project details at the links from mhall119
[18:08] <KevinWright> larsgk: that's my action item to provide a summary
[18:08] <kuifei> sure, I've read them through.
[18:09] <KevinWright> larsgk: there should be some existing launchpad docs I can point you to
[18:09] <daliusd> So design is final?
[18:09] <larsgk> btw, do you store an offline version of this channel?
[18:09] <kuifei> it's quite simple for the clock app
[18:10] <larsgk> KevinWright: ok - more than the rss blueprint/project page?
[18:10] <KevinWright> daliusd: I don't believe we have final designs. mhall119
[18:10] <mhall119> only what's in balsamiq
[18:10] <KevinWright> larsgk: not sure about offline - mhall119 again
[18:10] <mhall119> and those aren't mandatory designs
[18:11] <mhall119> larsgk: what do you mean an offline version?
[18:11] <larsgk> KevinWright: there were some initial designs on balsamiq - but I am sure there will be changes as we try our own medicine
[18:11] <KevinWright> larsgk: yes
[18:11] <larsgk> mhall119: just an irc log for those who didn't buy an offline service yet (me ;))
[18:11] <KevinWright> larsgk: so maybe concentrating on the backend functionality first will be easier
[18:12] <mhall119> larsgk: they should be on http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/
[18:12] <KevinWright> frals: at the moment what is available online is the most we have
[18:12] <larsgk> mhall119: cool - thanks
[18:12] <KevinWright> frals: more to come soon
[18:12] <mhall119> larsgk: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2013/02/12/%23ubuntu-phone.txt for today's
[18:13] <larsgk> mhall119: just checked - nice to know, thanks!
[18:13] <frals> KevinWright: ok, because its kinda important to have so we can scope out the work for clock app - ie how much of the alarm functionality will we have to implement and how much is provided by underlying components, e.g. cron or timed
[18:13] <daliusd> larsgk: change .txt to .html for nicer view (if that's important)
[18:14] <larsgk> frals: and when the phone is 'off' .. it should still wake up and ring
[18:14] <larsgk> frals: I guess ;)
[18:15] <frals> larsgk: yeah, theres quite a few cases to consider, which i dont think is in scope of the clock app... but i might be wrong :)
[18:15] <KevinWright> frals: we can do things iteratively. Must have basic clock that simply tells time as a first step. Then map out the second wave of features
[18:16] <KevinWright> frals: support for alarms as suggested. I suspect a service would be needed
[18:16] <frals> KevinWright: ok - the alarm stuff is marked as must. either way if its something clock team is responsible for its quite a huge task and something that needs to be started asap
[18:17] <kuifei> or, do we really need it to tell time? time is always in the indicator, right?
[18:17] <frals> ... and need to find the people in other teams that need similar functionality (eg calendar will need same stuff) and make sure it fits
[18:18] <larsgk> KevinWright: do you know if there will be an RSS meeting today? - else, I gotta run
[18:18] <KevinWright> frals: good point
[18:18] <KevinWright> larsgk: let's sync tomorrow
[18:18] <larsgk> KevinWright: ok - thanks .. ttyl
[18:18] <KevinWright> larsgk: ttyl
[18:19] <KevinWright> frals: would it make sense then to join forces with the calendar team on those common bits?
[18:20] <frals> KevinWright: yeah... is there some kind of uber architect that decides what libs get to be in the system etc?
[18:20] <frals> because like... a framework like the one for reminders/alarms is kinda important that it works and you know... doesnt suck ;)
[18:21] <KevinWright> frals: let me follow up with you on the deeper bits later
[18:21] <mhall119> can I get a quick show of hands, who is here for the Clock app?
[18:21] <frals> KevinWright: sure
[18:21] <frals> o/
[18:21] <KevinWright> frals and kuifei
[18:22] <mhall119> ok, and who is here for Calculator?
[18:22] <rferrazz> me
[18:22] <daliusd> and me
[18:22] <mhall119> ok, in case you guys aren't aware, there was a new trunk branch pushed to the projects this morning
[18:23] <mhall119> this contains new template code that is 100% QML, using new SDK components
[18:23] <daliusd> that's good :)
[18:23] <mhall119> so if you have an old branch that you're working on, you'll need to get this new one
[18:23] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: should we brainstorm the basic features
[18:23] <mhall119> we have some documentation on the development process here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuPhone/CoreApps/DevelopmentGuide
[18:23] <wastrel> this would appear to be a scheduled event
[18:24] <mhall119> that includes how to submit your changes as merge proposals back to the trunk branch
[18:24] <DanielDressler> for working with launchpad and the coreapps: do I need to be a member of the app's team to push to a new branch and propose for merging?
[18:24] <rferrazz> nice
[18:24] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: for the clock app
[18:24] <mhall119> DanielDressler: you need to be a member to commit to trunk, but anybody can submit a branch for a merge proposal
[18:24] <DanielDressler> nice thank you
[18:24] <mhall119> even team members should submit changes as a merge proposal that gets reviewed by someone else on the tema
[18:25] <kuifei> sure
[18:25] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: starting with a couple of basic things we can make a work item or two for
[18:25] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: maybe UI centric at first
[18:25] <rferrazz> so we can start coding (for calculator backend)
[18:25] <frals> KevinWright: sure, but i really want to limit the scope of the clock app so we know how much/little work there is to do as well
[18:25] <KevinWright> rferrazz: yes, throw out some ideas for that would be great
[18:25] <KevinWright> frals: agreed
[18:26] <frals> KevinWright, kuifei: ill start... show local time. ;-)
[18:26] <KevinWright> frals: +1
[18:26] <KevinWright> frals: change time zone
[18:26] <daliusd> rferrazz: I think we can do frontend as well. What's your vision for backend?
[18:26] <kuifei> good idea
[18:26] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: set alarm
[18:26] <frals> (KevinWright: are you taking meeting minutes and stuff?)
[18:27] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: I will make the minutes and record action items
[18:27] <kuifei> setting alarms should be the core
[18:27] <frals> KevinWright: is changing time zone something for the clock app, or for the system settings? i think we should provide a shortcut to the system settings to change timezone/region
[18:27] <rferrazz> thinking of parsing the calculation string (at least for scientific mode)
[18:28] <mhall119> frals: for system settings I would think ,and a shortcut would be good, but all of that can wait until the phone code itself is released
[18:28] <KevinWright> frals: yes, I was just looking at my andoid alarm app and it has a world clock
[18:28] <frals> KevinWright, kuifei: +1 for setting alarms (need info from KevinWright on how much of actual scheduling of alarm etc is implemented by us/vs lower level platform stuff)
[18:28] <daliusd> rferrazz, OK. I think we can parse strings in non scientific mode as well
[18:28] <rferrazz> daliusd, is there any final design for the frontend?
[18:28] <kuifei> we need think about the division between the clock/alarm app and the system settings
[18:29] <daliusd> rferrazz, mhall119 said that there might be never exist final one :)
[18:29] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: we can work on the UI for the alarm setting without knowing the deeper bits at first I imagine, at least to some degree
[18:29] <frals> kuifei: +1, i think showing the current local time (maybe additional optional tz as well) is a good starting point, and leave changing to system settings
[18:30] <mhall119> agreed
[18:30] <rferrazz> daliusd: ok, so we can pick the better ideas out from balsamiq and make our calculator
[18:30] <daliusd> rferrazz: I agree :-)
[18:31] <kuifei> a clock showing the current time, but not editable; then a list of alarms bellow this clock
[18:31] <daliusd> rferrazz: what we will use for calculations? JavaScript (V8 engine) or C++?
[18:31] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: do we have enough info for creating the set alarm view?
[18:31] <rferrazz> daliusd, i thnk c++ is a better choice
[18:31] <mhall119> daliusd: QML+Javascript is the preferred
[18:32] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: I mean enough design info
[18:32] <mhall119> unless there's a very good reason for using C++
[18:32] <frals> KevinWright, kuifei: depends how complicated we want the recurrency rules for the alarm view ;-)
[18:32] <KevinWright> frals: simple
[18:32] <kuifei> no, i didn't find any UI design for clock app
[18:32] <KevinWright> frals: I mean keep it simple
[18:32] <frals> KevinWright, kuifei: the only designs i found were https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/Clock+and+Weather+App but it seems... mixed up with weather
[18:32] <daliusd> mhall119, C++ might be slightly faster for math while V8 engine proved to be quite fast
[18:33] <KevinWright> mhall119: any idea about what frals just mentioned about designs?
[18:33] <DanielDressler> I would be surprised is performance proved an issue with the clock app
[18:33] <kuifei> thanks frals, for the link
[18:33] <rferrazz> daliusd, mhall119: ok, we can start with javascript
[18:33] <daliusd> DanielDressler, there are two meetings going on here :-) performance might be issue for calc app
[18:34] <KevinWright> daliusd: that's my fault
[18:34] <daliusd> OK. JavaScript :)
[18:34] <DanielDressler> daliusd: ah sorry I really am new
[18:35] <daliusd> rferrazz: OK I will try to do something with frontend then
[18:35] <DanielDressler> so does that mean there will be a meeting for the file manaer?
[18:35] <KevinWright> dmd, I'll send you a message later about it
[18:36] <dmd> KevinWright: thank you
[18:36] <kuifei> frals, i think we could start the alarm based on the UI design
[18:36] <frals> kuifei: yeah, should be doable
[18:37] <kuifei> other features about clock/alarms, indicator on the top bar, indicator on the lock screen, ...
[18:37] <frals> hmm, am i stupid or is there no search function on mybalsamiq? finding more clock designs now... theres a whole bunch of them
[18:37] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: so who might like to take care of the add/edit alarm view?
[18:37] <daliusd> rferrazz: does it look like a plan?
[18:38] <daliusd> rferrazz: I think it would be nice to have unit-tests for backend as well. Not sure how however :)
[18:38] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei:and I assume a view that shows current alarms already set
[18:38] <frals> kuifei, KevinWright: https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/ClockAlarmApp-DominicRichardsonMatthewStevens https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/Clock+-+Alarms+-+Timer+-+Stopwatch+%285th+idea%29
[18:38] <rferrazz> daliusd,yes but first we need to place in a basic structure
[18:39] <frals> KevinWright: should we just pick one of the designs we like and start working from that or how does this work? :)
[18:39] <daliusd> It might be possible that it is already in place
[18:39] <daliusd> at least older version had structure
[18:39] <KevinWright> daliusd, rferrazz: I didn't forget you guys but you look like you are taking care of business :)
[18:39] <KevinWright> frals: I think that sounds like a plan
[18:40] <rferrazz> daliusd: like placing the backend bones before start writing the frontend
[18:40] <kuifei> so which one should we take?
[18:41] <daliusd> rferrazz: frame is in place already http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-calculator-dev/ubuntu-calculator-app/trunk/files
[18:41] <frals> kuifei: im going through mybalsamiq to check if i can find more clock mockups atm
[18:41] <daliusd> rferrazz: I believe backend will be in *.js file anyway
[18:41] <frals> kuifei, KevinWright: we should probably sync up the ui for creating alarm with the one calendar creates for setting a reminder
[18:42] <daliusd> rferrazz: initially you can place file in the same folder as it is. Later we will move around everything if there will be need.
[18:42] <mhall119> KevinWright: sorry, what was that about design?
[18:42] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: yes I agree syncing with the calendar
[18:43] <daliusd> rferrazz: and I think I have idea for unit-tests as well. We could create other qml-app that will simply run and lists tests in ListView
[18:43] <KevinWright> mhall119: why clock and weather are mixed together at the link above ... I'm not familiar with balsamiq
[18:43] <rferrazz> daliusd: ok so i'll start with the backend
[18:44] <daliusd> rferraz: OK. I think that's it for today unless Kevin has something to add
[18:44] <kuifei> frals, KevinWright: I think I'll just trying to implement the UIs in the first link
[18:44] <daliusd> KevinWright: do you have anything else to say for us?
[18:44] <frals> kuifei, KevinWright: https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/Clock+-+Timer+-+Stopwatch+-+Alarms https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/Clock+and+Weather+App https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/Clock+-+Countdown+-+Stopwatch
[18:44] <frals> kuifei, KevinWright: https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/ClockAlarmApp-DominicRichardsonMatthewStevens https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/Clock+-+Alarms+-+Timer+-+Stopwatch+%285th+idea%29
[18:45] <frals> kuifei, KevinWright: so we got 5 different proposals now - and now clue how they align with calendars work on reminders :)
[18:45] <KevinWright> daliusd: sounds like you two have a plan hatched
[18:45] <mhall119> KevinWright: it doesn't look like we have any clock mockups linked to the wiki
[18:45] <rferrazz> daliusd, sounds good
[18:45] <mhall119> frals: can you add those links to the wiki page for the clock?
[18:45] <mhall119> KevinWright: which link has the mockups mixedup?
[18:45] <KevinWright> daliusd, rferrazz: I can make some meeting notes from the irc channel and send then to you to later to validate the plan
[18:46] <frals> mhall119: sure
[18:46] <mhall119> thanks frals
[18:46] <KevinWright> https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/Clock+and+Weather+App
[18:46] <daliusd> KevinWright: OK
[18:46] <rferrazz> daliusd, KevinWright: sure!
[18:46] <KevinWright>  daliusd, rferrazz: apologies for making it confusing with two discussions
[18:46] <daliusd> rferrazz: let's work ;-) Bye for now
[18:46] <mhall119> KevinWright: looks like one person did them both together, instead of separately
[18:47] <rferrazz> daliusd: bye :-)
[18:47] <mhall119> not a big deal, they can be linked to from both clock and weather wiki pages
[18:48] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: should we make an action item to decide on a specific design
[18:48] <frals> KevinWright, kuifei: yes, and it should align with calendars reminder design (at least for alarms)
[18:49] <kuifei> KevinWright: I think so.
[18:49] <kuifei> i like this one very much, https://ubuntu.mybalsamiq.com/projects/ubuntuphonecoreapps/Clock+-+Alarms+-+Timer+-+Stopwatch+%285th+idea%29
[18:50] <KevinWright> kuifei: I like that one too. fral, what do you think?
[18:50] <KevinWright> frals what do you think
[18:50] <frals> KevinWright: and we also need an action item to get a system level overview of whats available for e.g. reminders/alarms
[18:51] <KevinWright> frals: that one is mine
[18:51] <frals> kuifei, KevinWright: looks alright. i *hate* the way its designed to pick time there (coming from N9 which has the best time picker ever ;))
[18:51] <KevinWright> frals: I'll have to charge my n9 battery and take a look
[18:51] <KevinWright> frals: have not turned it on in a while
[18:52] <frals> KevinWright, kuifei: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XFOHc5z_fCU
[18:53] <KevinWright> frals: no I remember
[18:53] <KevinWright> frals: you are right
[18:54] <KevinWright> frals: even just the plain analogue clock is sweet
[18:54] <frals> KevinWright, kuifei: if we can incorporate a timepicker like the youtube link the design kuifei linked works for me ;)
[18:55] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: that sounds like a plan to me
[18:55] <kuifei> cool
[18:55] <frals> KevinWright: yeah, the design team on the n9 was ace
[18:56] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: OK so since timepicker is up in the air, what specific area would each of you look into out of that design?
[18:56] <kuifei> the video makes me miss my lost N9 again.
[18:56] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: I see 4 views
[18:56] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: clock, alarms, stopwatch, timer
[18:57] <frals> KevinWright, kuifei: i could start with the main clock view i guess -- and when the rest of our team shows up its easy to split in to components
[18:57] <kuifei> I may try the clock first
[18:58] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: that's two for clock
[18:58] <frals> np, i can start on the alarms view instead then
[18:58] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: ok that works
[18:58] <KevinWright> kuifei for clock and frals for alarm view
[18:58] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: done
[18:58] <frals> since we have something like 5 (or smth) more team members i guess we will get plenty of help anyway ;)
[18:59] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: I'll type up meeting notes and send them out to the whole team
[18:59] <KevinWright> frals: yup
[18:59] <ajalkane> this might be nice start for timepicker like N9: https://gitorious.org/harmattan-timepicker/harmattan-timepicker/blobs/master/TimePicker.qml
[18:59] <kuifei> thanks.
[19:00] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: alright, thanks for the great meeting, and sorry for the confusion earlier on
[19:00] <frals> bah the ubuntu wiki hates me with a passion, cant update the clockapp page
[19:00] <frals> KevinWright: add an action to update the wiki page with selected design we start with and links to the other designs
[19:00] <KevinWright> mhall119, can frals update the wiki page or does something special need to happen first?
[19:01] <KevinWright> frals: will do
[19:01] <mhall119> nope, anybody can update the wiki
[19:01] <frals> getting a 500 internal server error when signing in
[19:01] <mhall119> except when it fails
[19:01] <mhall119> :(
[19:02] <kuifei> :)
[19:03] <KevinWright> frals, kuifei: thanks again guys. chat with you soon. Cheers!
[19:03] <frals> KevinWright, kuifei: cheers, laters
[19:03] <dmd> does any one have an idea where ubuntu sticks nautilus's folder icon? I am searching /usr/share/icons but I'm going a bit crazy
[19:03] <kuifei> KevinWright, frals: Cheers!
[19:04] <mhall119> dmd: they are determined by the icon theme the user has chosen
[19:04] <mhall119> I think the default is still Humanity
[19:04] <dmd> thank you that does narrow my search
[19:05] <mhall119> dmd: why?
[19:05] <wastrel> /usr/share/icons/Humanity/places/48/gnome-folder.svg
[19:05] <dmd> I want to throw together a prototype of the file manager
[19:06] <dmd> wastrel: Thank you!
[19:06] <mhall119> you should use icon names, not paths to files, so they will change appropriately with the icon theme
[19:06] <dmd> oh that does sound like a good idea
[19:06] <wastrel> /usr/share/icons/Humanity/places/48/stock_folder.svg seems to be the same
[19:06] <mhall119> I think QML will do the proper icon lookup for you
[19:06] <dmd> now I need to figure that out
[19:06] <mhall119> try just using "stock_folder" or something like that for the icon
[19:07] <mhall119> dmd: see http://standards.freedesktop.org/icon-naming-spec/icon-naming-spec-latest.html for the standard naming conventions
[19:08] <dmd> nice
[19:08] <mhall119> bzoltan: jppiiroi1en: can you guys confirm that QML support this for icons?
[19:09] <dmd> the toolbars.qml is using "iconSource: Qt.resolvedUrl(filename)" is that about what I should use?
[19:09] <mhall119> dmd: can you give me a link to that file?
[19:09] <dmd> it is from the example use app
[19:09] <dmd> sec
[19:10] <dmd> /usr/lib/qt-components-ubuntu/demos/Toolbars.qml
[19:11] <frals> KevinWright, mhall119: the wiki signs me out everytime i get to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuPhone/CoreApps/Clock, if either of you could update the page with the design instead of me i'd be grateful
[19:12] <KevinWright> frals: I'll take care of it sometime in the next 12-24 hours
[19:12] <frals> KevinWright: cheers
[19:12] <mhall119> dmd: ah, those appear to be using images local to the application, not system-wide icons determined by the user's icon theme
[19:12] <KevinWright> frals: (or maybe less)
[19:12] <mhall119> frals: have you tried shift-refreshing to see if it's maybe just giving you a cached page?
[19:13] <frals> mhall119: yeah, no luck still :(
[19:13] <mhall119> bzoltan: jppiiroi1en: Mirv: can someone help frals with this?
[19:14] <mhall119> frals: those guys are all UTC+1 or +2 I think, so they may not be online anymore
[19:14] <frals> no worries, ill try again tomorrow - could be some delay because i had to approve wiki access to my account info or some crap on my end -- have to go afk now
[19:14] <frals> gnite all
[19:16] <dmd> mhall119: I am very new to qml. How should I get the folder icon through the proper method?
[19:16] <mhall119> dmd: I'm very new to QML as well, so I don't know exactly
[19:17] <dmd> ok then hacky solution time: copy&paste
[19:20] <dmd> I must say that qml with its json basis is much nicer than android's xml
[19:21] <ajalkane> dmd: depends on how Ubuntu has implemented image provider. See: http://doc.qt.digia.com/stable/qdeclarativeimageprovider.html
[19:22] <dmd> ajalkane: thank you
[20:20] <wastrel> so was that burst of activity a regularly scheduled thing?
[20:20] <dmd> I think they were having a meeting
[20:20] <dmd> for the calender and then the calculator
[20:21] <dmd> oh maybe dmd will not work as a nick
[20:33] <dmd> does qml have something like css's classes?
[20:34] <dmd> Is there a way make an element inherit a style? for example margins
[20:43] <ajalkane> dmd: Ubuntu implements something like CSS styles for QML but I don't know enough about them yet. In traditional QML you create components by composition instead of inheritance
[20:44] <dmd> sorry inheritance is by most chances going to be the wrong word
[20:44] <dmd> any idea of any examples for the ubntu styles?
[20:46] <ajalkane> dmd: see if this gives you some ideas: http://developer.ubuntu.com/api/ubuntu-12.10/qml/mobile/theming-components.html
[20:46] <dmd> thank you!
[20:46] <dmd> It looks like there is a lot more on the wiki than I thought
[20:47] <ajalkane> There's frankly not lot... but what's there is pretty good for getting started.
[20:48] <wastrel> dmd: what are you writing?
[20:49] <dmd> I want to try my hand at the file manager
[20:49] <dmd> so I'm mocking up the ui then I'll hack in basic file navigation
[20:49] <ajalkane> are you in the file manager team?
[20:49] <dmd> nope, I have no idea what is going on
[20:50] <ajalkane> ok, just wondered if anythings going on. Someone doing something is better than nothing happening at all.
[20:50] <dmd> I contacted Till who was my mentor two years ago asking him about how I could help with ubuntu phone and he pointed me to this chat room
[20:51] <dmd> I figure before I try to make anything offical I should prove to myself I can get something working
[20:51] <ajalkane> are you basing the mocks on any suggestions given in the community pages?
[20:51] <dmd> I want to go from the one in basmic but..
[20:51] <dmd> I do not think the accordian view of multiple file sources will work well on mobile
[20:52] <dmd> instead ubuntu has these cool views you can swip between
[20:52] <dmd> I think those would work better for different locations, like network shares vs local vs sd card
[20:52] <ajalkane> IMO it's best to start with the bare basics, getting the basics working, and then tackle the harder parts.
[20:53] <dmd> yeah
[20:53] <dmd> so far I have mocked in fake folders and fake files
[20:53] <dmd> I'm mocking in the context menu next
[21:12] <dmd> KevinWright: how might I go about going a team?
[21:48] <dmdrummond> dmd: There is a form here http://developer.ubuntu.com/get-started/gomobile/#step-get-involved
[21:49] <dmd> dmdrummond: thank you will fill that out
[23:19] <nOStahl> hows it going guys
[23:20] <dmd> everyone appears to be afk, or working
[23:20] <nOStahl> ah
[23:20] <nOStahl> me - I'm playing with my new gitlab server
[23:21] <dmd> nice
[23:22] <dmd> have a use in mind?
[23:22] <nOStahl> I'm really REALY liking gitlab so far
[23:27] <nOStahl> cant wait for ubuntu phone
[23:27] <nOStahl> wish I did not buy the iPhone 5 last month now haha
[23:27] <dmd> yeah I can imagine
[23:27] <dmd> not going to get a port for a little while
[23:28] <nOStahl> what I really wish is that I could install ubuntu phone on my iPhone 5
[23:28] <dmd> it is nice hardware
[23:28] <nOStahl> aye
[23:28] <dmd> did they get rid of the glass back?
[23:28] <nOStahl> ya
[23:28] <dmd> nice
[23:29] <dmd> I have the nexus 4 and the back is already scratched up. I refuse to use a case
[23:29] <dmd> no phone should need a case
[23:29] <dmd> I think they used a glass back since it trains you to grip the sides
[23:29] <nOStahl> unless you want it to change the look
[23:29] <nOStahl> I don't use a case on the iPhone 5
[23:30] <nOStahl> just make sure to keep keys in diff pocket etc
[23:30] <dmd> yeah I've cleaned out a pocket in my bag
[23:30] <dmd> only phone and tissue
[23:31] <nOStahl> gah I'd really like ubuntu phone on this iphone
[23:31] <dmd> one option that may work in the future is the chinese iphone knockoff
[23:31] <dmd> at least those have unlocked boot loaders
[23:32] <nOStahl> aye
[23:32] <nOStahl> any word on cdma work
[23:32] <dmd> no idea
[23:40] <nOStahl> so I had watched the keynote on ubuntu for phones
[23:41] <nOStahl> they didn't cover, is this going to be where we can dock it and use full blown ubuntu ?


[00:03] <SIR_Taco_> amichair: what does 'xset q' report for your Standby, Suspend, Off?
[00:04] <amichair> SIR_Taco_: if u mean under DPMS - Standby: 1800    Suspend: 2700    Off: 3600
[00:04] <amichair> but the issues are not with the display, but the pc itself shutting down/suspending
[00:06] <SIR_Taco_> amichair: ah, misunderstood the issue
[00:07] <MySystem> hello a short question in the keditfiletype there is a variable that i can use in the cmd like %U is there a list or a name to find a list with these variables
[00:08] <amichair> SIR_Taco_: any idea where the power profile settings are hiding nowadays?
[00:10] <xixor> yo
[00:10] <SIR_Taco_> amichair: the options in System Settings -> Power Management are working for you?
[00:10] <SIR_Taco_> *aren't
[00:12] <amichair> SIR_Taco_: there seems to be only one default profile. I don't see any mention of battery/low battery settings, which I think started working when on UPS power
[00:13] <amichair> there used to be ac/battery tabs, and/or powersave/performance/etc. profiles...
[00:14] <amichair> now the only 'flexibility' is in activity custome settings, but I don't use activities, and they won't solve my problem anyway
[00:14] <SIR_Taco_> amichair: you don't have these options? http://i.imgur.com/VfdCq.png
[00:15] <amichair> SIR_Taco_: my screen looks the same, but without the tabs
[00:15] <SIR_Taco_> hmm
[00:17] <amichair> they look familiar though, maybe I have them on the laptop, but not here
[00:18] <amichair> I have a feeling it's not showing them because it somehow detects that this is a desktop rather than a laptop... however it does apply whatever default battery settings are there when it goes to UPS, so it does actually support battery mode, just not allowing me to set it. That's just a hunch.
[00:21] <SIR_Taco_> amichair: do you have the 'upower' package installed?
[00:21] <amichair> I'll try manually removing the suspendsession stuff from powermanagementprofilesrc, see if it helps
[00:22] <amichair> SIR_Taco_: it appears so
[00:23] <SIR_Taco_> only other thing I can think of is that somehow, between upgrades, it's doesn't see your laptop as a laptop (ie with battery). Which laptop?
[00:23] <amichair> the issues are on the desktop, not the laptop
[00:24] <SIR_Taco_> oh
[00:25] <SIR_Taco_> ok, so you have a desktop on a UPS, and there's no options for the UPS then
[00:25] <amichair> I think after a recent upgrade it started treating the UPS as battery mode, but still doesn't let me configure it. Before that it never did anything different when on UPS.
[00:26] <amichair> this upgrade also changed my default settings for AC mode (it suddenly started hibernating, which it hasn't done in years). I played around with the settings, and I think that doesn't happen any more.
[00:27] <SIR_Taco_> amichair: what make of UPS?
[00:27] <amichair> APC
[00:27] <xixor> yo
[00:28] <SIR_Taco_> and you have apcupsd installed aswell?
[00:32] <amichair> yep
[00:33] <amichair> configuration hasn't changed, and I didn't see it as the cause for the shutdowns in the logs
[00:36] <amichair> SIR_Taco_: gotta go... I'll continue investigating this tomorrow. Thanks for your time and intention of helping :-)
[00:49] <veryhappy> help guys... i messed up my kde, i tried to remove all the other stuff not needed for my graphics driver that was activated because i wanted to have the latest nvidia driver and now i have the latest nvidia driver running but i don't have window decorations anymore... all windows appear in the left upper edge of my kde what shall i do???
[00:51] <arrrghhh2> veryhappy: someone suggested "try pressing ALT+F2 and run:  kwin --replace"
[00:51] <veryhappy> ok i try it out
[00:52] <Obsidian1723> before you do that.
[00:52] <Obsidian1723> sudo dpkg-reconfigure kwin
[00:52] <veryhappy> wtf: i told me that kwin isn't installed yet?
[00:52] <Obsidian1723> That should set it back to "facroty default" so to speak.
[00:52] <veryhappy> *it
[00:52] <Obsidian1723> IF that fails, then sudo apt-get --reinstall kwin
[00:53] <veryhappy> i know factory default you mean but it isn't installed :D lmfao
[00:53] <veryhappy> ok
[00:53] <Obsidian1723> --reinstall
[00:54] <veryhappy> Obsidian1723: invalid operation
[00:55] <arrrghhh2> wouldn't it be apt-get install --reinstall?
[00:56] <veryhappy> only apt-get install
[00:56] <veryhappy> but i guess i got the mistake
[00:56] <veryhappy> that i made
[00:56] <arrrghhh2> ...
[00:56] <veryhappy> when i tried to remove nvidia-common i also removed libkwinnvidiahack4
[00:56] <veryhappy> that's needed for the kde-window-manager package :D
[00:56] <arrrghhh2> hah
[00:57] <veryhappy> brb
[00:57] <veryhappy> just try it out
[00:58] <veryhappy> problem solved !!!!!!!!
[00:59] <Obsidian1723> cool
[00:59] <veryhappy> libkwinnvidiahack4 was reinstalled now and restarted
[00:59] <veryhappy> :D thanks guys
[01:00] <veryhappy> the human race gets only smarter by solving pc problems :D we should all use linux instead of windows, clicking around being dumb and fu**ing our women/men :D
[01:01] <veryhappy> though that can also be sometimes quite helpful to get the head clear again, just don't do it all time :D whatever thank you guys :D
[01:03] <Obsidian1723> veryhappy agreed, but users have become even more dumbed down.
[01:04] <xixor> yo
[01:05] <xixor> ...... most linux users now spend their time pointing and clicking around KDE or Gnome.... I don't see how that makes them any better than windows users
[01:05] <xixor> "maybe I'll try clicking in one of the dozen places I can configure KDE kwin window behaviour"
[01:06] <Obsidian1723> xixor: True, but those are only the newer users. Soon they will come to realizde that not everything on Linux can be done through a GUI, and that the GUI "programs" are really just Qt and GTK front-ends for command line based programs anyway.
[01:07] <xixor> again, no different than windows users
[01:07] <Obsidian1723> Many things have more options only via the command line. No GUI front-end will allow them access to all the options.
[01:08] <Obsidian1723> Well, Windows users have a pretty limited space in the command line. I'd say it's different.
[01:08] <xixor> hm..... cmd, powershell, and cygwin say otherwise
[01:08] <Obsidian1723> and none ofthem are near as flexible as bash
[01:08] <arrrghhh2> cygwin is basically linux for windows...
[01:08] <Obsidian1723> cygwin is a port hack at best.
[01:08] <arrrghhh2> powershell is an aftermarket addon (unless you're on win2012)
[01:09] <arrrghhh2> and cmd is just freakin useless
[01:09] <xixor> no, cygwin provides a POSIX environment from which to run POSIX programs.  Linux is just another hack of a POSIX environment on which to run those programs
[01:09] <genii-around> < cough-cough > #kubuntu-offtopic
[01:09] <Obsidian1723> arrrghhh2: and none of them equal bash
[01:09] <arrrghhh2> indeed.  and agreed with genii-around
[01:09] <xixor> sure
[01:25] <laurden> hi
[02:12] <skreech_> hi
[02:37] <draciron> OK getting really frustrated here :(
[02:37] <draciron> Been trying to help a friend through an install. nvidia drivers beena nightmare.
[02:38] <draciron> Novau locks her into 640-480 nvidia current gets the res to normal but cursor problems.
[02:39] <draciron> Had her remove novau and nvidia current but shes in dependency hell with 176 or 96.
[02:39] <draciron> now can't even get nvidia-current to reinstall to try to get Synaptics to resolve the dependency issues.
[02:39] <Obsidian1723> Did you try and reconfigure the drivers?
[02:39] <draciron> oh nvidia current worked until kernel update obliterated it.
[02:40] <draciron> Cept for the cursor issue.
[02:40] <Obsidian1723> sudo apt-get install -f && sudo dpkg-reconfigure nvidia-current
[02:40] <draciron> nvidia-config did nothing to help. Just wrote an xconfig file.
[02:40] <Obsidian1723> could try that
[02:40] <draciron> Thanks, will have her try that now.
[02:44] <draciron> Question is, will that break updates. When I've forced package installs in the past updates would get hung up
[02:44] <draciron> in dependency hell.
[02:49] <Obsidian1723> thatsn ot forcing it, only reconfiguring it.
[02:50] <Obsidian1723> forcing an install can be a bad idea, true that one.
[02:56] <arcspark> Hey, when I try to work with last.fm in amarok I get a message saying that a plugin is required for "LASTFM Protocol source"
[02:56] <arcspark> When I tell amarok to search for it, it can't find one
[02:57] <arcspark> according to Google, amarok 2.6 is supposed to be compiled with LastFM support built in
[02:57] <arcspark> any ideas what could be wrong?
[02:57] <arcspark> should i be running amarok as su?
[02:58] <Obsidian1723> no, dont run it with elevated privledges
[02:58] <arcspark> okay, good, i haven't been.
[02:58] <Obsidian1723> I gave up on amarok, banshee works fine. You could search to see if there are missing plugins
[02:59] <Obsidian1723> maybe install amarok-utils
[03:00] <arcspark> hmm. once my install of banshee finishes i'll try that and see if it fixes amarok.
[03:00] <Obsidian1723> banshee isn't samarok. that's like saying once I buy my Ford it will fix my Chevy
[03:00] <arcspark> no, i mean apt-get is currently locked
[03:01] <arcspark> by my installing banshee
[03:01] <Obsidian1723> ah ok
[03:03] <arcspark> yeah, says amarok-utils is already the newest version
[03:03] <Obsidian1723> ok
[03:03] <arcspark> if banshee has last.fm integration, though, it should work fine
[03:03] <Obsidian1723> yup
[03:03] <arcspark> assuming it's not also broken
[03:03] <Obsidian1723> works for me.
[03:09] <FRodrigues> hi
[03:09] <FRodrigues> can
[03:09] <SIR_Taco_> bottle
[03:09] <FRodrigues> can I install steam like it was normal Ubuntu?
[03:09] <FRodrigues> sorry :P
[03:10] <Obsidian1723> steam installs in Linux.
[03:12] <SIR_Taco_> FRodrigues: are you talking about the beta Steam client?
[03:12] <FRodrigues> yes
[03:13] <SIR_Taco_> FRodrigues: shouldn't matter... you may need to install the odd dependency, but the .deb should bring them in for you
[03:14] <FRodrigues> thanks
[03:15] <FRodrigues> I have ubuntu but now I'm thinking about installing kubuntu
[03:16] <FRodrigues> but I'm afraid of the lack of support and bugs that kubuntu may have
[03:16] <SIR_Taco_> FRodrigues: the base is the same, more-or-less
[03:17] <Obsidian1723> I run Kbuntu jkust fine, and Linux is Linux. KDE is just the DE for it.
[03:17] <Obsidian1723> thus K Ubuntu
[03:17] <Obsidian1723> just dont run non-LTS versions of Ubuntu and things are much more stable with the LTS.
[03:18] <FRodrigues> but can I install the latest kde in kubuntu?
[03:18] <Obsidian1723> It should be in it.
[03:20] <skreech_> FRodrigues: The lack of support?
[03:20] <FRodrigues> The unity is the loved child of canonical
[03:21] <FRodrigues> kde will never have the same support has the normal ubuntu.
[03:22] <skreech_> It never has had the same support >from canonical< but that isn't saying that much :)
[03:22] <Obsidian1723> true
[03:23] <skreech_> I've actually known a number of people to come to Kubuntu because they could not get help in the #ubuntu chan and we were just friendlier
[03:24] <Obsidian1723> Well, Ubujntu is Ubujntu. Toss KDE on it, it's Kubuntu, toss XFCE on it, it's Xubuntu...
[03:25] <SIR_Taco_> which was my point :P
[03:25] <FRodrigues> yeah
[03:25] <Obsidian1723> Linux is Linux, it's only the philosophy of design and the implementation which varies between distros really.
[03:25] <skreech_> which is why I said the support From canonical
[03:25] <skreech_> Which isn't much
[03:26] <Obsidian1723> If you want stablity, go Debian. If you want Debian, but with some non-free, go Ubuntu. If you want Ubuntu, but with it really all pre-configured, go Linux Mint. If you want to suffer, go gentoo. :D
[03:26] <skreech_> LFS more likely
[03:26] <FRodrigues> lol
[03:26] <Obsidian1723> yeah
[03:26] <Obsidian1723> or really go for a challenge, run DVL and then secure it.
[03:26] <skreech_> You men Run Windwos thensecure it
[03:27] <Obsidian1723> Securing Windows is installing Linux,.
[03:27] <skreech_> Shhhhhhh
[03:27] <FRodrigues> lol
[03:27] <Obsidian1723> and actually Windows doesn't have the most holes. That aware goes to Oracle.
[03:27] <Obsidian1723> award
[03:27] <skreech_> THat's not an OS
[03:28] <skreech_> Though it's heavily in Android so maybe Android wins?
[03:28] <Obsidian1723> Oracle has their own version of Linux.
[03:28] <Obsidian1723> of course they also have Java, no holes there heheheh
[03:28] <skreech_> In anycase back on topic. A) you can install steam on Kubuntu and b) Don't fear the lack of support. Fear the bugs
[03:29] <Obsidian1723> or in the Oracle EBS
[03:29] <FRodrigues> The kde have a lot of bugs : /
[03:29] <Obsidian1723> yeah, true that. If you need hand holding and 100% support, buy a Mac :D
[03:29] <skreech_> Yeah Unbreakable Linux which made RedHat compromise it's principles
[03:29] <Obsidian1723> ALL software has bugs.
[03:29] <skreech_> FRodrigues: It's a huge bit of software. I'd expect bugs
[03:30] <SIR_Taco_> FRodrigues: don't worry about it... give it a try and see
[03:30] <Obsidian1723> welp, time for more Dead Bird On A Plate Day food.
[03:30] <Obsidian1723> later all!
[03:30] <FRodrigues> bye
[03:30] <skreech_> FRodrigues: what bugs are you worried about?
[03:31] <FRodrigues> network manager
[03:31] <skreech_> you'll have to give me more than that
[03:32] <skreech_> you are afraid of being able to connect to network?
[03:32] <FRodrigues> yeah
[03:32] <skreech_> What are the specificsof the network?
[03:33] <skreech_> wired wireless? encrypted?
[03:33] <FRodrigues> WPA2 PEAP
[03:34] <FRodrigues> but the problem is the miner problems
[03:35] <FRodrigues> i remember one time that I couldn't change the icons
[03:35] <FRodrigues> and there weren't a solution
[03:36] <FRodrigues> the only solution was to wait for the 4.8 version : /
[03:37] <FRodrigues> I need to learn C++ to contribute something
[03:38] <FRodrigues> because I like KDE but I don't use
[03:38] <FRodrigues> because it's not polished like Unity or Gnome 2
[03:39] <FRodrigues> do you get it?
[03:41] <FRodrigues> http://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=107247
[03:49] <FRodrigues> how can I set Environment variables automatically?
[04:20] <skreech__> FRodrigues: Set them in your start up scripts
[04:20] <FRodrigues> but i dont know what are my start up scripts
[04:20] <skreech__> Yeah I understand. but Gnome 2 is quite old so it's had a lot of time to mature
[04:20] <FRodrigues> i put in .bashrc lol
[04:21] <skreech__> FRodrigues: That's where I would put it :)
[04:21] <skreech__> And that is a startup script
[04:22] <FRodrigues> I think there isn't enough people to properly polish KDE
[04:22] <FRodrigues> they have made and make great things
[04:24] <skreech__> Well there is #kde-quality which looks to do that. If that's what you are interested in then by all means jump in and help
[04:26] <swex> hey anybody have permanent disk io?
[04:27] <swex> I've got jdb2 writing every couple seconds..
[04:27] <swex> that's terrible
[04:28] <swex> I don't find actual bug for this issue, I mean I found alot of threads with this problem but no solution...
[04:29] <skreech__> jdb2?
[04:29] <swex> jbd2 ))
[04:30] <skreech__> what did you install?
[04:31] <skreech__> Oh that's the ext4 journal
[04:32] <skreech__> what's invoking it?
[04:32] <swex> skreech__: nothing
[04:33] <swex> skreech__: it start to behave like that dunno why
[04:33] <skreech__> hmm what services do you have running?
[04:39] <swex> nothing special
[04:39] <swex> skreech__: plz spell nick before, or I'm blind to your new msgs
[04:40] <skreech__> swex: Sorry
[06:03] <milo64> .-.
[07:05] <avihay> woot? skype for linux 4.1 is out?
[08:06] <Smurphy> Morning
[08:38] <testlab> I want to use unbuffer command in a script file. What packet name It is necessary to download with apt-get install <packet name> ?? Thanks!
[08:39] <tsimpson> !find bin/unbuffer
[08:39] <tsimpson> testlab: ^ you can just type "unbuffer" on the command line and it should tell you, or there's http://packages.ubutnu.com/ where you can search the contents of packages
[10:28] <noaXess> whats that.. if i do filetransfer with filezilla, xorg cpu usage is on 70+ %???
[10:29] <tsimpson> that's I/O for you
[10:30] <noaXess> ha.. refresh nvidia cache seams to heal xorg.. strange
[10:30] <noaXess> nvidia-settings -a PixmapCache=0 && sleep 2s && nvidia-settings -a PixmapCache=1
[10:57] <Walex2> noaXess: if you had a vague idea of the mess that is GPU hw interfaces and low level X/... code it would not surprise you
[10:58] <Walex2> noaXess: I find it strange that some GPU driver work most of the time despite everything
[11:12] <cseviciu> hi
[12:32] <BluesKaj> hi all
[12:36] <datruth> Hi
[14:23] <Husar|2> i, my touchpad in laptop stop moving mouse, but is work like scrolling, how can i fix it, or restart? (im on usb mouse now, which working good)
[14:23] <Husar|2> H
[14:23] <Husar|2> stop moving cursor*
[14:40] <Graf_Westerholt> Hi.
[15:31] <faLUCE>  hi. Which video-editor do you think is the best and most complete for linux? What do you think about Cinerella ?
[15:31] <RamchandraApte> only used avidemux
[15:32] <RamchandraApte> faLUCE: kdenlive didn't work the last time I tried it
[15:35] <simplew> yofel_: pring
[15:37] <simplew> JontheEchidna: pring
[15:40] <BluesKaj> simplew, don't you mean ping
[15:41] <OerHeks> or pringles?
[15:41] <RamchandraApte> BluesKaj: he has invented a new word
[15:41]  * RamchandraApte congrats simplew for inventing "pring"
[15:45] <simplew> what matters is that doing the same as a ping, but why would anyone pick on that? seams one hasnt nothing better to do...
[15:46] <BluesKaj> simplew, it was a simple correction on my part , that's all
[15:47] <BluesKaj> simplew, you could state your issue instead of trying to get personal help from individuals
[15:48] <BluesKaj> oh , make up your mind
[15:49] <BluesKaj> or is ith hmmm
[16:19] <ablyss> hi, what is the command to enable restricted drivers in kubuntu
[16:22] <bazhang> sudo apt-get install kubuntu-restricted-extras ablyss
[16:23] <bazhang> ablyss, unless you mean for the video card/wifi card
[16:23] <ablyss> bazhang, yes for the video
[16:23] <bazhang> !find jockey
[16:23] <bazhang> !info jockey-kde
[16:23] <ablyss> nvidia card
[16:24] <ablyss> thank you
[17:25] <Ab3L> hello
[17:30] <skreech_> Ab3L: Hello
[17:31] <Ab3L> ^_^y
[17:31] <skreech_> faLUCE: what's your intention?
[17:33] <faLUCE> skreech_: ?
[17:33] <skreech_> Ab3L: - _ ^
[17:33] <faLUCE> skreech_: about what?
[17:33] <skreech_> faLUCE: for the video editor?
[17:34] <faLUCE> skreech_: solved, meanwhile... they suggested me three main editors: kdenlive, openshot and cinerella
[17:34] <skreech_> Those would be the ones I suggest though ... I've not heard of cineralla
[17:35] <Ab3L> faLUCE: wow! not less than those three!
[17:35] <skreech_> faLUCE: Did you mean cinelerra ?
[17:35] <faLUCE> skreech_: yes :-)
[17:36] <skreech_> faLUCE: Ah yes then those were the three I was going to suggest :)
[17:36] <skreech_> Also Blender if you got the chops
[17:36] <faLUCE> :-)
[17:36] <skreech_> That's SERIOUS BUSINESS though
[17:38] <skreech_> granted Cinelerra isn't much better but I think more actual movies have been made with Blender than cinelerra
[17:38] <Ab3L> faLUCE: have someone told you about  open movie editor ?
[17:38] <skreech_> (opinion^^)
[17:42] <Catbuntu> Hi
[17:42] <faLUCE> Ab3L: no... is it good?
[17:43] <bobweaver> I want to help(I hear that ...) make kde be more declaritive with qml where to go and where to start ?
[17:44] <grek2> hi is possible to use unity lens in kde
[17:44] <grek2> ?
[17:44] <grek2> i love toboy + web hostory + files = hapy search
[17:45] <Catbuntu> I don't think so, as Unity lenses are for Unity.
[17:46] <Ab3L> faLUCE: i had good a experience with it.
[17:46] <bobweaver> Catbuntu,  if kde used more declaritive things then it could run lens in menu ?
[17:47] <grek2> kde have alt f2 search
[17:48] <grek2> i think mayby is possible to connect this search engines \
[17:48] <grek2> plugins to search is new great idea
[17:48] <Catbuntu> I don't know bobweaver :P
[17:48] <grek2> notes, web hostry, files, aps, aps  = great
[17:49] <Catbuntu> I'm not actually a KDE user, but I'm thinking to install Kubuntu on my testing partition... Or perhaps crunchbang.
[17:49] <grek2> kubuntu is very nice :)
[17:49] <ok_wait> agreed
[17:49] <Catbuntu> Yep.
[17:49] <bobweaver> Catbuntu,  I am asking in #kde I ask because I amm a qt/qml dev
[17:49] <Catbuntu> I have some problems with all KDE distros releated to minimizing (even with OpenSUSE) effects.
[17:50] <ok_wait> i used to use OpenSuSE with kde but i think it's just cleaner in ubuntu
[17:50] <ok_wait> get a better video card
[17:51] <bobweaver> what is base package for kde ? not kubuntu-desktop but just kde so I can compile and hack at it ?
[17:51] <ok_wait> it's black friday :)
[17:51] <bobweaver> Like the package with a CmakeList.txt file in it that builds kde
[17:53] <faLUCE> Ab3L: I'll suggest it to my friend
[17:54] <bobweaver> so no one know upstream for kde envo ?
[17:55] <skreech__> bobweaver: #kde-devel ?
[17:55] <bobweaver> Like I see all these tools kdesrc-build ect but can not find the .... thanks skreech__
[17:56] <skreech__> grek2: It is possible to connect them
[17:56] <skreech__> Catbuntu: What's the issue with minimizing?
[17:58] <skreech__> bobweaver: umm I forget if there is a kde-minimal
[17:58] <skreech__> !info kde-minimal
[17:59] <bobweaver> skreech__,  maybe
[17:59] <bobweaver> !info kdebase-workspace
[17:59] <bobweaver> but IDK I am new to kde
[18:00] <bobweaver> not to qt and qml but kde and how you all build it
[18:00] <skreech__> !info kde-standard
[18:00] <skreech__> bobweaver: I'd start in #kde-devel they have pertty good docs and help there
[18:01] <skreech__> though honestly QML help will probably be easiest to get in #plasma and #active
[18:04] <Catbuntu> skreech__, it just lagged my system.
[18:04] <Catbuntu> :(
[18:08] <ok_wait> ahhhh....   kde is so much better than gnome :)
[18:11] <skreech__> Catbuntu: what video card do you have?
[18:11] <Catbuntu> a NVIDIA 9300M GS
[18:11] <ronnoc> ok_wait: Indeed \m/
[18:11] <skreech__> hmm can You bring that up in #kwin ?
[18:11] <Catbuntu> It happened with the restricted drivers, I don't remember if it happened also with nouveau, I think it did.
[18:11] <skreech__> Catbuntu: Would be good if you could check that
[18:12] <Catbuntu> In general all the desktop environments at my computer ar worse with the restricted drivers.
[18:12] <Catbuntu> Excepting XFCE which I'm using now, and Unity at 12.04...
[18:12] <Catbuntu> GNOME Shell is cr*p with restricted drivers, KDE is acceptable at least.
[18:12] <Catbuntu> It doesn't freeze, but just lag.
[18:13] <Catbuntu> Though Kubuntu 12.10 seems to be better than 12.04, and OpenSUSE got better when I upgraded KDE to 4.9.
[18:13] <Catbuntu> So I think I'll give Kubuntu a try again.
[18:13] <Catbuntu> And then report a bug if it's needed.
[18:14] <skreech__> Alright that's perfectly acceptable :)
[18:15] <Catbuntu> Something that worries me is the GTK compatibility on KDE.
[18:24] <san> Hi guys
[18:24] <san> i updated to 13.04 daily build
[18:24] <san> but windows manager got crashed now
[18:25] <genii-around> san: #ubuntu+1
[18:25] <san> m trying to run kwin from terminal
[18:25] <san> and m getting kwin: error while loading shared libraries: libEGL.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
[18:25] <TheLordOfTime> san, next-version support in #ubuntu+1 and nowhere else
[18:25] <TheLordOfTime> do /join #ubuntu+1
[18:25] <san> ok.. Thanks
[18:27] <Daskreech> Catbuntu:  I wouldn't worry about that at all
[18:28] <Catbuntu> Why?
[18:28] <Catbuntu> :P
[18:28] <Catbuntu> Is it possible to use XChat without dying?
[18:30] <genii-around> I actually had so many lockups under 12.10 with gimp, firefox, and other GTK apps I reinstalled 12.04
[18:34] <Obsidian1723> genii-around: that's because it's unstable
[18:47] <simplew>  there are unresolved  conflicts updating raring: http://pastebin.com/qkrtb77G
[18:48] <Guest87562> cxvxcv
[18:49] <Ab3L> is there anybody who uses radio tray?
[18:55] <OerHeks> simplew, better chance in #ubuntu+1
[18:56] <Ab3L> there is an expert of the system tray?
[18:59] <simplew> OerHeks: so ubuntu+1 its also for kubuntu
[18:59] <OerHeks> simplew yes.
[19:00] <OerHeks> Ab3L, I am not an expert, but what is your question?
[19:02] <Ab3L> well, it doen't show anymore the icon of radio tray. it shows only an icon with a question mark. do you know how to get the original icons?
[19:02] <simplew> Ab3L: an icon of the radio tray?
[19:02] <Ab3L> i've got this problem since an update (don't remember which one).
[19:03] <Ab3L> simplew: yes
[19:03] <simplew> Ab3L: with radio you referring to wifi button?
[19:05] <Ab3L> simplew: no. there is an application called "radio tray". you can use it to hear web radios or streaming. what is good, is that you don't need to have a window that take place on the screen, and that you can change radio channel turn it on and off from the system tray.
[19:06] <simplew> Ab3L: ah its an app, and whats the problem?
[19:07] <Ab3L> just the appearence. the icon on the system tray is not the right one. there is a question mark instead.
[19:07] <simplew> Ab3L: thats related to the icon theme your using
[19:07] <simplew> i ned to login to kde, brb
[19:09] <OerHeks> i am trying the application radiotray now, never used it before
[19:10] <OerHeks> Yes, it gives me a white A4 page icon
[19:10] <Ab3L> like this one: http://wstaw.org/m/2012/11/23/plasma-desktopqO1992.png
[19:11] <OerHeks> Jups, with me without Questionmark
[19:12] <Ab3L> OerHeks: that may depend on your icon set.
[19:13] <OerHeks> my current set is oxygen
[19:13] <Ab3L> OerHeks: with Oxygen the questionmark is white/gray
[19:13] <Ab3L> with Oxygen transparent is blue
[19:14] <jman> Trying to install a saved package list.  but Muon keeps crashing or just doing nothing when i load file
[19:14] <OerHeks> i changed it to gnome/humanity/humanity-dark, those give a questionmark in the icon like yours.
[19:14] <rickycezar> I am on this site and my browser loaded a @font-face from it's CSS. The target url for the @font-face is protected, but the font is loaded on the browser. Is there some way to recover it, maybe from the cache or something?
[19:15] <Ab3L> ok. but there's a way to point a custom icon?
[19:16] <Ab3L> the same that appears in the launch menu (kickoff/lancelot/....)
[19:16] <Ab3L> ?
[19:20] <Katbuntu> Hi.
[19:20] <Katbuntu> Nice question: how can I install KDE spanish langpack?
[19:20] <Katbuntu> Before it was something like kde-i18n-es
[19:21] <jman> Is there another way to install a saved package list.  Muon either crashes or does nothing at all to download em!
[19:23] <simplew> Ab3L: run 'kcmshell4 icons'
[19:23] <OerHeks> Ab3L, the icons are stored in/usr/share/icons/(iconsetname) but i am not sure howto do that
[19:23] <rickycezar> does anybody have any tip for my issue?
[19:24] <Ab3L> OerHeks: yes, I've seen. but have the same problem as you: "don't know how to do that"
[19:25] <OerHeks> that icon manager isn't any help either :(
[19:26] <OerHeks> Katbuntu, kde-l10n-es
[19:26] <Katbuntu> Thanks!
[19:26] <tsimpson> Katbuntu: System Settings -> Locale, add Spanish, it should then install the package it needs
[19:26] <Katbuntu> Spanish doesn't appear at the system settings, but after upgrading I'll install the l10n and let's see.
[19:27] <Katbuntu> OerHeks: what's the difference between i18n and l18n?
[19:27] <Ab3L> simplew: <OerHeks> that icon manager isn't any help either :(
[19:27] <simplew> Ab3L: if is an icon name that isnt common than it will not be changed when changing icon theme
[19:27] <tsimpson> Katbuntu: i18n = internationalization, l10n = localization
[19:28] <Katbuntu> And what's the difference?
[19:28] <simplew> Ab3L: look to the .desktop file from that radio app and see which icon sues, maybe from that point you can do some
[19:28] <simplew> rickycezar: issue?
[19:28] <Ab3L> simplew: well, sometime the question mark desappears or change colour.
[19:29] <tsimpson> Katbuntu: well i18n would the process of making something translatable, l10n would be actually translating something
[19:29] <Ab3L> simplew: where are they located the .desktop files?
[19:30] <Katbuntu> Okay.
[19:30] <OerHeks> Ab3L, drag the radiotray to your desktop, it is located in 'multimedia'
[19:30] <OerHeks> odd it appears there with the right icon
[19:31] <simplew> Ab3L: /usr/share/applications
[19:31] <Katbuntu> Let's restart, brb.
[19:32] <OerHeks> Ab3L, i think this is worth a bugreport
[19:32] <Ab3L> simplew: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1380230
[19:33] <Ab3L> simplew: i've found two .desktop files. I pasted-bin them.
[19:34] <simplew> Ab3L: the icon name is radiotray, now check if the icons themes have that name
[19:36] <simplew> Ab3L: from this point you can change the icon that the radio app uses
 Ab3L: the icon name is radiotray, now check if the icons themes have that name <---  i don't have any idea about how to do it
[19:40] <Ab3L> where should i look?
[19:40] <simplew> Ab3L: icon themes, the ones that appear from runing 'kcmshell4 icons' are in /usr/share/icons
[19:40] <Ab3L> then, is it possible to add that name to the icon set?
[19:41] <simplew> Ab3L: you can add an icon with that name (if the icon doesnt already exists) to the icon theme and regenerate icon cache
[19:42] <veryhappy> hi guys, i have this annoying kde accessibility icon in my bar and would like to get rid off that, of course i understand there are humans with disabilities, i'm not one of them and so i don't need this thing. so how do i get rid off it?
[19:43] <simplew> veryhappy: right click on it and see the option to exit
[19:43] <veryhappy> simplew: haha, the funniest thing is, it keeps bothering me when i click on exit
[19:44] <simplew> veryhappy: i dont know which icon is, i would need to know more to be able to help
[19:45] <veryhappy> ok you see a blue background on it and in the foreground is a white little man shown.
[19:46] <simplew> veryhappy: i really dont know which app is that
[19:48] <veryhappy> why? it's the kde accessibiltiy application it shows me something like kcmaccess when i try to find out its name
[19:48] <Katbuntu> Hi
[19:49] <simplew> veryhappy: you can confgure it by runing 'kcmshell4 kcmaccess'
[19:52] <veryhappy> ok
[19:52] <veryhappy> thanks
[19:52] <veryhappy> but:
[19:53] <veryhappy> that's the normal dialog where i can't configure to NOT let it start
[19:53] <veryhappy> can't i switch off the service?
[19:55] <simplew> veryhappy: whats the output of 'ps aux|grep access' ?
[20:04] <veryhappy> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1380316/
[20:05] <simplew> veryhappy: run: kill -9 /usr/lib/kde4/libexec/kaccessibleapp
[20:09] <Katbuntu> It crashed D:
[20:09] <Katbuntu> I just used a "hot corner" and it logged out.
[20:09] <Katbuntu> :?
[20:18] <veryhappy> simplew: didn't work
[20:20] <simplew> veryhappy: yes it does, that kills the app
[20:20] <simplew> veryhappy: you can also run /usr/lib/kde4/libexec/kaccessibleapp and disable "Enable Screenreader"
[20:23] <simplew> veryhappy: seams isnt accepting -9 argument, run: sudo killall  /usr/lib/kde4/libexec/kaccessibleapp
[20:23] <simplew> veryhappy: that will for sure kill it
[20:25] <simplew> veryhappy: uau, once its killed it restarts
[20:26] <simplew> veryhappy: this is a bugyy app, better ask in #kde and report a bug
[20:28] <veryhappy> :D yea
[20:28] <veryhappy> it always restarts
[20:28] <veryhappy> i'll ask later in kde
[20:28] <veryhappy> now i gotta go for a while
[20:28] <veryhappy> thanks anyway for the try
[20:28] <veryhappy> take care
[20:28] <simplew> veryhappy: ypouhave another option
[20:28] <veryhappy> yea?
[20:28] <veryhappy> which one
[20:28] <simplew> veryhappy: you can simply uninstall the package kaccessible
[20:29] <veryhappy> oh over synaptics or muon?
[20:29] <veryhappy> just uninstall ok, i'll do that
[20:29] <simplew> veryhappy: sudo apt-get purge kaccessible
[20:29] <veryhappy> yea that also works
[20:29] <veryhappy> ok
[20:29] <veryhappy> thanks buddy
[20:29] <veryhappy> take care :)
[20:29] <simplew> bye
[20:33] <simplew> yofel: dbus keeps restarting kaccessible, how can it be killed? (since kill does kills it but it restarts)
[20:34] <Ab3L> simplew: it doesn't work. i'll make another attempt tomorrow
[20:34] <Ab3L> thanks
[20:36] <yofel> simplew: without knowing what actually starts it, I would remove the executable flag from the binary. But that's an ugly workaround at best
[20:37] <simplew> yofel: its dbus
[20:37] <Torch> maybe have a look in kded services?
[20:47] <simplew> kaccessible from hell
[20:48] <simplew> yofel: i close it with:  qdbus org.kde.kaccessibleapp /MainApplication org.kde.KApplication.quit
[20:48] <SJr> I think I have found a bug in KDE  on Kubuntu 12.04. If I run Eclipse, and change the color scheme a certain panel (not sure what to call it but is like a pop up used for overlays) gets the correct colour change the first time.  This happens even on new installs and is reproducable. For instance open eclipse, go in debbuging mode. Open up appearances -> Colors
[20:48] <SJr> . Change theme from Current to Norway, this window gets the correct color. Change it back to anything else, it's now black on black. Changing the color again has no effect.
[20:48] <simplew> yofel: and keeps restarintg
[20:49] <yofel> check what Torch said, otherwise I don't know
[20:49] <simplew> yofel: i dont know what that mans
[20:50]  * yofel isn't sure if kded has anthing to do with this though
[20:52] <Torch> yofel: the thing being a separate process rather not
[20:53] <yofel> yeah
[20:54] <Katbuntu> BBye.
[20:54] <simplew>  qdbus org.kde.kaccessibleapp /MainApplication quit    closes it, but it then dbus restarts it
[20:58] <BarkingFish> Hi guys - got a little issue I need sorting out if anyone can help.  I'm installing a brand new font family to my kit, the problem is that I can either install each variant individually, which will take hours, or if I try to install all of them at once, Plasma locks up, eventually followed by my PC.
[20:59] <BarkingFish> There are 85 variants, and I'm not going to sit and install them all one by one - I'll be here till hell freezes over and satan wears ear muffs :)
[21:00] <BarkingFish> Anyone know how I install them as a whole without taking all night or killing my pc please? :)
[21:05] <Torch> in the olden days[tm] you just copied the font files to /usr/loca/share/fonts/<whatever> and re-created the font cache
[21:05] <Torch> that should probably still work best for a larger number of fonts today
[21:05] <BarkingFish> yeah - it does, but only for local user.  I want them system wide, which requires installing them properly, with perms.
[21:06] <Torch> note the destination dir i gave
[21:06] <Torch> maybe google can help you with this on (k)ubuntu
[22:08] <dougl> too quiet in here... internet must be broken cuz 12.10 is not flawless or perfectly intuitive - c'mon folk look alive :)
[22:11] <BluesKaj> dougl, nothing
[22:11] <BluesKaj> 's perfect ,
[22:12] <BluesKaj> but 12.10 is humming along here just fine atm
[22:13] <dougl> hello BluesKaj how are you - same here... just ticking along, touch wood :)
[22:14] <BluesKaj> ine here dougl , and you ?
[22:14] <BluesKaj> er fine :)
[22:16] <dougl> What can I say => the weekend is here... all good ::)
[22:20] <BluesKaj> yup , almost dinnertime here ...think call it a day ..later
[22:25] <ptomblin> Does anybody have any experience with using two Dual-link DVI monitors?
[22:28] <dougl> ptomblin, I have used 2 monitors... dunno much about dual-link - would they be that different from a standard monitor or tv?
[22:29] <ptomblin> dougl, I have two monitors now.
[22:29] <ptomblin> But I'm thinking of buying two of those 27" IPS monitors.
[22:29] <dougl> oh - nice
[22:30] <ptomblin> They require dual-link DVI, which means having two video cards.  My current set-up has one video card driving both monitors.
[22:30] <ptomblin> Yeah, microcenter.com has them for $450 incluing new york tax.
[22:30] <ptomblin> I'm wondering if having the two monitors on separate video cards will change things.
[22:31] <dougl> what makes them that valuable? sli or crossfire?
[22:31] <ptomblin> Right now I can drag windows from one monitor to the other, but I don't know if it will be different with two video cards.
[22:32] <ptomblin> The monitors cost $450 because they have the same resolution as a $2500 Apple Cinema Display.
[22:32] <ptomblin> 2460x1440 or something like that.
[22:32] <dougl> nice... you use nvidia or ati?
[22:33] <ptomblin> My current card is an nVidia ... 430 or something like that.
[22:33] <ptomblin> It's got a dual link DVI port , as well as hdmi out.
[22:34] <ptomblin> GeForce GT 430 - according to lspci
[22:35] <dougl> evga = bad fan, check regularly.
[22:36] <dougl> I don't know about the twinview with 2 video cards... but if it is twinview it should perform the same...
[22:36] <dougl> how 'bout it ppl anyone know this for a fact?
[22:44] <simplew> i have set new fonts and sizes but each time o login kde apepars with ubuntu fonts and sizes instead the ones i did set, why is this happening?
[22:45] <simplew> yofel: any hint?
[22:50] <ptomblin> www.crashplan.com cloud backup is having a big sale - the price is currently just over $10 for their family plan, but it goes up every 2 hours
[22:50] <ptomblin> Looks like they support linux as well.
[22:53] <simplew> ptomblin: already have 10GB for free
[23:02] <simplew> why in KDM user guest does not appear?
[23:03] <yofel> simplew: no idea about the fonts right now, but kdm has no guest session, that's a lightdm feature
[23:03] <simplew> yofel: in other distros does
[23:04] <yofel> then they added it I guess? I don't know kdm too well
[23:05] <simplew> yofel: so this appers to be a problem in kubuntu
[23:07] <simplew> yofel: now i got why, because kdm is set to now allow uid less than 1000 and guest is 116
[23:09] <simplew> yofel: unbelievable, i havent logout and the fonts already got back to ubuntu defaults, what i set is gone, how can this be???
[23:10] <yofel> kde font settings or gtk ones?
[23:10] <simplew> kde fonts
[23:12] <simplew> yofel: some crazy script is runing in background...
[23:12] <yofel> check if your settings are owned by you, otherwise this shouldn't happen
[23:12] <simplew> yofel: of course they are
[23:14] <yofel> does someone else have an idea? I'm too tired to think of any sensible reason why this would happen that doesn't include background scripts that shouldn't be there
[23:15] <simplew> yofel: this appears to be related with /usr/share/kubuntu-default-settings  and an update-alternative runing
[23:15] <yofel> you are on quantal, are you?
[23:16] <simplew> yofel: now im in raring
[23:16] <yofel> -> #ubuntu+1 please
[23:17] <simplew> yofel: sorry, i forgotthat part
[23:26] <Catbuntu> H
[23:45] <Tjips_> I want to install kubuntu 12.10 using a USB flash. I used the amd64 iso I got from the download site and made a start-up disk in kubuntu 12.04.1 using the Startup Disk Creator. The problem is that my system isn't booting from it. Any ideas on what's going wrong?
[23:48] <dougl> Tjips_, I used netbootin to make usb stick... is your bios config'd to boot from usb or can you select it?
[23:49]  * dougl recalls 12.10 attempt #2 cd actually had the iso file on it not the image burned to it.
[23:50] <Tjips_> dougl: I config'd my bios so the flash is first in the boot order. I can also select what to boot from, but last time I tried to it just booted as if the flash wasn't there.
[23:51] <Tjips_> dougl: did the netbootin stick boot as intended?
[23:51] <dougl> Tjips_, sounds probable a bad copy, netbootin worked like a charm on 12.04 and 12.10
[23:52] <Tjips_> dougl: mmm, thanks. I think I'll try making it again with netbootin. wish me luck :D
[23:53] <dougl> good luck Tjips_ - use the force :)
[23:54] <racquad> hi there. I'm using Kubuntu and Thunderbird as my mail client. I would love to switch to Kmail, but I can't configure it to embed my HTML signature. It has a table and an image (hosted at my website). Thunderbird works fine with it, but kmail append a plain text. How can I configure it?
[23:58] <racquad> anyone? any idea?