[13:58] <seb128> hey
[13:59] <arges> hey
[14:00] <smoser> o/
[14:00]  * stgraber waves
[14:00] <skaet> o/
[14:00] <stgraber> #startmeeting Ubuntu 12.04.1 team meeting
[14:00] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Jun 28 14:00:39 2012 UTC.  The chair is stgraber. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
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[14:01] <stgraber> NCommander, stokachu, jibel, jamespage: ping
[14:01] <stgraber> xnox: around by any chance?
[14:02] <stgraber> #topic Action items review
[14:02] <stgraber> arges to work on a 12.04.1 bug report, showing targeted bugs and information on status in development release, patches attached and branches linked
[14:02] <xnox> stgraber: yeap
[14:02] <arges> stgraber, i think the launchpad page is sufficient
[14:03] <arges> stgraber, i wrote a script for our team to see which bugs we have targeted via arsenal
[14:03] <stokachu> o/
[14:03]  * xnox o/
[14:04] <stgraber> arges: ok, I don't particularly like sorting/filtering bugs with Launchpad but it's true we don't have so many that it's not doable
[14:04] <arges> stgraber, i guess my other issue was not figuring out what exactly was needed
[14:06] <stgraber> arges: I was mostly interested in having a way of finding low hanging fruits, that's bug targeted to the point release, already fixed in the dev release or with patches/branches attached for dev+point-release
[14:06] <xnox> and or fixed in a linked debian bug...
[14:06]  * smoser mentions that jamespages is on holiday
[14:06] <arges> stgraber, ah. this makes more sense.   so in launchpad we can see the icons right? but it doesn't show us all the information
[14:07] <arges> just patch/branch
[14:07] <arges> stgraber, if this is still valuable, i will work on this and make sure I ask questions before the next meeting. ok?
[14:08] <stgraber> arges: right, it doesn't tell us whether it's fixed in the dev release (good indication that the patches are good)
[14:08] <stgraber> arges: sounds good
[14:08] <stgraber> xnox: linked Debian bug sounds good too
[14:08] <stgraber> xnox to liase with ballons, gema and jibel w.r.t. fs/storage testing
[14:09] <xnox> stgraber: blocked/postpone, pending UTAH development subscribed to the mailing list
[14:09] <stgraber> ok, will poke you again in a couple of weeks then ;)
[14:09] <stgraber> #topic Review of upcoming deadlines
[14:09] <stgraber> Not sure how relevant this topic actually is :)
[14:09] <stgraber> As far as I know we don't have any deadlines beside 12.04.1 itself. If you're aware of any upstream point release that needs to get in 12.04.1 and hasn't been released yet, now is the time to speak!
[14:11] <stgraber> moving on
[14:11] <stgraber> #topic Quick look through the current bug lists
[14:11] <stgraber> We're now up to 121 bugs targeted to 12.04.1.
[14:11] <stgraber> A quick scan through the list shows almost 50% of them having a branch or a patch attached.
[14:11] <stgraber> So please go through https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+bugs?field.milestone%3Alist=49926 for packages your team is responsible for and review/upload these fixes!
[14:11] <stgraber> Out of these 121 bugs, 58 don't have an assignee. It'd be great if while reviewing the list, teams could assign these bugs to the team or to one of their team members.
[14:12] <seb128> (good part of that list is fix commited as well)
[14:13] <stgraber> right and that's pretty good to see :)
[14:14] <skaet> :)
[14:14] <stgraber> briefly went through pending-sru too, we don't seem to have a lot of old entries on there, so the verification work seems to be going quite well too
[14:15] <stgraber> most of the oldest entries are universe or are packages that we can't easily test at the moment (ubiquity being one of them)
[14:16] <stokachu> i got one that needs sponsorship
[14:16] <stokachu> bug #977964
[14:16] <seb128> stokachu, the libart-lgpl one?
[14:16] <xnox> i got two that need to be accepted
[14:17] <stokachu> seb128: ah yea
[14:17] <seb128> stokachu, I saw that earlier, I will sponsor it
[14:17] <stokachu> seb128: thanks :D
[14:17] <seb128> yw
[14:17] <stokachu> these next ones are ones on my todo list to get complete by next week
[14:18] <stokachu> bug #977952, bug #977947, bug #32860
[14:18] <seb128> I wanted to ask about the multiarch bugs progress ... but not sure, is there a "questions" part of the meeting I should wait for?
[14:18] <seb128> stokachu, it's about time we land the multiarch stuff, those need some testing so it's getting late
[14:18] <stgraber> there's a backlog of 30 packages in Unapproved at the moment, including xnox's packages. Hopefully that backlog will shrink post alpha-2 when people are a bit less busy releasing the alpha :)
[14:19] <stokachu> the main scope of my multiarch bugs to get complete is heavily influenced by third party needs
[14:19] <stokachu> but i am willing to work on others as well
[14:19] <xnox> stgraber: I don't mind the backlog, as long as they get approved and not kicked out.
[14:20] <seb128> I do mind the backlog, another issue I want to raise later ;-)
[14:20] <xnox> stgraber: i did test cases / bug template for all of mine, but I hope it will not be kicked out on the grounds of 'too hard to review'
[14:20] <seb128> the queue is stalling, 15 packages accept in a week is too low, it's impacting on our velocity...
[14:21] <xnox> stgraber: 2 packages, 8 and 1 SRU bugs respectfully
[14:21] <xnox> stgraber: 2 packages, 7 and 1 SRU bugs respectfully
[14:21] <stgraber> well, if you did the documentation and the diff is readable, it should be fine :)
[14:22] <stgraber> #topic Round table (status update from the various teams, what they're working on, where they need help, ...)
[14:23] <stgraber> will go in wiki order this time ;)
[14:23] <stgraber> didn't see NCommander being around, so will go directly with seb128
[14:23] <seb128> ok
[14:23] <seb128> great ;-)
[14:24] <seb128> so to be short
[14:24] <seb128> - desktop SRUs are going well (mostly)
[14:24] <seb128> - we got a round of compiz,libunity,bamf SRU this week (still in proposed)
[14:24] <seb128> - we should have an unity SRU in the next 2 weeks and probably another one toward the end of july
[14:24] <seb128> some issues,concerns:
[14:25] <seb128> - the multiarch changes are getting late, I saw very little activity on them
[14:25] <seb128> that's the sort of things we want to give some testing time to
[14:25] <seb128> - the SRU team is still lagging behind
[14:25] <seb128> we have a queue near 30 items, some stuff takes 2 week to get reviewed when they are trivial
[14:26] <seb128> that's impacting on velocity and blocking us to follow up with next rounds of fixes
[14:26] <seb128> ..
[14:26]  * xnox has no clue who is next
[14:27] <stgraber> me :)
[14:27] <seb128> oh
[14:27] <seb128> another issue raised:
[14:28] <seb128> - users feedback points that the number of whoopsie dialogs displayed makes the product looks buggy over what it is (often those are triggered for harmless issues in services that get respawned for example)
[14:29] <seb128> some people suggested we should consider turning off whoopsie with .1
[14:29] <seb128> ..
[14:29] <seb128> I'm done this time
[14:29] <seb128> not sure if we do questions or just keeps going and discuss stuff at the end ;-)
[14:29] <stgraber> skaet: I think you mentioned there was at least one SRU related meeting fairly recently, that's including re-staffing the SRU team right? (I seem to remember bdmurray and ScottK joining recently)
[14:29] <skaet> stgraber, yes,  there's a rotation been decided on for the SRU team
[14:30] <seb128> skaet, is the rotation schedule displayed somewhere?
[14:30] <stgraber> we can take questions as we go, so people don't have to keep lists ;)
[14:30] <seb128> so we can ping people on duty ;-)
[14:30] <seb128> displayed->published
[14:30] <skaet> seb128,  its in a google doc,  but I'll make up a page this afternoon after A2 is out
[14:30] <seb128> skaet, thanks
[14:30]  * skaet understands its needed.
[14:31] <seb128> it's very frustrating to see so little movement on SRUs reviews :-(
[14:31] <skaet> seb128,  doesn't quite solve the validation problem though.   So we need to figure that out.
[14:31] <seb128> well stgraber stated earlier that we don't have a validation issue so far?
[14:31] <seb128> ie by validation you mean verifying items in the queue
[14:32] <stgraber> right, verification is going quite well, I usually spend half a day a week verifying stuff and looks like the other members have been doing that too
[14:32] <skaet> we don't?
[14:32] <seb128> I didn't see anything concerned backlog or things staying for too long
[14:32] <skaet> ok.
[14:32] <seb128> skaet, well at least from the desktop side everything get validated before the week delay so far
[14:32] <skaet> seb128,  ok.   Will get that schedule of folks to ping posted.   See if that sorts it.
[14:33] <seb128> skaet, thanks
[14:33] <stgraber> skaet: most old entries are universe SRUs pre-testcase-era that I can't easily verify. I can't remember the reason for the others, but usually I try to verify > 6days old entries once a week at least
[14:33] <seb128> stokachu, reading your comment earlier the multiarch changes are being worked now right?
[14:33] <seb128> stokachu, i.e we should see progress on there in the next week?
[14:33] <stokachu> seb128: correct
[14:34] <stokachu> ive got sru's written for the ones i know about
[14:34] <stokachu> just need to finish the rest
[14:34] <seb128> ok
[14:34] <skaet> thank stgraber,  maybe we should brainstorm with ScottK and see if he has some ideas on how to make progress on those.
[14:35] <stgraber> skaet: I'm also wondering whether we should expire SRUs after a while, but that's a question for the SRU team really
[14:35] <stgraber> anyway, moving on a bit, feel free to continue pasting questions ;)
[14:35] <stgraber> stgraber:
[14:35] <skaet> stgraber, ok,  I'll carry it forward to them.
[14:36] <stgraber> I haven't been doing a whole lot of 12.04.1 stuff lately but did spend a day or so doing sru verification and I'm preparing a batch of network related SRUs
[14:36] <stgraber> there isn't anything critical in there but these are fixes I'm going to push to quantal so might as well SRU
[14:37] <stgraber> bug 1004775 is probably one for seb128 as it's technically a desktop package, but I'm affected and happy to help test any fix for it
[14:37] <xnox> for me the mdadm & e2fsprogs SRUs should get a much validation as possible & as long in -proposed as possible
[14:37] <xnox> as they are complex packages
[14:37] <xnox> and the deadline for 12.04.1 is fast approaching
[14:38] <seb128> stgraber, I will see if cyphermox can have a look
[14:38] <stokachu> roughly a month right?
[14:38] <stgraber> it's affecting everyone with an IPv6 network using NetworkManager in Automatic mode (default). It's not preventing people from working but it's spamming the syslog, seems to be spamming the routing table too and causes some DNS queries to fail
[14:38] <cyphermox> I'm working on it already
[14:39] <cyphermox> the routing table, I'm not sure it will change anything there.
[14:39] <ScottK> FWIW, the KDE version for 12.04.1 is in proposed for testing now.
[14:39] <seb128> cyphermox, thanks
[14:39] <stgraber> cyphermox: cool, thanks. The dnsmasq is really the annoying one, the routing table caching is weird but doesn't seem harmful
[14:39] <cyphermox> stgraber: right.
[14:40] <stgraber> ScottK: good to hear, no problem so far with verification?
[14:40] <ScottK> Not so far.  I'm running it here.
[14:40] <stgraber> cool
[14:40] <stgraber> stokachu:
[14:41] <stokachu> multiarch is the name of the game, continueing to get those bugs completed and sponsored
[14:41] <stokachu> ...
[14:41] <stgraber> arges:
[14:42] <arges> worked on 12.04.1 bugs, worked on milestone scripts for our team
[14:42] <arges> ..
[14:43] <stgraber> jibel:
[14:43] <jibel> automated testing reported broken oem installation
[14:44] <jibel> that usually occurs when the version of ubiquity on the CD and in the squashfs are different
[14:44] <jibel> will file a bug report
[14:45] <jibel> post-upgrade tests fail the obosolete config file check for everything bug oenric server while they usually pass
[14:45] <stgraber> oh, right, I have an AOB on that but might as well mention it now :)
[14:45] <jibel> I'll investigate next week this it started after we upgraded the auto-upgrader to python3
[14:45] <jibel> ..
[14:45] <jibel> s/bug oenric/but oneiric/
[14:45] <stgraber> cjwatson has been working on enabling -proposed for all precise dailies
[14:46] <stgraber> that's done for alternates but not working for live images
[14:46] <cjwatson> Yeah, sorry about that, it came down to something I thought about a year ago and then forgot
[14:46] <stgraber> which explain the out-of-sync issue you mentioned earlier
[14:46] <cjwatson> jibel: Indeed, there's no need for a bug report for the broken OEM installation in this case
[14:47] <jibel> cjwatson, ok, noted
[14:47] <cjwatson> If it persists next week I'd like to know
[14:47] <stgraber> jibel: I can't think of a reason why the python3 port would have broken th conffile check but let me know if you need some help there
[14:48] <stgraber> skaet:
[14:48] <jibel> stgraber, me neither but I don't like coincidences
[14:48] <skaet> working through bugs and milestoning some that should be considered for 12.04.1
[14:48] <skaet> from some of the ones that have come up from quantal mostly.
[14:48] <skaet> discussions about 12.04.2 schedules have started up.
[14:49] <skaet> but mostly working on quantal at the moment...
[14:49] <skaet> ;)
[14:49] <skaet> ..
[14:50] <stgraber> smoser:
[14:50] <smoser> - I'm not as current on our progress here as I need to be.  we clearly have a lot more bugs on the lists than other teams do.  I'll spend some time catching up
[14:50] <smoser>  with the teams and making sure we're getting some things done.
[14:50] <smoser>  - we did get a nova update into -proposed this week
[14:51] <smoser> i'm somewhat concerned that our list is so long.
[14:51] <smoser> but thats all. i'll poke around later today and we'll have more info next time.
[14:52] <stgraber> #topic AOB
[14:52] <stgraber> anything else people would like to mention/ask?
[14:53] <stgraber> doesn't look like it :)
[14:53] <skaet> :)
[14:53] <stgraber> well, thanks everyone, talk to you in two weeks then!
[14:54] <stokachu> thanks!
[14:54] <jibel> thanks stgraber
[14:54] <stgraber> #endmeeting
[14:54] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Jun 28 14:54:21 2012 UTC.
[14:54] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-06-28-14.00.moin.txt
[14:54] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-06-28-14.00.html
[14:54] <skaet> thanks stgraber
[14:54] <seb128> thanks
[14:55] <seb128> stgraber, skaet: nobody was interested to discuss the whoopsie on or off for .1 I guess then?
[14:56] <stgraber> seb128: oops, forgot about that one... did you discuss that with ev/pitti already? they're the most likely to have a strong opinion on that.
[14:57] <smoser> h.m.
[14:57] <smoser> stgraber, i have a bit of a feeling on it.
[14:58] <smoser> well..i'll look a bit beforr i comment and crate a more informed opinion.
[14:58] <smoser> the concern i have is just memory use in smaller server install (or vm)
[15:00] <Daviey> smoser: Well, the initial results from server have been null.
[15:00] <Daviey> smoser: As in, i don't think anyone has yet reported from an X-less box.. So it really is just a resource waste, until there is better exposure
[15:12] <seb128> stgraber, ev has a strong opinion on "we should fix the issues rather than turn it off"
[15:12] <seb128> in practice it's showing up badly on precise and we don't make enough progress with the resources we have to get in a good position soon on that front
[15:12] <seb128> so I think we should consider turning it of for .1
[16:15] <dholbach> ok, who's here for the MOTU meeting?
[16:16]  * coolbhavi waves
[16:17] <dholbach> coolbhavi, it looks like it's only the two of us
[16:17] <dholbach> nobody sent a reminder to the list I guess
[16:17] <dholbach> maybe we should just meet in 2 weeks instead with proper reminder beforehand?
[16:18] <coolbhavi> dholbach, yes right after meeting along with the minutes will help I think
[16:19] <dholbach> it'd be great if somebody (other than me) could do this :)
[16:19] <dholbach> I was just too busy to take care of this time
[16:19] <coolbhavi> dholbach, I can from next time if nobody beats me to it :)
[16:19] <dholbach> ok cool :)
[16:20] <dholbach> I don't have any updates for the meeting, but I just removed the "meeting times" bit from the agenda for next time
[16:20] <dholbach> it seems like there was little interest in moving it
[16:21] <coolbhavi> hmm I thought of freezing on motu school timings feedback so that we could have kick started motu school asap
[16:21]  * tumbleweed waves, but has to run
[16:21] <dholbach> ok, well then maybe we better clear out of the room and I'll just go update the agenda page with the proper date for next time
[16:21] <dholbach> coolbhavi, sounds good
[16:21] <coolbhavi> sure
[16:22] <coolbhavi> hey tumbleweed
[16:22] <dholbach> excellent - that was a very quick meeting then :)
[16:22] <coolbhavi> :)
[16:25] <coolbhavi> dholbach, anyways ll mail the list about proposed dates and times of MOTU school tomorrow and take discussion on list
[16:26] <dholbach> perfect, thanks a lot coolbhavi
[16:26] <coolbhavi> no mention dholbach
[16:32] <vibhav> .window 9
[18:00] <jono> alrighty folks
[18:00] <jono> #startmeeting
[18:00] <meetingology> Meeting started Thu Jun 28 18:00:20 2012 UTC.  The chair is jono. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
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[18:00] <jono> hey folks, and welcome to the very first Ubuntu Accomplishments meeting :-)
[18:00] <jono> who is here for the meeting?
[18:00] <notgary> I am o/
[18:01]  * cielak is here
[18:01] <highvoltage> "You've unlocked an accomplishment! Attending your first Ubuntu Accomplishments meeting!"
[18:01] <jono> highvoltage, LOL!
[18:01] <jono> well thanks folks for joining us
[18:01] <jono> there is not really a fixed agenda here, but I have a few topics I want to cover:
[18:01] <philipballew> 0/
[18:02] <jono>  * getting more accomplishments written
[18:02] <jono>  * getting more translation involvement
[18:02] <jono>  * testing
[18:02] <jono> does anyone else have any topics?
[18:03] <jono> ok then :-)
[18:03] <jono> maybe we can cover translations first
[18:03] <jono> so we have four projects -daemon -viewer -community-accomplishments and -desktop-accomplishments
[18:03] <jono> and then also the web gallery
[18:04] <cielak> I remember it was suggested that we bound some official translation groups to our project
[18:04] <jono> right now our translation coverage in the desktop app and daemon is pretty good
[18:04] <jono> but the accomplishments themselves is limited
[18:04] <jono> cielak, indeed
[18:04] <cielak> especially desktop ones, I wonder if they are available in more than 2 langs
[18:04] <hallino1> Me :)
[18:04] <jono> any thoughts on how we get more translators involved?
[18:04] <jono> it would be great if we had a translations leader who can help grow this community
[18:05] <jono> cielak, yeah
[18:05] <jono> is anyone interested in helping out with this?
[18:05] <cielak> I wonder whether we can't simply ask one of these translator organisations that translate everything in LP
[18:06] <cielak> like the Launchpad Translators
[18:06] <jono> cielak, like the Ubuntu translations groups?
[18:06] <jono> so maybe the next step is reaching out there
[18:06] <jono> I know some translators express concern about open permissions too
[18:06] <jono> so we might need to resolve that
[18:07] <cielak> we've had recently a case of translation mistake of griefing that coused a critical bug in viewer
[18:07] <jono> right
[18:07] <jono> ok, I will reach out to the translations groups to see if they can help us
[18:08] <jono> if anyone is passionate about this, do let us know
[18:08] <jono> we could definitely use some help here :-)
[18:08]  * gepatino is here
[18:08] <jono> hey gepatino, just the person
[18:08] <jono> gepatino, do you think it would be viable to provide a link in the web viewer so people can be linked to where they can translate opportunities?
[18:09] <jono> this might be a good way of getting more folks involved
[18:09] <notgary> How about writing some translation accomplishments -"You have make your first translation", "You have made 10 translations", "You have made 20 translations", etc. I have actually been thinking it would be cool to track Launchpad activity for acheivements, such as "You have merge X patches into Ubuntu". Perhaps this could be done for translations
[18:09] <jono> notgary, we would love to have that, but translations doesn't have an API in LP afaik
[18:09] <cielak> notgary: the problem with translations is that Launchpad API does not expose access to them
[18:10] <gepatino> jono, adding a link shouldn't be an issue
[18:10] <gepatino> should we check some rules? redirect so some specific language, etc?
[18:10] <jono> gepatino, cool - we would need to figure out how to generate a link to the correct strings, but we can look into that
[18:10] <cielak> notgary: and the problem with number-based accomplishments is that they often encourage pointless traffic
[18:10] <jono> gepatino, I am not sure of the details
[18:11] <jono> ok, so lets move on
[18:11] <jono> next I wanted to discuss testing
[18:11] <jono> cielak and I have been discussing this recently
[18:11] <gepatino> i was catching up... I meant it would be a problem to add link, thinking in linking to launchpad translations
[18:11] <jono> our codebase is growing, and so are our users, and thus the potential for bugs could increase
[18:11] <gepatino> then I've read about the translation groups not being open...
[18:11] <jono> gepatino, cool
[18:12] <jono> gepatino, well, open in terms of whether contributions are reviewed
[18:12] <jono> I think we should get advice from our translation community about how the translations are best governed
[18:12] <gepatino> ok
[18:12]  * cielak agrees
[18:12] <jono> so in terms of testing
[18:13] <jono> I would like to build unit test suites for all of our projects
[18:13] <jono> I know the web team are already working on this
[18:13] <jono> and I am planning on putting in place unit tests for the daemon
[18:13] <jono> I suspect the viewer is important but less critical than the daemon
[18:13] <jono> if the daemon gets it wrong, all viewers are screwed :-)
[18:14] <jono> hey janosTheHun
[18:14] <janosTheHun> hey jono !
[18:14] <cielak> viewer is just a bunch of GTK+ hacks, the real code is in the daemon ;)
[18:14] <jono> cielak, indeed :-)
[18:14] <jono> the other part of the testing which I wanted to discuss was how we test the server
[18:14] <jono> again, cielak and I discussed this a little earlier
[18:14]  * janosTheHun here now, but won't be long
[18:15] <jono> so while we have seen good traffic on the validation server, which suggests things are generally working well, there are sometimes issues, and these could be either U1 syncing delays or bugs in the server
[18:15] <cielak> janosTheHun: semi-final? :)
[18:15] <janosTheHun> cielak: yup :)
[18:15] <cielak> or generaly any case causing trouble with the validation process
[18:15] <cielak> there can be many more factors
[18:16] <jono> in terms of the U1 lag, I have a solution which I think could work - I will set up a U1 user who will generate some files and put the timestamp inside the file - when the file is synced we can compare the timestamps of the server to the file and get an idea of lag
[18:16] <jono> I think having visibility on U1 lag will help us in tracking down some issues
[18:16] <jono> I would also like the server testing to dynamically create and register shares and check on the success of that too
[18:16] <cielak> such file would be sent like each 10 minutes, or daily?
[18:16] <jono> cielak, I am thinking every 10 mins or so
[18:17] <jono> and then plot this into a a graph
[18:17] <jono> so we can compare when a bug occurs to the lag time
[18:17] <cielak> right
[18:17] <jono> bug X happened on 5th June, and oh look...U1 was lagging :-)
[18:17] <jono> in terms of ensuring the server is actually validating trophies correctly, I think the first step is probably unit tests
[18:18] <cielak> well, most our problems with validation server is not just lag, but no signature at all, yet that's a good idea nevertheless
[18:18] <jono> one challenge we have now is that if a user types in the wrong identification it will constantly fail
[18:18] <jono> cielak, right
[18:18] <jono> so a trophy not getting signed means either:
[18:19] <jono>  (1) the user is screwing around with .trophy files
[18:19] <jono>  (2) there is a bug in the code that uploads a trophy
[18:19] <cielak> 1) is unlike, if someone intentionally messes things up, they won't report a bug
[18:19] <jono> (3) the user entered extra-information that generated the .trophy and then changed it after it was synced, s when the server validates it the extra-info doesnt work
[18:20] <jono> yeah I think few people, if any are faking trophies
[18:20] <gepatino> (4) there is a bug in the code that validates the trophy
[18:20] <cielak> 3) is not valid, daemon will regenerate the trophy with new extrainfo, if it wasn't yet signed
[18:21] <jono> gepatino, oops, yes
[18:21] <philipballew> faking does not give you that good feeling that earning it does.
[18:21] <jono> cielak, right, but imagine this: the user adds e-a, it gets approved and generates a .trophy, that gets uploaded, they then change their e-i and U1 doesnt sync it yet
[18:21] <gepatino> so, the real programming bugs seems to be (2) and (4), am I right?
[18:21] <jono> philipballew, indeed
[18:22] <jono> gepatino, yup
[18:22] <cielak> jono: this happens just once, the next time the .trophy is sent it will be correct, and the server will sign it then
[18:22] <cielak> or will it not?
[18:22] <jono> cielak, agreed, I just mean that it is not inconceivable that there could be a mismatch
[18:23] <cielak> if I modify my .trophy and send a new version, will the server re-sign it?
[18:23] <jono> I do think we have some bugs in there somewhere
[18:23] <jono> cielak, if you already have the .asc, the server wont resign
[18:23] <jono> if you don't have the .asc it will try to sign
[18:23] <cielak> each time I upload a new version?
[18:23] <cielak> or just then the file is created?
[18:24] <jono> cielak, each time the file is updated
[18:24] <cielak> okay, that's correct then
[18:24] <jono> if you modify a file in U1 that is in a subscribed folder, it gets synced
[18:24] <cielak> so 3) is not really a problematic case
[18:25] <jono> cielak, right, I think the mismatch scenario is pretty rare anyway
[18:26] <cielak> indeed
[18:26] <jono> it will result in a logged failure on the server, but then just resolve itself
[18:26] <cielak> we better seek for bugs in the code :)
[18:26] <jono> what we need to identify is what is the source of the failures
[18:26] <jono> cielak, totally agree
[18:26] <jono> cielak, we just need to do more testing and find failures
[18:26] <janosTheHun> i recommend writing unit tests around this issue, and try to cover all the corner cases you can think of
[18:26] <jono> right now I think there is a lot we can do to get better visibility on failures
[18:26] <jono> janosTheHun, agreed
[18:27] <jono> janosTheHun, I was saying before you joined that I would like us to have unit tests for all of our projects
[18:27] <jono> and before we land code we can run the test suites
[18:28] <janosTheHun> jono: yup, good idea
[18:28] <cielak> we might also think to include some easy access to debug data
[18:29] <cielak> the daemon log file is working great
[18:29] <jono> cielak, what kind of debug data
[18:29] <cielak> for bug reports it's really useful
[18:29] <cielak> but there are other things we ask all users that report a bug
[18:29] <jono> cielak, I agree we might want to build some better debug tools into our software
[18:30] <cielak> like the share data, whether it got accepted, what files are in trophies directory
[18:30] <jono> one thing that could be useful for example is an easy way to see if a share is active
[18:30] <jono> yeah
[18:30] <jono> cielak, maybe we could add this to battery?
[18:30] <jono> add a switch to summarize system info
[18:30] <jono> accomplishments-battery -i for example
[18:30] <cielak> you have recently implemented support for getting our share data from the u1syncdaemon, what if we simply printed the result to the daemon log?
[18:30] <jono> and it displays the share status and other reporting
[18:31] <cielak> I'd integrate it with either daemon or viewer, so that when one reports a bug, we do not need to ask him to install the battery
[18:31] <jono> cielak, we could do that
[18:31] <jono> makes sense
[18:31] <jono> I am happy to take a look into that
[18:31] <jono> should be a simple addition :-)
[18:31] <cielak> actually, there is some bug in determining share ID, found it recently
[18:32] <jono> cielak, oh?
[18:32] <cielak> will need to take a closer look, but it makes me unable to publish my trophies :) (the shareid in URL does not match my actual shareid)
[18:32] <jono> cielak, I think I know this bug
[18:32] <jono> this might be because you have two active shares
[18:32] <cielak> nope, just one
[18:32] <jono> really?
[18:32] <jono> odd
[18:33] <cielak> yeah, will report it & investigate
[18:33] <jono> cool
[18:33] <jono> speaking of which....
[18:33] <jono> I have another suggestion
[18:33] <jono> I would like to suggest we have two log files
[18:33] <jono> daemon.log
[18:33] <jono> and scriptrunner.log
[18:33] <jono> the daemon is getting spammed with all the checks for accomplishments
[18:33] <cielak> aaah, that's wise
[18:33] <jono> which makes it difficult to read
[18:33] <janosTheHun> is there a wiki page about running the unit tests in the daemon project?
[18:33] <jono> janosTheHun, not yet, they don't exist
[18:34] <jono> janosTheHun, we have an original set of tests that hasnt been touched since January
[18:34] <jono> I need to go in and update them
[18:34] <jono> when I get a few working we can work together to build out full coverage
[18:34] <jono> cielak, would you be happy to split the daemon log into the two files?
[18:35] <jono> we may even want to have a log file standard info such as the share, share id, if it is active, trophydir etc
[18:35] <jono> so these daemon logs:
[18:35] <jono>  * daemon.log - general run time daemon info
[18:35] <jono>  * scriptrunner.log - log of when accomplishments are checked
[18:36] <jono>  * environment.log - a list of settings in the environment (e.g. share id, name, trophy dir, collections installed etc)
[18:36] <cielak> well, daemon.log will contain very little information, we might merge environment.log into it
[18:37] <jono> cielak, right, I was just thinking you would need to hunt it our in daemon.log
[18:37] <jono> whereas environment.log can just summarize
[18:37] <jono> I am happy with whatever you prefer though
[18:37] <cielak> maybe I'll try both, and compare which one makes more sense
[18:38] <cielak> we can have several instances of some 'logging' object, that would write to a single file
[18:38] <jono> cielak, awesome :-)
[18:38] <jono> indeed
[18:38] <jono> this will give us good visibility when people have issues
[18:38] <jono> cielak, we may want to consider this as a push into 2.1
[18:38] <jono> depending on how invasive it is
[18:38] <cielak> by the way: we have not created separate series for 0.2
[18:39] <cielak> thus we cannot separate 0.3 additions from 0.2.1 ones
[18:39] <jono> cielak, oops
[18:39] <jono> I will do that
[18:40] <jono> I will create the series, but we should probably only push critical fixes to 0.2.x
[18:40] <jono> so lets maybe do this in 0.3
[18:40] <jono> I will create the series today anyway
[18:40] <cielak> yeah, will be more time to test all that
[18:40] <janosTheHun> ok i guys i have to go, will try to do something for the daemon and then ping you
[18:40] <jono> cool
[18:40] <jono> laters janosTheHun! :-)
[18:40] <jono> thanks!
[18:40] <cielak> thanks janosTheHun, see you!
[18:41] <jono> so anything more to discuss on testing?
[18:42]  * cielak just pushed a tiny fix that significantly cleans up demon's log ;-)
[18:42] <jono> cielak, wow, you are fast, buddy :-)
[18:42] <jono> ok, so the final topic I wanted to discuss was growing our community of accomplishments writers
[18:42] <jono> I am a little behind on this
[18:43] <jono> I am planning on putting together documentation and a video for how to get people involved
[18:43] <cielak> it may be worth reminding that we have lots of forum accomplishments waiting
[18:43] <jono> but so far I have been focused on a few other things such as the branches
[18:43] <jono> cielak, oh we should look into that
[18:43] <cielak> and s-fox will be surely interested in developing them, but Canonical did not reply for some longer time
[18:44] <jono> yeah Canonical IS has not responded yet since his last email
[18:44] <jono> I will see if I can ping them to respond
[18:44] <jono> I also need to update the docs as battery now checks for missing fields in .accomplishment files
[18:44] <cielak> might be worth it, I can't imagine 0.3 release without forum accoms!
[18:44] <jono> indeed :-)
[18:44] <cielak> there is one more problem with the docs
[18:44] <jono> oh?
[18:45] <cielak> someone had problems with following the guide recently
[18:45] <cielak> the problem is with the order of chapters
[18:45] <cielak> I guess battery information is too soon
[18:45] <cielak> it assumes one has already installed the collection, that is working on a bazaar branch etc
[18:46] <jono> ahhh
[18:46] <cielak> so basically it requires knowledge from upcoming chapters
[18:46] <jono> we should ask people to file bugs in ubuntu-accomplishments for docs related issues
[18:46] <jono> cielak, could you ask that person to file a bug?
[18:46]  * cielak wanted to re-read the whole guide to determine causes, but hadn't yet time
[18:46] <jono> good idea
[18:47] <cielak> jono: sure, will try to
[18:47] <jono> and as we get more contributors involved it will help us spot other issues
[18:47] <jono> ok cool
[18:47] <jono> well I have covered everything I wanted to discuss today
[18:47] <jono> anything else?
[18:47] <cielak> wasn't it philipballew?
[18:48] <cielak> philipballew: are you still with us? ;-)
[18:48] <philipballew> yes!
[18:48] <cielak> awesome! would you mind reporting a bug in ubuntu-accomplishments concerning the troubles you had with following the guide on creating accomplishments?
[18:49] <philipballew> Yes. I will.
[18:49] <cielak> great thanks!
[18:49] <jono> ok, I guess we can wrap
[18:49] <cielak> maybe someone lurking has any questions concerning accomplishments?
[18:49] <jono> thanks folks for joining our first meeting!
[18:50] <jono> yeah, any questions?
[18:50] <jono> and remember that we live in #ubuntu-accomplishments
[18:50] <gepatino> is there any roadmap for web gallery to 0.3?
[18:50] <gepatino> or so far only the specs in the wiki?
[18:50] <philipballew> I am considering a simple video tutorial on making some for people who are not good at reading and understanding as they would be in they could see.
[18:51] <jono> gepatino, just the wiki right now
[18:51] <jono> but part of it is the Mobile spec
[18:51] <jono> did you see that gepatino?
[18:51] <jono> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Accomplishments/Specs/Mobile
[18:51] <jono> this is basically a stylesheet for the web gallery
[18:51] <jono> philipballew, that would be great
[18:52] <jono> my main advice is ensure that you have written a few accomplishments first before you do a tutorial
[18:52] <jono> someone else did a tutorial and they had not written an accomplishment and it wasnt so good
[18:52] <gepatino> i've read that, jono, thanks
[18:52] <jono> gepatino, cool
[18:53] <cielak> and of course such new accomplishments are very welcome! :)
[18:53] <gepatino> and finally, is there any release date for the web gallery? we are progressing but there are a lot of things to fix, like page layouts, check url schemas, etc
[18:53] <jono> gepatino, release date for 0.3 is Sep 5th
[18:54] <jono> so if we could shoot for then, that would be grea
[18:54]  * cielak has to remember it, hehe
[18:54] <jono> it would be cool to have it in place earlier so we can get some further testing
[18:54] <gepatino> sure, it would be nice to have one or two weeks before
[18:54] <cielak> hopefully we'll get trophies.ubuntu.com :)
[18:55] <jono> indeed :-)
[18:55] <jono> alright, lets wrap
[18:55] <jono> thanks, folks!
[18:55] <jono> #endmeeting
[18:55] <meetingology> Meeting ended Thu Jun 28 18:55:26 2012 UTC.
[18:55] <meetingology> Minutes (wiki):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-06-28-18.00.moin.txt
[18:55] <meetingology> Minutes (html):        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-06-28-18.00.html
[18:55] <cielak> thanks everyone, thanks jono!
[18:57] <jono> :-)
[18:59] <gepatino> see you guys


[00:25] <dodger_> MobileRoey: I'd be really surprised if it did
[00:25] <MobileRoey> right..
[00:25] <dodger_> it probably doesn't know about KDE or Phonon and pipes sound directly to ALSA
[00:26] <dodger_> hmmm
[00:26] <dodger_> hold on
[00:26] <dodger_> when you play a video, open the mixer
[00:26] <dodger_> (click the volume control icon in the system tray, then click mixer)
[00:27] <dodger_> then look at the playback streams tab and see if you can see the flash player's audio stream there
[00:27] <dodger_> if you do, right click on its icon at the top, and go to 'Move'
[00:27] <dodger_> there you should be able to select the output device for that particular stream
[00:39] <MobileRoey> ok
[00:39] <MobileRoey> ah wonderful, one moment then
[00:40] <MobileRoey> dodger_:  thanks! tha t worked!!! :)
[00:42] <MobileRoey> dodger_:  how can KDE do that?
[00:42] <MobileRoey> i.e. assert control over non-Phonon-compliant streams
[00:42] <MobileRoey> or maybe flash does play nice with phonon
[00:45] <dodger_> i actually don't know how that works exactly
[00:45] <dodger_> never looked into phonon in detail :P
[00:48] <MobileRoey> hehe thanks though :)
[00:48] <MobileRoey> hey do you know amarok + streaming?
[01:01] <dodger_> no, not really - like streaming from icecast servers and such?
[01:05] <MobileRoey> aye
[01:05] <MobileRoey> and charsets.
[01:06] <MobileRoey> I only see stuff like áñóə
[01:06] <MobileRoey> it's hebrew but the charset is off and I don't know how to fix it.  It appears like that in the Amarok titlebar
[01:06] <MobileRoey> (this changes wih the songs
[01:06] <MobileRoey> )
[01:11] <dodger_> sorry, i don't know anything about that
[01:14] <MobileRoey> aye ok
[01:14] <MobileRoey> thanks though
[04:28] <calcmandan> i'm looking for something that'll move my mouse pointer to 2-3 designated locations on my screen and done so within specific periods of time. anyone have a good cl tool that'll do this?
[04:33] <crudson> Any way to get the Virtual Desktop "Show desktop layout indicators" to appear on all monitors when switching, not just the one the mouse is on?
[05:38] <lordievader> calcmandan: xdotool + cron.
[05:50] <Guest71500> hi :D
[09:11] <Walex> Moscherkobold: IRC does not have a charset. IRC is "binary".
[09:11] <Borsi> is anyone using 7870, closed source driver with kernel 3.14 or higher?
[09:11] <Walex> Moscherkobold: oops, that was MobileRoey
[09:11] <Walex> Borsi: you probably :-)
[09:11] <Borsi> or any other ati card with latest kernels?
[09:12] <Borsi> well i am stuck at 3.13 series
[09:12] <Borsi> doesnt compile as module without some patch
[09:15] <lordievader> !info linux-image-generic
[09:16] <lordievader> Borsi: Probably not since Trusty doesn't carry 3.14 (or 3.15 for that matter).
[09:16] <Moscherkobold> Walex: np :)
[09:17] <Borsi> well kubuntu has quite recent kernel anyway
[09:17] <Borsi> but why are they maintaining kernel that has lack of support, why they just dont move to another kernel series?
[09:18] <lordievader> Borsi: That is the way Ubuntu works, releases will stick with the kernel version they originally got.
[09:59] <silv3r_m00n> hi
[09:59] <silv3r_m00n> recent versions of chromium/chrome are not integrating well with the oxygen theme of kde, any idea how to fix this ?
[11:06] <BluesKaj> 'Morning
[11:07] <mcstr> good morning
[16:21] <lordievader> Good evening.
[18:02] <chromahitcher> Hello world
[18:04] <lordievader> o/
[18:05] <bprompt> bon jour et tout de monde =P
[18:10] <BluesKaj> hmm bprompt , is that supposed to be french ? :)
[18:11] <bprompt> sorta =)
[20:52] <cyberlala> hi am new
[20:55] <genii> Too bad they left before I could welcome them with a mug of coffee.
[23:20] <OxDeadC0de> hey guys, got a fresh install of kubuntu 14.04, it was working great, but the power went out and the system went down. when it came back up, lightdm isn't showing the kde desktop option, so I can't log into any desktop really..
[23:21] <OxDeadC0de> how can I get it showing kde, or plasma-desktop or whatever the entry was, again?
[23:22] <Pibble> do you have a terminal
[23:22] <Pibble> ?
[23:22] <OxDeadC0de> yea
[23:22] <OxDeadC0de> well, control+alt+f1 term
[23:22] <OxDeadC0de> no options for.. anything at lightdm
[23:23] <Pibble> doing a quick search for you, might be able to help out
[23:23] <Pibble> gimme 5
[23:23] <OxDeadC0de> thanks, I'll be searching too
[23:24] <Pibble> Try ctrl alt f7?
[23:24] <Pibble> You can stop KDE with init 3
[23:24] <Pibble> then restart with init 5
[23:25] <OxDeadC0de> Lightdm is working, xorg is running, it's just, not showing any options for choosing the desktop manager to use
[23:25] <OxDeadC0de> have rebooted just to make sure
[23:25] <Pibble> Oh weird
[23:25] <Pibble> xorg config could be messed up
[23:25] <Pibble> Ive had it blank itself out before
[23:26] <OxDeadC0de> lightdm if anything is the one messed up
[23:26] <OxDeadC0de> tried dpkg-reconfigure --force lightdm, didn't do anything
[23:26] <Pibble> Full purge of the package and reinstall?
[23:26] <OxDeadC0de> probably some other package that ties lightdm and plasma-workspace together, adding the config entry for the DM to lightdm
[23:26] <Pibble> Might fix it for you
[23:26] <OxDeadC0de> I'll try that
[23:27] <Pibble> It SHOULD work like it did out of box
[23:27] <Pibble> might reset some settings
[23:28] <Pibble> But it could also purge some dependecies so be prepared for that
[23:30] <OxDeadC0de> it wanted to purge lightdm, lightdm-kde-greeter, and nvidia-prime. will take a second to get reinstalled.. need to find a network cable ;)
[23:30] <OxDeadC0de> also tried dpkg-reconfigure --force lightdm-kde-greeter, no change
[23:30] <Pibble> Yeah, those arent system breaking if purged
[23:30]  * OxDeadC0de nods
[23:30] <Pibble> It should work fine with defualt settings once reinstalled
[23:30] <Pibble> If it worked before that is
[23:30] <OxDeadC0de> the issue was that it was in the middle of updating packages when the power cut out for 3 hours while we upgraded the lines.. guess it didn't finish writing everything to disk
[23:31] <Pibble> Very possible
[23:31] <OxDeadC0de> *while we upgraded the power lines
[23:31] <Pibble> corrupt .config somewhere and everything is garbled
[23:31] <Pibble> xorg is finicky with anything that ties into it
[23:34] <OxDeadC0de> reinstall of the 3 packages had the same result. am trying apt-get update && apt-get upgrade
[23:35] <Pibble> I dont use lightdm so I dont know your exact setup D:
[23:37] <OxDeadC0de> it's just a fresh 14.04 from the dvd iso (installed via usb && yumi multiboot), with whatever updated packages the notification popup wanted me to upg
[23:37] <OxDeadC0de> 32-bit even.. shoulda done 64-bit.. but whatever.
[23:37] <Pibble> Ive had the iso's not burn right before
[23:37] <Pibble> Got a 99% working system that went down a couple days later
[23:37] <Pibble> after updates
[23:37] <OxDeadC0de> *installed from usb*, not burned
[23:38] <OxDeadC0de> ^_^
[23:38] <Pibble> Still, could be a bad download?
[23:38] <OxDeadC0de> I doubt it. is working fine on the other computers.
[23:38] <Pibble> Ah
[23:38] <Pibble> If its fresh you may try and full reinstall if you have the time.
[23:38] <Pibble> If you cant troubleshoot it that is
[23:39] <Pibble> may save you time in the long run
[23:39] <OxDeadC0de> yeah, I may end up doing that. hate that option, but at least it's there.
[23:40] <Pibble> And maybe
[23:40] <Pibble> get the 64 bit iso ;P
[23:42] <OxDeadC0de> bbiab, changing the breaker that powers the modem and router in the basement.
[23:51] <OxDeadC0de> am trying dpkg-reconfigure --force -a before hosing it.
[23:57] <OxDeadC0de> oh neat, can re-enable control+alt+backspace by doing dpkg-reconfigure --force keyboard-configuration


[12:48] <v0lZy> hi
[12:48] <v0lZy> anyone able to help with NetworkManager/Cockpit/Netplan/Openvswitch ...
[12:48] <v0lZy> having some issues
[12:49] <v0lZy> I'd like cockpit to show updates
[12:49] <v0lZy> but it pesters that its offline.
[12:49] <v0lZy> I have netplan, in which I have dhcp4: false for enp3s0 and enp4s0
[12:49] <v0lZy> enp3s0 is in an openvswitch bridge
[12:50] <v0lZy> bridge has static IP assigned and is my main connection to the internet
[12:50] <v0lZy> nmcli con picks up 'netplan-enp3s0' and 'netplan-enp4s0', but for netplan-enp4s0 it doesn't find a device
[13:11] <v0lZy> OK, managed to somehow configure it
[13:12] <v0lZy> but even with a valid IP (however no gateway), doesnt seem to help with the cockpit problem
[17:23] <gimzmoe> I've got a gaming laptop I want to use as a server, when I install the nvidia drivers and reboot it stays with nouveau drivers.  Any ideas for troubleshooting?


[22:45] <trippeh> so, hum, casper doesnt support ipv6 netboot?
[22:49] <trippeh> oh that stuff is in initramfs-tools now
[23:04] <trippeh> it gets a ipv6 address and route now - but still stuck in a loop re-trying dhcpcd
[23:05] <trippeh> with no errors :)
[23:07] <trippeh> ip6=any ip=off seems broken
[23:18] <trippeh> aha, I see the bug
[23:22] <trippeh> hm maybe not. but it did time out eventually and then boot successfully.
[23:25] <trippeh> fetching the iso and everything.
[23:57] <blahdeblah> What's the preferred mechanism for installing non-packaged pip modules and making them available system-wide, now that python is aggressively fighting against the system package manager?
[23:58] <blahdeblah> Do we just use --break-system-packages and continue on our merry way, or is there a better option?


[01:14] <pleia2> ok, we now have rt.ubuntu.com #17485 for getting a blog set up, we'll see what they say :)
[01:31] <jledbetter> Fantastic :)
[15:58] <pleia2> wow
[15:58] <pleia2> http://blog.ubuntu-women.org/
[15:59] <hypatia> :D
[15:59] <hypatia> that was quick!
[15:59] <pleia2> quickest ever!
[15:59] <hypatia> :D :D :D
[16:00] <Cheri703> nice!
[16:06] <svaksha> cool
[16:14] <Pendulum> pleia2: I didn't know they were allowed to approve things that quickly ;-)
[16:16] <pleia2> Pendulum: me neither :) it took us weeks to get the xubuntu wordpress *staging* site set up
[16:17] <pleia2> but maybe since they've approved wordpress they've been working through a quick deployment process
[16:20] <Pendulum> *nods*
[16:27] <Pendulum> is it a full moon?
[16:28] <maco> pleia2: did 3 months pass and i missed it?
[16:28] <pleia2> lol
[17:35] <MichelleQ> jledbetter: there's something obvious missing from that list.  The loco members need to 1) be told, and 2) tell their spouses that spouses are welcome.  I can't tell you how many of the wives/so's/girlfriends of our team said "I really didn't think I was invited".
[17:57] <JanC> and the same for husbands/boyfriends/children/parents/...? ;)   (in case they are not (yet) active in the loco, and if bringing them along makes it more likely that somebody comes to a loco event)
[17:58] <pleia2> of course, but we're talking about our "Best Practices For Attracting More Women To Your Team"
[18:03] <pleia2> (anyway spouse can be male or female)
[18:05] <vish> Flossie > https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/2011-July/030750.html
[18:06] <pleia2> cool
[18:10] <JanC> pleia2: being allowed/encouraged to bring along somebody else might convince the woman/girl to come herself, in some cases, I think?
[18:10] <pleia2> JanC: of course everyone should be made welcome
[18:59] <pleia2> http://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2/5940406445
[18:59] <pleia2> :)
[19:00] <hypatia> pleia2: omg!
[19:01] <pleia2> I am in love with the simplicity of the magnet (I got 25 of them)
[19:01] <pleia2> the post card could have been formatted better, since the dimensions of the image were made for the business card, but it works :)
[19:04] <pleia2> 500 business cards, 100 post cards, 25 magnets cost me about $15 w/ shipping
[19:04] <maco> and $5 to upload image i think?
[19:05] <pleia2> I included that, technically the business cards were free (they send out deals for free stuff every 25 seconds)
[20:18] <pleia2> ok, before I let it into the wild properly, comments? http://blog.ubuntu-women.org/
[20:19] <pleia2> the idea of writing a theme and going through the process of getting it approved and installed kinda makes me want to crawl into a hole, so I'm inclined to stick with default until later
[20:19] <pleia2> (maybe next cycle :) we have wiki theme to finish!)
[20:22] <pleia2> also wondering whether we should keep comments enabled, I'm tempted to go with "everything gets moderated" because I don't want cruel/painful/triggery stuff showing up
[20:24] <maco> is it wp?
[20:24] <maco> wp has a "moderate a user's first comment then once they're approved let them through from then on" setting
[20:25] <maco> i think its even the default
[20:26] <pleia2> yeah, wp
[20:26] <pleia2> maco: want an account on it? I can set it up now
[20:26] <maco> sure
[20:27] <pleia2> which email address to use? and what username?
[20:41] <maco> we now have Akismet setup on the blog
[20:41] <pleia2> thanks maco!
[20:41] <pleia2> wanna check the comment settings for sanity?
[20:42] <maco> If I ever leave, someone has to get a new API key though because i didn't choose the free option but if i'm not involved i'm not going to want to pay anymore either :P
[20:42] <maco> (it's "pay what you like" for non-business blogs)
[21:29] <JanC> pleia2: if you are looking for comments on the theme, the "header" part is way to high IMO (I'm pretty sure all content is out of view on a netbook?)
[21:34] <JanC> scratch that question mark, I had a look on my EEE 900 and the bottom of the screen is about halfway the black horizontal "menu bar"
[21:41] <pleia2> JanC: we're going to work on the theme next cycle
[21:42] <pleia2> we've got too much going on right now (and still have a wiki theme to complete!)
[21:42] <JanC> ☺
[22:44] <valorie> I like the theme as it is - simple
[23:11] <pleia2> there, the links are now the same orange as our logo
[23:34] <pleia2> can someone mail the list about UDS sponsorship opening up? I updated http://wiki.ubuntu-women.org/UDS (as updated as it'll get for now)
[23:35] <pleia2> but I have to email the list about the blog, and I think people might get sick of hearing from me :)
[23:35] <nigelb> Is it just me or is sponsorship process really early this time?
[23:35] <pleia2> it's really early, yay!
[23:35] <Cheri703> that was something we asked about, so people could get visas and such
[23:35] <pleia2> I hear some people need to get VISAs and things
[23:35]  * pleia2 nudges nigelb
[23:35] <nigelb> *cough*
[23:35] <pleia2> Mr. I-got-my-visa-12-hours-before-my-flight
[23:35] <pleia2> :)
[23:35] <nigelb> hehe
[23:35] <nigelb> pleia2: highvoltage has a better one. 2 to 3 hours before flight :D
[23:36] <pleia2> haha, wow
[23:37] <Cheri703> every time I see his sn, I have the chorus from this run through my head >.< http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2a4gyJsY0mc
[23:37] <nigelb> lol
[23:39] <Cheri703> also, that video is insane
[23:39]  * Cheri703 had never seen it before, sorry for inflicting it on you guys
[23:40] <pleia2> hahaha
[23:41] <Cheri703> o.O
[23:41] <Cheri703> for anyone reading the logs...sorry
[23:44] <AlanBell> I did some wordpress theme modifications for ubuntu-uk.org


[07:37] <webchat80> good morning
[07:37] <webchat80> I am new with in the community, and hoping to get some assistance
[09:30] <teddy-dbear> Morning peoples, critters and everything else


[14:48] <Palintheus> @schedule chicago
[15:50] <effie_jayx> @now
[16:13] <RoAkSoAx> @now
[17:04] <juliux> hi
[17:04] <juliux> meeting will start after we get some drinks at uds;)
[17:05] <JanC> hehe, I just fetched a beer from the fridge (had to run to be home in time)  ;)
[17:05] <effie_jayx> juliux,  you guys are elite :(
[17:06]  * effie_jayx settles from a papercup of water
[17:06] <juliux> chairman?
[17:06] <effie_jayx> I can do
[17:06] <juliux> cool
[17:06] <effie_jayx> is anyone here?
[17:06] <popey> moo
[17:06] <juliux> moo
[17:06] <effie_jayx> everyone I ment
[17:07] <Syntux> Hey, I'm bit late;
[17:07] <juliux> don`t worry
[17:07] <effie_jayx> anybody else from the Council?
[17:07] <juliux> boredandblogging: ready?
[17:07] <effie_jayx> JanC is here
[17:08] <boredandblogging> ok
[17:08] <boredandblogging> i think the first thing on the agenda was mine
[17:08] <juliux> think we should take a look to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncilAgenda and we should discusee what we are doing today
[17:08] <boredandblogging> yeah
[17:08] <effie_jayx> boredandblogging,  you chairman then
[17:09] <Syntux> +1 for discussing legal entities
[17:09] <juliux> Syntux: i think we will not doing this today
[17:10] <juliux> the cc meetings aid to the denish team that they should work on a provopsal
[17:10] <boredandblogging> ok
[17:10] <boredandblogging> jjj
[17:10] <Syntux> ok
[17:11] <JanC> I know that the Dutch team is thinking about legal entities too
[17:11] <juliux> yes
[17:11] <juliux> i think we should wait untile the cc had made a discussion
[17:11] <JanC> juliux: you talked to SWAT I guess?
[17:11] <effie_jayx> boredandblogging,  shall we begin then?
[17:11] <JanC> SWAT = Sebastian
[17:12] <juliux> JanC: yes but not about legel entities
[17:12] <Syntux> I sent an email including a concept letter to Mark, Alan, Juliux and Nick regarding that issue.
[17:12] <juliux> effie_jayx: yes pls
[17:12] <huats_> effie_jayx: boredandblogging has some connection pb
[17:12] <juliux> Syntux: wen you sned it?
[17:12] <effie_jayx> ok
[17:12] <juliux> when
[17:12] <Syntux> juliux,  19 May
[17:13] <juliux> Syntux: no mail here from you
[17:13] <Syntux> actually I have a meeting with HRH Princess Sumaya next week and this is why I'm pushing for discussing legal entities.
[17:13] <bandb_uds> this is nick, I'm using popey's eee
[17:13] <effie_jayx> juliux,  shall we hold on for boredandblogging  then?
[17:13] <Syntux> juliux, I sent it to<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[17:14] <bandb_uds> ok, lets do the first thing on the agenda
[17:14] <popey> agreed bandb_uds
[17:14] <bandb_uds> my idea is that we need to come up with a formal mission statement
[17:14] <bandb_uds> basically...
[17:14] <bandb_uds> a purpose statement
[17:15] <bandb_uds> I've noticed a lot of confusion in the community...
[17:15] <bandb_uds> and the press between Ubuntu and Canonical
[17:15] <bandb_uds> so lots of new LoCos
[17:15] <bandb_uds> think that Canonical should provide us with everything
[17:15] <juliux_> Syntux, that is not a valid email address
[17:15] <juliux_> bandb_uds, good
[17:15] <juliux_> Syntux, pls use<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[17:15] <popey> Syntux<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[17:15] <bandb_uds> While Canonical obviously is Ubuntu's main sponsor
[17:15] <juliux_> yes that is a real issue
[17:15] <bandb_uds> we obviously aren't the same thing
[17:16] <bandb_uds> I think we need to get into the habit of the LoCos supporting ourselves
[17:16] <Syntux> juliux, popey sent.
[17:16] <bandb_uds> and not being so dependent on Canonical
[17:16] <juliux_> Syntux, thxs
[17:16] <nixternal> GO LOCO!
[17:16] <nixternal> or go crazy, whichever fits the best :p
[17:16] <bandb_uds> then LoCos know who to contact (other LoCos)
[17:16] <bandb_uds> and it takes pressure off Canonical
[17:17] <bandb_uds> to support us so much
[17:17] <bandb_uds> so thats my main thing
[17:17] <bandb_uds> I want LoCos to work together to help ourselves
[17:17] <juliux_> i think that sounds real great idea, to push that "mission" to the locos
[17:17] <popey> I agree that there is a lack of perception of LoCo in the community
[17:17] <popey> and what LoCos do, and what canonical and the wider Ubuntu project is "obliged" to contribute to those LoCos
[17:18] <huats_> bandb_uds: that is I think the idea that jono want to promotte with loco twinning
[17:18] <Nafallo> makes sense
[17:18] <popey> yes, with twinning an "approved" loco could "twin" with an unapproved loco to help them build up and get approved
[17:18] <juliux_> i think i we get this statement clear to the loco teams there is a benfit for the locos so they know what support they get from canonical and what not and there is a win for canonical because the locoteams will grow on there own side
[17:19] <bandb_uds> huats_: I agree, LoCos helping LoCos
[17:19] <effie_jayx> how is twining different from mentoring
[17:19] <huats_> and I think that to push to further it is almost the idea of independency that is on stake
[17:19] <bandb_uds> I think twining/mentoring is part of it, but like popey said, there is a perception issue
[17:20] <effie_jayx> right
[17:20] <effie_jayx> so we are to decide on the mission of the council? or is there a proposal for a mission statement
[17:20] <JanC> maybe we'll have to write down some suggestions or rules about sponsoring & cooperation with other companies too?
[17:20] <juliux_> i think we are mixing issues, at first we should spread the mission and then work on the misson;)
[17:20] <bandb_uds> the LoCos are not extension of Canonical, we need to support ourselves
[17:21] <huats_> bandb_uds: +1
[17:21] <juliux_> bandb_uds, +1
[17:21] <doctormo> hello
[17:21] <popey> we need to be self sustaining
[17:22] <huats_> I mean we shoudl accept any help from canonical but not depend/wait on it
[17:22] <bandb_uds> popey: exactly
[17:22] <popey> and not keep asking for it :)
[17:22] <bandb_uds> right, we shouldn't have expectations
[17:22] <huats_> popey: definitly
[17:22] <bandb_uds> ok, so I think we are agreed in general?
[17:22] <popey> well, we shouldn't have _high_ expectations
[17:22] <bandb_uds> popey: fair enough :-)
[17:23] <effie_jayx> +1
[17:23] <nxvl> that what i was telling you about, in Peru we are having this ways to have our own incomes
[17:23] <popey> i think if we're more self sustaining then when we do ask for stuff from Canonical, we may actually get something
[17:23] <popey> if we can prove that we can do this stuff on our own
[17:23] <doctormo> popey: I think it's more important to work with Canonical and other LoCo teams than to beg from them.
[17:23] <popey> prove that we can work without their help
[17:23] <popey> doctormo: canonical have a very limited resource for "us"
[17:23] <popey> that's why I suggest that we try to help eachother, support eachother
[17:24] <doctormo> popey: but we don't, and we're not yet offering somethign in return.
[17:24] <doctormo> popey: And I agree about cross support
[17:24] <popey> doctormo: "we don't" what?
[17:24] <bandb_uds> exactly what popey sai
[17:24] <huats_> and the great side that if we do not depend on canonical we can still have our own word...
[17:24] <popey> ask canonical?
[17:24] <popey> ok, so we need to come up with a simple mission statement
[17:24] <popey> and send to the list for approval?>
[17:25] <popey> and the cc?
[17:25] <juliux_> so we will write the mission down then we will send it to the lococontacts liste and will discuss it here;)
[17:25] <juliux_> i think cc is good
[17:25] <bandb_uds> i think we can cc the cc into it
[17:25] <popey> ok, shall we move on?
[17:25] <juliux_> yes pls;)
[17:25] <bandb_uds> but yeah, lets come up with a few suggestions and try them out on the loco-contacts
[17:25] <bandb_uds> yes
[17:25] <effie_jayx> yep
[17:26] <bandb_uds> effie_jayx: you next?
[17:26] <effie_jayx> ok
[17:26] <doctormo> To advocate and communicate the availability of ubuntu as an alternative in local communities?
[17:26] <effie_jayx> we were working on the new approval process for LoCo teams
[17:27] <effie_jayx> and one of the elements needed to help us decide if a team is ready or not is a set of rules or guidelines that the CC has used for the longest time
[17:28] <effie_jayx> we have all worked together to give some more definition to these guidelines and you can find them  here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil/TeamApprovalGuidelines
[17:28] <effie_jayx> these come from a suggestion from jono and they have some little things I have added
[17:28] <effie_jayx> Shall we go through this quickly?
[17:29] <effie_jayx> just to see if we all agree on this
[17:29] <bandb_uds> effie_jayx: yes
[17:29] <effie_jayx> great
[17:29]  * popey reads
[17:29]  * juliux_ reads
[17:30] <effie_jayx> These guidelines see that the Team sees the approval not only as a reward but also a commitment to continue participating asactive or even more
[17:30] <popey> is this copy/pasted from what the cc used to use?
[17:30] <effie_jayx> popey,  I added some elements
[17:30] <effie_jayx> and defined a bit
[17:31] <popey> I am uneasy about the "trusted with CD" element
[17:31] <effie_jayx> Do the council feel this team could be trusted with additional resources such as additional CDs and being sent equipment for use?, Extra resources encourage more participation therefore, Being able to administer their resources is paramount, making sure that the team has what they need to promote ubuntu locally .
[17:32] <doctormo> my system76 computer crashed, can you guys recap
[17:32] <juliux_> !log?
[17:33] <effie_jayx> popey,  what exactly do you feel is questionable?
[17:33] <popey> if a loco passes all the other criteria, then by implication they would be responsible
[17:33] <popey> it's an unncessary requirement
[17:33] <effie_jayx> popey,  right... it looks tacky?
[17:33] <popey> a bit, yes
[17:33] <juliux_> i also think it is not a requirement
[17:33] <JanC> you mean the word "trusted" can be seen as offending to some people?
[17:33] <popey> e.g. if a loco passed all the others, how would you measure that one?
[17:34] <effie_jayx> popey,  I left it untouched
[17:34] <bandb_uds> i agree with popey
[17:34] <Syntux> and if I may state my opinion, mailing list activities isn't a  good measure for team activities in all cases; in our case Ubuntu-Jo it's easier to call for a meeting by phoning the members and it's easier to meet face-2-face than setting up IRC meeting or discussing anything over the mailing list, this is how we have been doing it and it works like charm here.
[17:34] <popey> ok, it's possible people could take CDs and ebay them
[17:34] <effie_jayx> I think we must ask what the rationale was behind it
[17:35] <juliux_> popey, yes it is possible but if they sell them localy you didn't get a notification about this
[17:35] <effie_jayx> Syntux,  sounds good to you, but how do you journalize these meetings?
[17:35] <JanC> Syntux: do you make meeting reports afterwards then?
[17:35] <juliux_> so i think that is a point which we can' t "controlled"
[17:35] <popey> exactly, so it seems somewhat moot
[17:35] <popey> maybe we could get clarification on that from the cc
[17:35] <Syntux> effie_jayx, JanC yeah we put MOMs in google DOCs and/or we take the action directly
[17:35] <popey> but I am overall happy with the rest of it
[17:36] <nxvl> yes, but you can see at the events photos or with some prove about events that their are going to use the right way
[17:36] <popey> Syntux: could you paste them into the wiki?
[17:36] <nxvl> i think
[17:36] <effie_jayx> popey,  we could discuss further to try and sencibilize that bit of the guidelines
[17:36] <popey> yes effie_jayx
[17:36] <nxvl> should not be a hard point to take care about, but an optional one which gives extra point
[17:36] <m-c> I find voice communication most effective to determine who is really interested in real-life loco activities.  Replies to a mailing list are much less effective indicators.
[17:36] <bandb_uds> adding photos or wiki reports would be excellent
[17:36] <nxvl> points*
[17:36] <popey> but overall, +1 from me for that list
[17:36] <effie_jayx> notice the wording to ensure further participation
[17:36] <juliux_> Syntux, in general irc and mailinglist is easier to access for everybody so we recommend that, but i a locoteam is doing it an other thing well, i think we will not have any problems with that
[17:36] <Syntux> popey, of course we can do that; but why the MOMs matter?
[17:37] <bandb_uds> we need to see some evidence that something is going on
[17:37] <effie_jayx> most people see approval as a goal ... a place you reach
[17:37] <popey> Syntux: it's a central place for everyone to collaborate
[17:37] <juliux_> this rules are not written on stone so i am happy with that list
[17:37] <popey> Syntux: we request team reports to be placed on the wiki
[17:37] <effie_jayx> and then it's all downhill from there.. and it is not... It is where the real commintment begins
[17:37] <huats_> effie_jayx: that is why I think tthere is a need for re-approval (which is the next point)
[17:37] <effie_jayx> great then
[17:38] <effie_jayx> so all in favor let's vote to approve (with comments)
[17:38] <popey> +1
[17:38] <JanC> maybe the team leadership shouldn't always be concentrated into 1 person?
[17:38] <juliux_> +1
[17:38] <popey> (with clarification from cc)
[17:38] <bandb_uds> +1 for clarification
[17:38] <Syntux> popey, we do reports but not MOMs because it's usually (jad call X arrange for Y, Faisal burn the CDs with his gamers friends, Khamis prepare lecture for X and Y) and we don't see any meaning of publishing such thing.
[17:38] <doctormo> what are we voting on? I see no statement
[17:38] <JanC> (otherwise I'm also +1 on this)
[17:39] <popey> Syntux: we could discuss this on the locoteams mailing list if you like?
[17:39] <popey> I'm sure others would value this conversation, and getting involved in it
[17:39] <JanC> Syntux: the meaning is us seeing you are doing something  ;)
[17:39] <juliux_> doctormo about https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil/TeamApprovalGuidelines
[17:39] <Syntux> popey, sure I will move it there.
[17:39] <juliux_> Syntux, thxs
[17:39] <popey> cool, thanks Syntux
[17:40] <Syntux> JanC, we do report activities after it's done but not meetings.
[17:40] <juliux_> so next point?
[17:40] <effie_jayx> JanC,  do the guidelines make reference to just one Contact?
[17:40] <huats_> Syntux: I mean, even if you don't do a MOM right now, then you should in the future
[17:40] <bandb_uds> re-approval dates
[17:40] <JanC> Leadership within the team must be build upon fairness and openess. The team must be in agreement with the fair apointment of a leader. This leader must represent the team in different situations in an efficient and effective manner, so the leader's commitment towards the team is paramount.
[17:40] <juliux_> we have 20minutes left so pls lets move on
[17:40] <popey> JanC: again, another one for the list - open discussion IMO
[17:41] <bandb_uds> i've added anniversary dates for when some LoCos need to be re-approved
[17:41] <JanC> okay  ツ
[17:41] <popey> I'd like to see the question of leadership discussed, it's an interesting topic I have opinions on
[17:41] <popey> but we don't really have time for it here I think
[17:41] <bandb_uds> if there is no anniversary date for them, the LoCos were approved more than a year ago
[17:41] <bandb_uds> and need to be reapproved anyway
[17:41] <juliux_> popey, we can do that on the next cc meeting
[17:41] <effie_jayx> bandb_uds,  have we decided on the procedure for this to happen then
[17:42] <juliux_> effie_jayx, the process will be the same like a first approval;)
[17:42] <bandb_uds> effie_jayx: for re-approval
[17:42] <bandb_uds> we talked about starting with 3
[17:42] <bandb_uds> that already need to go through re-approval
[17:42] <juliux_> bandb_uds, 4;)
[17:42] <popey> 4 teams for re-approval in the first meeting
[17:43] <bandb_uds> 4, sorry, contacting thenm
[17:43] <bandb_uds> and going through the process
[17:43] <effie_jayx> I thought we said something less paperwork like
[17:43] <popey> giving them warning
[17:43] <juliux_> effie_jayx, there is a loft of this on the community-loco-council document on gobby.ubuntu.com
[17:43] <nxvl> why did you re-approve teams?
[17:43] <popey> to ensure they continue to do good work
[17:43] <popey> and don't go stale
[17:43] <popey> or disappear
[17:43] <nxvl> or
[17:43] <juliux_> and to see if they needs some help from the council
[17:44] <popey> and to motivate them to do more good work
[17:44] <nxvl> oh, so is kind of a loco membership expiration?
[17:44] <popey> yes agreed juliux_
[17:44] <bandb_uds> being approved isn't the goal, its just a milestone
[17:44] <effie_jayx> nxvl,  to make sure they live...
[17:44] <popey> yes nxvl
[17:44] <bandb_uds> so...
[17:44] <effie_jayx> ajam
[17:44] <juliux_> when we will start with reapproval?
[17:44] <bandb_uds> we will soon be contacting 4 locos that need to approved
[17:44] <popey> we need to schedule who is going to be looked at first and let them know as soon as possible
[17:44] <juliux_> and how we will select the 4 teams?
[17:44] <popey> juliux_: random
[17:45] <bandb_uds> randomly
[17:45] <juliux_> random is good
[17:45] <juliux_> so we will give them 2 month time? or 1month?
[17:45] <popey> cat /dev/urandom > juliux_
[17:45] <bandb_uds> and lets see they all need to be reapproved by July
[17:45] <popey> where "all" means all 4
[17:45] <bandb_uds> s/see/say
[17:45] <effie_jayx> can we have updates on their process to have a clear idea on what they need to do and how they have done it and if they found any problems aloing the way?
[17:45] <popey> yes effie_jayx
[17:45] <popey> and offer help
[17:45] <popey> mentorship
[17:45] <bandb_uds> effie_jayx: yeah, thats a good idea
[17:45] <effie_jayx> popey,  exactly
[17:45] <popey> etc, if they are having difficulties
[17:46] <juliux_> so we have to select 4 teams for reapproval in july;)
[17:46] <popey> yes
[17:46] <nxvl> and how it will work if the LoCo still works, but the leader has disapear with all the access?
[17:46] <juliux_> who will run the random skript?
[17:46] <juliux_> nxvl, we will work with the loco to find a new leader
[17:46] <popey> nxvl: we work that out with the loco
[17:46] <effie_jayx> juliux_,  bandb_uds has a compehensive list already
[17:46] <popey> :)
[17:46] <juliux_> bandb_uds, pls take 4;)
[17:47] <nxvl> well, i don't think the problem will be the leadership, but the permissions/access to the mailling lists, irc channels, etc...
[17:48] <JanC> yeah, maybe it's a good time for locoteams to check those things  ;)
[17:48] <juliux_> ok the council wil select 4 and then inform them privatly
[17:48] <popey> ..rather than announce it here so they are under the spotlight
[17:48] <juliux_> nxvl, that are points we can work together withthem;)
[17:49] <bandb_uds> ok, so next point?
[17:49] <doctormo> Have any of the other LoCo teams considered LoCo specific development projects? Getting some software that helps us organise?
[17:49] <popey> nxvl: we have processes in place for fixing things like that with ubuntu ops, forum mods etc
[17:49] <popey> doctormo: I'd send that to the loco list if I were you
[17:49] <popey> as it's not an agenda item right now
[17:49] <JanC> popey: but reapproval can be a good time for teams to think about such things
[17:50] <juliux_> yes lets come to the next point;)
[17:50] <doctormo> popey: Oh I thought you'd ran out of items, you seem to be just talking about the same thing over and over.
[17:50] <popey> JanC: yes, but we don't want to put them in the spotlight before _they_ know :)
[17:50] <effie_jayx> next up: Resource Allocation Process Doc - any progress?
[17:50] <viperhoot> with the reapproval, the loco teams again considered new?
[17:51] <bandb_uds> who was supposed to do that?
[17:51] <JanC> viperhoot: not new, just not dead  ;)
[17:52] <popey> doctormo: seen the agenda?
[17:52] <JanC> bandb_uds: popey?
[17:52] <juliux_> popey, ?
[17:52] <popey> hmm?
[17:52] <popey> was it me?
[17:52] <bandb_uds> hold on
[17:52] <juliux_> Resource Allocation Process Doc
[17:52] <juliux_> ?
[17:52] <popey> not done yet
[17:53] <bandb_uds> ok
[17:53] <popey> postpone to next meeting
[17:53] <bandb_uds> next?
[17:53] <bandb_uds> conflict resolution
[17:53] <bandb_uds> juliux?
[17:53] <juliux_> it is started but not finished
[17:53] <juliux_> i will work on this during this week
[17:54] <bandb_uds> next?
[17:54] <bandb_uds> legal entities
[17:54] <Syntux> JordanTeam ?
[17:54] <popey> juliux_: grab us if you need help this week given we're in UDS
[17:54] <JanC> legal entities
[17:54] <juliux_> legal entities are up to the community council
[17:55] <effie_jayx> sounds fair to me
[17:55] <bandb_uds> yeah, the CC discussed it yesterday
[17:55] <juliux_> the denish team has the task to write a proposal for that
[17:55] <bandb_uds> please check their logs
[17:55] <juliux_> so lets wait
[17:55] <effie_jayx> I suggest we all be there when a final resolve on the issue is given
[17:55] <effie_jayx> all the LoCo council
[17:56] <popey> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/loco-contacts/2008-May/002198.html
[17:56] <JanC> if possible, yes
[17:56] <popey> so we need to talk to the cc and canonical about this?
[17:56] <effie_jayx> des the LoCo Council have an assesment for the CC
[17:56] <effie_jayx> ?
[17:56] <bandb_uds> +1
[17:56] <popey> how about whilst at UDS we get some time with sabdfl and other cc members to get some direction?
[17:57] <effie_jayx> we might get asked our opinion on the issue?
[17:57] <juliux_> popey, a good idea
[17:57] <effie_jayx> popey,  I think that is a good start...
[17:57] <JanC> popey: if that's possible, that would be nice
[17:57] <popey> Matt East in that thread kind of threw it up in the air to the loco council, cc and canonical
[17:57]  * effie_jayx has got to go to USD next time
[17:58]  * effie_jayx sets up ... help.effiejayxgotousd.org
[17:58] <JanC> effie_jayx: just organise it and you must be there...  ;)
[17:58] <doctormo> We need to talk about how some things we want to do are made difficult by not having any incorperated body.
[17:58] <popey> yes doctormo thats something we need to consider
[17:58] <juliux_> doctormo, legal entities is up to the cc and not to the loco council atm
[17:58] <popey> but not something we can really decide on now without some input from the cc and canonical
[17:59] <JanC> doctormo: you can sometimes use another legal entity as a proxy
[17:59] <doctormo> juliux_: it's up to neither, they can advise us as teams but IMO it's up to teams.
[17:59] <popey> JanC: I'd rather not get into it now/here
[17:59] <popey> all we can do is advise
[18:00] <popey> we can't specifically give you a direction based on your local law / regulations
[18:00] <doctormo> popey: Indeed, that is why leaving it up to the CC is not good. it seems like passing the buck
[18:00] <JanC> we can point to several possible options for teams to consider though
[18:00] <popey> we aren't leaving it up to the cc
[18:01] <popey> we are discussing with the cc and canoincal
[18:01] <juliux_> doctormo, we will work with them on that but we will not make any decision about it today!
[18:01] <effie_jayx> popey,  I agree with you
[18:01] <JanC> and on the locoteam least  ;)
[18:01] <JanC> list
[18:01] <doctormo> popey: why are the CC and cononical not here to talk about it then?
[18:01] <bandb_uds> because they talked about it yesterday
[18:02] <bandb_uds> check the CC logs
[18:02] <juliux_> bandb_uds, +1
[18:02] <bandb_uds> and there are action items
[18:02] <effie_jayx> doctormo,  and this is our meeting, we organize our ideas and we escalate them to CC if needed
[18:02] <doctormo> bandb_uds: having every person read every log is a waste of time, is there a summery?
[18:02] <popey> doctormo: it's not every log, it's one log
[18:03] <juliux_> the danish team has the task to write a provosal about that
[18:03] <juliux_> and then the cc will review that
[18:03] <effie_jayx> time gents
[18:03] <juliux_> and the cc will talk with canonical about trademark issuses about this
[18:03] <popey> indeed, beer calling
[18:03] <juliux_> popey, +1
[18:03] <doctormo> -1
[18:03] <Syntux> doctormo, that one is short and sweet http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/05/20/%23ubuntu-meeting.html
[18:03] <juliux_> so when we will have the next meeting?
[18:03] <juliux_> in two weeks? or in four week?
[18:03] <popey> 2
[18:03] <juliux_> ok
[18:04] <effie_jayx> ok
[18:04] <effie_jayx> set a date for next meeting
[18:04] <popey> teams to approve etc
[18:04] <effie_jayx> ?
[18:04] <m-c> does prague still have great beers available for less than a dollar each?  ;)
[18:04] <juliux_> so next meeting is at the 4th of june
[18:04] <popey> stuff to do, so it makes sense to get it done soon
[18:04] <effie_jayx> next meeting we are doing approvals?
[18:04] <juliux_> m-c, yes
[18:04] <popey> m-c: if you go to the right places :)
[18:04] <Syntux> no approval for today?
[18:04] <juliux_> Syntux, we are running out of time
[18:04] <Syntux> oh God
[18:04] <Syntux> ok
[18:04] <nxvl> m-c: they cost between 30 and 35 monetary units, which change i don't know
[18:04] <effie_jayx> Council, next meeting will be?
[18:05] <popey> we are scheduling the next meeting for 2 weeks which is pretty quick, so we can get the approvals done
[18:05] <juliux_> effie_jayx, 4th june
[18:05] <effie_jayx> time?
[18:05] <JanC> what time?
[18:05] <juliux_> i will check with the edubuntu and server team at which time they have there meetings
[18:05] <juliux_> so we don' t get in conflict with them
[18:05] <juliux_> and then i will let you known
[18:05] <Syntux> I wonder if you guys could consider JordanTeam application today as I'm traveling the first two weeks of June.
[18:05] <popey> -n
[18:05] <m-c> nxvl: and you get to have vistas of castles while you enjoy it.  oh, the trials of the free software developer...  ;)
[18:06] <popey> Syntux: we really dont have time
[18:06] <juliux_> Syntux, i personal had no time yet to ready your application
[18:06] <popey> we are going to get kicked out soon
[18:06] <bandb_uds> feel free to subscribe to the agenda page
[18:06] <nxvl> m-c: :D
[18:06] <juliux_> Syntux, where are all busy with uds and we need now some beer;)
[18:06] <Syntux> lol ok
[18:06] <juliux_> so cu in 2 weeks
[18:06] <juliux_> Syntux, we are working sine 9:00 ;)
[18:06] <juliux_> cu later
[18:06] <JanC> Syntux: maybe someone else from the team can help?
[18:06] <bandb_uds> to get notified of any changes
[18:06] <doctormo> I don't think I'll join these meetings again, I don't see the point.
[18:06] <popey> we need to check with other teams to fix the time
[18:07] <popey> and will add it to locoteam list
[18:07] <Syntux> juliux, popey can you confirm if you got the PDF?
[18:07] <popey> and fridge
[18:07] <popey> Syntux: i did
[18:07] <juliux_> Syntux, i did
[18:07] <juliux_> cu
[18:07] <Syntux> JanC, maybe I will check with them.
[18:08] <effie_jayx> popey,  the minute for the meeting
[18:08] <effie_jayx> since you are 3 and are with beers it should come easily... so the USD attendees can do it
[18:08]  * effie_jayx runs
[18:08] <bandb_uds> thanks all for coming
[18:09] <effie_jayx> bandb_uds,  thank you
[18:09] <bandb_uds> see ya all later
[18:11] <Syntux> yeah, later.
[18:12] <Celvin> Aproval never comes :-(
[18:12] <effie_jayx> Celvin,  it takes time
[18:13] <effie_jayx> we are just settling in
[18:13] <Celvin> effie_jayx, I guess :-(
[18:13] <effie_jayx> making sure we are on the right page
[18:13] <effie_jayx> Celvin,  are you in any of the teams
[18:13] <Celvin> El Salvador LocoTeam
[18:13] <effie_jayx> I am currently reviewing El salvador and Peru
[18:14] <Celvin> :-O
[18:14] <effie_jayx> Celvin,  yep
[18:14] <Celvin> oooH, good! if I can help just say me
[18:15] <effie_jayx> Celvin, well today you saw the guidelines and what we expect
[18:15] <Celvin> A little of
[18:15] <effie_jayx> Celvin,  one thing you need to make sure is that your teams covers a good number of it
[18:17] <effie_jayx> Celvin,  it'll be another two weeks but it'll give you time to be approval ready
[18:17] <Celvin> effie_jayx, Registered members are about 47
[18:20] <Celvin> but this 28, 29 y 30 of this mounth we will have a big meeting with approximately 200 people
[18:21] <Celvin> effie_jayx, in the mailling list have 68 members and in the launchpad 45
[18:22] <effie_jayx> Celvin,  numbers are good...
[18:22] <effie_jayx> I remember ve had something along 74 members when it asked for approval
[18:22] <effie_jayx> Celvin,  are you in #ubuntu-locoteams
[18:22] <effie_jayx> ?
[18:23] <Celvin> nop
[18:23] <Celvin> effie_jayx, now yes
[18:23] <Celvin> :-D
[18:30] <MooDoo> hello
[19:01] <Lukehasnoname> hax
[19:35] <Lukehasnoname> What time is it GMT?
[19:36] <Lukehasnoname> Damnit! CDT is -5, not -6
[19:40] <Seveas> @now
[20:24] <Lukehasnoname> ...
[20:52] <Lukehasnoname> @now
[21:28] <Lukehasnoname> Hello all
[21:58] <Lukehasnoname> @now
[22:00] <Lukehasnoname> There isn't a meeting, is there?
[22:00] <Lukehasnoname> UDS
[22:05] <Lukehasnoname> damnit
[23:06] <juliux> 2


[00:02] <psychok7> knome thanks it works :)
[00:02] <knome> np
[00:03] <duffman_> Hi I have a problem with the scroll wheel on my mouse in xubuntu does not work
[00:03] <duffman_> someone help me?
[00:05] <duffman_> hi??
[00:06] <knome> duffman_, if you run 'xkbevd' in terminal an scroll, does it give any output?
[00:08] <duffman_> yes
[00:08] <knome> duffman_, also, is it a "normal" mouse, or some not-so-common one (button count etc?)
[00:09] <duffman_> is mouse usb
[00:09] <duffman_> all boton found but scroll not found
[00:09] <knome> so when you scroll, there is no output?
[00:11] <duffman_> dont output scroll but other button yes
[00:13] <knome> i have no ideas then...
[00:13] <duffman_> :/
[00:14] <knome> might have something to do with mouse not being recognised properly, creating xorg.conf with a mouse section and especially looking that ZAxisMapping is correct might help
[00:15] <knome> but i'm not at all familiar with that
[01:18] <einseenai> hello -)
[01:18] <einseenai> charlie-tca, are you here?
[01:20] <einseenai> charlie-tca, I used build of 31 august, but bug with multiple "don't show this message again" persists. i reported it. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-notifyd/+bug/839203
[03:27] <mikodo> How do you  burn an .iso to HD, from an .avi burned on to a DVD with xfce 4.8, and then play it with vlc or mplayer or such? I can do it with Ubuntu Lucid. With Xubuntu, I can burn the .iso to the HD the same way in Xubuntu, (with k3b), but cannot play it with either of the players.
[03:28] <mikodo> Any guides or tips/links?
[03:38] <mikodo> Just thinking this may be taboo here
[03:38] <mikodo> Can I delete it some how?
[03:39] <pleia2> mikodo: what version of xubuntu?
[03:39] <mikodo> Lucid
[03:39] <pleia2> k3b and vlc would be the same exact packages as with ubuntu lucid
[03:40] <mikodo> Strange thing though, I tried replicating with Xubuntu many times to no avail.
[03:41] <pleia2> very strange
[03:41] <mikodo> Yes, I want to free my self of Ubuntu, when Lucid EOl comes ...
[03:43] <mikodo> Maybe if I installed Gnome3 on top of Xubuntu 12.04, I can do this then with the newest Ubuntu DE
[03:44] <mikodo> Edit, meant to say without the newest Ubuntu DE
[03:44] <pleia2> k3b is a kde app
[03:44] <pleia2> so it seems strange to me that it would be a gnome issue
[03:45] <mikodo> Not really a gnome issue, seems to be with Xfce 4.8
[03:45] <pleia2> yeah, I never used 4.8 on lucid
[03:45] <pleia2> I guess you're using the ppa?
[03:47] <mikodo> Two things: It is not a problem with kde, It will burn an .iso alright with Xubuntu, just cannot play it with the players. On the PPA, I couldn't find one for k3b
[03:49] <pleia2> I meant to get xfce 4.8 on lucid
[03:50] <mikodo> It runs nice.
[03:50] <pleia2> do you get some kind of error from vlc or mplayer?
[03:50] <pleia2> doing a google search for the error might lead you to figuring out what the encoding problem is with k3b
[03:51] <pleia2> anyway, I need to order some dinner, hopefully someone else will come by :) good luck!
[03:51] <mikodo> No errors, just shows in the players as they not having any data from the iso to play
[03:51] <mikodo> Yes, thanks pleia2
[04:07] <mikodo> Time for my supper too
[04:14] <mikodo> It seems to not be a problem with k3b with xfce, the .iso in it's properties shows the correct amount of data, just like it does in gnome2, just the players won't play it, I haven't tried any other players ...
[06:16] <mikodo> From above: Maybe if I burned the .iso with a Gnome app like Brasero it would be able to played my VLC or Mplayer, instead of burning the .iso's from k3b. Gnome2 will use kde apps. but maybe xfce isn't able to use all the kde apps like Gnome2.
[06:17] <mikodo> Will try that later and report any successes.
[07:27] <Shirakawasuna> anyone know how to get xfwm4 to open a given app on a particular workspace? I've googled it and the results say it doesn't have this functionality, but I just wanted to double check that there weren't plans in progress/a recent change
[08:32] <Sysi> Shirakawasuna: check out devilspie
[09:37] <pauk960> hi, can somebody change the download link for beta1 under latest news because it leads to alpha 2
[09:55] <Unit193> pauk960: Thanks for letting us know, reported
[10:35] <Ycarene> is there a way I can test run unity without having to load ubuntu-desktop (and unloading xubuntu-desktop)?
[14:00] <incorrect> i guess there are not going to be many changes in 11.10
[15:40] <moylan> help! after booting my xubuntu 11.04 system i find that min/max and application title bars are missing. any ideas?
[15:45] <Sysi> alt+F2 xfwm4 --replace
[15:45] <moylan> will give it a bash, thanks!
[16:13] <moylan> thank you Sysi, that seems to have repaired the problem. made a note in personal wiki in case it happens again.
[16:33] <Sysi> is there any workaround for lucid's user switching from xcsreensaver failing -bug?
[16:37] <micha_> Hallo!
[19:44] <incorrect> if i purge off nautilus and that removes the gnome-session package i will not be able to run the gnome services?
[19:45] <Sysi> or you can't login to gnome
[19:46] <incorrect> that is fine
[19:57] <incorrect> is it worth changing to lightdm?
[19:57] <incorrect> in 11.04?
[20:01] <Sysi> if gdm works, no
[20:02] <incorrect> i have 1gb in this netbook and well if i can save any memory
[20:03] <incorrect> when did 1gb of ram stop being a lot?
[20:04] <Sysi> not yet.. depending what you're doing on that netbook
[20:04] <incorrect> well i do run eclipse and firefox
[20:05] <Sysi> ugh, eclipse uses lots of ram
[20:05] <incorrect> it can i limited mine to 256
[20:06] <Sysi> I think you could set it to be more and you'd still have enough
[20:06] <incorrect> well, 384mb will probably be where it ends up
[20:07] <Sysi> have you considered using something other than eclipse?
[20:07] <incorrect> yes i tried many
[20:07] <incorrect> i am hooked on using mylyn with my trac setup
[20:08] <incorrect> weirdly enough its not eclipse that is such a major hog, its firefox
[20:08] <Sysi> close it and open again, get adblock and maybe flashblock
[20:09] <incorrect> i might try midori
[20:21] <bronson> Running Xubuntu on Oneiric works pretty well but xfce4-power-manager won't run.l
[20:22] <bronson> It produces a "BadName (named color or font doesn't exist)" X error.
[20:22] <bronson> Any ideas on how to fix this?
[20:30] <lukinfore> bronson, say add needed font
[20:31] <Sysi> !oneiric
[20:31] <Sysi> we don't know that well #here
[20:31] <bronson> lukinfore, how do I tell what font it needs?
[20:32] <lukinfore> bronson, not sure. try "strace -efile command" maybe
[20:33] <bronson> It says "Details: serial 295 error_code 15 request_code 150 minor_code 11"
[20:33] <bronson> trying strace...
[20:35] <bronson> doesn't produce anything helpful
[20:38] <bronson> Anything else I can do here?  I'm out of ideas.
[20:39] <Sysi> /join #ubuntu+1
[20:41] <bronson> Sysi, haven't found any xfce users there in the past but I can give it a shot.
[20:43] <Sysi> file a bug report if you can't find solution
[20:43] <bronson> Sysi, already filed: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-power-manager/+bug/821170
[20:43] <bronson> Unfortunately ignored.
[21:05] <GridCube> updating iso :D
[21:05] <GridCube> oh... i could do that from ssh today...
[21:07] <GridCube> ups
[21:24] <Redhammer_the_Ol> hi I am not sure if you guys can help me but here goes:
[21:24] <Redhammer_the_Ol> I have a short question (and I have been trying my google-fu for a while) I cannot seem to get sound of embeded flash on my mythbuntu 11.04 (via upgrade from 10.10) box I have tried reinstalling, purging, flash-aid, manual installation and am now  bit at my wits end
[21:26] <Redhammer_the_Ol> am running xcfe with no pulse audio installed and am quite clueless, sound works fine on other applications
[21:35] <well_laid_lawn> Redhammer_the_Ol: where's sound not working?
[21:38] <Redhammer_the_Ol> in flash
[21:38] <Redhammer_the_Ol> ie youtube etc
[21:38] <Redhammer_the_Ol> its fine in vlc, fine in mythtv
[21:38] <well_laid_lawn> I just use alsa and sound works fine in  flash
[21:39] <well_laid_lawn> I didn't do anything special to get it either
[21:39] <well_laid_lawn> afair
[21:39] <Redhammer_the_Ol> I believe I am using no more than alsa
[21:42] <Sysi> you could try using pulseaudio
[21:44] <Redhammer_the_Ol> uuuh that worries me
[21:44] <Redhammer_the_Ol> i mean pulseaudio
[21:44] <Redhammer_the_Ol> am sceptic it will mess up mythtv
[21:45] <Sysi> you can remove it if it doesn't work
[21:45] <GridCube> Redhammer_the_Ol, try uninstalling flash
[21:46] <Sysi> he told he has tried uninstalling and reinstalling stuff
[21:46] <GridCube> oh
[21:46] <GridCube> there are a few flash plugins beside the original one
[21:47] <Redhammer_the_Ol> yes I tried 64bit beta , I tried 32bit with wrapper
[21:47] <Redhammer_the_Ol> I tried gnash
[21:47] <Sysi> that breaks adobe flash
[21:47] <Redhammer_the_Ol> yes I started with 32bit, then purged
[21:47] <Redhammer_the_Ol> then tried 64bit purged
[21:48] <Redhammer_the_Ol> then tried gnash and purged
[21:48] <Redhammer_the_Ol> deleted and purged firefox
[21:48] <Redhammer_the_Ol> and chromium
[21:51] <GridCube> Redhammer_the_Ol, http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=204022 ??
[21:56] <Redhammer_the_Ol> will try
[21:56] <Redhammer_the_Ol> thanks
[21:57] <GridCube> also after installing/uninstalling you have to reboot, yes reboot, thanks adobe for that
[21:59] <Redhammer_the_Ol> lets see
[21:59] <Redhammer_the_Ol> will purge all
[21:59] <Redhammer_the_Ol> and then do 32bit
[22:14] <Redhammer_the_Ol> no luck
[22:14] <Redhammer_the_Ol> well well
[22:15] <GridCube> :(
[22:17] <Xfiles> hello
[22:18] <Xfiles> i'm on a fresh install of xubuntu 10.10
[22:18] <Xfiles> impossible to run the clear cmd in a terminal
[22:18] <GridCube> mmm
[22:18] <GridCube> what terminal?
[22:18] <Xfiles> bash
[22:19] <GridCube> xterm or xfce4-terminal?
[22:19] <GridCube> on a tty?
[22:19] <Xfiles> how to know ?
[22:19] <Xfiles> i would say xterm at random
[22:20] <GridCube> if you are using a tty you should know that, else the title of the window says so
[22:20] <GridCube> or the >help >about
[22:20] <Xfiles> it's noted terminal
[22:20] <GridCube> mmm
[22:20] <well_laid_lawn> why do you think it is impossible to run the clear command?
[22:21] <Xfiles> i have some error msg
[22:21] <Xfiles> let me copy
[22:21] <GridCube> !pastebin
[22:21] <Xfiles> TERM environment variable not set
[22:21] <Xfiles> that's what it says
[22:21] <julius> Sup peoplezz?
[22:22] <julius> what up bitches
[22:22] <well_laid_lawn> Xfiles: try   export TERM=xterm
[22:22] <Xfiles> yeah i've found that
[22:22] <Xfiles> but is this solution proper ?
[22:22] <Xfiles> *ive found and done that
[22:22] <julius> hey dooshes listen to me
[22:23] <well_laid_lawn> Xfiles: what's in your ~/.bashrc? and yes the solution is proper
[22:23] <Xfiles> eww
[22:23] <julius> boner boner boner boner boner boner boner
[22:23] <Xfiles> i don't have .bashrc
[22:23] <julius> BONER BONER
[22:23] <Xfiles> well that's scatty
[22:24] <julius> Bitch tits
[22:24] <well_laid_lawn> any other .bash files in ~ Xfiles
[22:24] <well_laid_lawn> ?
[22:24] <Xfiles> ohh
[22:24] <Xfiles> yeah i've one
[22:24] <GridCube> Xfiles, you did a clean install or updated
[22:24] <julius> SSSSSHHHHHHIIIIITTTTTTTTT
[22:25] <Xfiles> GridCube, a clean one with a live cd
[22:25] <GridCube> mmm
[22:25] <julius> Everyone here can SUCK BALLS
[22:26] <Xfiles> GridCube, the .bashrc file contains the default stuff
[22:26] <julius> FUCK DICK FUCK DICK
[22:26] <Xfiles> i didn't edit it
[22:27] <GridCube> thats weird
[22:27] <Xfiles> yeah
[22:27] <Xfiles> i can't run screen
[22:27] <Xfiles> and irssi
[22:27] <GridCube> open xterm
[22:27] <GridCube> alt-f2 > xterm > run
[22:28] <Xfiles> why it don't work with
[22:28] <Xfiles> accessories>terminal ?
[22:28] <Xfiles> *doesn't
[22:29] <PerfieM> Reporting for duty, sir
[22:29] <Xfiles> hi PerfieM
[22:29] <PerfieM> Evening, chief
[22:30] <GridCube> Xfiles, try uninstalling xfce4-terminal and reinstalling it
[22:30] <Xfiles> yeah
[22:30] <Xfiles> i thought about it
[22:30] <GridCube> sudo apt-get purge xfce4-terminal && sudo apt-get install xfce4-terminal
[22:31] <well_laid_lawn> I'd put   export TERm=xterm   in .bashrc then in a terminal   source .bashrc
[22:31] <GridCube> but clear works on xterm?
[22:31] <well_laid_lawn> clear is a bash builtin afaik
[22:31] <Xfiles> yeah
[22:32] <Xfiles> i want to use xfce4-term
[22:32] <well_laid_lawn> o k
[22:32] <GridCube> Xfiles, its a fresh install?
[22:32] <Xfiles> GridCube, yep
[22:32] <Xfiles> sure
[22:32] <GridCube> can't you install 11.04?
[22:33] <Xfiles> i don't want to
[22:33] <GridCube> this problem seems to happen whit 10.10
[22:33] <well_laid_lawn> Xfiles: have you updated since the install?
[22:33] <Xfiles> yes
[22:33] <well_laid_lawn> k
[22:33] <Xfiles> and i skipped it :(
[22:34] <Xfiles> because of my slow connection
[22:34] <well_laid_lawn> there you go then...
[22:34] <well_laid_lawn> update && upgrade
[22:34] <Xfiles> yeah i've reinstalled xfce4-term
[22:34] <Xfiles> but cannot clear
[22:34] <GridCube> do an sudo apt-get update
[22:35] <GridCube> and then install xfce4-terminal
[22:35] <GridCube> maybe its fixed on a later release
[22:37] <Xfiles> nope
[22:37] <Xfiles> oh
[22:37] <Xfiles> yes maybe
[22:37]  * Xfiles crossing fingers
[22:37] <Xfiles> same stuff
[22:38] <well_laid_lawn> there was an error with the default environment setup in 10.10 iirc
[22:38] <GridCube> mmm
[22:38] <GridCube> yes its a 10.10 problem
[22:38] <Xfiles> echo "export TERM=xterm" | sudo tee /etc/profile.d/set_term.sh && source /etc/profile
[22:38] <Xfiles> maybe ?
[22:38] <GridCube> probably thats what the bug says
[22:38] <Xfiles> yeah
[22:38] <Xfiles> if i do that
[22:39] <Xfiles> clear will run
[22:39] <GridCube> bug 621927
[22:39] <Xfiles> but i couldn't run irssi or screen
[22:40] <GridCube> :/
[22:40] <GridCube> not even using xterm?
[22:40] <Xfiles> all run perfectly on xterm
[22:41] <GridCube> mmm
[22:41] <GridCube> you can install another terminal emulator?
[22:41] <Xfiles> yes why not
[22:41] <GridCube> sudo apt-get install lxterminal
[22:42] <Xfiles> what you think about zsh ??
[22:42] <GridCube> never used it
[22:43] <Xfiles> GridCube, same stuff
[22:43] <Xfiles> can't clear
[22:44] <GridCube> :/
[22:44] <Xfiles> Can't initialize screen handling, quitting.
[22:44] <Xfiles> You can still use the dummy mode with -d parameter
[22:44] <GridCube> well i don't know then
[22:44] <Xfiles> while running irssi
[22:44] <GridCube> :(
[22:44] <GridCube> someone smarter can help you later i guess
[22:44] <Xfiles> yeah no lizards
[22:45] <well_laid_lawn> needs a full updatee && upgrade
[22:45] <well_laid_lawn> ...
[22:45] <Xfiles> eww
[22:45] <GridCube> yes that might help
[22:45] <GridCube> or upgrading to 11.04
[22:45] <GridCube> or waiting a few weeks and installing 11.10 :D
[22:45] <Xfiles> that's scatty
[22:46] <Xfiles> there is not this problem on 10.10 gnome
[22:46] <GridCube> probably not
[22:46] <Xfiles> i've tested there isn't
[22:46] <GridCube> but i think you just didnt get it, because it appears that there was
[22:46] <GridCube> see the bug, all the reports
[22:47] <GridCube> sometimes stuff happens bro
[22:48] <Xfiles> what is guake ??
[22:48] <Xfiles> another terminal ?
[22:48] <GridCube> guake is a drop down terminal
[22:49] <GridCube> like in quake
[22:49] <GridCube> you press a key and a terminal popsout
[22:53] <Xfiles> lol
[22:55] <GridCube> :P
[22:55] <GridCube> i use tilda for that
[22:55] <GridCube> its basically the same
[22:58] <Xfiles> it runs
[22:59] <Xfiles> dunno how
[22:59] <Xfiles> but irssi go with xfce 4 term
[23:04] <GridCube> XD
[23:10] <Xfiles> GridCube, it doesn't run with lxterm :(
[23:10] <GridCube> :/
[23:10] <GridCube> but it does whit xfce4-terminal?
[23:11] <Xfiles> yep
[23:11] <Xfiles> totally scatty
[23:11] <Xfiles> maybe engineers were drinking when coding
[23:20] <Xfiles> GridCube, it runs with lxterm !
[23:20] <Xfiles> echo "export TERM=xterm" | sudo tee /etc/profile.d/set_term.sh && source /etc/profile
[23:20] <GridCube> jajaja
[23:20] <GridCube> XD
[23:20] <Xfiles> i think i've upgraded xfce4 term
[23:20] <Xfiles> and wit the update version when you do the stuff above it runs
[23:21] <Xfiles> see you back on irrsi