[00:02] <gamerchick02> cmaloney, do you you have meds to take care of your ailing stomach?
[00:02] <cmaloney> yeah, took some meijer tums
[00:03] <gamerchick02> good. feel better, man
[00:03] <gamerchick02> and i MIGHT have bought two CDs from Blackbird Blackbird today.
[00:03] <gamerchick02> :-D
[00:05] <waf> rick_h_: http://vpaste.net/bArQp
[00:05] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/1GGoHl - text/plain; charset=UTF-8
[00:30] <mrgoodcat> dpkg -s /etc/os-release
[00:41] <mrgoodcat> did any of you know  theabout /etc/os-release file?
[00:41] <mrgoodcat> gah
[00:41] <mrgoodcat> about the *
[00:46] <jrwren> zomg, I can linux on the desktop now: http://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/27vr19/firefox_30_released_finally_supports_gstreamer10/
[00:46] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/HOyjye - Too Many Requests
[00:50] <mrgoodcat> jrwren: what was preventing you before?
[01:19] <cmaloney> mrgoodcat: I knew about lsb_release
[01:19] <cmaloney> but not os-release
[01:20] <mrgoodcat> os-release is not distro-specific
[01:21] <mrgoodcat> it's part of systemd so it can be used on most distros now
[01:21] <jrwren> mrgoodcat: nothing. i'm just happy about the firefox h264 support via gstreamer
[01:22] <mrgoodcat> well most may be an overstatement
[01:22] <mrgoodcat> but systemd is slowly becoming the de-facto "standard"
[01:40] <cmaloney> rick_h_: I just want to know: how is UPS going to deliever this? http://mashable.com/2014/06/11/titan-zeus-370-inch-tv/?utm_cid=mash-com-G+-main-photo
[01:40] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/XeEsQH - This 370-Inch TV Costs $1.6 Million — and Someone Actually Bought It
[01:41] <cmaloney> and I think Erica might notice it. :)
[01:45] <gamerchick02> who would pay that much for a TV?
[01:45] <mrgoodcat> gamerchick02: who wouldn't
[01:45] <mrgoodcat> if i had 1.6M to burn on a TV i'd for sure have a movie theater
[01:45] <gamerchick02> i wouldn't, partly because i don't have 1.6 million bucks and i could find a bunch of other things to spend it on.
[01:46] <mrgoodcat> that's why i said "on a TV"
[01:46] <gamerchick02> ah
[01:46] <mrgoodcat> it assumes that i am rich enough to be able to budget 1.6 just for my TV
[01:47] <gamerchick02> yes for a movie theater
[01:47] <mrgoodcat> presumably i've already bought Ferarri and Porsche
[01:47] <mrgoodcat> the companies not the cars
[01:47] <gamerchick02> LOL yes
[01:47] <mrgoodcat> and commissioned a real-life iron man suit
[01:47] <mrgoodcat> that's very important
[01:47] <gamerchick02> dude
[01:47] <mrgoodcat> higher priority than the TV
[01:47] <gamerchick02> that'd be awesome
[01:48] <mrgoodcat> can't figure out why Elon Musk doesn't already have one
[01:48] <mrgoodcat> or Richard Branson
[01:48] <mrgoodcat> or any one of the tech gazillionaires
[01:48] <gamerchick02> if i was Richard Branson i'd surely have an Iron Man suit.
[01:48] <gamerchick02> what about Bill Gates?
[01:48] <mrgoodcat> he's too grounded
[01:48] <gamerchick02> hah, literally
[01:49] <gamerchick02> he'd rather bring world peace and water and education to everyone.
[01:49] <gamerchick02> which, if i was Bill Gates, i probably would do that too.
[01:50] <mrgoodcat> i'd have an Iron Man suit
[01:50] <mrgoodcat> lol
[01:50] <gamerchick02> of course!
[01:51] <mrgoodcat> hmmm maybe someone in this channel more versed in blockchain and privacy can tell me if this could possibly be as good as it seems http://storj.io/
[01:51] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/avZkDZ - Storj - The Future of Cloud Storage
[03:10] <mrgoodcat> who was that at coffee house coders tonight?
[03:10] <mrgoodcat> writing the weechat plugin
[12:53] <trevlar> mrgoodcat: me
[13:02] <mrgoodcat> ah. now i can't remember why i was even looking for you
[13:02] <mrgoodcat> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
[13:02] <mrgoodcat> sorry
[13:05] <mrgoodcat> anybody here play with rust?
[13:10] <brousch__> mrgoodcat: My car does
[13:10] <mrgoodcat> ha
[13:10] <mrgoodcat> so that's a no then?
[13:23] <cmaloney> Off to a great start. :)
[13:23] <cmaloney> mrgoodcat: Haven't played with Rust yet
[13:23] <cmaloney> Seemes every day another company comes up with another language. :)
[13:23] <cmaloney> Been sticking with Python this whole time.
[13:24] <cmaloney> with a smidge of Javascript because you can't swing a dead cat around a web browser without hitting Javascript.
[13:25] <mrgoodcat> can't do systems programming in python or javascript
[13:26] <cmaloney> bullshit. :)
[13:26] <cmaloney> But yeah, it's not as fun. :)
[13:28] <jrwren> why can't you do systems programming in python?
[13:29] <cmaloney> Because Hacker News said so
[13:29] <jrwren> I knew you could
[13:29] <mrgoodcat> jrwren: my friends and i are developing a toy kernel for the rapsberry pi for learns. if you can figure out a way to do it in python let me know
[13:29] <jrwren> well, i could, but why would i :p
[13:29] <jrwren> use C for that :p
[13:29] <mrgoodcat> that's what we're doign
[13:30] <cmaloney> Actually Python would be sweet as a kernel
[13:30] <mrgoodcat> well c++ actually
[13:30] <cmaloney> create a mini bootloader that brings up Python
[13:30] <mrgoodcat> inb4c++sucks
[13:30] <jrwren> python would not be sweet as a kernel
[13:30] <jrwren> oh, a mini bootloader.
[13:30] <mrgoodcat> cmaloney: ha we were thinking about micropython
[13:30] <cmaloney> then you can have all the fun of duck-typing IOCTLs.
[13:30] <jrwren> cmaloney: yeah, that would be sweet.
[13:31] <jrwren> i'm actually OK with duck typing ioctls too.
[13:31] <jrwren> how about embedding cpython in teh linux kernel and writing linux kernel modules in python?
[13:32] <jrwren> hrm... does pypy offer a means to ahead of time compile?
[13:33] <cmaloney> Unsure.
[13:34] <jrwren> i didn't see it listed.
[13:35] <jrwren> cython then!
[13:36] <cmaloney> Yeah, I think pypy's claim to fame is the jit
[13:36] <cmaloney> Kind of like asking to run Java without the JVM
[13:37] <mrgoodcat> ok well if you dont like new languages, then maybe new privacy minded storage methods...
[13:37] <cmaloney> ?
[13:37] <mrgoodcat> http://storj.io
[13:37] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/avZkDZ - Storj - The Future of Cloud Storage
[13:37] <cmaloney> God, that again? :)
[13:37] <mrgoodcat> haha
[13:37] <mrgoodcat> there was no comment about it last night
[13:37] <mrgoodcat> so i figured i'd ask again
[13:38] <cmaloney> THERE WAS A REASON THERE WAS NO COMMENT
[13:38] <cmaloney> ;)
[13:38] <mrgoodcat> i'm really just wondering if it's even viable
[13:38] <cmaloney> Is there money involved?
[13:38] <mrgoodcat> i dont know enough about blockchain
[13:38] <mrgoodcat> yes, money in and out
[13:39] <cmaloney> Is it controlled by a centralized authority?
[13:39] <mrgoodcat> no
[13:39] <cmaloney> Then it will be gamed and is ultimately doomed to failure. :)
[13:40] <mrgoodcat> you earn Storcoins (bitcoin clone) by allowing it to use your disk space and calculating the checksums, Storcoins can be redeemed for money
[13:40] <cmaloney> Right, as can micropayments. :)
[13:41]  * cmaloney is trying to think of what the 1990s ___gold was called
[13:42] <cmaloney> e-gold.
[13:43] <cmaloney> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-gold
[13:43] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/13dOi - E-gold - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
[13:43] <jrwren> cmaloney: and yet, that is like asking to run C# without the VM, and that is exactly what mono aot does :)
[13:44] <cmaloney> jrwren: That's because there's value to C#. :)
[13:45] <cmaloney> As opposed to Java, where everyon'e first step with theJVM is to ditch Java. :)
[13:45] <mrgoodcat> lol
[13:45] <mrgoodcat> there are a billion JVM languages
[13:45] <cmaloney> Exactly.
[13:46] <jrwren> kinda true.
[13:46] <cmaloney> I'm being a little glib here but I'm not aware of the same "rip out the language" mentality in the .NET environment.
[13:47] <cmaloney> Even though .NET kinda encourages it.
[13:47] <jrwren> definitely not.
[13:47] <mrgoodcat> well c# is pretty nice
[13:47] <mrgoodcat> so...
[13:47] <jrwren> there is good support for F# and VB.NET of course, but i dno't see people running from C# like they run from Jaba
[13:47] <jrwren> I love C#
[13:47] <brousch__> VB.NET r0x!
[13:47] <mrgoodcat> C# the hutt
[13:48] <mrgoodcat> python.NET
[13:48] <mrgoodcat> go
[13:49] <cmaloney> mrgoodcat: Definitely. There's ironpython and ironruby
[13:49] <mrgoodcat> yup
[13:49] <cmaloney> but I consider those more porting an existing language
[13:49] <cmaloney> Clojure and Scala are new languages that replace Java.
[13:50] <brousch__> ironpython is very neglected, and ironruby is dead
[13:50] <cmaloney> Not aware of .NET languages that were totally new, third party creations.
[13:50] <cmaloney> brousch__: Unsurprising
[13:51] <cmaloney> (and yes, F# is totally new, but that's Microsoft's doing).
[13:51] <mrgoodcat> that's because there isnt any real compelling reason to use ironpython or ironruby
[13:52] <mrgoodcat> afaict
[13:52] <cmaloney> Yeah.
[13:53] <jrwren> and ironruby is abandoned
[13:53] <jrwren> and ironpython has like 1 person working on it, kinda.
[13:53] <jrwren> cmaloney: there is Boo
[13:53] <jrwren> cmaloney: there is unityscript :)
[13:53] <jrwren> both totally new, third party creations
[13:54] <cmaloney> jrwren: I stand corrected.
[13:55] <cmaloney> How many of them have O'Reilly books? :)
[13:55] <cmaloney> or Pragmatic Programmer books? :)
[13:56] <jrwren> likely none.
[13:56] <enleeten> there's a C# implementation for the JVM
[13:57] <mrgoodcat> rly?
[13:57] <enleeten> https://code.google.com/p/stab-language/
[13:57] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/mwTCQs - stab-language - A multi-paradigm programming language designed for the Java Virtual Machine - Google Project Hosting
[13:57] <jrwren> wow
[13:57] <jrwren> scala isn't far from a C# for jvm :p
[13:57] <enleeten> true
[13:58] <enleeten> but stab is almost a direct clone
[13:58] <enleeten> I want to like scala but it's like perl
[13:58] <jrwren> indeed. I love it. this stab lang is great.
[13:58] <jrwren> but... type erasure :(
[13:58] <cmaloney> What's wrong with Perl? :)
[13:58] <enleeten> it tends to turn into unreadable ick after a while
[14:00] <cmaloney> enleeten: Only if you don't do chmod a-w before it becomes unreadable. :)
[14:03] <enleeten> ha that should be in the scala docs
[14:03] <enleeten> maybe perl isn't the best analogue
[14:03] <enleeten> maybe C++ for the jvm
[14:03] <enleeten> would be more accurate
[14:08] <jrwren> perl is far more readable than any erlang I've ever seen.
[14:08] <jrwren> and the kids LOVE erlang
[14:08] <jrwren> in todays climate of codereview, I don't feel perl would get unreadable.
[14:10] <jrwren> you'd have guidelines similar to pep8 that say, use the verbose option of all the vars in perlvar
[14:11] <jrwren> and checking tools to catch where that doesn't happen
[14:11] <jrwren> although $ARG and @ARG instead of $_ and @_ is kinda weird in perl
[14:12] <jrwren> but $GID instead of $( and $GID instead of $) makes lots of sense IMO
[14:12] <mrgoodcat> It is too hard to determine the type of a Scalar, e.g there is no easy way to determine if a variable is a string.
[14:16] <cmaloney> In Perl?
[14:16] <cmaloney> It's very easy.
[14:16] <cmaloney> [0-9.] <- number
[14:16] <cmaloney> Anything else == String
[14:18] <jrwren> mrgoodcat: that is not a perl thing, that is a dynamically typed thing.
[14:19] <jrwren> zomg, ya know what would be sweet?  openstack nova LXC host migration
[14:47] <jrwren> anyone know if rsync has an option similar to scp -3 ?
[15:45] <jrwren> zomg, I just had a crazy idea... put all my data in ceph... at home. im my basement
[15:46] <brousch__> That is crazy.
[16:22] <cmaloney> jrwren: That's utterly brilliant. :)
[16:22] <cmaloney> Then you could put it all in LXC containers all living on the same drive.
[16:54] <cmaloney> Today's lunch: Lentils Curry with Rice
[16:55] <cmaloney> looks like a dog's breakfast. :)
[16:57] <brousch__> post-digestion?
[17:17] <jrwren> and i can cry when cephfs fails and I lose my data and then ya'll can tell me "they said not production ready!"
[17:36] <mrgoodcat> jrwren: what are you trying to accomplish by running the data through the localhost?
[17:36] <mrgoodcat> is it a NAT problem or something?
[17:41] <jrwren> huh?
[17:41] <jrwren> oh.
[17:41] <jrwren> its ok, i just used scp -3
[17:41] <jrwren> but yes, 1 network is not on internet.
[19:44] <_stink_> rick_h_: is there an IRC channel for nose?
[19:44] <_stink_> or cmaloney --^
[19:44] <_stink_> or anyone.
[19:45] <rick_h_> _stink_: no, not that I know of
[19:45] <rick_h_> _stink_: we moved to pytest, nose 1 is deprecated and nose2 was too different and not as usable
[19:46] <_stink_> ah, ok
[19:46] <_stink_> https://nose.readthedocs.org/en/latest/ is deprecated?
[19:46] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/0VWBz - Installation and quick start — nose 1.3.3 documentation
[19:46] <_stink_> github shows recent dev
[19:47] <_stink_> anyway suddenly i'm seeing stuff living from test method to test method in a very strange way - like i instantiate an instance and it suddenly has attributes preset.  weird.
[19:47] <rick_h_> _stink_: the guy that runs it said it was deprecated so I moved on
[19:48] <_stink_> o cool
[19:48] <_stink_> thanks for the info!
[19:54] <cmaloney> _stink_: We're still using nose
[19:54] <cmaloney> in that we're not really doing a lot of unit testing. :)
[19:54] <brousch__> Real men test in production
[19:55] <cmaloney> and commit there.
[19:55] <cmaloney> .np squeekyhoh
[19:55] <mrgoodcat> i just sniff my keyboard with my IRL nose
[19:55] <cmaloney> .np squeekyhoho
[19:55] <bookiebot> squeekyhoho's current track - The Wanderer by Amorphis on Circle
[19:55] <_stink_> cmaloney: hah.  rest assured that this testing is for a personal thing, not for work.
[19:55] <cmaloney> _stink_: Yeah, screw work testing. :)
[19:55] <mrgoodcat> bugs smell a bit bitter on the keyboard
[19:55] <mrgoodcat> try that
[19:56] <mrgoodcat> :)
[19:56] <cmaloney> all I smell on my keyboard are broken dreams
[19:56] <cmaloney> Wait, that's lunch
[19:56] <cmaloney> n/m
[19:56] <greg-g> from last week
[19:56] <cmaloney> greg-g: I'll have you know I sanitize my keyboard once in a great while
[19:57] <greg-g> emphasis on great
[19:57] <cmaloney> GREAT!
[19:57] <mrgoodcat> if you can't smell teh bug on your keyboard make sure you are sniffing the keyboard you used to write the code. alternatively, put the code on a flash drive and sniff that. Sometimes it works a little better
[19:57] <greg-g> cmaloney: now now Tony
[19:59] <rick_h_> anyone ever seen a network interfaces em1?
[20:00] <cmaloney> rick_h_: I think it's a new wired interface
[20:01] <rick_h_> cmaloney: interesting
[20:01] <cmaloney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/1320916
[20:01] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/u89Fsu - Bug #1320916 “NICs being mapped with strange names that make no ...” : Bugs : “udev” package : Ubuntu
[20:01] <cmaloney> Wonder if it's some systemd thing?
[21:05] <rick_h_> smoser: got a sec? server network issue and your name is dropped in http://askubuntu.com/questions/63456/waiting-for-network-configuration-adding-3-to-5-minutes-to-boot-time
[21:05] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/YLdpPa - startup - "Waiting for network configuration" adding 3 to 5 minutes to boot time - Ask Ubuntu
[21:10] <smoser> rick_h_, is that a problem for you now ?
[21:11] <rick_h_> smoser: well I think it's related, and causing maas to not come up, but found another link which might be more correct trying something
[21:11] <smoser> basically, if you're seeing a message like that, then its bcause /etc/network/interfaces has a interface configured that is not going to come up.
[21:12] <rick_h_> smoser: yea, trying to get the dual nic on this nuc to come up right
[21:12] <rick_h_> well, one is a usb nic, other is built iun
[21:13] <smoser> rick_h_, i'm sorry. i've got to run.
[21:13] <rick_h_> smoser: all good, thanks
[21:13] <smoser> i can try to help tomrorow
[21:13] <rick_h_> smoser: ty
[21:16] <gamerchick02> https://www.humblebundle.com/weekly movies.
[21:16] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/iDYd8 - Humble Weekly Bundle: Indievision Presented by Devolver Digital (pay what you want and help charity)
[21:25] <cmaloney> gamerchick02: yeah, this is a rough week
[21:25] <cmaloney> http://bundleofholding.com
[21:25] <bookiebot> http://goo.gl/554dq - PARANOIA Bundle - it's mandatory!
[21:26] <gamerchick02> LOL
[21:27] <gamerchick02> i just bought two albums from blackbird blackbird yesterday so i'll probably miss those.
[21:27] <gamerchick02> but wow that's a great deal
[21:27] <gamerchick02> hrm...
[21:46] <mrgoodcat> i was all exceited about amazon prime music until i actually tried to listen to something on it
[21:46] <mrgoodcat> what a shit service
[21:47] <cmaloney> mrgoodcat: Yeah, as soon as I saw "only popular music" it instantly became dead to me.
[21:47] <cmaloney> Yay top 40 bullshit radio.
[21:47] <mrgoodcat> not even
[21:47] <mrgoodcat> eminem is conspicuously missing
[21:47] <mrgoodcat> it's not even top 40
[21:48] <cmaloney> it's what I lovingly refer to as "Secretary rock"
[21:48] <mrgoodcat> it's like 30/40
[21:48] <mrgoodcat> and not even the "top"
[21:48] <mrgoodcat> woof
[21:48] <cmaloney> That drivel that only administrative assistats listen to on their crappy clock radios at work.
[21:48] <cmaloney> WNIC / WMGC.
[21:48] <mrgoodcat> lol
[21:49] <mrgoodcat> 95.5 the douche
[21:49] <cmaloney> "background noise" or more appropriately "music to make me stabby"
[21:50] <mrgoodcat> taking requests at 1-800-IMA-DCHE
[22:53] <gamerchick02> ew


[13:44] <ikonia> hello MasterPiece
[13:44] <MasterPiece> Hello !
[13:44] <MasterPiece> Oh
[13:44] <MasterPiece> I'm sorry!
[13:44] <MasterPiece> its auto join!
[13:44] <ikonia> no problem
[13:44] <MasterPiece> bye :D
[15:10] <k1l_> @mark #ubuntu Corey84- giving false advice
[15:11] <ikonia> not again....
[15:12] <k1l_> Corey84-> wahtever I'll go back to helping my primary distro then
[15:13] <ikonia> he is just parroting stuff from mint
[15:13] <ikonia> and he spews nonsense into #fedora too
[15:13] <ikonia> he tries to help
 ermahgerd my linux broke
[23:31] <bazhang> yeah troll
[23:32] <k1l> not new to bantracker


[01:27] <Azelphur> Low: $267.21, High: $352.12, Bitcoin market volatility at its finest (3 hour time frame)
[01:28] <daftykins> i had a message from my brother asking if i did anything with bitcoin today
[01:28] <daftykins> i lawl'd 'cause i don't understand it at all
[01:28] <daftykins> he alluded to that common idea of leaving a box crunching away mining
[01:28] <Azelphur> hehe
[01:28] <daftykins> but i said that from what i had heard that tends to just offset against your electricity bill :D
[01:29] <Azelphur> daftykins: that means that the value of 1 bitcoin has fluctuated between $267.21 and $352.12 over the past 3 hours
[01:29] <Azelphur> almost $100 price fluctuation xD
[01:30] <daftykins> oh i more meant the entire bitcoin phenomena
[01:30] <daftykins> but ja, that's pretty mad
[01:30] <Azelphur> which means my BTC holdings have fluctuated between $30729 and $40493
[01:30] <Azelphur> ergo, I just lost, and regained, $10k value
[01:30] <Azelphur> bitcoin is a fun little rollercoaster.
[01:31] <daftykins> could you pull the trigger and cash-out instantly though? taxman aside
[01:31] <Azelphur> yea
[01:31] <Azelphur> well not super instantly, I'd have to boot up my laptop with the encrypted drive
[01:31] <Azelphur> and transfer the funds into an exchange
[02:32] <ali1234> what exchange was at $267??
[02:32] <Azelphur> ali1234: bitstamp
[02:33] <Azelphur> ali1234: http://bitcoinity.org/markets/bitstamp/USD
[02:33] <ali1234> gox was at $381 earlier
[02:33] <Azelphur> ali1234: yea, it's pre-crashing :)
[02:33] <ali1234> i should add bitstamp to my thing
[02:34] <ali1234> daftykins: mining was really profitable if you did it two years ago
[02:34] <ali1234> it's impossible now
[02:35] <ali1234> unless you have specialist hardware, which is almost impossible to buy
[02:35] <Azelphur> unless you're me
[02:35] <Azelphur> ali1234: part of me wonders if I should go lawsuit BFL for late shipping
[02:35] <Azelphur> they cost me a boatload
[02:35] <ali1234> you're lucky to even get anything
[02:35] <Azelphur> true
[02:36] <ali1234> you won't get anything from suing them, due to everyone else doing the same thing
[02:36] <ali1234> so i'd say it's a waste of time
[02:36] <Azelphur> amazingly, nobody else seems to be doing it
[02:37] <Azelphur> ali1234: in other news, my channel has been taking great amusement at https://github.com/search?q=exec+sudo+%24_GET&type=Code
[02:37] <Azelphur> I'm sure you'll enjoy it too xD
[02:38] <ali1234> i don't get it
[02:38] <Azelphur> ali1234: don't know PHP?
[02:38] <ali1234> well obviously php cannot into sudo
[02:38] <ali1234> if it's not interactive
[02:38] <ali1234> unless the host is really badly configured
[02:38] <ali1234> but other than that i don't get it
[02:38] <Azelphur> ali1234: they probably nosudo'd it to get that code to work, I'd guess
[02:39] <ali1234> wait
[02:39] <ali1234> sudo $_GET
[02:40] <ali1234> noooooooo
[02:40] <ali1234> noooooooooooooooooooo
[02:40] <ali1234>  /o\
[02:41] <ali1234> exec anything with $_GET is bad enough, you can just inject your own sudo if you want
[02:55] <Azelphur> ali1234: hahaha
[02:55] <Azelphur> ali1234: you figured it out gz
[02:55] <Azelphur> :P
[09:38] <ali1234> hmm... it's now possible to have two gmail accounts open in tabs without one getting booted out
[09:38] <ali1234> this is cool
[09:38] <jussi> ali1234: welcome to 2011
[09:38] <jussi> :P
[09:38] <ali1234> well it never worked for me as recently as ... about 2 months ago
[09:39] <jussi> ali1234: you just have to enable it
[09:39] <jussi> up to 4 accounts at once
[09:39] <ali1234> i did
[09:39] <ali1234> it seems to have started working when they changed the login screen recently
[09:39] <jussi> and then dont log out of the first one, you click the corner and click "add account"
[09:40] <ali1234> yes, that
[09:40] <ali1234> i was doing that months ago
[09:40] <ali1234> if i had two gmail tabs open on the same account, and then clicked that to open a different one, the other tab would also be booted out
[09:45] <popey> I'm still keeping separate browser windows for separate accounts
[09:46] <MartijnVdS> I've started doing that as well
[09:52] <Myrtti> need to do hangouts for work, so I've got them on a separate profile in chromium and my own stuff in firefox
[09:52] <MartijnVdS> you can have 2 profiles inside chrom(e|ium), running at the same time (in different windows, like private mode)
[09:56] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[10:03] <Myrtti> Yeah
[10:03] <Myrtti> I did use separate profiles on Firefox first
[10:04] <nigelb> ali1234: Oh, yeah. It stopped working for me recently too.
[10:05]  * nigelb needs to try again.
[10:05] <Myrtti> but gdocs and hangouts work better on chromium, so I made a new profile for my work persona for chromium
[10:06] <popey> I have 14 chromium personas
[10:06] <popey> probably should shrink that a bit
[10:09] <popey> mostly for separate random twitter accounts
[10:18] <AlanBell> morning
[10:18]  * AlanBell upgraded the home always-on server to 13.10
[10:19] <AlanBell> and couldn't get it to boot with the new kernel, so is now using a raspberry pi instead :)
[10:20] <brobostigon> i am an rpi doing loads of stuff, radvd, dlna, webcam server, get-iplayer repo.
[10:22] <AlanBell> http://hencam.libertus.co.uk/video is now back up (the server does the html page around the image, and reverse proxies the image)
[10:22] <brobostigon> cool.
[10:31] <ali1234> i've probably asked this before, but is there any way to make xterm cat it's stdin?
[10:35] <ali1234> eg to watch stderr on an interactive command: somecommand 2> $(xterm cat)
[10:36] <AlanBell> why xterm?
[10:36] <AlanBell> and not the tty device?
[10:37] <ali1234> i dunno, just seemed logical
[10:39] <AlanBell> if you do tty in the target xterm, then echo "foo" > /dev/pts/9   (or whatever) then it comes up
[10:40] <ali1234> i could also use a named pipe, or a logfile and tail, but that's messy
[10:40] <AlanBell> but that does require you to launch the target xterm and find the tty number
[13:46] <dwatkins> AlanBell: I like your cluster idea, makes me wish I had the cash to burn so I could have you name it flibbertygibbet or something ;)
[13:47] <AlanBell> :)
[13:47] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: try ssh'ing into "supercalifragilisticexpialidocious"
[13:47] <MartijnVdS> without tab-completion
[13:50] <dwatkins> Host supercalifragilisticexpialidocious not found: 3(NXDOMAIN) ;)
[13:50] <dwatkins> I was thinking more the name of the "let's compile Ubuntu for the ARM processor in the Raspberry Pi", but that would also be amusing.
[13:51] <dwatkins> We used to have a mailserver called Sagittarius, but no-one knew how to spell it.
[13:52] <MartijnVdS> "I name it `pwgen -sy 30 1`"
[13:52] <AlanBell> 50 character limit :)
[13:52] <MartijnVdS> AlanBell: pwgen -sy 50 1 then
[13:52] <AlanBell> yay
[13:53] <penguin42> dwatkins: You're not trying if you don't get unicode into the hostname
[13:54] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: ooh, Punycode :)
[14:07] <dwatkins> Can you use unicode in DNS names?
[14:08] <dwatkins> I vaguely remember reading it used to be allowed, but isn't any more, suggesting you can only use letters from "our" 26-letter alphabet.
[14:08] <penguin42> I thought there were top level internationals?
[14:09] <AlanBell> you can probably use it in a hostname
[14:09]  * penguin42 boots a VM to try
[14:10] <ali1234> reddit is letting gold buyers name servers now
[14:10] <ali1234> one of them got named localhost
[14:10] <penguin42> ouch
[14:11] <penguin42> hmm hostname didn't like the fliptext I gave it
[14:13] <penguin42> hmm, hostnamectl will set it
[14:15] <penguin42> haha - but sethostname does !
[14:17] <penguin42> as does avahi-set-host-name
[14:24] <penguin42> MartijnVdS: Oh I hadn't read about punycode before - very neat
[14:35] <shauno> there's sort of unicode dns names .. they get translated into ascii for lookups, which is a little mind bending
[14:37] <shauno> eg, http://💩.l
[14:38] <shauno> or not.  ate that one bad lol
[14:40] <penguin42> shauno: Yeh that's apparently the Punycode
[14:43] <shauno> ah, I didn't know it had a name.  the only rfc I've seen it in just calls it ToAscii.  and then proceeds to warp your mind trying to explain how it works
[14:49] <shauno> absolutely miserable here today, but I fear rain isn't going to be an acceptable excuse for avoiding the cinema :/
[14:50] <penguin42> it's ok here today, yesterday was biblical - thunder, hail, localised flooding etc
[14:52] <shauno> oh this isn't that bad, just "blah".  nonstop rain for the last 8 hours
[14:53] <shauno> combined with sunday busses being run apparently by lottery, and my motivation to get into town is destroyed
[14:53] <penguin42> http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/flooding-after-hail-rain-thunder-6288101
[14:55] <shauno> heh, fun
[14:55] <shauno> I haven't actually seen lightning since I moved here (2006).  strange place
[14:55] <penguin42> blue skies today
[14:55] <penguin42> where?
[14:56] <shauno> west coast of ireland
[14:58] <penguin42> so you watch the storms roll in off the atlantic, go past and dump it on us?
[14:58] <shauno> when I was in the states, it seemed to be lightning all autumn.  sun all summer, and snow all winter.  all three are incredibly rare here
[15:00] <penguin42> generally we don't get much extreme weather - it's all kind of meh
[15:02] <shauno> I used to live in barrow (south lakes) .. I assume it's much of the same there
[15:03] <penguin42> well, they don't call it lakes for nothing
[15:03] <shauno> they call it lakes because it sounds much prettier than what it actually is ;)
[15:04] <penguin42> barrow is the industrially bit isn't/wasn't it?
[15:05] <shauno> it was.  it's now the unemployed bit.  built on ironworks & shipbuilding - neither of which are particularly strong industries anymore
[15:06] <penguin42> nod
[15:07] <shauno> about the only thing they have left is that we can't outsource the military, so they still build submarines
[15:08] <penguin42> nod, I know someone who is an admin at a small ISP somewhere around there as well
[15:09] <shauno> although last I heard, they still had europe's largest door.  which is a claim to fame I guess
[15:09] <penguin42> ? Something for a submarine shed?
[15:09] <shauno> yeah.  they're built indoors
[15:09] <penguin42> wouldn't want them to get wet
[15:11] <shauno> I Think it's kinda neat.  it's nice to think that our nuclear deterent is built by some northern lads in a shed
[15:12] <penguin42> haha well if you put it like that
[16:40] <dwatkins> I just broke my Windows 8 installation (deleted the D: drive whilst changing the linux swap partition size) - good job I don't really use nor care about it :)
[16:41] <daftykins> D:
[16:41] <daftykins> whoops
[16:41] <dwatkins> Yeah, that was my reaction, followed by a shrug. I can't remember the last time I used it for anything but games.
[16:42] <dwatkins> Time to move Ubuntu onto the SSD :D
[16:42] <daftykins> i've still not even used 8 native - though i'd want to acquire an 8.1 ISO now
[16:44] <dwatkins> I played Borderlands 2 and Homeworld 2 on it a bit, but they are easily reinstalled.
[16:44] <dwatkins> My only dilemma now is whether Windows 8 can exist on the 2nd physical disk, which isn't an SSD.
[16:45] <dwatkins> I'll either use this HOWTO or just reinstall 13.10 - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MovingLinuxPartition
[16:47] <daftykins> ah the ol' juggling fun :)
[16:48] <dwatkins> Yeah, probably easier to just reinstall - might give Debian a try...
[16:49]  * penguin42 is running Fedora/KDE on his main machine now - its' interesting, from a KDE perspective mostly the same, some places work better some worse
[16:53] <dwatkins> I'd like to give Gnome 3 a try.
[16:53] <penguin42> dwatkins: Well you can do that on any of them
[16:54] <dwatkins> Yeah, it's the default on recent Debians, I gather, and I'm curious to see how well Steam runs on Debian, too.
[16:54] <ali1234> how recent?
[16:55] <dwatkins> Wheezy, I guess, ali1234.
[16:56] <dwatkins> turns out the reason for all this is that I left my USB stick connected, so sda became the stick, and sdb and sdc are the new sda and sdb
[16:56] <daftykins> erk
[16:57] <penguin42> dwatkins: Yeh well the sd* naming is unspecified - you're not supposed to rely on them!
[16:57] <dwatkins> Just goes to show you should always check before doing mkswap /dev/sdb2
[16:57] <dwatkins> yeah, I remembered that afterwards, penguin42 ...
[16:57] <penguin42> dwatkins: I just wanted to rub it in
[16:58] <dwatkins> hehe
[16:59] <dwatkins> all this was probably pointless, and I'll most likely discover that hibernation isn't working for some other reason, but at least I havn't lost anything important.
[17:17] <daftykins> how might i recursively grep a folder of .php configs and other files for "<IP_ADDRESS>" appearing somewhere therein?
[17:17] <daftykins> grep -r <string> * <-- is what i tried
[17:19] <penguin42> grep -r '10[.]10[.]10[.]10' .
[17:20] <daftykins> ah, the periods had to be escaped?
[17:20] <penguin42> yeh because they'll match on anything
[17:20] <daftykins> ah :) i just got nothing from either
[17:20] <daftykins> ty though!
[17:21] <penguin42> try it on a dummy text file first
[17:21] <daftykins> i've just manually updated a wordpress site to the latest version but it still has issues connecting out
[17:25] <dwatkins> Interestingly, Windows 8 recovered from my running mkswap on its C: drive, I guess it only wrote to the start of the partition.
[17:25] <ali1234> mkswap doesn't do very much at all unless you actually mount the swap
[17:26] <dwatkins> I added it, realised it was 10 times too big, then swapoff'ed it.
[17:26] <dwatkins> s/added/mounted/
[17:26] <dwatkins> Having 8 GB of RAM is kinda useful.
[17:28] <thatgreenguy> admin python
[17:35] <daftykins> ooh i finally have more error detail
[17:38] <thatgreenguy> #python
[17:39] <penguin42> thatgreenguy: You need to do   /join #python
[17:49] <daftykins> [Sun Nov 10 17:42:32 2013] [error] [client <IP_ADDRESS>] PHP Warning:  An unexpected error occurred. Something may be wrong with WordPress.org or this server's configuration. If you continue to have problems, please try the support forums. (WordPress could not establish a secure connection to WordPress.org. Please contact your server administrator.) in .../wp-admin/includes/plugin-install
[17:49] <daftykins> that's what i'm getting on my VPS
[17:50] <daftykins> very, very odd
[17:50] <penguin42> can it resolve wordpress.org?
[17:50] <daftykins> yep, wget files, connect with both SSL and without
[17:52] <daftykins> echo $http_proxy returns a blank line, so no proxy is set i assume
[17:52]  * penguin42 knows neither wordpress or php, but is there any way to trace what it's doing - if all else fails tcpdump or strace?
[17:53] <daftykins> that's an idea
[17:53] <daftykins> not used tcpdump before mind you
[17:54] <penguin42> daftykins: IMHO probably your easiest way if it's on a remote server is to use tcpdump to a file and then pull the file back to a local machine and poke at it with wireshark
[17:54] <daftykins> sounds good
[18:04] <daftykins> penguin42: hrmm i can see DNS queries in my captures to api.wordpress.org but after that i can't tell what's going on
[18:07] <daftykins> i think it gets the DNS response but then i have no record of it communicating with it
[18:22] <penguin42> daftykins: So you don't see it trying to open a connection to the IP it gets back?
[18:22] <daftykins> no :S
[18:23] <penguin42> hmm, can you open a connection to api.wordpress.org?
[18:23] <daftykins> yeah i used wget to grab its' index before
[18:23] <daftykins> via https
[18:24] <daftykins> there was an odd packet immediately after the DNS queries though
[18:25] <penguin42> do you see the DNS reply?
[18:25] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/3cloqlhxdw6z8r6/cap.png
[18:25] <daftykins> penguin42: what do you make of that?
[18:28] <penguin42> daftykins: What's that <IP_ADDRESS> address - bbdhome2-221-144.network.sure.com ?
[18:28] <daftykins> mine
[18:28] <daftykins> i'm SSH'd in
[18:29] <penguin42> ok, so did you have a web browser open and got an internal server error back?
[18:29] <daftykins> yep
[18:30] <daftykins> i performed my test action which errors, to try and get it to show packets of what it's up to
[18:30] <daftykins> (in this case, searching for plugins - which goes off to the wordpress API site for results)
[18:30] <penguin42> that I think is just part of that reply which you see in the full packet on the next line, it didn't fit in one ether (TCP?) packet
[18:31] <daftykins> hrmm
[18:32] <penguin42> daftykins: I don't see anything wrong there - maybe the AAAA lookups aren't helping, but I doubt it
[18:32] <daftykins> hmm an IPv4 vs. v6 quirk?
[18:33] <penguin42> maybe, but I doubt it - you can see it's doing IPv4 DNS lookups for both the IPv4 and IPv6 addresses, and only getting an IPv4 address back (is my reading) - so that should be OK?
[18:33] <penguin42> daftykins: But it doesn't look like it's then trying to open any connection
[18:33] <daftykins> indeed, it's like it gives up
[18:33] <daftykins> thanks penguin42 - i've no idea who to ask this of next :S
[18:33] <daftykins> actually maybe if i create a test site
[18:34] <penguin42> a php person I think
[18:34] <daftykins> i can see if a stock one works
[18:34] <daftykins> hehe
[19:51] <MartijnVdS> Yay!
[19:52] <MartijnVdS> Just ordered some EP I've wanted for *years*
[19:52] <MartijnVdS> (but that wasn't available)
[19:55] <penguin42> you mean one of those vinyl things?
[19:55] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: no, a CD (the digital edition exists, but is missing a track)
[19:55] <penguin42> oh, that's ok then - of what?
[19:55] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: http://www.nerinapallot.com/shop2/?productDetails.cfm?Basket=1@,&ProductID=1500
[19:56] <MartijnVdS> that one :)
[19:58] <penguin42> MartijnVdS: Never heard of her - but ... Buckminster fuller as a song....
[19:59] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7eclTcAht0
[19:59] <shauno> what's that 500 Server Error on the line below the one highlighted?
[19:59] <MartijnVdS> shauno: which one?
[20:00] <MartijnVdS> shauno: oh you're reading backlog
[20:00] <shauno> sorry, the screencap of wireshark
[20:00] <shauno> ah yeah, didn't notice that was 90 mins ago
[20:00] <penguin42> MartijnVdS: How bizarre
[20:00] <penguin42> shauno: I think that's the result of the reassembly of the one that's highlighted ?
[20:01] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: I drove to Cornwall to see her last May. She's great :)
[20:06] <penguin42> from where?
[20:07] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: from my place in the Netherlands
[20:07] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: so.. here to Rotterdam, then Harwich to Land's End
[20:08] <penguin42> wow
[20:08] <daftykins> shauno: are you good with wordpress and related shenanigans?
[20:08] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: I needed a few days off anyway, drove down (and back up) over 3-4 days :)
[20:08] <shauno> not particularly  lol
[20:08] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: (so a week total)
[20:08] <daftykins> shauno: the next packet was just the web server coming back with the error page that it can't contact wordpress' API domain
[20:08] <popey> Evening.
[20:08] <shauno> I was just curious where the 500 was coming from, because there'd be more logged on the server for that
[20:08] <shauno> ah
[20:09] <daftykins> shauno: this is the issue i've been fighting with tonight, both the real site and a test wordpress site can't talk to wordpress.org on my bigv VPS
[20:09] <daftykins> i've asked the web dev that made the site but he's stumped
[20:11] <shauno> it almost looks like 'happy eyeballs' going wrong
[20:11] <daftykins> huh? :)
[20:12] <shauno> this practice of sending A & AAAA requests together instead of sequentially
[20:12] <daftykins> hmm
[20:12] <daftykins> any thoughts on how to rule that out from testing?
[20:13] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: disable IPv4 xor IPv6
[20:13] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: if that makes it work, you've found the problem
[20:13] <shauno> pretty much, yeah :/
[20:13] <daftykins> ooh - can i stop apache running on IPv6 0o
[20:13] <daftykins> would that work maybe? or does the PHP code being system level still see interfaces and get results etc.
[20:13] <shauno> (or making it try to hit a host that does have an AAAA record)
[20:14] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: you need to deconfigure the address, or libc will magically send AAAA and A requests
[20:16] <shauno> the crashcourse on 'happy eyeballs' is that originally the RFCs said you queried AAAA first and A if it returned negative, if you have a native (not-teredo, etc) v6 route.
[20:16] <shauno> which was a great plan until real life showed up, and sticking that delay on every single v4 query sucked.  so now they have a scheme where they send them in parallel
[20:17] <daftykins> :>
[20:17] <daftykins> perhaps it not getting an answer for both is indeed, why it seems to give up trying
[20:17] <shauno> well, I'm not getting a v6 for wordpress.org either
[20:18] <daftykins> and api.wordpress.org ?
[20:18] <shauno> is just a cname to wordpress.org
[20:19] <shauno> I gotta pop out :/  but on that, it is the dns I'd be looking at, because there's no outgoing connections after the response
[20:20] <shauno> it gets the dns response, and then complains.  rather than trying to connect to anything at all, and then complaining
[20:20] <daftykins> *nod*
[20:21] <daftykins> thanks shauno
[20:23] <daftykins> i echo'd 1 to /proc/sys/net/ipv6/conf/eth0/disable_ipv6
[20:23] <daftykins> the interface lost its' v6 config
[20:24] <daftykins> but no change has been had
[20:24] <penguin42> that's not the problem you had - the problem was it was doing an IPv4 lookup for IPv6 addresses
[20:24] <penguin42> so that's DNS config - although I actually doubt it's the problem you had
[20:24] <daftykins> oh?
[20:24] <penguin42> daftykins: Yeh all the packets were on IPv4 addresses, but it was sending a AAAA DNS lookup which is for IPv6 addresses
[20:25] <penguin42> (but since it got a reply to the A query, that's why I'm saying I doubt it's the problem - but it's possible)
[20:25] <daftykins> sorry i must be being daft here, i see it sent both queries then it got the v4 replies - isn't that normal?
[20:25] <MartijnVdS> it is
[20:26] <daftykins> MartijnVdS: have you seen the pic in question?
[20:26] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/3cloqlhxdw6z8r6/cap.png
[20:26] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: yes, the server replies "500" which means something on the server doesn't like the request
[20:26] <MartijnVdS> the request is sent, and is responded to
[20:26] <daftykins> nah that's the error page saying it was unable to contact the API at wordpress
[20:27] <daftykins> the thing i'm doing on the site (searching for a plugin) trips out
[20:27] <daftykins> "WordPress could not establish a secure connection to WordPress.org. Please contact your server administrator."
[20:27] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: it doesn't do anything but a DNS request, before it determines it can't connect to WP?
[20:27] <daftykins> correct
[20:28] <daftykins> highly suspicious isn't it?
[20:28] <MartijnVdS> maybe you don't have php-ssl installed? :)
[20:28] <MartijnVdS> or whatever PHP uses to talk SSL
[20:28] <MartijnVdS> ("secure connection")
[20:28] <daftykins> i can't see a relevant package
[20:28] <MartijnVdS> because it's not even sending a SYN to open a connection to one of the IPs it receives from the DNS lookup
[20:29] <daftykins> indeed
[20:29] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: the openssl-module is included with php, but your extensions.ini might have it disabled
[20:30] <MartijnVdS> can you ping the address? (api.wordpress.org)
[20:30] <MartijnVdS> 66.155.30.{249,250}
[20:30] <daftykins> yep and wget the index
[20:30] <MartijnVdS> using https?
[20:30] <daftykins> yep
[20:30] <MartijnVdS> or plain old http
[20:31] <daftykins> wget https://api.wordpress.org
[20:31] <daftykins> 2013-11-10 20:31:00 (108 MB/s) - `index.html' saved [442]
[20:31] <MartijnVdS> I think it's suspicious that you get the 500 error before it even *tries* to connect (i.e. send a SYN packet) to those addresses
[20:31] <MartijnVdS> unless you filtered those from the capture
[20:31] <MartijnVdS> I have a bigv.io VM, let me try.
[20:31] <daftykins> ty :)
[20:32] <daftykins> i created a fresh 3.7.1 wordpress instance which still has the same issue
[20:32] <MartijnVdS> ah wait
[20:32] <MartijnVdS> I'd need to set up mysql and everything for that wouldn't I
[20:32] <daftykins> yeah :(
[20:33] <daftykins> i chose debian for mine - is there a wise meta package i can install that might cover any potential deps?
[20:33] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: wordpress? 8-)
[20:33] <daftykins> haha
[20:33] <MartijnVdS> $ apt-cache show wordpress
[20:33] <MartijnVdS> Package: wordpress
[20:33] <MartijnVdS> Priority: optional
[20:33] <daftykins> well no i'm using their auto management thing
[20:33] <daftykins> so things would no doubt berak
[20:33] <daftykins> *break
[20:34] <MartijnVdS> sure but apt-cache show shows you what the Debian dev thinks are the dependencies
[20:34] <daftykins> *nod* i just ran:  apt-cache showpkg wordpress
[20:34] <MartijnVdS> just use "show", showpkg is unreadable ;)
[20:36] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: is that wireshark dump filtered at all?
[20:36] <daftykins> no, but i'm a newbie when it comes to the tcpdump command i used to create it
[20:36] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: tcpdump -i eth0 -w dumpfile
[20:36] <MartijnVdS> should be enough
[20:36] <daftykins> tcpdump -nnvvw capture3.cap i ran
[20:37] <MartijnVdS> that's extra verbose and no DNS lookups by tcpdump itself
[20:37] <daftykins> *nod*
[20:37] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: you could write a small PHP program and run it on the cli
[20:37] <daftykins> The following extra packages will be installed: libjs-prototype libjs-scriptaculous
[20:37] <daftykins> The following NEW packages will be installed: libjs-cropper libjs-prototype libjs-scriptaculous libphp-phpmailer libphp-snoopy
[20:37] <daftykins> those were missing but nothing has changed as a result
[20:38] <MartijnVdS>  Some of Snoopy's features:
[20:38] <MartijnVdS>  .
[20:38] <MartijnVdS>   * easily fetch the contents of a web page
[20:38] <daftykins> :D
[20:38] <daftykins> classic
[20:39] <daftykins> same issue even now
[20:40] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: do you get "An unexpected error occurred. Something may be wrong with WordPress.org or this server's configuration"
[20:40] <daftykins> yep
[20:40] <daftykins> i've poured over the results in google regarding it
[20:40] <daftykins> nothing seems relevant
[20:41] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: This might be the culprit:
[20:41] <MartijnVdS>                         'sslcertificates' => ABSPATH . WPINC . '/certificates/ca-bundle.crt',
[20:41] <MartijnVdS> does that exist?
[20:42] <MartijnVdS> it should..
[20:42] <daftykins> whereabouts are you looking?
[20:42] <MartijnVdS> wordpress/ root
[20:42] <MartijnVdS> just downloaded the tarball
[20:42] <daftykins> there are no certs at all, no
[20:43] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: you could put a "strace -f -p xxx -p yyy" on all your httpd processes (xxx, yyy are the PIDs, add more as needed)
[20:43] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: uh
[20:43] <MartijnVdS> strace -f -o outputfile
[20:43] <daftykins> hang on it's meant to be in /wp-includes/
[20:43] <MartijnVdS> -p xxx -p yyy
[20:43] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: it is: ABSPATH is the absolute path to wordpress/, WPINC is the wp-includes dir
[20:44] <MartijnVdS> the strace might contain useful information (what it tries/gets back) for API access
[20:44] <MartijnVdS> it's a bit low-level
[20:45] <daftykins> what's the location of that path reference for me to check?
[20:45] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: wordpress/wp-includes/certificates/ca-bundle.crt
[20:45] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: should all be readable (not writable!) by the user php runs as (www-data?)
[20:46] <daftykins> ah-haaaa permissions, let's give that a whirl
[20:47] <daftykins> my site is actually in /srv/domain.com/public/htdocs/
[20:48] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: though it's not even trying to create a connection (let alone an SSL connection), so either it aborts before trying (because it can't find the file) or something weird is going on
[20:49] <daftykins> *nod*
[20:49] <daftykins> so the strace plan could be a good one
[20:50] <daftykins> ok i'll give that one a whirl after i make some food
[20:50] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: it might be overkill, is there anything in your errorlog? (httpd)
[20:51] <daftykins> [Sun Nov 10 20:48:02 2013] [warn] RSA server certificate is a CA certificate (BasicConstraints: CA == TRUE !?)
[20:51] <daftykins> that crops up
[20:51] <MartijnVdS> is that *your* https cert, or the remote end?
[20:52] <daftykins> none of my domains possess certs as far as i know
[20:52] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: but apache is still instructed to load one.. maybe the snakeoil one
[20:52] <MartijnVdS> the default always-installed one
[20:52] <daftykins> i wonder if i can justk ill it
[20:53] <MartijnVdS> a2dismod ssl
[20:55] <popey> I pulled a tenner out of my pocket and noticed some scribbles all over it...
[20:55] <popey> http://i.imgur.com/ra8r3Ka.jpg
[20:55] <daftykins> MartijnVdS: bytemark's symbiosis thing, has SSLEngine enabled within its' sites-available config
[20:55] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: ah you use that? :)
[20:55] <MartijnVdS> daftykins: I just installed Ubuntu server on mine ;)
[20:55] <daftykins> yeah atop debian
[20:58] <daftykins> alright i'm really burnt out on this now
[20:58] <daftykins> time for food
[20:58] <daftykins> MartijnVdS: thanks for your help thus far - if you have any further ideas i'd be pleased :>
[21:00] <daftykins> popey: how rude
[21:03] <daftykins> sidenote: do any clothes shops in London stay open late on a Sunday night? 0o
[21:04] <penguin42> are they allowed to?
[21:05] <popey> unlikely
[21:05] <popey> most places close at 4pm
[21:11] <diddledan> daftykins: just a wild guess, is php5-curl installed?
[21:12] <diddledan> however, php errors should be logged somewhere, so a 500 error should have something in a logfile to explain why wordpress failed
[21:46] <daftykins> diddledan: yep it is - i enabled PHP logging to file, but didn't get anything produced when repeating the action
[21:48] <daftykins> which i found very odd :S
[21:49] <diddledan> daftykins: you could try editing your wp-config.php and add `define('WP_DEBUG', true); define('WP_DEBUG_LOG', true); define('WP_DEBUG_DISPLAY', false);` and rerun. the debug log is in "wordpress/wp-content/debug.log" <-- remember to delete it once done because it can leak information
[21:51] <daftykins> diddledan: roger that! i'll do it on my test site, i had seen that idea but hadn't gotten around to it for whatever reason
[21:55] <daftykins> diddledan: it's not writing anything new compared with the apache error log :(
[21:55] <daftykins> still just: "WordPress could not establish a secure connection to WordPress.org. Please contact your server administrator."
[21:55] <diddledan> hmm
[21:56] <diddledan> is there nothing preceeding that statement?
[21:57] <daftykins> [10-Nov-2013 21:54:07] PHP Warning:  An unexpected error occurred. Something may be wrong with WordPress.org or this server’s configuration. If you continue to have problems, please try the support forums. (WordPress could not establish a secure connection to WordPress.org. Please contact your server administrator.) in /srv/test.com/public/htdocs/wp-admin/includes/plugin-install.php
[21:57] <daftykins> that's the full sucker
[22:04] <diddledan> daftykins: can you try running http://pastebin.com/SERmAPbF which should output the full headers in addition to the html from a connection to wordpress.org
[22:04] <diddledan> if that fails but still doesn't telll us why, we can amend it to add some more error reporting
[22:04] <daftykins> would i just put that in a file and run "php file" ?
[22:04] <diddledan> yes please :-)
[22:05] <diddledan> it'll make a nice mess in your terminal - I've written it to be runnable in a browser, too
[22:06] <daftykins> not sure if this is an issue but i re-ran it outputting to a file
[22:06] <daftykins> PHP Warning:  Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at /srv/test.com/public/htdocs/file:3) in /srv/test.com/public/htdocs/file on line 12
[22:06] <daftykins> and got told that
[22:06] <diddledan> that's fine
[22:07] <diddledan> that's because I used header() in the php file
[22:07] <daftykins> http://pastebin.com/WSFq6UCN
[22:08] <daftykins> diddledan: there she be ^
[22:08] <diddledan> ok, that says that php can successfullly connect to wordpress.org - it gets weirderer
[22:08] <daftykins> ^_^
[22:09] <diddledan> try plopping it on your test site and running it via the browser to confirm whether it's able to do it when run through apache
[22:10] <daftykins> was naming it file.php and visiting path/file.php correct?
[22:10] <diddledan> yup
[22:10] <daftykins> as i just get a blank page
[22:11] <daubers> Evening
[22:11] <diddledan> aha, that's interesting
[22:12] <diddledan> I've written a two-line modification to force it to output errors to the browser: http://pastebin.com/q6kUzWDt do the same as before to run it via a browser
[22:13] <daftykins> i'm pasting into nano over SSH with KiTTY and getting a lot of green squares - that likely to be a problem?
[22:13] <diddledan> ooh
[22:13] <diddledan> erm
[22:13] <diddledan> that doesn't sound right
[22:15] <daftykins> i manually typed it out and still get blank :O
[22:16] <diddledan> hmm
[22:17] <diddledan> try putting a "print 'finished';" at the bottom underneath the print $output line
[22:17] <diddledan> that was we can tell whether I've messed up my code :-p
[22:17] <diddledan> way*
[22:17] <daftykins> yep it returned 'finished'
[22:17] <daftykins> :S
[22:19] <daftykins> what is it doing D:
[22:22] <daftykins> diddledan: any further thoughts :)
[22:22] <daftykins> +?
[22:22] <diddledan> I'm just gonna do a bit of experimentation on my vps
[22:22] <daftykins> is it the content type throwing it?
[22:25] <diddledan> nope, it works fine on my ubuntu 12.04 virtual machine
[22:25] <daftykins> are you expecting to see the HTML text or will it show the actual page?
[22:25] <diddledan> the text
[22:25] <diddledan> along with headers at the top
[22:25] <daftykins> yeah it works at command line but apache2 is doing something
[22:25] <daftykins> could a funky php-suhosin status be causing it?
[22:26] <diddledan> it might be an issue with suhosin
[22:26] <daftykins> (i'm unsure whether it's on, off, or partially there at the moment)
[22:26] <diddledan> alternatively apache may not have been restarted since php5-curl was installed?
[22:26] <daftykins> it was definitely already installed
[22:27] <diddledan> or alternatively there might be php.ini differences between the apache2 and cli iterations
[22:28] <daftykins> my /etc/php5/apache2/php.ini is actually autocreated by the bytemark symbiosis system i'm using
[22:28] <diddledan> dang
[22:28] <daftykins> but it's there and readable
[22:28] <daftykins> shall i pastebin it?
[22:28] <diddledan> worth a try
[22:31] <daftykins> http://pastebin.com/KUt47XKS
[22:38] <diddledan> nothing seems out of the ordinary there
[22:39] <daftykins> hang on /usr/bin/php /usr/bin/php5
[22:40] <daftykins> no difference with either 0o
[22:40] <daftykins> /usr/bin/php -> /etc/alternatives/php
[22:40] <daftykins> 0o
[22:41] <daftykins> symlink^
[22:41] <diddledan> `man update-alternatives` tells you about that mechanism
[22:42] <diddledan> on my ubuntu the /etc/alternatives/php points to /usr/bin/php5
[22:43] <daftykins> ah yes :)
[22:43] <daftykins> well i'm glad i don't seem to have done anything too stupid
[22:43] <daftykins> would it help if i let you have a look at my test domain at all?
[22:45] <diddledan> it might
[22:45] <daftykins> http://test.com.testing.togusa.default.kusanagi.uk0.bigv.io/file2.php
[22:45] <daftykins> there's where i created the file
[22:46] <diddledan> lurvely url :-p
[22:46] <daftykins> hah yeah, crazy bigv domains are soooo long
[22:46] <daftykins> then test.com.testing for my little fake domain
[22:47] <diddledan> ok, I've been reading up on suhosin - it might be logging to /var/log/messages
[22:48] <daftykins> i think i managed to fully remove it
[22:48] <daftykins> php5-suhosin got removed
[22:48] <diddledan> sorry, I mena /var/log/syslog
[22:48] <diddledan> hmm
[22:48] <diddledan> did you restart apache after?
[22:48] <daftykins> yep
[22:49] <diddledan> and yet it's still failing. I was working on the assumption that we'd proven that php itself can do the job
[22:49] <daftykins> *nod*
[22:49] <diddledan> it doeswn't make sense >.<
[22:49] <daftykins> something is highly screwy isn't it
[22:49] <daftykins> perhaps i should fire something off to bytemark and just see if i've done something stupid that their symbiosis system gets affected by?
[22:49] <diddledan> I don't suppose it can hurt
[22:50] <diddledan> they might be able to help
[22:50] <daftykins> is there any other form of test i can have php perform atop apache?
[22:54] <mgdm> what's going on, and did you turn selinux off?
[22:54] <mgdm> if indeed it's on...
[22:54] <daftykins> how would i tell on this debian VPS?
[22:54] <mgdm> ah, that's probably a no
[22:55] <daftykins> win \o/
[22:55] <mgdm> I don't have a page up button - can you explain (in PM if you like) what's up?
[22:55] <daftykins> basically wordpress isn't able to contact its' API address, in order to get some results
[22:55] <Azelphur> Seeker`: I got the arduino out...and I UNKILLED IT.
[22:55] <daftykins> (e.g. plugin searches)
[22:55] <daftykins> mgdm: diddledan kindly helped create a test PHP file that pulls the target page down, it works at CLI, but not from behind apache
[22:56] <mgdm> Oh, it's wordpress. hmmm. :-) So - do you know what mechanism it's using? curl? file_get_contents?
[22:56] <daftykins> https://github.com/WordPress/WordPress/blob/master/wp-admin/includes/plugin-install.php
[22:56] <daftykins> i believe that's the one in question
[22:57] <mgdm> holy moley
[22:57] <mgdm> it sends seriazed PHP to another host, which then unserializes it
[22:57] <daftykins> line 77 is what keeps getting flagged as the issue
[22:58] <daftykins> well you know, where it breaks from
[22:59] <mgdm> i'm trying to find the source of wp_http
[23:00] <diddledan> https://github.com/WordPress/WordPress/blob/master/wp-includes/http.php
[23:01] <diddledan> not sure where the calss is tho
[23:01] <diddledan> class*
[23:01] <mgdm> I found it
[23:01] <mgdm> https://github.com/WordPress/WordPress/blob/70fd806759b7a18d45950eb2c368e15949f1ef21/wp-includes/class-http.php
[23:02] <daftykins> ooh i'm getting more content in tcpdump now
[23:02] <mgdm> whaaat
[23:02] <mgdm> this impleents its own HTTP client using fsockopen()
[23:03] <mgdm> what the *hell* are these guys smoking?
[23:03] <daftykins> it appears to be getting TCP resets when awaiting its' reply
[23:03] <daftykins> maybe it is firewall after all...?
[23:03] <mgdm> seems that way
[23:03] <daftykins> omg.
[23:03] <daftykins> i just flushed iptables and it works
[23:03] <mgdm> heh
[23:03] <diddledan> >.<
[23:04] <diddledan> don't you hate that
[23:04] <daftykins> sorry about that guys, but earlier tcpdump wasn't even showing anything beyond the DNS queries
[23:04] <daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/3cloqlhxdw6z8r6/cap.png
[23:04] <daftykins> in my earlier capture ^
[23:05] <daftykins> ok so now i need to look into what's blocking the response :D
[23:08] <daftykins> diddledan + mgdm thanks guys, i think i'm going to call it a night there before i go crazier with it
[23:08] <diddledan> lol
[23:08] <mgdm> hehe, fair enough
[23:09] <daftykins> g'night everyone \o
[23:10] <daftykins> thank you to all those who helped
[23:14] <daftykins> dafty in mountain out of a molehill situation
[23:14] <daftykins> ^_^


[09:08] -queuebot:#ubuntu-ci-eng- slyon, https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/4391 Preparing packages
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[06:05] <fabbione> morning
[06:41] <desrt> word.
[07:06] <fabbione> hey desrt
[07:06] <fabbione> happy with your new headers?
[07:06] <fabbione> desrt: btw i did look at that driver you requested
[07:07] <fabbione> i might included it in the next kernel
[07:07] <fabbione> (was too close to release for the previous)
[07:07] <fabbione> but you need to get somebody to pkg the utilities
[07:07] <desrt> fabbione; oh.  i didn't know you received those bugs :)
[07:07] <desrt> and yes.  the headers are working flawlessly.  thank you very much :)
[07:08] <fabbione> desrt: i get them automatically :)
[07:08] <desrt> i love bugzilla :)
[07:08] <fabbione> i don't
[07:09] <fabbione> it tells me that i suck at maintaining the kernel :P
[07:09] <desrt> oh.  why not?
[07:09] <desrt> no.  it tells you that maintaining a kernel is a hard job
[07:09] <fabbione> nah just kidding ;)
[07:09] <desrt> btw... the first time i ever talked to you was at jdub's recommendation... almost 6 months ago
[07:10] <desrt> i don't know if you remember why that was
[07:11] <fabbione> hmmm i can't really remember...
[07:11] <desrt> gamin.
[07:11] <fabbione> probably.. gamin sucks :P
[07:11] <desrt> and the reason i brought it up: still some cases where it stops working :/
[07:11] <fabbione> ahhh yeah
[07:11] <fabbione> now i reacall
[07:11] <desrt> my desktop stopped updating again yesterday
[07:12] <fabbione> there is probably nothing to update :)
[07:12] <fabbione> it was sunday
[07:12] <desrt> no.. i mean, i was saving files with firefox
[07:12] <desrt> and i had to ctrl+r the desktop to get them to appear
[07:13] <fabbione> what kernel?
[07:13] <desrt> 2.6.12-whatever
[07:13] <desrt> 3?
[07:13] <fabbione> because the latest gamin needs the latest kernel
[07:13] <desrt> -4
[07:13] <desrt> oh hmmm
[07:13] <fabbione> inotify did change from something to ioctl...
[07:13] <fabbione> or whatever...
[07:13] <desrt> maybe i installed a new gamin but had an old kernel
[07:13] <fabbione> and they need to be synced
[07:14] <desrt> and have only recently rebooted
[07:14] <fabbione> mostlikely
[07:14] <desrt> ok
[07:14] <desrt> hm
[07:14] <desrt> actually, it's broken right now
[07:14] <desrt> Linux moonpix 2.6.12-4-686-smp #1 SMP Fri Jul 22 12:56:02 UTC 2005 i686 GNU/Linux
[07:15] <desrt> i just touched a file on my desktop... nautilus doesn't show it until manual refresh
[07:15] <fabbione> can you check if dmesg has comething?
[07:15] <fabbione> something...
[07:15] <desrt> what am i looking for?
[07:15] <fabbione> dunno
[07:15] <fabbione> anything ...
[07:15] <desrt> [4294670.897000]  inotify syscall
[07:15] <desrt> this is all, really
[07:15] <fabbione> ok i will need to check gamin source and our inotify patch
[07:15] <fabbione> perhaps the syscalls aren't synced properly
[07:16] <fabbione> i am pretty sure i have an idea of what's broken...
[07:18] <desrt> btw: restart nautilus -> works fine again
[07:24] <fabbione> hmm
[07:24] <fabbione> i wonder if it is a nautilus issue
[07:24] <fabbione> if the syscalls were not synced, it wouldn't work at all
[07:24] <fabbione> desrt: there is a tutorial on the gnome/gain website
[07:24] <fabbione> that explains how to debug gamin
[07:25] <infinity> (Like when running a breezy kernel on hoary, for instance)
[07:25] <infinity> God, my lack of updating desktop is irritating.
[07:25] <desrt> infinity; you too?
[07:25] <fabbione> iirc sending a kill -USR2 to the gamin process will enable and dump debugging info in /tmp
[07:25] <desrt> oh.  that's useful.
[07:25] <fabbione> infinity: yes.. you cannot run breezy kernels on hoary
[07:25] <infinity> desrt : Yes, but I know why mine doesn't work. :)
[07:25] <desrt> infinity; :)
[07:25] <fabbione> desrt: but please check the website for the correct signals
[07:26] <desrt> mine looks just like the same old bug that was a problem around hoary-prerelease time
[07:26] <fabbione> and be sure to issue the command once again to stop it :)
[07:26] <infinity> fabbione : Sure I can, I just have a few broken features.  On the other hand, my network works and my machine doesn't crash.  The machine's going breezy once I make X less suck.
[07:26] <desrt> fabbione; produces fabulous amounts of output? :)
[07:26] <fabbione> desrt: quite :)
[07:27] <fabbione> infinity: yeah well.. broken features for you are show stoppers for users
[07:27] <fabbione> infinity: you know that ;)
[07:27] <infinity> ;)
[07:27] <fabbione> fantastic..
[07:27] <desrt> fyi, http://www.gnome.org/~veillard/gamin/debug.html
[07:27] <fabbione> fresh breezy install.. X manages to hang my keyboard because fixed fonts are missing....
[07:28] <fabbione> LOVELY
[07:28] <desrt> fixed fonts aren't missing
[07:28] <desrt> mkfontdir is missing
[07:28] <desrt> X can't generate the fontdir cache... therefore can't find any fonts
[07:28] <infinity> It's not "missing", it's just gone for a bit of a jaunt around the block.
[07:28] <desrt> well... i'll be very happy when it gets back from its jaunt :)
[07:28] <infinity> People get so upset about the smallest binaries...
[07:29] <desrt> mkfontdir, xset, xkb*, xmodmap, ...
[07:29] <infinity> desrt : It's all coming back in good time.
[07:29] <desrt> i copied all of the stuff i needed (including fontdir caches) in from my laptop :)
[07:29] <infinity> SOme of the xbk stuff already came back in xkbutils.
[07:30] <fabbione> now.. where is daniels when i need to test my new dildo set?
[07:30] <desrt> fabbione; those new USB-powered dildos?
[07:30] <infinity> I'd be nice to him, if I were you.
[07:31] <infinity> We still need to assing the "make sure X upgrades smoothly from hoary" task to someone.
[07:31] <fabbione> desrt: yes.. with IRDA remote control support ;)
[07:31] <fabbione> infinity: remember that i did Xfree86 -> Xorg
[07:31] <fabbione> infinity: i know what we are talking about
[07:31] <fabbione> and Xorg -> Xorg is simpler
[07:31] <infinity> (Daniel's got the "make it modular and make it work" task, and I've got the "make sure the bloody thing builds in a deterministic and bootstrappable fashion" task...)
[07:32] <fabbione> infinity: btw.. xkbdutils didn't enter the archive yet?
[07:32] <infinity> Yeah, upgrading is the simplest of the bunch, but it's still going to nee a mess of testing, and soon.
[07:32] <infinity> Oh, is it still NEW?   It's FTBFS, and I've been too busy to notice.
[07:33] <fabbione> i got the new libxaw.. that's good
[07:34] <fabbione> what pkg has mkfontdir now?
[07:36] <fabbione> daniels: ?
[07:36] <fabbione> modprobe -k dildo
[07:36] <fabbione> USB: Detected sodomotron on port 1:1.1
[07:37] <fabbione> USB: enabling /dev/sodomotron device for immediate access
[07:42] <desrt> one day... one day i will upload.
[07:46] <fabbione> hmmm i can't remeber how i did fix the KBD problem...
[07:48] <fabbione> AH RIGHT
[07:48] <fabbione> xkbdutils :)
[07:49] <fabbione> dpkg-deb: building package `xkbutils' in `./xkbutils_7.0-2_i386.deb'.
[07:49] <daniels> fabbione: mkfontdir doesn't really exist right now
[07:49] <daniels> i'll fix that tonight
[07:49] <daniels> not at home at the moment
[07:50] <daniels> and yeah, I'll be making sure upgrades work fine, but right now they're not even close
[07:50] <fabbione> daniels: eheh dude... you know how much i love to tease you
[07:50] <daniels> xkbutils got source ACCEPTED, but still needs its binaries NEWed
[07:50] <fabbione> but i need to get a working breezy on one machine
[07:50] <fabbione> and i am checking all the gotchas
[07:50] <daniels> yeah, fair enough
[07:50] <daniels> it's still a work in progress :) but gotta run now
[07:51] <daniels> later
[07:51] <fabbione> (EE) Couldn't load XKB keymap, falling back to pre-XKB keymap
[07:51] <fabbione> (EE) Couldn't load XKB keymap, falling back to pre-XKB keymap
[07:51] <fabbione> daniels: help me only one sec
[07:51] <fabbione> i fixed it yesterday.. but i can't remember how
[07:51] <fabbione> do you recall it?
[07:51] <desrt> fabbione; you can just copy the fonts.cache-1 files from another box
[07:51] <fabbione> desrt: i already fixed the fonts problem
[07:51] <infinity> daniels : Binaries kinda had to build first.  *cough*
[07:51] <desrt> :)
[07:51] <infinity> daniels : I just uploaded a new libxaw that xkbutils is now build-dep on.
[07:53] <desrt> you guys never dpkg-buildpackage, right?  you just upload the source package to the build farm....
[07:53] <infinity> dpkg-buildpackage -S :)
[07:53] <fabbione> i do
[07:53] <infinity> But yes, I do binary builds before I upload.
[07:53] <infinity> I just don't upload the binaries.
[07:54] <infinity> I do "dpkg-buildpackage -uc -us -S ; dpkg-buildpackage -uc -us -b"... If the latter succeeds, I sign and upload the results of the former.
[07:58] <desrt> is the ftp archive signing machine-generated?
[07:58] <fabbione> desrt: ?
[07:59] <desrt> the binary .deb's are signed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[07:59] <fabbione> the .deb are not signed
[07:59] <infinity> The uploads are.
[08:00] <desrt> but aren't the actual .deb's md5'd and then the list is signed?
[08:00] <desrt> like, the actual binary debs
[08:00] <fabbione> desrt: nope...
[08:00] <fabbione> there is no need to
[08:00] <infinity> Yes.  The binary .changes are signed.
[08:00] <fabbione> desrt: only the sources are signed
[08:00] <infinity> fabbione : The binaries are too, dude.
[08:01] <desrt> then what's the point of apt-key and why does apt-get sometimes warn you about unauthenticated packages?
[08:01] <fabbione> infinity: yeah but in the .changes
[08:01] <infinity> fabbione : Yes, that's what he was talking about.
[08:01] <fabbione> there is no signatures of the md5 inside the deb
[08:01] <desrt> right.. i think it's in the Releases file
[08:01] <fabbione> desrt: it's a chain
[08:01] <fabbione> basically you verify that the Release file has a good signature
[08:02] <fabbione> that means that the Packages.gz can be trusted via md5 check on top of the Release file
[08:02] <infinity> desrt : That is the Releases file, which verifies the integrity of the Packages file, which verfies the integrity of the debs, which were verified by a signed .changes when they were uploaded.
[08:02] <infinity> And yes, Releases.gpg is autosigned.
[08:02] <desrt> infinity; gotcha.  thanks :)
[08:02] <infinity> Release.gpg, even.
[08:02] <fabbione> if the Contents of Packages is verified, it means that the md5 contained in it for the binary debs can be trusted
[08:03] <desrt> makes sense
[08:03] <desrt> i imagine that we can't be too far away, though, from someone being able to feasibly calculate MD5^-1(x)
[08:04] <infinity> MD5 can be broken, but can you break it AND deliver data that does something useful (or malicious)?
[08:04] <infinity> That's a much bigger challenge.
[08:04] <desrt> well... you can write a bad package
[08:04] <infinity> Collisions can happen.  Interesting collisions, I'm not so sure about.
[08:05] <desrt> then add some useless padding bytes into the end of it to make the md5 match
[08:05] <infinity> Harder than you'd think.
[08:05] <infinity> Especially since the file size also has to match.
[08:05] <desrt> difficult... but md5 is getting weaker by the day
[08:06] <fabbione> desrt: that's why the Release contains also teh SHA1
[08:06] <infinity> I suspect a picture of my cat probably has the same MD5 as libc6.deb, but I'm not sure how I can use this to take over the world.
[08:06] <desrt> that i didn't know.
[08:06] <fabbione> and mathing both md5 adn sha1 at the same time is impossible
[08:06] <desrt> that makes it very much more difficult
[08:06] <infinity> fabbione : It's the sha1 of the Packages file, we don't carry the sha1 of the debs.
[08:06] <desrt> plus.. honestly
[08:06] <infinity> fabbione : So you could still poision individual debs.  But really, I think the argument is moot.
[08:07] <desrt> half the time it says "packages can't be authenticated" i just hit "yes, continue" anyway
[08:07] <desrt> so who cares :)
[08:07] <infinity> If I have access to poision you in such a sophisticated way, I can probably do something muhc simpler to you.
[08:08] <fabbione> desrt: echo 'APT::Get::AllowUnauthenticated "1";' > /etc/apt/apt.conf
[08:08] <fabbione> and you will forget even to press enter ;)
[08:09] <desrt> nah... i'd at least like it to tell me :)
[08:10] <infinity> It still tells you.
[08:10] <infinity> It just doesn't pause for confirmation.
[08:10] <infinity> "Foo bar baz are unauthenticated, but installing anyway, cause the override is on <zooom!>"
[04:02] <jbailey> lamont: *poke*
[04:03] <jbailey> lamont: I still need you to let me know if I can book you soonish for another biarch setup, or if infinity is capable of doing it.
[04:03] <jbailey> lamont: doko is threatening to beat me...
[04:03] <jbailey> And as interesting as that sounds, Angie is the jealous type.
[07:14] <fabbione> doko: gcc-snapshot is running the testsuite here... on sparc
[08:06] <doko> fabbione: it's not biarch, that's the reason it works
[08:12] <fabbione> ah
[08:12] <fabbione> ok


[08:02] <diplo> Morning all
[08:23] <SuperMatt> morning
[09:14] <davmor2> Morning all
[09:20] <brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
[10:05] <ging_> i did a bad thing
[10:05] <ging_> i installed linux mint
[10:05] <ging_> then i installed ubuntu desktop to it
[10:05] <ging_> and selected lightdm and the window manager
[10:06] <ging_> and now i have unity, with a weird mix of mint
[10:10] <ging> does anyone know of a good way to fully unmint it?
[10:10] <davmor2> ging: why would you do that?
[10:11] <ging> i started a new job
[10:11] <ging> first day i was given a linux mint usb stick to setup my machine
[10:11] <ging> i thought i would give it a go
[10:13] <ging> but i had enough
[10:15] <ging> i need to figure out how to unmint grub
[10:16] <ging> the mint luks decrypt screen does not work properly
[10:17] <ging> when you type in your password it does into some other terminal
[10:17] <ging> in clear text
[10:18] <ging> so i have to boot, then reboot so it falls back to a simple decrypt screen
[10:18] <ging> which thanksfully does work
[10:20] <ging> i am scared to just uninstall mint-common
[10:24] <ging> my biggest problem is i did something to my x settings to make it controlled by nvidia
[10:25] <ging> and i can't get to the unity screen settings
[10:25] <ging> so i can't turn off the sticky menu thing
[10:27] <ging> dconf write /org/compiz/profiles/unity/plugins/unityshell/launcher-capture-mouse false
[10:27] <ging> :(
[10:28] <ging> that does work though
[10:38] <ging> but none of this has cured my origonal problem, which was clicking and dragging stuff makes applications die
[11:15] <davmor2> ging: just install ubuntu then use the debs on the usb pendrive to install anything you need for work :)  A potential solution at least
[11:27] <popey> ging: I'd be inclined to nuke and install ubuntu tbh
[11:30] <awilkins> ging, Likewise. My advice would be back up your home folder (and maybe /etc) and nuke and restore. I keep my home folders on a separate partition just so I can do this at a moment's notice.
[11:31] <awilkins> When I upgraded to xenial something completely bricked my OS, was back up and running again after a 20 minute install with all my files and settings intact because of this.
[13:18] <ging> it seems to have worked suprisingly well
[13:19] <ging> just not fixed any of my origonal issues
[13:19] <ging> except the one that i didnt like mint
[13:36] <popey> given that some things just don't work on mint that should, I'd nuke it
[13:39] <diddledan> I've never liked mint - they frankenstein ubuntu repos with their own repo where their repo has _some_ stuff recompiled or differently versioned so anything from ubuntu which you expect to work with something you've installed from mint will fail - e.g. I had an issue where mint had separately compiled apache or php and apache-modules or php-modules failed to
[13:39] <diddledan> work with it because they hadn't maintained ABI
[13:40] <diddledan> I forget whether it was apache or php - or both
[16:25] <diddledan> ooh, doctor strange is out
[16:26] <diddledan> gotta love a bit of cumerbund
[16:26] <diddledan> cumberbund?
[16:27] <diddledan> how do you spell that?
[16:52] <davmor2> diddledan: yeah cumberland is awesome chips and eggs
[16:52] <diddledan> mm, sausage
[16:52] <diddledan> sausage spiral no less!
[18:40] <daftykins> diddledan: how's the SMART data look on that drive post zero?
[18:40] <diddledan> daftykins: it says no errors now
[18:41] <daftykins> smartctl output or nothing ;D
[18:42] <diddledan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/24060254/
[18:44] <daftykins> ooh no remaps or anything, not too bad... so based on its' power on hours you could use it as a kinda general storage you don't really care about sort of drive, or a testing one - but definitely nothing live
[18:53] <diddledan> :-)
[18:54] <daftykins> diddledan: warning, cat torture - https://i.imgur.com/yaG5abA.gifv
[18:56] <diddledan> :-o
[18:57] <diddledan> poor kitty :-(
[18:58] <diddledan> moar gentoo security patches tonight
[18:59] <daftykins> :D
[18:59] <diddledan> mysql and php
[18:59] <diddledan> \o/
[19:02] <davmor2> daftykins: You know the is my cat planning to kill gag....in this case could we claim justifiable homicide
[19:02] <daftykins> :>
[19:05] <diddledan> I really should turn on my lights
[19:05] <diddledan> sitting in the glow of monitors only is a bit haxx0rish
[19:05] <diddledan> where's my hoodie?
[19:05]  * diddledan wanders off to find the hoodie
[19:06] <daftykins> yep hood up please
[19:06] <daftykins> :D
[19:18] <daftykins> diddledan: i caught this magic timing yesterday - http://i.imgur.com/TJMdRhw.jpg
[19:18] <daftykins> tail to the face!
[19:18] <diddledan> lol
[19:18] <diddledan> floof
[19:18] <daftykins> they've been watching the outside world, which right now they're not permitted to experience...
[19:19] <diddledan> aww :-( are they going cabin feverish?
[19:20] <daftykins> nah, huge house - i think it's more the kitten curiosity and "how can be do more things that the human staff will worry over us for doing?"
[19:20] <daftykins> any of you guys have a really really tough time adjusting to some new specs, before? i've never found it this tough
[19:21] <daftykins> i could see distant stuff like the TV from my sofa perfectly immediately, but i couldn't even read my laptop on my lap in front of me for a while o0
[19:21] <diddledan> nope, but I have a fairly simple prescription
[19:21] <daftykins> it's improved a bit now, but i almost have to look slightly off to the side to see irssi's text clearly, very offputting
[19:21] <daftykins> ah, lucky, i'm on -10 in one eye now
[19:56] <zmoylan-pi> i have had new specs drive me bonkers.  it's was like they set the focal point a different distance than i was used to...
[19:56] <zmoylan-pi> had to move all my screens and keyboards to make space for printed documentation
[19:56] <daftykins> :(
[19:57] <zmoylan-pi> i put it down to merely been from a family with crap eyesight and probably time for bifocals
[19:57] <daftykins> oof
[19:58] <zmoylan-pi> i've carried a monocular for reading bus numbers since i was in early 20s. even with glasses i couldn't read them on some buses
[20:54] <ali1234> zmoylan-pi: my mum had an eye test and they completely messed it up. got her glasses and she couldn't see anything
[20:54] <ali1234> turns out they let a trainee do it, and then the person who was supposed to check it, didn't
[20:55] <ali1234> she went to a different optician and showed them her current and previous prescription and they were like "there's no way that could be right"
[20:58] <zmoylan-pi> i've been using the same optometrist for yonks.  a family run place rather than the usual faceless mob.  in my case it's far more likely that it's my eyes failing
[20:58] <ali1234> it was boots that messed it up iirc
[20:59] <ali1234> the worst thing though is it took her 6 months to do anything about it, because she thought it was just her eyes getting worse
[20:59] <daftykins> O_O
[21:00] <daftykins> every optician in the island seems to be at retirement age now which isn't very encouraging
[21:01] <zmoylan-pi> you've reached the optician event horizon were no new opticans open and the only new ones come along when old ones retire or die
[21:02] <daftykins> indeed!
[21:03] <daftykins> love the way mine emailed out from an address they aren't checking anymore, too...
[21:08] <zmoylan-pi> you just have to hack their gibson to find their real address... :-P
[21:12] <daftykins> well if you put it like that...
[21:17] <zmoylan-pi> and isn't the current best way to get their attention is to poke them on twitter?
[21:24] <Azelphur> I'm happy, bought a refurbished UPS on eBay for £160, looks like it'll hold up all my crap (3 x 40" monitors and two PCs) for an hour :D
[21:27] <daftykins> best to get safe shutdown configured!
[21:27] <daftykins> i've been chasing a Dutch company for a delayed replacement battery for an old APC unit of late
[21:31] <Azelphur> yea, gotta do that
[21:51] <zmoylan-pi> probably waiting for the postmans hernia to heal after the crimbo rush... :-P
[21:51] <daftykins> ;) more than likely a European country trying to work out how to cross the wet bit to get here
[21:52] <zmoylan-pi> the dutch build a wall, drain the area behind it and repeat... simple
[21:59] <diddledan> zmoylan-pi: and make the islanders pay for it
[21:59] <daftykins> https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/02/24/iphone_7_plus_burning_battery/
[21:59] <daftykins> :D
[22:00] <daftykins> zmoylan-pi: my you've been busy, first Nokia, now... https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/02/24/revive_the_psion_5_series/
[22:02] <zmoylan-pi> it's weird in 2008 nokia really really irked me... and my mates laughed when i went on and on about how many mistakes they were making.  within 12 months they had all switched from nokia to android... along with a sizeable chunk of the planet.  i didn't speak to all those people. honest guv
[22:03] <zmoylan-pi> of course, today i took this pic in upmarket shopping centre on dublins most expensive shopping street... https://twitter.com/angryearthling/status/835246630710431745/photo/1
[22:04] <daftykins> :>
[22:05] <zmoylan-pi> they're usually only spotted in street were they're selling fish and veg from stalls on the cobbles


[07:37] <roaksoax> rvba: is there a bug for the UI thing?
[07:39] <rvba> roaksoax: what UI thing?
[07:39] <roaksoax> bigjools: ^^
[07:39] <roaksoax> rvba: the message of not having images
[07:40] <bigjools> yes
[07:40] <bigjools> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1302554
[07:40] <bigjools> argh
[07:40] <bigjools> https://bugs.launchpad.net/maas/+bug/1068843
[07:40] <bigjools> it's all the same problem
[07:41] <roaksoax> cool thanks
[13:42] <roaksoax> bigjools: squashfs is enabled in quantal by default
[13:42] <roaksoax> bigjools: the problme is the error message that gets displayed in the region
[13:43] <roaksoax> is related to the fact that it "doesn't" find the squashfs image on disk
[13:43] <roaksoax> which is obviously false :)
[13:43] <bigjools> roaksoax: my /etc/maas/import_squashfs did not enable quantal by default
[13:44] <roaksoax> bigjools: ah you mean there, but that doesn't affect if it is called from maas-import-pxe-files
[13:45] <bigjools> roaksoax: it seemed to - mipf didn't download squashfs until I enabled it in there
[13:46] <roaksoax> bigjools: no you need to enable quantal on maas_import_pxe_files in order for it to download the squashfs image
[13:46] <roaksoax> bigjools: becuase the release gets sources from [ ! -f /etc/maas/import_pxe_files ] || . /etc/maas/import_pxe_files
[13:46] <roaksoax> so if enabled in import_pxe_files it will be downloaded
[13:46] <bigjools> roaksoax: what is /etc/maas/import_squashfs for then?
[13:47] <roaksoax> bigjools: to override whatever it source from import_pxe_files or if you call import_squashfs directly
[13:47] <roaksoax> bigjools: same as with import_ephemerals
[13:51] <bigjools> roaksoax: so what do you mean by "enable quantal on maas_import_pxe_files" then
[13:51] <bigjools> since I thought it was done via that file :)
[13:51] <bigjools> ETOOMANYCONFIGFILES
[13:53] <roaksoax> bigjools: well so, since we tell the user to use maas-import-pxe-files, we should enable quantal there right?
[13:53] <roaksoax> bigjools: so that script calls -ephemerals -squaqshfs
[13:54] <roaksoax> but each of those can be run independently from -pxe-files
[13:54] <bigjools> roaksoax: I don't know what you mean by "enable quantal there"
[13:54] <roaksoax> bigjools: enable quantal in the config file for maas-import-pxe-files (maas_import_pxe_files)
[13:55] <bigjools> roaksoax: ah there's *another* file I had missed \o/
[13:55] <bigjools> :)
[13:55] <roaksoax> right, so there's 3 maas_import_pxe_files, maas_import_ephemerals, maas_import_squashfs
[13:56] <roaksoax> since -ephemerals, -squashfs can be run independently, then they not only source maas_import_pxe_files for config, but you can override its config in maas_import_ephemerals, maas_import_squashfs accordingly
[14:25] <roaksoax> smoser: ping
[14:25] <roaksoax> smoser: can you come to this room please?
[14:25] <smoser> coming


[08:43] <fnoyanisi> selam
[08:44] <fnoyanisi> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5LfPucCIwo
[08:44] <fnoyanisi> zihniniz acilsin
[21:24] <enderr> Merhaba arkadaslar