[09:05] <mpt> jnick_tait, bug 1288364 needs some artwork. Is that something you could organize?
[09:06] <jnick_tait> mpt, we can certainly assign it to a member of the visual team and get it worked on
[09:06] <mpt> jnick_tait, cool. iainfarrell might be interested too.
[09:07] <mpt> (I mentioned it to him yesterday.)


[03:59] <guest-2uz4bz> Hello
[04:01] <cfhowlett> guest-2uz4bz, greetings.
[04:04] <guest-2uz4bz> I'm hyaving a bit of a problem
[04:04] <cfhowlett> guest-2uz4bz, state the issue with details please
[04:05] <guest-2uz4bz> I just installed studio 12.10 , and all of a sudden there is some kind of boot loop at the login screen, so I'm using the guest acc now
[04:05] <guest-2uz4bz> I mean login loop
[04:06] <cfhowlett> guest-2uz4bz, so you can't login at all then?
[04:07] <guest-2uz4bz> I can login using the ctrl+alt+f1, but not with the normal gui
[04:09] <cfhowlett> guest-2uz4bz, see the link ... http://askubuntu.com/questions/223501/ubuntu-12-10-gets-stuck-in-a-login-loop
[04:14] <guest-2uz4bz> chown username:username .Xauthority
[04:14] <guest-2uz4bz> I put this into the terminal?
[04:15] <cfhowlett> guest-2
[04:15] <guest-2uz4bz> yes?
[04:15] <cfhowlett> yes.  reboot into single user mode and do the fix
[04:39] <testing> I'm the same one from before
[04:39] <testing> the guest
[04:39] <testing> My "fix"
[04:39] <cfhowlett> testing, restate your issue.  we don't remember
[04:39] <testing> I was in a login loop
[04:40] <cfhowlett> testing, ah yes. remembering now ...
[04:41] <testing> as I was saying, my "fix" was just to make a new account (this one) and just scrapping the old one
[04:41] <cfhowlett> testing, nicely done.  I take it everything works properly now?
[04:42] <testing> It seems to, I logged in and out a few times before this and its fine!
[04:44] <cfhowlett> testing, hats off to you, Sir.
[04:45] <testing> Thank you good sir.
[04:45] <cfhowlett> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/7001421/WeSaluteYou.gif
[17:36] <damianos> While I'm not new to linux, I am a total newb when it comes to linux audio production. I just installed 12.10 into vmware fusion to play around with it. My sound is all messed up. It's a slow distorted stutter and it's system wide. Any tips on configuring 12.10 in a VMware VM?
[17:37] <holstein> damianos: i wouldnt expect to use JACK in vm
[17:37] <holstein> i would just run the live CD
[17:37] <damianos> That's a bummer. I can't save any work that way
[17:38] <holstein> damianos: ?
[17:38] <holstein> damianos: you save it where ever you like
[17:38] <holstein> damianos: you can literally save it to the same exact place you are saving now, if you like
[17:39] <holstein> damianos: the "bummer" is, you cant expect JACK to work well on virtual hardware
[17:39] <holstein> you can elaborate as to what your needs are though, ,since JACK might be overkill for your purposes
[17:39] <holstein> could be that you could just add the pacakges to the current distro you are using
[17:41] <damianos> I'm on a mac and use linux VMs for a web development server. I unfortunately don't have a dedicated box for this right now
[17:42] <holstein> damianos: you can run the live CD on the intel mac
[17:42] <holstein> damianos: you can run JACK and some of the other software on OSX natively
[17:42] <holstein> damianos: its not a limiation, nor an issue with JACK.. its more a limitation of the virtual hardware
[17:42] <damianos> Oh I know
[17:43] <damianos> VMware has been a pain
[17:43] <holstein> damianos: i personally dont suggest using jack with internal sound cards, much less fake ones
[17:43] <damianos> mouse issues too
[17:43] <damianos> ok then
[17:43] <holstein> damianos: well, virtualization in general.. though, i usually use virtualbox
[17:43] <holstein> damianos: but,, the live CD should give you a decent experience to test with
[17:43] <damianos> ok so generally VM's are a no go when it comes to ALSA and JACK
[17:44] <damianos> actually, I have an old Pentium D board sitting on a shelf. Maybe I can recycle some parts and put it on that
[17:45] <holstein> damianos: jack.. just jack
[17:45] <holstein> damianos: i woud try it.. you might not get great performance, but you could see what is capable
[17:46] <holstein> OR, reboot the mac holding down the C key and try it there.. saving the work to a USB stick, or the hard drive
[17:46] <holstein> sibelius is "self contained" though, and doesnt "require" any more midi/audio applications
[17:47] <holstein> ^^ sorry.. wrong window
[17:47] <damianos> lol I figured
[17:47] <damianos> actually low powered is good for me
[17:48] <holstein> might be for you.. but for content creation, you might want more
[17:48] <holstein> i use jack on a netbook
[17:48] <holstein> i have realistic expectations
[17:48] <holstein> i set the latency high, and i dont edit on it
[17:48] <damianos> I'm looking to put together an appliance for guitar processing
[17:48] <holstein> just track... in the field.. since its small
[17:48] <holstein> damianos: you'll want a nice card
[17:48] <holstein> damianos: low latency
[17:48] <damianos> I have an maudio firewire solo kicking around
[17:48] <holstein> damianos: you wont do that with *any* internal sounc card
[17:49] <holstein> sound*
[17:49] <holstein> damianos: i use a firewire devcie
[17:49] <holstein> device*
[17:49] <holstein> you'll want to set something up and start tweaking
[17:49] <holstein>  you'll want to hang in #opensourcemusicans
[17:49] <holstein> having done what you are trying to do.. i dont do it
[17:49] <damianos> yes but I can still test my Pd patches and just have Pd generate the tones. That would at least eliminate the need for round trip
[17:50] <holstein> damianos: nah,.. its about the time when you hit the string, and the sound card "proecesses" it, and spits it out
[17:51] <holstein> doing *no* precessing at all in the box. it still has to pull it in analog, and convert it to digital, and convert it back, and spit it out
[17:51] <damianos> well here is my plan. Have a pd patch with fiddle to process incoming signal and send the midi through jack to trigger linux sampler
[17:51] <holstein> damianos: sure
[17:51] <holstein> damianos: and you *can*
[17:51] <holstein> damianos: you'll need a nice card, and a fast machine
[17:51] <damianos> even for just 4 channels?
[17:52] <holstein> damianos: set it up and test.. with the live CD
[17:52] <holstein> damianos: i use 8 at a time typically
[17:53] <damianos> are there maudio firewire drivers around? Last time I checked a couple of years ago there was nothing except for the delta series
[17:54] <holstein> damianos: i typically read and search, and trust nothing i read or search
[17:54] <holstein> i plug it in, and test with a live CD
[17:55] <holstein> i save reciepts
[17:55] <holstein> damianos: i would literally get it out.. fire up the live CD.. open up JACK and seclect the firewire driver and see
[17:55] <holstein> also, the chipset.. the agere chipsets the macs usually use are awful
[17:55] <holstein> i have texas instruments chipsets that i have researched and tested
[17:56] <holstein> http://www.ffado.org/?q=devicesupport/list
[17:56] <holstein> a kernel update, or JACK.. or ffado, and the device that worked could break
[17:56] <holstein> or, become fully functional
[17:57] <holstein> i typically test with an AVLinux live CD and the ubuntustudio liveCD's... i like to see different alsa/JACK/ffado/kernel versions running on that particual hardware
[17:58] <damianos> well it says on the site you linked that my firewire device "reported to work"
[17:59] <holstein> damianos: cool.. thats typically a good sign
[17:59] <damianos> I think I'll slap that motherboard into a box in here and check
[17:59] <holstein> that means you can usually make it work
[17:59] <holstein> damianos: the issue is.. if you plug it in and it doesnt work... who can do anything about it?
[17:59] <holstein> maudio wont
[17:59] <damianos> there is also a creative audigy2zs in there in the PCI slot
[17:59] <holstein> ffado cant
[17:59] <holstein> we cant either.. so, i usualy just fire it up and try firsthand
[17:59] <damianos> I don't care about that
[18:00] <holstein> damianos: the creative is more for playback.. not content creation
[18:00] <holstein> damianos: i put it onpar with an internal sound card.. but it wont hurt to try it
[18:00] <damianos> in the long run I'll be using one of these… http://www.minidsp.com/products/usb-audio-interface/usbstreamer
[18:00] <holstein> i dont trust usb hardware wither
[18:00] <holstein> either*
[18:01] <damianos> What I'd like to use the creative card for is the midi interface and the firewire port
[18:01] <holstein> some use them for exactly what you are trying though... with pd.. over in #opensourcemusicians
[18:32] <_raven_> hi
[18:32] <_raven_> do you know about any commandline mastering tool which is able to receive and transmit streams from/to an icecast server?
[22:21] <Guest63673>  /msg NickServ identify <password>
[23:14]  * al4nc4ds http://boitempoeditorial.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/capa-cypherpunks-provisc3b3ria.jpg
[23:40] <holstein> al4nc4ds: i think that would be appropriate in an offtopic channel
[23:48] <al4nc4ds> damn command. /ame
[23:48] <holstein> al4nc4ds: ?
[23:49]  * al4nc4ds help
[23:49] <holstein> al4nc4ds: i suppose what im getting at is, please refrain from linking images in the channel.. or irrelevant items...
[23:50] <al4nc4ds> ok no worries


[23:47] <cjenkin2> infinity: cjwatson: I just wanted to report that running debconf-set-selections after oem-config-prepare does the trick!
[23:47] <cjenkin2> Thanks a bunch for all your help :)


[06:18] <nhaines> OCLUG meeting went really well today.  So did my presentation "Advocacy for Advocates".  In fact, I got asked to give the talk at another group.
[06:18] <ianorlin> where is that group?
[06:19] <nhaines> Looks like there's going to be a lot of volunteers from OCLUG to help with the installfest.
[06:19] <nhaines> It's in Orange County.  Fullerton.
[06:19] <ianorlin> ah
[06:19]  * ianorlin lives in Torrance
[06:29] <nhaines> Just a jaunt across the 91 to the 57.  :)
[06:30] <rww> you can tell nhaines is in socal because he prepends highway numbers with "the"
[06:30]  * ianorlin does too
[19:05] <grantbow> I posted a blog entry to berkeleylug.com as the meeting is scheduled to start now until three
[19:19] <grantbow> hi Michael
[19:22] <MichaelPaoli> Hello ... and we have http://www.berkeleylug.com/ & http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-california/2687-ubuntu-hour-berkeley/ - Berkeley Linux Users Group & Ubuntu Hour Berkeley.
[19:22] <darthrobot> Title: [Berkeley Linux Users Group]
[19:22] <darthrobot> Title: [Ubuntu Hour Berkeley | Ubuntu LoCo Team Portal]
[19:24] <grantbow> is there a big group today at Bobby G's?
[20:18] <grantbow> MichaelPaoli?
[21:08] <MichaelPaoli> We've so far had 6 people here today.  So fair sized.
[21:13] <grantbow> MichaelPaoli: good :-) I would have been there but my transportation didn't work out the way I had hoped.
[21:14] <MichaelPaoli> grantbow Ah, well, TCP/IP transport seems to work pretty well, ... but harder to move bodies around that way.  ;-)


[00:13] <nijaba> m_3: sure, I'll take a look at it tomorrow.
[00:13] <nijaba> SpamapS: around?
[00:16] <m_3> nijaba: thanks
[00:16] <nijaba> well, maybe someone else can help me decide on this.  I think I have found an easy way to trigger a copy to all peers from a confg-change event
[00:16] <nijaba> My question is, how should I implement this:
[00:17] <nijaba> 1/ sh_peer_rsync_replay: replays exactly the same copies that were done in the peer relation events
[00:19] <nijaba> 2/ sh_peer_rsync sourcepath destpath: copy the given path(s) to all host that were done in the peer relation event
[00:19] <nijaba> 3/ both?
[00:50] <SpamapS> nijaba: here now
[00:51] <nijaba> SpamapS: here to.  working on 3/
[00:51] <nijaba> SpamapS: here to. working on 3
[00:51] <nijaba> lots of lag..
[00:52] <SpamapS> nijaba: so I think another way to look at it is that if we avoid ever calling relation-* in these peer functions, then we can use them anywhere....
[00:53] <nijaba> SpamapS: nope, that won't work.  the initial copy needs to be through a handshake capable mechanism
[00:53] <SpamapS> nijaba: or another way to do it is to detect whether or not we're in a relation, if we are, cache the results of relation-* , and if we're not, use any cached results
[00:53] <SpamapS> oo.. I like that.. hmm
[00:53] <nijaba> SpamapS: subsequent one can cache
[00:53] <SpamapS> Yeah, so if you haven't cached, just exit gracefully
[00:53] <nijaba> yep
[00:53] <SpamapS> EAGAIN ;)
[00:54]  * SpamapS finds it interesting that we're running into all the same things one does with every event loop system
[00:54] <nijaba> yup
[00:55] <SpamapS> nijaba: I'm just now opening up your branch for review :-P
[00:56]  * SpamapS curses the way his attention deficit "condition" has put his fingers in so many pies
[00:56] <nijaba> SpamapS: cool.  again, my first issue it the test_peer.sh which needs to run with sudo
[00:56] <SpamapS> nijaba: yeah, that has to be fixed
[00:56] <SpamapS> I'm 99.9% sure we can run sshd as whoever we want
[00:57] <nijaba> SpamapS: the problem is not who, but how sshd handle certificates.  Short of building a full chroot, I got stuck
[00:57] <SpamapS> nijaba: have you merged with trunk recently? I took a quick look and it looks like you didn't pull in the test reorg that I did.
[00:58] <nijaba> SpamapS: yes, I have.  let me check
[00:59] <nijaba> SpamapS: looks like I may not have pushed the merge...
[00:59] <SpamapS> test_peer.sh is gone in lp:~nijaba/charm-tools/peer-scp
[00:59] <SpamapS> ah ok
[01:00] <nijaba> SpamapS: nope, I forgot a bzr add
[01:01] <nijaba> SpamapS: fixed now
[01:01] <nijaba> and pushed
[01:05] <SpamapS> right thats still broken
[01:06] <nijaba> how so?
[01:06] <SpamapS> oh its the sudo thing never mind ;)
[01:06] <SpamapS> running it in a sudo-less chroot it was not happy
[01:06] <nijaba> nah, it's not :)
[01:06] <SpamapS> so you didn't want to just generate a key for the test, and use cmdline options to point sshd at it?
[01:07] <nijaba> SpamapS: I tried...  my problem was with the host keys
[01:07] <SpamapS> right thats what I mean
[01:08] <nijaba> well, I did figure out how to point it to different host keys, not owned by root, so that it would not block the hanshake
[01:08] <nijaba> this is what I was trying up to rev 102
[01:09] <EvilBill> mchenetz: Wow, easy_install worked.
[01:10] <nijaba> SpamapS: of before that....
[01:10] <mchenetz> Evilbill: awesome
[01:10] <SpamapS> nijaba: I just did a ssh-keygen -t rsa -b 1024 -n -f /tmp/foobar/my_host_key , then sshd -o HostKey=/tmp/foobar/my_host_key -p 29292 .. and its working as I'd expect it to
[01:11] <EvilBill> Yeah, no kidding. :) Thanks for the work on that.
[01:11] <nijaba> SpamapS: you are able to scp to it?
[01:11] <nijaba> duh....
[01:11] <mchenetz> evillbill: no prob… i am still refining the process
[01:11] <nijaba> must have been something else
[01:11] <SpamapS> nijaba: trying that now
[01:11]  * nijaba slaps himself
[01:11] <SpamapS> nijaba: but I can ssh to it
[01:12] <nijaba> SpamapS: if you can ssh, then there is no issue with the handshake
[01:18] <SpamapS> nijaba: so, its pretys imple really. You just have to generate the key, then add [localhost]:29292 right before the ssh-rsa in the key, and thats your known hosts file (-o UserKnownHostsFile=...)
[01:18] <SpamapS> typing accurately, however, not so simple. ;)
[01:19] <nijaba> SpamapS: ah, that's why my handshake was failing....  thanks!  I'll fix and re-submit.  maybe not tonight though
[01:19] <nijaba> why being the port num in the knowhosts
[01:22] <SpamapS> nijaba: because two sshd's can have different host keys
[01:23] <nijaba> SpamapS: I did not think of that
[01:23] <nijaba> SpamapS: thanks so much
[01:25] <SpamapS> nijaba: np, I'll try to look at the other stuff with a blind eye to the tests. :)
[01:26] <nijaba> :)
[01:40] <jelmer> hi SpamapS, did you see my reply to bug 906000 ?
[01:40] <_mup_> Bug #906000: opens new connection for each charm that is fetched <Juju Charm Tools:New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/906000 >
[02:11]  * nijaba falling asleep -> bed
[04:55] <_mup_> juju/ssh-known_hosts r452 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[04:55] <_mup_> Mock bootstrap
[05:30] <_mup_> juju/ssh-known_hosts r453 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[05:30] <_mup_> Cleanup of mocking
[10:05] <nijaba> m_3: review of juju-classroom done
[12:01] <niemeyer> Helloooo
[12:01] <niemeyer> Ho ho ho
[12:01] <niemeyer> Oh, wait.. not there yet..
[13:13] <koolhead11> juju works with Lucid too? correct?
[13:33] <niemeyer> SpamapS: Have you been testing it in Lucid?
[13:34] <koolhead11> niemeyer: i have found a friend who wants to try juju on eucalyptus :D
[13:34] <niemeyer> koolhead11: Ah, nice!
[13:34] <niemeyer> koolhead11: That should work, I think
[13:35] <koolhead11> i asked him to get it from PPA
[13:35] <koolhead11> niemeyer: am on it.  once we get success will pastebin steps sumwer and later push it on documentation :D
[13:37] <niemeyer> koolhead11: Sweet!
[13:48] <tyska> hello guys
[13:48] <tyska> im having this error on juju bootstrap command -- Failure: twisted.internet.error.TCPTimedOutError: TCP connection timed out: 110: Connection timed out.
[13:48] <koolhead11> niemeyer: tyska is testing eucalyptus/juj
[13:48] <koolhead11> on lucid
[13:48] <niemeyer> tyska: Looks like a timeout indeed.. :-)
[13:49] <niemeyer> tyska: It's unable to communicate with the server
[13:50] <tyska> niemeyer: but my machine has internet access, what could be the problem then?
[13:51] <koolhead11> tyska: can you see /home//juju/enviornments.yaml file
[13:51] <koolhead11> you have to modify it for your local settings :P
[13:51] <tyska> koolhead11: what needs to be there?
[13:51] <koolhead11> 1 sec
[13:52] <tyska> koolhead11: i think i need to set type as ec2, not local
[13:52] <niemeyer> Sorry guys, I have a scheduled lunch and can't be late, but I'll be back later
[13:52] <tyska> koolhead11: beucause im trying to use juju with eucalyptus
[13:52] <tyska> niemeyer: np, im going to lunch too
[13:52] <tyska> koolhead11: i will be right back
[13:52] <koolhead11> tyska: k
[13:59] <koolhead11> tyska: http://paste.ubuntu.com/777428/
[14:20] <tyska> im back
[14:20] <tyska> are u there koolhead11
[14:20] <tyska> ?
[14:20] <koolhead11> yes
[14:20] <koolhead11> [19:29] <koolhead11> tyska: http://paste.ubuntu.com/777428/
[14:21] <tyska> yeah
[14:21] <tyska> will check this
[14:24] <tyska> after editing environments.yaml -- Connection was refused by other side: 111: Connection refused.
[14:27] <koolhead11> tyska: juju -v bootstrap
[14:28] <tyska> Failure: twisted.internet.error.ConnectionRefusedError: Connection was refused by other side: 111: Connection refused.
[14:28] <tyska> it seems the clc of eucalyptus refused the connection, put i used the same access and secret key on credentials generated by euca_conf
[14:28] <tyska> *but
[14:29] <koolhead11> tyska: so see if your putting correct credentials
[14:29] <koolhead11> :d
[14:29] <tyska> already did it
[14:29] <tyska> the credentials are the same as eucarc
[14:31] <koolhead11> tyska: i dont see any other issue rather than wrong credentials.
[14:31] <tyska> me neither
[14:32] <tyska> =/
[14:32] <koolhead11> tyska: how about the ec2 url path :P
[14:32] <koolhead11> ec2-uri: http://my.private.cloud:8773/services/Cloud     s3-uri: http://my.private.s3:3333
[14:33] <tyska> the same as in eucarc file
[14:43] <tyska> koolhead11: some good new?
[14:49] <koolhead11> tyska: tell me
[14:49] <tyska> koolhead11: ec2-urL instead of ec2-urI =)
[14:49] <tyska> koolhead11: no
[14:49] <tyska> koolhead11: false clue
[14:50] <tyska> koolhead11: but there something wrong, regardless the adress of ec2 and s3, anything i put there returns the same error
[14:53] <niemeyer> jimbaker: Can you please help tyska out?
[15:02] <m_3> nijaba: thanks!
[15:04] <nijaba> m_3: np.  sorry to be picky.  hope not to be wrong too :)
[15:06] <m_3> nijaba: hey... no problem at all
[15:07] <m_3> most of this is really old from the byobu-classroom charm and needs to be updated
[15:07] <m_3> it's good to catch both of them now
[15:08] <niemeyer> tyska: Can you please run the same command with strace, and send me the output?
[15:09] <tyska> niemeyer: ok
[15:09] <nijaba> m_3: yep, I figured you inherited most of this from the original charm
[15:09] <m_3> nijaba: without looking too carefully :)
[15:09] <m_3> that's what the review process is for
[15:10] <nijaba> +1
[15:13] <tyska> niemeyer: here it is http://pastebin.com/txjnw0KK
[15:15] <niemeyer> tyska: Can you please run "telnet <IP_ADDRESS> 80" on the same machine?
[15:16] <tyska> niemeyer: sure, but why on 80?
[15:16] <tyska> niemeyer: why not on 8773?
[15:17] <niemeyer> tyska: How does your configuration look like?
[15:17] <tyska> niemeyer: see it here http://paste.ubuntu.com/777428/
[15:18] <tyska> niemeyer: im trying to configure juju with eucalyptus, then i change ec2-uri to my ec2_url which is http://<IP_ADDRESS>:8773/services/Eucalyptus
[15:21] <niemeyer> tyska: Good question.. apparently it's not where it is connecting..
[15:22] <tyska> yeah
[15:22] <tyska> i saw in strace it trying to connect port 80, but i dont understood why
[15:23] <tyska> telnet on port 80 fails
[15:23] <tyska> but in 8773 works well
[15:23] <niemeyer> tyska: Btw, the URL you paste above is not the URL that is in the configuration
[15:25] <tyska> niemeyer: yeah i know, that pastebin is just a template
[15:25] <tyska> i changed that for my cloud url
[15:26] <niemeyer> tyska: Yeah, it's just that I have to trust the information you provide
[15:26] <niemeyer> tyska: Otherwise we'll get nowhere :)
[15:26] <tyska> hehe, ok, let me paste my config file
[15:27] <tyska> http://pastebin.com/KNF8g9ph
[15:31] <niemeyer> tyska: Ok, can you please run the command again, while running this in a separate terminal: sudo tcpdump -vv -i any 'host <IP_ADDRESS>'
[15:31] <niemeyer> tyska: I suspect it won't help much, but at least we'll kill another possibility
[15:32] <tyska> niemeyer: before that i wanna know a thing
[15:32] <tyska> niemeyer: im running this command from the machine <IP_ADDRESS>
[15:32] <tyska> niemeyer: could i run this from another machine that is in the same subnet right?
[15:33] <niemeyer> tyska: I'd prefer if you run it in the same environment
[15:33] <m_3> tyska: can you successfully spin up instances using just euca-tools?  i.e., no juju
[15:33] <m_3> tyska: and are you in one of the 'MANAGED' networking modes?
[15:33] <niemeyer> m_3: juju seems to be talking to the wrong port for whatever reason
[15:33] <tyska> m_3: eucalyptus working fine, using managed novlan
[15:34] <tyska> niemeyer: in fact, i tried to do from another machine, and the error changed, but the machine connected in the port 8773
[15:34] <m_3> cool just making sure there's a baseline
[15:34] <tyska> niemeyer: wanna u see the strace or wanna keep trying from the machine <IP_ADDRESS>?
[15:35] <niemeyer> tyska: The new error please
[15:35] <niemeyer> tyska: It connects to the right port here, FWIW
[15:35] <niemeyer> tyska: Which juju version are you running?
[15:36] <tyska> 0.5 i think
[15:36] <niemeyer> tyska: The full version you get out of dpkg -l
[15:37] <tyska> 0.5+bzr432 on <IP_ADDRESS> machine and 0.5+bzr398 on my notebook
[15:38] <tyska> niemeyer: http://paste.ubuntu.com/777552/ the connection error from my notebook
[15:38] <tyska> same juju config file
[15:43] <SpamapS> hmmm
[15:43] <SpamapS> that seems *odd*
[15:43] <SpamapS> you got the PPA version on the machines, but the archive version on your notebook
[15:44] <SpamapS> tyska: or are the notebook and the <IP_ADDRESS> machines totally unrelated?
[15:44] <tyska> SpamapS: unrelated
[15:44] <SpamapS> ok
[15:45] <tyska> SpamapS: but the clc (<IP_ADDRESS>) is lucid, with ppa added via add-apt-repository, and my notebook is oneiric without ppa
[15:45] <tyska> oneiric repositories already have juju package
[15:45] <SpamapS> jelmer: I did see your reply to bug 906000 .. I am very far behind on replying to things. ;) I'll gather my thoughts on that soon.
[15:45] <_mup_> Bug #906000: opens new connection for each charm that is fetched <Juju Charm Tools:New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/906000 >
[15:46] <SpamapS> niemeyer: I have not been testing juju on lucid, no. (answering your question from backscroll...)
[15:46] <tyska> i dont know why the things simply dont work on the first time to me
[15:46] <SpamapS> tyska: Right, the PPA version is *a lot* newer and has a few bug fixes that you'll probably want.
[15:47] <jelmer> SpamapS: thanks - no hurry, I just wasn't sure whether you'd seen it
[15:47] <tyska> SpamapS: but oddly the ppa version does not consider the port i put in the config file (8773) and try to connect into port 80
[15:47] <tyska> SpamapS: the older version try to connect on the right port
[15:48] <SpamapS> tyska: I'm fairly certain the URL is just handed to a lower library, txaws
[15:48] <SpamapS> tyska: so what version of python-txaws do you have installed?
[15:49] <niemeyer> tyska: Can you please paste the normal output from the command you're running?
[15:49] <tyska> 0.0.1bzr-0juju92~lucid1
[15:49] <tyska> niemeyer: in which machine?
[15:50] <tyska> SpamapS: 0.2-0ubuntu5 on my notebook
[15:50] <SpamapS> so perhaps txaws needs updating on lucid
[15:53] <koolhead11> tyska: did you do apt-get upgrade too
[15:53] <tyska> SpamapS: but from which repository? the lucid repositories are just showing 0.0.1
[15:55] <tyska> koolhead11: already did
[15:55] <tyska> niemeyer: the error on my notebook is 500 internal server error
[15:55] <tyska> niemeyer: on the clc the error is Connection was refused by other side: 111: Connection refused.
[15:56] <niemeyer> tyska: Looks like Eucalyptus is failing on you
[15:56] <niemeyer> tyska: We're probably touching a bad edge there
[15:57] <tyska> niemeyer: euca commands works fine from my notebook, eucalyptus is working fine
[15:57] <tyska> niemeyer: i can run new instances, see the resources available, create volumes and upload new images with no problem
[15:58] <niemeyer> tyska: 500 is an error from the server side
[15:58] <niemeyer> tyska: Please check out the logs
[15:58] <hazmat> greetings
[15:58]  * hazmat catches up
[15:59] <tyska> you mean eucalyptus logs?
[15:59] <niemeyer> tyska: Yes, looks for the reason why it's returning a 500/internal error
[15:59] <tyska> niemeyer: there is no error on the logs
[16:01] <niemeyer> tyska: Maybe on S3 then
[16:02] <SpamapS> We haven't tested against euca in a while, but I thought I remembered us doing it at least a couple of times before OpenStack was usable.
[16:02] <niemeyer> tyska: Can you please paste the actual error?
[16:03] <hazmat> this is debugging juju with eucalyptus? do we have a traceback from juju -v bootstrap?
[16:04] <niemeyer> hazmat: He's about to paste it
[16:04] <hazmat> hmm.... yeah.. that looks like an s3 error
[16:04] <tyska> niemeyer: 500 error is an auth error, maybe juju is not passing the keys in the right way
[16:04] <niemeyer> tyska: No, it's an internal error from the server
[16:04] <hazmat> tyska, the server error would be in the walrus logs
[16:04] <niemeyer> tyska: Can you please paste the actual error?
[16:05] <tyska> 500 internal server error
[16:05] <tyska> walrus does not have log
[16:05] <tyska> just cloud-error.log
[16:05] <tyska> and there is no error in this log
[16:07] <tyska> if i try to connect to the url from my browser, i get 500 internal server error
[16:07] <tyska> i think juju is trying to do that without using the access and secret keys
[16:07] <niemeyer> tyska: 500 is not an authentication error..
[16:08] <niemeyer> tyska: and juju does use the keys to access S3, otherwise nothing else would work
[16:09] <tyska> walrus and clc are on the same machine
[16:09] <niemeyer> tyska: You can dump the TCP session with tcpdump if you want to check what's going through the wire
[16:09] <niemeyer> tyska: As I suggested earlier
[16:09] <tyska> niemeyer: sure
[16:09] <tyska> from my notebook or clc machine?
[16:10] <niemeyer> tyska: From the place you want to debug :)
[16:11] <tyska> ok
[16:12] <koolhead11> tyska: rushing home. hope it works. :)
[16:12] <tyska> koolhead11: ok, tks for the help
[16:13] <tyska> niemeyer: V
[16:13] <tyska> http://paste.ubuntu.com/777594/
[16:16] <niemeyer> tyska: That's not printing the actual packets, sorry.. let me check which option we need
[16:19] <niemeyer> tyska: -X
[16:19] <niemeyer> tyska: Can you please run the same experiment again with -X in tcpdump, rather than -vv
[16:19] <tyska> niemeyer: sure
[16:20] <tyska> http://paste.ubuntu.com/777597/
[16:20] <niemeyer> tyska: Btw, where are you located?
[16:20] <tyska> Brazil
[16:21] <niemeyer> tyska: Alright, that dump is useful.. let's see
[16:21] <niemeyer> tyska: Where?
[16:21] <niemeyer> tyska: I mean, where in Brazil?
[16:21] <tyska> Rio Grande do Sul, did you know Brazil?
[16:21] <niemeyer> tyska: I live about 60km from you
[16:21] <tyska> niemeyer: =O where are u?
[16:22] <niemeyer> tyska: Pelotas
[16:23] <tyska> niemeyer: are u brazilian?
[16:23] <niemeyer> tyska: Yep
[16:23] <tyska> niemeyer: hahaha then why are we talking in english?
[16:24] <niemeyer> tyska: Because that's the language that most people here understand
[16:24] <tyska> niemeyer: off course
[16:24] <tyska> niemeyer: where do you work?
[16:25] <niemeyer> tyska: I work at Canonical, on juju
[16:25] <tyska> niemeyer: cool
[16:25] <niemeyer> tyska: "ization:.AWS.WKy"
[16:25] <niemeyer> tyska: You see that in the dump?
[16:25] <niemeyer> tyska: It's juju sending the auth keys
[16:25] <tyska> yeah
[16:26] <niemeyer> tyska: And here is Walrus blowing up: "HTTP/1.1.500"
[16:26] <niemeyer> tyska: it was doing a GET: "GET./juju-f8"
[16:27] <niemeyer> tyska: We used to have someone from Eucalyptus here.. hold on
[16:27] <tyska> niemeyer: but this reply is not from walrus
[16:28] <tyska> niemeyer: it is the reply from services/Cloud, i can see it if i access from my browser
[16:28] <niemeyer> tyska: Is it not?
[16:28] <niemeyer> What's sitting at clc.cloud.c3.furg.br.8773?
[16:28] <tyska> niemeyer: if i access services/Walrus i get another error response, but in xml format
[16:28] <tyska> both clc and walrus
[16:29] <niemeyer> tyska: That sounds suspect..
[16:29] <niemeyer> tyska: You can't have the two processes listening on the same IP port
[16:30] <niemeyer> s/ip/tcp
[16:30] <tyska> it's make sense
[16:31] <tyska> but maybe there is just one process that handle with the requests
[16:31] <tyska> when you request services/Eucalyptus it sends you to clc, services/Walrus sends to Walrus
[16:32] <niemeyer> tyska: and what does "sends to Walrus" mean?
[16:33] <tyska> i think its just a webservice handler listening the 8773 port
[16:34] <tyska> and when i say 'i think' it is because i dont know for sure
[16:35] <tyska> that redirect the requests to the right processes
[16:35] <niemeyer> tyska: Sorry, I don't get it.. services/Walrus sends you to what?
[16:35] <tyska> to the walrus process
[16:35] <tyska> eucalyptus-walrus
[16:36] <tyska> niemeyer: see it here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/777617/ - this is the response when i acess <IP_ADDRESS>:8773/services/Walrus
[16:37] <tyska> niemeyer: and this is the response if i access <IP_ADDRESS>:8773/services/Walrus - Failure: 500 Internal Server Error
[16:37] <tyska> niemeyer: and if i acess just <IP_ADDRESS>:8773 the answer is the error 500 too
[16:38] <niemeyer> tyska: You said you were using other tools, right?
[16:38] <niemeyer> tyska: Which tools were you using to interact with walrus?
[16:39] <tyska> tyska: i never did direct interactions with walrus, but node controllers need to access walrus to get the images to run instances
[16:39] <tyska> ops
[16:40] <tyska> niemeyer:
[16:40] <niemeyer> tyska: Perhaps it's just like you said.. walrus might be embedded within the HTTP server as a Java app
[16:40] <tyska> and walrus is used too, to upload images, which i did three times
[16:40] <niemeyer> tyska: Under a specific URL
[16:40] <SpamapS> niemeyer: I think its proxied
[16:40] <niemeyer> tyska: and I'm not quite sure juju, or other tools, handle it like that to be honest
[16:40] <m_3> tyska: perhaps try http://localhost:8773/services/{Eucalyptus,Walrus} from the clc directly?
[16:41] <SpamapS> but again, "i think" .. you probably need somebody with an actual clue at this point
[16:41] <SpamapS> m_3: hey, you fit that bill..
[16:41] <tyska> m_3: already tried it
[16:41] <niemeyer> SpamapS: I don't think so.. I think it's all jars onto the java app server
[16:41] <SpamapS> Oh even more fun. :)
[16:41] <tyska> m_3: but in the clc i think i have another problem with juju, which is old version of python-txaws
[16:42] <niemeyer> tyska: Have you used s3cmd before?
[16:42] <m_3> tyska: ok, so I'd start with just getting s3curl or similar to work with the http://localhost:8773/services/Walrus
[16:42] <m_3> niemeyer: exactly
[16:42] <tyska> m_3: the ec2-uri is not correctly parsed from the config file
[16:42] <tyska> niemeyer: never used s3cmd before
[16:42] <niemeyer> m_3: Why is it not?
[16:42] <jcastro> mchenetz: hey so I've incorporated bill's feedback into the OSX instructions
[16:42] <niemeyer> m_3: Seems to be working correctly so far..
[16:43] <niemeyer> Sorry..
[16:43] <niemeyer> tyska: Why is it not?
[16:43] <niemeyer> tyska: It seems to work well so far..
[16:43] <niemeyer> tyska: The error is not related to the ec2-uri
[16:43] <mchenetz> jcastro: Sounds good… Evilbill installed successfully with Easy_install method
[16:43] <tyska> niemeyer: remember that in the first machine, the strace shows that it tying to connect to the port 80
[16:43] <tyska> instead 8773
[16:43] <niemeyer> tyska: It's quite possible that the problem is that txaws isn't handling the prefix /eucalyptus/Walrus correctly
[16:44] <niemeyer> tyska: This was strange, but we never got to know why that was happening
[16:44] <tyska> niemeyer: let me remove the prefix just to see it grabs the right port
[16:44] <jcastro> mchenetz: did that permission problem he talked about end up being a real problem?
[16:44] <niemeyer> tyska: It's incorrect to say that ec2-uri isn't being parsed correctly, though.. we use it in other situations, e.g. to set different EC2 regions, and it actually works
[16:44] <jcastro> mchenetz: I can widen the call for testing if you'd like
[16:45] <mchenetz> jcastro: Yes, i ask working on the permission problem. I created a VM to test with.
[16:45] <niemeyer> tyska: You also just pointed out you have an old version of python-txaws in that machine
[16:45] <hazmat> definitely s3 usage supports ports, the url path suffix doesn't appear to have been tested previously though
[16:45] <niemeyer> tyska: Which is exactly what's used to access the services
[16:45] <mchenetz> jcastro: I am currently working on a mac app store version too...
[16:45] <niemeyer> hazmat: Yeah, it's probably it..
[16:45] <jcastro> mchenetz: ok so do you think you want more testers?
[16:46] <niemeyer> hazmat: I'd just like to check if walrus itself is working at that URL at all before spending any time on it
[16:46] <hazmat> niemeyer, maybe.. its not clear walrus is fully functional in this installation
[16:46] <niemeyer> hazmat: It's at least answering at that URL, apparently
[16:46] <mchenetz> jcastro: Hold off for right now… I will update the script and then test again
[16:46]  * jcastro nods
[16:46] <niemeyer> hazmat: and, regardless, the URL juju is accessing is not prefixed
[16:46] <niemeyer> hazmat: as we can see in the dump
[16:47] <tyska> niemeyer: removing the suffix does not help, juju bootstrap keeps trying to connect to port 80 instead 8773
[16:47] <niemeyer> hazmat: It's also suspect because it doesn't seem to be informing the bucket name
[16:47] <tyska> niemeyer: im saying in this specific case, the port in the config file is being ignorated
[16:47] <niemeyer> tyska: In your laptop it's not trying to connect to that URL
[16:48] <niemeyer> tyska: as we could see in the dump
[16:48] <tyska> niemeyer: in the laptop it is connecting to the right port
[16:48] <niemeyer> tyska: Right?
[16:48] <tyska> niemeyer: right
[16:48] <niemeyer> tyska: and in the one that is connecting to the wrong URL, you have an out of date python-txaws, right?
[16:48] <tyska> niemeyer: i was saying to m_3, that i cant test if localhost:8773 works, because for some reason it grabs the wrong port
[16:48] <tyska> niemeyer: yeah
[16:49] <niemeyer> tyska: Cool.. so all I'm saying we can't take any conclusions out of that
[16:49] <tyska> niemeyer: version is 0.0.1 instead 0.2, and that is probably the reason for the wrong parse
[16:49] <niemeyer> tyska: The first thing to put in your clc the same package versions you have in your other machine
[16:49] <niemeyer> s/to/is to/
[16:50] <tyska> niemeyer: yeah, but how? since one is lucid and another is oneiric
[16:50] <tyska> niemeyer: there is no 0.2 package in the lucid repositories
[16:51] <niemeyer> tyska: Ok, there's an issue there then..
[16:51] <niemeyer> tyska: But you don't need those packages in that machine
[16:51] <niemeyer> tyska: Just use your laptop
[16:51] <tyska> niemeyer: no problem
[16:51] <niemeyer> tyska: Everything juju needs will work fine that
[16:51] <niemeyer> way
[16:51] <tyska> as i sayd, i was just saying to m_3, that i cant test if localhost:8773 works, because for some reason it grabs the wrong port
[16:51] <niemeyer> tyska: What we have to sort out is why S3 isn't working
[16:51] <niemeyer> tyska: Well, the first thing anyway
[16:51] <tyska> in the clc machine
[16:52] <niemeyer> tyska: So.. can you please try with s3cmd?
[16:52] <tyska> niemeyer: we cant say S3 isn't working, at least yet
[16:52] <tyska> niemeyer: we need to use the s3cmd to know that for sure
[16:52] <niemeyer> tyska: We can say the S3 interaction between juju and walrus is not working
[16:52] <tyska> niemeyer: yeah, this we can
[16:52] <niemeyer> Good :)
[16:53] <niemeyer> tyska: So, please try s3cmd out.. or any other S3 client, for that matter, and see how it goes.. if it's working, we'll likely need to fix txaws to work with path prefixes
[16:53] <niemeyer> tyska: Thanks for debugging that, btw
[16:53] <tyska> niemeyer: ok
[16:53] <tyska> niemeyer: no problem, i thanks for the help
[16:54] <m_3> s3curl might be a little easier to configure for eucalyptus than s3cmd
[16:55] <m_3> both are covered in http://cssoss.wordpress.com/2010/05/10/eucalyptus-beginner%E2%80%99s-guide-%E2%80%93-uec-edition-chapter-6-%E2%80%93-storage%C2%A0management/
[17:00] <tyska> thanks m_3, i was suffering to configure s3cmd
[17:02] <m_3> tyska: s3cmd is a pain
[17:07] <tyska> i cant find the package perl-Digest-HMAC
[17:07] <tyska> to install s3curl
[17:09] <SpamapS> tyska: apt-get doesn't have s3cmd?
[17:09] <SpamapS> tyska: usually its just 'sudo apt-get install s3cmd'
[17:09] <tyska> SpamapS: s3cmd yes, but it is complex to configurate
[17:09] <tyska> SpamapS: i just wanna a simple tool to test, it seems s3curl is simplest
[17:11] <m_3> tyska: libdigest-hmac-perl on lucid
[17:12] <tyska> m_3: tks
[17:13] <tyska> m_3: i already have this package installed, but im on oneiric (notebook)
[17:16] <niemeyer> tyska: Can't see how s3cmd is any worse to configure than any other alternative
[17:17] <niemeyer> tyska: You'll need access key, secret key, and the endpoints
[17:17] <niemeyer> on all of htem
[17:17] <m_3> s3cmd required a patch to talk to walrus
[17:17] <tyska> niemeyer: ok then, lets see
[17:17] <m_3> last I checked
[17:17] <tyska> we have two choices
[17:17] <niemeyer> m_3: What was the patch about?
[17:17] <tyska> my notebook and clc machine
[17:17] <m_3> service path issues iirc
[17:17] <tyska> i get different erros
[17:17] <tyska> with s3cmd
[17:18] <m_3> niemeyer: http://open.eucalyptus.com/wiki/s3cmd
[17:18] <tyska> see it here
[17:18] <tyska> http://paste.ubuntu.com/777672/
[17:18] <tyska> i used this to configure the s3cmd
[17:18] <tyska> http://open.eucalyptus.com/wiki/sample-s3cmd-config
[17:20] <SpamapS> I'm surprised we didn't pull that patch into s3cmd for Ubuntu
[17:20] <m_3> me too
[17:21] <niemeyer> LOL
[17:21] <niemeyer> m_3: Cheers
[17:21] <niemeyer> http://open.eucalyptus.com/wiki/s3cmd-<IP_ADDRESS>
[17:21] <m_3> afaik, nobody else (s3 or openstack) adds a service path prefix (services/Walrus) to the s3-uri
[17:21] <niemeyer> The patch to s3cmd is fixing _exactly_ the problem we're seeing with juju :-)
[17:21] <m_3> right
[17:22] <m_3> but looking through the txaws code it looks like it handles 'path' in parsing the uri
[17:22] <SpamapS> so maybe walrus isn't fully s3 compatible?
[17:22] <niemeyer> tyska: Can you please file a bug, and report the problem we've perceived regarding the S3 prefix?
[17:22] <m_3> looking at txaws.utils parse next
[17:22] <niemeyer> m_3: I'm not sure about where the issue lies, but it's quite clear from the dump that it has no prefix when doing the HTTP GET at least
[17:22]  * m_3 grins at "fully s3 compatible"
[17:23] <m_3> right GET /juju-...
[17:23] <niemeyer> Yeah, looks like such an easy to remain compatible issue
[17:23] <niemeyer> Just open a separate port
[17:23] <niemeyer> Why requiring everybody to change their libraries..
[17:23] <m_3> like 3333
[17:24] <m_3> there's a bit more of a mess to deal with in the euca case... the jetty routing would need to change
[17:24] <m_3> they might've done that in later versions though
[17:25] <SpamapS> Seems like we keep hitting this issue where the S3 piece isn't really S3-like at all
[17:25] <SpamapS> niemeyer: seems like the file storage providers need to have compatibility modes. :-P
[17:26] <tyska> then that's it guys? must i report a bug in launchpad?
[17:27] <m_3> tyska: please do... then that's a point to watch for notifications when it's fixed
[17:27] <niemeyer> tyska: Yes, please..
[17:27] <tyska> ok then guys, thank you very much for the help
[17:28] <niemeyer> tyska: As you can see.. walrus is doing something different, which libraries are not ready to handle.. we want to support it, but we'll have to fix it
[17:28] <tyska> niemeyer: no problem
[17:28] <niemeyer> tyska: The alternative, if you want to keep going right now is:
[17:28] <niemeyer> 1) Change Walrus so it behaves normally
[17:28] <niemeyer> 2) Use real S3
[17:29] <niemeyer> No matter what, please file the bug so we can schedule it
[17:29] <SpamapS> tyska: probably want to file it against txaws, and then "also affects" juju so its seen in both bug trackers.
[17:30]  * SpamapS retreats to the fortress of solitude to try and get nijaba's code review done
[17:31]  * nijaba warns anyone that try to bother him that I bite ;)
[17:33] <tyska> niemeyer: i will wait it fixed, since im setting the things up by now
[17:33] <tyska> SpamapS: it just affects txaws in the oldest version, 0.0.1, in the 0.2 version it is already fixed
[17:34] <_mup_> juju/ssh-known_hosts r454 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[17:34] <_mup_> Fix mocks for test_sshclient
[17:35] <_mup_> Bug #907450 was filed: juju does not work with Walrus when s3-uri has a suffix <juju:New> < https://launchpad.net/bugs/907450 >
[17:36] <koolhead17> tyska: :D
[17:36] <tyska> ;)
[17:36] <koolhead17> nijaba: i have asked for the checksum in the mailing list of owncloud
[17:36] <tyska> koolhead17: we found a bug in juju + walrus
[17:36] <nijaba> koolhead17: would be nice to have, yes
[17:37] <koolhead17> tyska: awesome!! :D
[17:37] <koolhead17> nijaba: :)
[17:38] <tyska> ok then guys, again thanks for the help
[17:38] <tyska> im leaving for now, but i come back when this bug is fixed
[17:39] <niemeyer> tyska: Cheers.. thanks for your help, and have fun there
[17:40] <jcastro> SpamapS: you owe me a blog post remember. :)
[17:41] <m_3> tyska: thanks for the debug help
[17:44] <SpamapS> jcastro: oi... right
[17:44] <SpamapS> tyska: indeed, so we just need to get the lucid txaws fixed
[18:13] <jcastro> m_3: SpamapS ok so I need to pick a list of 4 as the new top targets
[18:13] <jcastro> I was thinking, diaspora
[18:13] <jcastro> openfire, phpbb, and zenoss
[18:13] <jcastro> thoughts?
[18:14] <SpamapS> hm
[18:15] <SpamapS> jcastro: I wonder if there are any Debian maintainers of webapp packages that would want to also maintain the charm for their app.
[18:15] <jcastro> ooh
[18:15] <jcastro> do you have any in mind?
[18:15] <jcastro> also, that would depend on if you put juju in debian yet?
[18:16]  * jelmer waves
[18:16] <jcastro> marcoceppi: was it you who said big blue button was a complicated mess?
[18:16] <jcastro> hi jelmer!
[18:16] <jelmer> SpamapS: I'm Debian/Ubuntu maintainer for loggerhead/wikkid and interested in maintaining charms for both.
[18:16] <marcoceppi> jcastro: Yes
[18:16] <marcoceppi> not that it was a mess, but that it would "rely" on a lot of services that have yet to be charmed
[18:16] <SpamapS> jelmer: sweet!
[18:16] <marcoceppi> like a Red5 server, asterisks server, etc
[18:17] <jcastro> marcoceppi: ah ok, let's keep that one for later then
[18:17] <jcastro> marcoceppi: I know you're signed up for phpbb but I'd like to put it on the target list, it's like a good beginner charm I think
[18:18] <SpamapS> jelmer: regarding making 'charm getall' more efficient.. I believe that we will do away with 'charm getall' in the near future, both because the charm store is growing rapidly, and because the charm store service built into juju *should* supersede it.
[18:18] <jcastro> if someone snags it then good, if not, you can snag it back?
[18:18] <marcoceppi> jcastro: That's fine :D
[18:18] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: so it sounds not like a mess, but like a lot of fun!
[18:18] <jcastro> asterisx will be tricky
[18:18] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: It took me almost 2 months to get it working properly last time I set it up
[18:18] <SpamapS> asterisk is , IIRC, basically unusable in the cloud
[18:18] <jcastro> yeah
[18:18] <SpamapS> because it needs a source of timing
[18:19]  * m_3 runs screaming from voip config
[18:20] <jelmer> SpamapS: ah, ok
[18:20] <m_3> jcastro: sounds like a good list to start with
[18:21] <m_3> jelmer SpamapS: getall is a really really useful bandaid... but still a bandaid
[18:23] <SpamapS> Yeah, I hate how long it takes..
[18:23] <SpamapS> and I'm pretty sure I'm misusing mr's bzr support
[18:23] <SpamapS> but I don't want to put much effort into it as its really aa bandaid and nothing more.
[18:25] <jelmer> SpamapS: out of curiosity, what's it going to be replaced by?
[18:25] <m_3> jcastro: is there a way to identify the target charms as "intro" -vs- "more advanced"?
[18:25] <m_3> jelmer: the charm store.... 'juju deploy cs:mysql mydb'
[18:26] <jcastro> m_3: I usually go about how complicated the service itself is
[18:26] <SpamapS> jelmer: juju will abstract the bzr out of the charm store for users who don't want to edit the charms.
[18:26] <jcastro> typical LAMP, not so much, complicated things like openstack, more so
[18:26] <jcastro> I don't really have a system to it
[18:26] <jelmer> m_3, SpamapS: ah, of course. thanks
[18:26] <SpamapS> jelmer: and since I expect there will be 100's of charms, we won't want to 'getall' anymore.. we'll just want to get the ones we need to edit.
[18:27] <SpamapS> jelmer: basically using 'getall' is like checking out all of the packaging branches in Ubuntu. ;)
[18:28] <m_3> jcastro: right... in the blog post setting targets, maybe at least make a stab at "this might be a great one for first-timers" -vs- has-a-lot-of-complex-relations
[18:28]  * jcastro nods
[18:28] <SpamapS> nijaba: reviewed
[18:28] <nijaba> SpamapS: thanks.  will look in a sec
[18:31] <m_3> jelmer: great question to the list about tests... testing framework for charms is in progress
[18:32] <jelmer> SpamapS: well, there are people who want to check out all source packages on ubuntu... :-) But yeah, that's a good point
[18:32]  * m_3 food
[18:32] <jelmer> m_3: thanks
[18:33] <hazmat> jcastro, ejabberd for the hit list
[18:36] <jcastro> oooh
[18:37] <jcastro> ok I'll do that one instead of openfire
[18:37] <jcastro> I don't need 2 XMPP servers right off the bat
[18:39] <marcoceppi> ejabberd will probably be the easier of the two
[18:39] <jcastro> you're just scared of java
[18:40] <nijaba> SpamapS: I do not understand this sentence in your comment [1] Perhaps we should recommend haveged with charm-helpers-sh
[18:42] <SpamapS> nijaba: sorry, there is a package 'haveged'
[18:42] <SpamapS> nijaba: it inserts entropy using some proven mathematical pseudo random generation algorithm.
[18:42] <marcoceppi> jcastro: It haunts me
[18:42] <nijaba> SpamapS: ah, ok.  never used it.  Thought there were some char missing
[18:51] <nijaba> SpamapS: so one just launche haveged and that's it?
[18:52] <nijaba> SpamapS: actually, install, since it is a deamon
[18:58] <SpamapS> nijaba: just having it installed, it does its thing
[18:58] <SpamapS> nijaba: I think some might object to it though, sometimes no entropy is better than low quality entropy.
[19:00] <nijaba> SpamapS: we should ask the security team
[19:00] <nijaba> SpamapS: just resubmited with the requested changes
[19:43] <jcastro> anyone ever deploy zenoss before?
[19:45] <jcastro> nijaba: did you talk to the zenoss guy at ODS by any chance?
[19:52] <marcoceppi> Finally getting around to finishing PMA
[19:52] <robbiew> jcastro: mattray in #openstack and #txlf may be able to help
[19:52] <robbiew> he used to work at Zenoss before going over to OpsCode
[19:52] <koolhead17> jcastro: i know some community guy from there :P
[19:52] <robbiew> he's an ubuntu user
[19:53] <jcastro> robbiew: yeah, I was trying to reach the guy I spoke with at ODS. But Matt was next on my list
[19:53] <jcastro> also, I thought he went to Dell?
[19:53] <robbiew> jcastro: maybe so...heh
[19:53] <robbiew> last I spoke with him, he was at OpsCode...working on Crowbar stuff I think
[19:53] <jcastro> oh, I need to follow up with him
[19:54] <jcastro> koolhead17: ok so I'll pursue this guy, want to ping your buddies who know zenoss?
[19:54] <jcastro> we have nagios and someone is working on sensu, people will want a zenoss charm
[19:54] <koolhead17> jcastro: this guy is zenoss community manager i think
[19:54] <jcastro> koolhead17: oh dude, hook me up
[19:54] <jcastro> koolhead17: can you PM me his contact info?
[19:55] <koolhead17> jcastro: give few mins.
[19:55] <jcastro> <3
[19:55]  * koolhead17 checks his twitter
[20:02] <jcastro> marcoceppi: ok here it is: http://cloud.ubuntu.com/2011/12/juju-charm-status-were-looking-for-a-few-good-charmers/
[20:03] <jcastro> koolhead and I will chase down zenoss
[20:03] <koolhead17> jcastro: awesome!! :D
[20:04] <marcoceppi> jcastro: I like the targeted approach
[20:04] <jcastro> yeah
[20:04] <jcastro> marcoceppi: hey so in a different tack.
[20:04] <jcastro> marcoceppi: for each one I'm going to try to find someone new by posting on their project's list
[20:04] <jcastro> or by finding someone who is deploying it
[20:05] <jcastro> So I was thinking, you keep working on whatever, and I'll keep looking for new people
[20:05] <jcastro> and if we get one that's just flailing or whatever then we can snag it
[20:05] <jcastro> marcoceppi: so basically, I'm going to focus on getting new people for these, instead of having you and George do them all, heh
[20:06] <marcoceppi> Sounds like a great idea to get Juju/Charms "out there"
[20:06] <jcastro> yeah plus I want to give projects a chance to pounce on their own charm
[20:06] <jcastro> be charge of their own destiny, etc.
[20:11] <marcoceppi> Ack, it looks like one of my merges was replaced in an update to charm-helpers
[20:11] <marcoceppi> Oh, wait - I see now
[20:15] <marcoceppi> nijaba You around?
[20:17] <tekonivelo> hi all
[20:18] <tekonivelo> i was here earlier (a week perhaps?), asking if there's a chance to deploy a charm without spawning a new machine
[20:18] <tekonivelo> someone told me this is in the works
[20:19] <tekonivelo> i'm now looking for that feature blueprint in Launchpad
[20:20] <tekonivelo> (and dreaming about Cotton Candy at the same time http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2011/11/cotton-candy-the-usb-sized-arm-pc-that-runs-ubuntu/)
[20:21] <tekonivelo> is it this one https://blueprints.launchpad.net/juju/+spec/subordinate-services?
[20:22] <tekonivelo> i'm incompetent in reading this juju-talk :)
[20:30] <marcoceppi> Charm is done! \o/
[20:35] <jcastro> m_3: hey, jrgifford is working on rails, what's the status of this here: https://code.launchpad.net/~mark-mims/charm/oneiric/rails/trunk
[20:50] <SpamapS> tekonivelo: subordinate services is good for combining charms .. but you really need machine placement to do the smaller scale.
[20:51] <robbiew> marcoceppi: yes sir!!! :D
[20:59]  * koolhead17 is eagerly waiting for next charm school
[20:59] <jcastro> early in the new year
[20:59] <jcastro> actually, I should pick a date now
[21:00] <SpamapS> jcastro: it might make sense to have it right after or before SCALE
[21:02] <jcastro> I'll link up with mims when he gets back
[21:02] <jcastro> I think one in January early, then a real one at SCaLE, then february, with an option for January virtual again if we need it.
[21:03] <koolhead17> hello robbiew
[21:04] <robbiew> koolhead17: o/
[21:04] <koolhead17> :)
[21:19] <EvilBill> hm, looking at the charms… there's not one for openldap, is there?
[21:22] <jrgifford> EvilBill: don't think so.
[21:22] <EvilBill> hm
[21:22] <EvilBill> maybe if I feel ambitious, and finish my next Linux Journal article.
[21:23] <EvilBill> and jcastro - my SCALE talk didn't get accepted.
[21:24] <jcastro> EvilBill: want to roll with me and clint for juju school then?
[21:24]  * koolhead17 feels openldap tough nut.
[21:24] <EvilBill> define "roll with you"
[21:25] <jcastro> help people out getting it running, basically like an instructor
[21:25] <jcastro> I can train you up over some in n' out. :D
[21:25] <SpamapS> hey, thats what a hamburger's all about
[21:26] <mainerror> The phpBB3 charm should be fairly easy to write, eh?
[21:27] <mainerror> There is a phpBB package.
[21:27] <EvilBill> jcastro: I can probably do that. Will be at scale on the Thursday before it starts, and I will have my car and I know exactly where everything is there, including in n out. ;)
[21:27] <jcastro> mainerror: yup ....
[21:27] <SpamapS> mainerror: exactly
[21:28] <SpamapS> I wonder if we can genericize a charm helper for anything that uses dbconfig-common
[21:28] <mainerror> I'm trying to get it up right now.
[21:28] <jcastro> EvilBill: there's at least like 5 article opportunities just being around SpamapS.
[21:29] <mainerror> The PyroCMS charm requires me to write a cli installer myself which I can't do right now.
[21:29] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: looking at https://code.launchpad.net/~marcoceppi/charm-tools/wget-args/+merge/86617 .. just curious why we want --content-disposition ?
[21:29] <jcastro> mainerror: yeah there's a correlation of ease of charm writing and how popular or easy something is to install without a charm
[21:29] <EvilBill> jcastro: then I will be sure to have a recorder running at all times. ;)
[21:30] <SpamapS> EvilBill: are you in LA?
[21:30] <EvilBill> I'm in silicon valley, but will be there for Xmas, and for scale.
[21:31]  * SpamapS will pontificate gratuitously to make sure the facts are inseperable from his opinions
[21:31] <SpamapS> EvilBill: great. that reminds me that I need to register for mongoLA
[21:31] <jcastro> mainerror: a config to use the upstream phpbb in that charm would be ninja
[21:33] <mainerror> Do you mean a switch to choose if you want the package version or the upstream version?
[21:33] <jcastro> yeah
[21:33] <mainerror> I see. Makes sense.
[21:34] <SpamapS> I'd prefer that it default to the one from the archive though.
[21:34] <jcastro> mainerror: marco's done it on his, just steal it
[21:34] <jcastro> yeah, and always default to the archive
[21:34] <mainerror> If only they (phpbb) had a download latest release link ...
[21:35] <SpamapS> mainerror: thats no good usually anyway, because you need to verify the integrity of the download
[21:35] <SpamapS> so unless you can download the md5/gpg signature via HTTPS (with a valid CA cert).. you have to sha256sum the file anyway.
[21:35] <mainerror> Along with a MD5 file it would not be that bad. :)
[21:36] <mainerror> Yea.
[21:36]  * SpamapS wants people to get into the habit of sha256sum'ing, not md5suming
[21:36] <jcastro> actually, charmers should recommend that during reviews to default to archive
[21:39] <SpamapS> jcastro: as we get more of a security policy and better tags, we'll require that for inclusion in the "canonical supported" charm tag(s)
[21:39] <jcastro> that was going to be my next questoin
[21:39] <mainerror> Wait, how am I supposed to sha256sum the file if the phpBB guys don't provide a hash to compare it against?
[21:39] <negronjl> marcoceppi: I approved your merge proposal
[21:43] <SpamapS> mainerror: you need to first inspect the contents, make sure you got the real file.
[21:43] <SpamapS> mainerror: then you need do 'sha256sum file.tar.gz'
[21:44] <SpamapS> mainerror: that value can then be used to check against the file when the charm downloads it
[21:44] <SpamapS> mainerror: there's a helper function for doing this in shell/bash
[21:44] <mainerror> Oh! That makes sense now.
[21:44] <SpamapS> mainerror: maybe just focus on the apt-get version first?
[21:45] <marcoceppi> negronjl: Thanks!
[21:45] <mainerror> Yea. I'll try to get that up first and add the config option once it is up and running.
[21:45] <marcoceppi> mainerror: They do
[21:45] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: the man page for wget describes --content-disposition as experimental...
[21:46] <mainerror> marcoceppi: They do what?
[21:46] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: It didn't say that in the latest wget, did it?
[21:46] <SpamapS> ii  wget                    1.13.4-1ubuntu2         retrieves files from the web
[21:46] <marcoceppi> mainerror: They provide an md5hash, phpBB group
[21:46] <mainerror> Yea I know that. I was referring to a md5hash file. :)
[21:47] <SpamapS> oneiric has 3.0.7 .. pretty close to upstream's 3.0.9 ... ;)
[21:47] <marcoceppi> mainerror: http://www.phpbb.com/files/release/phpBB-3.0.9.tar.bz2.md5
[21:47] <mainerror> :O
[21:47] <marcoceppi> But yeah, use package manager first <3
[21:47] <mainerror> Am I that blind?
[21:48] <SpamapS> note that the MD5 there is worthless since it is transmitted via HTTP
[21:48] <marcoceppi> They don't advertise it, I know someone on the dev team :)
[21:48] <mainerror> Oh nice. :)
[21:48] <SpamapS> marcoceppi: tell them to start publishing gpg signatures
[21:48] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: Yeah, unless... https?
[21:49] <SpamapS> then at least we can have a set of GPG keys that we trust in charm-helpers automatically.
[21:49] <SpamapS> But at that point its like.. how about we just start using the archive? ;)
[21:50] <marcoceppi> heh
[21:50]  * SpamapS plans to try hard to get involved with ubuntu-backports so we can use them in charms more.
[21:50] <EvilBill> so, now that I have juju on mac os x - is there a way to get charm-tools going on os x, too? ;)
[21:51] <EvilBill> right now I just rsync'd them from my linux box but being able to natively update would be nice.
[21:51] <SpamapS> EvilBill: bzr branch lp:charm-tools ; cd charm-tools ; make install
[21:51] <SpamapS> EvilBill: it would be quite nice to have them in brew too.
[21:51] <EvilBill> Yeah, it would.
[21:52] <EvilBill> blah, and something blew up.
[21:52] <EvilBill> looks like the Mac version of readlink doesn't allow the -f option
[21:53] <SpamapS> bummer
[21:53] <SpamapS> pretty useful bit
[21:53] <EvilBill> yeah.
[21:53] <EvilBill> wonder tho
[21:53] <_mup_> juju/ssh-known_hosts r455 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[21:53] <_mup_> Fix mocks for EC2 test_bootstrap
[21:53] <SpamapS> EvilBill: if you wouldn't mind reporting a bug, it would help quite a bit.
[21:53] <EvilBill> doesn't appear to be in ports or brew :/
[21:54] <EvilBill> Yeah, I'll happily do that, once I run off to another damn meeting.
[21:54] <EvilBill> got a meeting in five.
[21:54] <SpamapS> http://www.despair.com/meetings.html
[21:54] <SpamapS> best
[21:54] <SpamapS> poster
[21:54] <SpamapS> evar
[21:55] <EvilBill> SpamapS: thanks for that.
[21:55] <EvilBill> lol
[21:55] <EvilBill> we're trying to straighten this place out
[21:55] <EvilBill> awesome, my meeting JUST got moved to tomorrrow.
[21:55] <EvilBill> bug coming your way
[21:55] <SpamapS> http://www.despair.com/proc24x30pri.html
[21:56] <SpamapS> ^^ so you went to that model ;)
[21:56] <EvilBill> SpamapS: Dude, do you think I'd be in DevOps if I didn't believe in that model?
[21:57] <marcoceppi> Loule, I always laugh a little when someone days DevOps
[21:57] <EvilBill> LOL
[21:57] <EvilBill> Yeah, it's not like it's that big a secret.
[21:57] <EvilBill> but they wanted to hire me in as "DevOps Manager"
[21:57] <EvilBill> and I was like "how much money? fuck, I'm THERE."
[21:57] <SpamapS> "what? Our developers shouldn't be plotting our ops managers' deaths?"
[21:59] <EvilBill> I've been doing DevOps since way before the buzzword. We used to call it "Hey, this cool way of doing business so stuff runs smoothly."
[21:59] <EvilBill> Problem with that name is that it didn't fit on slides.
[22:00] <_mup_> juju/ssh-known_hosts r456 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[22:00] <_mup_> Fix remaining tests in EC2 test_bootstrap
[22:08] <EvilBill> SpamapS: I may have a workaround for the readlink thing
[22:08] <EvilBill> want me to file the bug, and list the workaround?
[22:24] <jcastro> SpamapS: or m_3: phpmyadmin could use a look see, and hopefully a promulgation.
[22:24] <m_3> jcastro: yeah, just saw that mail
[22:25] <jcastro> \o/
[22:26] <marcoceppi> m_3: One thing I wasn't sure about, htaccess password
[22:26] <marcoceppi> As it currently stands you've got to use juju set to enable it, otherwise no one will be able to access the phpMyAdmin site
[22:26] <marcoceppi> since I didn't just want to throw a default one in there
[22:28] <m_3> marcoceppi: wow, yeah I really think all charms should work using defaults
[22:28] <m_3> just pulled it though, so let me take a look
[22:28] <marcoceppi> So, put a password in there by default? I feel like that kind of defeats the purpose of password protection
[22:29] <marcoceppi> m_3: I'm about to head home, so I'll be back in about 40 mins. I created a video to demonstrate the workflow: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXsiffMI5Uc
[22:31] <m_3> ha!... yeah, I was just about to ask for a readme :)
[22:31]  * m_3 watchin the 'tube
[22:34] <m_3> marcoceppi: hmmm...  think I'm gonna have to bounce this charm back... no soundtrack!?!  drive safely man
[22:36] <marcoceppi> m_3: So, besides the readme, heh, I'm guessing it's the htpasswd password issue?
[22:38] <m_3> marcoceppi: just yanking your chain
[22:42] <SpamapS> for phpmyadmin, I think its reasonable to say that it doesn't actually *do* anything useful without you providing a username and password
[22:43] <m_3> SpamapS: right... really it doesn't _do_ anything until you relate it
[22:44] <m_3> so should it go to 'install_error' with default config params?
[22:44] <EvilBill> SpamapS: Hey, I have a bug ready to submit against charm-tools re: mac os…. with a workaround included.
[22:44] <EvilBill> Want me to fire that off?
[22:45] <SpamapS> m_3: no!
[22:45] <SpamapS> m_3: it should just reject all users from logging in.
[22:45] <SpamapS> m_3: it would be cool to have the 403 page give some hint.
[22:45] <SpamapS> EvilBill: yeah that would be great, thanks!
[22:47] <SpamapS> m_3: like "403, Access Denied, site has no users."
[22:47] <EvilBill> SpamapS: done.
[22:49]  * m_3 copying that line into the review
[22:51] <SpamapS> I like the way wordpress does it. The first user to access the site gets presented with a wizard.
[22:52] <SpamapS> the window for compromise is very narrow, and if somebody does "steal" your wordpress, you just drop the db and start over.
[22:52] <SpamapS> maybe we should write a charm helper that makes a little web form for apps that don't have such a capability.
[22:53]  * SpamapS puts on his mad scientist hat and looks into it
[22:55] <m_3> SpamapS: I guess stealing the phpmyadmin instance like that doesn't necessarily compromise the root pw of the related db... dunno tho
[23:11] <m_3> marcoceppi: really nice job with this
[23:30] <_mup_> juju/ssh-known_hosts r457 committed by<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[23:30] <_mup_> Fix cooperative inheritance for test_state
[23:36] <marcoceppi> SpamapS: phpMyAdmin doesn't have that, so I would have to script that in.
[23:36] <marcoceppi> m_3: Thanks!
[23:37] <m_3> marcoceppi: almost done... waiting for another test scenario
[23:37] <marcoceppi> m_3: Cool, I'll jump on those changes asap as I'm looking to wrap this up tonight to move on to Steam and others
[23:38] <marcoceppi> I've got a pretty good idea how I want to handle a lot of the stuff in steam
[23:45] <marcoceppi> Is that WordPress install script part of wordpress or was that written explicitly for the charm?
[23:45] <marcoceppi> Because it wouldn't be too hard to write
[23:50] <m_3> marcoceppi: ah, I'd wait on it... the current behavior works pretty well... especially once there's a readme
[23:51] <marcoceppi> I'll add it as a bug once it's progd
[23:51] <m_3> marcoceppi: one quick question though... the bottom of db-admin-relation-changed
[23:51] <marcoceppi> Yeah?
[23:52] <m_3> mysqladmin creates a hard-coded "phpmyadmin" db... but then it runs the create script on a $database
[23:52] <m_3> that's working in my current test b/c the service is named "phpmyadmin"
[23:53] <m_3> what happens when that's not the case?
[23:54] <m_3> checking with another test scenario
[23:54] <marcoceppi> Since it's not a db relation, it's db-admin it will just create phpmyadmin db everytime. Are you saying that it should create the database based on the name of the service? IE if it was `custompmaname`>
[23:56]  * m_3 checking what creates 'database' in mysql-root interface
[23:57] <marcoceppi> m_3: Nothing does :)
[23:57] <marcoceppi> That's why mysqladmin create is run in the hook
[23:57] <marcoceppi> It did originally, but it was removed when we relaized that since you're "db-admin" you can create any db
[23:58] <m_3> but the relation sets $database though
[23:58] <marcoceppi> It *shouldn't* if it does it's because I missed it during the patching
[23:59] <m_3> config-changed, line 36 uses it though


[07:14] <dholbach> good morning
[10:05] <locodir-user> Hi, I have a Dell Poweredge T110 II with Ubuntu 13.10- the graphics are very laggy, could someone please help?
[11:32] <belkinsa> locodir-user, please ask in #ubuntu, that is our support channel. To join type in /join #ubuntu


[16:12] <bauxit> hy
[16:13] <bauxit> do you know something wrong with ubiquity or just me
[16:13] <bauxit> http://s12.postimg.org/3lo2bhqjg/Screenshot_from_2015_06_04_15_55_14.jpg
[16:13] <bauxit> i cant install mint
[16:50] <cyphermox> bauxit: that reminds me of another bug I saw before, but I'm not sure why it's doing this
[16:50] <cyphermox> any partitions already on that disk?
[16:51] <bauxit> yes
[16:51] <bauxit> 3 partition
[16:52] <bauxit> but i try with full clean hdd and i give same error
[16:52] <bauxit> btw
[16:53] <bauxit> text mode install never give backk
[16:53] <bauxit> ?
[16:54] <bauxit> i understand some people like brainless clicking but i think its not good way
[16:55] <bauxit> maybe with option (expert/basic) install
[16:55] <bauxit> expert with text mode and basic with gui
[16:55] <bauxit> what do you think?
[16:56] <bauxit> i hope this bug will be fix soon
[16:57] <bauxit> if i can help you i do
[16:57] <bauxit> but i'm beginner :)
[16:57] <bauxit> with same english skill :)
[17:01] <cjwatson> bauxit: Ubuntu has a text mode installer (http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/netboot/; despite the name, doesn't have to be netbooted, you can burn the mini.iso to a CD or write it to a USB stick and go from there).  However, we don't support Linux Mint here; you'll have to ask them if they have a similar facility.
[17:02] <bauxit> ok but i burn to usb disk and i boot from usb
[17:02] <bauxit> thans for help
[17:02] <bauxit> *stick
[17:02] <bauxit> ^^
[17:05] <bauxit> well i try it thanks
[17:05] <bauxit> i hope i can do it
[17:06] <bauxit> sorry for disturb
[17:07] <cyphermox> cjwatson: thanks.
[18:55] <infinity> cjwatson: Hey, thanks for reminding me that netboot is missing wily. :P
[19:02] <cjwatson> infinity: yw :)
[19:03] <infinity> All fixed.


[12:09] <cmaloney> morning
[12:11] <rick_h_> morn
[12:13] <cmaloney> how goes?
[12:13] <cmaloney> mug meetin tonight
[16:40] <cmaloney> I'm not sure if we're "Growing" or if there's some spam deluge brewing but it seems there's at least one or two people per day adding themselves to the Ubuntu MI team
[17:20] <jcastro> it's spam lately
[17:21] <jcastro> you might want to consider locking it down for a bit
[17:21] <jcastro> my inbox is basically hell right now, heh
[17:22] <cmaloney> jcastro: That's what I figured
[17:22] <cmaloney> I've been approving them
[17:22] <cmaloney> but wondering if I might just turn folks away for a bit.
[17:23] <cmaloney> Speaking of spam, apparently Marilyn Manson wants to join my CC Metal Music community on G+
[17:23] <cmaloney> so that's a thing. ;)
[17:23] <jcastro> heh
[21:12] <greg-g> jcastro: cmaloney hat collectors :)
[21:14] <cmaloney> heh
[21:14] <cmaloney> Well, just found out that Metal Injection isn't syndicating any more outside podcasts
[21:14] <cmaloney> so there goes my listeners. ;)
[21:17] <greg-g> dang
[21:18] <cmaloney> Now I get to see if folks will listen to it on their own. :)
[21:18] <cmaloney> That's kind of liberating
[21:18] <cmaloney> And it's not like the shows aren't "re-syndicated" by shady sites. :)


[15:00] <bittin> Anyone know if you can update to the Dev version of 19.10 now?
[15:06] <hggdh> bittin: you *can*. Just be aware that it is VERY early in the cycle. If you know what you are doing, then do it -- preferrably in a TEST machine, at least initially.
[15:07] <bittin> hggdh: alright how do i do then?
[15:08] <hggdh> bittin: the usual caveats apply: your machine may burst in flames, kittens may die, etc. In other words: assume some critical issue may pop up, and plan accordingly
[15:09] <hggdh> bittin: (1) verify /etc/update-manager/release-upgrades is set to 'normal'; if not, do so;
[15:10] <hggdh> bittin: (2) close all currently-running programs, open a terminal, and run 'sudo do-release-upgrade -d'
[15:10] <hggdh> bittin: actually, (0) make a backup of everything you consider important in your machine
[15:14] <hggdh> bittin: all the above assumes you are running a clean version of Ubuntu. No PPAs, no non-ubuntu programs/products installed, up-to-date. If there are (any of them), YMMV a lot.
[15:25] <dax> eoan isn't in http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/meta-release-development yet, so i don't think do-release-upgrade knows about it
[15:25] <dax> this early in the cycle you'd probably need to edit sources.list and dist-upgrade
[15:25] <bittin> dax: does not seem so
[15:27] <lotuspsychje> its raining cosmic to dingo upgrade fails in -announce
[15:27] <lotuspsychje> see bug #1825420 also
[15:27] <bittin> dax: i tried not sure if i did anything wrong: https://pastebin.com/hPSCG7vT
[15:28] <dax> bittin: it's spelled eoan
[15:28] <dax> (and some of those repositories may not exist yet, since eoan is so new)
[15:29] <dax> i know hggdh already mentioned it, but just to emphasize: it's *extremely* early in the eoan cycle, and stuff is liable to be missing or broken for months
[15:30] <bittin> dax: thanks, updating 405 packages now
[15:30] <dax> good luck :)
[15:31] <bittin> thanks
[15:32] <lotuspsychje> bittin: are you installing 19.10 for fun or want to help bug out?
[15:32] <bittin> lotuspsychje: for fun but will report if i found bugs
[15:33] <lotuspsychje> bittin: hence my question, if you want to help bug out we reccomend using clean dailys and not upgrades. this way you wont give extra seeking work to the developers
[15:36] <bittin> lotuspsychje: well i have a stable install on another ssd in case something really horrible happends
[15:37] <lotuspsychje> is it also a 19.10 bittin ?
[15:37] <bittin> lotuspsychje: nope 19.04
[15:40] <lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic
[15:40] <bittin> Listening too http://ubuntupodcast.org/2019/05/02/s12e04-ant-attack/ and updating to 19.10 now
[15:41] <lotuspsychje> bittin: let us know if your upgrade went well ok, as its same kernel as the cosmic to dingo bug
[15:44] <bittin> lotuspsychje: will do gonna listen to todays Ubuntu Podcast episode first and do a reboot
[15:51] <bittin> gonna reboot now wish me luck
[15:54] <bittin> https://i.imgur.com/PN61p7m.png
[15:54] <lotuspsychje> lookin good
[15:54] <bittin> it booted
[15:54] <bittin> thats a good start :)
[15:55] <lotuspsychje> bittin: how about your sources list and kernel version?
[15:56] <bittin> kernel 5.0.0-14
[15:56] <lotuspsychje> sounds good
[15:56] <bittin> and sources.list seems fine
[16:00] <bittin> thanks for the help and cya around
[16:15] <luna> :)


[06:06] <brobostigon> morning
[06:09] <zxmoypi> o/
[06:27] <brobostigon> \o
[11:16] <daftykins> \o/
[11:21] <brobostigon> \o/
[11:22] <daftykins> my my, bad weather has stopped my HelloFRESH food box from making it this morning once again
[11:25] <daftykins> i can see the boat though! just south of the Isle of Wight right now ^_^
[16:08] <zxmoypi> yes i used to love how in stormy weather the ferries couldn't dock. i remember one storm in 90s it was like 10 days at sea. passengers were stuck till it made shore


[02:24] <psc> how do you launch your studio on login (ladish_control sload xxx)?
[02:25] <psc> rc.d or gui sessions at startup?
[08:57] <U___> hi anyone here
[08:58] <U___> hello?


[08:21] <cholcombe> bdx, as far as i'm aware it works
[08:21] <cholcombe> bdx, are you having an issue with it?
[09:04] <kjackal> Hello juju world
[11:25] <lazyPower> mornin #juju o/
[11:25] <icey> bdx: it doesn't 100% work as it doesn't get the info from the existing consul charm; I was working on a slight fork of the existing consul charm to be an agent charm, ie: local subordinate consul that doesn't run the gui but didn't get around to finishing / puyblishing it
[11:26] <lazyPower> icey - yeah, we really do need to upgrade that charm. thing is we dont have any consumers in ~containers anymore now that we've dropped the swarm work
[11:26] <icey> lazyPower: I have a vault charm that is a consumer :)
[11:26] <lazyPower> and with swarms new self-contained bidniss shipping with docker.
[11:26] <icey> well, would be if it related correctly :-P
[11:26] <lazyPower> heh heh
[11:26] <lazyPower> should be simple, its just ip:port
[11:27] <icey> but lazyPower the consul docs suggest running a consul agent on EVERY machine and querying your local agent, rather than a remote agent...
[11:27] <icey> basically no consul client has HA support where you can give it several IPs
[11:27] <icey> :-/
[11:28] <lazyPower> i mean, thats fine, it works either way
[11:28] <lazyPower> you can query remotely or query via the local proxy
[11:28] <lazyPower> it all goes to the same place
[11:29] <icey> lazyPower: but querying remotely means I'm down if the node I'm talking to goes down since no HA love
[11:29] <lazyPower> thats a possibility, yes
[11:29] <icey> at least querying locally means if my machine is down nothing is different ;-)
[11:30] <lazyPower> i guess? it'll buffer your writes
[11:30] <lazyPower> but not your reads
[11:31] <icey> lazyPower: yeah; I decided to work towards the doc suggested version of local agent but never got to finish that work; making the vault charm I've got use a remote consul shouldn't be too bad, besides the fact that it (vault) will not let you configure multiple consuls to talk to
[11:32] <lazyPower> making a local agent should be mostly done. fork the charm, convert it into a sub and drop the UI bits, add the relation and the template logic and you're done right?
[11:32] <icey> lazyPower: yeah
[11:32] <lazyPower> also i'm not 100% on it not buffing reads, it may give you a cache
[11:32] <icey> OH
[11:32] <icey> and add a relation
[11:32] <icey> for the consul-agent
[11:32] <lazyPower> yep
[11:32] <icey> otherwise, yeah it's all there
[11:33] <lazyPower> seems like that would be short sighted for them to not give you a minimal cache of the kv data
[11:33] <lazyPower> so i bet they do
[11:33] <lazyPower> but i dont recall having read that anywhere
[12:18] <jcastro> lazyPower: the conjure up instructions for observable kubernetes doesn't seem to work for me
[12:19] <lazyPower> jcastro - ok, can you describe whats happening?
[12:19] <jcastro> it seems like it's trying to install a package?
[12:19] <jcastro> jorge@ivory:~$ conjure-up cs:~containers/observable-kubernetes
[12:19] <jcastro> Reading package lists...
[12:19] <jcastro> Building dependency tree...
[12:19] <jcastro> Reading state information...
[12:19] <jcastro> E: Unable to locate package cs:~containers
[12:20] <lazyPower> ah you missed bundle/ in the url
[12:20] <lazyPower> cs:~containers/bundle/observable-kubernetes
[12:20]  * lazyPower checks the readme
[12:20] <jcastro> nope
[12:20] <jcastro> same error
[12:20] <jcastro> and I am following the readme
[12:20] <lazyPower> hmm i wonder if we missed some metadata on our last publish or something
[12:20] <lazyPower> stokachu - ping
[12:22] <lazyPower> jcastro - one thing that i know is a grey area is we dont have that path under CI, so we've lost visibility into if we break that route. it should 'just work' but we're also manually having to set metadata points so conjure knows where to look for the bundle
[12:22] <jcastro> hmm, how do you guys feel like just all of us concentrating on a working bundle, updated revs across the board today?
[12:22] <lazyPower> and i think thats the core of the issue
[12:22] <lazyPower> jcastro - i'm eyeballs deep in this blog post, but i'm getting close to finishing. I think ~ 11/12 i'll be done.
[12:22] <jcastro> ok
[12:23] <jcastro> I guess I'll start my post but with the native bundle
[12:34] <stokachu> jcastro: no cs:
[12:34] <stokachu> just ~containers/observable-kubernetes
[12:35] <stokachu> jcastro: oh i see a bug in the code, we check for cs: and not cs:~
[12:37] <lazyPower> stokachu thanks for taking a look
[12:37] <stokachu> np
[12:49] <jcastro> lazyPower: ok so check this out, adding a # passes charm proof in the bundle
[12:49] <jcastro> so I will document the bundle itself for constraints
[12:50] <jcastro> and then by default not define any, so the primary use case should be pull, modidy, deploy, not deploy out of the store as-is. I'll update the readme and whatnot
[12:50] <jcastro> and then do a PR
[12:57] <lazyPower> jcastro - ok, sounds good to me. I know that the target was intended to give machine constraints, but given the context of what we've found i think thats a better option
[13:16] <jcastro> lazyPower: does `juju run --application kubernetes is-leader` usually take a long time?
[13:16] <lazyPower> a couple seconds at most
[13:16] <jcastro> readme is out of date on that too, fixing
[13:16] <jcastro> oh nm, cluster is not up yet
[13:36] <jcastro> lazyPower: upgrade worked: Server Version: version.Info{Major:"1", Minor:"3", GitVersion:"v1.3.1", GitCommit:"fe4aa01af2e1ce3d464e11bc465237e38dbcff27", GitTreeState:"clean"}
[13:36] <lazyPower> jcastro - awesome. v1.3.3 is latest however. you did 1.3.1?
[13:37] <lazyPower> but i know we should be compliant. The only downside is what we've already discussed, the missing federation bits.
[13:41] <jcastro> yeah I wanted to see how that worked
[13:49] <lazyPower> Pretty spiffy how it tears down and reconstructs in place right?


[03:12] <studio-user036> hi can someone help me with my wireless network problem?
[03:13] <SlidingHorn> studio-user036: Feel free to ask - if someone has an answer, they'll reply.  Also, you might want to change your nick so you can be referenced easier :)
[03:18] <Bobtheblob> hey can i get help setting up my wireless network... i think i need to change my driver
[03:19] <SlidingHorn> Bobtheblob: what seems to be the problem?  (more detail is better)
[03:22] <Bobtheblob> after i got done installing ubuntu studio it never found my network i have it plugged in my intoo my wired right now... i really want to get the wireless card to work. it used to work when i had windows. my guess is it probly needs a driver but im not sure how to found out how to get the right one
[03:56] <Helpme> hi anyone know if Broadcom Limited BCM4311 802.11b/g WLAN [14e4:4311] (rev 01) will work on ubuntu studio Bionic Beaver 18.04 or is this card not supported?
[04:00] <SlidingHorn> Helpme: Broadcom wifi is notoriously problematic in linux, if I remember correctly.  let me see what I can find
[04:07] <SlidingHorn> Helpme: have you attempted to install any broadcom drivers yet?
[04:09] <SlidingHorn> oh wait, sorry, Helpme - You were just asking if it was supported.  My understanding is that that card *should* work using the firmware-b43-installer package
[04:15] <Helpme> i tried to look for additional drivers in the software updater but the one they found doesnt seem to work and that one says its broadcom 802.11 LinuxSTA wireless driver source from bcmwl-kernel-source (proprietary)
[04:18] <SlidingHorn> Helpme: I believe you'll have to remove those if you installed them and use the firmware-b43-installer package instead.
[04:21] <Helpme> im still very new at this. how do i do that?
[04:22] <SlidingHorn> Helpme: While this is a Linux Mint forum, I believe this should be a similar process for you.  Have a read: https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=232330
[04:23] <SlidingHorn> Helpme: I'd suggest reading all the way through before actually doing anything
[04:24] <Helpme> ok thanks ill read up
[04:40] <helpme> hi SlidingHorn it worked i got my wireless going thank you very much for the help. awesome!
[04:40] <SlidingHorn> helpme: awesome!  happy to help :)
[04:40] <helpme> :)
[10:12] <bob77bhs> i have a problem with ubuntu studio and simple-scan, it is installed but cannot find the starter icon, any ideas?
[14:00] <Glorfindel> Hey all, looking at turning some of my old desktops into  DAWs. is there a list of hw that tends to lend it's self to low latency more than another type (brands, models, whatever)? Or does the audio interface have more to do with that than anything else?
[15:12] <OvenWerks> A hard question to answer. If the audio interface includes direct monitoring, most DAW use does not need low latency.
[15:13] <OvenWerks> I have found that almost all mother boards need some tweaking or at least experimenting to set up. For example PCI or PCIe interfaces often work better in one slot than another.
[15:16] <OvenWerks> with USB interfaces adding a PICe USB card just for the interface seems to help, but at least trying each USB port to find one that works best. Making sure the mouse and keyboard are not using the same internal USB hub or irq helps too.
[15:42] <Glorfindel> OvenWerks: thanks for the insight, I appreciate it. I'm hoping to use the Focusrite Scarlet series as they seemed to be the best budget audio interface that was compatible (not to mention the only budget interface that was a known brand, at least for me) the "compatible hardware" wiki page mentioned they were very low latency, and I was wondering if that was something that changed much from system to system
[15:43] <Glorfindel> the main reason I'm hoping for low latency is because I'd like to be able to use a pc to change the sound for an electric guitar, and then send the output to the amp, for practicing in real time
[15:45] <Glorfindel> that is a fair point though, with the direct monitoring I wouldn't need to have low latency if I was just recording... I'll have to keep that in mind
[15:58] <OvenWerks> most USB IFs can run with buffer size 64 or 128 which is low enough for guitar effects most people find. The absolute minimum is normally 32/2 with some work and maybe the odd xrun. USB runs with 1ms poling so probably one needs double that for reasonable stability.
[16:23] <Glorfindel> OvenWerks: most of what you have said is over my head, but I'll do what you suggested (checking different ports for latency, and etc) and if it's not satisfactory, I'll stop by again and see if there are any solutions to be had. thanks!
[16:25] <rapidwave> How do we edit the Ubuntu Studio applications menu?
[16:25] <Glorfindel> rapidwave: edit in what way?
[16:25] <Glorfindel> adding more programs to the favorites section? color scheme?
[16:26] <OvenWerks> rapidwave: best not to at all.
[16:30] <OvenWerks> neither alacarte or menulibre work right
[16:31] <OvenWerks> you are left with learning the whole xdg set of directories and config files and manually editing them.
[16:32] <OvenWerks> xfce, lxde and gnome all come with broken system menu config files
[16:33] <OvenWerks> the one in Studio is fixed. KDE has a correct one too.
[16:33] <OvenWerks> rapidwave: are you using the actual application menu or whisker?
[16:43] <rapidwave> Umm, it's the round blue icon with white lines through it.
[16:45] <OvenWerks> OK, that is just an icon and can point to either.
[16:45] <OvenWerks> is it just a straight drop down menu or does it have two panes?
[16:46] <OvenWerks> And a search box and some extra icons and...
[16:52]  * OvenWerks can't remember cause he doesn't use whisker
[17:09] <rapidwave>  It's just one pane that has categories for applications and a search box at the bottom
[19:44] <studio-user374> hi, wondering if anyone can help me, stereo sound works but no audio through headphones even though volume control registers sound and shows no sign of being muted