 Could someone please give this a second set of eyes? https://www.reddit.com/r/Lubuntu/s/aDINHNRBzD
 CC @lynorian in the unlikely case it's a documentation issue on our part ^^^^
 why you won't tell him where the GUIs are (re @tsimonq2: Could someone please give this a second set of eyes? https://www.reddit.com/r/Lubuntu/s/aDINHNRBzD)
 maybe it's because I'm a developer but both Openbox settings and LXQt session settings have menu entries (re @eiabruh: why you won't tell him where the GUIs are)
 I'll tell him to search for a better guide insted of running commands
 im thatyolky btw, we talked on reddit some time ago
 nope, there is a GUI part for that in LXQt preferences
 I have a feeling this story will be better once we switch to Wayland
 Completely agreed.
 will we? (re @tsimonq2: I have a feeling this story will be better once we switch to Wayland)
 24.10 is fully Wayland yeah (re @eiabruh: will we?)
 sounds cool
 The reddit link is describing stuff in the rc.xml for openbox writing a response now
 ok just realizing looking at this file is somewhat wierd as we have alt shift up and alt shift down in there twice
 wait there is also a click action
 Wait... what? 💀 (re @lynorian: ok just realizing looking at this file is somewhat wierd as we have alt shift up and alt shift down in there twice)
 That can't be good.
 And what I have in the manual is for using those keys is the binding that doesn't seem to do anything...


[00:00] <italomaia_> wow, cool!
[00:00] <NTFS> !ops
[00:00] <NTFS> !ops
[00:00] <jar> :)
[00:02] <italomaia_> jar, i'll be leaving now. Thanks for the help and great night for you
[00:03] <jar> :) Good night
[00:10] <Bitbuck> www.eve-radio.com
[00:10] <Black_Phantom> Hello, How to install xubuntu inside Ubuntu 9.10 ? so that I can easily switch them in the login screen
[00:10] <jar> Black_Phantom, sudo apt-get install xubuntu-desktop
[00:11] <Black_Phantom> jar: I see, thanks alot.
[00:11] <jar> No problem.
[00:14] <Bitbuck> www.eve-radio.com
[03:07] <owen1> How to uninstall totem? i have 4 related packages - libtotem-plparser12, totem-common, totem-gstreamer, totem-plugins.  i still want to use mplayer though.
[03:08] <owen1> i think it's totem-gstreamer
[03:09] <jar> sudo apt-get --purge remove totem ?
[03:09] <owen1> jar: even if i can't see totem in dpkg/
[03:09] <owen1> +
[03:09] <owen1> ?
[03:09] <jar> Beg pardon?
[03:10] <jar> The following packages will be REMOVED:
[03:10] <jar>   totem* totem-gstreamer* totem-mozilla* totem-plugins*
[03:10] <jar> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 4 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
[03:10] <jar> Seems to work for me.
[03:10] <owen1> jar: interesting. thanks
[03:10] <jar> np
[03:13] <owen1> i'll look for the aptitude equivalent for this (since i only use aptitude)
[03:13] <jar> Why?
[03:14] <jar> http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/aptitude
[03:14] <jar> Now that autoremove is in apt, they're essentially the same thing.
[03:14] <owen1> jar: i heard that aptitude is doing a better job of handeling dependencies.
[03:14] <owen1> let me read your link
[03:14] <jar> That used to be the case.
[03:15] <jar> Ever since Edgy apt has been on part with aptitutde.
[03:18] <owen1> ok, read it. so do u ever used aptitude?
[03:19] <owen1> i want to stick to one of them if possible.
[03:19] <owen1> i used to do install/remove/show/search all with aptitude.
[03:25] <owen1> jar: after reading the link you sent, can i assume that sudo apt-get autoremove app == sudo aptitude remove app +
[03:26] <owen1> ?
[03:29] <jar> oh, sorry owen1
[03:29] <jar> i was away
[03:29] <jar> I use apt exclusively
[03:29] <jar> Yes, apt-get autoremove discards old dependencies
[03:30] <owen1> jar: do u ever use remove? why not using autoremove all the time?
[03:30] <jar> I do.
[03:31] <jar> I use --purge autoremove
[03:32] <owen1> i just looked at the man page for aptitude and couldn't find the difference between remove and purge
[03:32] <danielsevigny> Does anyone know how to install both the 32bit and the 64bit version of python side by side in Karmic 64?
[03:32] <owen1> and when running 'sudo aptitude purge totem' nothing was removed.
[03:33] <jar> I'm not sure if aptitutde supports purge
[03:33] <jar> I don't use it
[03:33] <jar> danielsevigny, No idea - all my computers run in 32bit mode.
[03:37] <AstroTurf> LOL, U ALL RACIST AGAINST MY NEW DISTRO - BLOATBUTU
[03:37] <danielsevigny> No one seems to have any idea...
[03:37] <AstroTurf> I AM REPRESENTATIVE FROM NAACP
[03:38] <AstroTurf> MY SITE: HTTP://U-RACIST.CO.CC
[03:39] <likemindead> !ops
[03:39] <AstroTurf> LIKEMINDEAD
[03:40] <AstroTurf> U RACIST AGAINST ME
[03:41] <likemindead> Sorry, danielsevigny, I don't think that's possible. If so, it's beyond me.
[03:42] <jar> Pici, good to know you're an op for when this crap happens
[05:57] <owen1> how to play an swf file from the browser's cache? i get this in mplayer: '[swf @ 0x883f748]Compressed SWF format not supported'
[05:58] <Sysi> some other player or install codec?
[06:00] <owen1> Sysi: i try with totem as well. what package do i need to install?
[06:01] <owen1> i have xubuntu-restriced-extras
[06:02] <Sysi> something for gstreamer
[06:03] <owen1> Sysi: sudo aptitude search gstreamer shows around 30 packages..
[06:04] <owen1> and about 10 of them are installed
[06:13] <Sysi> if enough discspace you can istall all
[06:13] <Sysi> it might was -bad
[06:13] <Sysi> sorry, need to go →
[06:21] <owen1> Sysi: np. thank
[06:21] <owen1> s
[08:33] <sayyestolife> Greetings.
[08:35] <sayyestolife> I currently have a setup with one hard drive which has windows vista as it's main OS and then a ubuntu installation (done via Wubi). And now I'd like to get rid of the windows OS entirely. Would it be fairly easy to "reinstall" xubuntu via my current ubuntu installation (and also overwrite the windows part etc)?
[08:38] <TheSheep> no
[08:39] <TheSheep> wubi installs inside the windows partition
[08:41] <sayyestolife> Oh, so wubi is "locked" inside the Windows partition?
[08:44] <Balsaq> hiya Sysi!
[08:45] <Sysi> ohai
[09:10] <Balsaq> ungowha
[09:33] <jozefk> hello. my question is if I can have Gimp, Inkscape, Scribus and apps like that on Xubuntu?
[09:34] <TheSheep> yes
[09:34] <TheSheep> you can install anything from ubuntu repositories
[09:35] <jozefk> that sounds great
[09:42] <jozefk> how painful it upgrading from one release to another one?
[09:46] <TheSheep> !upgrade
[09:48] <jozefk> instructions? i didn't ask for instructions but i asked how painful it is to upgrade your system
[09:49] <TheSheep> you can read the instructions and have an idea on how painful it is
[09:49] <TheSheep> I don't feel qualified to assess the pain level for your particular case
[09:50] <Balsaq> there is no pain whatsoever
[09:50] <TheSheep> see how it varies? :)
[09:51] <Balsaq> i sticking with 9.04 though
[09:52] <jozefk> :)
[09:52] <Balsaq> when the updates come in, it offers the upgrade right there...no need to look for it, it comes too you.
[09:53] <jozefk> even if there is it's only twice a year so not that big problem
[09:55] <jozefk> it comes to you and it works?
[09:55] <Balsaq> yup
[09:56] <Balsaq> are you getting the updates regularly?
[09:58] <Balsaq> when you click to accept the updates you will see a box pop up that show the updates being downloaded into your machine...near the top of that box it will offer you to click for the next edition(upgrade)...l just saw it when i accepted an update awhile ago.
[10:01] <jozefk> m8 i am thinking to try Xubuntu. used Arch Linux for a year or so. before that Debian. Before Debian, SuSE
[10:03] <Balsaq> i have tried ubuntu, linux mint, suse, pclinuxos, xubuntu, puppylinux and fedora and xubuntu is the best
[10:03] <Balsaq> linux mint may be the easiest though
[10:05] <jozefk> that's why I'm here :)
[10:06] <Balsaq> i am interested in arch
[10:06] <Balsaq> looks like a lot of work though
[10:07] <jozefk> arch is good. but I just got tired of fixing issues after each upgrade
[10:07] <jozefk> that's why I asked those questions about xubuntu upgrade
[10:08] <Balsaq> i started aith 8.10 and took 9.04 and everything worked
[10:08] <Balsaq> but i have heard a few people complain
[10:09] <Balsaq> but even when i installed xubuntu the 1st time everything worked..printer sound all of it
[10:10] <jozefk> right now i'm typing this from PC-BSD.  I like it but the lack of drivers is an issue. don't have sound. using vesa for graphic :
[10:10] <jozefk> :P
[10:12] <Balsaq> my in laws have a brand new gateway computer...they came over and ran my xubuntu computer and said it was faster, then i told them i was on a 6 year old   2.4 single core with 512rdram...
[10:12] <jozefk> :)
[10:12] <Balsaq> they are on a dual core with 3 gigs or ram and vista
[10:13] <Balsaq> they were shocked
[10:13] <jozefk> vista is *crap*
[10:13] <jozefk> but win7 is good
[10:13] <Balsaq> my xp pro computers run good
[10:14] <jozefk> 7 is better than xp
[10:14] <Sysi> any windows haven't been better for me than xubuntu
[10:14] <jozefk> yesterday i replaced xp with 7
[10:14] <jozefk> doing dual boot
[10:14] <Sahkolihaa> I was unimpressed with 7.
[10:14] <jozefk> any windows is not better than any linux, for me
[10:15] <Sahkolihaa> Especially when it told me to activate again after changing my graphics card. That point I simply said "stuff it" and completely switched to Linux.
[10:15] <Balsaq> i hope 7 is good but i must admit ive lost faith in windows
[10:15] <Sahkolihaa> Gave Ubuntu a try, then Ubuntu Studio, but found I was having too many issues with PulseAudio, so I switched to Xubuntu so I could stick to just ALSA.
[10:15] <Balsaq> if they dump xp support i will boot them out for good
[10:15] <Sahkolihaa> And behold, all my sound issues vanished. :P
[10:15] <Balsaq> xubuntu is really special
[10:16] <Sahkolihaa> I love how booting into Xubuntu with Compiz running only uses 140MiB RAM.
[10:16] <Sahkolihaa> That is simply amazing.
[10:16] <jozefk> i got xubuntu last night. it's only 700MB
[10:16] <jozefk> or less
[10:17] <jozefk> at least i know it fits on 1 cd :)
[10:17] <Balsaq> oh yes 1 cd
[10:17] <Sahkolihaa> I had to file a bug regarding xfce4-panel and Compiz though.
[10:17] <Sahkolihaa> Compiz seems to make the panels switch positions at boot up.
[10:17] <Sahkolihaa> That's the only issue I have.
[10:18] <jozefk> i don't really care about compiz and stuff. even in KDE I switch off all effects and stuff
[10:18] <Balsaq> i tried to what is compiz for?
[10:18] <Balsaq> what is compiz i meant
[10:18] <Sahkolihaa> It's an eye-candy window manager.
[10:18] <Balsaq> o
[10:19] <Sahkolihaa> I have a 9800GT so Compiz has little to no impact on performance.
[10:19] <Balsaq> yeah thats not me
[10:19] <Sahkolihaa> And - KDE. :(
[10:19] <Sahkolihaa> Crashed too much for me.
[10:19] <Balsaq> i am a xfce man for sure
[10:19] <jozefk> some versions - yes
[10:19] <Sysi> only good thing in compiz are window selections
[10:19] <Balsaq> i like pure speed
[10:20] <Sysi> xfce-opacities are soo candy :3
[10:20] <Balsaq> 3:)
[10:20] <Sahkolihaa> I do like how light xfce is though.
[10:20] <Sahkolihaa> I just wish the Xubuntu team would drop some of the GNome stuff and use xfce's software. :/
[10:24] <Balsaq> gotta sleep...later
[10:43] <jozefk> shall it always be free? I mean ubuntu/xubuntu?
[11:17] <Bitbuck> Time for my flight.  Have a good day.
[13:31] <Cyber_Akuma_2> Hey guys, I have been googling but haven't had much luck, are is there any cd coverart I can download to print on my Xubuntu 9.10 cd?
[13:32] <knome> Cyber_Akuma_2, not really.
[13:33] <Cyber_Akuma_2> Heh, ok then, is there anyway I can download the logos/art resources for Ubuntu so I can try to (keyboard: try) make my own? The artwork resources page from the subuntu site just linked me to ubuntu logos and skins/themes for xubuntu
[13:33] <Cyber_Akuma_2> anywhere*
[13:34] <Cyber_Akuma_2> ARGH, sorry, im still waking up, I meant keyword, not keyboard
[13:43] <psycho_oreos> http://emonk.fi/open/xubuntu/9.10/Wallpaper/ <--- does these help?
[14:05] <Cyber_Akuma_2> Thanks, but they don't really help, oh well, ill continue trying to google for images, thanks.
[14:05] <knome> psycho_oreos, please link to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Artwork/Karmic
[14:05] <psycho_oreos> knome, o.O err ok, apologies
[14:06] <knome> psycho_oreos, np. :)
[14:07] <knome> not that it mattered a lot, but the first link probably is going to disappear someday
[14:08] <Cyber_Akuma_2> Heh, yeah, saw that one, as I said, it just seems to have themes and its more of a place for people to upload  art :)
[14:12] <knome> Cyber_Akuma_2, there is no official cover art for xubuntu.
[14:12] <knome> Cyber_Akuma_2, you might find some community stuff, though, but i haven't heard of those either.
[14:16] <tpg> good afternoon lads
[19:27] <benchik> hello
[19:28] <benchik> how do i install wifi on xubuntu 9.10? i don't the wifi network icon and locator of wifi routers. i have dell inspiron 11z and i chose: broadcom b43 wireless driver ,in hardware drivers. please help
[19:29] <benchik> do i need to loagout and llogin after driver installation?
[19:29] <likemindead> !ndiswrapper | benchik
[19:30] <likemindead> Those Broadcom chips can be a pain. :-\
[19:30] <benchik> :(
[19:31] <likemindead> Yeah. I usually toss 'em and get a cheap, well supported wifi card from eBay.
[19:31] <likemindead> You can make it work, though. It's just a bit of work.
[19:32] <benchik> the guide is ubuntu oriented, while i run xubuntu. i guess the gui app is DE oriented. no?
[19:33] <likemindead> It's network-manager. Should be the same.
[19:35] <benchik> but the xfce panel's network manager different from gnome's one, no?
[19:40] <benchik> brb
[20:36] <benchik> hello
[20:36] <jar> hey
[20:37] <benchik> i have dell inspiron 11z. the screen brightness buttons show as if it changes, but the screen brightness (on battery) doesn't change
[20:38] <jar> hm
[20:38] <jar> weird
[20:38] <dooglus> I usually have a submenu in my rat menu called 'other' with all my WINE apps on it
[20:38] <dooglus> how can I get it back?
[20:38] <dooglus> but occasionally (like now) the whole submenu is missing
[20:38] <jar> dooglus, did a wine upgrade knock it out?
[20:39] <dooglus> jar: I don't think so.  today's upgrade only updated chromium and tzdata.
[20:39] <jar> hm
[20:39] <jar> well menus are controlled by .desktop files, your wine apps are in your home
[20:40] <dooglus> I'm sure rebooting will fix it - the .desktop (or whatever) files will be fine
[20:40] <dooglus> but I can't reboot right now
[20:40] <benchik> jar: the buttons i'm talking about are the keyboard buttons. and i get xubuntu response in notification windows. but the brightness itself doesn't change
[20:40] <jar> hm
[20:40] <jar> sounds like a kernel problem
[20:41] <jar> acpi
[20:41] <jar> My brightness buttons work fine on my netbook
[20:41] <dooglus> mine do too
[20:41] <benchik> jar: suggestions of action?
[20:42] <jar> benchik, hmm
[20:42] <jar> no clue really, the kernel is entirely up to the kernel developers
[20:42] <jar> you could make a bug report and see what happens
[20:43] <jar> benchik, you could also try a live disk of another distro or dual boot windows to see if it isn;t a hardware problem
[20:44] <benchik> on windows 7 it works fine
[20:45] <jar> Then I would try another live disk to see if it's supported in linux at all.
[20:45] <jar> laptops are tricky thing
[20:45] <jar> +s
[20:45] <jar> sometimes the special buttons work
[20:45] <jar> sometimes.. they don't
[20:45] <jar> Like one or two of my buttons don't work in Linux
[20:45] <jar> but id never use them anyways
[20:50] <benchik> well. if i reboot the correct brightness (according AC/battery) is chosen. good enough i guess
[20:50] <jar> Sounds like the driver isn't up to snuff
[20:50] <jar> not surprising since most laptop manufacturers use custom hardware
[20:51] <likemindead> Yep. :-\
[20:53] <benchik> my touchpad has gestures and some of them work out of the box. impressive
[20:55] <benchik> well,  thanks guys
[20:55] <benchik> good night
[20:55] <benchik> :)
[21:24] <tpg> Anyone here with the EEE PC 1005HA-H on Xubuntu? ^^
[21:24] <jar> tpg, No - but feel free to ask the question.
[21:25] <tpg> jar, Not really a very important question at the moment, and I probably would find it at google. But im sort of wondering about the opinons with the laptop-xubuntu ^^ Im curious to the button functionality to turn off the touchpad oO
[21:26] <jar> tpg, You should be able to.
[21:26] <jar> I run Xubuntu on my Toshiba netbook
[21:27] <Sysi> i have 1005ha and xubu
[21:27] <tpg> jar, hmm I see. Im busy installing Xubuntu on my netbook right now
[21:28] <Sysi> by default disabling touchpad won't work
[21:30] <tpg> Sysi, ah, I heard something about ¨eeecontrol¨ a very long time ago for this kind of thing, is that what I need, or maybe what you use?
[21:31] <Sysi> i don't need that feature
[21:31] <Sysi> neither have eeecontrol
[21:32] <Sysi> i have default xubuntu and governor plugin, which is rather useless
[21:42] <tpg> Sysi, great, I guess ill see if I`ll need that functionality or not when I have installed Xubuntu. Thanks ;)
[21:43] <Sysi> i'd guess it's possible to get work
[21:43] <Sysi> if button is recognised
[22:11] <tpg> this is weird, seems like when I try to install Xubuntu 9.10 on my 1005HA and try to run it with ¨Install Xubuntu¨ or ¨start without making any changes¨ it shows the xubuntu wallpaper thing after a while and then I get a black screen and the cursor seems as if its busy doing something... but its taking ages.... 30mins for sure
[22:18] <m8t> hello, I read somewhere that the installations is ok with a 1.5GB hdd, but during the installation it failed with no space left with a 2GB hdd
[22:24] <m8t> http://xubuntu.com/get it's written here, in minimum system requirements
[22:25] <jar> m8t, That can be read one of two ways.
[22:25] <m8t> i read it black on white :)
[22:25] <jar> But you're right, it should be more clear that it uses more space during the install.
[22:26] <jar> If an install requires 1.5 at the end, it's most certainly going to go over that during the install process.
[22:26] <jar> m8t, You might have better luck with Crunchbang or something without X11
[22:27] <jar> 2GB is not enough for an desktop envrionment.
[22:27] <m8t> i installed from the desktop version, maybe its true for the alternate one
[22:27] <genii> Might want to alter the APT::Archives::MaxSize "500";     apt setting to something less than 500 (Mb)
[22:27] <m8t> it's no problem actually, i upgraded the hdd
[22:27] <jar> hm
[22:28] <jar> I'm not entirely sure what the space used during the install process is.
[22:28] <jar> I'd have to ask a dev.
[22:29] <m8t> i'm doing the installation currently, i can check at the end
[22:30] <jar> end != during
[22:33] <jar> wtf
[22:33] <jar> xfce's clock seems to think today is Friday.
[22:34] <jar> just the tooltip anyways
[22:37] <m8t> after the copy of files is done the disk is filled up at 1.9GB
[22:38] <jar> I'll make a note of that and see if it can get changed..
[22:45] <m8t> now it is downloading extra packages for l10n, with an eta of 12minutes
[22:46] <jar> that's to be expected
[22:52] <m8t> genii: it doesn't look that fixing the max size of archives will help, the disk is already filled over the 1.5GB and there is only 90MB of cached archives, of course i don't know if this is any different to the alternate cd
[22:53] <genii> Hm
[23:13] <m8t> it downloaded 130MB of packages and after the deb installations/configurations the disk tops at 2.5GB and at the end of the installation it is down to 2.4GB
[23:14] <jar> m8t, You can slim it up some more by removing packages.
[23:14] <m8t> it's booting right now on the dd
[23:15] <m8t> but, i wasn't asked for packages to install during the process :/
[23:15] <m8t> and after all, i prefer a full desktop, otherwise i had started off a basic installation and installed Xorg+Xfce (for instance) myself :)
[23:17] <m8t> it's 2.4GB, with a swap partition of 190MB (I have 380MB of RAM, i don't know if that counts like if the swap size is calculated)
[23:17] <m8t> jar: well, that's it, thanks for the follow-up :)
[23:17] <jar> np


[01:24] <veebers> thumper, menn0 I'm getting a _bunch_ of log message like this when trying to get the status "INFO  juju.api apiclient.go:507 dialing "wss://<IP_ADDRESS>:17070/model/25914173-c6bf-4a50-86b3-4ba6060f5d59/api""
[01:24] <veebers> I can see that the lxd containers still exist (my first thought is it being wiped from underneath). While the env is still up what debugging can I do?
[01:27] <menn0> veebers: context please :)
[01:27] <menn0> veebers: what lead up to this/
[01:29] <veebers> menn0: oh sorry sure, I bootstrap, I add a new model, I deploy a charm (CI dummy charm), I then add a unit to it. I then wait for it to be considered 'started' and with 'workloads'. At this point I check the status in a loop for a couple of minutes with a bit of a sleep inbetween checks
[01:30] <veebers> The first status check succeeded, it output something, the second attempt is now sitting there with that message repeating over and over
[01:33] <veebers> menn0: it's now failed with this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/23245012/
[01:35] <menn0> veebers: the apiclient "dialing" messages are attempts to connect to the Juju API server(s)
[01:35] <menn0> veebers: it keeps trying and then has given up
[01:35] <axw> veebers: that upgrade-juju thing should be fixed in master now
[01:35] <menn0> veebers: this might mean the controller was unhappy
[01:36] <axw> menn0: when you're free, can you please review https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6336
[01:36] <veebers> axw: sweet, I've just built and about to try it out.
[01:37] <menn0> veebers: can you get logs for the controller machine(s)
[01:37] <veebers> menn0: I have the lxd containers still (have paused the test from cleaning up) is there anything I can grab off them off interest while it's running? (normal log collection will occur once I un-pause it
[01:37] <menn0> ?
[01:37] <menn0> veebers: the normal log collection should be enough
[01:37] <veebers> menn0: oh, I took too long typing :-) Yep I can grab them. I'll just let it complete and grab the logs from there
[01:38] <menn0> axw: will look shortly
[01:39] <veebers> will be some minutes as part of the clean up is to check status, so we'll go through this timeout process again
[02:22] <veebers> menn0: ok, I now have the log files, you want them?
[02:23] <menn0> veebers: sure. dropbox?
[02:23] <menn0> veebers: or email if they're not too big
[02:24] <veebers> menn0: which log? or do you want them all? You could probably scp them off the machine itself
[04:54] <veebers> axw: Where would I find juju stuff on the controller machine? I'm logged into an lxd machine that "apparently" is the controller based on the bootstrap output but /var/log/juju is empty and "ps aux | grep -i juju" returns nothing. I find this quite odd
[04:55] <veebers> I've logged in because I have this issue again with "INFO  juju.api apiclient.go:507 dialing "wss://<IP_ADDRESS>:17070/api" being repeated over and over (I imagine because the controller is borked somehow)
[04:56] <axw> veebers: that's where you would find the logs. agent and other data is in /var/lib/juju. if the agent failed to come up, there should be something in /var/log/cloud-init-output.log
[04:57] <veebers> axw, this is really odd as the system had been working before, I added models, deployed charms etc. and now it's not responding. /var/lib/juju doesn't even exist on that machine :-\
[04:57] <axw> veebers: juju 2.0?
[04:58] <veebers> axw: yep, 2.0-rc2 (although a day or so old)
[04:58] <axw> veebers: there have been bugs where juju would uninstall itself. I thought it was sorted for 2.0, but possibly not...
[04:58] <axw> I don't *think* it wipes /var/log/juju on unistnall though
[04:58] <veebers> axw: did that uninstall bug include wiping all logs etc.?
[04:58] <veebers> heh
[04:59] <veebers> /var/log/juju exists, but it's empty
[05:00] <veebers> axw: juju was totally running on this machine before hand, a grep juju /var/logs/syslog says so, also status stopping juju ... etc.
[05:01] <axw> veebers: the uninstall code doesn't touch logs. so it's something else
[05:11] <veebers> axw: Would you have a couple of minutes to help me work out if it's an existing bug or needs a new one?
[05:12] <axw> not sure what I can tell you if there's nothing there. I have looked at the uninstall code and it doesn't touch logs, so it's not the same old one I referred to
[05:13] <veebers> axw: ok. I'll have a dig around and see what details I can uncover
[05:15] <veebers> axw: oh btw your fix unblocks me and the functional upgrade test, cheers :-)
[05:15] <axw> cool
[08:15] <voidspace> dimitern: ping
[08:25] <dimitern> voidspace: pong, otp though - might be slow to respond
[08:25] <voidspace> dimitern: ok
[08:26] <voidspace> dimitern: currently the network.Select*Address|HostPort return the first address matching the requested scope
[08:26] <voidspace> dimitern: we have a "bug" where IPv6 addresses are being returned when users want an IPv4 one
[08:27] <voidspace> dimitern: so I'm changing the functions to prefer IPv4 (but still return IPv6 if that's all that is available as an exact match for the scope)
[08:27] <voidspace> dimitern: so the choice is, should the order of preference be:
[08:27] <voidspace> dimitern: IPv4, hostname, IPv6
[08:27] <voidspace> dimitern: or
[08:27] <voidspace> dimitern: IPv4, IPv6, hostname
[08:28] <voidspace> dimitern: or alternatively:
[08:29] <voidspace> dimitern: IPv4, hostname or IPv6 (so *only* prefer IPv4 - no weighting on IPv6 or hostname, just whichever appears first)
[08:29] <redir> frobware: ping
[08:29] <voidspace> dimitern: whatever we pick I have to adjust some tests
[08:29] <voidspace> dimitern: I like just preferring IPv4 (option 3)
[08:30] <hoenir> option 3 sounds the most reasonable
[08:31] <voidspace> hoenir: cool, thanks
[08:59] <redir> rogpeppe: yt?
[09:02] <rogpeppe> redir: yt?
[09:02] <rogpeppe> redir: ah "you there?"
[09:02] <rogpeppe> redir: yes
[09:32] <dimitern> voidspace: sorry, we just finished now - reading scrollback
[09:32] <voidspace> dimitern: I'm doing option 3, just fixing tests
[09:32] <voidspace> dimitern: so you can ignore it if you like
[09:33] <dimitern> voidspace: option 3 sounds reasonable atm
[09:34] <dimitern> however we should really move away from the notion of a single preferred address
[09:35] <dimitern> voidspace: please ping me with the PR when you're done, I'd like to have a look
[09:35] <voidspace> dimitern: sure, it's pretty straightforward really
[09:39] <rogpeppe> here's an update to juju-core that fixes it for the changed Clock interface and updates dependencies: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6337
[09:47] <redir> thanks rogpeppe
[10:46] <voidspace> dimitern: a consequence is that the Select*Addresses/HostPorts (note the plural) only return IPv4 if they are available - not IPv6 at all
[10:46] <voidspace> dimitern: I think that's still ok as we'll want to use IPv4 if they're available - still treating IPv6 as a fallback
[10:46] <voidspace> dimitern: we can change that if we need to
[10:56] <voidspace> dimitern: PR https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6338
[11:03] <dimitern> voidspace: looking
[11:04] <voidspace> dimitern: I'm doing a "juju deploy ubuntu -n 15" on lxd
[11:04] <voidspace> dimitern: so far all of the machines have IPv4 addresses
[11:04] <dimitern> voidspace: that'll only work if you bump up the limits on number of open files
[11:05] <voidspace> also running a full test suite just to check no tests depend on the old behaviour
[11:05] <voidspace> dimitern: working fine so far
[11:05] <dimitern> voidspace: please, double check what actually runs in each container
[11:05] <voidspace> dimitern: well, 9 started so far
[11:05] <voidspace> now 10
[11:05] <voidspace> dimitern: what do you mean?
[11:05] <dimitern> voidspace: if it's only /sbin/init and a couple of other processes, that's the limit issue - I'll try to find the bug
[11:12] <voidspace> dimitern: 14 of the 15 have started ok and are reporting IPv4 addresses
[11:12] <rogpeppe> some fixes to make test pass under Go tip; review appreciated: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6339
[11:14] <dimitern> voidspace: ok, if you hit the open file limit issue, they should be stuck in pendingf
[11:15] <voidspace> dimitern: nope, all started fine - killing it now because it has ground my machine to a crawl
[11:15] <voidspace> running tests at the same time!
[11:37] <babbageclunk> jam: https://github.com/babbageclunk/juju/tree/mongo-ssl
[11:46] <jam> very interesting babbageclunk, seems all the mongo testing infrastructure already supported not having an SSL cert. I'm a little surprised that juju connecting to mongo isn't complaining that it isn't trusted.
[11:46] <dimitern> voidspace: I'll review your PR after lunch, if that's ok - we've been on a HO with jam till now
[11:47] <jam> ah, but maybe we don't check the SSL of mongo to the same degree that we check the API Conn.
[11:47] <jam> babbageclunk: have you looked at all to see if we are using an SSL cert on the Controller as well for things like JujuConnSuite, and whether we're are connecting to ourselves over an SSL connection?
[11:48] <babbageclunk> jam: Ah, no - didn't think to check that, sorry.
[11:49] <babbageclunk> jam: Can take a look at that now, if you like?
[11:49] <jam> babbageclunk: might be worthy of a look at least.
[11:50] <babbageclunk> jam: Ok, I'll have a go now.
[11:50] <jam> given how small your patch is, and that it is ~10% across the board, I'm starting to lean more towards it being worth doing.
[11:52] <frobware> dimitern: http://paste.ubuntu.com/23246440/
[12:04] <rogpeppe> anyone wanna sign off on this before i land it? (trivial-ish changes to make Juju tests pass under Go tip) https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6339
[12:05] <perrito666> rogpeppe: wont that break the tests with other go versions?
[12:16] <rogpeppe> perrito666: it shouldn't, no
[12:16] <rogpeppe> perrito666: the CI bot should make sure that's OK
[12:17] <rogpeppe> perrito666: i tried to change things so that it would work under all versions
[12:26] <perrito666> rogpeppe: cool, as long as you tested with other versions ship it
[12:42] <dimitern> voidspace: reviewed, with some questions
[12:43] <rick_h_> voidspace: are you able to help review/QA macgreagoir's branch so we can try to get it into the next rc please?
[13:04] <dimitern> rick_h_: are we planning on including the maas bridge fixes in rc2?
[13:05] <rick_h_> dimitern: yes, that's why the EOD timline
[13:05] <rick_h_> dimitern: they have to be there to allow openstack to go back to being install-able by folks
[13:05] <frobware> rick_h_: I was also going to try macgreagoir's change today; largely because voidspace reported that he could not repro
[13:05] <rick_h_> frobware: k, all good
[13:05] <dimitern> rick_h_: I've tested the changes, as agreed on maas 1.9, testing on 2.0 now
[13:05] <rick_h_> dimitern: k, ty
[13:06] <macgreagoir> voidspace frobware: I retested earlier this week and can repro :-) Comment in the review.
[13:06] <dimitern> rick_h_: I'll propose the PR with the changes; also the last CI run (of the same branch, minus the "configured" handling) passed OK
[13:07] <rick_h_> dimitern: k
[13:14] <dimitern> here's the PR https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6341
[13:17] <rick_h_> natefinch: if the rax stuff works properly now can you file a bug against the docs/rackspace setup with any notes/etc please?
[13:17] <rick_h_> natefinch: and check the cloud config docs around that as I know there was some question over a domain name and such in the past
[13:18] <rick_h_> voidspace: assigned a card your way for next please.
[13:19] <rick_h_> dooferlad: how goes the return? Have you gotten through catch up enough to pick up the hostname/lxd issues today?
[13:19] <dooferlad> rick_h_: naughty me - didn't move the cards
[13:20] <rick_h_> dooferlad: cool, ty. Just checking :)
[13:20] <natefinch> rick_h_: will do
[13:24] <dimitern> dooferlad: hey there, long time no see ;)
[13:24] <dooferlad> dimitern: hi
[13:25] <voidspace> rick_h_: I did QA it and it didn't work for me
[13:26] <rick_h_> voidspace: ic, ok
[13:27] <voidspace> rick_h_: I see you put me on the list-spaces card - I was thinking about picking that one up
[13:27] <voidspace> rick_h_: is the kanban board ordered?
[13:27] <natefinch> rick_h_: I actually think it's a bug in our code... juju add-credential rackspace asks for a domain name, and shouldn't
[13:27] <rick_h_> voidspace: somewhat, I do try to stick critical at the top
[13:27] <rick_h_> natefinch: k, I want to make sure we're polishing off that experience there so that this works ootb.
[13:27] <voidspace> kk
[13:27] <rick_h_> natefinch: if that's a bug in asking for it then we need a card to remove that please
[13:28] <voidspace> rick_h_: grabbing coffee before our sync up - be with you in 5
[13:28] <rick_h_> voidspace: but it tends to wander sometimes when I don't keep at it every day
[13:28] <rick_h_> voidspace: rgr
[13:28] <natefinch> rick_h_: making the bug then the card, right now
[13:28] <rick_h_> natefinch: ty
[13:31]  * dimitern can confirm https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6341 works as expected on MAAS 1.9 + 2.0 by manual testing
[13:37] <macgreagoir> dimitern: http://reviews.vapour.ws/r/5715/
[13:52] <natefinch> rick_h_: ug, so this seems to be a problem for openstack as well - the interactive add-credentials code is very dumb, and just prompts for everything you could possibly set, which doesn't take into account whether or not it's v2 or v3.  Ideally we'd ask the user if it's v2 or v3 and then only prompt for domain name for v3.... but there's no way to do that right now.  I *can* fix it for rackspace by overriding the entire
[13:52] <natefinch> schema for rackspace to exclude domain-name.
[13:53] <rick_h_> natefinch: since it's different enough from openstack I'd be +1 to a rackspace specific config
[13:55] <natefinch> rick_h_: cool
[13:56] <natefinch> rick_h_: I'll make a separate bug for the openstack issue.  It's addressable via documentation, but just not user-friendly that way.
[13:56] <rick_h_> natefinch: understand, ty
[13:56] <rick_h_> natefinch: look for an existing bug though, I know this domain-name issue has come up and thought it was in bug form.
[13:56] <rick_h_> but I could be wrong and it was in email or something
[13:58] <natefinch> rick_h_: https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju/+bug/1577776
[13:59] <natefinch> rick_h_: seems like we just added domain-name to openstack config, which might be why other things around it are breaking
[14:00] <rick_h_> natefinch: gotcha
[14:00] <rick_h_> natefinch: ok, so let's update rackspace so we can try to get it smooth ootb and we'll have to revisit the openstack case
[14:01] <natefinch> yep
[14:02] <natefinch> rick_h_: ping for standup ;)
[14:03] <voidspace> dimitern: I answered your questions by the way
[14:05] <voidspace> rick_h_: ping for standup...
[14:05] <dimitern> voidspace: cheers, looking
[14:06] <rick_h_> voidspace: doh omw
[14:07] <voidspace> dimitern: thanks!
[14:09] <dimitern> voidspace: LGTM
[14:10] <natefinch> katco: we need to develop one universal standard error package that covers both juju errors and errgo
[14:10] <katco`> natefinch: "and then you have 3 problems"
[14:12] <natefinch> katco`: just reminded me of that xkcd with 14 competing standards :)
[14:12] <katco`> natefinch: not sure if you were serious :)
[14:12] <natefinch> katco`: no no :)
[14:12] <katco`> haha
[14:13] <natefinch> dooferlad: show us your shirt
[14:14] <natefinch> dooferlad: thought that was Nathan Fillion at first
[14:14] <dooferlad> natefinch: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Con_Man_(web_series)
[14:15] <natefinch> oh, it is, ok :)
[14:20] <natefinch> dooferlad: weird, I recognize the title font and stuff, but somehow never looked deeper than that.  It sounds amazing
[14:20] <dooferlad> natefinch: it is rather good. I haven't seen it all yet due to new children.
[14:21] <natefinch> dooferlad: totally understand that
[14:22] <natefinch> dooferlad: I only recently got past season 3 of Game of Thrones for the same reason :)
[14:24] <natefinch> katco: hooly crap. According to godoc.org, Dave's github.com/pkg/errors package is imported by 623 packages
[14:36] <katco> natefinch: yep. he brought the lessons learned on juju to the whole community
[14:39] <natefinch> katco: there have been other errors packages, but I guess star power has its benefits :)
[14:40] <katco> :)
[14:42] <mup> Bug #1628155 changed: cmd/juju: juju deploy "see also" refers to non-existent command <helptext> <usability> <juju:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1628155>
[14:54] <voidspace> babbageclunk: ping
[14:54] <babbageclunk> voidspace: pong
[14:57] <babbageclunk> dooferlad: how's double-dadhood going?
[14:58] <dooferlad> babbageclunk: OK. The expected problem (not enough sleep) but from an unexpected source (elder daughter).
[14:59] <dooferlad> babbageclunk: Mostly loving it though!
[15:00] <babbageclunk> dooferlad: yeah, we found that too - you don't get to take advantage of all the time little babies spend asleep to catch up on some yourself!
[15:00] <dooferlad> babbageclunk: definitely not when you are working :-)
[15:01] <natefinch> oh man, just used go rename in vscode... this is game changing
[15:02] <perrito666> natefinch: how so?
[15:02] <perrito666> I mean, go rename is an external tool :p
[15:03] <natefinch> perrito666: right right, but the CLI is kind of hard to use...  in vscode I just click the thing I want to rename and hit F2, type in the new name, and it just works.
[15:04] <perrito666> ah never used it in the cli, I use vim-go
[15:04] <perrito666> I would guess katco has a similar one for emacs, I dont think anyone uses go rename in the cli
[15:05] <katco> indeed i do
[15:05] <katco> comes standard in the emacs go-mode
[15:06] <katco> i can also visually debug with delve
[15:06] <natefinch> yeah, I just started debugging with delve a few days ago, also amazing
[15:06] <katco> yeah i missed visually debugging hehe
[15:06] <natefinch> yep
[15:07] <katco> it's still not my goto bc it's still a little more cumbersome than i'd like, but it's there and very helpful
[15:07] <natefinch> it's pretty great in vscode.  Very easy to set breakpoints, give it a command line to run, inspect local variables, etc.
[15:07] <natefinch> anyway, gotta run, back after lunch
[15:08] <perrito666> redir: ping
[15:18] <redir> yo
[15:18] <redir> otp perrito666
[15:22] <perrito666> redir: just ping me when you hang
[15:22] <redir> will do perrito666
[15:22] <perrito666> tx
[15:24] <anastasiamac> babbageclunk: this is what it gives me :D http://juju-ci.vapour.ws:8080/job/github-merge-juju/9349/artifact/artifacts/windows-out.log
[15:31] <voidspace> dimitern: rick_h_: ping
[15:32] <rick_h_> voidspace: pong
[15:32] <voidspace> rick_h_: landing onto develop now, right?
[15:32] <rick_h_> voidspace: starting monday
[15:32] <voidspace> ah
[15:32] <rick_h_> voidspace: so not today, getting the ducks in a row to prepare
[15:32] <voidspace> rick_h_: so just land this branch on Monday then
[15:32] <voidspace> I mean on master
[15:33] <rick_h_> voidspace: yea, on master please
[15:33] <voidspace> rick_h_: I think you did say this in standup...
[15:33] <voidspace> kk
[15:33] <rick_h_> voidspace: yep, all good
[15:33] <dimitern> voidspace: pong
[15:33] <voidspace> dimitern: unping :-)
[15:33] <voidspace> dimitern: landing the prefer IPv4 branch
[15:33] <dooferlad> bridge everything... LXD not getting on the right subnet https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/0h06Df4K/
[15:33] <dimitern> voidspace: go for it :)
[15:34] <dooferlad> dimitern, frobware: ^^
[15:34] <dimitern> dooferlad: which branch are you testing?
[15:35] <frobware> dooferlad: let's do the testing on the master-lp1627037-final branch I am about to push.
[15:35] <frobware> dooferlad, dimitern: it's not clear to me we're all testing the final thing
[15:35] <dooferlad> This is without your latest changes. Just master + a couple of changes of my own that shouldn't do anything to break this.
[15:36] <frobware> dooferlad: ohhhh....
[15:36] <dooferlad> it has bridged everything
[15:36] <dooferlad> but LXD gave the container a 10. address, not something from the host <IP_ADDRESS>/24...
[15:37] <dimitern> dooferlad: that might happen if the <IP_ADDRESS>/24 has no available IPs
[15:37] <dooferlad> dimitern: there are plenty
[15:37] <dimitern> dooferlad: I had this case when I used a subnet which I forgot that I reserved .1-.254 previously
[15:38] <dooferlad> dimitern: I launched machines since that are fine
[15:38] <dimitern> dooferlad: any errors in the log of the host ?
[15:39] <dooferlad> dimitern: not that I have seen yet
[15:40] <dooferlad> oh, fun: "ERROR juju.worker.proxyupdater proxyupdater.go:160 lxdbr0 has no ipv4 or ipv6 subnet enabled"
[15:41] <dooferlad> It looks like your lxdbr0 has not yet been configured. Please configure it via:
[15:41] <dooferlad> sudo dpkg-reconfigure -p medium lxd
[15:41] <dooferlad> and then bootstrap again.
[15:44] <voidspace> dooferlad: I always get that, and then it works
[15:44] <voidspace> dooferlad: I *think* it's normal
[15:44] <voidspace> deceiving though, because it takes a while to download the template, so it seems like it hasn't worked and there is this error message in the logs...
[15:44] <voidspace> and then about ten minutes later it completes...
[15:44] <dooferlad> voidspace: you are right - I get it on working machines too.
[15:45] <voidspace> annoying, especially at error level
[15:45] <dooferlad> what a rubbish message!
[15:46] <rogpeppe> perrito666: did you have a look at https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6339 ? i'd quite like to land it if poss.
[15:48] <dimitern> it's total crap yeah
[15:48] <dimitern> but it's fine otherwise
[15:48] <dimitern> doesn't stop it from working
[15:48] <dooferlad> Well, the address is wrong for the container... https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/7BdR7noH/
[15:48] <rogpeppe> dimitern: or maybe you might have a look - it's basically trivial. https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6339
[15:49] <dimitern> rogpeppe: we'll be leaving the office in a minute or so, sorry :/
[15:50] <rogpeppe> dimitern: ok
[15:50] <rogpeppe> dimitern: i might land it anyway
[15:50] <rogpeppe> dimitern: i have one review (not from core though)
[16:00] <redir> perrito666: what's up?
[16:03] <perrito666> rogpeppe: I did, sorry I lgtmd in irc and forget to do it in gh
[16:03] <perrito666> redir: priv
[16:03] <rogpeppe> perrito666: thanks
[16:35] <voidspace> perrito666: where are you based again?
[16:35] <perrito666> voidspace: argentina
[16:35]  * perrito666 looks out of the window and sees a rocket from voidspace aproaching
[16:36] <voidspace> perrito666: heh
[16:36] <voidspace> perrito666: fancy brining me a large rock to the next sprint?
[16:37] <perrito666> voidspace: too many variables in that sentences
[16:37] <voidspace> perrito666: there are some lovely amethyst geodes in your part of the world and I would really like one
[16:37] <perrito666> define large and rock
[16:37] <voidspace> perrito666: especially a sphere
[16:37] <voidspace> perrito666: a few kilos...
[16:38] <perrito666> I presume customs wouldnt have an issue with it so I dont see why not
[16:38] <voidspace> perrito666: :-)
[16:38] <perrito666> send me more details and ill try to procure one
[16:38] <voidspace> perrito666: I'll send you a link to an example and see if you can find one - I think it would be much *cheaper* if you find one than me buying it from a non-indigenous provider...
[16:39] <perrito666> certainly I think these things are sort of easy to find here, hippies use them to to all kind of crafts
[16:39] <voidspace> hippies are great :-)
[16:40] <perrito666> if you say so
[16:40] <voidspace> I do, and I'm glad you consider me an authority
[16:40] <perrito666> ill go to the flea market and find out once you send me a pic
[16:40] <perrito666> lol
[16:40] <voidspace> perrito666: this is the sort of thing I would love, the purpler the better
[16:40] <voidspace> perrito666: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TOP-GRADE-HUGE-DARK-PURPLE-AMETHYST-GEODE-SPHERE-FROM-URUGUAY-/232091390623?hash=item3609b9929f:g:5E8AAOSwTA9X4-8m
[16:40] <voidspace> perrito666: that size is wonderful, that price is not
[16:41] <perrito666> should this be a perfectly shaped ball?
[16:41] <voidspace> perrito666: ideally but not necessarily, to be fair I love any and all beautiful minerals
[16:42] <voidspace> perrito666: as they're cut from a geode they're usually ground to a shape like a sphere with a "bite" taken out of it
[16:42] <voidspace> perrito666: so not a perfect sphere - I'd much prefer one with some of the crystals intact
[16:43] <perrito666> do search "amatista" in mercadolibre.com
[16:43] <perrito666> .com.ar
[16:45] <voidspace> perrito666: cool, looking
[16:50] <voidspace> perrito666: this is the closest, not really exactly what I'm after (would prefer more purple and more spiky) http://articulo.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-629608847-esfera-de-agata-y-amatista-hermosa-115mm-1600grs-_JM
[16:50] <voidspace> perrito666: I'll look again, thanks
[16:50] <voidspace> perrito666: and if you see anything - or any other large beautiful minerals - let me know :-)
[16:51] <perrito666> ill do, ill tlegram you pics
[16:51] <perrito666> the hippie fair opens only on weekends
[16:52] <voidspace> perrito666: flourite is nice I think there is some in Argentina
[16:52] <voidspace> perrito666: I have agate
[16:54] <voidspace> perrito666: anyway, thanks :-)
[17:13]  * rick_h_ goes for lunchables
[17:13] <perrito666> I could use reviews in https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6344 https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6340 https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6321
[17:14] <natefinch> greedy
[17:15] <natefinch> perrito666: I'm looking at 6344
[17:25] <rogpeppe> this PR implements letsencrypt certificate support for controllers. anyone fancy taking a look? https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6345
[17:25] <natefinch> whoa, awesome!
[17:28] <rogpeppe> natefinch: note: if you want to try it out, you need to bootstrap with api-port=443
[17:29] <natefinch> rogpeppe: ahh, interesting
[17:29] <rogpeppe> natefinch: alternatively you can run a port forwarder on the controller instance to forward from 443 to 17070 but then you'll need to open up port 443 in the security group
[17:54] <natefinch> rick_h_: so there's some auto-detection of environment variables for openstack, so like you can set OS_TENANT_NAME and we'll pick it up.  Currently that's being reused for rackspace... I don't think we should reuse those environment variables, what do you think?
[17:59] <rick_h_> natefinch: meet you in standup?
[18:01] <natefinch> rick_h_: yep
[18:03] <natefinch> fastest hangout ever
[18:04] <rick_h_> :)
[18:53] <cmars> hello, i have a runaway jujud burning up my machine. how do i attach the profiler to it?
[18:54] <cmars> for example, https://paste.ubuntu.com/23247920/
[18:55] <natefinch> cmars: anything interesting in the logs?
[18:55] <cmars> looking
[18:58] <cmars> natefinch, maybe. lots of messages like this are spewing to machine-0.log: https://paste.ubuntu.com/23247941/
[19:01] <natefinch> cmars: can you run juju model-config logging-config="<root>=TRACE"
[19:01] <natefinch> rick_h_: when did set-model-config and get-model-config get rolled into one command?
[19:02] <cmars> natefinch, set model-config on the controller model?
[19:02] <natefinch> cmars: uh, yes
[19:02] <natefinch> cmars: I can never remember if it matters, probably does
[19:06] <cmars> natefinch, controller model worked. here's the last 2000 lines with trace on: https://pastebin.canonical.com/166645/
[19:06] <alexisb> natefinch, about 3 weeks ago regarding the model-config command
[19:07] <alexisb> set-config and get-config also got collapsed
[19:07] <natefinch> alexisb: personally not a fan of losing the verbness on set
[19:10] <rick_h_> natefinch: yea, that was the negative, was in beta18.
[19:13]  * rick_h_ goes to get the boy from school, biab
[19:21] <thumper> rogpeppe: I haven't looked at your letsencrypt branch, just saw the email fly past. Just wanted to say that I love the idea, and very cool that you've done this
[19:34] <rogpeppe> thumper: thanks!
[19:39] <natefinch> simple PR anyone?  https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6346  just overriding a couple methods on the rackspace provider to strip out domain name as a valid credential attribute.
[19:47] <gQuigs> are there daily builds available for juju 1.25?   I'd like to try a fix that's committed but not released
[19:53] <katco> thumper: hey we need a third opinion, got a sec?
[19:53] <thumper> katco: sure
[19:53] <thumper> gQuigs: I don't think so
[19:54] <katco> thumper: can you TAL at my comment regarding juju/rety here? https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6321/files
[19:54] <thumper> sure
[19:54] <katco> thumper: and lmk if that's appropriate? perrito666 would rather use a simple for loop
[19:54] <thumper> ack
[20:02] <natefinch> thumper: https://github.com/juju/retry/pull/4
[20:02]  * thumper pushes it on the stack
[20:02] <natefinch> thumper: just a doc update, no rush
[20:03] <katco> thumper: sweet, i didn't know you were preemptable. the possibilities...
[20:03] <thumper> queue, no stack
[20:03] <thumper> geez
[20:04] <katco> aw boo
[20:04] <thumper> nerds
[20:04] <thumper> well
[20:04] <thumper> geeks
[20:04] <thumper> but that is just stating the obvious
[20:04] <natefinch> also pedants, evidently
[20:04] <thumper> my kids a beginning to understand just how much of a geek household they live in
[20:04] <katco> sudo review my comment already!
[20:04] <thumper> well, we do work at pedantical
[20:04] <katco> lol
[20:05] <katco> natefinch: comment left on your pr
[20:06] <natefinch> katco: added QA steps
[20:06] <natefinch> katco: thanks for the reminder
[20:07] <katco> thumper: ta
[20:08] <natefinch> does anyone else think we'll get push back for calling our Kubernetes distro the Canonical Distribution of Kuberneters?  Makes it sound like its the official one.
[20:08] <katco> thumper: so can you clarify when it's appropraite to use juju/retry?
[20:08] <thumper> I think that play on words is hillarious
[20:09] <thumper> I don't think it is
[20:09] <thumper> retry either has time limits or retry limits
[20:09] <thumper> whereas this is polling
[20:09] <katco> thumper: does juju/retry demand a time/retry limit?
[20:09] <thumper> yeah, it does
[20:09] <thumper> I wonder if I added an infinite?
[20:09] <natefinch> I think retry implies "try until you succeed"
[20:10] <natefinch> otherwise it would just be called juju/loop
[20:10]  * thumper checks something
[20:10] <katco> thumper: ah i see in https://github.com/juju/retry/blob/master/retry.go#L155
[20:11] <thumper> yeah, it expects either a max duration or max times
[20:11] <thumper> whereas I think perhaps that should be loosened
[20:11] <thumper> to expect one or more of: max duration, max retries, or stop channel
[20:11] <natefinch> I was just gonna mention stop channel
[20:11] <thumper> pull request welcome :)
[20:12] <thumper> actually
[20:12] <katco> see? he's totally preemptable
[20:12] <thumper> if you say Attempts: retry.UnlimitedAttempts
[20:12] <natefinch> katco: lol
[20:13] <katco> i'm just going to keep bringing stuff up
[20:13] <thumper> then that passes
[20:13] <katco> hey thumper what do you think of mongo?
[20:13] <thumper> it is lovely
[20:13] <thumper> as long as you don't care about all your data
[20:29] <katco> ah i'm not crazy! no wonder i couldn't figure out where this error message was coming from. different results after first time deploy is run
[20:33] <kwmonroe> hey alexisb, yesterday we talked about azure slowing down on long running deployments.  i've got a controller with molasses in its tubes if you're interested.  bug 1628206 has my logs.. i can keep it up as long as you want.
[20:33] <mup> Bug #1628206: azure controller size seems too small <juju:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1628206>
[20:33] <alexisb> kwmonroe, thanks for the bug
[20:33] <kwmonroe> np alexisb, thanks for being such a wonderful person.
[20:33] <alexisb> axw comes online this afternoon
[20:33] <alexisb> :)
[20:34] <alexisb> kwmonroe, can you send me info with details on access
[20:34] <alexisb> then I can have axw take a look when he comes online
[20:34] <kwmonroe> will do alexisb
[20:35] <alexisb> katco if you have time: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6347
[20:35] <alexisb> I would like to land this today if possible and it is a simple change
[20:36] <katco> alexisb: looks simple enough; you grepped for all possible places that reference get-controller, etc.?
[20:36] <alexisb> yes
[20:37] <katco> alexisb: lgtm
[20:43] <babbageclunk> thumper: sorry, back now - hangout?
[20:44] <thumper> babbageclunk: ack
[20:48] <natefinch> rick_h_: I presume I should work on the card assigned to me in the todo?  this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/juju/+bug/1621375
[20:48] <mup> Bug #1621375: "juju logout" should clear cookies for the controller <juju:Triaged by rharding> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/1621375>
[20:49] <rick_h_> natefinch: yea, so I suspected that was related to the other one you had in tracking
[20:49] <rick_h_> natefinch: my thought was that might be why a logout didn't actually log you out
[20:58] <katco> rick_h_: i need an opinion, hangout rq?
[21:37] <alexisb> rick_h_, ping
[21:40] <katco> PR for someone: https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6348
[22:50] <thumper> katco: comments added
[22:56] <thumper> alexisb: unit leader in status https://github.com/juju/juju/pull/6350
[23:09] <alexisb> thumper, awesome


[01:31] <Anho> ayyyy
[12:02] <dupingping> Hello, all
[12:03] <marcoceppi> o/ We'll be getting started in just a min
[12:03] <FrozenZia> Hello hello.
[12:03] <dupingping> When does the meeting start?
[12:04] <popey> hello
[12:04] <marcoceppi> #startmeeting 1200 UTC Ubuntu Membership Board
[12:04] <meetingology> Meeting started Wed Oct 21 12:04:24 2015 UTC.  The chair is marcoceppi. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
[12:04] <meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
[12:04] <Kilos> hi dupingping FrozenZia
[12:04] <dupingping> hi, Kilos
[12:04] <dupingping> I am here.
[12:05] <marcoceppi> Hello and welcome to the Ubuntu Membership Review Board for the 1200 UTC meeting for October 21, 2015.
[12:05] <marcoceppi> The wiki page for the Review Board is available here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership/Boards
[12:05] <marcoceppi> We will attempt to get through all of the applicants that have added themselves to that list before today's meeting. If we are unable to make it through the entire list due to time constraints, then at the next meeting we will pick up where we left off.
[12:05] <marcoceppi> The format for the meeting is as follows: We will go through the list of applicants one by one, by date of application (FIFO).
[12:05] <marcoceppi> Each applicant should introduce themselves (1-5 sentences) and provide links to their Ubuntu Wiki page. After the introduction the members of the Membership Review Board will review the pages and, if needed, ask the applicant further questions.
[12:05] <marcoceppi> During this time it is encouraged for other members of the community to show their support for the applicant. Do not be alarmed if the members of the Membership Review Board are quiet during this time; they are most likely reading wiki/launchpad/forum/other pages and deciding how they are going to vote.
[12:05] <marcoceppi> When the board is ready to vote, they will publicly vote in the channel with either +1, 0, or -1 (for membership, abstain, and against membership, respectively). If the sum of those numbers amounts to at least +1, then the applicant is now an official Ubuntu member! (feel free congratulate them!)
[12:06] <marcoceppi> #votesrequired 4
[12:06] <meetingology> votes now need 4 to be passed
[12:07] <marcoceppi> #voters popey marcoceppi Kilos IdleOne hggdh belkinsa
[12:07] <meetingology> Warning: Nick not in channel: IdleOne
[12:07] <meetingology> Warning: Nick not in channel: belkinsa
[12:07] <meetingology> Current voters: IdleOne Kilos belkinsa hggdh marcoceppi popey
[12:07] <marcoceppi> Now, without any further ado, lets get started with the first applicant...
[12:07] <marcoceppi> #subtopic FrozenZia
[12:07] <popey> I'm glad you know how to operate this bot marcoceppi :)
[12:08] <FrozenZia> Right, so Paul Brown, native of New Mexico originally, moved to Finland after a year as an exchange student.
[12:08] <Kilos> yeah me too
[12:08] <marcoceppi> well, except for subtopic didn't seem to  work :\
[12:08] <marcoceppi> Welcome FrozenZia!
[12:08] <FrozenZia> Zia is an indian symbol from the NM state flag, and being here in Finland nowadays, well, that's where FrozenZia came from.
[12:09] <FrozenZia> Here's the Wiki link: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PaulVinsonBrown
[12:09] <FrozenZia> I've basically been spending the last 4ish years trying to refurbish old computers, install Ubuntu on them, and sell them / donate them forward.
[12:10] <FrozenZia> That's the very shortest version of the story, really.
[12:11] <FrozenZia> Had an email from Walter Lapchynski pointing out that my contributions to the actual Ubuntu *project* in terms of bug reports, translating, code, etc...
[12:11] <FrozenZia> has actually been very close to zero, but that for all that's lacking there I have done plenty of ADVOCACY.
[12:11] <dupingping> Hi, everybody.
[12:12] <marcoceppi> FrozenZia: I see you've done translation for Code Club World, which is awesome! Have you looked at doing translations for the Ubuntu projects?
[12:12] <FrozenZia> I'm very much interested in doing more, but time time time...
[12:12] <FrozenZia> marcoceppi: yes and no.
[12:13] <FrozenZia> The few times I've looked at it, I've maybe gotten to the "first steps" page, and then got distracted with some other project, etc...
[12:14] <FrozenZia> Don't really know at this point how really *easy* or *diffictult* it is to get started translating, but suggested that at OggCamp in Liverpool at the end of the month I'd be willing to try and organize a sort of "translating for newbies" workshop or something.
[12:15] <FrozenZia> Problem being it'd be a blind leading the blind sort of situation at this point.
[12:15] <marcoceppi> FrozenZia: I've found often teaching is the best way to learn something ;)
[12:15] <marcoceppi> FrozenZia: have you been in contact with the Finland loco at all?
[12:15] <FrozenZia> marcoceppi: so true. so very true.
[12:16] <popey> I would prefer to see the testimonials on the page if possible, rather than emails to us, but that's just a personal preference.
[12:16] <FrozenZia> marcoceppi: well, other than a few posts in the Finnish forums, not really -- have been disheartened there didn't seem to be much *local* activity (I'm *not* in Helsinki), and the
[12:17] <FrozenZia> Tampere crowd has been meeting Wednesday nites which haven't worked for my schedule.
[12:17] <Kilos> FrozenZia what was the problem of getting your testimonials that went to our mailing list on your wiki page
[12:17] <FrozenZia> popey: Yeah, I just had people to ask for testimonials that would have found registering to be able to update the wiki "beyond them".
[12:18] <Kilos> ah
[12:18] <popey> Yeah, the wiki is obtuse for beginners
[12:18] <FrozenZia> Even Vagrant, who is very capable, commented that he didn't know if he'd ever edited the Ubuntu Wiki and so I sent him the e-mail-address option.
[12:19] <popey> ok.
[12:19] <popey> My main concern is the lack of direct measurable contribution to Ubuntu.
[12:19] <FrozenZia> Did definitely *not* mean to create extra e-mail for everyone.
[12:20] <popey> It's fine, we don't get much email on that list :D
[12:21] <FrozenZia> popey: understandable about the measurable contribution.
[12:21] <popey> Typically we go through the wiki page and look at the contributions.
[12:21] <popey> Like translations in launchpad, forum posts, blog entries and so on.
[12:22] <FrozenZia> I could dig up some numbers of computers that are now "out in the wild" with Ubuntu installed due to my efforts, but it'd just be me "saying" that's how many are out there.
[12:22] <popey> Right, you understand our problem then :)
[12:22] <marcoceppi> FrozenZia: do you have any plans outside of a potential oggcamp talk and your current efforts with computers for the next 6 months in the Ubuntu universe?
[12:23] <FrozenZia> ...and as Walter said, due to this, you would be largely looking at testimonials, which I suspect I haven't actually managed to get very many of.
[12:24] <FrozenZia> marcoceppi: Definitely very interested in participating in translations.
[12:25] <marcoceppi> Any other questions for FrozenZia, FrozenZia any comments before going to a vote?
[12:25] <FrozenZia> A comment I sent to Walter earlier, and so I *think* you have all seen...
[12:25] <hggdh> FrozenZia: I would like to hear more about your plans
[12:27] <FrozenZia> hggdh: First the comment -- that I really am spending *so* much of my time in getting this business off the ground, and providing tech support for the machines we already have sold, that there's not a lot of time to do much else.
[12:28] <FrozenZia> hggdh: Hmmm -- not sure what to tell you --
[12:28] <FrozenZia> We've just moved our company out of a cellar and into a "real" premesis, so we've got LOTS more visibility,
[12:28] <hggdh> FrozenZia: that's OK. The thing that worries me is a mix of shown sustainable work on Ubuntu
[12:29] <hggdh> FrozenZia: We measure contributions to Ubuntu here...
[12:31] <FrozenZia> what with the current refugee stuff going on we're contacting refugee -facilities and trying to provide them with machines for refugees to use while there,...
[12:31] <hggdh> FrozenZia: I am personally inclined to suggest you wait a bit more while you collect data on your Ubuntu contributions
[12:31] <FrozenZia> At this point, it's the advocacy.
[12:32] <Kilos> FrozenZia imo you have the potential to be a great ubuntu member, you just need some more to add in contributions to ubuntu itself
[12:33] <Kilos> like translations are needed all the time
[12:33] <hggdh> FrozenZia: which we need to be able to check; if we cannot check, we cannot validate it to the point we accept your work in Ubuntu as *both* sustained and significant
[12:33] <FrozenZia> I have a few bug reports, comments on some, some forum input, but they're really nothing compared to the other work I've done.
[12:34] <FrozenZia> hggdh: Kilos: yep, disappointing, but understandable.
[12:34] <marcoceppi> #vote FrozenZia
[12:34] <meetingology> Please vote on: FrozenZia
[12:34] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname)
[12:35] <popey> -1
[12:35] <meetingology> -1 received from popey
[12:35] <Kilos> 0
[12:35] <meetingology> 0 received from Kilos
[12:35] <hggdh> +0 I cannot really validate the two keywords for membership: sustained and significant
[12:35] <meetingology> +0 I cannot really validate the two keywords for membership: sustained and significant received from hggdh
[12:36] <marcoceppi> -1 I think you've got a great start. Keep up the advocacy and help share your knowledge/translations skill with the project and reapply again in the comming months!
[12:36] <meetingology> -1 I think you've got a great start. Keep up the advocacy and help share your knowledge/translations skill with the project and reapply again in the comming months! received from marcoceppi
[12:36] <Kilos> FrozenZia do a bit more thats visible to us please and try again
[12:36] <marcoceppi> #endvote
[12:36] <meetingology> Voting ended on: FrozenZia
[12:36] <meetingology> Votes for:0 Votes against:2 Abstentions:2
[12:36] <meetingology> Motion denied
[12:36] <Kilos> FrozenZia dont give up
[12:37] <FrozenZia> When trying again "later", what sort of time-frame would you suggest?
[12:37] <hggdh> FrozenZia: you *ARE* on the right track. But we need to confirm you work. Please do come back in a few months
[12:37] <marcoceppi> Thank you FrozenZia for taking time to apply, we appreciate all you've done so far but feel a little more sustained contributions would be good to show
[12:37] <popey> we usually recommend coming back in ~3 months or more
[12:37] <FrozenZia> See you all in January, then. =o)
[12:37] <Kilos> thanks so far fo
[12:37] <marcoceppi> FrozenZia: we look forward to it!
[12:38] <Kilos> yes we do
[12:38] <marcoceppi> Okay, without further ado!
[12:38] <Kilos> hit them translations
[12:38] <marcoceppi> #subtopic dupingping
[12:38]  * FrozenZia thanks all for their time.
[12:38] <popey> Thanks FrozenZia
[12:38] <Kilos> yw
[12:38] <marcoceppi> dupingping: welcome, please take a few lines to introduce yourself
[12:38] <hggdh> FrozenZia: I expect you back here :-)
[12:38] <dupingping> Hi, all. i'm here.
[12:39] <dupingping> yes, I'm from china.
[12:39] <dupingping> I have no jobs now in any company.
[12:40] <marcoceppi> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DuPingping
[12:41] <dupingping> And i am just contributing for Ubuntu.
[12:41] <dupingping> I worked on Ubuntu precise and trusty.
[12:41] <dupingping> I created two Ubuntu softwares.
[12:41] <dupingping> Ubuntu Dock and Sticky Notes.
[12:41] <dupingping> They are all only for Ubuntu.
[12:41] <dupingping> And I worked on gtk3 and some others.
[12:41] <dupingping> I know about compiz how to work, So i made some patches for metacity, that runs as compiz
[12:41] <dupingping> I have my own site, http://korsoftware.com
[12:41] <dupingping> I have a critical bug fix patch for precise.
[12:42] <dupingping> yes, it's my Ubuntu wiki written by me.
[12:42] <dupingping> I worked on askubuntu, too.
[12:42] <dupingping> So i made good answers and questions many peoples like them.
[12:43] <dupingping> I wish Ubuntu become a first Desktop OS in the world. I think it's possible completely.
[12:44] <dupingping> I wrote about it on the my own site.
[12:44] <popey> Nice to see the AskUbuntu answers!
[12:44] <dupingping> thank you, popey
[12:45] <dupingping> And i also worked on askubuntu as a reviewer for first question and answers.
[12:45] <dupingping> So i got many budgets includes gold budget.
[12:46] <marcoceppi> dupingping: Nice job on getting the Steward badge for review
[12:46] <popey> Yeah, collecting badges on AskUbuntu is addictive :)
[12:46] <dupingping> I can show you metacity patch to make metacity runs as compiz with wave effect and scale effect when window is resized.
[12:46] <dupingping> marcoceppi, thank you.
[12:47] <marcoceppi> dupingping: I see you've created apps for Ubuntu desktop, have you considered doing the same for the Ubuntu Phone?
[12:47] <dupingping> Not yet on Ubuntu phone. but i plan to make some apps on Ubuntu Phone.
[12:48] <dupingping> I'm really professor for C and gtk3 programming.
[12:48] <popey> Is Ubuntu Dock based on some other software, or did you write it all yourself?
[12:48] <dupingping> of course, by myself. from scratch.
[12:48] <dupingping> I can show you the source fully to you.
[12:49] <dupingping> If i created it based on another softwares, i'll not created anyone.
[12:50] <dupingping> I always think not same as another persons.
[12:50] <dupingping> I'll explain you why i created them on Ubuntu?
[12:51] <popey> No, I don't need to see the source, I believe you :)
[12:51] <dupingping> I want to make Ubuntu to the most beautiful and most useful OS in the world.
[12:51] <dupingping> :) thank you.
[12:52] <marcoceppi> #vote dupingping
[12:52] <meetingology> Please vote on: dupingping
[12:52] <meetingology> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (for private voting, private message me with 'vote +1/-1/+0 #channelname)
[12:52] <Kilos> dupingping ty for all your hard work so far
[12:52] <Kilos> +1
[12:52] <meetingology> +1 received from Kilos
[12:52] <popey> +1
[12:52] <meetingology> +1 received from popey
[12:52] <popey> Would love to see some translations - especially on the phone apps :D
[12:52] <dupingping> Thank you Kilos and popey.
[12:52] <hggdh> +1 please also try to join a Local community if at all possible
[12:52] <meetingology> +1 please also try to join a Local community if at all possible received from hggdh
[12:52] <marcoceppi> +1
[12:52] <meetingology> +1 received from marcoceppi
[12:52] <dupingping> Thank you for all.
[12:52] <marcoceppi> #endvote
[12:52] <meetingology> Voting ended on: dupingping
[12:52] <meetingology> Votes for:4 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0
[12:52] <meetingology> Motion carried
[12:53] <hggdh> dupingping: welcome in!
[12:53] <marcoceppi> Keep up the great work!
[12:53] <dupingping> Thank you very much.
[12:53] <dupingping> I like Ubuntu and work on Ubuntu.
[12:53] <Kilos> congratulations dupingping and welcome to the members
[12:53] <FrozenZia> Congrats dupingping!
[12:53] <dupingping> that's greatest news in my life.
[12:54] <hggdh> dupingping: we are happy with you :-)
[12:54] <popey> \o/
[12:54] <Kilos> we are happy to have you with us
[12:54] <dupingping> Now i'm a Ubuntu Member?
[12:54] <hggdh> dupingping: yes you are
[12:54] <popey> once someone adds you to the group on launchpad, yes
[12:54] <dupingping> Now what do i do since now?
[12:54] <popey> Keep doing awesome things!
[12:54] <dupingping> that's great.
[12:54] <Kilos> yes dont stop
[12:55] <dupingping> yes i'll continue
[12:55] <marcoceppi> No one else is on the list and we're nearing the top of the hour, thank you FrozenZia and dupingping for applying and to popey Kilos and hggdh for being present
[12:55] <marcoceppi> #endmeeting
[12:55] <meetingology> Meeting ended Wed Oct 21 12:55:14 2015 UTC.
[12:55] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2015/ubuntu-meeting.2015-10-21-12.04.moin.txt
[12:55] <Kilos> join a loco if you can and keep active
[12:55] <dupingping> just a question to you. possible?
[12:55] <FrozenZia> Hey 1 question.
[12:55] <Kilos> ty marcoceppi for chairing for us
[12:55] <Kilos> yes dupingping
[12:56] <marcoceppi> Sorry, didn't mean to close so soon. dupingping FrozenZia we're still here, go for it
[12:56] <dupingping> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership shows me certification card image.
[12:56] <dupingping> How can i get certification card?
[12:56] <marcoceppi> dupingping: fill out this form: https://forms.canonical.com/certificate/
[12:57] <FrozenZia> I noticed in a map of ubuntu members that there's someone close to me -- any way to find out who that is? Or send them *my* contact info and a request to get in touch?
[12:57] <dupingping> yes, i'll do it.
[12:57] <marcoceppi> FrozenZia: that's a good question. I don't think there is a way - popey?
[12:58] <Kilos> is there a loco in finland?
[12:58] <popey> no
[12:58] <popey> You should contact the loco
[12:58] <FrozenZia> 'Course now I started thinking of alternatives -- ad in the local paper, "Do you Ubuntu?"
[12:58] <FrozenZia> popey: alright, will do that.
[12:59] <Kilos> FrozenZia you can also look for lugs there
[12:59] <Kilos> all lugs have ubuntu users in them
[12:59] <FrozenZia> Thanks again, and I guess see at least popey in OggCamp!
[13:01] <dupingping> Please help me, just one question.
[13:01] <dupingping> I went to https://forms.canonical.com/certificate/
[13:01] <dupingping> And it request me enter verification code.
[13:01] <dupingping> what is it?
[13:01] <popey> uh, really?
[13:02] <dupingping> yes, popey.
[13:02] <popey> That's odd.
[13:02] <dupingping> How can i recover the verification code?
[13:02] <popey> Only Canonical employees should have to do that.
[13:02] <popey> if you go to https://login.ubuntu.com/device-list do you see any devices listed?
[13:03] <popey> like a 2-factor auth device
[13:03] <Kilos> i think she must first have membership activated guys?
[13:03] <popey> there is that too :)
[13:03] <popey> dupingping is in ~ubuntumembers
[13:04] <Kilos> elacheche normally does it quick
[13:04] <popey> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntumembers
[13:04] <Kilos> cool
[13:04] <dupingping> yes, let me try.
[13:04] <popey> try going to the form again dupingping
[13:06] <dupingping> to modify the device, it request me enter the verification code.
[13:07] <popey> ok, try the form again?
[13:07] <popey> https://forms.canonical.com/certificate/
[13:07] <dupingping> let me try again.
[13:07] <dupingping> it shows me "Type your verification code" again,
[13:08] <dupingping> perhaps, i forgot my verification code.
[13:08] <popey> is it asking for a code that you get sent via email?
[13:08] <popey> is there an option to re-send it?
[13:08] <dupingping> yes, let me try again.
[13:10] <dupingping> where i can ask my code? so i can get the code via my email?
[13:11] <popey> dupingping: does it look like this? http://imgur.com/absPmXS
[13:11] <dupingping> right
[13:11] <popey> the same?
[13:11] <dupingping> yes
[13:12] <popey> okay
[13:12] <dupingping> I need have any device?
[13:12] <popey> Have you ever worked for Canonical?
[13:13] <dupingping> yes. i am contributing for ubunut.
[13:13] <Kilos> dupingping dont forget you are always welcome on the africa channel
[13:13] <Kilos> cheers everyone
[13:13] <dupingping> Kilos, yes, right.
[13:13] <dupingping> popey, at the page, what code i need to enter?
[13:14] <popey> dupingping: you should not be getting that page
[13:14] <popey> dupingping: I am talking to our technical people, it might take some time to fix.
[13:15] <popey> dupingping: can you drop me an email -<EMAIL_ADDRESS>and I will follow up a little later.
[13:15] <dupingping> yes, i'll do it, popey.
[13:16] <popey> thanks
[13:16] <popey> I'll follow up with our technical people
[13:16] <dupingping> see you later. thank you today.
[13:16] <popey> o/
[13:16] <dupingping> lol
[15:37] <dupingping> Hi, popey.
[15:38] <popey> dupingping: hey
[15:38] <dupingping> oh, my account was suspended.
[15:38] <dupingping> :(
[15:38] <dupingping> I tried to enter my verification code many and many times.
[15:39] <popey> oh dear.
[15:39] <dupingping> and it shows me your account is suspended.
[15:39] <popey> can you join #canonical-sysadmin ?
[15:39] <dupingping> let me try.
[15:39] <dupingping> good, logged in.


[09:43] <ailo> Len-nb: I'm trying to change IRQ for my pci devices, but nothing happens
[09:43] <ailo> I find that there's a lot to learn about IRQ on my account, as I'm reading more about it
[09:43] <ailo> What are they exactly, and how does the kernel handle them
[09:43] <ailo> So, I'm unable to reproduce your config right now
[09:44] <ailo> I mean, I'm unable to reproduce your problem with xruns
[09:45] <ailo> Len-nb: When you changed the order between your audio device and your eth card, you did that in the bios, right?
[09:45] <ailo> You'll be sleeping now, but just let me know when you read this :)
[10:42] <ailo> Anybody notice how flash just changed?
[10:44] <ailo> Everythings handled by the totem plugin, only not everything works anymore
[14:15] <ailo> Len-nb: Well, on this machine, the only way to achieve the same type of situation with the irq's was having the pci cards placed in a certain order to have my wifi be ahead of my audio card. But, with this machine, that seems to have improved performance for me, cause now my audio device is not sharing irq with anything else
[14:17] <ailo> I will have to test on other machines. Also, do we know for sure that the order of the IRQ's matter?
[14:18] <ailo> I know there are two kinds of interrupts. Short and long ones. The short ones will interrupt everything else and spit out it's full message, while long ones will push out their message in parets
[14:18] <ailo> parts*
[14:19] <ailo> I'm not getting any xruns either way
[14:19] <ailo> I was getting xruns because of pulseaudio though
[14:19] <ailo> So, I'm not using the jack bridge
[14:59] <Len-nb> ailo, irq setup is somewhat hardware dependant. there has been a standard chip that has been used since the original ibm pc.
[15:01] <Len-nb> the pc had 8 irqs and then shortly after they found that was not enough and so used two of the same chip.
[15:04] <Len-nb> then someone made another chip that can handle up to 256 irqs, but it handles things the same way and they only use 24 of them.
[15:06] <Len-nb> In any case, if there are more than one interrupt the highest number interrupt blocks lower numbers untill the cpu resets it.
[15:06] <Len-nb> This is a physical thing.
[15:13] <Len-nb> Huh, he's gone
[16:02] <Len-nb> ailo, did you see anything i said?
[16:24] <ailo> Len-nb: Ok, but did you change your irq's using the bios, or you just switched places with your pci cards?
[16:25] <ailo> For me changing irq's in the bios has had no effect
[16:25] <ailo> I will need to see with other machines, if it's the same thing
[16:26] <Len-nb> ailo, on my MB I had to change the card position PCIe is different again
[16:26] <Len-nb> I think it is all done by central chip
[16:27] <Len-nb> I can "reserve" an irq with bios, but not set it for a card.
[16:28] <ailo> I have an old ASUS board on which I remember being able to change IRQ for a bunch of devices. Will try today to see what that does
[16:28] <Len-nb> Mine is a one bit or something like that.
[16:30] <Len-nb> The other odd thing is that the bios shows irqs at boot, but they are different from what linux says they are.
[16:31] <ailo> I have a dim recollection of Linux preparing its own irq
[16:32] <ailo> In which case, the bios has no effect
[16:33] <ailo> Len-nb: Do you have problems with flash-player?
[16:33] <ailo> I'm a bit annoyed by suddenly having totem handling flash. It doesn't do it very well
[16:45] <Len-nb> My wife seems to have had problems... more so with firefox than chromium
[16:45] <ailo> Firefox and chromium behaves a bit differently, but they are both using a totem plugin instead of flash
[16:46] <ailo> I wasn't able to change that in the browser itself
[16:46] <Len-nb> Hmm.
[16:46] <ailo> It claims to be using flash, but it's not
[16:46] <Len-nb> It is true that when I installed there was no flash DL.
[16:47] <ailo> youtube works fine, but any autoplay flash does not autoplay, and stuff that requires a more recent flash does not work. Just like it is using gnash
[16:47] <Len-nb> The thing to do is find a page that uses a part of flash that totom doesn't handle. Then it should download the real one.
[16:47] <ailo> I have flash installed
[16:47] <ailo> This is not a flash problem
[16:47] <ailo> It's a Ubuntu problem
[16:48] <Len-nb> Surprise!
[16:48] <ailo> This happened after I updated last
[16:48] <ailo> I double checked to see if Wheezy was suffering from the same thing. It's gotta be some kind of config somehwere that is new to Ubuntu
[16:48] <Len-nb> Ubunu
[16:49] <Len-nb> toops ubuntu is trying to be all free lic.
[16:50] <ailo> I don't think so. Debian is, by making it possible to install a kernel without non-free firmware
[16:50] <ailo> Ubuntu is not doing that to my knowledge
[16:51] <ailo> Flash is pain in the but
[16:51] <Len-nb> ubuntu tries to make it's ISOs all free lic., but offer the non-free in repo.
[16:52] <ailo> The kernel itself is non-free, so I still don't think so
[16:52] <Len-nb> Esp. for anything that might be illegal in some country
[16:52] <ailo> Also, I had flash working for months. This happened after the final release
[16:53] <ailo> Anyway, I've been trying to find anyone else complaining about it. That is why I'm asking
[16:53] <Len-nb> While I was watching #ubuntu-release they had a list of thing to release post 12.04
[16:54] <Len-nb> I did notice when we first went live dvd that a lot of flash stuff worked right out of the box, but the "you need to install flash" prompt still came up.
[16:55] <Len-nb> Maybe they have "fixed" that.
[16:55] <Len-nb> anyway, I have to go. by now.
[17:47] <ailo> Does someone have 4+ GB RAM? Would be good to see if the -lowlatency pae is a pae, or if the -generic pae is a pae
[18:45] <micahg> umm, both are PAE kernels?
[19:57] <ailo> micahg: According to Ralph on the mail list he's not able to locate all of his memory
[20:01] <micahg> ailo: what's the subect/
[20:01] <micahg> *subject
[20:09] <ailo> micahg: "no audio output using Precise due to Pulseaudio?"
[20:09] <ailo> He just mentions this in one of his replies
[20:11] <micahg> an upgrade from oneiric won't switch to the PAE kernel, the user has to do that


[00:11] <snap-l> Hah, that's awesome.
[00:17] <snap-l> Pretty sure this isn't Jaco Pastorious: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/9058804/jaco.png
[01:54] <jjesse> evening
[01:56] <rick_h__> evening
[02:29] <_stink_> yo
[02:33] <jjesse> yo
[03:55] <snap-l> yo
[12:22] <Wolfger> morning
[12:59] <brousch> http://hipstergrammers.tumblr.com
[13:15] <rick_h__> yea, was checking that out last night. Funny stuff
[13:41] <Wolfger> http://programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/127263/how-to-enable-proxy-python
[13:47] <brousch> is it normal dbus-daemon to be using 500MB of RAM?
[13:51] <Wolfger> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus/+bug/295741
[13:51] <Wolfger> Define "normal"
[13:54] <Wolfger> Google indicates it's fairly "normal" for people to complain about dbus memory leaks
[13:57] <rick_h__> heh, awesome
[13:57] <Wolfger> Least insightful answer ever: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=91455
[13:57] <rick_h__> Blazeix: snap-l widox_ reminder CHC is early edition tonight 7pm
[14:06] <Wolfger> Geez... skip a couple CHC's and they drop you off the reminder list
[14:07] <Wolfger> s/a couple/all/
[14:09] <brousch> aparently restarting dbus makes some things not happy
[14:10] <rick_h__> Wolfger: a couple? :P
[14:10] <rick_h__> yea, I try to be inclusive, but I do give up after a while
[14:12] <Wolfger> rick_h__: don't blame you
[14:16] <rick_h__> smoser: http://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/nrtlf/i_created_an_opensource_alternative_to/
[14:35] <snap-l> Good morning
[14:38] <Wolfger> Good morning
[14:58] <snap-l> How's the morning so far?
[14:58] <jjesse> ok
[14:58] <jjesse> roof guys just showed up to start the process of a new roof
[14:58] <jjesse> so i'm glad there is no snow
[15:01] <snap-l> Yeah, that's a good thing
[15:01] <snap-l> we got snow pretty much all day yesterday, but it didn't stick.
[15:01] <snap-l> (thankfully)
[15:32] <snap-l> Anbody want the shittiest VB book? http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0136060722/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=decafbadnet-20&linkCode=as2&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=0136060722
[15:33] <brousch> ooooh, only $0.16
[15:33] <snap-l> I'll send it to you for free
[15:34] <brousch> isn't it pointless to sell for less than like $2.30 because of fees?
[15:34] <snap-l> brousch: Well, they take it out of the shipping credt
[15:36] <brousch> i think when i last sold on there i determined that if i sold at $2.30 i would end up with $1
[15:36] <brousch> hardly worth the hassle of boxing it up and shipping
[15:36] <brousch> less than minimum wage
[15:37] <snap-l> Yeah, at that point you're just aiming to get it out of the house
[15:37] <snap-l> honestly, anything that I put up on Amazon is just gravy
[15:37] <brousch> i can get it out of the house by dropping it off at the goodwill
[15:38] <snap-l> Well, JoDee is going to take it to OU, with a note
[15:39] <snap-l> I'm sorry you have to take this abortion of a class. Here's the abortion of a book to go with it with my compliments.
[15:45]  * ColonelPanic001 kills krunner
[15:46] <ColonelPanic001> kworker, sorry
[15:46] <ColonelPanic001> too much kde for me
[16:12] <Wolfger> killing kworkers is frowned upon by management
[16:25] <snap-l> Coders at Work is $10 eBook today.
[16:25] <snap-l> HIGHLY recommended.
[16:25] <snap-l> http://www.apress.com/dailydeals/index/view/id/50/url/aHR0cDovL3d3dy5hcHJlc3MuY29tLzk3ODE0MzAyMTk0ODQ/
[16:27] <Wolfger> No Larry Wall? --
[16:27] <snap-l> Eh?
[16:27] <Wolfger> "15 of the most interesting computer programmers alive today"
[16:28] <Wolfger> Larry Wall has got to be on that list
[16:28] <Wolfger> unless he passed away and I didn't know
[16:30] <brousch> well it's official. this ancient p3 can run xubuntu with 256M of RAM
[16:30] <snap-l> I think they had enough curmudgeonly programmers with the JWZ interview that they wanted to give some more positive spin on the profession. ;)
[16:30] <Wolfger> sweet
[16:30] <brousch> however it struggled with youtube because of the animated ads
[16:31] <Wolfger> snap-l: curmudgeonly? I never thought so...
[16:33] <Wolfger> but, uh, it's Founders at work for $10, not Coders at Work
[16:33] <Wolfger> unless I'm reading that page wrong.
[16:33] <snap-l> Wolfger: I think you're seriously reading that wrong.
[16:34] <snap-l> Either that, or they're giving you another deal.
[16:35] <Wolfger> Huh. I closed the tab and reopened it, and now it's Coders at Work for $10
[16:37] <brousch> hah, chrome w/ adblock can play youtube OK as long as you don't move the mouse
[16:41] <brousch> krondor: you use xbmc?
[16:41] <krondor> brousch:  Aye, I'm a huge xbmc addict for a long time now
[16:41] <brousch> i'm looking for a media center program for a big workstation i acquired
[16:42] <brousch> was going to try boxee, but they just announced that they are cutting off linux version
[16:43] <brousch> you just slap it on ubuntu 11.10?
[16:43] <krondor> yeah I'm running it on ubuntu 11.10 and a jailbroke atv2 (which I wouldn't recommend)
[16:44] <brousch> i don't care about the TV tuner part, i mostly just want to server music and stored videos
[16:45] <krondor> if you liked boxee you'll like xbmc, but maybe you'll miss the social features
[16:45] <krondor> I never used them in boxee
[16:45] <brousch> bleh, social
[16:45] <brousch> channels would be nice, but aren't strictly needed
[16:45] <brousch> like netlfix, hulu, etc
[16:46] <brousch> this damn thing has 8 cores and 5x750MB drives
[16:46] <krondor> mythtv has increasingly good support for xbmc as a frontend, but I haven't used a dvr (or myth) in some time
[16:48] <krondor> there are plugins for hulu/netflix in xbmc, but netflix needs windows not linux (damn silverlight)
[16:48] <brousch> that's ok, i use the wii now
[16:49] <Wolfger> what, moonlight doesn't work? ;-)
[16:49] <brousch> or my chromebook or my nookcolor
[16:49] <devinheitmueller> Wolfger: Moonlight doesn't include the DRM support required or Netflix.
[16:49] <krondor> there is an amazon prime video plugin for xbmc though that does work in linux, but it's kind of beta
[16:49] <rick_h__> party everyone
[16:49] <rick_h__> krondor: 7pm CHC tonight if you're bored
[16:50] <krondor> hope to be there :)
[16:51] <rick_h__> awesome
[16:51] <krondor> brousch:  best thing about xbmc over boxee is the mysql backend for synchronized media data
[16:51] <krondor> lifehacker had a good writeup http://lifehacker.com/5634515/how-to-synchronize-your-xbmc-media-center-across-every-room-in-the-house
[16:53] <brousch> an, so i can install the client on my laptop and still view stuff from my server?
[16:54] <brousch> heh, article also links 2 others i need to read
[16:55] <krondor> brousch:  yeah, the xbmc wiki is nice too. well maintained particularly the advanced settings.xml functions.
[18:06] <snap-l> Just had my little niece over here
[18:06] <rick_h__> nice
[18:06] <snap-l> Yeah, she's adorable
[18:06] <snap-l> you can see her testing my bro-in-law
[18:07] <snap-l> She was folding over and chewing on the carpet
[18:08] <snap-l> and she was testinghim to see if he'd relent
[18:09] <rick_h__> heh, yea that's fun
[18:09] <rick_h__> we're getting the head butting on the floor once in a while
[18:12] <snap-l> They'll definitely do everything in their power to test their boundaries
[18:13] <rick_h__> yea, Michael is officially 2 today.
[18:18] <brousch> fours aren't so bad so far
[18:25] <Wolfger> speaking only as an "uncle", 3 is the worst age
[18:26] <Wolfger> speaking of kids.... I'm going to spam you all now. :-)
[18:27] <Wolfger> My best friend recently published his first children's book, done completely on free software (Kubuntu, Gimp, etc)  http://www.amazon.com/Zombielocks-Daniel-M-Pipe-II/dp/146642348X/ref=sr_1_1
[18:28] <Wolfger> There's also a non-Amazon link for the Amazon haters. I'll dig it out if anybody wants it.
[18:31] <snap-l> Interesting.
[18:32] <brousch> looks creepy
[19:25] <rick_h__> bah, looks like router wireless is gone...booo. Router reboots, works over wire, but wireless won't connect any more
[19:25]  * rick_h__ plays taps for the ole 54GL that's been running tomato for years now
[19:29] <krondor> I recommend Buffalo they're cheap and support DD-WRT ootb
[19:30] <rick_h__> yea, see their list
[19:30] <rick_h__> but the links don't match the search terms, strange
[19:39] <krondor> this is what I'm running; http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16833162031
[19:44] <krondor> hmm, but reading the reviews maybe you don't want that lol.  Not a lot of good things said about the v2 model
[19:49] <snap-l> I've been kicking around getting a faster router, but haven't as of yet because I love Tomato
[20:18] <rick_h__> yea, while I don't run a custom firmware on it, I do like my cisco/linksys N router I got a while back
[20:18] <rick_h__> thinking of just getting the replacement for that model
[20:19] <rick_h__> I don't tend to really do a ton with the router these days. I've got servers for all that stuff. Just port forward things you stupid router
[20:20] <rick_h__> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001SEL36M/ref=wms_ohs_product is what I have for my "roku only" router
[20:21] <rick_h__> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004T9RR7C/ref=wms_ohs_product is what I'm going to grab I think for the every day device use replacement
[21:28] <brousch> can ya'll see these photo galleries? https://picasaweb.google.com/102663141609195877664
[22:10] <snap-l> Hmm, not seeing much tomato support for N routers
[22:17] <rick_h__> +
[22:22] <snap-l> Looking at the Tomato USB pages.
[22:25] <jrwren> i'm disappointed in router firmwares.
[22:25] <jrwren> openwrt, ddwrt, tomatousb all seem to have died IMO.
[22:25] <jrwren> they stopped adding cool things.
[22:25] <jrwren> I'm back to a "server" firewall.
[22:26] <snap-l> Well, it seems that all of the firmware development hasn't really made it to the N routers
[22:27] <jrwren> oh no, ddwrt supports lots of n routers.
[22:27] <jrwren> and openwrt supports a good few.
[22:27] <snap-l> Right, but tomato doesn't.
[22:27] <jrwren> right.
[22:27] <snap-l> and I like Tomato
[22:27] <jrwren> tomatousb seems to have the least support.
[22:27] <jrwren> i like tomoto teh best too.
[22:28] <jrwren> although in principle i should like openwrt
[22:28] <jrwren> but i find its difficult to use is so great it outweighs the principles of the matter.
[22:39] <snap-l> Any opinions on the NETGEAR WNR3500L?


[08:04] <juliank> @pilot in
[18:42] <mfo> ubuntu-meta in noble needs changes [1] for SRU bug 2039328. please, could someone more experienced and with devel upload rights review/sponsor to noble, if it's correct?  thanks!
[18:42] -ubottu:#ubuntu-devel- Bug 2039328 in ubuntu-meta (Ubuntu Noble) "Update ubuntu-meta with promotions done between last ubuntu-meta build & release" [Medium, Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2039328
[18:42] <mfo> [1] https://code.launchpad.net/~mfo/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-meta/+git/ubuntu-meta/+merge/455081