[00:38] <igc> morning all
[00:42] <jelmer> hi Ian
[00:42] <jelmer> lifeless: it looks ok, but it seems like the check patch is significantly changeed, not just polished?
[00:43] <igc> hi jelmer. Thanks that your reviews over the weekend. Much appreciated
[00:43] <igc> morning lifeless
[00:44] <jelmer> igc: svn-keywords is already partially working :-)
[00:44] <igc> jelmer: I'm actually keen to get bzr-keywords into the core as well, so you can assume that code is there and build on it
[00:45] <igc> jelmer: now that the fallback bit is in place, you'll only need to register how to expand the keywords I think
[00:45] <igc> jelmer: and you get the sweet publishing features in bzr-keywords for free as well
[00:46] <igc> next weekend maybe :-)
[00:47] <stbuehler> jelmer: saw my feedback for svn / dpush ?
[00:47] <jelmer> stbuehler: hi
[00:47] <jelmer> stbuehler: where?
[00:47] <jelmer> (I haven't seen anything yet)
[00:48] <stbuehler>  jelmer: just wanted to give some feedback: bzr dpush does *not* give you the svn-revisions back, even if you had new commits pushed to upstream svn
[00:49] <stbuehler> perhaps that works if you never used the normal push, didn't try that
[00:49] <stbuehler> seems like i cannot force bzr to rebase to the svn branch
[00:50] <jelmer> stbuehler: no, it doesn't as that would require changing existing revisions; we can keep a map though and display that sort of information
[00:51] <lifeless> jelmer: yes, 0.9.5 to 0.9.6 added a special linker script
[00:51] <stbuehler> i wouldn't mind changing them, if it where an option :)
[00:52] <jelmer> stbuehler: can you please file a bug report about this? I'll try to get it fixed for the next version
[00:53] <stbuehler> jelmer: so dpush should change existing revisions? k, let me try :)
[00:54] <jelmer> stbuehler: yeah, dpush basically pushes all revisions into the remote repository
[00:55] <jelmer> stbuehler: and then fetches the revisions that were created remotely and overwrites the local revisions with them
[00:58] <jelmer> stbuehler: push (by definition) only changes the remote revision
[00:58] <jelmer> s/revision/branch/
[00:59] <stbuehler> yes, that is perfectly valid :)
[01:02] <lifeless> jelmer: the 0.9.6 patch is polish from the subunit point of view, its just updating against the check project
[01:18] <jelmer> stbuehler: oh, maybe I misunderstood
[01:18] <jelmer> stbuehler: dpush won't change any previously "bzr push"'ed revisions of course
[01:19] <jelmer> it only affects revisions not yet in svn in any form
[01:23] <stbuehler> i mentioned i "dpush"ed new commits, which were not in svn
[01:23] <stbuehler> but maybe it only works if you never used "push"
[01:24] <jelmer> stbuehler: sorry
[01:25] <jelmer> stbuehler: it should work fine if older revisions were pushed
[01:25] <jelmer> stbuehler: is this repo public?
[01:25] <stbuehler> svn://svn.lighttpd.net/spawn-fcgi/trunk
[01:26] <jelmer> thanks
[01:28] <jelmer> stbuehler: ok, I figured out what's happening, this shouldn't be too hard to fix
[01:47] <jelmer> lifeless: btw, I hope to split out libtorture from samba at some point
[01:48] <jelmer> so we can use that in bitlbee, ctrlproxy, etc in favor of libcheck
[01:48] <lifeless> jelmer: thats your C testing infrastructure?
[01:48] <jelmer> lifeless: yep
[01:48] <jelmer> it already does subunit
[01:48] <lifeless> jelmer: I'd be inclined to put patches into libcheck, the fork isolation really is nice
[01:49] <jelmer> lifeless: is there any chance of your subunit patch actually making it into libcheck?
[01:49] <lifeless> jelmer: yes
[01:50] <lifeless> I've resubmitted it, chris pickett has ack'd that they were being overly nitpicky
[01:51] <jelmer> hmm
[01:54] <lifeless> entry point to the recent dicussion http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_name=1235597368.24285.63.camel%40lifeless-64
[01:54] <lifeless> its a terrible list archive ui
[01:59] <jelmer> ah, cool
[02:24] <jelmer> bleh, sf svn is still slow :-(
[02:24] <jelmer> lifeless: you are using bzr-svn for check development, right ? >-)
[02:24] <lifeless> jelmer: yes, do you want me to push trunk in bzr format somewhere?
[02:25] <jelmer> lifeless: yes, if it's not too much trouble
[02:25] <lifeless> sure thing
[02:26] <jelmer> I can do a pull myself, but it looks like it's going to take at least 30 min at this rate..
[02:27] <lifeless> there is a  https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~vcs-imports/check/trunk :)
[02:28] <jelmer> lifeless: except that imports from CVS, and hasn't been updated since 2005 :-)
[02:29] <lifeless> heh. we should redirect it then :) . bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Elifeless/check/svn
[02:29] <lifeless> pushing my subunit branch now
[02:30] <jelmer> lifeless: thanks
[02:32] <lifeless> jelmer: bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lifeless/check/subunit
[02:34] <jelmer> got it
[02:34] <jelmer> did launchpad just upgrade to 1.13 or something?
[02:34] <lifeless> not for 2 more days
[02:35] <jelmer> it's too freakishly fast all of a sudden
[02:38] <spiv> Last week bzr.dev got a fix for a performance bug when pushing to pre-1.13 servers, maybe it's that?
[02:38] <lifeless> I think jelmer was pulling :)
[02:39] <jelmer> well, pushing was the main thing that got faster
[02:39] <jelmer> I pushed a 130Mb repo to lp in < 1m
[02:42] <lifeless> that would be spiv's fix
[02:45] <spiv> :)
[03:25] <lifeless> lunch, back soon
[03:42] <jml> lifeless: the only subunit branch up for review I see is https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~radix/subunit/report-errors-better/+merge/4292
[03:42] <lifeless> jml: jelmer reviewed the polish branch
[03:42] <jml> oh cool.
[04:02] <lifeless> jml: if you didn't get notice about the subunit branch, are you subscribed appropriately to trunk ?
[04:25] <thumper> lifeless: what would cause a knit to become corrupt and raise SHA1KnitCorrupt when calling show_log?
[04:26] <lifeless> an actual knit?
[04:26] <lifeless> or something in a pack?
[04:30] <lifeless> thumper: ^
[04:34] <ovnicraft> hi folks. is it posible configure bzr with emacs to commit comments?
[04:43] <bob2> ovnicraft: recent emacs has vc-bzr built in
[04:47]  * igc lunch
[04:52] <ovnicraft> bob2, yep i got it thx
[04:57] <beuno> igc, hi
[04:58] <beuno> I was looking at your mergeline cache RFC supersede your plugin?
[05:01] <lifeless> tracked down the commit failure
[05:02] <lifeless> [bah]
[05:25] <igc> hi beuno
[05:31] <beuno> hey igc
[05:32] <beuno> how are you?
[05:33] <igc> beuno: flat out - trying hard to make our next-gen the best it can be
[05:34] <igc> beuno: no, it doesn't supercede it - it helps it though
[05:34] <beuno> igc, I've seen. It's impressive work
[05:35] <beuno> ok, good, because I was about to spend the weekend working on loggerhead + your plugin to get them working well together
[05:35] <igc> beuno: there's still a need for caching the full history to make log *really* fast - that the revnocache
[05:35] <beuno> I obviously got sidetracked by RL, but was very clse  :)
[05:35] <beuno> *cloase
[05:35] <igc> the mergeline case helps *one* special but importasnt case - lookup of a single non-mainline revno
[05:35] <beuno> hotcha
[05:36] <beuno> (typing sucking)
[05:36] <beuno> I see
[05:36] <beuno> brisbane-core is going to rock...
[05:37] <fullermd> Hmm.  Is there some reason it can't help in other cases?
[05:37] <lifeless> igc: a 22K file is quite a lot of data to be updating on push/pull over the wire... I'm inclined to react cautiously and suggest taking the revnocache approach
[05:38] <fullermd> I can see that it wouldn't save you any total time on log (since you pull all the info anyway), but wouldn't it let you number and start displaying more quickly?
[05:39] <igc> lifeless: it doesn't get updated on push or pull
[05:39] <igc> lifeless: only the first time log is used on that remote branch
[05:57] <Stanlin> hi
[06:00] <lifeless> igc: I don't get the connection between my ocmment and your reply :)
[06:03] <Stanlin> May i use BZR with any kind of files?
[06:04] <igc> lifeless: log, status and diff are read operations
[06:05] <igc> you suggested not updating files during them
[06:05] <fullermd> bzr currently maintains an embargo against Cuban and North Korean files...
[06:05] <igc> I'm saying "that's the whole basis of the design"
[06:05] <igc> I'm now updating the mergeline-store file *outside* the read transaction
[06:06] <igc> so I think it's safe
[06:06] <igc> given I check the data is still current before saving it
[06:06] <igc> and lack of data there is handled without a drama
[06:06] <igc> lifeless: make more sense now?
[06:07] <igc> lifeless: and sorry if the reply wasc rushed - I'm tired today :-(
[06:07] <igc> s/wasc/was/
[06:10] <lifeless> igc: well, its clearly vulnerable to race conditions
[06:11]  * fullermd is somewhat uncomfortable on principle with the idea of 'log' writing stuff...
[06:11] <lifeless> igc: I assume I'm not understanding the cache, and I'm really concerned that this is being rushed into - we have only this week to freeze the bbc format, if I remember the dates
[06:13] <igc> lifeless: right. fwiw, I'm not doing anything that couldn't work on bzr.dev now - it's not tied to brisbane-core though I'm ok with doing that
[06:13] <lifeless> igc: this isn't clearly correct, and has serious potentially serious issues as all caches do.
[06:14] <lifeless> not to mention that writing during a read operation is simply impossible on e.g. http:// urls, so its entirely useless there
[06:14] <fullermd> Are serious potentially trivial issues more or less hazardous than trivial potentially serious issues?
[06:14] <igc> lifeless: true. But the important case if local so we could easily restrict it to that
[06:14] <igc> s/if/is/
[06:14] <igc> and remove any network concerns
[06:15] <lifeless> igc: I'm finding the discussion hard, it feels like you're presenting this as all-or-nothing, and already-analysed-this-is-right, rather than engaging
[06:15] <igc> lifeless: sorry - I'm not meaning to come across like that
[06:16] <igc> lifeless: and I'm very interested in how you think it's subject to race conditions and/or ought to proceed
[06:16] <lifeless> igc: so as a design principle we are trying to remove all our caches
[06:17] <lifeless> for instance, one possible cache that was proposed as an alternative to brisbane-core was to cache inventory deltass in commit objects
[06:17] <lifeless> we successfully avoided that while still getting good performance
[06:17] <lifeless> which means we get good performance on arbitrary tree deltas rather than only on adjacent ones
[06:18] <igc> lifeless: really? That's sounds crazy. Caches are necessarily bad. Even bash has them :-)
[06:18] <igc> s/are/aren't/
[06:19] <bob2> Stanlin: yes
[06:19] <lifeless> for this case, I'm interested in: what the root problem is. (is it revnos? is it index performance? something else?) I'm interested in why the operations are faster *overall* with this - what work is it actually saving, and why
[06:20] <lifeless> igc: caches increase data storage, add the opportunity for bugs relateed to coherency, increase writes needed and can often reduce performance overall
[06:20] <Stanlin> bob2: including graphics and big files??
[06:21] <fullermd> Stanlin: It will _work_ for them (mod performance or memory issues with large files, anyway).  Whether it's particularly _useful_ depends on your situation.
[06:22] <Stanlin> fullermd: awesome, ok so i can go ahead and use bzr for all my desktop
[06:23] <fullermd> If any files are a significant fraction of your available physical memory (ISO's and the like are common offenders), you're likely to hit some unpleasantness.
[06:23] <fullermd> And of course a number of operations (like merging) are a lot less useful with binary files.
[06:23] <Stanlin> fullermd: well for starters i just want to do it with small documents
[06:24] <Stanlin> fullermd: what is the best scenario to , use bzr, as server,   and lets all users push and pull, without editors or any control?
[06:25] <lifeless> igc: so we really want caches where they really appear to be the best answer, not the first answer.
[06:26] <fullermd> Stanlin: That's way too broad a question to answer in general   :)
[06:26] <lifeless> igc: and this one, given the data I have so far, appears to be the first answer with none of the deep questions answered
[06:26] <fullermd> Stanlin: Very dependant on exactly what your situation is.
[06:27] <Stanlin> is bzr superior to Git?
[06:27] <lifeless> igc: I may well be wrong and have missed the guts of the analysis
[06:27] <lifeless> Stanlin: we think so :)
[06:27] <fullermd> Yes and No and See Me Next Tuesday.
[06:27] <Stanlin> gnight all :D
[06:29] <lifeless> woo, faster commit landing
[06:30]  * Stanlin performs aptitude remove git
[06:35] <igc> lifeless: it's very early days w.r.t the mergeline cache. It works but that doesn't make it the answer. Please don't reject it on principle though. From *my* analysis, it's the smallest amount of data needed to make some selected use cases perform well. I done lots in work in recent months on stuff like revnocache and this is the only part of that plugin that I've ever thought should go in the core
[06:35] <igc> And if it's not core-worthy, it will go into revnocache instead
[06:36] <lifeless> igc: I won't reject it on principle; but to put it in core I would want those deeper questions considered
[06:36] <igc> lifeless: sure, and I have considered cache currency in the design already, for example
[06:37] <lifeless> I need to head off; day is done and all
[06:37] <lifeless> http://pqm.bazaar-vcs.org/
[06:37] <lifeless> record-iter-changes commit - landing now
[06:38] <igc> lifeless: well done and thanks no the commit stuff
[06:38] <igc> s/no/on/
[06:39] <igc> and for playing devil's advocate :-)
[06:40] <fullermd> FWIW, I agree in principle too...
[06:40] <fullermd> I'd rather see fixable performance issues fixed (even if rather later) than papered over.
[06:40] <fullermd> Once papered over, fixes tend to get pushed back a long ways, and even when made, the papering often remains messing things up worse   :|
[06:41] <fullermd> (this of course expresses no opinion whatsoever on where the current questions falls on that spectrum, since that's all the opinion I'm qualified to express...)
[06:43] <igc> fullermd: we currently cache the last revno and last-rev-id for the mainline
[06:43] <lifeless> igc: revno is a cache, last-rev-id isn't
[06:43] <lifeless> :)
[06:43]  * lifeless goes
[06:44] <igc> fullermd: all I'm doing is extending the idea to each "mergeline" so finding a rev-id for x.y.z doesn't require a full graph build
[06:45] <fullermd> igc: Convincing me of the fitness or lack thereof of some internal mechanism is kinda wasted effort   ;)
[06:47] <fullermd> I have pro and con feelings on the issue, but considering how drastically uninformed they are compared to anybody else you talk to about it...
[06:51] <igc> fullermd: thanks for the tip. I was being polite and offering an explanation in case you cared :-)
[06:54] <fullermd> Oh, I do appreciate that.  It's why I'm here and occasionally even pay attention   8-}
[06:55] <fullermd> Just that pretty much any insight or judgement that might occur to me, lifeless already thought of 20 minutes before I read any descriptions, and either already brought up or mentally discarded as absurd.
[07:41] <vila> hi all
[07:42] <Peng_> Good morning.
[07:43] <igc> hi vila
[08:09] <thumper> can someone tell me the difference between 1.13 and 1.13.1?
[08:09] <thumper> will it matter server side?
[08:09] <thumper> should LP use 1.13 or 1.13.1?
[08:17] <Peng_> thumper: Look at the announcement: 1.13.1 fixes a version number mismatch in bzr vs. bzrlib, fixes an error in NEWS (I think), fixes 'merge --force', and bzr-1.13.tar.gz didn't include the Pyrex-generated C files. Does any of that matter for LP?
[08:18] <Peng_> thumper: If LP doesn't use "bzr", doesn't use "bzr --force" and has Pyrex installed on the build machine or doesn't use the tarball in the first place, I guess it doesn't really matter.
[08:26] <thumper> Peng_: thanks, I think LP will stick with 1.13
[08:26] <thumper> :)
[08:27] <Peng_> Err, "bzr merge --force", I meant..
[09:03] <spiv> thumper: I agree with Peng_'s assessment.  Also, we write the NEWS file for a reason ;)
[09:03] <thumper> spiv: don't expect people to actually read NEWS, geez
[09:03] <thumper> spiv: what makes you think I have a copy of trunk?
[09:05] <spiv> thumper: Well, I'm reasonably sure you have a tool to browse files in branches online
[09:06] <spiv> thumper: but also the relevant parts of NEWS are sent in each release announcement
[09:06] <thumper> spiv: geez, why all this reading when someone can just ask :P
[09:07] <spiv> thumper: of course, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~bzr/bzr/trunk/annotate/head:/NEWS would be even better if LP didn't time out trying to render it ;)
[09:07] <spiv> thumper: when you ask, all I do is go and read that file
[09:07] <spiv> thumper: so you might as well cut out the middle man :)
[09:07] <thumper> spiv: and save me the trouble :)
[12:09] <VSpike> Greetings.  A general question.  I have a project where parts of it are customized files for the end customer - e.g. web pages, set up files, theme files etc...
[12:09] <VSpike> I want to maintain these branches in parallel for the long term.  Is there a way to make this easier, i.e. to ensure that some changes in a branch never get pushed to the parent?
[12:10] <VSpike> The other approach would be to treat all the customer specific files as a separate project under source control.
[12:10] <VSpike> But bzr doesn't seem to handle related sub-projects yet - unless that has change since I last checked?
[12:26] <yogsototh> VSpike: got the same problem with 3 différent environments.
[12:26] <yogsototh> I use 3 differents branches
[12:26] <yogsototh> And I never use pull nor push
[12:26] <yogsototh> but only merge
[12:27] <yogsototh> That should work just great
[12:38] <VSpike> yogsototh: do you mean that you never make code changes in the child branches that need go back to parent?
[13:20] <joie> Apologies if I'm asking the obvious - but I can't find it in the docs. Is there any way of finding out the common ancestor a merge command is using?
[13:21] <joie> (I'm kinda new to bzr - but been using baz for a long while, trying to make the switch!)
[13:21] <lifeless> joie: bzr find-merge-base
[13:22] <lifeless> joie: found in 'bzr help hidden-commands'
[13:22] <joie> Ahhah - sounds like a useful thing to know - thanks!
[13:23] <joie> I'm essentially trying to do the equivalent of a baz apply-delta to put all the work from one branch onto my working branch, and want to be sure that merge is doing the "right" thing!
[13:43] <james_w> jelmer: hey, thanks, I was just about to take another look at bzr 1.13.1 and I saw the ACCEPTED mail.
[13:56] <jelmer> james_w: it turned out there was a bug in the python2.6 package in experimental that I had instlaled
[13:56] <jelmer> james_w: uninstalling it made the problem go away
[14:05] <Tak> jelmer: hello
[14:13] <igc> night all
[14:18] <emmajane> igc, just got your email. The reason I emailed you back with the link was because I don't have time to do this right now.
[14:32] <liw> what's this mean: Unable to contact DBus session: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.Spawn.ExecFailed: dbus-launch failed to autolaunch D-Bus session: Autolaunch error: X11 initialization failed.
[14:36] <jelmer> liw: bzr-dbus was unable to contact your local DBus
[14:37] <jelmer> liw: while attempting to signal that a new commit was made / branch was updated
[14:39] <liw> ok. why is dbus being contacted? I'm not running under X for that command (ssh into the machine; there is an open X session in the console, though)
[15:14] <jelmer> liw: you have bzr-dbus installed probably
[15:14] <jelmer> liw: newer versions of bzr-dbus will not show any error / output if it fails
[15:22] <liw> jelmer, ok, then I'll just ignore it, thanks
[15:34] <jam> vila: just a quick question, if you managed to fix the duplicate "CHKInventory" stuff.
[15:35] <vila> ajmitch: yu[
[15:35] <vila> ajmitch: sorry wrong target
[15:35] <vila> jam: yes ?
[15:36] <jam> vila: ?? or 'yes' :)
[15:36] <vila> jam: I pushed --overwrite on vilajam
[15:36] <vila> jam: 'just quick question, if' I was waiting for the question :)
[15:41] <vila> jam: the fix may not be the cleanest one (you can still find the duplicate in a couple of revisions if you dig enough), but I think it's "good enough"
[15:49] <meuserj> Is there an existing plugin or other method for creating a default template for commit text?
[15:50] <jelmer> meuserj: there's no plugin yet, but there is a hook you can use if you're going to write such a plugin
[15:55] <vila> jam: in gc, _compress last returned value is length, documented as 'number of bytes accumulated in the group output so far' but the code seems to calculate the delta length instead
[15:56] <vila> vila: it seems to be used only in _insert_record_stream and even there that seems like a left over
[16:03] <jam> vila: so the return is currently (sha1, start_of_record, end_of_record, kind, length_of_record)
[16:03] <jam> the last part is obviously redundant with end_of_record - start_of_record
[16:04] <vila> jam: not so obviously :-) but thanks for confirming, it's not always the case for the python impl. but if the semantic is correct, I'll just delete it
[16:05] <vila> jam: can I get also get rid of the last_fulltext_len in _insert_record_stream ?
[16:07] <jam> vila: sure, I think there was something about returning the size of the fulltext that was being compressed, etc
[16:07] <jam> I would probably just get rid of 'length'
[16:07] <jam> (evolving interfaces :)
[16:08] <vila> jam: ok, doing it right now
[16:08] <jam> so stuff like last_fulltext_len was meant as a possible way to play with varying the compression decisions
[16:09] <vila> I can 1) get rid of it as well as length, 2) keep it and update it with end - start
[16:10] <jam> vila: We can always bring it back if we decide we want to use it
[16:10] <jam> for now, cleaner code is probably better for landing in bzr.dev
[16:10] <vila> ok
[16:22] <jelmer> jam: hi
[16:22] <jelmer> jam: How do I create a branch5 format programmatically?
[16:31] <jam> jelmer: in a test suite or just from bzrlib?
[16:32] <jelmer> jam: in a testsuite
[16:33] <jelmer> for other branch formats I can use ._matchingbzrdir
[16:33] <jam> jelmer: self.make_branch('dirstate'
[16:33] <jam> would probably be fine
[16:33] <jam> at least that was the last one to use Branch5
[16:33] <jam> if you need more control than that, then I can go through it
[16:34] <jam> (that will be a knit format repo, with a branch5 branch)
[16:34] <jelmer> jam: is there any way to obtain that from a BranchFormat instance?
[16:34] <jam> jelmer: are you saying you need the name of the format?
[16:35] <jelmer> jam: I have a BranchFormat instance (BzrBranchFormat5) and need to create a branch that uses it
[16:35] <jam> bzrlib.branch.BranchFormat5.initialize()
[16:35] <jelmer> preferably as generic as possible, without special casing BzrBranchFormat5
[16:35] <jelmer> This is for the InterBranch tests
[16:35] <jam> jelmer: my_format.initialiaze(a_bzrdir) ?
[16:35] <jam> my_format.initialize(a_bzrdir) ?
[16:35] <jelmer> jam: but in that case what format can a_bzrdir have?
[16:36] <jam> jelmer: there is only 1 'metadir' bzrdir format
[16:36] <jelmer> can I use a BranchFormat5 with a recent repo format?
[16:36] <jam> jelmer: yes
[16:36] <jam> it will "work" we just don't give you a way to specify that with a short name from 'init'
[16:36] <jelmer> ah, neat, I wasn't aware of that
[17:14] <jam> vila: so where are you at? I haven't seen your commit showing up yet :)
[17:15] <vila> I tracked down the unicode symlinks error back to bzr.dev@4216 :-/
[17:15] <vila> Can you run ./bzr selftest -s bt.branch_implementations.test_sprout.TestSprout.test_sprout_with_unicode_symlink in your bzr trunk ?
[17:18] <vila> jam: ^ ?
[17:19] <jam> vila: currently on win32, I'm sure it will pass just fine :)
[17:19] <vila> jam: lol, yeah, but I don't understand how pqm let it pass
[17:21] <jam> vila: on my server, that test fails about 5 times
[17:21] <jam> 'ascii' codec can't decode byte 0xce
[17:21] <vila> yup, that one
[17:21] <jelmer> with or without the dirstate pyrex extensions?
[17:21] <jam> jelmer: both
[17:21] <vila> jelmer: both
[17:22] <jam> vila: maybe a python2.4 issue?
[17:22] <vila> revno 4215 succeeds, 4216 fails
[17:22] <vila> just reproduced it with 2.4 too 8-/
[17:26] <jam> vila: so I could see where 'iter_changes' is accidentally using 8-bit symlink_target rather than unicode, but yeah, I don't see how pqm didn't fail just like us
[17:28] <vila> UnicodeFilenameFeature not available on pqm ?
[17:28] <jam> vila: certainly possible, I don't know
[17:28] <jam> actually, probably likely
[17:28] <jam> try setting LANG=fr
[17:28] <jam> or something
[17:28] <jam> rather than fr.UTF-8
[17:29] <vila> EMYOSDOESNTSPEAKFRANCAIS :)
[17:29] <vila> LANG=en_US.UTF-8
[17:29] <vila> always
[17:30] <jam> :)
[17:30] <jam> so LANG=en_US  then :)
[17:30] <jam> vila: yeah, it passed with a skip here
[17:30] <vila> yup, tests are skipped in that case
[17:32] <vila> crap
[17:33] <vila> jam: by the way, I pushed my last changes at vilajam
[17:34] <vila> jam: you may want to pull --overwrite from there though
[17:34] <vila> jam: I mean, I you keep a mirror of that one
[17:34] <vila> jam: I mean, IFF you keep a mirror of that one
[17:36] <jam> vila: well, I'm a bit saddened that you keep '--overwrite'ing all of my branches. You pushed up your history for brisbane-core, and vilajam...
[17:37] <vila> jam: ?? I try to respect the mainline most of the time, but here you had committed *on top* of the error, so I tried to get rid of the problem as best as I can :-/
[17:39] <vila> jam: I tried alternate ways to fix it, but most of them ended up with the wrong annotation for both CHKInventory and CHKInventoryDirectory (all the lines were attributed to *me*), at least now the attributions are correct and  your revisions still present
[17:40] <jam> not a big deal, really
[17:40] <jam> I was just surprised to see both mainlines changing to "merged bbc@" especially since it was the bbc trunk
[17:40] <vila> I thought correct annotations were more important than revision history :-/
[17:41] <jam> vila: personally I use "bzr log" about 20x more than "bzr annotate", but as I said, in another week I won't even notice
[17:41] <vila> jam: and yes, the way I rebuilt my loom wasn't the clearest either :-/
[17:42] <vila> jam: on the other hand, may be you should push to jamvila :)
[17:43] <jam> :)
[17:51] <vadi2> does bzr use sha1 behind the scenes?
[17:52] <james_w> yes
[18:24] <luks> heh, python is going to use mercurual
[18:28] <cody-somerville> luks, its official?
[18:28] <cody-somerville> luks, link?
[18:28] <luks> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2009-March/087931.html
[18:44] <jszakmeister> yep, it's official.
[18:47] <cody-somerville> That sucks :(
[18:47] <cody-somerville> bzr rocks
[18:48]  * jszakmeister agrees
[18:48] <cody-somerville> Is there an announcement or anything?
[18:48] <jszakmeister> It probably boiled down to performance... the email is a little vague, but I agree... a decision needed to be made
[18:49] <jszakmeister> luks put the url in IRC
[18:58] <cody-somerville> but bzr is fast now :(
[19:06] <BFrank> that is the joy of open source, you are free to choose amongst many good choices
[19:08] <cody-somerville> I can't wait until Launchpad supports git and mercurial imports
[19:09] <santagada> is the code for launchpad avaliable somewhere already?
[19:09] <cody-somerville> santagada, You might want to ask in #launchpad - this is #bzr
[19:09] <Toksyuryel> and each choice typically tries its best to make switching between choices as painless as possible
[19:09] <mwhudson_> cody-somerville: soon!
[19:09] <mwhudson_> for git
[19:09] <santagada> cody-somerville: no one here knows? I would supose it is pretty important
[19:10] <cody-somerville> santagada, Why?
[19:10] <cody-somerville> mwhudson_, :)
[19:12] <antoranz> when I pack, can I delete everything in .bzr/repository/obsolete_packs/?
[19:12] <beuno_> antoranz, in general, yes
[19:12] <antoranz> ok
[19:19] <bialix> hi guys, in which time igc (Ian) will be here?
[19:20] <beuno> bialix, I'd say in about 3 hours or so
[19:20] <bialix> thanks. perhaps too late for me
[19:21] <BFrank> why doesn't it cleanup obsolete packs?
[19:22] <bialix> igc: I'd like to talk about eol labels and strategies with you tomorrow morning (~ 6-8 am UTC). OK?
[19:22] <beuno> BFrank, I don't know all the details, but it mostly has to do to ensure that we don't run into data loss
[19:22] <BFrank> hmm
[19:22] <bialix> igc: I'll be there tomorrow.
[19:22] <beuno> BFrank, there are some crazy scenarios where that happens
[19:22] <BFrank> when exactly does it cleanup the obsolote packs?
[19:22] <BFrank> shouldn't there be a point when it is safe for bazaar to clean them up?
[19:23] <james_w> it cleans them up before writing any more
[19:23] <james_w> so next time it does a "pack" operation it first removes the obsolete ones
[19:24] <BFrank> shouldn't it cleanup for other types of operations, where it won't create new ones?
[19:24] <BFrank> or do all operations create them?
[19:24] <james_w> no, just the ones you would expect
[19:24] <james_w> commit, pull, pack, merge, push into, etc.
[19:25] <BFrank> hmm
[19:25] <antoranz> what tool can I use to import a git repository into bzr?
[19:26] <mwhudson> antoranz: bzr-git or bzr-fastimport
[19:26] <antoranz> ok
[19:31] <mwhudson> antoranz: the latter is probably more robust at this point, but bzr-git is moving fast
[19:31] <antoranz> ok
[19:32] <jelmer> mwhudson: moin
[19:32] <mwhudson> jelmer: hi
[19:32] <jelmer> mwhudson: my git import now works on lp btw
[19:32] <mwhudson> jelmer: yes, i saw that
[19:32] <mwhudson> jelmer: did you find out what was going on when it was just showing 1000 revs?
[19:33] <jelmer> mwhudson: yes, I had only pushed 1000 revisions (bzr push -r1000) :-)
[19:33] <mwhudson> jelmer: hahahaha
[19:49] <mwhudson> jelmer: so if i wanted to make a bzr-svn import of pypy, what would i have to do?
[19:49] <mwhudson> jelmer: i remember you saying that i could probably hack something to ignore certain errors
[19:57] <jelmer> mwhudson: ah, yeah
[19:57] <jelmer> mwhudson: when it calls get_dir()
[19:57] <jelmer> you have to ignore 157002 errors
[20:15] <mwhudson> jelmer: alternatively
[20:15] <mwhudson> if i dump the repo, filter out the offending fileprops, recreate it locally
[20:15] <mwhudson> do the import from my local repo, will it be possible to update the import from codespeak?
[20:16] <jelmer> mwhudson: yes
[20:21] <mwhudson> jelmer: awesome
[20:21] <mwhudson> jelmer: do you happen to know how to filter a dumpfile?
[20:25] <jelmer> mwhudson: vi ? :-)
[20:25] <mwhudson> jelmer: heh
[20:28] <phinze> so i've got a meeting this afternoon about revising my group's code review practice, which currently consists of all devs (4-6 of them) sitting around a table and scrolling through one big diff that's getting deployed
[20:28] <phinze> wondering if anyone else using bazaar in a dev group can talk about what they do for code review?
[20:29] <phinze> we're hoping to move toward peer-review where one other dev signs off on each commit to trunk
[20:33] <james_w> phinze: that's what bzr does, as you probably know
[20:33] <phinze> yes bzr does PQM where what like at least one other dev must approve?
[20:34] <james_w> you work with much smaller, more targetted diffs, which is a big win
[20:34] <james_w> but there will some cross-change intricacies that can be missed
[20:34] <james_w> yeah, two core devs total, so you get two reviews of code from those that haven't been let in to that group yet
[20:35] <phinze> we're thinking of using PQM here too
[20:35] <james_w> I think that's a stricter requirement than a lot of open source projects, where once you are a core committer you can generally do what you like
[20:36] <phinze> yeah seems pretty strict but also seems like it works :)
[20:36] <phinze> so it's either BB:approve or BB:reject...?
[20:36] <james_w> e.g. in Ubuntu. What happens there is sometimes you request your changes are reviewed before uploading (committing to mainline). Some people watch the -changes list (equivalent to -commits) and review things that catch their eye
[20:36] <james_w> so it's much less comprehensive
[20:37] <james_w> but the volume of changes there is too large, and the expertise too thinly spread, to have bzr's system of review.
[20:37] <phinze> ahh yeah
[20:38] <james_w> there is BB:approve, BB:reject, BB:rebsubmit, BB:tweak, BB:comment and BB:abstain I think
[20:38] <phinze> lol abstain
[20:38] <james_w> where approve, resubmit and tweak are the most commonly used
[20:38] <phinze> how to resubmit/tweak work in that case
[20:38] <phinze> are they just different semantic keywords on top of reject?
[20:40] <phinze> s/to/do
[20:40] <james_w> reject is pretty final, "I don't want any change like this in bzr", for something like "remove bzr commit, make everyone commit by editing .bzr/repository"
[20:40] <phinze> :)
[20:41] <james_w> resubmit means, "I'm fine with where you are going, but there are some problems with your implementation, make some changes and ask for review again"
[20:41] <james_w> tweak means "basically fine, there's a typo here, fix that up and submit it, you don't need to get it re-reviewed"
[20:42] <phinze> from BB/PQM's perspective, though, it's just a "go/no go"?
[20:42] <james_w> BB tracks the votes, I'm not sure what algorithm it uses to decide, if any
[20:42] <james_w> PQM is not automatic, a developer has to submit each change
[20:43] <james_w> there's no link between them currently
[20:43] <phinze> ahh BB and PQM are two separate systems... i thought they were two head of one beast
[20:43] <james_w> PQM just saves you from having to wait for the testsuite before committing, you submit, and some time later get a mail telling you if it passed or not
[20:44] <james_w> nah, they could work more closely together, but it works fine to have them separate, so no-one put the effort in
[20:57] <mwhudson> jelmer: ok, i have a dump file, can you give me some clues what i'm looking for?
[21:00] <jelmer> mwhudson: look for the particular revision that was causing problems (I think I mentioned it in the bug report)
[21:00] <jelmer> You'll see entries in the dump file for each property change and each file change
[21:00] <jelmer> just remote the K ... / V ... bits for the problematic property (with a / in the name IIRC)
[21:02]  * mwhudson wonders about an appropriate tool for editing a 3.7 gig file
[21:03] <stbuehler> "rm" :)
[21:04] <NfNitLoop> heh.
[21:04] <thumper> mwhudson: sed
[21:04] <mwhudson> thumper: you might be rite
[21:04] <thumper> mwhudson: or emacs :)
[21:04] <mwhudson> right
[21:04] <mwhudson> does emacs not load the entire file into ram?
[21:04] <mwhudson> i was ~sure it did
[21:04] <NfNitLoop> a friend of mine had to remove middle chunks of very large (gig+) files and ended up using head & tail.
[21:05] <thumper> mwhudson: I'm not sure
[21:05] <jelmer> mwhudson: there are some tools for editing svn dumps
[21:05] <jelmer> but I'm not familiar with them
[21:05] <jelmer> they do exist though :-)
[21:08] <mwhudson> ok
[21:08] <phinze> james_w: thanks for explaining all that; very helpful!
[21:10] <james_w> np
[21:10]  * mwhudson finds a perl thingy
[21:14] <mwhudson> hang on
[21:15] <mwhudson> jelmer: can svn-import import from a dump file?
[21:16] <mwhudson> or
[21:16] <jelmer> mwhudson: it can import from a dump file but it will simply load the dump file into a repo and then import it
[21:16] <jelmer> mwhudson: actually, you should be able to import from that dumpfile directly
[21:16] <jelmer> mwhudson: as that problem only occurred over http
[21:17] <mwhudson> right
[21:17] <mwhudson> that was what i was thinking
[21:24]  * mwhudson plays the install dependencies game
[21:36] <shtylman_> I am looking to setup my own bzr server for a group I am working with. I wanted to do it using https transport to basically get pretty urls (ie. https://domain/repo/project) ... I know bzr can work over ssh, but then I don't get the pretty name...without putting the repo under root...which I would like to avoid...any suggestions/ideas?
[21:50] <NfNitLoop> shtylman_: You can use read-only "dumb servers" over HTTP trivially:
[21:50] <NfNitLoop> http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/bzr.dev/en/user-guide/index.html
[21:50] <NfNitLoop> but ssh will probably be best (read: easiest) if you want to give people write access.
[21:56] <shtylman_> NfNitLoop: I am aware of the "dumb" servers...and yea...I was thinking the same thing....but just wondering if I overlooked something simple
[21:57] <NfNitLoop> Not that I know of.
[21:57] <NfNitLoop> you could use `bzr serve`, but that's apparently only for a single repo.
[21:59] <LarstiQ> afaik bzr serve is for directory hierarchies, not repositories.
[21:59] <NfNitLoop> Oh.  ok, misread that while skimming.
[21:59] <LarstiQ> so serving / would work
[21:59] <NfNitLoop> there you go then, bzr serve.
[21:59] <NfNitLoop> (though, you probably don't want to serve /)  ;)
[22:00] <LarstiQ> shtylman_: you could use a chrooting ssh server to prettify your urls, just like launchpad does
[22:00] <mwhudson> jelmer: import to a brisbane-core format blew up in a really exciting way
[22:01] <shtylman_> LarstiQ: will that interfere with the current ssh server on the machine? sounds like it will...
[22:01] <LarstiQ> shtylman_: it could
[22:02] <mwhudson> jelmer: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/140987/
[22:02]  * LarstiQ goes to bed
[22:06] <mwhudson> jelmer: and then when trying to import into --1.9 http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/140995/
[22:25] <jelmer> mwhudson: not sure any of those are bzr-svn issues
[22:25] <mwhudson> jelmer: what might they be?
[22:26] <mwhudson> the thread-starting one is pretty odd
[22:27] <jelmer> mwhudson: Does it start a very large number of threads or something like that?
[22:27] <mwhudson> jelmer: bit hard to tell, this is on a remote machine
[22:28] <mwhudson> which is an openaz slice, or something, so it's possibly a slightly strange environment
[22:28] <lifeless> shtylman_: you could put a symlink in the root
[22:29] <shtylman_> lifeless: yep...decided on that few min ago :)
[22:33] <jam> jelmer: for the first pastebin, something is passing a 'key' that has a unicode string, which I don't think is allowed. Since both "file_id" and "revision_id" are declared to be utf-8 strings internally.
[22:34] <jam> Given that it is clearly an 'id' followed by a 'path' I'm a bit confused by it, though
[22:34] <jam> Though it also seems be failing in the middle of 'svn/errors.py ... convert'
[22:35] <jam> which sounds like an exception in the middle of reporting an exception.
[22:35] <mwhudson> jelmer: i'm tar tjf-ing the repo, will see if it ends up small enough to download to my laptop reasonably
[22:36] <mwhudson> cfj, obv
[22:37] <jam> anyway, I'm off for tonight, catch y'all later :)
[22:38] <lifeless> gnight jam
[22:54] <igc> morning al
[22:54] <igc> all
[22:56] <lifeless> hi igc
[22:57] <igc> hi lifeless
[22:57] <igc> lifeless, jam: I'm up at the hospital most of the day
[22:57] <lifeless> igc: good luck
[22:57] <igc> what code do you want me reviewing while I'm there?
[22:57] <igc> I'm thinking chk_map
[22:58] <igc> (groupcompress in out of my depth and we have 3 people who ought to know it reasonably well)
[22:58] <igc> s/in/is/
[22:58] <lifeless> that would make sense; re the cache you are proposing, yes your mail comes across very strongly ;). I would like to note that AIUI the revnos do _not_ require the full graph to be traversed
[22:59] <lifeless> so if we strip the hyperbole we can be examining that part of the problem
[23:00]  * SamB_irssi begins to wonder why svn-import is only available for svn ...
[23:10] <plexq> I'm trying to merge lots of subprojects into one big central project.  Is there a way to do that?
[23:11] <plexq> should I just make one big honking bzr
[23:11] <lifeless> there is a merge-into plugin
[23:11] <plexq> or do subprojects like you can in svn
[23:11] <plexq> merge-into - yeah - I saw that - does it still work? i t hasn't been touched in 9 months?
[23:12] <lifeless> as far as I know it does work yes
[23:13] <lifeless> we have sub projects being worked on but its not really ready yet
[23:14] <plexq> kk
[23:15] <plexq> I'd heard a rumour that bazaar was going away because Gnome picked git, is there any truth to this?
[23:15] <SamB_irssi> I heard that Emacs is going to be switching to bzr soon ...
[23:15] <james_w> first I've heard of it
[23:19] <lifeless> plexq: no truth to it at all
[23:19] <lifeless> and yes, emacs are talking timeframes now
[23:20] <plexq> I know for us - it will depend on IDE plugins.  We are using bazaar right now, but I've heard there is a pure Python version of git, and IntelliJ 8.1 now has a git plugin, but no good bazaar support :(
[23:22] <lifeless> plexq: the pure version of git is 'dulwich' a project started for 'bzr-git', our git interoperation plugin
[23:23] <plexq> heh
[23:23] <lifeless> eclipse has bzr support FWIW
[23:23] <plexq> yeah - but eclipse is a POS
[23:23] <plexq> it's horrible
[23:23] <plexq> took one look at IntelliJ and never looked back
[23:54]  * igc breakfast


[00:00] <uberdub> Linux uberdub-HP-Mini-311-1000 2.6.38-8-generic #42-Ubuntu SMP Mon Apr 11 03:31:50 UTC 2011 i686 i686 i386 GNU/Linux
[00:00] <guest09876> k
[00:01] <guest09876> we ruled out that one
[00:01] <guest09876> im looking at the known bugs
[00:01] <guest09876> see if anything matches
[00:02] <guest09876> uberdub, from reading recent forums i see people still using distro releases from four years agoors
[00:04] <uberdub> yeah
[00:04] <uberdub> everything pertaining to my card is pretty old in the forums, hence why Im here
[00:05] <uberdub> none of them are specific to my errors either
[00:05] <guest09876> linux doesnt even know what my card is lol
[00:05] <uberdub> what does lspci say?
[00:06] <guest09876> lshw says its one thing ORRR another lol
[00:06] <uberdub> have you looked at lspci?
[00:06] <uberdub> should say whats connected
[00:06] <guest09876> says the same thing
[00:06] <guest09876> nope
[00:06] <uberdub> says what?
[00:06] <guest09876> its not connected
[00:07] <uberdub> doesnt see it at all?
[00:07] <guest09876> it does but it doesnt know what it is
[00:07] <guest09876> and dell doesnt have what card it is on the specs pade
[00:07] <guest09876> page*
[00:08] <uberdub> hmm
[00:08] <uberdub> yeah you need to know that in order to use it
[00:08] <guest09876> i know
[00:08] <uberdub> man, Im about to just put winblows on my laptop
[00:08] <guest09876> im going to but a 12 dollars linksys card probably
[00:09] <guest09876> i always had real good luck with linksys
[00:09] <uberdub> linksys is just a brand though
[00:09] <uberdub> they dont make chips afaik
[00:10] <guest09876> all what i know when it says linksys it works lol
[00:10] <uberdub> I guess asking for a linux OS that just works is asking too much
[00:10] <uberdub> Im tired of my hardware being limited
[00:10] <guest09876> you can always use windows lol
[00:10] <uberdub> due to crap drivers, or the nonexistence of drivers
[00:11] <uberdub> I hate windows
[00:11] <uberdub> but I might
[00:11] <guest09876> lol
[00:11] <guest09876> good luck
[00:12] <guest09876> every computer i had windows on always got some type of virus on it
[00:12] <guest09876> never with linux
[00:12] <uberdub> I dont have issues with viruses
[00:12] <guest09876> well malware etc
[00:13] <uberdub> it can be high maintenance in that regard, but at least things actually work
[00:13] <uberdub> you wont get malware, and viruses with proper administration
[00:14] <guest09876> im pretty sure thast incorrect
[00:14] <guest09876> thats*
[00:14] <uberdub> its a lot easier to scan, and delete those things than write your own config scripts from scratch just to use the basic functions of your hardware
[00:14] <guest09876> but im going to agree to disagree cause im not looking for a deabte lol
[00:14] <guest09876> debate*
[00:15] <uberdub> sure new instances of malware, and viruses cant be detected, but thats rare
[00:15] <uberdub> dont download porn
[00:16] <BajK> lol
[00:16] <uberdub> you have to let software on your computer
[00:16] <uberdub> it doesnt magically install itself
[00:17] <moshy> iv found that the synaptic package installer is very handy
[00:17] <moshy> who is the smart ubuntu user here?
[00:18] <guest09876> moshy, not me
[00:19] <moshy> any way i have 2 hard drives that i need to repair the fat on and i have no clue where to start since im new to ubuntu
[00:20] <moshy> the recovery software include with the drives dose not work as it needs an active windows interface to recover and thy are my windows drives
[00:20] <moshy> any sugestions?
[00:34] <BajK_> man, why is the mouse always so slow :D *changing mouse acceleratioon to 15x and pointer threshold to 2px/ :D
[00:47] <amichair> does anyone know how to use sfdisk?
[00:54] <l1950ff> un saludo
[00:59] <EldonG> Hey...I have a strange problem on my Kubuntu laptop...Diablo 2 won't play or install...it can't find the CD, even when it's in the drive or an ISO is mounted.
[01:00] <EldonG> anybody?
[01:04] <EldonG> hihi?
[01:15] <guest09876> EldonG , Hello and i have no idea
[01:16] <guest09876> are you using wine?
[01:20] <EldonG> Yeah, using wine...I don't get it.
[01:24] <EldonG> Heck...I installed Oblivion. the other day...but it crashes.
[01:27] <EldonG> any gamers in here?
[01:41] <uberdub> cant help with wine
[01:41] <uberdub> sorry
[01:41] <uberdub> I dont use it
[01:41] <uberdub> if its not native, Im not interested
[01:41] <uberdub> got a ps3 for all the latest gaming
[01:53] <sayeghr> Hey guys
[01:53] <sayeghr> Ive got a weird problem. I cant seem to copy files to the USB. it seems to just copy like a symlink or some shit.
[01:54] <sayeghr> Anyone around?
[01:55] <mr-rich> sayeghr: patience ...
[01:55] <sayeghr> Just wanting to make sure people are around, sorry.
[02:11] <BlackF1r3> is anyone here?
[02:11] <BlackF1r3> i got a q
[02:12] <BlackF1r3> what is the diff between kubuntu and ubuntu?
[02:12] <sayeghr> kubuntu uses KDE for its desktop environment whereas ubuntu uses gnome3/unity.
[02:12] <sayeghr> Thats about it.
[02:12] <BlackF1r3> ah ok and which is nicer looking?
[02:13] <sayeghr> I liked gnome 2
[02:13] <sayeghr> but with the new version, gnome 3 and unity
[02:13] <sayeghr> I think its a piece of shit
[02:13] <FloodBotK1> sayeghr: Please don't flood; use http://paste.ubuntu.com to paste; don't use Enter as punctuation.
[02:13] <sayeghr> So... I use kubuntu (for kde, which in my opinon looks better and runs better)
[02:14] <BlackF1r3> oh ok thank you man and have u tried other linux distros?
[02:15] <sayeghr> Archlinux
[02:15] <sayeghr> I like it a lot. Its a bit difficult to get going out of hte gate, but if you are somewhat experienced, I highly recommend it.
[02:15] <sayeghr> Otherwise, kubuntu or ubuntu is a good start.
[02:15] <BlackF1r3> interesting whats that like ? i have used ubuntu and puppy linux
[02:16] <sayeghr> archlinux all the packages get compiled on the fly
[02:16] <BlackF1r3> switching over to Kubuntu right now
[02:16] <sayeghr> instead of prepackaged binaries
[02:16] <sayeghr> ya, kubuntu is a good choice
[02:16] <sayeghr> archlinux is the latest and greatest
[02:16] <FloodBotK1> sayeghr: Please don't flood; use http://paste.ubuntu.com to paste; don't use Enter as punctuation.
[02:16] <sayeghr> so, sometimes it breaks
[02:16] <sayeghr> kubuntus been solid so far for me.
[02:16] <BlackF1r3> ah i see so i would have to know a lot for that to work out?
[02:18] <sayeghr> kubuntu no, its easy.
[02:18] <sayeghr> you've got it
[02:18] <sayeghr> arch is mroe complicated, yes.
[02:18] <BlackF1r3> thats what i meant
[02:20] <BlackF1r3> hows linux mint?
[02:21] <sayeghr> dunno, Ive only really used archlinux, ubuntu, fedora, and redhat.
[02:23] <BlackF1r3> kk thanks dude u have been great help
[02:23] <sayeghr> Awesome, take it easy bro.
[02:24] <sayeghr> Hey guys, Ive got a weird problem. I cant seem to copy files to the USB. it seems to just copy like a symlink or some shit.
[02:24] <IdleOne> sayeghr: please keep the language clean
[02:24] <taglass> "archlinux all the packages get compiled on the fly" umm what?  That's only the case for stuff out of AUR.
[02:27] <BlackF1r3> whats LXDE ?
[02:27] <taglass> http://lxde.org/
[02:28] <BlackF1r3> thanks
[02:29] <sayeghr> not sure
[02:30] <BlackF1r3> can u install multiple graphical enviornments on one system?
[02:30] <taglass> Yes
[02:31] <taglass> The login screen will have a dropdown box that lets you select which one you want to use for that session.
[02:31] <BlackF1r3> ok when i come back will someone teach me?
[02:33] <taglass> BlackF1r3: sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get install lxde
[02:34] <BlackF1r3> kk
[02:34] <taglass> That should install lxde
[02:44] <moshy> im using xfce  and need to recover the file alocation tabel on 2 windows hard drives however i cant seem to find a drive interface any place , is that some kind of package i need to install?
[03:15] <frogonwheels> moshy: Hm.. I've had to do stuff similar to that before.  It was a while ago, and Linux has surely moved on a long way - for me it was the pointers to the FAT (in the first 512bytes of the partition) that I'd managed to clear.
[03:17] <frogonwheels> moshy:  I ended up using  dd and  compiling a little utility  that used linux header files that described the fat - and poking in values myself, after wading through the disk to find the position of the FATs
[03:17] <frogonwheels> moshy: (and then dd'ing it back).
[03:18] <frogonwheels> moshy: I'm talking 8+ years ago now that I really think of it!
[03:19] <frogonwheels> moshy:  ?>? http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/TestDisk ??
[04:22] <EldonG> hey...I asked before...but...does anybody play Diablo 2 that might help me?
[04:28] <c2tarun> EldonG: obviously you are not going to ask any questions, iike how to play. :) just ask the problem
[04:28] <EldonG> Ok...Kubuntu sees the disk, but D2 doesn't.  Very strange.
[04:29] <c2tarun> what do you mean by sees the disk?
[04:37] <LINKSWORD2> Greetings, all.
[04:40] <Linkmaster> he LINKSWORD2
[04:40] <Linkmaster> *hey
[04:41] <LINKSWORD2> What's up?
[04:42] <Linkmaster> nothing much, you join the -offtopic?
[04:44] <LINKSWORD2> Oy, let's try this again. Linkmaster, can you give me the info / command to join offtopic?
[04:44] <Linkmaster> What client are you using?
[04:45] <LINKSWORD2> That was strange.
[04:45] <LINKSWORD2> Anyway, I'm using Quassel IRC on Kubuntu 11.
[04:45] <c2tarun> Linkmaster: do you think clients are relevant? commands are processed be the node
[04:46] <c2tarun> *be=by
[04:46] <LINKSWORD2> lol @ c2tarun
[04:46] <Linkmaster> c2tarun: no, but if he was using a client familiar to me, I was just going to tell him that way instead
[04:46] <LINKSWORD2> Well, Linkmaster, are you familiar with Quassel IRC?
[04:46] <Linkmaster> LINKSWORD2: press the 'join' at the top, click on the channel section and type #kubuntu-offtopic and there you go
[04:46] <Linkmaster> LINKSWORD2: its my favorite :D
[04:47] <c2tarun> or just click on #kubuntu-offtopic <--- here
[04:47] <LINKSWORD2> Thanks, c2tarun
[04:49] <LINKSWORD2> ... Crash-fest/
[04:49] <LINKSWORD2> ?*
[04:50] <LINKSWORD2> Is there a keyboard command to switch between open channels?
[04:51] <Linkmaster> not sure, but c2tarun thanks for teaching me something new
[04:52] <c2tarun> LINKSWORD2: for Quassel I dont know, but there are keyboard shortcuts in konversation.
[04:53] <c2tarun> LINKSWORD2: in quassel its Alt+DOWN/UP
[04:53] <LINKSWORD2> OK, thanks.
[04:54] <c2tarun> anytime you want a shortcut just take a look at settings>configure shortcuts. If there is any you can use it, or configure it accordingly :)
[04:55] <tx0105> does anybody know what the major differences...if any...there are between Mint 10 KDE and Kubuntu 11.04? I'm trying to decide on a KDE flavor
[04:56] <c2tarun> tx0105: well differences in mint and kubuntu are diff then diff in KDE versions, you can tell us the version of KDE you are using.
[04:56] <c2tarun> kubuntu 11.04 supplied with kde 4.6.2
[04:59] <tx0105> so kubuntu has the newer version of KDE?
[04:59] <Linkmaster> tx0105: yep, 4.6.3
[04:59] <Linkmaster> and if you really know what your doing[through neon I believe] you can run the beta of 4.7
[05:00] <c2tarun> for more info you can ping guys in #project-neon
[05:02] <mr-rich> Ok, ugraded to Natty and kpackagekit (tray icon) is STILL missbehaving ... :(
[05:02] <c2tarun> mr-rich: what are they doing ;) they tray icons?
[05:03] <LINKSWORD2> They's BOUNCING! :D
[05:03] <c2tarun> really??   I'm sorry, my brain is in smartass mode tonight.
[05:06] <darthanubis> X prevents any key cmds for working
[05:07] <c2tarun> darthanubis: try ctrl+esc
[05:07] <mr-rich> darthanubis: are  you using free free drivers or vendor drivers?
[05:07] <darthanubis> nvidias
[05:07] <darthanubis> from th erepos
[05:07] <darthanubis> repos
[05:08] <mr-rich> darthanubis: so you ran the "get extra drivers" pgm?
[05:08] <darthanubis> yes
[05:08] <LINKSWORD2> Hey guys, I've checked the digital clock settings, and I can't find any way to enlarge the font. Kubuntu 11.04 Natty.
[05:09] <c2tarun> LINKSWORD2: system settings> application appearance
[05:10] <LINKSWORD2> OK, I'll check that.
[05:11] <mr-rich> c2tarun: debus will behave for like 3-5 days, then I'll find the cpu pegged on high ...
[05:12] <mr-rich> c2tarun: I'll check the # of fds open and sure enough, it 1024 ...
[05:12] <LINKSWORD2> Thanks again, c2tarun
[05:12] <mr-rich> c2tarun: I kill the update icon (kpackagekit) and it dropes to ~100 or so ...
[05:13] <c2tarun> mr-rich: is you system fully updated?
[05:13] <mr-rich> fully ...
[05:13] <mr-rich> the only program I don't update is tvtime ...
[05:14] <LINKSWORD2> WTF is that? lol
[05:14] <mr-rich> The latest version of tvtime will crash on startup because of my usb camera ...
[05:14] <c2tarun> mr-rich: then I fear I cant help you. I am not able to think of anything that might causing that problem, hang around for a while, someone will surely reply :)
[05:14] <mr-rich> tvtime is a tv viewing program ...
[05:15] <LINKSWORD2> xD
[05:15] <mr-rich> c2tarun: the temp work around is to kill kpackagekit every couple of days ...
[05:15] <mr-rich> it respawns in a few minutes anyway ...
[05:16] <c2tarun> mr-rich: in that way you will not be able to get the benefits of autmatic update I guess
[05:16] <mr-rich> c2tarun: the icon respawns ...
[05:16] <mr-rich> always comes back ...
[05:17] <mr-rich> takes a few days to eat up all the fds and then hammers the CPU ...
[05:18] <mr-rich> beats rebooting every week ... :)
[05:18] <LINKSWORD2> ;p;
[05:18] <LINKSWORD2> lol*
[05:19] <LINKSWORD2> Well, all.... I'm signing off for the night.
[05:19] <LINKSWORD2> See ya'll later.
[05:21] <akis> hi. what do i have to do to remove from wallet the the access to network connections?
[05:45] <DarthFrog> Open the Wallet Manager and delete the wallet.  But if you do that, you'll have to enter your password each time.
[05:50] <akis> or if i disabled wallet manager?
[06:36] <c2tarun> well why do you have to do any such thing to access network connection? Can't you just access it directly?
[06:45] <frogonwheels> c2tarun: you have a password for wifi?
[06:45] <c2tarun> frogonwheels: ya
[06:46] <frogonwheels> c2tarun: well that's why you need access to the wallet.
[06:46] <frogonwheels> (for right or wrong)
[06:47] <c2tarun> frogonwheels: actually  I was referring to question of akis, he asked to remove the wallet, we can enter the password and acces network con. and if he dont have wallet password then I guess he cannot remove it as well.
[06:48] <frogonwheels> oh yeah sorry, so you were:)  akis ^^^^
[06:49] <c2tarun> frogonwheels: I dont think he is still here :(
[06:50] <frogonwheels> c2tarun: nope. not. :) oh wel
[07:32] <simion314> is kubuntu site down? ubuntu.com works but not kubuntu.org
[07:35] <Unit193> simion314: Unable to Connect?
[07:36] <simion314> Unit193: yes
[08:27] <romeus> hello :)
[08:31] <romeus> I recently installed kubuntu having been a ubuntu user for a while. I'm trying to configure KDE with the shortcuts I'm used to. I noticed that the Global Keyboard Shortcuts utility doesn't allow mouse and keyboard combinations e.g. control+shift+click to close a window, control+alt+click drag to free rotate cube. Is there any way to do this?
[08:33] <romeus> (I'd like to stick to Kwin, and not switch to compiz)
[09:05] <cousin_mario> hello
[09:06] <cousin_mario> is there a standard way to have kde/qt apps start minimised?
[09:12] <fayaz_> cousin_mario: my first guess is playing around with qdbus...
[09:13] <fayaz_> but i couldn't find anything useful there...
[09:13] <fayaz_> cousin_mario: try poking around in there. you might get lucky
[09:16] <orzel> hello. A friend of mine is trying to update from maverick to natty using the GUI. The computer is blocked on "Installing update : 93%" and has not done anything more for hours. I only have a ssh access to it. I dont dare rebooting
[09:16] <orzel> pstree shows there are processes such as : natty───dpkg───linux-image-2.6───sh───update-initramf───mkinitramfs───mkinitramfs─┬─awk
[09:16] <orzel> and modprobe (under mkinitramfs)
[09:16] <orzel> top shows nothing special
[09:17] <orzel>  /var/log/dist-upgrade/main.log isn't touche since 1.5 hours ago
[09:18] <orzel> i've only done (successful) cli-only update using do-release-upgrade, so i'm a little bit stuck on this one
[09:20] <orzel> it seems the mkinitramfs is blocked. There is an empty file /boot/initrd.img-2.6.38-8-generic.new
[09:52] <shockrates> can someone upload the last version of kmess at ubuntu? (this one has network connection loss bug)
[09:52] <cousin_mario> fayaz: I'm not sure what that is...
[10:09] <shockrates> hey i get this
[10:10] <shockrates> sudo apt-get update
[10:10] <shockrates> E: Type 'src' is not known on line 2 in source list /etc/apt/sources.list.d/kmess-packages-kmess-stable-natty.list
[10:10] <shockrates> E: The list of sources could not be read.
[10:10] <shockrates> how do i fix it?\
[10:10] <FloodBotK1> shockrates: Please don't flood; use http://paste.ubuntu.com to paste; don't use Enter as punctuation.
[10:16] <fayaz> cousin_mario: qdbus? its a mechanism kde uses for ipc stuff...
[10:22] <cousin_mario> fayaz: Ok, I'm not very familiar with it.
[10:23] <cousin_mario> fayaz: I'm just trying to have a particular app start minimised.
[10:24] <fayaz> cousin_mario: qdbus command can be handy... just try it... the arguments are tabcompleted...
[10:28] <cousin_mario> fayaz: hmm, interesting
[10:30] <cousin_mario> fayaz: only it allows me to do everything but operate on the window gadgets
[11:16] <Gary-Stead> Hi !
[11:16] <Gary-Stead> I have a problem with Kubuntu : http://zupimages.net/up/0/1452279773.jpeg <= Screenshot
[11:16] <Gary-Stead> I don't know if you understand French :/
[11:19] <valorie> Gary-Stead: I see you get an error message, but do you still get sound?
[11:20] <Gary-Stead> valorie: In KDE no
[11:20] <Gary-Stead> valorie: Wait i try from other application
[11:20] <Gary-Stead> Ha >< I have a sound
[11:20] <Gary-Stead> But he is listen 1 time on 2
[11:20] <valorie> you might try #pulseaudio for more specific help
[11:21] <valorie> sorry, I'm off to bed
[11:21] <Gary-Stead> :/ Ok
[11:21] <mongrelp> test
[11:41] <Wulong> Are there anything like gnome-do for KDE? there was katapult in the old days.
[11:52] <namekcin> hello, how can i create split archive using 7z? maybe with Ark?
[11:52] <cousin_mario> bbl
[12:03] <BenceF> hi! is 11.04 a LTS release?
[12:04] <simion314> BenceF: no
[12:04] <BenceF> simion314: whats the release cycle for LTS releases in kubuntu?
[12:05] <simion314> 10.04 is LTS and 12.04 will be a LTS
[12:05] <BenceF> so its every two years then
[12:05] <simion314> BenceF: there are 2 years between 2 LTS
[12:05] <simion314> BenceF: yes
[12:05] <BenceF> ok
[12:07] <BenceF> thanks
[12:07] <BenceF> is there a way to upgrade from 10.04 to 11.04 directly?
[12:11] <Chronix> o.o
[12:11] <Chronix> anyone alive
[12:11] <Chronix> #kubuntu-offtopic
[12:11] <Chronix> ops
[12:12] <jacobw> cogito ergo sum
[12:12] <Chronix> lol
[12:13] <Chronix> how you you say that in english
[12:13] <Chronix> "i think so i am"?
[12:13] <BenceF> therefor
[12:19] <jacobw> yeah :)
[12:19] <jacobw> rene decartes ftw
[12:27] <Chronix> so is there anyone who programs in c++ here? what compiler do you use?
[12:28] <jacobw> g++
[12:29] <christophe> kubuntu
[12:33] <jacobw> heh
[12:33] <jacobw> Chronix:, are you learning C++ ?
[12:33] <Chronix> i kinda know the basics already but i have been programming on windows
[12:34] <Chronix> and i just switched to kubuntu yesterday
[12:34] <Chronix> and its my first time i use linux more than a day
[12:34] <Chronix> :P
[12:34] <Chronix> i dont plan on going back to windows anytime soon
[12:34] <Chronix> i was using visual studio i thought of using codeblocks as it looks similar and isnt bad
[12:37] <jacobw> kdevelop is the c/c++ ide included with KDE SC
[12:37] <jacobw> it does many other languages too
[12:38] <Chronix> i dont wanna think about other languages right now.. i mainly plan to develop games and i wish to try and get them cross platform
[12:39] <jacobw> compilers and IDEs are different
[12:40] <jacobw> visual studio is not a compiler, neither is kdevelop
[12:40] <Chronix> well i know its an ide
[12:40] <Chronix> i was just taking it general
[12:40] <Chronix> ly
[12:40] <Chronix> speaking
[12:40] <FloodBotK1> Chronix: Please don't flood; use http://paste.ubuntu.com to paste; don't use Enter as punctuation.
[12:41] <Chronix> i think ill probably use codeblocks as i like it.. but i wonder if its worth it
[12:41] <Chronix> i mean, if its good
[12:49] <ShorTie> i upgraded from 10.10 to 11.04, now all i get is a black screen .. :(~
[12:50] <jacobw> ShorTie: does pressing ctrl+alt+f2 take you to a terminal login?
[12:51] <ShorTie> ya, can get to netroot in recovery
[12:57] <jacobw> Chronix: i use vim to write code and compile it with g++
[12:57] <jacobw> Chronix: i think learning the language is the most important thing, the program you use to write the code is mostly irrelevent
[12:57] <ShorTie> is there a boot log somewhere i can look at?
[12:58] <Chronix> i have followed almost every video from antiRTFM on youtube
[12:58] <Chronix> i think ill just make an advanced text rpg and probably once i finish it ill move on to SDL
[13:03] <jacobw> i haven't heard of antirtfm before
[13:04] <Chronix> http://www.youtube.com/antiRTFM
[13:05] <Chronix> he covers most things about basics
[13:10] <jacobw> i think i prefer books to videos
[13:11] <Chronix> what books do you suggest
[13:12] <Tm_T> !offtopic
[13:12] <Tm_T> just a kind reminder ^
[13:12] <Chronix> im already on that channel
[13:13] <jacobw> i've never learnt C++ so i ca't really comment on C++, but i found 'The C Programming Language' great for learning C
[13:13] <c2tarun_> anyone here using tata photon+ on kubuntu?
[13:17] <jacobw> Chronix: #c++ will have a lot to say about learning c++
[13:17] <Chronix> thank you jacobw :P
[13:37] <mellin> Morning. My wireless connection automatically disconnects when the screen locks, or I close my laptop lid. How do I change this behaviour?
[14:06] <soee> is there any chance that we see KDE 4.7b in Kubuntu repos soon ?
[14:16] <takoski> Hi
[14:17] <takoski> whats channel Ubuntu italy?
[14:21] <OerHeks> !it | takoski
[14:22] <takoski> Hi i have a problem for Xdcc send
[14:22] <takoski> i use ubuntu 11.04 and konversation
[14:23] <takoski> program tell me Sorry, this command is unsupported
[14:27] <BluesKaj> Howdy all
[14:28] <takoski> ?
[14:28] <takoski> Hi i have a problem for Xdcc send
[14:28] <takoski> program tell me Sorry, this command is unsupported
[14:28] <FloodBotK1> takoski: Please don't flood; use http://paste.ubuntu.com to paste; don't use Enter as punctuation.
[14:46] <aliengod> oin #ubuntu.hu
[14:54] <dsaintz> hello
[15:04] <cousin_mario> hello
[15:04] <cousin_mario> what's the recommended multimedia plugin to use with firefox?
[15:08] <dan_l> cousin_mario:  for what type of mulimedia?
[15:09] <cousin_mario> dan_l: wmv, avi, mpg...
[15:09] <dan_l> cousin_mario:  that stuff isn't working out of the box for you?
[15:09] <cousin_mario> dan_l: not really
[15:10] <cousin_mario> dan_l: what plugin are you using, in case it does for you?
[15:10] <dan_l> vlc multimedia plugin
[15:10] <dan_l> but that might be because I have VLC installed
[15:15] <cousin_mario> dan_l: that was my choice as well, but it doesn't appear to be working:/
[15:15] <dan_l> send me a link to what isn't working?
[15:15] <cousin_mario> oh, wait, I had another plugin installed as well
[15:16] <cousin_mario> trying again
[15:19] <cousin_mario> dan_l: found a link that won't work, but it's not exactly SFW
[15:19] <dan_l> I'm not exactly at work.
[15:19] <dan_l> you can pm it over
[15:20] <cousin_mario> dan_l: err, is there anything I can do to debug it in place?:)
[15:21] <dan_l> There are occasional problems with websites that are off the interwebz beaten path.   Perhaps go here and identify where exactly the problem is:  http://www.cs.nyu.edu/~argyle/browser_plugin_test.html
[15:22] <dan_l> but come on man, it's 9:30 am.  Pr0n already?  :)
[15:22] <cousin_mario> it's 16:22 for me:)
[15:24] <cousin_mario> dan_l: the mpg test page is not opening:/
[15:25] <cousin_mario> any chance it's geoip limited?
[15:25] <dan_l> http://www.archive.org/details/test-mpeg
[15:25] <dan_l> try that?
[15:26] <mr-rich> dan_l: do you live in East Canada?
[15:27] <dan_l> mr-rich, are you calling me french?
[15:27] <dan_l> No.  I'm from Chicago.
[15:27] <mr-rich> aha ...
[15:27] <cousin_mario> dan_l: that crashes as well
[15:27] <dan_l> It's a small town near a big lake.  Why do you ask?
[15:27] <mr-rich> wrong direction ...
[15:27] <dan_l> cousin_mario, so it loads the page and crashes out on you?
[15:28] <cousin_mario> dan_l: it crashes when I click the link
[15:28] <mr-rich> it's 10:30 here ...
[15:28] <cousin_mario> the .mpg file, that is
[15:28] <dan_l> the browser crashes on you?
[15:28] <cousin_mario> yes
[15:28] <dan_l> ffx4 on natty?
[15:29] <cousin_mario> rightio
[15:29] <DarkriftX> whats the best way to see which nvidia driver im using?
[15:30] <BluesKaj> DarkriftX, in the kmenu > apps> settings
[15:31] <DarkriftX> nvidia settings shows me "270.41.06" but the drivers have numbers lke 96, 173 and 185
[15:32] <dan_l> cousin_mario:  does vlc otherwise work for you?
[15:32] <BluesKaj> DarkriftX, those are drivers for older Kubuntu Versions
[15:32] <cousin_mario> dan_l: yes, it can play the same files if downloaded separately
[15:33] <BluesKaj> if you are using 11.04 then the 270 driver is the correct one , DarkriftX
[15:33] <DarkriftX> ok
[15:33] <DarkriftX> thanks
[15:33] <dan_l> cousin_mario:  x64?
[15:33] <cousin_mario> dan_l: yes
[15:34] <cousin_mario> dan_l: /usr/lib/firefox-4.0.1/firefox-bin: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins/libvlcplugin.so: undefined symbol: NPP_Initialize <- this is what comes out in the console on crash
[15:36] <dan_l> have a look at this:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vlc/+bug/722690
[15:36] <dan_l> there doesn't appear to be a suggested solution
[15:37] <dan_l> but, I would think you could uninstall vlc and see what else happens
[15:37] <dan_l> I'm not sure why this isn't happening to me.
[15:37] <dan_l> Maybe because I have medibuntu?
[15:37] <dan_l> brb
[15:37] <cousin_mario> I have medibuntu as well
[15:40]  * cousin_mario can't help the feeling of having stepped into a powder keg since installing natty.
[15:42] <DarkriftX> its always like that at first
[15:43] <DarkriftX> thats why i normally wait 1-4 weeks. lets everyone in here figure all the hard stuff out so i can beg for help :P
[15:44] <cousin_mario> DarkriftX: if only 4 weeks sufficed:P
[15:44] <DarkriftX> meh, it helps a lot, trust me
[16:16] <cousin_mario> I think I've tried every possible media player and none seems to be working as well as totem.
[16:59] <dmtarmey> does anyone know of a good alternative to cheese as it dosnt seem to work on my machine very well
[17:09] <wn1zid> camorama
[17:16] <dmtarmey> cheers wn1zid how do i install it pls
[17:19] <wn1zid> I've never used it, but i know its a pain to install, maybe some one here knows
[17:29] <DarthFrog> wn1zid: What's wrong with "sudo apt-get install camorama"?
[17:30] <wn1zid> well, from googling, there seem to be some issues on installing it in kubuntu, like i said, I've never used it in kubuntu so i don't know.
[17:54] <ilias> what is the best program to see tv in kubuntu?
[17:56] <fosstux> Hi! I have massive problems setting up my Logitech Bluetooth mouse M555B on 11.04. I cannot connect my laptop with this mouse - What am I doing wrong????
[17:58] <DarthFrog> ilias: I use MythTV.
[17:59] <ilias> is installable with sudo apt-get install command?
[18:01] <DarthFrog> ilias: Yes.  But I suggest you go to http://www.mythtv..org first to find out if it's what you want.
[18:02] <DarthFrog> !mythtv | ilias
[18:03] <DarthFrog> It's very well supported.  And extremely capable.  But not simple. :-)
[18:04] <ilias> is it running in 10.04 as well?
[18:05] <DarthFrog> Yes.  There's also an Ubuntu version based on it:  Mythbuntu.
[18:06] <ilias> ok thanks. for scanners what software do you suggest?
[18:07] <DarthFrog> Image scanners?  XSane.
[18:08] <ilias> is it installable trough terminal?
[18:08] <DarthFrog> Though there is a native KDE scanning program.  Can't remember what it's called, haven't looked at it in a long time but I remember thinking that XSane was head and shoulders above it.  I think it's name might be Kooka or something like that.
[18:09] <DarthFrog> try "apt-cache search <package name or search term>" to find out what's available to install.
[18:14] <ilias> i am using in my desktop suse 11.2 and there are pre-installed 2 programs, i dont remember know their names and i am using only the 1 of them. xsane looks better. i am asking all these besause i am running in my notebook 10.04 and is very light and fast although my notebook is 5 years old (1,5 ghz+750 mb ram) so i i am considering to installe 10.04 to my desktop too (2,2 dula core + 1gb ram). in my desktop they are connected a usb tv card and an old hp
[18:14] <ilias> scanmachine plus a usb samsung printer. all these devices are running very well under 11.2. Are you sure 10.04 would revognze them and install the apropriate drivers?
[18:15] <DarthFrog> Am I sure?  Of course not.  I've never even seen your hardware. :-)
[18:16] <DarthFrog> ilias: Remember: Answers are $1, correct answers are $10.  Dumb looks are still free. :-)
[18:16] <DarthFrog> You're getting it free, here. :-)
[18:16] <ilias> yea ok. sure is not the appropriate word. have you the opinion or the hope that 10.04 can do it?
[18:17] <DarthFrog> I would expect so.  If your hardware is supported in Linux, I would expect that Ubuntu will be able to use it.
[18:17] <ilias> i know very well all these. i am old enough in linux users' community.
[18:18] <DarthFrog> 10.04 is only 1 year old, after all.
[18:18] <DarthFrog> Plug your USB scanner in and see what happens.  It probably won't blow up and catch fire. :-)
[18:19] <ilias> ok. that is an advantage. because both my tv card and my scanner they have been recognized from older versions of use (10+).
[18:19] <wn1zid> lol
[18:20] <wn1zid> spending the few extra bucks for more ram sure makes things easier on your system.
[18:20] <ilias> as kinfocenter is not pre-installed in 10.04 how can i check running live cd if the system can "see" my usb tv card?
[18:21] <DarthFrog> wn1zid: And on your patience.  While patience may be a virtue, the necessity for patience is a PITA.
[18:21] <DarthFrog> ilias:  Use the "lsusb" command.  Try "lsusb -v | less".
[18:22] <ilias> this command will show every usb device plugged on my system?
[18:23] <DarthFrog> If it isn't listed in the output, your system doesn't know about it.
[18:25] <DarthFrog> W00t!  The next kernel will be 3.0. :-)
[18:25] <ilias> very helpful indeed. thanks. what do you think is better to choise 10.04 or 11.04?
[18:25] <cousin_mario> ilias: avoid 11.04 like the plague
[18:25] <ilias> i am running already as i have mentioned above 10.04
[18:25] <wn1zid> if they keep unity, ill go debian.
[18:26] <cousin_mario> wn1zid: it's not like gnome 3 is much better...
[18:26] <wn1zid> it will get better, they always fix the bugs
[18:26] <cousin_mario> it's not about bugs
[18:26] <wn1zid> but unity, forget it
[18:26] <ilias> @cousin...plague!!!
[18:26] <DarthFrog> ilias: I can't give you a firm answer to that.  I run 10.04 on one machine because that's the last version that I can get the Loki version of Alpha Centauri to work properly.  My main machine is 11.04 and works fine.  10.04 is best for folks who just want to use their machine and not tinker with it.
[18:26] <ilias> 10.04 is ok.
[18:27] <DarthFrog> Loki's Alpha Centauri runs fine in 11.04, but I can't get sound to work. :-(   It's my favourite game.
[18:27]  * DarthFrog is old school.
[18:28] <ilias> 10.04 is very fast and stable. and with chrome on it is extremely fast for internet's browsing. i recommend it with any doubt.
[18:28] <DarthFrog> It's also a LTS version.
[18:29] <ilias> i can say that my older notebook with 10.04 and chrome is faster than my newer desktop with dual core running suse 11.2 and ff.
[18:30] <ilias> i am running 10.04 lts actually. is this better than palin 10.04?
[18:30] <ilias> i am running 10.04 lts actually. is this better than plain 10.04?
[18:30] <cousin_mario> 10.04 *is* a LTS version
[18:31] <DarthFrog> ilias: `They're one and the same.
[18:31] <ilias> ok. ic.
[18:31] <cousin_mario> ilias: stick with it, natty is beta quality at best
[18:33] <ilias> well i try it tommorow on my desktop and i ihave probls i join this forum, to help me. i hope it will see my tv card and my scanner too. i think is very simple to do it.
[18:46] <jacobw> i can't seek to a position in the audio file in amarok?
[18:46] <cousin_mario> bbl
[18:46] <jacobw> the file is an mp3, is this a known problem with the gstreamer codecs?
[18:48] <wn1zid> it wont play any mp3's ??
[18:49] <jacobw> https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=237298
[18:49] <jacobw> that is the issue i'm having, it turns out that i answered my own question quite well :D
[18:49] <wn1zid> ya
[18:57] <Karen> hi all can anyone help me with my ubuntu error?
[18:58] <Karen> hey anyone here?
[18:59] <Karen> anyone  live here? or all bots?
[18:59] <DarthFrog> !ask
[18:59] <Torch> All bots
[19:00] <Karen> ok thank u
[19:00] <Karen> hi
[19:00] <Karen> i have a problem like this
[19:01] <Karen> i have 2 operating systems Windows 7 and ubuntu but now it bring me a problem , its all in black and one line GRUB RESCUE  i have many files in my windows desktop can u said me how can i but to my windows and take all from there?
[19:02] <DarthFrog> Umm, your English is somewhat hard to understand.  What's black and what does "but to my windows" mean?
[19:02] <Karen> can u help me with that DarthFrog?
[19:03] <DarthFrog> "but" = boot?
[19:03] <Karen> DarthFrog yes sorry for that i am not good in english
[19:03] <DarthFrog> What is your native language?
[19:03] <Karen> i can speak russian or armenian
[19:04] <DarthFrog> You could try #ubuntu-ru and ask in Russian.
[19:04] <DarthFrog> !ru
[19:04] <Karen> thank u now i will try
[19:04] <DarthFrog> Good luck.
[19:04] <Karen> thank u
[19:14] <jarle> is there some generic x-init files, in ~/ that I can put my startup scripts in that will work no matter which desktop I choose to run?
[19:16] <jarle> I think .xinitrc is only run if using startx, not when using kdm?
[19:40] <Monika> After upgrading my husband's netbook to Kubuntu 11.04, KDE does not start by itself anymore. Instead when selecting KDE Plasma Desktop only a console starts in the top left corner, without window decoration. When I type startkde into it, KDE starts normally. The /usr/share/xsessions/kde-plasma.desktop file looks alright. What can I do to fix this?
[19:41] <melkor> Is there an easy way to clear recent documents?
[19:41] <Monika> In the K menu? Right-click.
[19:42] <Monika> There you have the options "Clear recent programs" and "Clear recent documents"
[19:42] <melkor> okay Ill try it.
[19:44] <melkor> I don't see any option to clear documents when I right click on the K menu.
[19:48] <melkor> Its really odd that there isn't a convenient way to clear recent documents.
[19:49] <Monika> melkor in the K menu on the tab with the recent items
[19:49] <Monika> right-click there
[19:49] <Monika> do not right-click on the K
[19:50] <melkor> okay, I actually have to do it on the documents.  I was doing it on the Recent tab and I did not get the option to clear.
[19:51] <Monika> ah, yeah
[19:51] <Monika> that's a bit confusing
[20:29] <GRWCHo> hey ... dose anyone have an ETA on KDE 4.7 beta on kubuntu.
[20:32] <Monika> What's an ETA?
[20:32] <GRWCHo> Estimated Time of Arrivel :)
[20:33] <GRWCHo> when will it be available ... in the beta PPA ?
[20:33] <GRWCHo> anyone ?
[20:34] <DarkwingDuck> GRWCHo: It's been talked about. I don't have a good ETA though.
[20:34] <DarkwingDuck> hey LINKSWORD2
[20:34] <LINKSWORD2> Greetings.
[20:35] <GRWCHo> DarkwingDuck:  will it be released in the due release date ie. 25.07.2011 ?
[20:38] <DarkwingDuck> GRWCHo: I think that will come up in our next meeting... We are going to be going over specs then.
[20:39] <DarkwingDuck> GRWCHo: and I should have a better answer after that.
[20:40] <DarkwingDuck> GRWCHo: I would expect to see it around Beta2 for the Oneiric 11.10 cycle
[20:41] <kubuntunoob> hi all
[20:42] <DarkwingDuck> GRWCHo: For a Oneiric 11.10 timeline you can refer https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricReleaseSchedule
[20:42] <GRWCHo> DarkwingDuck: 10x
[20:43] <DarkwingDuck> GRWCHo: ??
[20:43] <ckDev> Hi guys. Just got my new Lenovo Thinkpad W520 and i fail to install 11.04, and 10.4.2 LTS, anyone had the same probs
[20:44] <DarkwingDuck> ckDev: What fails? It's works 100% on my ThinkPad W700
[20:45] <ckDev> with 11.04 I get to the blue install screen, where I select the language and the start the live cd. It just keeps hanging at that stage after presssing enter
[20:46] <ckDev> with 10.04 I have not (initramfs) Unable to find a medium containing a live file system
[20:46] <ckDev> I have now: initramfs.....
[20:47] <GRWCHo> DarkwingDuck: i said thanks :(10=ten+X)
[20:47] <ckDev> DarkwingDuck: are you on 11.04?
[20:47] <DarkwingDuck> I caught that right after I hit the ?? LOL
[20:47] <DarkwingDuck> ckDev: have you tried the alt installer/
[20:47] <DarkwingDuck> ?
[20:48] <DarkwingDuck> i'm not sure why it's hanging but, I have not used a liveCD in a very very long time.
[20:48] <ckDev> DarkingDuck: nope, thats actually a good idea.
[20:48] <ShorTie> did you check the cd
[20:49] <ckDev> ShorTie: Yes, did, tried using USB sticks and CDs, several times. Downloading the alternate cd now, probably best bet.
[20:50] <DarkwingDuck> ckDev: I would assume so... Also, do you use hardware RAID?
[20:50] <ckDev> DarkwinDuck: no Raid. So you installed 11.04?
[20:51] <DarkwingDuck> ckDev: Yup, no issues.
[20:52] <DarkwingDuck> Well, aside from the annoying nVidia stuff
[20:53] <ckDev> downloading now, will see how it goes
[20:59] <Guest47834> .
[20:59] <Guest47834> hum
[21:02] <sourav7mishra> I just messed with the panel at the bottom of my desktop..I am no longer getting the list of applications opened in a desktop..and all the visible/invisible icons have come to the right.. how can I fix this..
[21:03] <DarkwingDuck> sourav7mishra: 1) Remove the panel 2) Right click desktop and unlock widgets 3) right click desktop Add Panel > Default Panel
[21:03] <DarkwingDuck> This will restore the default panel
[21:10] <sourav7mishra> @DarkwingDuck, when I right click @ the desktop, I get the 'Lock Widgets' option..!
[21:12] <sourav7mishra> DarkwingDuck: when I right click @ the desktop, I get the 'Lock Widgets' option..!
[21:13] <montfras> soura7mishra: that means they are already unlocked, proceed with the next step
[21:14] <LINKSWORD2> Is there a way to be notified if Caps Lock, Num Lock, etc. is on?
[21:15] <DarkwingDuck> Most keyboards/laptops have a light...
[21:16] <DarkwingDuck> But, for those that don't I'm sure it wouldn't be a large python script to detect it.
[21:16] <LINKSWORD2> Well, my keyboard does not. I need an alert or something.
[21:17] <DarkwingDuck> I know know of anything off the top of my head though.
[21:17] <LINKSWORD2> BRB
[21:19] <sithlord48> can anyone help me create a .desktop file that is a link to sh "path of .desktop"/install/script.sh . it seams that sh loses the path of the .desktop file
[21:20] <tsimpson> you can't get the location of the .desktop file from within it
[21:21] <montfras> LINKSWORD2: http://kde-apps.org/content/show.php/KeyLeds+Plasmoid?content=136203
[21:21] <tsimpson> montfras: he left
[21:21] <sithlord48> im trying to create a portable installer  the script runs but for ease i want to lanch it via a .desktop file do u know of a way to do this ?
[21:21] <montfras> great :p
[21:22] <tsimpson> sithlord48: don't bother with the .desktop file? ;)
[21:23] <tsimpson> besides, scripts usually want a terminal to run in, which .desktop files don't provide
[21:23] <sithlord48> this script is all kdialog stuff
[21:23] <montfras> sithlord48: right click in a folder should give you the option to make a shortcut to a program
[21:24] <tsimpson> montfras: his issue is that the location to "the program" isn't known
[21:24] <sithlord48> the main issues is the folder needs to be portable as its an installer for a program
[21:24] <montfras> if it is in the same package you can use a symbolic path
[21:25] <tsimpson> sithlord48: just have the script executable, I haven't seen a DE where you can't just double-click a .sh and have it run
[21:25] <montfras> and include a README with instructions incase it's not possible
[21:26] <montfras> automatic installation is considered rude in some ocasions
[21:27] <sithlord48> tsimpson:  my only consern is that the file will lose the =X
[21:27] <tsimpson> not if you put it in a .tar
[21:28] <sithlord48> will be .tar.gz
[21:28] <tsimpson> then permissions are stored along with the files
[21:28] <c2tarun> I am facing a weird problem, I bought a mobile broadband data card today, when I am plugging it I am getting connection option, I am able to connect it and use it, but on disconnecting I can see two n-m icons in tray icons and none of my applications work on disconnecting.
[21:28] <sithlord48> well then i guess i don't need the .desktop at all
[21:29] <c2tarun> + when I reboot my kernel freez on kubuntu splash screen and then I have to manually reboot and then it starts, why is it happening?
[21:33] <akshay2000> Hello.
[21:34] <Monika> After upgrading my husband's netbook to Kubuntu 11.04 / KDE 4.6.2, KDE/Plasma does not start by itself anymore. Instead when selecting "KDE Plasma Desktop" as the session type only a console starts in the top left corner, without window decoration. When I type startkde into it, KDE starts normally. The /usr/share/xsessions/kde-plasma.desktop file looks alright. Any ideas how to fix this?
[21:38] <sithlord48> tsimpson: ah i think i found my issue. im testing on my computer and transporting to another one via usb stick when i copy the folder (as a folder) to the stick it loses isExecutiable (no +x from /media allowed?)
[21:39] <tsimpson> yeah, usually everything mounted in /media has +x removed
[21:45] <SMOSA> hola
[22:11] <jumanji> hello :D
[22:14] <Nardel> hello world
[22:15] <frodo> most are sleeping
[22:45] <andreb> hi all
[22:45] <andreb> has anyone done bind in chroot ? on buntu 10.04 ?
[22:49] <giantpune> hi boys.  i have gotten used to the gnome DE and have recently made the switch to KDE.  there are a couple things im trying to figure out and im hoping somebody can help me
[22:51] <giantpune> first, i cant figure out how to use KDE to open a program and pass something via argv.  for example, in gnome, windows,and OSX, you can drag a file onto some program and it will open that program and pass the filename as argv[ 1 ].  does KDE not support this?
[22:52] <LINKSWORD2> Well, that was fun.
[22:53] <LINKSWORD2> I installed Avant Window Navigator and got a message that my computer did not have the hardware required to run Unity with AWN.
[22:53] <LINKSWORD2> After removing AWN and restarting, my computer is still showing the Ubuntu classic layout & interface. How can I fix this?
[22:55] <giantpune> and second, when you drag a file into the terminal in gnome, it copies the filename and puts a space after the name. in kubuntu, i can drag a file into the terminal, but i dont see how to have it automatically put the space after the filename.  does anybody know of a way to do this?
[23:04] <Mausschubser> hello, strigi doesn't run on my system even when the tick is put
[23:04] <Mausschubser> but nepomuk does
[23:05] <Mausschubser> I can't find an answer on ubuntuusers.de
[23:14] <Mausschubser> there is to be a test
[23:14] <Mausschubser> to check strig and stuff
[23:15] <Mausschubser> strigi
[23:16] <Mausschubser> apachelogger: hallo
[23:17] <Mausschubser> good night
[23:38] <Newbiathon> how do i connect to irc using quassel with ssl encryption?
[23:39] <Newbiathon> anyone have the time to explain?
[23:40] <Ddpbf> Newbiathon: i ll have some time in few minuts
[23:42] <Newbiathon> k thank u Ddpbf
[23:43] <Ddpbf> just to install quassel
[23:43] <Ddpbf> :>
[23:43] <Ddpbf> why you dont use konversation?
[23:46] <Ddpbf> Newbiathon: are you here?
[23:46] <Ddpbf> go to file -> networks->configure network
[23:47] <Ddpbf> and check in ssl
[23:48] <Newbiathon_> hey
[23:48] <Newbiathon_> sorry im new to kubuntu and don't know where my quassel client minimized to
[23:48] <Newbiathon_> lol
[23:48] <Newbiathon_> my name fits eh?
[23:49] <Ddpbf> it minimizied in systemtray
[23:49] <Ddpbf> there is two of you
[23:49] <Ddpbf> :)
[23:50] <Newbiathon> oh ok found it
[23:51] <Newbiathon> ill ditch one
[23:52] <Newbiathon> is quassel a good irc client?
[23:52] <rww> yes
[23:52] <Ddpbf> yes
[23:52] <Newbiathon> or should i get xchat or something?
[23:52] <Newbiathon> ok
[23:52] <Ddpbf> it is complicated
[23:52] <Ddpbf> but good
[23:52] <Newbiathon> so to do the ssl connection for security
[23:52] <Ddpbf> Newbiathon: better use konvesation
[23:52] <Ddpbf> it is also kde programm
[23:52] <Ddpbf> it si more friendly
[23:53] <Newbiathon> i know all the old school irc commands
[23:53] <Newbiathon> setting alias and all
[23:53] <Newbiathon> just not familiar with kubuntu yet
[23:53] <Newbiathon> so ssl is like using a proxy kind of?
[23:54] <Newbiathon> connecting through another pc"?
[23:54] <Ddpbf> secret security layer
[23:54] <Newbiathon> not sure what secure socket layer actually does
[23:55] <Ddpbf> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Sockets_Layer
[23:55] <DeltaEpsilon> are there going to be kde 4.7 beta packages in the repo?
[23:58] <Ddpbf> Newbiathon: did you tied to connect
[23:58] <Ddpbf> with ssl?


[13:58] <mnn> while looking into RenameMap, I've found a bug - bzr move --auto tries to move parent directory, even though that wasn't actually moved
[13:59] <mnn> pastebin of commands should explain better:
[13:59] <mnn> http://pastebin.com/5aL3Qrnn
[14:01] <mnn> this is present both in trunk and also in 2.5.1
[14:05] <mnn> no idea if this is intended or not, but I'd like to post a bug on launchpad, if there are no objections
[15:03] <wgz> mnn: I tend to go with a file-first policy, marking a bug as a dupe or invalid later if I learn something else works fine
[15:04] <wgz> I think we may have a bug for this though, search for "inconsistent delta"
[15:05] <wgz> maybe bug 373319?
[15:10] <wgz> the dirstate code is frustratingly hard to hack on, but people have managed to dive in and fix problems with it in the past
[16:12] <mnn> wgz: well I actually wanted to adjust move --auto to handle moving into new directory, while stumbled upon this
[18:29] <mnn> wgz: I think I have identified the problem
[18:29] <mnn> I need to try the fix and run the tests, if I haven't broken anything in the process
[18:56] <mnn> ok, it seems we have a winner:
[18:56] <mnn> http://pastebin.com/QRfpeZjx
[19:21] <mnn> here's test with reproduction script from 373319
[19:21] <mnn> http://pastebin.com/tZKzTjrF
[19:31] <mnn> ok, the code doesn't choke on complicated cases... so I guess it's ready:
[19:31] <mnn> http://pastebin.com/0GaUf7UJ
[22:11] <mnn> what is this???
[22:11] <mnn> 'bzr: ERROR: unknown command ""status""\n'
[22:12] <mnn> first I did simple self.run_bzr('status') but got exception about result code mismatch - so I tried self.run_bzr('status', 3) and got this nonsense
[22:18] <wgz> mnn: using bzr from outside its normal initialisation, you need a bunch of extra silly steps
[22:20] <wgz> see lp:~gz/+junk/call_bzr_init for an example
[22:21] <mnn> my working directory is actually a branch ... I'm aware that bzr's working directory needs to be in such directory
[22:21] <mnn> I'm writing a test
[22:21] <wgz> okay, then you just want to look at the tests under blackbox for actually running commands
[22:22] <wgz> the base test class doesn't support doing things with bzr commands or things on disk
[22:23] <mnn> I'm modifying TestRenameMap which is a TestCaseWithTransport
[22:23] <mnn> TestAdd is TestCaseWithTransport too
[22:23] <mnn> and it uses self.run_bzr(), obviously
[22:24] <wgz> okay, I need to stop answering your questions before thinking properly :)
[22:25] <mnn> yeah :) because unfortunately they haven't been helpful
[22:27] <mnn> and btw could you take another look at this?
[22:27] <mnn> https://code.launchpad.net/~mnn282/bzr/sftp-unsupported-operation-more-info/+merge/116849
[22:28] <wgz> yup, I shall, stop being slack and respond to that
[22:28] <wgz> some of my advice from the other day wasn't completely ideal either :)
[22:29] <mnn> yeah... but I was able to work around them :)
[22:30] <wgz> so, for instance, @classmethod would probably be better than staticmethod for the _translate_io_error function, which then takes cls as the first argument and saves importing and upcalling to Transport
[22:30] <wgz> and a few other little niggles, otherwise it's great
[22:30] <mnn> well write all those niggles there, I will take a look at them later... now I want bzr status! :)
[22:31] <wgz> ...not having any ideas on your self.run_bzr("status") problem, looking at bzrlib/tests/blackbox/test_status.py (especially the simpler tests at the bottom)... it should just work
[22:31] <wgz> pastebin me the smallest test you get weirdness with?
[22:36] <mnn> well even such small test gives me save result:
[22:36] <mnn> http://pastebin.com/wddFKXNj
[22:36] <mnn> I definitely must be doing something wrong
[22:43] <wgz> give me a whole test class and method
[22:43] <mnn> wow, this is just weird... suddenly it works :) I've tackled issues with locks and inequality issues
[22:44] <mnn> will push the branch and make merge proposal
[22:44] <wgz> right, that looked like it should be fine given the right test class
[22:50] <wgz> have you discovered the neat way of running just a subset of tests yet?
[22:51] <wgz> do `python bzr selftest -s bt.test_source` for instance
[22:52] <mnn> I use bzr selftest -v source_name (i.e. bzr selftest -v test_rename_map)
[22:54] <mnn> btw. https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/373319
[22:54] <mnn> wow, it took 3 years to fix a bug from its original discovery... and such high priority bug
[22:54] <wgz> using -s and the path (bt. short for bzrlib.tests. and bb. being short for bzrlib.tests.blackbox) avoids loading all the other modules so is nice and quick
[23:01] <mnn> yeah.. it is much faster... however it seems to print less information than -v
[23:02] <mnn> wgz: btw. more reviewing :)
[23:02] <mnn> https://code.launchpad.net/~mnn282/bzr/auto-rename-fix/+merge/117203
[23:02] <wgz> mnn: looks like you could simplify that test a little but doing:
[23:03] <wgz> tree = self.make_branch_and_tree('.')
[23:03] <wgz> rather than 'tree'
[23:03] <mnn> yeah, right
[23:03] <mnn> I'm still new to all this
[23:03] <wgz> the rest is going over my head right now
[23:04] <mnn> no problem... just don't forget about me :)
[23:05] <wgz> and you do want to run `bzr selftest -s bt.test_source` on your branches
[23:05] <wgz> because we have a test that fails if there's not a unix-style newline terminator at the end
[23:06] <wgz> and I think both branches have a file that like that
[23:06] <wgz> shows up in the diff on the mp as:
[23:06] <wgz> \ No newline at end of file
[23:06] <wgz> (picky I know... but it's there)
[23:08] <wgz> good work on both though, even if I nitpick things a fair bit, it's only because the fundamentals are good and you're just not familiar with a few style things
[23:08] <mnn> no problem... that's why I always ask about stuff
[23:08] <mnn> ... and sometimes hitting a wall here :)
[23:13] <wgz> mnn: can you do <http://www.canonical.com/contributors>?
[23:13] <wgz> there's an online form and the terms a less silly than they used to be
[23:14] <wgz><EMAIL_ADDRESS>is who you want to cc at the end.
[23:15] <mnn> yeah, I see him on the page:  John Arbash Meinel (john.meinel {at} canonical {dot} com)
[23:20] <mnn> it's actually the first license agreement that I'm reading fully... since it's so short :)


[09:49] <jcristau> bryce_: hi. any chance you can try the patch i attached to fdo bug 16674? it fixed vesa/randr here
[09:52] <bryce_> jcristau: I can package it up for matt to test; unfortunately I'm on travel in London this week and don't have access to my test gear
[09:53] <jcristau> ok
[10:06] <bryce_> wow, such a simple fix
[10:09] <jcristau> yeah. it turns out that (int) (mode->Clock * 1000.0 / mode->HTotal / mode->VTotal + 0.5) when mode->Clock, mode->HTotal and mode->VTotal are all 0 doesn't give such a meaningful refresh rate
[10:12] <bryce_> ahh
[10:13] <jcristau> spent a few hours trying to understand what was going wrong
[10:18] <bryce_> much appreciated.  building server pkgs presently...
[10:19] <bryce_> yeah I banged my head on gdk client-side for the better part of a day before I left
[10:20] <jcristau> i figured it wasn't a client-side problem when i made a trivial app that just did XRRGetScreenResources()/XRRGetCrtcInfo()/XRRGetOutputInfo() and that returned crap
[11:06] <bryce_> jcristau: ok posted to http://people.ubuntu.com/~bryce/Testing/xserver/ and asked mdz to give it a try
[11:08] <crevette> hey bryce
[11:16] <bryce_> heya crevette
[11:34] <crevette> bryce_, I've a brand new thinkpad T61 with intel chip, and all is working great except cpu sticks to 100% cpu for intensive CPU
[11:36] <crevette> I blaming GPU because with the same hardware with Nvidia I didn't have issue
[11:36] <crevette> is it a known issue
[11:36] <crevette> ?
[11:50] <bryce_> crevette: don't know
[11:57] <mvo> bryce_: *cough* I just uploaded the new mesa from debian experimental to intrepid
[12:07] <bryce_> mvo: great.  any effect on the bugs we're looking at?
[13:17] <bryce_> jcristau: yes mdz confirmed that this patch fixes the issue
[13:17] <jcristau> cool
[14:20] <tormod> this looks wrong: 7.1~rc3-1~ppa1 Published in intrepid-release 2 hours ago
[14:38] <bryce_> tormod: is that the mesa release?
[14:38] <bryce_> mvo accidentally uploaded it earlier.  However I assume it failed to build?
[14:38] <bryce_> in any case he's planning on putting a fixed up new mesa in
[14:38] <mvo> bryce_: yes, my bad
[14:38] <mvo> it fails to build
[14:39] <mvo> never do more than one thing at a time ;)
[14:39] <tormod> bryce_: the version looked a bit strange for a real upload :)
[14:39]  * mvo blushes in shame
[14:39] <tormod> glad to see a new mesa coming anyway!
[14:39] <bryce_> mvo apologized profusely to us and will fix :-)
[14:41] <bryce_> mvo, right no need to do the merge via git
[14:41] <bryce_> mvo, our git page - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/GitUsage
[14:41] <bryce_> only xorg and xorg-server require git
[14:42] <bryce_> hmm, speaking of which I forgot to check in the fix for matt's bug
[14:42] <tormod> mesa should be synced, right?
[14:42] <jcristau> there's an ubuntu branch for mesa too
[14:42] <jcristau> tormod: no
[14:42] <tormod> the ubuntu branch is not up to date
[14:43] <bryce_> jcristau: I believe timo created that for merge convenience, but isn't requiring it
[14:44] <tormod> the build failure indicates it can not be synced I guess...
[14:44] <jcristau> a bit weird to have a branch there if it's not going to be used
[14:44] <bryce_> tormod: it needs to be merged
[14:48]  * mvo is working on it now
[15:05] <jcristau> bryce_: hmm, there's already a python binding for libxf86config, i thought
[15:05] <bryce_> tjaalton: it looks like maybe your -0ubuntu2 change for xorg-server wasn't committed to git?  (or maybe I'm doing something wrong...)
[15:06] <jcristau> right, no -0ubuntu2 in git
[15:11] <tjaalton> damn, let me push (back again)
[15:11] <bryce_> tjaalton: you'll need to merge my change I just uploaded (sorry)
[15:11] <tjaalton> bryce_: no worries, my bad
[15:17] <bryce_> summarizes current X in ubuntu:  http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=ubuntu_810_xorg&num=1
[15:29] <tjaalton> yeah, merging mesa using the git branch would be trivial
[16:00] <mvo> tjaalton: could you please check if you can merge my (not yet uploaded changes) from http://people.ubuntu.com/~mvo/git/mesa.git/ ?
[16:01] <mvo> tjaalton: my git-foo is very weak, so I would like to know if it actually works :)
[16:03] <jcristau> mvo: i think you need to run git-update-server-info on the server for http:// git to work
[16:04] <jcristau> mvo: and if you chmod +x hooks/post-update it should be done automatically
[16:41] <mvo> jcristau: thanks, I thought I had done that, but it seems like it was not run for some reason. I ran it now manually
[16:41] <mvo> jcristau: if you could test-merge it, that would be cool!
[17:30] <tjaalton> mvo: ok I'll check it out
[17:31] <mvo> tjaalton: its a really trivial merge (I hope :)
[17:42] <tjaalton> mvo: I bet it is :)
[17:42] <tjaalton> fetching it.. gonna take a while
[18:42] <jcristau> mvo: looks good. pulled and pushed back out.
[18:42]  * mvo hugs jcristau
[18:42] <mvo> thanks!
[20:12] <tjaalton> jcristau: wow thanks, so I failed to push mesa too.. amazing
[20:14] <tjaalton> my git fetch didn't finish after ~2h, so maybe this GPRS connection is not that suitable for development after all :P
[20:16] <jcristau> heh
[20:20] <tormod> we've got new mesa \o/
[20:21]  * jcristau got it like *days* ago.. ;)
[20:22] <tjaalton> the "old " one was quite rece tnt too, not quite rc1
[20:24] <tormod> I think some people will be happy for the fixes, especially on intel
[20:24] <jcristau> i965 compiz is still b0rked though
[20:25] <tormod> is there an easy way to see the Ubuntu delta, short of waiting for patches.ubuntu.com
[20:25] <tormod> ?
[20:26] <tormod> and short of debdiffing src packages...
[20:26]  * crevette wants to upgrade to intrepid
[20:26] <jcristau> git diff debian-experimental..ubuntu
[20:28] <tormod> jcristau: thanks, can't get easier I guess :)