[00:07] <beepie> i believe ikonia should not be a moderator for #ubuntu. very unprofessional.
[00:08] <beepie> the ban is very discriminating that i was "not helpful" when the user in question I provided assistance to last night.
[00:08] <beepie> the log shows I answered a user multiple times to help him, and I was harrassed by "ikonia" when I voice my complaint that that particular user kept asking the same question too many times.
[00:08] <bazhang> beepie, just a moment please
[00:09] <beepie> not knowing who ikonia was, they're not helpful by saying other users are not helpful when the whole evening i've been helping users.
[00:09] <beepie> .
[00:11] <bazhang> finished?
[00:11] <beepie> where are the ops
[00:11] <k1l> beepie: that is not entirely true. you didnt provide helpful support. most time you were ranting or telling others bad advice not knowing some ubuntu specifics
[00:11] <beepie> any ops on?
[00:11] <bazhang> here
[00:11] <k1l> so i kicked you on jan. 23rd and today.
[00:11] <beepie> k1l, most of the questions asked where ubuntu-derivative specifics.
[00:12] <beepie> begs to answer the broadness to approach towards an answer.
[00:12] <k1l> your attitude is not wanted in #ubuntu.
[00:12] <beepie> one user asked about a driver issue for updating the intel gfx. that helped.
[00:12] <beepie> another user asked another -- "kubuntu"
[00:12] <beepie> that too is not the vanilla flavored ubuntu-unity.
[00:12] <beepie> my attitude?
[00:12] <beepie> well people thank me on there.
[00:13] <beepie> i wonder why.
[00:13] <k1l> thats not right. you talked the user into updateing the intel driver.
[00:13] <beepie> perhaps k1l you're so much into ikonia's loyal blood, that you're afraid to even voice your own personal unbias review of anything./
[00:13] <beepie> so maybe you should man up and see it for what it is.
[00:13] <k1l> then there was a user with a firewire issue and you told him about linux kernel stuff.
[00:13] <beepie> incorrect.
[00:13] <beepie> that's correct.
[00:14] <beepie> I pointed to the Ubuntu/Canonical firewire support.
[00:14] <beepie> url.
[00:14] <k1l> and my first kick on jan 23rd was just when there was too much of your bad advice and rantings.
[00:14] <beepie> he said it was too obsolete.
[00:14] <beepie> so I pointed to the Linux/kernel official updated pages of 2015.
[00:14] <beepie> I explained to that user, the limitation of firewire is by the kernel project.
[00:14] <beepie> and it would not be the "blame" upon the ubuntu distro if firewire (all) would be supported on Ubuntu.
[00:14] <beepie> so I even said
[00:15] <beepie> "they are both separate projects"
[00:15] <beepie> if you read.
[00:15] <beepie> I even bothered to explain the limitation of firewire. pretty much out the corridor what do expect of Ubuntu.
[00:15] <beepie> Ubuntu does not go into firewire projects, .. though he was repeating the same "broad" question about support of firewire on Linux./
[00:15] <beepie> it was a "broad question".
[00:15] <beepie> geebus.
[00:15] <beepie> anyways.
[00:16] <k1l> linking a beginner to linux kernel documentation is just not the kind of support we do in the ubuntu community.
[00:16] <beepie> you unban me, and i'll ignore repetitive annoying users.
[00:16] <beepie> much of the questions were not ubuntu-specific afaict.
[00:16] <k1l> if that is a common behaviour of your distros support i think you should stick to that
[00:16] <bazhang> beepie, your type of support is not welcome in #ubuntu
[00:17] <beepie> so far i haven't seen much ubuntu-unity support.
[00:17] <beepie> bazhang, k1l can you guys actually quote the "curse" that is so bad that led to this ban?
[00:17] <beepie> if you think I've been that unhelpful I wonder why users thank me.
[00:17] <hggdh> beepie: attitude is one problem, and we have not seen anything suggesting you would change it
[00:17] <beepie> seems that there's so much royal-blood bedding going on here.
[00:17] <k1l> beepie: i explained already. its the repeated attitude and rantings while giving bad advice.
[00:17] <beepie> "attitude"
[00:18] <beepie> and show me what's attitude?
[00:18] <hggdh> QED.
[00:18] <beepie> annoying users who "repeat" the same question is bad attitude.
[00:18] <beepie> that's what is bad attitude.
[00:18] <beepie> I even bothered to provide them with two referential links.
[00:18] <valorie> "royal-blood bedding"?
[00:18] <valorie> good lord
[00:18] <beepie> I've beenattacked here by saying I don't provide "ubuntu-specific" support.
[00:18] <beepie> WOW.
[00:18] <beepie> If anyone even bothered to read the log.
[00:18] <beepie> EVER>
[00:19] <beepie> the first url I provided was a ubuntu-specific FIREWIRE url.
[00:19] <beepie> WOW.
[00:19] <beepie> now where's the bad attitude here?
[00:19] <beepie> k1l, bazhang ignorance and cowardice on your parts.
[00:19] <hggdh> beepie: are you done?
[00:19] <k1l> beepie: any more insults?
[00:20] <beepie> k1l, bazhang you two could careless about the review.
[00:20] <beepie> k1l, because you're lying.
[00:20] <beepie> k1l, it's in the log.
[00:20] <beepie> k1l, the log shows it.
[00:21] <beepie> k1l, you said I dont' provide ubuntu-specific support. What do you say about me providing a Ubuntu firewire specific url at all?  I wonder how you can even consider yourself to be "fair" on here.
[00:21] <beepie> I'll wait for a more mature ops to come on here and determine better judgement than you two.
[00:21] <beepie> too many of you are kids in here.
[00:21] <hggdh> beepie: I am against lifting your ban, just based on your behaviour (and yes, attitude) here.
[00:22] <hggdh> no change in behaviour. Ah well.
[00:22] <k1l> yes
[00:22] <Unit193> hggdh: Why, that's because you're too much of a buddy with ikon!  Think for yourself, man!
[00:23] <bazhang> nice to be called a kid!
[00:23] <k1l> @mark beepie again not able to resolve the issue
[00:28] <valorie> Unit193: no, it's because we're Blood Royal!
[00:28] <Unit193> \o/
[00:28] <valorie> and bedding one another, I guess
[00:28] <valorie> kinky
[00:28] <bazhang> ooh callouts in other channels
[01:16] <hggdh> Unit193: ahyes, me and me buddies. Tainted, completely tainted. But happy :-)
[01:41] <Dylan____> Uban me please
[01:49] <ikonia> hello Dylan____
[01:49] <ikonia> sorry you've been kept waiting
[01:50] <ikonia> where/when/why did you get banned ?
[02:12] <ikonia> Dylan____: if you're too busy, please come back later
[02:16] <hggdh> he is already marked as away...
[05:48] <elky> looks like we have a classroom joining #ubuntu
[06:06] <aaura> anybody here?
[06:15] <elky> sure
[06:16] <elky> aaura: 'sup?
[06:17] <aaura> my Original nick is : Detai, as i'm sure k1l, rww and ikonia will tell you that I was banned from #ubuntu for occasional use of CAPS, posting in the channel things like " if anyone has question, i'm happy to help.",  and lastly for as k1l put it "ban-evasion",  as I considered first reasons for ban (caps, and support offering) unjustified, I dont think ban-evasion applies in that sense.
[06:18] <aaura> I just spoke to svetlana, and she finally explained why you cant offer support , or solicit support in the channel, because it ANNOYS admins, that are just idling
[06:19] <rww> hi
[06:19] <aaura> that I understand, and had one of those that banned me for that offense explained that, i would have complied
[06:19] <rww> oh, it's you, never mind
[06:19] <aaura> hi rww
[06:21] <aaura> to be fair I originally used CAPS to emphisize only certain words, I did not type full line in caps
[06:22] <aaura> for the most part I'm sorry for the misunderstanding... on my part of the rules, and I will comply with them in the future
[06:23] <aaura> before the ban I was very effective at narrowing the problems posted in #ubuntu, and solved many my self.
[06:24] <aaura> my skill set is very wide, going back to Mentor Pro Server, which most of you would have likely never heard of.
[06:25] <Jordan_U> aaura: You just said that you don't feel that ban-evasion applies because you don't think the original ban was justified. The channel guidelines are clear, http://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Guidelines and you violated them. The fact that you think that it's OK to violate them in the first place after being asked many times to stop, then don't find it at all problematic that you then evaded that ban (to post
[06:25] <Jordan_U> vitriol in the channel) makes me highly skeptical that you will follow the guidelines in the future.
[06:26] <elky> my eyes are bleeding reading all this case alternating text
[06:27] <aaura> if someone assignes an arbitrary meaning to CAPS tomorrow, and you accidentally use CAPS and offend someone  do you think that you should be sanctioned ?
[06:27] <elky> you need to go away and work on fixing your yelling problem
[06:28] <elky> there are sentences in these logs which literally have case alternating with each new word
[06:28] <aaura> Jordan_U: SUPPORT SOLICITING, appeared completely unjustified, until svetlana explained it
[06:29] <Jordan_U> aaura: There are clear guidelines that you must accept to participate in #ubuntu. If you don't want to follow those guidelines then it's fine for you to simply choose not to participate in the channel. What's not fine is being asked to change your behavior multiple times and yet refusing to do so. What is *absolutely unacceptable* is spamming the channel with vitriol. It will take a lot to convince me
[06:29] <Jordan_U>  that you are mature enough to be allowed back in #ubuntu.
[06:29] <aaura> I use caps to EMPHASIZE, and not to shout!
[06:29] <Jordan_U> aaura: It frankly doesn't matter if you think the guidelines in #ubuntu are reasonable or not. If you choose to participate in the channel then you choose to follow its guidelines.
[06:30] <aaura> Jordan_U: Support soliciting- has to be better explained... in the guidelines, and most people never read guidelines...
[06:31] <aaura> once, svetlana explained that it annoys, idling observers, I understood.
[06:32] <aaura> noone, that banned me for that ever clarified why that guideline makes any sense, until svetlana
[06:33] <Jordan_U> aaura: Support soliciting is literally the least of the problems you have caused in #ubuntu. Your vitriol is what is completely unacceptable. Even if I agreed that your support soliciting was fine, it is your conduct after that point that has convinced me that lifting the ban would be a bad idea.
[06:33] <aaura> Jordan_U: define the "vitriol"
[06:34] <Jordan_U> aaura: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/vitriol
[06:35] <aaura> Jordan_U: that's funny, I know the meaning, what is it that you are referring to as it applies to me..
[06:36] <elky> aaura: the bit where you started on about hungarians might be a good start for your introspection
[06:37] <aaura> ohh ikonia crossed the line...
[06:37] <elky> he's not hungarian
[06:37] <aaura> ikonian accused me of being "just googling for answers"
[06:37] <Jordan_U> aaura: "2016-01-27T18:05:33 <detai> Bunch of EGOMANAICAL assholes" but one of many examples.
[06:38] <aaura> what was preceeded by that egomanaical comment?
[06:38] <elky> that's no reason to start calling people cocksuckers.
[06:38] <aaura> list the whole exchange...
[06:38] <Jordan_U> aaura: It's seriously problematic that you think that matters.
[06:39] <aaura> so when ops call me names, that's ok?
[06:39] <elky> also, whether or not someone can take a dick has literally no place for any of our channels. I'd have fired you real life for that.
[06:39] <aaura> when ops use abusive language that's ok?
[06:39] <rww> I still wanna know how ikonia is hungarian
[06:40] <Jordan_U> aaura: No, ops "calling you names" would not be OK. It also wouldn't be relevant to your being banned.
[06:40] <elky> rww: hungry maybe?
[06:40] <rww> elky: it involves /whois somehow but I haven't figured it out
[06:40] <elky> aaura: nothing said by any ops in these logs comes close to your misogynist and/or homophobic slurs
[06:41] <Jordan_U> rww: I don't think that's a productive question to ask. Can we please try to drop that thread of discussion?
[06:42] <aaura> I did say I was sorry for the misunderstaning, on my part...
[06:42] <elky> aaura: i have serious worries that you'd have such grotesque outbursts if someone in the support channel got frustrated and said something that hurt your sense of ego, which is all that i can see to have happened to you here.
[06:43] <aaura> i knew that ikonia was an op,
[06:43] <elky> so?
[06:43] <aaura> and what ikonia said was out of line
[06:44] <elky> no it wasn't.
[06:44] <aaura> suggesting that all i do is Google for answers?
[06:45] <elky> if he is concerned that you are passing on information without vetting it then it is his responsibility to say so, to prevent people from blindly following
[06:46] <aaura> that is not the case... I vet and verify all suggestion i make, as much as possible, and if i'm uncertain if the solution works i make it know
[06:46] <aaura> known
[06:47] <elky> great that we can clear that up then. however your behaviour after that is still an issue
[06:47] <elky> the most serious of the issues.
[06:48] <aaura> ban evasion?
[06:49] <Jordan_U> aaura: Virtiol.
[06:49] <Jordan_U> s/Virtiol/Vitriol/
[06:49] <elky> no, the bits where you think that your comments about dicks and hungarians are even vaguely appropriate or proportionate responses to your ego taking a hit
[06:50] <elky> eventually someone is going to hurt your feelings again and i really don't want that kind of behaviour, which you apparently don't seem to think is bad behaviour, in the support channel
[06:51] <aaura> from my point of view ops like rww and ikonia banned me for what I (then) considered trivial - power-tripping by those ops ... had things like offering support been explained, it would've never occured
[06:51] <elky> you don't get to behave like that even if they are powertripping ops
[06:52] <aaura> I have restaint when your ops do not...and I have shown that capacity yesterday in chat with k1l
[06:52] <aaura> i'd like to point out that yesterday in a long chat with k1l, I never used a single pejorative towards him... while k1l cannot say the same..
[06:53] <aaura> atleast k1l was talking to me Ikonia insulted me and kicked / banned me summarily
[06:53] <Flannel> I just want to interject and say, aaura, if you have issues with the actions of certain operators, we do have a process for getting those looked at by additional ops, to guard against "power tripping".
[06:54] <aaura> Flannel: those procedures were / are unknown to me
[06:54] <Flannel> (The easist/most consistent first step is to come in here and ask about it.)
[06:54] <elky> what pejorative did k1l use?
[06:54] <aaura> when that incident with ikonia occured i was not aware of this channel
[06:55] <elky> you really do need to learn about reading topics of the channels you join, it will make for much nicer encounters.
[06:55] <aaura> elky: ask him, i'm sure he remembers our lenthy conversation yesterday, (my nick yesterday was KingMidas)
[06:55] <elky> you'd have known about here if you had
[06:56] <Flannel> aaura: I understand.  And I'm not saying you should have known about them (although they are in the IRC guidelines), I just want you to be aware of them now and in the future.  We don't want personal issues to become operator-actions, just like we don't want people to think they're being targetted for personal reasons.
[06:56] <aaura> elky: you have a point, but how many channels do you visit per day?  do you "first" read all the channel policies?
[06:57] <Flannel> aaura: It's always a good idea to read the topics upon your first entry into an unfamiliar channel, yes.
[06:57] <Flannel> aaura: Just like you pay special attention to speed limits/traffic signs the first time you drive through an area.
[06:58] <aaura> Flannel: I am here after I spoke to svetlana, she explained about why "soliciting support" is a policy and she told me about this channel
[06:58] <aaura> Flannel: to be fair, i do now recall being 'redirected' by k1l into this channel
[06:58] <elky> you were here yesterday though
[06:58] <Flannel> but, it was my intent to add another voice to this conversation.  So I'm stopping.  Please continue with elky.  But just for completeness and your records, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/AppealProcess is info on the appeals process should you find yourself in need in the future.
[06:59] <elky> aaura: so you only just today found out about this channel is what you're saying?
[06:59] <aaura> Flannel: but that conversation was circular in nature... he banned me for ban-evasion-evasion which would not have been necessary if the policies made sense and did not carry 'arbitrary' appearance..
[07:00] <Flannel> aaura: Like I said, I haven't read the scrollback, and elky already has a handle on it, so I'm taking my leave of this conversation.  Please continue with elky.  Thanks.
[07:01] <aaura> i was talking to k1l in likely this channel but i was redirected to this channel after i tried to rejoin #ubuntu... the significance of this channel was not apparent
[07:03] <elky> aaura: but you didn't speak to k1l until today?
[07:03] <aaura> elky: why do you think i'm here?
[07:03] <aaura> not on this channel
[07:05] <rww> I note that rules being seemingly arbitrary is not a very good reason to ignore then, and that insulting people is not a very good way to get clarification on rules.
[07:05] <rww> them*
[07:08] <elky> aaura: i'm not sure there's much more to discuss. you need to take some time off from #ubuntu and have...
[07:08] <elky> ok then
[07:09] <rww> I should do more testing at some point on what makes webchat quit with which messages
[07:11] <aaura> elky: i'm back
[07:11] <aaura> my interface froze up
[07:12] <elky> aaura: i'm not sure there's much more to discuss. you need to take some time off from #ubuntu and have some consideration about how you can better react to things people say.
 I note that rules being seemingly arbitrary is not a very good reason to ignore them, and that insulting people is not a very good way to get clarification on rules.
[07:12] <rww> That and what elky said are what you missed ^
[07:12] <elky> some anger management resources might be useful, there are many online.
[07:14] <aaura> elky: Why do you think i'm here, and my anger management is fine, when I spoke to k1l privately yesterday, i never used a single pejorative, unlike him
[07:15] <elky> aaura: your anger management is not fine, and you still haven't told me what pejorative he used since you can remember him doing so.
[07:15] <aaura> elky: if I was that type of person, that you portray, would i've come here trying to resolve this issue? you already know i have the skills to ban-evade at will.
[07:16] <aaura> and i'm not going to... if he was logging that chat like he's supposed to then you'll be shown that log
[07:16] <elky> you're not helping yourself here.
[07:16] <rww> "like he's supposed to" what
[07:17] <elky> there is no such obligation.
[07:17] <aaura> well since you log everything everywhere for posterity... why wouldn't he...
[07:17] <rww> if you want conversations logged, do them in a logged channel. This is why I don't do PM ban resolution
[07:18] <aaura> well k1l did
[07:18] <rww> aaura: because there is nothing anywhere obliging him to do so
[07:19] <rww> aaura: that's his choice and yours, and if you choose to bring issues from it in here, we expect more than "he said a bad word!"
[07:19] <aaura> and not only did he use disparaging remarks, but he also used psychological technics to intimidate and ostrasize me
[07:19] <rww> do you have a log of this?
[07:19] <aaura> I first want to hear that k1l doesnt... the i'll answer that question rww
[07:20] <rww> He's not around and you are, so you get to talk first
[07:20] <aaura> this is not a trial...
[07:20] <rww> And in general, you seem to have this belief that chanop requests are subject to negotiation and you only have to follow rules you agree with
[07:20] <aaura> i'm not here to rehash bs that was based on a misunderstanding...
[07:21] <aaura> I'm here to say i'm sorry for the most part for the misunderstanding and for things that were said by me which might not have been appropriate
[07:22] <aaura> but that appology does not apply to ikonia's comment
[07:22] <aaura> ikonian crossed the line
[07:22] <elky> so you can't deal with people challenging your advice?
[07:23] <aaura> I have show that i can have a civil conversation with k1l, even when the other side is not civil with me
[07:23] <rww> < aaura> i'm not here to rehash bs that was based on a misunderstanding...
[07:23] <rww> < aaura> I have show that i can have a civil conversation with k1l, even when the other side is not civil with me
[07:23] <elky> you are going to have a very very bad time in #ubuntu if you can't deal with being challenged.
[07:23] <aaura> ikonia comments were "generalized" not refering to a specific advice, that is the "point'
[07:23] <rww> stop bringing it up constantly if you're not here to rehash it
[07:23] <rww> And stop making unsupported accusations
[07:24] <aaura> unsupported accusations?
[07:24] <aaura> about ikonia?
[07:25] <aaura> very supported that conversation was logged
[07:25] <elky> no the ones you keep making about k1l but refusing to provide supporting evidence for
[07:26] <aaura> I want him to say that he does not have a log first.
[07:26] <aaura> for what ever reason...
[07:26] <rww> oh for god's sake
[07:26] <rww> you're the one bringing it up
[07:26] <rww> you get to support it with evidence
[07:26] <rww> if you're not willing to do that, stop bringing it up
[07:26] <aaura> rww: lets focus on you... you kicked/banned me, what was the reason...
[07:27] <rww> and stop playing games with "you first!" and "but he did a bad thing too!", this is not a kindergarten playground
[07:27] <rww> aaura: because you were being combatative in #ubuntu-ops, the conversation was going in circles, and you'd ignored me repeatedly telling you to come back after you'd calmed down
[07:27] <aaura> you cant play the "im the adult here" card now... you banned me, why?
[07:27] <rww> I just told you why.
[07:28] <aaura> ohh please pull the log, and tell me why now?
[07:28] <elky> if you are relying on k1l not having logs, then there is no way we can trust you since the only rational reason you would be doing that is to figure how much fantasy you can exercise
[07:28] <rww> aaura: sure, sec
[07:29] <rww> aaura: https://paste.ubuntu.com/14693954/ this is a log from the first time i told you to come back tomorrow through your ban
[07:29] <rww> you'll note lines 2, 6, 14, where i provide explanation
[07:30] <rww> one sec while i pull the irclogs.ubuntu.com page to check something
[07:30] <rww> yep, there we go. public log from ubuntulog is at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2016/01/27/%23ubuntu-ops.html#t18:11
[07:30] <rww> you'll note also the line at 18:16 where i provide a reason for our bantracker, and a duration
[07:30] <rww> < rww> @comment 71004 unable to do ban resolution due to user attitude, banned until tomorrow to prevent further escalation/arguing, 12h
[07:30] <aaura> so this was after the exchange with ikonia
[07:31] <rww> do you have any further questions about me banning you, or does that cover it?
[07:31] <rww> looks like it, yes
[07:31] <rww> since that was 8 hours earlier
[07:31] <aaura> your position was decidedly onesided... you protected ikonia
[07:32] <aaura> instead of asking him to appoligise, you banned me to cool off for 12 hours
[07:32] <rww> To be quite honest, I don't care about protecting ikonia. If he's wrong, I tell him so, to his face, and have done so in the past.
[07:32] <aaura> I was telling him he's wrong and you banned me...
[07:32] <aaura> which policy did i violate?
[07:33] <aaura> "being combative with ops" is too ambigous
[07:33] <rww> "Recommendations from channel operators, including those stored in the channel bots, should be followed."
[07:33] <rww> second paragraph of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Guidelines
[07:33] <aaura> so from my point of view it looked very stacked
[07:34] <rww> To be quite honest, I'm not interested in your point of view of how your ban looked. The discussion was going around in circles, and I ended it to avoid even more time being wasted on it.
[07:35] <rww> That is a judgement call I get to make, as a designated channel operator of #ubuntu-ops.
[07:35] <rww> If you disagree with my reasoning, you are free to use the usual Ubuntu channel appeals process.
[07:35] <aaura> Sending many messages in a short amount of time is called "flooding" the channel. Flooding the channel disrupts all conversations. Please don't do it. If you want to show large texts, such as errors, use the pastebin and post the URL to the paste instead. ?
[07:35] <rww> !appeals
[07:35] <aaura> I was not flooding... as a second paragraph says
[07:35] <rww> aaura: That isn't the second paragraph of that page, it's the fourth.
[07:36] <rww> as is made quite obvious by me also quoting the relevant section, which quote you could look for in the page
[07:36] <aaura> ubottu: i hate to break it to you but most people dont read the policies Cover to Cover when entering a new channel
[07:36] <rww> This is the message you got when joining #ubuntu: 07:36 -- ChanServ: Entrymsg   : Welcome to #ubuntu! Please read the channel topic. This channel is logged. Use of this channel implies acceptance of terms at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/TermsOfService
[07:37] <rww> This is on that linked page: "In the Core Channels the IRC Guidelines constitute the main channel rules, they must be followed by all users at all times."
[07:37] <aaura> rww: this is your line <+rww> second paragraph of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Guidelines
[07:37] <rww> Regardless of whether you decide to ignore this or not, you are bound by it. If you don't like it, don't use our core channels.
[07:37] <rww> 07:33 <+rww> "Recommendations from channel operators, including those stored in the channel bots, should be followed."
[07:37] <rww> 07:33 <+rww> second paragraph of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Guidelines
[07:38] <aaura> rww: you expect every user to read the TermsOfService for an IRC channel??? really?
[07:38] <rww> aaura: Yes, I do.
[07:38] <rww> and you agree that you are going to abide by them when you speak in #ubuntu
[07:38] <rww> and if you don't like that, don't join #ubuntu or #ubuntu-ops or other core channels
[07:39] <rww> As I believe you have been told already, channels on freenode are not a public forum where you have an unlimited right to free speech. freenode channels have channel founders and channel ops, and are given broad latitude by network staff as to what rules are in place.
[07:39] <aaura> rww: you are aware that there are other irc channels/servers? right?
[07:39] <rww> aaura: Yes. You are free to use them if you don't like how ours are run.
[07:40] <rww> As has been given to you twice already, you are also free to use our appeals process if you believe Ubuntu's IRC Council would be interested in hearing about what I am saying.
[07:44] <aauro> well that didn't take long at all
[07:44] <rww> 07:39 < aaura> rww: you are aware that there are other irc channels/servers? right?
[07:44] <rww> 07:39 <+rww> aaura: Yes. You are free to use them if you don't like how ours are run.
[07:44] <rww> 07:40 <+rww> As has been given to you twice already, you are also free to use our appeals process if you believe Ubuntu's IRC Council would be interested in hearing about what I am saying.
[07:44] <rww> 07:44 <-- aaura<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
[07:44] <rww> 07:44 --> aauro<EMAIL_ADDRESS>has joined #ubuntu-ops
[07:45] <aauro> is there and IRC Superior Court I can file and appeal with.....  Who do you people think you are???
[07:45] <aauro> i think k1l is back online
[07:45] <rww> You've already been given our appeals link twice. I understand that you are having connection issues and probably lost it the first two times though, so
[07:45] <rww> !appeals
[07:46] <rww> You are mistaken, he's been idle for about 7 hours.
[07:46] <rww> You would now be at step (4) on that page.
[07:46] <aauro> he's the one blocking my connection from  aaura<EMAIL_ADDRESS>[07:46] <rww> not right now he's not, since he hasn't done anything on IRC for 7 hours
[07:47] <aauro> I'm going to say this slowly with small words,   I  am not reading the "AppealProcess" or any other arbitrary menucia you paste
[07:48] <rww> Okay. Then please feel free to find some other channels to help people in.
[07:48] <rww> If you're not going to go through our processes, you're not re-entering our channels.
[07:48] <rww> As has been explained to you by multiple people, both ops and non-ops, we set the guidelines and policy in #ubuntu-*. You don't get to ignore the ones you don't like.
[07:49] <rww> Any further requests to remove your bans should be directed to our IRC Council using the process linked above, as multiple #ubuntu and #ubuntu-ops operators have reviewed them and upheld them, per our appeals process.
[07:49] <aauro> you dont have a process, you dont explain your policies, the same policies that have utterly arbitrary appearance, and you dont sanction your ops that insult people and use abusive language.. (ikonia, k1l)
[07:50] <elky> are you kidding me?
[07:50] <rww> I linked you the process three times now, I am not required to explain policies to you before you are required to follow them, and whether or not ikonia or k1l have been sanctioned is frankly none of your concern.
[07:50] <rww> So again, if you feel that we have inadequately addressed your issue, go follow the appeals process.
[07:50] <rww> Ignoring the appeals process and expecting appeals to work is not going to go well.
[07:50] <aauro> rww: you, yourself have admitted to Protecting Ikonia by banning me to "cool-off"
 | To be quite honest, I don't care about protecting ikonia. If he's wrong, I tell him so, to his face, and have done so in the past.
[07:51] <rww> I am quickly growing tired of repeating myself.
[07:53] <aauro> i came to appologise, i've previously show capacity for civil discussion with k1l, and if you rww / ikonia had explained your policies when conflict first arose, like svetlana has done.  this would've never been an issue
[07:53] <rww> I think that's about it for our (as in: you and #ubuntu-* ops) conversation.  We noticed a lot of joins from the same IP.
[08:11] <DETAI> они здесь дескруменируют
[08:11] <s3012> ин рашен плиз
[08:12] <DETAI> придумую тупуе правила и потом выёбуются
[08:12] <s3012> ++
[08:12] <DETAI> rww is too dumb to speak russian
[08:12] <s3012> СЛАВА УКРАИНЕ
[08:12] <s3012> СЛАВА ЯИЦАм
[08:12] <DETAI> Героям СЛАВА
[08:12] <DETAI> агагага
[08:12] <rww> s3012: Do you speak English well enough to answer a couple of questions?
[08:13] <s3012> хохлы сосут хуи
[08:13] <DETAI> ну тогда тебе точно пиздец
[08:13] <s3012> ??
[08:14] <DETAI> этот rww он твой ip забанит полностю
[08:14] <rww> sekrit: the other person speaking is not a channel op and cannot help unban you. If you do not know English, please use an alternate channel such as #ubuntu-ru if you have support questions, or make your own if you want to chat with people.
[08:14] <rww> ... wut
[08:14] <rww> s3012: the other person speaking is not a channel op and cannot help unban you. If you do not know English, please use an alternate channel such as #ubuntu-ru if you have support questions, or make your own if you want to chat with people.
[08:15] <rww> dunno how that tab complete misfired, stupid client :(
[08:15] <DETAI> the other person is fluent in russian,
[08:15] <s3012> rww: i spoke inglish well
[08:15] <DETAI> ohh yes this conversation i'm dying to see
[08:15] <s3012> What тебе надо?
[08:15] <rww> s3012: Okay.  Is it one person or a class or...?
[08:15] <DETAI> hahahahaha
[08:16] <DETAI> rww: because he's using a russian PROXY
[08:16] <DETAI> you DIMWITTT
[08:16] <DETAI> he's last question was  " What do you want"
[08:16] <s3012> russia, vologda kirova st
[08:17] <DETAI> ты чё ему свой адрес дал??
[08:17] <s3012> i немножко speak english
[08:17] <rww> !ru
[08:17] <DETAI> rww: how is that SUPERIORITY complex now???
[08:18] <rww> s3012: so /join #ubuntu-ru for Ubuntu support. For general chat, you could invent a new channel for you and your friends :)
[08:18] <DETAI> вот вот ПОШЁЛ вон ХАЛОП
[08:19] <s3012> меня банят на ру как только захожу скажи ему
[08:19] <DETAI> этот придурок меня твоим дружком принял
[08:19] <DETAI> he's saying that he is instaKICKED/banned from that ru channel
[08:21] <rww> s3012: I am unable to speak Russian, and #ubuntu is English-language only. If #ubuntu-ru does not work, I cannot do anything.
[08:26] <DETAI> ohh wait
[08:26] <DETAI> i wonder what's going to happen next?
[08:31] <DETAI> dont you know that the IRC, portion of irc.freenode.net alway belonged to the Russian Federation... Russians are just trying to reinstate the Historical truth.
[08:33] <DETAI> LMAOO, well this endevour wasn't a total disaster, atleast I watched rww trying to talk to a russian... in english...   and I found out that #Ubuntu is for ENGLISH SPEAKING users only.--- NICE!!!
[16:25] <ikonia> hello gpwn
[16:25] <gpwn> hello ikonia
[16:25] <ikonia> I saw a bit of drama in #ubuntu, what's up ?
[16:25] <gpwn> i don't know
[16:25] <gpwn> guy is weird
[16:26] <gpwn> he keeps sending me PMs
[16:26] <gpwn> and then he pasted fake logs in #ubuntu
[16:26] <ikonia> so he won't be doing that any more
[16:26] <rww> pancakis:, I assume?
[16:26] <ikonia> I suggest you ignore him in pm and don't engage with him outside the channel
[16:26] <gpwn> yes
[16:26] <gpwn> ikonia: why won't he be doing that anymore?
[16:26] <gpwn> you banned him?
[16:27] <ikonia> no, but he won't be putting any more data in the channel
[16:27] <gpwn> lol
[17:29] <k1l> gpwn: when the issue is cleared please part this channel. ideling is only allowed for team members. thanks :)
[22:18] <k1l> showaz (~showaz@unaffiliated/showaz)   did not stop with his "mark shuttleworth killed all ubuntu flavors" stuff. might come to other ubuntu channels now


[23:09] <Gartral> onetinsoldier: Guis are useless right now as i cant read anything right now, im throwing a last-ditch effort and ripping a copy of the /usr/share/fonts folder from a vm and putting it into the same path in the real hrad drive
[23:10] <Green_> forkup: 80gb
[23:10] <alx1> FNi, hrm someone here may know but you could try installing (you can always reclaim the space after if you decide against it)
[23:10] <onetinsoldier> Gartral: roger. i wish you luck
[23:10] <forkup> gonna take a while
[23:10] <Green_> forkup: the drive is 80gb, the partition is about 77
[23:10] <eipi-1> when i connect a client to my network and it receives its ip from DHCPd it always adds the dhcp server as gateway to route. which option in dhcpd.conf do i need to not have a gateway defined at all?
[23:11] <Green_> forkup: it's ok, i started this install, like 5 days ago XD
[23:11] <forkup> haha ./
[23:11] <sjm> eipi-1:  man dhcpd.conf
[23:11] <Green_> forkup: know what OneSocialWeb is?
[23:12] <forkup> no clue
[23:12] <shawnboy> s
[23:12] <bodom> Is there a way to make a bootable usb stick from an iso?
[23:13] <Green_> forkup: http://onesocialweb.org/, basicly the next generation of social networks (done right, decentrelized and distributed etc)
[23:13] <Green_> i'll be installing a server on this machine :)
[23:13] <forkup> bodom: get unetbootin
[23:13] <dbum> bodom: unetbootin
[23:13] <acerimmer_> bodom: Startup Disc Creator under System>Preferences
[23:14] <vivid> has anyone had an issue with gnome-screensaver?
[23:14] <acerimmer_> !anyone>vivid
[23:14] <vivid> i just turned it on and its totally not working, after the set time, it fades out like its going to blank the screen, but then just comes back on
[23:15] <bodom> forkup, dbum, acerimmer_: ty
[23:15] <forkup> np
[23:15] <dbum> bodom:  ⓃⓅ
[23:15] <forkup> shower time, bbl
[23:17] <vivid> hehe, got the autoignore on PMs, failbot
[23:19] <blendmaster1024> what is a good tool to view an SVN database?
[23:20] <Vovk> heya... can someone help me with a wine/apt question? I've been trying to install an older version of wine (1.1.37) and I've apt-get purged my previous version of wine. but whenever I try to install wine with the older deb package, I get errors saying that it's trying to override a file which is owned by the newer package
[23:21] <Vovk> any ideas?
[23:21] <wamicho> looking for nice none online game like enemy teritory
[23:22] <wamicho> anybody
[23:22] <Vovk> tried alien arena or warsow wamicho?
[23:23] <blendmaster1024> again (1/2): what is a good tool to view an SVN database?
[23:23] <Vovk> any ideas on the apt problem or is chat just dead?
[23:24] <blendmaster1024> Vovk: well ... you could try using the dpkg force option
[23:24] <Vovk> hmm
[23:24] <blendmaster1024> but that risks damage if there is a real conflict
[23:24] <acerimmer_> Vovk: also, check your /home for hidden .config files
[23:24] <Vovk> the config file in question is in /etc
[23:24] <wamicho> ok Vovk
[23:24] <Vovk> a shared applications menu file
[23:25] <Vovk> i deleted it...
[23:25]  * blendmaster1024 facepalms
[23:25] <Vovk> it may have been the wrong move... i figured the package would just make a new one
[23:25] <blendmaster1024> it keeps a database, and doesn't touch the filesystem until it decides it's ok
[23:25] <Vovk> aah nvm...
[23:26] <Vovk> so dpkg force... i'll trying
[23:28] <Vovk> hmm man page says that using --force on dpkg without understanding what you're doing can break your whole system O.o
[23:28] <wasabiii> --force-confmiss
[23:28] <wasabiii> is the only one you need
[23:28] <Vovk> thanks
[23:30] <Vovk> so i did sudo dpkg -i --force-confmiss <packagename> and I encountered the same error ""trying to overwrite '/etc/xdg/menus/applications-merged/wine.menu', which is also in package wine1.2 0:1.2~rc1-0ubuntu1~lucidppa1"
[23:31] <SuperMiguel> whats a good irc cli client?
[23:31] <owenll> SuperMiguel: pidgin
[23:31] <SuperMiguel> pidgin is not cli
[23:32] <Vovk> SuperMiguel, irssi
[23:32] <xangua> SuperMiguel: finch is the cli version of pidgin
[23:32] <SuperMiguel> finch vs irssi?
[23:32] <xangua> well is more like pidgin's brother, bot uses lipurple
[23:32] <Vovk> pidgin is not an IRC client, is it?
[23:33] <xangua> SuperMiguel: finch can conect to every protocol pidgin can, if you preffer a irc focus client then use what ypu like
[23:33] <owenll> Vovk: i'm using pidgin now?
[23:33] <buu> bitlbee!
[23:33] <xangua> Vovk: irc, facebook, even twitter client
[23:34] <Vovk> interesting :D
[23:34] <Vovk> i'm using xchat irc... but i've got irssi installed incase i accidentally bork my X
[23:35] <Isam_> Does this image mean Ubuntu doesn't recognize my wireless card: http://img532.imageshack.us/img532/2013/screenshot2cq.png
[23:35] <sgs1990> does ennyone know why a game shuts down emediatly when i start it,, the screen just flahes black and than it shuts down
[23:35] <Vovk> sgs1990, try running the game with the terminal so that you can get some output
[23:36] <sgs1990> Vovk:  how do i do that,, im not really good whit the terminal and all
[23:36] <Vovk> what game is it sgs?
[23:36] <sgs1990> savage2
[23:36] <SuperMiguel> whats a light battery monitor/ battery status indicator ?
[23:37] <Vovk> did you install it from the repos or did you install it on your own from a tar?
[23:37] <sgs1990> i installed it from a .bin file whit the terminal
[23:38] <xangua> SuperMiguel: gnome has a battery status integrated, or were you refering to network manager¿
[23:38] <SuperMiguel> xangua, battery.. but im using openbox.. and dont really want to install gnome shit
[23:39] <Isam_> Does this image mean Ubuntu doesn't recognize my wireless card: http://img532.imageshack.us/img532/2013/screenshot2cq.png
[23:39] <Green_> forkup: finished it, still the same error?
[23:39] <xangua> SuperMiguel: no idea then, maybe with conky¿
[23:39] <Green_> error*
[23:39] <c3l> how do I see in what repo a specific package is in, with apt-cache?
[23:39] <SuperMiguel> xangua, great idea!!
[23:39] <mahmoud> hello
[23:40] <mahmoud> can any one help me ?
[23:40] <owenll> !hi | mahmoud
[23:40] <mahmoud> hi owenll
[23:40] <Taravel> hello, is there a tool to chek if an Hard disk is damaged? is there a way to force to delete a direcory?  thanks
[23:40] <mahmoud> can u help me in application text encoding please ?
[23:40] <minimec> Isam_: Your image doesn't give us much information. open a gnome-terminal and check your card entry with lspci (probably Network controller)
[23:41] <brokuntu> ok, i managed to get the text based installer ISO onto a bootable flash disk and install from it, so, i power up, and all i see is black screen
[23:41] <nishanth> does any one know how to make a live stream video play that uses mms plugin?
[23:41] <brokuntu> just like all I saw is black screen trying to use the live CD ubuntu keeps trying to use an inappropriate intel driver fror my IGC
[23:41] <jrife> @brokuntu: what graphics card do you have?
[23:41] <gartral|p> How do I get a numerical permissions read for a specific folder in console?
[23:41] <Green_> Trying to install Ubuntu Server and getting this error on boot: "Kernel Parnic - not syncing: VPS: Unable to mount root fs on unknown-block(0,0)" can anyone help??
[23:42] <mahmoud> owenll ?
[23:42] <mahmoud> u still there ?
[23:42] <forkup> Green_: what error
[23:42] <Green_> forkup: same one
[23:43] <ADmiral> Hi, 10.04 I've installed libgme0, which is supposed to play .spc, .nsf audio formats (among others). Audacious can play them now, but vlc and mplayer can't. I need to use vlc. What should I do?
[23:43] <Green_> the one i wrote... O_O
[23:43] <forkup> i never heard the first one, only the query about fsck
[23:43] <brokuntu> jrife: 82865G
[23:43] <jrife> nvidia or what?
[23:43] <brokuntu> intel
[23:43] <jrife> oh, i had the same problem with intel
[23:43] <Green_> forkup: it's in the msg itself.. but again: "Kernel panic - not syncing: VPS: Unable to mount root fs on unknown-block(0,0)"
[23:43] <mahmoud> #sound
[23:43] <mahmoud> im out
[23:44] <subsume> I've got like 10 postfix smtp processes in my 'top'. How can I figure out what thsi is about?
[23:44] <forkup> let's go to pm
[23:44] <jrife> brokuntu: can you use an older kernel version to boot?
[23:44] <Green_> sure
[23:44] <brokuntu> i only just installed
[23:44] <brokuntu> i cant even show up recovery mode
[23:44] <brokuntu> i get a black screen
[23:44] <brokuntu> can i pass a kernel boot option to say like "NO F****** " graphics
[23:45] <jrife> yeah i'd try that
[23:45] <jrife> it worked for me
[23:45] <Loshki> subsume: Try #postfix, where the experts hang out...
[23:45] <subsume> kk
[23:47] <Blade-Runner> hi
[23:47] <userteck> uberlandia
[23:48] <owenll> !hi | Blade-Runner
[23:49] <Blade-Runner> looks like guys have taken a break..!
[23:49] <harkle> I'm trying to add a ppa repository, but I don't have add-apt-repository for some reason. All I need to do is get the GPG key, but I need to do it through a proxy. When I use gpg on its own, it works, but only when I DON'T use sudo, and when I use apt-key adv, the --keyserver-options http-proxy seems not to be passed through to GPG. WHAT DO? o.o
[23:50] <harkle> Do I need to specify a certain keyring or something? :/
[23:50] <xangua> harkle: what version of ubuntu¿ have you tried to go to the PPA's web and manualy download and install the GPG¿
[23:50] <bugs_bugger> hi. guys, i feel a little stupid: how to upgrade ubuntu from desktop-cd?
[23:51] <harkle> xangua: it's 10.04, but it's actually the VMware image of Bitnami's DjangoStack.
[23:51] <Ari_Lazarus> Hi guys - as per the mapping page at the wiki I reconfigured xorg.conf so that when my system starts up it would remap certain mousekeys. However, today when I log on I discovered that xorg.conf complains about a 'screen not found' error, and I had to boot X into a different display number. What did I do wrong here?
[23:51] <Blade-Runner> !upgrade | bugs_bugger
[23:51] <xangua> harkle: is thata modified version of ubuntu¿¿
[23:51] <Firefishe> Hello all.  :)  I'm currently using the 64bit live cd of 10.04 LTS and wanted to know if it's possible to reboot somehow without losing the ram disk.
[23:51] <xangua> bugs_bugger: you need alternate to upgrade with the cd, not live
[23:52] <harkle> xangua: it seems to be; I didn't know I could download the gpg key directly, so that's good. What do I do with it so that apt-get will use it?
[23:52] <harkle> Firefishe: you mean you want to preserve the contents of RAM through a reboot?
[23:53] <harkle> Of a specific program or of the whole system?
[23:53] <bugs_bugger> xangua: ah. i see. now i know why i had a 9.10 altertate disc as well :) im too lazy, ill try online upgrade. thanks
[23:53] <xangua> harkle: just open synaptic and go to the menu of repositorioes (software origins also work) and there is a tab where ypu can select the file to import it
[23:53] <harkle> xangua: Can't; I've got nothing but command line.
[23:54] <xangua> harkle: better to use the oficial ubuntu build if you want to get more help, those are the rules ;)
[23:54] <harkle> :P
[23:54] <bttf> hey, basic question... when i run a program from terminal, it doesn't go back to my command line
[23:54] <xangua> mmmm then no idea
[23:54] <bttf> where it shows my home dir
[23:54] <harkle> xangua: I think I can find what to do from here; thanks for telling me about the direct link to download the key!
[23:54] <trism> harkle: sudo apt-key add path_to_file
[23:55] <xangua> well i'm out to take fresh air, see you ubuntu support channel ;)
[23:55] <harkle> trism: ah, danke schoen.
[23:57] <metalforever> harkle sudo apt-get install xorg ?
[23:57] <metalforever> >_<
[23:57] <metalforever> or reinstall
[23:58] <john> Hi, running Ubuntu 9.10 on an AMD dual core pc.  went to sstem admin, update adn tried to update to 10.  would not do it since could not find astromirror. uchicago.edu.  any suggestions?
[23:59] <jiffe> how would I get everything but kern.* syslogging somewhere?
[23:59] <hufx> bttf:  you get it back when you exit the gui program    so you could just open another terminal


[15:16] <mrtesty> Anyone from AU here? I need your help to get a VPN offer kindly help me, PM me the tokens please, I cannot afford it, thanks
[15:16] <mrtesty> https://twitter.com/cryptostorm_is/status/656970807093108736
[15:16] <mrtesty> see this ^
[15:17] <mrtesty> Anyone from AU here? I need your help to get a VPN offer kindly help me, PM me the tokens please, I cannot afford it, thanks link - https://twitter.com/cryptostorm_is/status/656970807093108736
[23:33] <jea> i don't think that person is going to get much help from us